Comments on: The Bird Rock Bandits v. The “Flying Hawaiian”: Four High School Friends Sentenced in Killing of Professor Surfer Emery Kauanui

By: jose

jose — Mon, 24 May 2010 05:23:04 +0000

If they were the bird street banditos, they would have been considered a gang

By: Patty C

Patty C — Tue, 18 Nov 2008 22:00:34 +0000

http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-surfer19-2008nov19,0,4252904.story

San Diego jury finds man guilty of surfer’s murder
Sean Masterson / For The Times
Seth Cravens, shown at a bail hearing in September 2007, was convicted today of second-degree murder.
The Associated Press
12:34 PM PST, November 18, 2008

By: NATASHA

NATASHA — Sat, 11 Oct 2008 07:59:43 +0000

we like the way in which you presented the facts
it was not a gang fight, but two young men fighting over a girl

By: NATASHA

NATASHA — Sat, 11 Oct 2008 07:57:18 +0000

i feel that ” the tragedy” was that two young men fought over Genny Grosso at the bar, where Eric House was doused in beer by Emery who then invited Eric House ” to come and fight” the others went along for the ride and Emery came out of his condo took off his shirt and beat Eric House to a pulp, he then argued with Seth Cravn who punched him, Emery fell backward and broke his skull, no one jumped him, no one ganged up on him, his body bore no marks of blows of any kind ( autopsy)
A tragedy for all as some of these kids had no past of violence but Emery did and was on parole ; Osuna and Craven also had a past
End of story

By: Patty C

Patty C — Sun, 07 Sep 2008 15:02:48 +0000

Are you asking? In the case of employees drinking on the job – maybe.

When I was a CGL claims manager, one of our underwriters placed a collection of Bar/Restaruant LL risks in NJ and PA for a broker who presented them as having negligible loss history.

Right.

I had three horrific death cases from car accidents within the first month!

By: jonathanturley

jonathanturley — Sat, 06 Sep 2008 22:23:53 +0000

Patty C:

There still remains the problem of causation and foreseeability. Dram shop cases usually involve drunk driving or alcohol-caused medical problems. Getting into a fight thirty minutes and some distance after leaving the bar makes this an interesting case. Would a burglary or a property vandalization be included in foreseeable acts against the bar? I can see the arguments on the other side, but the bar has the advantage in starting out, even with a negligence per se instruction.

By: Patty C

Patty C — Sat, 06 Sep 2008 21:27:13 +0000

I don’t think there was that much time or distance involved.

Unless I am reading wrong, they got kicked out at 1am and the attack happened at 1:30am. In the time intervening the girlfriend dropped the boyfriend off, jogged back to the bar, got her own car, overheard threatening conversation, and then drove back to his family’s home to witness the attack as it was occurring.

I’m betting the bar is on the hook, at least partially, if for no other reason than for serving minors and/or continuing to serve these intoxicated patrons.

Whether there is liquor liability insurance coverage is another question altogether.

I also wonder if the pro-surf organization purchases Event coverage separately and/or if they simply verify that a facility has coverage where alcohol will be served.

By: jonathanturley

jonathanturley — Sat, 06 Sep 2008 19:12:52 +0000

Rafflaw:

Very interesting case. Much appreciated. I expect this new case will answer your question as to the effect of time and distance on such a claim.

By: rafflaw

rafflaw — Sat, 06 Sep 2008 17:59:39 +0000

I handled a dram shop case(civil PI) years ago with a Chicago bar that allowed a large group of friends(5-6) get drunk and when they came out of the bar they started beating up one guy in the parking lot. My client and a friend came out of a house across the street and came to the “rescue” of the individual in the parking lot. The drunk group then chased my client across the street and proceeded to beat him with a hockey stick or a baseball bat. Now the distance wasn’t an issue, but there was some time involved and my guy could have run into the house, but tried to stand his ground. We won a pretty good settlement from the bar owners under the dram shop statute, but I always wondered what a jury would have said about my guy not trying to disengage until it was too late.