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	<title>Comments on: Freeman: Chattanooga Police Department Declines to Charge Officer Who Allegedly Threw a 71-Year-Old Man to Floor and a Good Samaritan Through a Glass Door</title>
	<atom:link href="http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/</link>
	<description>Res ipsa loquitur (&#34;The thing itself speaks&#34;)</description>
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		<title>By: anon nurse</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-263527</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[anon nurse]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Aug 2011 12:29:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-263527</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Court Of Appeals Affirms Firing Of Officer Kenneth Freeman
posted March 31, 2011

The Tennessee Court of Appeals has upheld the firing of former Chattanooga Police Officer Kenneth Freeman.

http://www.chattanoogan.com/articles/article_197932.asp]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Court Of Appeals Affirms Firing Of Officer Kenneth Freeman<br />
posted March 31, 2011</p>
<p>The Tennessee Court of Appeals has upheld the firing of former Chattanooga Police Officer Kenneth Freeman.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.chattanoogan.com/articles/article_197932.asp" rel="nofollow">http://www.chattanoogan.com/articles/article_197932.asp</a></p>
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		<title>By: Otteray Scribe</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-263467</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Otteray Scribe]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Aug 2011 05:03:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-263467</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[This is old news from two years ago, but Officer Freeman was fired from the Chattanooga Police Department.

http://chattarati.com/metro/government-politics/2009/8/12/chattanooga-police-department-terminates-officer-k/]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is old news from two years ago, but Officer Freeman was fired from the Chattanooga Police Department.</p>
<p><a href="http://chattarati.com/metro/government-politics/2009/8/12/chattanooga-police-department-terminates-officer-k/" rel="nofollow">http://chattarati.com/metro/government-politics/2009/8/12/chattanooga-police-department-terminates-officer-k/</a></p>
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		<title>By: D Fisher</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-263442</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[D Fisher]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Aug 2011 02:25:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-263442</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[This report says it all. Freeman was in the wrong. http://media.timesfreepress.com/docs/2009/01/Freeman_IA_report_0130.pdf]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This report says it all. Freeman was in the wrong. <a href="http://media.timesfreepress.com/docs/2009/01/Freeman_IA_report_0130.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://media.timesfreepress.com/docs/2009/01/Freeman_IA_report_0130.pdf</a></p>
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		<title>By: bukkake interracial</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-246268</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[bukkake interracial]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 09 Jul 2011 01:17:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-246268</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[advertising and *********** with Adwords. Anyway I?m adding this RSS to my e-mail and could glance out for a lot extra of your respective interesting content. Make sure you update this again soon..]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>advertising and *********** with Adwords. Anyway I?m adding this RSS to my e-mail and could glance out for a lot extra of your respective interesting content. Make sure you update this again soon..</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: smokey</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-84164</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[smokey]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Oct 2009 20:49:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-84164</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Cops are above the law in some places in the united states and in TN all cops are above the law they follow their own set of rules. Everyone should be in fear of police officers]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Cops are above the law in some places in the united states and in TN all cops are above the law they follow their own set of rules. Everyone should be in fear of police officers</p>
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		<title>By: ceanf</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-38499</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[ceanf]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 09 Feb 2009 20:08:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-38499</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[@USA...  come on buddy do you really think that if you, or i, or any other regular citizen for that matter, had thrown an elderly man to the ground and another man through a glass door just because they touched you would NOT be charged with assault? get real. what world do you live in?  they would throw an ordinary citizen in jail, no questions asked.  this is just another sad example of the scalia&#039;s new &#039;professionalism&#039; and the growing divide between the laws that police and citizens are bound to.  it is also sad that there are people such as yourself, who support the police being governed by a different set of laws than citizens.  that said, you must be a pig or related to one.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@USA&#8230;  come on buddy do you really think that if you, or i, or any other regular citizen for that matter, had thrown an elderly man to the ground and another man through a glass door just because they touched you would NOT be charged with assault? get real. what world do you live in?  they would throw an ordinary citizen in jail, no questions asked.  this is just another sad example of the scalia&#8217;s new &#8216;professionalism&#8217; and the growing divide between the laws that police and citizens are bound to.  it is also sad that there are people such as yourself, who support the police being governed by a different set of laws than citizens.  that said, you must be a pig or related to one.</p>
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		<title>By: david</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-38031</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[david]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Feb 2009 03:44:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-38031</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[oh an another thing...get rid of that idiot!!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>oh an another thing&#8230;get rid of that idiot!!</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: david</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-38030</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[david]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Feb 2009 03:42:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-38030</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[some officers tend to use the badge as a...i can do anything i want and get away with it.just because the man brushed his shoulder doesn&#039;mean he was assaulting the officer,that&#039;s a crock of crap!!!he should be fired.the decision by the police department not to prosecute is lame.where is justice to protect the meak little people,especially one who was trying to do his job.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>some officers tend to use the badge as a&#8230;i can do anything i want and get away with it.just because the man brushed his shoulder doesn&#8217;mean he was assaulting the officer,that&#8217;s a crock of crap!!!he should be fired.the decision by the police department not to prosecute is lame.where is justice to protect the meak little people,especially one who was trying to do his job.</p>
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		<title>By: Jed</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-38008</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Jed]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Feb 2009 00:30:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-38008</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[One thing im just not getting.If the cop really thought he was being assaulted, why didnt he just arrest the old man?.Not one post talks about this.Even after he beat the crap out of both men,why didnt he arrest them?.He would still be a moron, but at least he would have some sort of defense.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One thing im just not getting.If the cop really thought he was being assaulted, why didnt he just arrest the old man?.Not one post talks about this.Even after he beat the crap out of both men,why didnt he arrest them?.He would still be a moron, but at least he would have some sort of defense.</p>
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		<title>By: Officer Rams Van Full of Children, Brandishes Weapon, Arrests Father on Baseless Charge, and Receives No Punishment &#171; JONATHAN TURLEY</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-37905</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Officer Rams Van Full of Children, Brandishes Weapon, Arrests Father on Baseless Charge, and Receives No Punishment &#171; JONATHAN TURLEY]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Feb 2009 11:32:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-37905</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] her weapon without apparent cause, terrorizes children, and then files a baseless charge. As in the recent Chattanooga case, the lack of action taken against the officer raises a troubling question of a double standard for [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] her weapon without apparent cause, terrorizes children, and then files a baseless charge. As in the recent Chattanooga case, the lack of action taken against the officer raises a troubling question of a double standard for [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Ed</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-37659</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Ed]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Feb 2009 18:35:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-37659</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[To the cop-lover who suggested that we would all cherish having a cop around if we heard glass-breaking in the middle of the night and some stranger was about to enter, etc. etc. (I&#039;m paraphrasing his entry.)  Uh, moron, you cops are NEVER there in time.  And you don&#039;t have a clue what to do when you do show up.  I can take care of myself just fine if someone tries to break in.  I&#039;m well-armed, as are many people in this country.  We the People solve way more crimes than the mentally ill cops ever will.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To the cop-lover who suggested that we would all cherish having a cop around if we heard glass-breaking in the middle of the night and some stranger was about to enter, etc. etc. (I&#8217;m paraphrasing his entry.)  Uh, moron, you cops are NEVER there in time.  And you don&#8217;t have a clue what to do when you do show up.  I can take care of myself just fine if someone tries to break in.  I&#8217;m well-armed, as are many people in this country.  We the People solve way more crimes than the mentally ill cops ever will.</p>
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		<title>By: Greg</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-36898</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Greg]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Jan 2009 23:08:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-36898</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The Chattanooga Police force must have no standards of conduct for an employee?

This same detective has assaulted someone while on duty
outside a court room and now a elderly Walmart greeter
maybe when Freeman actually hurts someone the city of Chattanooga will be justly sued as well as the administration.....  

Mr.Freeman you woudld no longer represent the law of Chattanooga if I made the decision.... You are an  embrassment Period.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Chattanooga Police force must have no standards of conduct for an employee?</p>
<p>This same detective has assaulted someone while on duty<br />
outside a court room and now a elderly Walmart greeter<br />
maybe when Freeman actually hurts someone the city of Chattanooga will be justly sued as well as the administration&#8230;..  </p>
<p>Mr.Freeman you woudld no longer represent the law of Chattanooga if I made the decision&#8230;. You are an  embrassment Period.</p>
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		<title>By: Police Officer Drives After Drinking, Crashes Into Fountain, Flees the Scene of an Accident, Abandons Car with Gun Inside, and Then Lies to Police . . . And Is Charged With Criminal Damage &#171; JONATHAN TURLEY</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-36794</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Police Officer Drives After Drinking, Crashes Into Fountain, Flees the Scene of an Accident, Abandons Car with Gun Inside, and Then Lies to Police . . . And Is Charged With Criminal Damage &#171; JONATHAN TURLEY]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Jan 2009 12:28:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-36794</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] Many wonder why police seem able to proliferate charges for the most minor offenses of citizens, but seem far more circumspect when dealing with fellow officers, such as the recent case out of Chattanooga. [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Many wonder why police seem able to proliferate charges for the most minor offenses of citizens, but seem far more circumspect when dealing with fellow officers, such as the recent case out of Chattanooga. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Chicago Police Officer Pleads Guilty of Beating 60-Year-Old Man Handcuffed and Shackled to Wheelchair &#171; JONATHAN TURLEY</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-35845</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Chicago Police Officer Pleads Guilty of Beating 60-Year-Old Man Handcuffed and Shackled to Wheelchair &#171; JONATHAN TURLEY]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Jan 2009 15:00:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-35845</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] What is odd is that Cozzi was only sentenced previously to a misdemeanor battery. What does it take to convict a police officer of a felony. Yet, the victim should be satisfied that there was any charge at all given the treatment of a recent case of a Chattanooga police officer. [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] What is odd is that Cozzi was only sentenced previously to a misdemeanor battery. What does it take to convict a police officer of a felony. Yet, the victim should be satisfied that there was any charge at all given the treatment of a recent case of a Chattanooga police officer. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: indieregister</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-35385</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[indieregister]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Jan 2009 06:03:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-35385</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[OK, manhandled may be a bit strong for a grab on the arm. But there&#039;s definitely intent to hold the shopper, and that&#039;s the crux of the issue. Should store employees physically restrain someone simply because an alarm goes off?

Some EAS systems have a digital counter that records every activation. Look at the next one you pass. Unless it&#039;s been very recently reset, you&#039;re likely to see a high double- or low-triple-digit number. If even half of these represented actual shoplifters, police would have to set up a substation in the parking lot. An active sensor triggers the alarm, and while many false positives are due to cashier error, some high-dollar electronics contain EAS sensors inside the packaging that can&#039;t be disabled during checkout. Magnetic strips on credit cards or key cards have been known to trigger the alarms in some cases.

It&#039;s perhaps a minor phenomenon of social conditioning that we pay any heed to a system that cries wolf so often. Most people ignore car alarms and regard them as more irritant than crime deterrent. Why, then, should rational, free thinking adults click their heels together in full halt and open their bags for inspection at the beckoning of a robotic voice? There&#039;s something altogether Pavlovian about this response. You know you didn&#039;t steal, you know the doorway inspection for contraband will be fruitless, so why endure it?

What should store employees do? Well, they&#039;re certainly free to approach customers and ask to see their receipts. As long as it&#039;s an interrogative and not an imperative -- that is, the search is completely voluntary -- they have every right to take that step. But to demand proof of purchase, to hold someone&#039;s cart, to grab them or otherwise restrain them amounts to an irresponsible and indefensible strong-arm witch hunt. In those four states that allow detention for an EAS activation, just because an employee can stop you doesn&#039;t mean he should. The law extends to merchants the right to hold customers, but there is no corollary law requiring those customers to play along. They can keep walking, and if they&#039;re physically restrained, they can refuse to be searched and demand the police be called.

Responsible loss prevention agents don&#039;t detain someone on suspicion alone -- the corresponding number of &quot;bad stops,&quot; or false arrests, would be staggering. To touch a customer and physically prevent him from leaving, you should have nothing less than actual knowledge of shoplifting. That&#039;s the accepted industry practice. That&#039;s why the store has surveillance cameras -- and someone deep in the bowels of the building watching real-time on a monitor.

What should the store do when someone sets off the alarm and waves off the exit search? If LP didn&#039;t see him steal, absolutely nothing! They can follow me to the car and write down my license plate number if they want...as I&#039;m not a thief, I have nothing to worry about. Call the police, you suggest? Call and tell them what? &quot;We think someone maybe stole, but we don&#039;t know. He set off an alarm that goes off dozens of times a day.&quot;?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>OK, manhandled may be a bit strong for a grab on the arm. But there&#8217;s definitely intent to hold the shopper, and that&#8217;s the crux of the issue. Should store employees physically restrain someone simply because an alarm goes off?</p>
<p>Some EAS systems have a digital counter that records every activation. Look at the next one you pass. Unless it&#8217;s been very recently reset, you&#8217;re likely to see a high double- or low-triple-digit number. If even half of these represented actual shoplifters, police would have to set up a substation in the parking lot. An active sensor triggers the alarm, and while many false positives are due to cashier error, some high-dollar electronics contain EAS sensors inside the packaging that can&#8217;t be disabled during checkout. Magnetic strips on credit cards or key cards have been known to trigger the alarms in some cases.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s perhaps a minor phenomenon of social conditioning that we pay any heed to a system that cries wolf so often. Most people ignore car alarms and regard them as more irritant than crime deterrent. Why, then, should rational, free thinking adults click their heels together in full halt and open their bags for inspection at the beckoning of a robotic voice? There&#8217;s something altogether Pavlovian about this response. You know you didn&#8217;t steal, you know the doorway inspection for contraband will be fruitless, so why endure it?</p>
<p>What should store employees do? Well, they&#8217;re certainly free to approach customers and ask to see their receipts. As long as it&#8217;s an interrogative and not an imperative &#8212; that is, the search is completely voluntary &#8212; they have every right to take that step. But to demand proof of purchase, to hold someone&#8217;s cart, to grab them or otherwise restrain them amounts to an irresponsible and indefensible strong-arm witch hunt. In those four states that allow detention for an EAS activation, just because an employee can stop you doesn&#8217;t mean he should. The law extends to merchants the right to hold customers, but there is no corollary law requiring those customers to play along. They can keep walking, and if they&#8217;re physically restrained, they can refuse to be searched and demand the police be called.</p>
<p>Responsible loss prevention agents don&#8217;t detain someone on suspicion alone &#8212; the corresponding number of &#8220;bad stops,&#8221; or false arrests, would be staggering. To touch a customer and physically prevent him from leaving, you should have nothing less than actual knowledge of shoplifting. That&#8217;s the accepted industry practice. That&#8217;s why the store has surveillance cameras &#8212; and someone deep in the bowels of the building watching real-time on a monitor.</p>
<p>What should the store do when someone sets off the alarm and waves off the exit search? If LP didn&#8217;t see him steal, absolutely nothing! They can follow me to the car and write down my license plate number if they want&#8230;as I&#8217;m not a thief, I have nothing to worry about. Call the police, you suggest? Call and tell them what? &#8220;We think someone maybe stole, but we don&#8217;t know. He set off an alarm that goes off dozens of times a day.&#8221;?</p>
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		<title>By: Pedantic</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-35297</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Pedantic]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 19 Jan 2009 13:03:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-35297</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[indieregister:

&quot;Channel 9 has used the word “grabbed” in at least two stories posted online about the incident.&quot;

---------------------------------------

The exact sentence from that article:

&quot;The greeter reportedly told Freeman to stop and grabbed him on the arm.&quot;

We aren&#039;t told who &quot;reported&quot; the grabbing, but since the title of the article is &quot;Chattanooga Officer Tells His Side on Assault Complaint&quot;, we can reasonably that this is the detective&#039;s side of the story.

You should shrink from using the word &quot;manhandled&quot;, because as you know, it implies much more violent behavior than merely &quot;grabbed&quot;.  It is an attempt to strengthen your argument by emotional means, not by effective argumentation.

But, now, a hypothetical.

You seem to have indicated in an earlier post that you don&#039;t think the sounding of the alarm plus the refusal to cooperate should constitute probable cause to detain (I quote):

&quot;I’m truly sorry I neglected to mention that at least four states by my count — Florida, Georgia, Mississippoi and West Virginia — have shoplifting laws that empower merchants to detain and search shoppers who activate the EAS sensors. While I certainly disagree with the law in these cases...&quot;

Suppose a customer, not otherwise suspected of shoplifting, trips the EAS alarm upon leaving the store.  Suppose an employee asks the customer to stop and submit to an inspection of his/her bags, but the customer ignores the request and simply continues walking out of the store.

What would you have the store do in such cases?  Just let the customer go on his way, possibly with stolen merchandise (and, possibly not, of course)?  Take his picture?  Call the police, who won&#039;t get there until the customer is long gone?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>indieregister:</p>
<p>&#8220;Channel 9 has used the word “grabbed” in at least two stories posted online about the incident.&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;</p>
<p>The exact sentence from that article:</p>
<p>&#8220;The greeter reportedly told Freeman to stop and grabbed him on the arm.&#8221;</p>
<p>We aren&#8217;t told who &#8220;reported&#8221; the grabbing, but since the title of the article is &#8220;Chattanooga Officer Tells His Side on Assault Complaint&#8221;, we can reasonably that this is the detective&#8217;s side of the story.</p>
<p>You should shrink from using the word &#8220;manhandled&#8221;, because as you know, it implies much more violent behavior than merely &#8220;grabbed&#8221;.  It is an attempt to strengthen your argument by emotional means, not by effective argumentation.</p>
<p>But, now, a hypothetical.</p>
<p>You seem to have indicated in an earlier post that you don&#8217;t think the sounding of the alarm plus the refusal to cooperate should constitute probable cause to detain (I quote):</p>
<p>&#8220;I’m truly sorry I neglected to mention that at least four states by my count — Florida, Georgia, Mississippoi and West Virginia — have shoplifting laws that empower merchants to detain and search shoppers who activate the EAS sensors. While I certainly disagree with the law in these cases&#8230;&#8221;</p>
<p>Suppose a customer, not otherwise suspected of shoplifting, trips the EAS alarm upon leaving the store.  Suppose an employee asks the customer to stop and submit to an inspection of his/her bags, but the customer ignores the request and simply continues walking out of the store.</p>
<p>What would you have the store do in such cases?  Just let the customer go on his way, possibly with stolen merchandise (and, possibly not, of course)?  Take his picture?  Call the police, who won&#8217;t get there until the customer is long gone?</p>
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		<title>By: indieregister</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-35129</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[indieregister]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Jan 2009 05:42:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-35129</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Mespo,

Your little anecdotes and condescending swipes fail to advance your position. If you&#039;re such a learned scholar, why have you failed repeatedly to answer my challenges to your highly suspect legal theories and instead responded with ad hominem bile?

You don&#039;t prove that you&#039;re correct. You don&#039;t debate. You just repeat yourself.

When I pointed out the shortcomings with your summary of the Sporny case, you remained silent. When I picked apart your assertion that the greeter had probable cause to try to detain the detective, you said nothing.

You and I may respectuflly disagree on some subjects, but I&#039;m a fair person who will admit when he&#039;s wrong. So, prove your point. Enlighten me. Tell me what gave the greeter probable cause to grab Freeman in an attempt to detain him.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mespo,</p>
<p>Your little anecdotes and condescending swipes fail to advance your position. If you&#8217;re such a learned scholar, why have you failed repeatedly to answer my challenges to your highly suspect legal theories and instead responded with ad hominem bile?</p>
<p>You don&#8217;t prove that you&#8217;re correct. You don&#8217;t debate. You just repeat yourself.</p>
<p>When I pointed out the shortcomings with your summary of the Sporny case, you remained silent. When I picked apart your assertion that the greeter had probable cause to try to detain the detective, you said nothing.</p>
<p>You and I may respectuflly disagree on some subjects, but I&#8217;m a fair person who will admit when he&#8217;s wrong. So, prove your point. Enlighten me. Tell me what gave the greeter probable cause to grab Freeman in an attempt to detain him.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: mespo727272</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-35127</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[mespo727272]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Jan 2009 04:57:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-35127</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[indieregister:

&quot;Despite Mespo’s putdown, (s)he hasn’t disputed the fact that the greeter didn’t have probable cause to detain Freeman.&quot;

***********

Your utter misunderstanding of this situation in spite of the black letter law gently shoved under your nose coupled with your chosen profession of independent journalism, force me to repeat a famous line by  former IU coach Bobby Knight. When confronted by an equally clueless reporter asking the same exasperating questions already covered in the answer he just gave, Knight responded &quot;All of us learn to write in the second grade. Most of us go on to greater things.&quot; Knight is assuredly no role model for anything, but his observation of some in the press is spot on.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>indieregister:</p>
<p>&#8220;Despite Mespo’s putdown, (s)he hasn’t disputed the fact that the greeter didn’t have probable cause to detain Freeman.&#8221;</p>
<p>***********</p>
<p>Your utter misunderstanding of this situation in spite of the black letter law gently shoved under your nose coupled with your chosen profession of independent journalism, force me to repeat a famous line by  former IU coach Bobby Knight. When confronted by an equally clueless reporter asking the same exasperating questions already covered in the answer he just gave, Knight responded &#8220;All of us learn to write in the second grade. Most of us go on to greater things.&#8221; Knight is assuredly no role model for anything, but his observation of some in the press is spot on.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: indieregister</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-35119</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[indieregister]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Jan 2009 02:11:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-35119</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Pedantic:

Channel 9 has used the word &quot;grabbed&quot; in at least two stories posted online about the incident.

http://www.newschannel9.com/news/officer_974544___article.html/freeman_charged.html

The Chattanoogan says the greeter &quot;reached to stop&quot; Freeman. That&#039;s pretty vague, and I&#039;ll leave it to others to parse its meaning, but it certainly sounds like some attempt at restraint.

Yes, I used the word manhandled, and I won&#039;t shrink from it. Store employees who use their hands instead of their mouths when they approach customers are at least thoughtless and rude and at the most intentionally trying to intimidate the shopper.

Despite Mespo&#039;s putdown, (s)he hasn&#039;t disputed the fact that the greeter didn&#039;t have probable cause to detain Freeman. Again, no one&#039;s completely innocent here. The greeter was wrong and the detective was dead wrong.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Pedantic:</p>
<p>Channel 9 has used the word &#8220;grabbed&#8221; in at least two stories posted online about the incident.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.newschannel9.com/news/officer_974544___article.html/freeman_charged.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.newschannel9.com/news/officer_974544___article.html/freeman_charged.html</a></p>
<p>The Chattanoogan says the greeter &#8220;reached to stop&#8221; Freeman. That&#8217;s pretty vague, and I&#8217;ll leave it to others to parse its meaning, but it certainly sounds like some attempt at restraint.</p>
<p>Yes, I used the word manhandled, and I won&#8217;t shrink from it. Store employees who use their hands instead of their mouths when they approach customers are at least thoughtless and rude and at the most intentionally trying to intimidate the shopper.</p>
<p>Despite Mespo&#8217;s putdown, (s)he hasn&#8217;t disputed the fact that the greeter didn&#8217;t have probable cause to detain Freeman. Again, no one&#8217;s completely innocent here. The greeter was wrong and the detective was dead wrong.</p>
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		<title>By: mespo727272</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-35014</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[mespo727272]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 Jan 2009 11:34:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-35014</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[indieregister:

&quot;...you’re making me dizzy.&quot;

****************

Though I&#039;d like to, I don&#039;t think I can take credit for that.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>indieregister:</p>
<p>&#8220;&#8230;you’re making me dizzy.&#8221;</p>
<p>****************</p>
<p>Though I&#8217;d like to, I don&#8217;t think I can take credit for that.</p>
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		<title>By: carole</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-35013</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[carole]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 Jan 2009 09:50:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-35013</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I think there are some cop commentors who are taking offense with the rest of us defending the Walmart greeter.  Let me ask you this, If that was your grandfather, or father being shoved to the ground.  Would your stance be different?  My dad wasn&#039;t the greatest human being, but I&#039;d be damned if I EVER let someone get away with shoving him into or onto any floor.  I have seen very littel restraint in alot of cops, and there are alot of crooked cops.  TO me, this is just another cop out of control and needs anger management.  REALLY shoving to the ground?  I think the so called police officer was definitely in the wrong, and should have had the consequences for his actions.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think there are some cop commentors who are taking offense with the rest of us defending the Walmart greeter.  Let me ask you this, If that was your grandfather, or father being shoved to the ground.  Would your stance be different?  My dad wasn&#8217;t the greatest human being, but I&#8217;d be damned if I EVER let someone get away with shoving him into or onto any floor.  I have seen very littel restraint in alot of cops, and there are alot of crooked cops.  TO me, this is just another cop out of control and needs anger management.  REALLY shoving to the ground?  I think the so called police officer was definitely in the wrong, and should have had the consequences for his actions.</p>
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		<title>By: Pedantic</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-35009</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Pedantic]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 Jan 2009 06:58:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-35009</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[In the article at the beginning of all this, we find this sentence, which I have cut and pasted from the article:

&quot;He tried to stop Freeman and pushed against a soft drink machine and to the floor.&quot;

Then in the first response by USA, we find this quote:

“He said he reached to try to stop Det. Freeman and he was pushed against a soft drink machine and to the floor.”

This sentence is not to be found in the article as Turley posted it; we have to go to the Chattanoogan article to find it.

But, USA morphs &quot;reached&quot; to &quot;grabbed&quot;.  For most of the remaining responses the act performed by Walker is called &quot;grabbed&quot;, although this word wasn&#039;t used in any of the articles I&#039;ve seen.

But, now in the immediately previous response by indieregister, &quot;grabbed&quot; becomes &quot;manhandled&quot;.

How these descriptions escalate!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In the article at the beginning of all this, we find this sentence, which I have cut and pasted from the article:</p>
<p>&#8220;He tried to stop Freeman and pushed against a soft drink machine and to the floor.&#8221;</p>
<p>Then in the first response by USA, we find this quote:</p>
<p>“He said he reached to try to stop Det. Freeman and he was pushed against a soft drink machine and to the floor.”</p>
<p>This sentence is not to be found in the article as Turley posted it; we have to go to the Chattanoogan article to find it.</p>
<p>But, USA morphs &#8220;reached&#8221; to &#8220;grabbed&#8221;.  For most of the remaining responses the act performed by Walker is called &#8220;grabbed&#8221;, although this word wasn&#8217;t used in any of the articles I&#8217;ve seen.</p>
<p>But, now in the immediately previous response by indieregister, &#8220;grabbed&#8221; becomes &#8220;manhandled&#8221;.</p>
<p>How these descriptions escalate!</p>
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		<title>By: RepubAnon</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-35005</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[RepubAnon]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 Jan 2009 05:29:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-35005</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Let&#039;s leave one fact out of the scenario: what if this guy wasn&#039;t a police officer - but was instead a criminal defense lawyer?  Would it still be OK for the lawyer to shove the greeter, or push the good samaritan through a plate glass window? 

If not, why not?  Shall we enforce the laws differently depending upon whether we approve (or disapprove) of the alleged perpetrator?  Can we do this and still claim to be a society that values the &quot;rule of law&quot; rather than the rule of man?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Let&#8217;s leave one fact out of the scenario: what if this guy wasn&#8217;t a police officer &#8211; but was instead a criminal defense lawyer?  Would it still be OK for the lawyer to shove the greeter, or push the good samaritan through a plate glass window? </p>
<p>If not, why not?  Shall we enforce the laws differently depending upon whether we approve (or disapprove) of the alleged perpetrator?  Can we do this and still claim to be a society that values the &#8220;rule of law&#8221; rather than the rule of man?</p>
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		<title>By: indieregister</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-35003</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[indieregister]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 Jan 2009 05:06:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-35003</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[You&#039;re talking in circles, mespo, and you&#039;re making me dizzy.

The point we differ on is whether the greeter had PC to detain Freeman on suspicion of shoplifting. His grabbing was the attempted detainment. It would be nonsensical to say that his shoving the greeter helped establish PC for the grab that PRECEDED the shove, now wouldn&#039;t it?

My question to you was and still remains: Did the greeter have probable cause to try to detain Freeman? By your formula of EAS activation plus failure to cooperate, it seems that he didn&#039;t, since there&#039;s no indication that Freeman was uncooperative before the greeter tried to detain him.

Lest anyone accuse me of defending the cop, I&#039;ll say again that his retaliatory shove was a disproportionate use of force response, and Freeman most likely should have been charged with simple assault or its equivalent. While he is held to a higher standard because he&#039;s a police officer, however, two wrongs do not make a right.

The greeter, old and frail and pitiable as many have painted him, was still spry enough to try to manhandle a shopper. I doubt he was meekly trying to get the man&#039;s attention. A tap on the shoulder translates to &quot;Excuse me, sir,&quot; but grabbing someone&#039;s arm is a restraint. You don&#039;t get all handsy with a customer you haven&#039;t even spoken to.

The first wrong belongs to the greeter, and the greater wrong belongs to the detective. Agreed?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You&#8217;re talking in circles, mespo, and you&#8217;re making me dizzy.</p>
<p>The point we differ on is whether the greeter had PC to detain Freeman on suspicion of shoplifting. His grabbing was the attempted detainment. It would be nonsensical to say that his shoving the greeter helped establish PC for the grab that PRECEDED the shove, now wouldn&#8217;t it?</p>
<p>My question to you was and still remains: Did the greeter have probable cause to try to detain Freeman? By your formula of EAS activation plus failure to cooperate, it seems that he didn&#8217;t, since there&#8217;s no indication that Freeman was uncooperative before the greeter tried to detain him.</p>
<p>Lest anyone accuse me of defending the cop, I&#8217;ll say again that his retaliatory shove was a disproportionate use of force response, and Freeman most likely should have been charged with simple assault or its equivalent. While he is held to a higher standard because he&#8217;s a police officer, however, two wrongs do not make a right.</p>
<p>The greeter, old and frail and pitiable as many have painted him, was still spry enough to try to manhandle a shopper. I doubt he was meekly trying to get the man&#8217;s attention. A tap on the shoulder translates to &#8220;Excuse me, sir,&#8221; but grabbing someone&#8217;s arm is a restraint. You don&#8217;t get all handsy with a customer you haven&#8217;t even spoken to.</p>
<p>The first wrong belongs to the greeter, and the greater wrong belongs to the detective. Agreed?</p>
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		<title>By: mespo727272</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-34972</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[mespo727272]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 Jan 2009 00:49:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-34972</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[indieregister&quot;

&quot;Declining a consent search shouldn’t be considered evidence that someone’s guilty. Explain that one to me…please!&quot;

*************

Apparently you have trouble synthesizing separate events into a coherent whole. Failure to agree to a consent search without more doesn&#039;t amount to probable cause, and failing to heed an EAS buzzer doesn&#039;t either. We&#039;re talking about the combination of the two which at least two courts says amounts to probable cause. Much like hydrogen and oxygen combine to make water yet neither is wet. I hope this illustrates the concept which obviously eludes your grasp.

BTW throwing a 71 year old through a plate glass door usually qualifies as &quot;belligerent failure to cooperate&quot; in the minds of most reasonable people, I suspect.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>indieregister&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8220;Declining a consent search shouldn’t be considered evidence that someone’s guilty. Explain that one to me…please!&#8221;</p>
<p>*************</p>
<p>Apparently you have trouble synthesizing separate events into a coherent whole. Failure to agree to a consent search without more doesn&#8217;t amount to probable cause, and failing to heed an EAS buzzer doesn&#8217;t either. We&#8217;re talking about the combination of the two which at least two courts says amounts to probable cause. Much like hydrogen and oxygen combine to make water yet neither is wet. I hope this illustrates the concept which obviously eludes your grasp.</p>
<p>BTW throwing a 71 year old through a plate glass door usually qualifies as &#8220;belligerent failure to cooperate&#8221; in the minds of most reasonable people, I suspect.</p>
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		<title>By: Metro</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-34966</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Metro]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Jan 2009 22:25:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-34966</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[So, all the folks defending the officer&#039;s assault:

Cops are supposed to have and use judgement, and they&#039;re trained, so we are continually told, to use it in life-threatening situations. Is it rational, is it smart,--is it &lt;em&gt;good judgement&lt;/em&gt; to beat down an old man who reaches out and grabs your arm?

Or would anyone with an ounce of brain perhaps simply ask what the individual wanted?

Of course, as some people have stated, the excitement of being touched may have simply triggered the officer&#039;s catlike ninja self-defence reflexes, which also explains why he threw a third party through a plate glass door. Sure ... his catlike ninja reflexes hadn&#039;t been deactivated yet ... that musta been it. Musta been.

The thought that this detective is running around armed makes me glad I don&#039;t live anywhere near him. And you could add some of the authoritarians in the comment thread above to that.

People have been charged with assault for standing on a sidewalk in front of cops, farting near cops, and in other, equally ludicrous circumstances. But a cop beats down on an old man and tosses a stranger through a window and that&#039;s just peachy?

Something is wrong with your mind if you consider this somehow justified.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So, all the folks defending the officer&#8217;s assault:</p>
<p>Cops are supposed to have and use judgement, and they&#8217;re trained, so we are continually told, to use it in life-threatening situations. Is it rational, is it smart,&#8211;is it <em>good judgement</em> to beat down an old man who reaches out and grabs your arm?</p>
<p>Or would anyone with an ounce of brain perhaps simply ask what the individual wanted?</p>
<p>Of course, as some people have stated, the excitement of being touched may have simply triggered the officer&#8217;s catlike ninja self-defence reflexes, which also explains why he threw a third party through a plate glass door. Sure &#8230; his catlike ninja reflexes hadn&#8217;t been deactivated yet &#8230; that musta been it. Musta been.</p>
<p>The thought that this detective is running around armed makes me glad I don&#8217;t live anywhere near him. And you could add some of the authoritarians in the comment thread above to that.</p>
<p>People have been charged with assault for standing on a sidewalk in front of cops, farting near cops, and in other, equally ludicrous circumstances. But a cop beats down on an old man and tosses a stranger through a window and that&#8217;s just peachy?</p>
<p>Something is wrong with your mind if you consider this somehow justified.</p>
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		<title>By: Concerned Citizen</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-34889</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Concerned Citizen]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Jan 2009 11:25:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-34889</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The greeter had actually asked to see Freeman&#039;s reciept PRIOR to the alarm activating which the greeter admitted later that HE WAS THE ONE that accidentally set off the alarm not the officer]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The greeter had actually asked to see Freeman&#8217;s reciept PRIOR to the alarm activating which the greeter admitted later that HE WAS THE ONE that accidentally set off the alarm not the officer</p>
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		<title>By: Shoe Ducking &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Serious Shoe - It only took 14 days&#8230;</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-34887</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Shoe Ducking &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Serious Shoe - It only took 14 days&#8230;]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Jan 2009 10:46:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-34887</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] Interesting discussion: http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-office... [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Interesting discussion: <a href="http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-office.." rel="nofollow">http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-office..</a>. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: indieregister</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-34881</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[indieregister]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Jan 2009 07:54:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-34881</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Mespo: 
As I previously noted, your summary of the Sporny case was incorrect. I&#039;ll give you half credit, as the second case was ruled as you explained it.

You said the greeter had PC to detain Freeman because of the &quot;triggered EAS coupled with the detective’s belligerent failure to cooperate.&quot;

First of all, where&#039;s this belligerent failure to cooperate? None of the media accounts indicate that the greeter asked Freeman to stop or shouted to get his attention -- only that he immediately got grabby. Surely you&#039;re not suggesting that every exiting customer is supposed to instantly freeze on the spot whenever a security alarm sounds.

Maybe Freeman would have gladly and voluntarily showed his receipt. Maybe he would have politely told the greeter that he chose not to be searched. We don&#039;t know that the greeter ever asked. He grabbed.

Secondly, something doesn&#039;t seem to add up in your &quot;Alarm + failure to cooperate = probable cause&quot; equation. What would constitute cooperation? Letting an employee rifle through your bags and review your receipt?

A receipt check is a consent search. It&#039;s our property, they ask for permission to inspect it because (1) private citizens can&#039;t forcibly search, and (2) they don&#039;t have PC to detain. Declining a consent search shouldn&#039;t be considered evidence that someone&#039;s guilty. Explain that one to me...please!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mespo:<br />
As I previously noted, your summary of the Sporny case was incorrect. I&#8217;ll give you half credit, as the second case was ruled as you explained it.</p>
<p>You said the greeter had PC to detain Freeman because of the &#8220;triggered EAS coupled with the detective’s belligerent failure to cooperate.&#8221;</p>
<p>First of all, where&#8217;s this belligerent failure to cooperate? None of the media accounts indicate that the greeter asked Freeman to stop or shouted to get his attention &#8212; only that he immediately got grabby. Surely you&#8217;re not suggesting that every exiting customer is supposed to instantly freeze on the spot whenever a security alarm sounds.</p>
<p>Maybe Freeman would have gladly and voluntarily showed his receipt. Maybe he would have politely told the greeter that he chose not to be searched. We don&#8217;t know that the greeter ever asked. He grabbed.</p>
<p>Secondly, something doesn&#8217;t seem to add up in your &#8220;Alarm + failure to cooperate = probable cause&#8221; equation. What would constitute cooperation? Letting an employee rifle through your bags and review your receipt?</p>
<p>A receipt check is a consent search. It&#8217;s our property, they ask for permission to inspect it because (1) private citizens can&#8217;t forcibly search, and (2) they don&#8217;t have PC to detain. Declining a consent search shouldn&#8217;t be considered evidence that someone&#8217;s guilty. Explain that one to me&#8230;please!</p>
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		<title>By: Concerned Citizen</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-34853</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Concerned Citizen]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Jan 2009 02:28:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-34853</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I do believe that Freeman did overreact, but the bottom line is that If I haven&#039;t done anything wrong and someone grabs my arm and walks around in front of me to stop me I would try to keep the person from doing that also.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I do believe that Freeman did overreact, but the bottom line is that If I haven&#8217;t done anything wrong and someone grabs my arm and walks around in front of me to stop me I would try to keep the person from doing that also.</p>
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		<title>By: Concerned Citizen</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-34852</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Concerned Citizen]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Jan 2009 02:25:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-34852</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[From what I understand the greeter did have any reason to suspect the officer of shoplifting.  So without and probable cause I fail to see how Wal-Marts policy to check reciepts for the sake of seeing reciepts is any different than unlawful detaining.  

I guess the way I see it is that what is the different between stopping people jsut to see their reciepts for the sake of seeing them when there is an appearance of having done nothing wrong and for example a police officer stopping you while driving by him on the street just to see if you have a drivers license and to just check you out for no other reason other than he felt like it.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>From what I understand the greeter did have any reason to suspect the officer of shoplifting.  So without and probable cause I fail to see how Wal-Marts policy to check reciepts for the sake of seeing reciepts is any different than unlawful detaining.  </p>
<p>I guess the way I see it is that what is the different between stopping people jsut to see their reciepts for the sake of seeing them when there is an appearance of having done nothing wrong and for example a police officer stopping you while driving by him on the street just to see if you have a drivers license and to just check you out for no other reason other than he felt like it.</p>
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		<title>By: mespo727272</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-34839</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[mespo727272]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Jan 2009 00:11:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-34839</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[ROTCODDAM:

&quot;A lot less than that has passed for probable cause in false arrest complaints against police officers.&quot;

*********

This is the most elliptical nonsense I have read on this blog. If the arrest lacked probable cause it was unlawful. If a court determined that the circumstances amounted to probable cause it therefore existed. If you mean that police departments routinely dismiss complaints with pre-textual arguments of probable cause, thank you for stating the obvious. That&#039;s why we have courts. 

The point that many have made throughout this thread is that ample probable cause existed for the greeter to detain the officer  due to the triggered EAS coupled with the detective&#039;s belligerent failure to cooperate. That is the holding in the two cases I cited above. I am aware of no case which holds the triggered EAS, in and of itself, warrants a detainer without more.

Stick to the pastry advice. You&#039;ll have more credibility.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>ROTCODDAM:</p>
<p>&#8220;A lot less than that has passed for probable cause in false arrest complaints against police officers.&#8221;</p>
<p>*********</p>
<p>This is the most elliptical nonsense I have read on this blog. If the arrest lacked probable cause it was unlawful. If a court determined that the circumstances amounted to probable cause it therefore existed. If you mean that police departments routinely dismiss complaints with pre-textual arguments of probable cause, thank you for stating the obvious. That&#8217;s why we have courts. </p>
<p>The point that many have made throughout this thread is that ample probable cause existed for the greeter to detain the officer  due to the triggered EAS coupled with the detective&#8217;s belligerent failure to cooperate. That is the holding in the two cases I cited above. I am aware of no case which holds the triggered EAS, in and of itself, warrants a detainer without more.</p>
<p>Stick to the pastry advice. You&#8217;ll have more credibility.</p>
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		<title>By: GreeaterBeater</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-34833</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[GreeaterBeater]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Jan 2009 00:01:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-34833</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[It is nearly impossible for most police officers to recognize criminality in their own ranks. The mindset simply forbids it.

Consider the BART police who stood by, perhaps in shock like all the other witnesses, and did absolutely nothing in response to witnessing a fellow uniformed officer murder a detained, unarmed citizen by shooting him at point blank range as the citizen lay prone on the ground with his hands pinned behind his back by another officer. I&#039;m sure they were surprised. But what is important to understand from the incident is that none of the dozen or so other police present at the time recognized what Officer Mehserle did as being a crime. He wears the same uniform as them. Attends the same roll call. 

The unique cultural mindset of comradeship among law enforcement officers in most agencies simply precludes any consideration, no matter how glaring the evidence, of another officer&#039;s criminality. It&#039;s considered wrong to even think that way.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is nearly impossible for most police officers to recognize criminality in their own ranks. The mindset simply forbids it.</p>
<p>Consider the BART police who stood by, perhaps in shock like all the other witnesses, and did absolutely nothing in response to witnessing a fellow uniformed officer murder a detained, unarmed citizen by shooting him at point blank range as the citizen lay prone on the ground with his hands pinned behind his back by another officer. I&#8217;m sure they were surprised. But what is important to understand from the incident is that none of the dozen or so other police present at the time recognized what Officer Mehserle did as being a crime. He wears the same uniform as them. Attends the same roll call. </p>
<p>The unique cultural mindset of comradeship among law enforcement officers in most agencies simply precludes any consideration, no matter how glaring the evidence, of another officer&#8217;s criminality. It&#8217;s considered wrong to even think that way.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: ROTCODDAM</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-34819</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[ROTCODDAM]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Jan 2009 23:31:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-34819</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&quot;In the case of the greeter, he has an express statutory right as an agent of the shop owner to detain a suspected shoptlifter if he does so with probable cause and in a reasonable manner. Otherwise it is battery in the context of this case.&quot;

Otherwise?
Neat trick.
But &quot;the context of this case&quot; includes the fact that, mistakenly or not, the theft security alarm sounded as detective Freeman was attempting to exit the store. A lot less than that has passed for probable cause in false arrest complaints against police officers. Detective Walker&#039;s associate, Sgt. McPherson, responded by stopping and displaying his receipt for inspection. And there is nothing in the police reports or any of the statements to indicate that Mr. Walker&#039;s attempts to detain Detective Freeman were anything other than reasonable.

It&#039;s also quite neat how you managed to totally ignore the relevant issue: was detective Freeman reasonable to fear for his personal safety under the circumstances, thus justifying his reaction?
You&#039;ll find few who would agree that he is, outside the ranks of Tennessee law enforcement.

Let the local prosecutor charge Mr. Walker with battery if he thinks it is justified (RME). But the fact remains that Detective Freeman should have been arrested at the scene. And unless the prosecutor determined from the evidence that he was reasonable to fear for his safety, Detective Freeman should have been charged and arraigned.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;In the case of the greeter, he has an express statutory right as an agent of the shop owner to detain a suspected shoptlifter if he does so with probable cause and in a reasonable manner. Otherwise it is battery in the context of this case.&#8221;</p>
<p>Otherwise?<br />
Neat trick.<br />
But &#8220;the context of this case&#8221; includes the fact that, mistakenly or not, the theft security alarm sounded as detective Freeman was attempting to exit the store. A lot less than that has passed for probable cause in false arrest complaints against police officers. Detective Walker&#8217;s associate, Sgt. McPherson, responded by stopping and displaying his receipt for inspection. And there is nothing in the police reports or any of the statements to indicate that Mr. Walker&#8217;s attempts to detain Detective Freeman were anything other than reasonable.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s also quite neat how you managed to totally ignore the relevant issue: was detective Freeman reasonable to fear for his personal safety under the circumstances, thus justifying his reaction?<br />
You&#8217;ll find few who would agree that he is, outside the ranks of Tennessee law enforcement.</p>
<p>Let the local prosecutor charge Mr. Walker with battery if he thinks it is justified (RME). But the fact remains that Detective Freeman should have been arrested at the scene. And unless the prosecutor determined from the evidence that he was reasonable to fear for his safety, Detective Freeman should have been charged and arraigned.</p>
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		<title>By: mespo727272</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-34813</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[mespo727272]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Jan 2009 22:58:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-34813</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[ROTCODDAM:

&quot;Physically touching or blocking a person to get their attention has not been viewed by any court of jurisdiction as a form of assault.&quot;

*********

I suppose you mean &quot;battery&quot; here rather than &quot;assault,&quot; but where did you get the idea that intentionally &quot;touching or blocking a person to get their attention&quot; isn&#039;t battery.  Battery is an offensive or injurious touching without legal justification to do so. Surgeons may be sued for battery if they simply exceed the scope of the patient&#039;s consent, so your statement that intentionally touching someone without permission or legal justification isn&#039;t battery just doesn&#039;t hold water. In the case of the greeter, he has an express statutory right as an agent of the shop owner to detain a suspected shoptlifter if he does so with probable cause and in a reasonable manner. Otherwise it is battery in the context of this case. For example if the greeter simply picked someone out of a crowd and grabbed them to shake then down as a shoplifter, that is battery.

Also your reversing the situation isn&#039;t much help either since if the officer is doing the arrest it&#039;s no longer a &quot;citizen&#039;s arrest.&quot; Instead, the officer has express statutory policing authority to  detain and arrest for certain offenses committed in his presence or pursuant to a warrant of arrest. If the suspect resists, he is resisting a prima facie lawful act by the officer which is itself a crime in most jurisdictions.

About the only thing I am getting out of your comment worthwhile is to avoid selling cookies to the detective. I&#039;ll take that sound advice.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>ROTCODDAM:</p>
<p>&#8220;Physically touching or blocking a person to get their attention has not been viewed by any court of jurisdiction as a form of assault.&#8221;</p>
<p>*********</p>
<p>I suppose you mean &#8220;battery&#8221; here rather than &#8220;assault,&#8221; but where did you get the idea that intentionally &#8220;touching or blocking a person to get their attention&#8221; isn&#8217;t battery.  Battery is an offensive or injurious touching without legal justification to do so. Surgeons may be sued for battery if they simply exceed the scope of the patient&#8217;s consent, so your statement that intentionally touching someone without permission or legal justification isn&#8217;t battery just doesn&#8217;t hold water. In the case of the greeter, he has an express statutory right as an agent of the shop owner to detain a suspected shoptlifter if he does so with probable cause and in a reasonable manner. Otherwise it is battery in the context of this case. For example if the greeter simply picked someone out of a crowd and grabbed them to shake then down as a shoplifter, that is battery.</p>
<p>Also your reversing the situation isn&#8217;t much help either since if the officer is doing the arrest it&#8217;s no longer a &#8220;citizen&#8217;s arrest.&#8221; Instead, the officer has express statutory policing authority to  detain and arrest for certain offenses committed in his presence or pursuant to a warrant of arrest. If the suspect resists, he is resisting a prima facie lawful act by the officer which is itself a crime in most jurisdictions.</p>
<p>About the only thing I am getting out of your comment worthwhile is to avoid selling cookies to the detective. I&#8217;ll take that sound advice.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: mespo727272</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-34808</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[mespo727272]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Jan 2009 22:31:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-34808</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[john:

&quot;Cops are filthy power hungry pigs. No more no less. Expect little from their kind.&quot;

*************

I&#039;ll hold you to that mantra the next time you hear the tinkling of breaking glass in your downstairs at night and the rustling of footsteps up toward your bedroom door. Maybe someone who was paid attention to in school will rush to your house armed to defend you. Put them on your speed dial. If I was a cop in your town, you&#039;d need to.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>john:</p>
<p>&#8220;Cops are filthy power hungry pigs. No more no less. Expect little from their kind.&#8221;</p>
<p>*************</p>
<p>I&#8217;ll hold you to that mantra the next time you hear the tinkling of breaking glass in your downstairs at night and the rustling of footsteps up toward your bedroom door. Maybe someone who was paid attention to in school will rush to your house armed to defend you. Put them on your speed dial. If I was a cop in your town, you&#8217;d need to.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Former Federal LEO</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-34804</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Former Federal LEO]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Jan 2009 22:19:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-34804</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[john,

Your statement is unfounded nonsense.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>john,</p>
<p>Your statement is unfounded nonsense.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: john</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-34796</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[john]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Jan 2009 20:57:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-34796</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Cops are filthy power hungry pigs. No more no less. Expect little from their kind.

Cops are simply mad that they never paid attention in school and are stuck in their back-water hick-town.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Cops are filthy power hungry pigs. No more no less. Expect little from their kind.</p>
<p>Cops are simply mad that they never paid attention in school and are stuck in their back-water hick-town.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: ROTCODDAM</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-34793</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[ROTCODDAM]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Jan 2009 20:28:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-34793</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[It&#039;s worth considering the relevant state law on citizen&#039;s arrest in this case. Given the circumstances, Mr. Walker was probably within his rights and the law to attempt to physically restrain a shoplifting suspect (regardless of store policy). The police officer&#039;s reaction is in no way mitigated by any attempt on the part of Mr. Walker to effect such an arrest. And the police officer&#039;s reaction can rightly be viewed in precisely the same light were the roles reversed. Had the police officer attempted to detain Mr. Walker as a shoplifting suspect and been assaulted in this manner, Mr. Walker would be awaiting trial.

Physically touching or blocking a person to get their attention has not been viewed by any court of jurisdiction as a form of assault. (Plenty of big city mayors have tried it with pan handlers.) Otherwise, police officers would face assault prosecutions on a daily basis. But reacting to such touching with a violent assault has almost always been regarded as a crime. Normally the only circumstance to mitigate such a determination would be evidence to support a claim by Detective Freeman that his personal safety was endangered by the touching. But that determination should not be made by the responding police officers investigating the incident. They take statements and collect evidence. Following an arrest, a prosecutor would determine from the statements, evidence, and any follow up interviews if Detective Freeman had reasonable cause to fear for his personal safety when a seventy one year old store employee touched him.

Whatever you do, don&#039;t try to sell any Girl Scout cookies to Detective Freeman this year.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s worth considering the relevant state law on citizen&#8217;s arrest in this case. Given the circumstances, Mr. Walker was probably within his rights and the law to attempt to physically restrain a shoplifting suspect (regardless of store policy). The police officer&#8217;s reaction is in no way mitigated by any attempt on the part of Mr. Walker to effect such an arrest. And the police officer&#8217;s reaction can rightly be viewed in precisely the same light were the roles reversed. Had the police officer attempted to detain Mr. Walker as a shoplifting suspect and been assaulted in this manner, Mr. Walker would be awaiting trial.</p>
<p>Physically touching or blocking a person to get their attention has not been viewed by any court of jurisdiction as a form of assault. (Plenty of big city mayors have tried it with pan handlers.) Otherwise, police officers would face assault prosecutions on a daily basis. But reacting to such touching with a violent assault has almost always been regarded as a crime. Normally the only circumstance to mitigate such a determination would be evidence to support a claim by Detective Freeman that his personal safety was endangered by the touching. But that determination should not be made by the responding police officers investigating the incident. They take statements and collect evidence. Following an arrest, a prosecutor would determine from the statements, evidence, and any follow up interviews if Detective Freeman had reasonable cause to fear for his personal safety when a seventy one year old store employee touched him.</p>
<p>Whatever you do, don&#8217;t try to sell any Girl Scout cookies to Detective Freeman this year.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Concerned Citizen</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-34742</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Concerned Citizen]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Jan 2009 13:42:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-34742</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[According to the report the greeter told police that he had a tag in his pocket and when he turned to tell Freeman to stop he was the one who set off the alarm.  The greeter stated that he forgot that the tag was in his pocket.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>According to the report the greeter told police that he had a tag in his pocket and when he turned to tell Freeman to stop he was the one who set off the alarm.  The greeter stated that he forgot that the tag was in his pocket.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Common Sense</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-34740</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Common Sense]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Jan 2009 12:43:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-34740</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&quot;Rule number 1: NEVER GRAB a POLICE OFFICER; their training is to instantly react to being grabbed, their life may depend on a fast reaction.

The police officer had every right to react to being grabbed.&quot;

They are also trained to handle any situation by de-escalation.  Trying to resolve it peacefully.  So in your opinion if a cop feels a tug on his sleeve he has every right to kick the hell out of that person.  WOW, I feel sorry for the first lost kid that was trained to find a police and gets this guy, he is going to get F#&amp;ked up.  I just hope someone is around to get video of it so you got something to spank the monkey to...]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Rule number 1: NEVER GRAB a POLICE OFFICER; their training is to instantly react to being grabbed, their life may depend on a fast reaction.</p>
<p>The police officer had every right to react to being grabbed.&#8221;</p>
<p>They are also trained to handle any situation by de-escalation.  Trying to resolve it peacefully.  So in your opinion if a cop feels a tug on his sleeve he has every right to kick the hell out of that person.  WOW, I feel sorry for the first lost kid that was trained to find a police and gets this guy, he is going to get F#&amp;ked up.  I just hope someone is around to get video of it so you got something to spank the monkey to&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: MESMERIZE</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-34732</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[MESMERIZE]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Jan 2009 05:13:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-34732</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I take it all back.  I&#039;m an idiot, and I was drunk.  I apologize.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I take it all back.  I&#8217;m an idiot, and I was drunk.  I apologize.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: bilejones</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-34727</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[bilejones]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Jan 2009 03:31:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-34727</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The brutal thugs of the police departments need to be put back in their cages.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The brutal thugs of the police departments need to be put back in their cages.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Former Federal LEO</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-34705</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Former Federal LEO]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Jan 2009 00:20:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-34705</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I do not shop much, although I have had the alarm system trigger on me several times.  Once, and the most embarrassing, the alarm occurred while I was in uniform.  Of course, just like getplaning and other decent, honest shoppers, I always submit to whatever the merchant wants, which most times is, “oh, you are okay, go ahead”.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I do not shop much, although I have had the alarm system trigger on me several times.  Once, and the most embarrassing, the alarm occurred while I was in uniform.  Of course, just like getplaning and other decent, honest shoppers, I always submit to whatever the merchant wants, which most times is, “oh, you are okay, go ahead”.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: getplaning</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-34704</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[getplaning]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Jan 2009 23:53:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-34704</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[USA, Mesmerize-
I can&#039;t tell you how many times the door alarm has gone off as I leave Target, Walmart, Sam&#039;s, you-name-it. When the door checker asks to see my reciept, I always cheerfully show it to them. I am helping them do their jobs, and that&#039;s my job as a customer. Anyone who resists or refuses is acting like a criminal, don&#039;t you agree?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>USA, Mesmerize-<br />
I can&#8217;t tell you how many times the door alarm has gone off as I leave Target, Walmart, Sam&#8217;s, you-name-it. When the door checker asks to see my reciept, I always cheerfully show it to them. I am helping them do their jobs, and that&#8217;s my job as a customer. Anyone who resists or refuses is acting like a criminal, don&#8217;t you agree?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Former Federal LEO</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-34694</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Former Federal LEO]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Jan 2009 21:51:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-34694</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Hey Mike Spindell,

My aged mind is likely not more that 1/2 a step behind yours at best; however, it is more likely 2 steps ahead of yours in &#039;mind going&#039; agedness.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey Mike Spindell,</p>
<p>My aged mind is likely not more that 1/2 a step behind yours at best; however, it is more likely 2 steps ahead of yours in &#8216;mind going&#8217; agedness.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Deirdre Helfferich</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-34691</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Deirdre Helfferich]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Jan 2009 21:23:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-34691</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[One thing an officer of the law is supposed to be able to do is SHOW GOOD JUDGEMENT. Recognizing the difference between a threatening situation and a normal one is a vital skill for a person who is licensed to use deadly force; it&#039;s part of regular training. This officer clearly showed an inability to distinguish between the two types of situations--which is a serious hazard not only to the public, but to the officer himself. He can create dangerous situations where none existed before. 

The Chattanooga Police Department, in giving no accountability for this extremely poor behavior on the part of its officer, has demonstrated nothing less than corruption and really, really stupid policy. Recall the recent shooting in Oakland--this is simply an example of the same kind of thing. Should the man have been shot because he reached toward the officer, would that have been justified? What if the greeter had had a heart attack or some other physical trauma as a result of the assault? Should the officer have been exonerated for manslaughter if the glass his other victim went through had sliced the carotid artery? The three (officer and victims) of them were lucky that this didn&#039;t turn out worse.

As Tom Baker said above, there is absolutely no excuse for what the officer did, and there is absolutely none for the Chattanooga Police Department&#039;s response to the situation. Both the department and the officer have been irresponsible in the extreme.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One thing an officer of the law is supposed to be able to do is SHOW GOOD JUDGEMENT. Recognizing the difference between a threatening situation and a normal one is a vital skill for a person who is licensed to use deadly force; it&#8217;s part of regular training. This officer clearly showed an inability to distinguish between the two types of situations&#8211;which is a serious hazard not only to the public, but to the officer himself. He can create dangerous situations where none existed before. </p>
<p>The Chattanooga Police Department, in giving no accountability for this extremely poor behavior on the part of its officer, has demonstrated nothing less than corruption and really, really stupid policy. Recall the recent shooting in Oakland&#8211;this is simply an example of the same kind of thing. Should the man have been shot because he reached toward the officer, would that have been justified? What if the greeter had had a heart attack or some other physical trauma as a result of the assault? Should the officer have been exonerated for manslaughter if the glass his other victim went through had sliced the carotid artery? The three (officer and victims) of them were lucky that this didn&#8217;t turn out worse.</p>
<p>As Tom Baker said above, there is absolutely no excuse for what the officer did, and there is absolutely none for the Chattanooga Police Department&#8217;s response to the situation. Both the department and the officer have been irresponsible in the extreme.</p>
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		<title>By: tom baker</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-34657</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[tom baker]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Jan 2009 16:27:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-34657</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[There are several posters here who I hope get the privilege of being beaten or tasered (or having a loved one beaten or tasered) for looking at a cop the wrong way.

There is NO EXCUSE for what that officer did. None.

A badge is not a license to be a belligerent asshole.

You jackbooters defending him should find a nice police state to live in. For the time being, this isn&#039;t one.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There are several posters here who I hope get the privilege of being beaten or tasered (or having a loved one beaten or tasered) for looking at a cop the wrong way.</p>
<p>There is NO EXCUSE for what that officer did. None.</p>
<p>A badge is not a license to be a belligerent asshole.</p>
<p>You jackbooters defending him should find a nice police state to live in. For the time being, this isn&#8217;t one.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Joe Strummer</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-34647</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Joe Strummer]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Jan 2009 14:21:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-34647</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Republicans have spent 30 years building a police state. Now cops are running amok. It&#039;s going to take a long time to undo the damage the GOP hath wrought.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Republicans have spent 30 years building a police state. Now cops are running amok. It&#8217;s going to take a long time to undo the damage the GOP hath wrought.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: ba'al</title>
		<link>http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/10/freeman-chattanooga-police-department-declines-to-charge-officer-who-threw-a-71-year-old-man-to-floor-and-a-good-samaritan-through-a-glass-door/#comment-34643</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[ba'al]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Jan 2009 12:54:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jonathanturley.org/?p=6977#comment-34643</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[What would have happened if the person who assaulted these two Walmart employees had not been a cop?  Obviously they would be arrested.  So, the fact that this guy was a cop changes things?  Why?  How? 

Aside from the legal issues, this guy is a bully.  He should certainly not be a cop.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What would have happened if the person who assaulted these two Walmart employees had not been a cop?  Obviously they would be arrested.  So, the fact that this guy was a cop changes things?  Why?  How? </p>
<p>Aside from the legal issues, this guy is a bully.  He should certainly not be a cop.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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