Fox Anchor Interviews Scholar Over Book On Jesus By Repeatedly Referencing His Islamic Faith

Reza_AslanIn the interview below, Fox News Lauren Green is interviewing the author of a new book on Jesus Christ. However, Green appears to be incapable of getting over that academic/author Reza Aslan is a Muslim. While Fox and the other networks routinely interview Christian and Jewish experts on Islam (including highly biased authors), it appears inconceivable that a Muslim would ever write a book on Christianity.


Ironically, Aslan once converted to Christianity and then converted back to Islam. However, it is his current religion that seems to be the stumbling block for Green:

GREEN: This is an interesting book. Now I want to clarify, you’re a Muslim, so why did you write a book about the founder of Christianity?

ASLAN: Well to be clear, I am a scholar of religions with four degrees — including one in the New Testament, and fluency in biblical Greek, who has been studying the origins of Christianity for two decades — who also just happens to be a Muslim. So it’s not that I’m just some Muslim writing about Jesus, I am an expert with a Ph.D in the history of religions…

GREEN: But it still begs the question why would you be interested in the founder of Christianity?

ASLAN: Because it’s my job as an academic. I am a professor of religion, including the New Testament. That’s what I do for a living, actually.

The interview repeatedly return to his religion as the most interesting aspect of the interview. It is a highly disturbing interview and a powerful example of how Muslims face double standards in their treatment in the media.

143 thoughts on “Fox Anchor Interviews Scholar Over Book On Jesus By Repeatedly Referencing His Islamic Faith

  1. I saw this story and it disgusts me. There is no hope for our society if people cannot get past someone’s religion. According to Fox News, a Jewish person cannot learn about the Christian faith and a Muslim cannot learn about the Christian Faith, but the Christians know everything about those terrorist Muslims. Scary.

  2. The interviewer should be fired. To ignore the academic achievement this fellow has a reached simply shows her level of ignorance. She had a predetermined outcome and asked questions to obtain the outcome.

  3. But raff! If’n a blasphemer ever read the (insert holy book of choice here) or about their history or even thought about it they’d burst into flames! So academic study of those subject is absolutely out of the question for non-believers.

    Unless you’re fire proof.

    FAUXNews! Boldly marching into the 13th Century!

  4. GREEN: This is an interesting book. Now I want to clarify, you’re a Muslim, so why did you write a book about the founder of Christianity?

    ASLAN: This is an interesting discussion. Now, I want to clarify–you’re an idiot…so why were you hired to interview people on a news program?

  5. I saw that interview and it was such a stunning examination of bad journalism I bookmarked the interview!

    Below is a link to the longer version of the interview. The interviewer becomes increasingly combative and aggressive in challenging his credibility and then, at the end of the interview, alleges that he is concealing that he is a muslim, which he has not.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/07/27/reza-aslan-fox-zealot_n_3665211.html

    Ms Greene has this as her qualifications, kind of far afield from journalism:

    “Green is well known as a concert pianist with a degree in piano performance from The University of Minnesota.”

  6. I’ve seen Reza Aslan on CNN & MSNBC several times & had seen this post on Facebook last night. So I went to Amazon thinking I might get the book, but was surprised it only had 2.5 stars to a rating! When I started reading some of the reviews, which so many of them were 5 stars (!), and then I read that “someone” seemed to be trying to sabotage the book, by giving a barrage of 1 star reviews!!! Something doesn’t seem right here! Aan is a bright scholar!

  7. lottakatz, I as well watched the 9 minute interview. I could not stop watching. It’s like a 9 minute train wreck!! Mr Aslan showed more patience than I thought a human was capable. How he didn’t get up after the 4th time he was challenged is beyond me. Kudos for him. ….. I did get a kick out of the looks on his face. I imagine he was amazed at how many buckets of stupid Ms Green was spilling on herself.

  8. I do not care about his credentials in human wisdom. Jesus is God. When Jesus walked on earth he was God with blood in him. Muslims will deny that. When Jesus rose up from the dead walked through the rock at the entrance to the tomb not having blood in him. The stone had to be rolled away for people with blood in them to look in. Jesus walked through a wall to talk to his disciples. The doors were locked. Had Moses or Abraham seen Jesus being resurrected would have recognized Jesus as being the same being they saw in the old thousands of years ago. I bet that so called experts never said that. He is a boaster. He has no truth. He wants to support islamic views not any Christian view at all. When pressed he will say that Jesus is according to his view is a great prophet. That puts him on the same level as John the baptist. This guy is a lot of hot air nothing more. His intent is to try to make Islam extractive to Real Christians.Don’t fall for that guy. They think that saying the word great prophet in front of the name Jesus shows respect. They are lying. That is what is known as loving with dissimulation deception. Muslims are known for that.

  9. Yeah that is messed up. Ive seen Christians attacked the same way by the progressives though.

    Btw….PROGRESSIVES ARE INSANE !!!!!

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2008453/School-bans-bid-stop-children-falling-gender-stereotypes.html#ixzz1Qb9NNxwz

    School In Sweden Trying To Get Rid Of Gender Stereotypes

    A school in Sweden is trying to get rid of gender stereotypes by banning the use of pronouns like “him” and “her.” The pre-school, called Egalia, is located in Stockholm. In addition to the avoidance of designations that might betray the gender of the child, Egalia also plans out the kind of toys the kids play with, the books they read, and the different colors they are surrounded with, all with the goal of removing stereotypes.

    The country of Sweden is trying to reach gender equality by starting very early with children; the pre-school is trying to put this into practice. The idea is that males have an unfair edge in society that must be rectified.

    Teacher Jenny Johnsson says:

    “Society expects girls to be girlie, nice and pretty and boys to be manly, rough and outgoing. Egalia gives them a fantastic opportunity to be whoever they want to be.”

    Some of the school’s methods include:

    Placing lego’s next to toy kitchens, “to make sure the children draw no mental barriers between cooking and construction”
    Making almost every children’s book center around homosexual couples, single parents or adopted children
    Placing emphasis on tolerance of gay, lesbian, bisexual, and transgender people
    Experimenting with “new ideas” like more than one “mother” during roleplay
    Using the word “hen” to refer to a visitor instead of “han” or “hon” (him/her in Swedish). The use of “Hen” is genderless

    Not everybody is gung ho about these methods of trying to eliminate gender roles/gender stereotypes. Jay Belsky from University of California, said:

    “The kind of things that boys like to do – run around and turn sticks into swords – will soon be disapproved of. So gender neutrality at its worst is emasculating maleness.”

  10. gene, there have been posting issues lately where posts dont show up so people are posting the same thing to try and get it to show up.

  11. get real,

    I’m fully aware of the spam filter problem. Hughes does that even when the spam filter is working fine.

  12. Must be slow news day – this is the best you all have to discuss….and with such great venom too. Must be a nice luxury to sit in your basements and torch everything anyone says about anything while the real world spins right by you. Grow up or find another hobby.

  13. His background could involve a deep understanding of Greek myth: It’s still real people pretending to know the wills of blatantly fictional characters that were invented by our ignorant ancestors.

    Every time religious people talk about religion, swap out the characters and replace them with Othello and Hamlet.

    Sects are like Shakespearian devotees all arguing over which play is the real truth.

    Bunk.

  14. While I fully agree that the interview was of such low quality, I cannot agree that Aslan’s work is scholarly, factual or original. Nor can I accept that it is not written with an agenda. His religion DOES play a huge role. While stating that the gospels are just myths, his arguments are all based and backed by the gospels. Aslan is good at playing with words on his gullible readers. Please read the book before ye judge his work.

  15. They’re not racist. It’s just that the Professor over and over has to keep telling the fox talking head his academic credentials qualify him to write a book about Jesus, even though in her white racist thinking, his religion makes him a sub-human who should never dare even think he has any right to comment on anything Christian.

  16. Please compare Aslan’s book with the 3 works of S.G.F.Brandon on Jesus, written in 1951, 1967 (Jesus and the Zealots) and 1968; you will see a lot of overlap. Aslan’s work is just old wine in a new bottle. His faith helps him to express the idea more powerfully. Aslan’s earlier work on Allah, extolling his greatness and mercy, in his book “No God, but God” will reiterate what I say.

  17. L. Green may be caught up in a dogma storm:

    A Franciscan priest sits down next to a Jesuit priest while riding a train to Rome. After a while the Franciscan notices that the Jesuit is smoking and praying.

    Franciscan: I’m surprised to see you doing that. Jesuit: Why’s that? Franciscan: Well, our order asked the Holy Father for permission to do that and were denied.

    Jesuit: Really? We asked the Pope, and he said we could. What did you ask him?

    Franciscan: We asked if we could smoke while we prayed, and he said no.

    Jesuit: Ahhhh! That’s the problem. We Jesuits asked if we could pray while we smoked, and he said, “of course!”

    Dogma is tricky and nuanced sometimes.

  18. Sam, July 29, 2013 at 6:48 am

    While I fully agree that the interview was of such low quality, I cannot agree that Aslan’s work is scholarly, factual or original. Nor can I accept that it is not written with an agenda. His religion DOES play a huge role. While stating that the gospels are just myths, his arguments are all based and backed by the gospels. Aslan is good at playing with words on his gullible readers. Please read the book before ye judge his work.
    =============================
    The Koran calls Jesus a prophet, Judaism says that too, only Judaism says Jesus was a false prophet.

    The Koran also says the books of the Bible are scripture.

  19. There are many people with casts amounts of knowledge…. I would trust someone with these credentials to write a book about such subjects….

  20. Jonathan,

    This has nothing to do with the content of your comments. As a site dedicated to free speech, we do not like to delete comments or bar commenters. I am the only one who can ban anyone from the site. However, you continue to post repeated comments that are interrupting the flow of the blog. Please do not post the same comment more than once. I have deleted two identical comments to your last comment, but I cannot monitor the comments due to professional obligations. I need people to respect the common forum of the blog and not clog the comment lines with repeated identical posting. You help would be much appreciated.

    Jonathan Turley

  21. This is a perfect example of how convincing a media personality can be. To any reasonable person this is merely a tool with the credibility of being black on a conservative show, well articulated, and neutral with an inquisitive intensity. All in all one would expect some sort of unbiased position here with control and clarity. She is nothing more than some pencil/pen twirling idiot stooge for a conservative media. Her concerned focus and obvious plan of attack take her out of the realm of journalism and into that of late night evangelical shows where she should add a few inches to her hairdo.

    The really scary thing here is that this ability to appear legitimate pervades our political and judicial system. Citizens receive information that is mostly, if not all, vehicle with little, or wrong content. The message is the massage.
    Judges, Senators, Congressmen, and other politicians/hacks who have been elected based on media barrages like this, make up most of our government and judiciary.

  22. That the author’s faith is not present in his academic work is, however, impossible to accept. The man is obviously searching for an answer through an organized religion-islam to catholicism, then back to islam- as well as the scholastic method. A certain amount of bias will always exist when one is spiritually and emotionally linked to the topic. At least the author has made an effort to present his version of the topic in an organized and accepted method. Scholasticism is the science of knowledge which is based on the attempt to surface everything relevant, organize this relevancy in a way accepted by scholars from all denominations, and present it openly for discussion. The woman would have done a better job to focus on his scholasticism and his faith. It is the same for Jews, Christians, and all believer/scholars. It is accepted that the story of Jesus was written several generations after his death. It was written slowly and carefully. There was and is no evidence, even that he existed let alone performed at any of the events in the stories. Homer’s stories were oratory until put down in words. There was a Troy, economic rivalry between the Eastern Greeks and the Western Greeks, people believed in gods. But for a few twists and turns here and there and the mother of an emperor, we could be worshiping someone else now. For myself, regardless of whether or not the author is Islamic, Jewish, or Christian, he is a scholar and is making an attempt at being unbiased. The woman leading the charge is simply a fool and unfortunately the type of fool that too many people listen to.

  23. Dredd – I am not here to argue a case for Jesus. I was only commenting on the book of Aslan and trying to impress that there was nothing original about this book and that it had a lot to do with Aslan’s faith, rather than his doctorate. You have to study this book in the light of his earlier book. The stupidity of the Fox anchor does not give leverage to his book. Fox is known for such bigotry. But Aslan’s bigotry cannot be ignored either on the basis of his education. Scholars are humans. We tend to forget this fact in America.

  24. LAUREN GREEN: Welcome back to Fox News! Today we’re pleased to have on our show one of the legendary songwriters of all time, Irving Berlin. Mr. Berlin, I have a rather pointed question to ask you. You wrote “White Christmas” and “Easter Parade,” did you not?

    BERLIN: Yes, I did.

    GREEN: But, Mr. Berlin, you yourself are Jewish, are you not?

    BERLIN: Yes, I am.

    GREEN: So what I’m wondering, Mr. Berlin, is whatever makes you think you are qualified to write songs about Christmas and Easter when you yourself are Jewish?

    BERLIN: Well, they’re just holiday songs–

    GREEN: Yes, but Christmas and Easter are CHRISTIAN holidays.

    BERLIN: That’s true, but–

    GREEN: I’m just wondering why you, as a Jewish man, would choose to write songs about Christian holidays. I mean, you’ve never written a Christmas card, or walked down Fifth Avenue with a woman wearing an Easter bonnet.

    BERLIN: I’m a songwriter. I write songs about things people enjoy, songs about life. I don’t understand–

    GREEN: But Mr. Berlin, I just don’t understand why you feel yourself qualified to write songs about Christian celebrations when you yourself are not Christian.

    BERLIN: But there’s nothing particularly Christian about snow, or a pretty woman in a spring hat–

    GREEN: I guess I’m just puzzled, Mr. Berlin. It doesn’t seem to me that you’re qualified to write about such Christian subjects, is all.

    BERLIN: But they’re not Christian. What, I’m only qualified to write “White Hanukkah,” or “Purim Parade”?

    GREEN: Mr. Berlin, I just don’t see why you would choose these topics for your songs, that’s all.

    BERLIN: Oy vey.

  25. I am real. I am telling all what really is not what religions tell you. I Know what his intent is. He does not Know Jesus who is Lord. He will deny that. I know what is on his mind.

  26. Prof. Turley speaks of the double standard Muslims face from the media based upon this one interview. I agree that this interview is somewhat disturbing, but this stems from the fact that this interviewer needs some education about religion scholars and the relationship between Islam and Jesus. There are examples of a double standard working the other way also, ones which favor Islam over Christianity.

    An interesting observation concerns the comments that assume all of Fox News is as bad as this one interview. Such comments are motivated by the same kind of bias as this interviewer and represent a double standard in regards to perceptions about news agencies where Fox News is regarded in a negative light, even though polls consistently show Fox News to be more trusted than the other news agencies. (e.g.,
    http://townhall.com/tipsheet/katiepavlich/2013/04/30/new-poll-viewers-choose-fox-news-over-cnn-as-most-trusted-news-source-n1582800

    http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Journalism/2013/04/25/Poll-Fox-Most-Believable-CNN-Least-Believable
    ).

  27. She also misuses “begging the question”. Yes, I know there is a push to accept this misuse, since it is so widespread. I disagree with that. Your mileage may vary.

  28. Jonathan: No, I am real. And I am telling all what really is not what you tell them. I Know what your intent is. You do not Know Jesus. You will deny that. But I know what is on your mind.

  29. I think this reporter should be given a forum to play the piano and comment, a female Victor Borge. That may help her find a better rhythm and harmony to her questions.

  30. Gods light in me will torch evil wherever it is. Even fox news knows that so called scholars intent is to glorify Islam not Jesus who is the Lord God of all that is seen and unseen.

  31. Hi JH,

    I don’t have time for long debates. But I do have a couple of questions for you, if you can directly answer them without repeating dogma. Now if you can only parrot back to me what your preacher says, then you really shouldn’t be here wasting everyone’s time. I have maybe even more than two questions about your faith, if you don’t mind really answering from your soul and being truthful as best you can.

    1) Is Jesus the God of Abraham? And if you answer yes, does that men that the God who created the entire universe was a man?

    2) I want to know what you think about church history. Do you go to an actual church every Sunday that’s the same church? Do you believe like many Christians that your church is the very same church founded by Jesus?

    Remember be from the heart and honest, NOT HATEfUL

  32. JH,

    You sort of answered me and then you totally didn’t answer me. I asked you two yes or no questions. Is jesus the God of Abraham and do you go to the church founded by Jesus 2,000 years ago?

    You undermine yourself when you proclaim the Bible is corrupted. You say the Bible is corrupted in one breath and in the next, you start quoting it. Can you see how this is sort of not a straight line of thinking?

    You seem to be saying we should not have jails or the death penalty. That is fine detail and I am asking you general questions. I don’t think that because you write comments here, everyone in the world will disband their court systems tomorrow and end the death penalty.

    I am asking you about what you believe, but I am kind of busy. Can you tell me what you believe about Jesus and your church?

    If you can’t, it’s kool….just asking

  33. DavidM,

    Of all the humorous comments in this thread, yours are quite possibly the funniest. Polls consistently show Fox News most trusted!!? Among pinheads and republicans. Considering that studies show Fox consistently reports inaccurate facts and falsehoods, all you’re saying is that America is getting stupider and more gullible

  34. RTC wrote: “Polls consistently show Fox News most trusted!!? Among pinheads and republicans.”

    No, the polls I linked to were done by left leaning groups, like the Huffington Post.

    RTC wrote: “Considering that studies show Fox consistently reports inaccurate facts and falsehoods, all you’re saying is that America is getting stupider and more gullible”

    Yes, that is true too, but in reality, it mostly is the case of picking the lesser of the unreliable. Every news organization is affected by bias and slants the news through their own lens. The news organizations often make mistakes too, all of them, not just Fox News. Some are worse than others. The polls seem to indicate outlets like CNN or MSNBC are less trusted than Fox News. I realize that many here get their news from left leaning sources, so they love to use the epithet Faux News because their favorite propaganda doesn’t have center stage there, but the polls are factually true, that Fox News is the most trusted news source among all Americans.

    What is interesting to me are how the left leaning news groups will constantly publish stats showing that Fox News is declining in popularity, but at the same time omit divulging that Fox News still remains the most trusted news organization. Not honest reporting at all. Very misleading to those they service.

  35. Elaine M:

    GREEN: This is an interesting book. Now I want to clarify, you’re a Muslim, so why did you write a book about the founder of Christianity?

    *******************
    “This is an interesting book, Mr. Gibbon. Now I want to to clarify, you’re an Englishman, so why did you write a book about the Romans.”

    The same mentality that suggest unless your physician has had cancer herself she has no business treating you for it.

    What a moroon!!

  36. Judaism Denys Jesus as Lord one way. Qur’an denies Jesus as Lord in another way making him equal to John the Baptist. Thomas did not deny Jesus as Lord at all. Satan denies Jesus every which way. Who is in Judaism and the Muslim religion at this point in time?

  37. Judaism denies Jesus as Lord one way. Qur’an denies Jesus as Lord in another way making him equal to John the Baptist. Thomas did not deny Jesus as Lord at all. Satan denies Jesus every which way. Who is in Judaism and the Muslim religion at this point in time?

  38. I do not want a post to have an error on it. The post I posted last in a sequence would be the one with the fewer errors. I do my best to find them correcting them. Had this web page be like other web pages I would not have to do what you are seeing. The comments are not identical.

  39. Jesus got false accusations too. I defend people religions spotted with the world oppress with man made laws using Gods word like it was a gun. I do not do that stop giving false Pharisaical accusations abominable accusations. The people that are fanatical are against the-people I defend like the minding there own business gay, zoosexual, furry, clothing optional person. Fanatics hire police men and make legal buildings to condemn people. Fanatics influence people to kill like the Taliban and eye for eye sharia following Muslims and USA military. They are fanatics. I am against them. Bow your head saying you are sorry for your false words.

  40. Had the Lord be on your mind our spirits would be one. My intent is to make the fire in Gog and Magog smaller than God would have seen when humanity fell. There is no way you would have known that. That lake is chaff burning. What reality is is this: That Muslim guy favoring islamic law is anti Christ. He does not know what Christian is. Nether do you. A Christian does not do what is in following verse but Muslims have done that demanded in Qur’an. West has done the same perverting Scripture KJV. It has to be agreed that Jesus is not in either them.John 10:10
    King James Version (KJV)
    10 The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly.
    Shara law does not give life being a thief. Legal a system military and police do not give life being a thief. That so called scholar is also a thief at heart.

  41. JH,

    I guess that means you refuse to address me and actually speak to me about your faith…I tried…..but you seem like just another deep end Christian dude who can’t openly talk about what you believe other than to command everyone else to follow you. You are here pretending you get to order people about how we should pray. No Muslim is here demanding anyone follow Islam. The only fanatic here shoving their religion in a very VERY intolerant way is YOU.

    Like we can’t ignore you….(smile)…PEACE!

  42. Imposable for me t be hurtful. I will give you truth religions held in a safe opened by me. My teacher is the Holy spirit and only the Holy spirit. I am at odds with the preaches I have faced even as Jesus was at odds with the religions people of his time when he had blood in him. 1, Jesus is the God of Abraham. Like I said before hadj Abraham been raised seeing Jesus with blood in him would have said my Lord and My God. The spirit of God resided in a body with blood in him. in the same body Abraham a saw and the same body Moses saw on the mount. Upon rising from the dead was exactly like what Moses saw and what Abraham saw. In spirit Jesus needs to be in our body with blood in it to overcome even as he overcame. Over come like Christ overcame refute to call jehad power refusing to calling war power refusing calling anywhere power.
    2, Church history patterned themselves after the people that rejected Jesus. That is why we have what we have. I do not go to any church what so ever. I sat in on a bible study once but when the people in the church started to see the truth that is in me the pastor escorted b me to the door. I showed that the gays are not wanting worse for anyone thus are not sodomites at all.
    What is in me is what Jesus intended not what is. I see Christs church outside of man made walls. The churches made with walls are founded on Peter, Judas, and Barabbas. Their reflection is seen in what we have that needs to be ground to powder for the souls sake of many.

  43. David,

    Your reply to RTC was not in the spam filter when I looked. It must have been eaten by the WordPress Vortex of Doom ™. Try again if you like.

  44. Keep this one.This is edited. It is Imposable for me to be hurtful. I will give you truth religions held in a safe opened by me. My teacher is the Holy spirit and only the Holy spirit. I am at odds with the preaches I have faced even as Jesus was at odds with the religions people of his time when he had blood in him. 1, Jesus is the God of Abraham. Like I said before had Abraham been raised seeing Jesus with blood in him would have said my Lord and My God. The spirit of God resided in a body with blood in him. in the same body Abraham saw and the same body Moses saw on the mount. Upon rising from the dead was exactly like what Moses saw and what Abraham saw. In spirit Jesus needs to be in our body with blood in it to overcome even as he overcame. Over come like Christ overcame refuse to call jehad power refusing to calling war power refusing calling war power.
    2, Church history patterned themselves after the people that rejected Jesus. That is why we have what we have. I do not go to any church what so ever. I sat in on a bible study once, but when the people in the church started to see the truth that is in me the pastor escorted b me to the door. I showed that the gays are not wanting worse for anyone thus are not sodomites at all.
    What is in me is what Jesus intended not what is. I see Christs church outside of man made walls. The churches made with walls are founded on Peter, Judas, and Barabbas. Their reflection is seen in what we have that needs to be ground to powder for the souls sake of many.

  45. “Keep this one.This is edited.”

    Or how about this Jonathan? You make sure your stuff is carefully edited to say exactly what you want before you hit “Post Comment”.

    Your cooperation on these matters is greatly appreciated.

  46. Okay, you believe Jesus is the God who created the universe and everything in it, but you do not go to church.

    The idea of Jesus being the God of Abraham comes directly from the Catholics. Did you know that? Are you going to pretend that this doctrine reached you through some sneak route that does not involve church institutions? Were you just sitting in your bed one night, totally unaware of Christian doctrine and then you just happened to decide you would follow the edicts of the Council of Nicaea?

    But really I have a bigger question for you. You claim the spirit, but the spirit is not easily offended, so I as I ask politely, please think and give me a calm answer.

    This is my BIG question for you:

    You claim a man as your god, who in your book it says the man died. Does that mean that death can claim your god? Does your god die? You see that confuses me because the God of Abraham says He is eternal.

    Eternal means you cannot die.

    If you die and come back, that’s reincarnation. So you believe your god redeemed you by dying and coming back, but you want to say that’s not reincarnation? (Webster’s plays that game) But the coming back is not where I question you and what you believe.

    You worship a god who dies?

    Was he vulnerable to death back then but now he’s not? Where in your scripture does your god promise you he won’t die again? My understanding of Christianity says he died to forgive you your sins. Because your god was unable to say “you are forgiven”????? The God of Abraham, who created everything that exists, says “BE” and it becomes….your god was unable to forgive you without a human blood sacrifice…that just happened to imitate the pagans of that region of that time? Anyway….sorry for being so long. I just don’t understand how people can worship a man-god who dies…so I need for you to explain to me how it is possible for the God of Abraham to say He cannot be seen and He cannot die when addressing Moses and Abraham and then you say in a “new testament” that God has changed his mind, become a man for everyone to see and died. Who’s lying? The old covenant or the new?

  47. Jesus is the God of Abraham. Jesus in the new is the same one Abraham saw in the old. Do yoiu see now? I told you. I do not God to any church made with human hands. People coorupt the Bible. There is a devil. Jesus never jailed. The devil is in his self imposed Jail A jail Robs people of money giving guilt. That is all. Nothing godly in it at all. Satan has an unseen Jail the NDE -people mistakenly think is Hell. Gods light gets rid of evil forever. The devil and only the devil wants death. God is not in the stars making them explode or fissile out. Jesus is God who is like a humble child. that has charity. That is not a cheap clothing store like religions made people think thinking they were crafty.
    I wrote it like this so people will get a butter idea what the verses are saying.
    Slightly Modified 1corinthians,13,
    4 God is Charity who suffereth long, and is kind. God is charity who envieth not. God is charity who vaunteth not himself not being puffed up not behaving himself unseemly, not seeking his own meaning seeking to love everyone. God is not easily provoked thinking no evil not rejoicing in iniquity. God rejoices in the truth bearing all things, believing all things, hoping all things, enduring all things. God in us will be like that. Does the militarily, jails, police, legal sytem that condemns or islsmic law have that? I see the in the furries zoosexuals and others oppressed by human law and people perverting scripture to make it into a thing humans love and that is a weapon. My body is my church.

  48. Regarding Fox “News” credibility. Research shows that people who watch only Fox are less informed than people who watch no news at all. The same study found that most other news TV outlets did not fare much better, with the exception of people who get their news from NPR.

    Source: The Business Insider
    http://www.businessinsider.com/study-watching-fox-news-makes-you-less-informed-than-watching-no-news-at-all-2012-5

    Here is the original research paper (PDF file):
    http://publicmind.fdu.edu/2012/confirmed/

    So much for Fox being a credible source.

  49. Edited;
    Jesus is the God of Abraham. Jesus in the new is the same one Abraham saw in the old. Do you see now? I told you. I do not Go to any church made with human hands. People corrupt the Bible. There is a devil. Jesus never jailed. The devil is in his self imposed Jail A jail Robs people of money giving guilt. That is all. Nothing godly in it at all. Satan has an unseen Jail the NDE -people mistakenly think is Hell. Gods light gets rid of evil forever. The devil and only the devil wants death. God is not in the stars making them explode or fissile out. Jesus is God who is like a humble child. that has charity. That is not a cheap clothing store like religions made people think thinking they were crafty.
    I wrote it like this so people will get a better idea what the verses are saying.
    Slightly Modified 1corinthians,13,
    4 God is Charity who suffereth long, and is kind. God is charity who envieth not. God is charity who vaunteth not himself not being puffed up not behaving himself unseemly, not seeking his own meaning seeking to love everyone. God is not easily provoked thinking no evil not rejoicing in iniquity. God rejoices in the truth bearing all things, believing all things, hoping all things, enduring all things. God in us will be like that. Does the militarily, jails, police, legal sytem that condemns or islsmic law have that? I see the in the furries zoosexuals and others oppressed by human law and people perverting scripture to make it into a thing humans love and that is a weapon. My body is my church.

  50. I was not aware this is a forum to debate theology. Regardless, is there any way to stem the tide of gibberish being spewed?

  51. Sorry, but Aslan is a Muslim who has just wrote a book about Jesus, so how are we supposed to discuss the article and not talk about religion?

  52. OS wrote: “So much for Fox being a credible source.”

    ROTFLOL. Are you serious? Are you treating this as a credible study?

    There are huge scientific problems with this poll and the conclusion they attempt to draw from it. One does not even need to be scientifically knowledgeable to be suspicious of any study that claims the difference between 1.04 out of 4 questions is different than 1.22 out of 4. Consider how small the sample size must get when they have to weed out the people who said Yes to viewing ONLY Fox News in the last week as opposed to other sources of news. They only start with 1185 respondents, and imagine how many get news from more than one source. Consider also the fact that they only ask the news source watched in the last week. Why not say last month or last year? Too bad they do not give us the actual dataset to look at. They should at least give the sample size in relation to the conclusion they make. This study should be an example in every university about how NOT to conduct a useful poll.

    What would be interesting is if these pollsters recruited Fox News analysts to design the questions to be asked. How much you want to bet the results would skew in the other direction?

    The idea that people watching only Fox News would be less able to answer a question about opposition forces removing Mubarak is silly. Same with the other questions. There is little doubt these are not statistically significant results due to numerous errors ingrained in the design of the poll. In regards to this one question about Mubarak, how about finding just one news clip from Fox News that falsely reported that the opposition forces failed to remove him. That would be the only way that Fox News could un-educate people in the way being claimed.

  53. LOL@ greg White racist. I love it. Even though she is black. She must be a ‘White Black’ amiright?

    GregAbdul 1, July 29, 2013 at 7:08 am
    They’re not racist. It’s just that the Professor over and over has to keep telling the fox talking head his academic credentials qualify him to write a book about Jesus, even though in her white racist thinking

  54. Blousie: “. . . spewers are our crosses to bear.”

    Albatrosses would be more accurate, signifying an unwelcome burden. Bearing one’s cross is to take up one’s ministry — to serve other people, to meet their needs. It is an act of love. It can still be a burden — a whopping big one. And un-fun but willingly undertaken. Like Jesus to the mount.

    Sorry to get all theological, but I was overcomed. Some of the other posts were starting to effect me like just like when those Martian heads exploded from Slim Picken’s yodeling.

  55. David,

    Are you generally this hostile towards people off this blog, are is this generally your way of life?

  56. This is not new. There are many who disregard the testimony of the apostles in the Apostolic letters, and choose to follow and spread a different teaching that will not save from judgement.

  57. She is neither a Christian nor a journalist. I’m not a religious person but I’m pretty sure Jesus did not found Christianity. Makes me wonder what she’d say if the author of the book had been a Jew. Then again, since she is so clueless, she probably doesn’t understand the term “Children of the Book.”

  58. Personanongrata 7:35 pm: “Lauren Green is a bigot.”
    ****

    Not necessarily. She gets paid by an entertainment network (FOX is not a news network according to R Murdock- it’s an entertainment network) with a political point of view. She gets money to dance to that tune. She may be acting like a bigot, for pay, to advance her employer’s pov.

    We know what that is called. There’s an old joke: something, something, ‘now we’re just negotiating the price’.

  59. orolee,

    A gentle smile coming your way … with love I bear the cross of the false idol worshippers who witness with such error trusting that the path they trod will eventually turn towards the light … a faith that trusts in the Grace that passeth all understanding.

    How’s that for getting all theological? This is a tough audience … one treads carefully. ;)

  60. Lauren Green has a history of negative reporting on stories involving the Muslim faith. As I wrote earlier, Fox dumbs down the news stories to the point where one knows less after seeing the segment than if they had not watched it at all. She is incapable of a fair and unbiased interview. Reza Aslan is only the latest to be caught in the disinformation campaign. The fish rots from the head down, and this reporting philosophy and technique comes directly from Roger Ailes, aka, Jabb the Hutt. Rolling Stone did a story on Ailes and his background which pulled back the veil somewhat. The comments that follow this story about the incident in Media Matters are better than the story itself. Most commenters seem to be bright and insightful.

    http://mediamatters.org/blog/2013/07/29/reza-aslan-and-how-fox-news-islamophobia-comes/195097

  61. Here is more background on Ms. Green and her style of “reporting” stories about Muslims in the news. As far as anyone can recall, she has not reported a single story on positive accomplishments of Muslims. Perhaps those kinds of stories are not deemed newsworthy. If a purported news station only reported news that consistently placed Christians and Jews in a negative light, those groups would be breaking out the torches and pitchforks.

    http://mediamatters.org/blog/2013/07/29/fox-reporter-lauren-greens-double-standard-on-r/195114

    Also, Ms. Green may have forgotten completely about the Law of Unintended Consequences. The following is copied and pasted directly from the Amazon.com web page for Reza’s book, “Zealot: The Life and Times of Jesus of Nazareth.”

    Amazon Best Sellers Rank: #1 in Books

  62. I never said we shouldn’t be discussing religion. I was pointing out that theology is irrelevant to this conversation.

  63. What other religions in the last 20 years or so, have followers that routinely blow up innocent women and children in acts of terrorism.

  64. DavidM,

    You’re attempting to use the meaning of trust interchangeably with reliability, and it simply isn’t the case. Media watchdogs like Media Matters routinely document inaccurate, nonfactual reporting by Fox. Nearly every time a member of the Republican party gets caught in a scandal, the Fox title banners have them labeled as Democratic. Fox is the result of Nixon’s idea of using a broadcast news outlet to function as a propaganda tool for the Repubs.

    If more people do indeed trust Fox News, then it’s probably because Fox is telling them what they want to hear, like climate change doesn’t exist or social policies that address poverty do nothing but breed laziness and create more poverty. Look at the frenzy that took place over Nate Silver’s election forecasts during the last election; you guys excoriated him because you wanted hear that the race was closer. Turns out he was spot on, which is why your typical Fox Snoozer dislikes and distrusts with increasing vehemence. I think you could find polls indicating more pepole trust comic books than newspapers these days.

  65. We should bar anyone coming into the country from every state that has ties to terrorism. That includes places like Egypt and Saudia Arabia. Only people that should be allowed to visit should have to pass background checks and have strict short term visas for vacations or business.

    Violators should be deported and barred from ever returning and forced to sell any US holdings.

  66. While we are on the subject its also time to start holding Israel accountable for being terrorists themselves as well as dragging us into their fights. Personally If I had it my way Id cut off all funding and support.

    Israel has more spies in this country than China does.

  67. David,

    One last comment on Fox, if you’re still following this post: Fox is responsible for a general dumbing down of the journalistic reporting overall, as the different outlets try to outfox Fox, as it were, for viewership and readers

  68. RTC,
    Regarding dumbing down the news. If you read that study, you will see that other news outlets did not fare much better than Fox. Of course, Fox was lowest on the list of being informative, with only NPR doing reasonably well.

    The invention of the Chyron machine and improved computer graphics went a long way toward turning news reporting into an entertainment medium. Walter Cronkite and the Huntley-Brinkley Report did a great job of informing with factual reporting. Having a good news department budget and gifted reporters out in the field made it possible. People who watched news presenters trained by Edward R. Murrow, aka “Murrow’s Boys,” got honest to goodness news reporting. Cronkite, Huntley and Brinkley did it without fancy graphics, scrolls or flashing screens. I am sure the chances of someone like Roger Ailes (and his counterparts on other networks) hiring reporters like that is about the same as hell freezing over.

    I highly recommend Bob Edward’s book, Edward R. Murrow and the Birth of Broadcast Journalism (Turning Points in History). It does not take much imagination to know what Murrow would have to say about the present state of entertainment that pretends to be news.

    Bob Edwards is a student of Murrow. I read somewhere that he was hard for NPR management to deal with as an employee, but his on-air stuff was top notch. He did not talk over guests, but got the information in a fair and unbiased way. There was one interview that lasted a good five minutes, and word count revealed that Bob Edwards spoke exactly 77 words during that interview. Just enough to keep the guest on topic and talking.

  69. getreal: “What other religions in the last 20 years or so, have followers that routinely blow up innocent women and children in acts of terrorism.”

    U.S. fundamentalist Christian religions

  70. Blousie: “orolee, A gentle smile coming your way …”

    Thank you. I received grievous news late last night. Your words may have brought the only smile I will know today.

  71. TexasDad wrote: “Are you generally this hostile towards people off this blog, are is this generally your way of life?”

    Hostile? That’s a strange word to use in relation to my posts. People do not generally find me hostile, no, but my passionate response to certain injustices in society have caused me to be attacked by citizens who disagree with me, or to be arrested by policemen who think I should not be allowed to speak. Of course, people who find agreement with me love me and support me. It all depends upon the audience whether what I say is perceived as bitter or sweet.

  72. RTC wrote: “You’re attempting to use the meaning of trust interchangeably with reliability, and it simply isn’t the case. Media watchdogs like Media Matters routinely document inaccurate, nonfactual reporting by Fox.”

    Many poll reports use the word “reliable” as well as “trust” interchangeably. The terms, though technically different, are somewhat related. Consider this report of a poll by Huffington Post, where the title says Fox More Reliable Than CNN, MSNBC.
    http://sweetness-light.com/archive/huffpo-poll-fox-more-reliable-than-cnn-msnbc#.UffgntLvii0

    Or look at this poll posted on democratic underground that says 72% say that Fox News is more reliable:
    http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104×66525

    As for Media Matters, I guess you don’t realize that Fox News points out the false reporting by Media Matters. It is a common joke there, how Media Matters routinely misleads people into believing false information. Bill O’Reilly always jabs at them, and invites guests on who have believed Media Matters on some errant idea of what He said or what Fox News said about something. He then shows them how they were believing a completely false report. This is part of what makes Fox News interesting to watch, the fact that they actually invite people over from the other side of the aisle, to discuss and debate. I pay attention to all sources, and my sense is that Media Matters gets facts wrong way more often than Fox News does. The problem is that they focus on being critical of statements, often misinterpreting what they read. It is easy to be a critic, but a little harder to convey actual information in a meaningful way. In any case, all the news networks make mistakes trying to get some juicy news out there before everybody else, but Media Matters is really bad about getting it wrong and about never retracting the statement or making an apology to those hurt by it.

    RTC wrote: “I think you could find polls indicating more people trust comic books than newspapers these days.”

    LOL. You are right about that. When I was young, journalists were taught not to take sides, to be objective, there were actual standards of journalism. Now, journalism is all about entertainment or changing society through some juicy story. The truth doesn’t matter. What truth? It is all relative now. There is no truth.

  73. RTC wrote: “Fox is responsible for a general dumbing down of the journalistic reporting overall…”

    I don’t see it that way. They certainly are not worse at it than the other news organizations. When the Zimmerman trial was going on, CNN was glued to covering it, but Fox was more involved with other stories. That’s not “dumbing down” reporting.

    When I go to Media Matters, it seems like a hate group. Hate for Fox News. Hate for Conservatives. Hate for Rush Limbaugh. Everything is geared toward stereotyping others and often misrepresenting them. That creates a much different environment than Fox News, which although they call Media Matters on the carpet from time to time, for the most part they just present the liberal viewpoint right along with a conservative viewpoint and let the viewers decide which is most persuasive. Sometimes I agree with the conservative. Sometimes I agree with the liberal.

  74. David sez: “…When I go to Media Matters, it seems like a hate group. Hate for Fox News. Hate for Conservatives. Hate for Rush Limbaugh….”

    ******************************************

    Projection much, David? After she testified before a Congressional committee about making birth control affordable for poor women, Rush called law student Sandra Fluke ’round heeled,’ a ‘slut’ and a ‘prostitute’ just to name three specific sexist slurs. In about thirty seconds of Google search, I came up with 46 direct quotes (with dates) of his sexist attacks on Ms. Fluke. To call them hateful is too kind a word for that sort of piggish behavior. There appeared to be a lot more than than, but got tired of counting.

    Then there was the matter of mocking Michael J. Fox for having Parkinson’s Disease. Parkinson’s Disease is not a laughing matter, and those of us who know or love people with the disorder found his remarks beyond hateful. They were sadistic.

    I could go on about Rushbo, but need to get back to work. BTW, I see that he is being dropped by Cumulus Media because advertisers have been fleeing him in droves. CM is also dropping Sean Hannity. But never fear, both are being picked up by Clear Channel. And who are the primary owners of Clear Channel, pray tell? Why, Bain Capital and Thomas H. Lee Partners, of course. You don’t think the super rich would let their boys drown in a sea of unpaid bills, do you?

    As for Fox “News.” They are the public propaganda outlet for the Republican Party, the ultra-rich right wing, and Christianist fundies. When you call the media watchdog group Media Matters a hate organization, I am reminded of the famous comment by President Truman back in 1948:

    “I never give them hell. I just tell the truth and they think it’s hell.”

    I don’t hate conservatives. I am pretty conservative myself. However, I am quite progressive on social issues. When I was a kid I learned all the parables of Jesus and thought they were great reminders of one’s responsibilities in a civilized society.

  75. oh? where have these christians been blowing up people in acts of religion based terrorism?

    orolee 1, July 30, 2013 at 11:11 am

    getreal: “What other religions in the last 20 years or so, have followers that routinely blow up innocent women and children in acts of terrorism.”

    U.S. fundamentalist Christian religions

  76. OS wrote: “Rush called law student Sandra Fluke ’round heeled,’ a ‘slut’ and a ‘prostitute’ just to name three specific sexist slurs.”

    I happened to listen to Rush Limbaugh the day he committed this so-called offense. It is a gross misrepresentation to say he called her any of those names. Rush basically led his audience through the logic of a single 30 year old co-ed attending an expensive private university who complains to Congress about the government not paying her to be able to have sex without reproductive results. What do we call a girl who wants someone else to pay for her to have sex? We call that person a slut, don’t we? That kind of co-ed is called a prostitute, isn’t it? Isn’t that what society calls this kind of person who wants someone else to pay so she can have as much sex as she wants with whomever she wants to have it? Now wait a minute, so what does that make us, the ones who are paying for her to have sex? Well, I guess we are the Johns. No, we aren’t having sex with her, so we aren’t the Johns. We are paying, so I guess we are the pimps. Maybe pimp is not the right word… okay, I take it back, she is not a slut then.

    These are not his exact words. I don’t have time to research this for you, but the point is that over the length of hours, he was basically being humorous and outlining the logic of what we the taxpayers are expected to do for Sandra Fluke. He was not yelling out epithets or expressing hatred toward Sandra Fluke. He did not scream, “That woman is a slut!” No, he used no pejoratives like the leftist media portrayed him to do. His focus was on her argument, not the person of Sandra Fluke. He led his audience through the logic of it. We are expected to pay for this single woman to have as much sex as she likes without the consequence of reproduction. She complains to Congress, expecting us to be her pimp, so-to-speak. She is paying something like $70,000 a year to attend George Washington University (Tuition alone is $40K), and the average starting salary for a graduate from there is something like $136,000 a year. But she can’t afford her own birth control, and she feels it is owed to her from the rest of us. It is kind of absurd.

    You may not like his analogy, but I personally found it a very fitting dialogue and very funny. It is too bad so many people on the left have to get so emotional over it. I wouldn’t mind the emotion so much if they were just honest about it, but as you illustrate here, no honesty is allowed. The facts have to be twisted to make someone appear to be as evil a person as possible. But that’s not hatred, no.

  77. Yeh, DavidM, what OS said. You took a major step off the reality curb and you’re reeling around in the middle of Crazy St. with that last post.

  78. i wonder how many churches have been burned by atheists versus christians bombing non christians. Care to compare the two? Yeah didnt think so.

    want to know who the future terrorists will; be? Progressives planting bombs in churches. Buncha damn nazis

  79. btw those isolated rare events do not even remotely compare to the muslim terrorist bombings that happen every single day.

    the ira-england thing was about the only possible comparison and that hasnt been active for 20 years really.

  80. “oh? where have these christians been blowing up people in acts of religion based terrorism?”

    Every time one of them pushes the button to launch a bomb from a drone and kills civilians. Just because they are wearing uniforms and following orders doesn’t lessen the terroristic killing — we just call it legal.

  81. OL,
    I knew I should have bought Kool Aid stock when it was low. Have you noticed, there seems to be a high demand for it around here lately?

    Funny about the notion Christians are not terrorists. My first immigrant ancestor on my Mother’s side got out of France in 1629 just one jump ahead of Richelieu’s goons. An estimated 100,000 Huguenots were rounded up and murdered in some very creative ways by the Christians of the day who thought they worshiped Christ in the wrong way. The St. Bartholemy’s Day massacre of1572 resulted in somewhere between 5,000 and 30,000 people being killed by good Christians. In Paris, about 25,000 were rounded up and murdered. No one knows the final death toll, but the hundred thousand number seems reasonable, given what we know. About a half million people fled France because of the Christianist religious terrorism, my 10x great grandfather being one of them. The Christian church has a LOT of blood on its hands. We could go back to the Inquisition if you like. That was an exercise in Christian terrorism too.

    Then there was that little matter of the Crusades. We in the West are still reaping the fallout from that social and religious disaster.

  82. The FOX anchor is a buffoon, I am surprised they allow her to still host a show or read from a tele prompter because apart from being ignorant she is somewhat illiterate [not entirely true, but you understand the point]. My guess is she is intimate with the Producer, otherwise how else does a bimbo get to keep her job. It really reduces all the intellectual and hard working women in the industry to see an idiot [if you have a better word then substitute it there] still on air. I am not horrified by what she said, I am merely surprised at how she maintains her self image on screen. Either she is virtually so thick she can just manage the alphabet or she is self absorbed. Either way like 1000’s of viewers, I would not waste my time watching her again.

  83. orolee, I’m sorry to hear you have received such bad news. May the burden grow lighter with time.

  84. Bill Dewell wrote: “The FOX anchor is a buffoon … she is somewhat illiterate… she is virtually so thick she can just manage the alphabet… I would not waste my time watching her again.”

    Your reaction seems a little extreme to me, Bill. She had a poor interview. So what. She was looking for an answer she didn’t get, so she ended up repeating herself, causing the guest to repeat himself. This doesn’t mean she is incapable of conducting a good interview. If your standard was applied to all newscasters who interviewed guests from a different philosophical bent, there would be none left. We don’t have any Walter Cronkite’s anymore. :-)

  85. Get real,

    If You think church defacings is left just to atheists…. I’ll disregard the rest of your postings…

  86. DavidM,
    There is finally something we can agree on. There are no Walter Cronkites any more. Chet Huntley, David Brinkley and Ed Murrow are all gone as well. As are their news directors who were real reporters, not entertainers. An era has passed. I don’t think a modern era cable news network would either support them or give them a show. Not enough flash and splash.

  87. Its amusing the back and forth between the conservative and liberals here on which story book has more violence carried out by its sheep. The reality is that the government is more violent than all of them put together. In some cases such violence is carried out because the story book readers were able to get in key positions of governments.

  88. RTC wrote: “You took a major step off the reality curb…”

    I can only surmise that neither you nor OS actually listened the broadcast. It was truly one of Limbaugh’s greatest broadcasts ever. He slowly analyzed who Sandra Fluke was and why the Democrats chose her to be their poster girl for the issue of taxpayer funded contraception. For a very long time, he never applied any labels at all. I’m sure many listeners were shouting their own labels at the radio, wanting to know exactly what was in Limbaugh’s mind before he actually said it. It was one of the most original and brilliant analyses I had ever heard on the Sandra Fluke cultural phenomena. No other broadcaster was brave enough to make such a logical and coherent analysis that was for the most part completely devoid of emotion. What is sad is that so many on the left are so emotionally invested in their brand of political correctness, that they could not comprehend his brilliance. Instead they chose the path of expressing hatred for Limbaugh, which continues to this day. At no time did Limbaugh ever express hatred for Sandra Fluke.

  89. DavidM.

    You have a truly sick sense of humor if you found Limbaugh’s comments about Sandra Fluke humorous.

    Do you think women who use birth control are immoral? Did you know that birth control pills are used to treat some medical conditions? Do you care?

    Other Reasons to Take the Pill
    By Janis Graham
    http://www.webmd.com/sex/birth-control/features/other-reasons-to-take-the-pill

    Excerpt:
    The Pill isn’t just for birth control: Did you know that it can also protect against certain life-threatening cancers, plus help relieve some painful period symptoms? Here, experts explain the top seven health benefits of taking the Pill and how to make them work for you…

    Pill perk #5: Endometriosis relief

    Endometriosis, a condition in which uterine-lining tissue grows in other pelvic areas, can lead to scarring, severe pain, and sometimes infertility. The Pill stops the growth of tissue in other areas by reducing the hormones that cause the lining to build up.

    Pill perk #7: Polycystic Ovarian Syndrome (PCOS) relief

    While the Pill doesn’t cure PCOS – a hormonal disorder that triggers irregular cycles, excessive hair growth, and acne – it does offer symptom relief to sufferers. Experts recommend women with PCOS take a pill with 30 to 35 mcg of estrogen, since estrogen helps regulate periods, and combats skin problems and unwanted hair growth.

    *****

    Rush Limbaugh Calls a Female Georgetown Student, Sandra Fluke, a ‘Slut’

  90. David,
    Limbaugh is certainly not too stupid to know that Ms. Fluke was not advocating for herself personally, but for the millions of poor women who need birth control for a number of medical conditions unique to women, as well as controlling whether or not they want to get pregnant. But what if she was. The man is intellectually dishonest, emotionally stunted and a sadist. He is about as humorous as a bad case of scabies.

    If you found him the slightest bit amusing, you have a real problem, because only a person with a deep-seated sadistic streak would find that kind of drivel funny. I have not listened to those broadcasts, but did read the transcripts of it and several that followed. Under pressure, in a later broadcast he said he would not call her a slut, but a roundheels instead. Some apology, huh? Forty or fifty separate personal attacks like that on one young female law student, all because she testified before a Congressional subcommittee. That is a moral outrage that makes him no better than the Westboro “Baptist church.”

  91. Elaine M wrote: “Do you think women who use birth control are immoral? Did you know that birth control pills are used to treat some medical conditions? Do you care?”

    Her testimony before Congress concerned people like her, a 30 yr old co-ed, who supposedly could not afford birth control for the purpose of preventing the reproductive consequences of having natural sex.

    The analysis was purely logical, about the money being demanded to be paid and the reasons for it to be paid… so single college co-eds attending private universities like GW Law could have more sexual freedom. The analysis involved discussing various reasons why she would need this to be done, and what the primary reason probably really was. Incidentally, George Washington University is an expensive private university started by the same Baptist minister who started the Southern Baptist Convention. It costs a lot to attend there, and the graduates there earn among the highest starting salaries. The narration dealt a lot with why the Democrats chose this woman to champion their cause.

    Do I think women using birth control are immoral? Not necessarily, but the proliferation of birth control certainly leads to many immoral consequences. Rush Limbaugh speculated upon at least one of these.

    Would you agree that making it really easy for single college girls to have sexual relations with college boys without the reproductive consequences of natural sex would be promoting a sexually immoral lifestyle?

  92. OS wrote: “I have not listened to those broadcasts, but did read the transcripts of it and several that followed.”

    I doubt you can understand well from transcripts because they do not convey the tone of the voice, the pauses in between words, etc. Ms. Fluke’s testimony before Congress was made personal by her, because she identified herself as a third year student attending a Jesuit law school. Surely you know that Catholic teaching is that using contraception to prevent pregnancy is immoral. She clearly wants government to prohibit or interfere with the Catholic administration’s religious practice on that issue. To pretend otherwise is clearly dishonest.

    I fail to comprehend how you perceive sadism in someone who laughed at Mr. Limbaugh’s analysis. That statement makes no sense to me.

  93. David,

    Fish have the capability to obtain oxygen from water…. Snakes go in water too….. Does that make them a fish?

    But then again…. We must not drink the same water or air….. I don’t like the venom you spew….

  94. Elaine M wrote: “Other Reasons to Take the Pill”

    Did you know that according to Sandra Fluke’s testimony, 80% of the women who needed the pill for medical reasons were able to have it covered under their insurance? The other 20% were judged to be lying about why they needed it. Yes, she was upset about that 20%, but she and everybody else is ignoring the elephant in the room. Rush Limbaugh simply happened to talk about that elephant in a direct and honest way.

  95. David, No, I would not agree that making it easier for single women to have access to birth control is immoral, sexually or otherwise. It gives them the same opportunities to enjoy healthy sexual activity with the same repercussions as those college boys must deal with.

    As for your contentions that Limbaugh was spinning some elaborate joke, i would agree that he was engaging in his trademark sense of humor, which is often cheap, cruel, and underhanded. His style is to deliver outrageous personal insults and then claim he merely joking, and accuse anyone offended by his comments of having no sense of humor, “What, you can’t take a joke?”

    There is nothing funny about Limbaugh. His career is built upon pushing boulders down hill, validating the anger and discontent among the alienated in society. His audience does not tune in to learn anything, but rather to receive targets for their resentments. Limbaugh’s gift is to make the most ignorant attitudes sound intelligent. The fact that you listen to Limbaugh is instructive; the fact that you listened to him as he elaborately laid out his “joke” and thought it was funny reflects quite negatively on you.

  96. DavidM,

    Following are the full remarks of Sandra Fluke, testifying before a Democratic congressional panel convened by Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi, on contraception coverage and women’s health:

    Leader Pelosi, members of Congress, good morning, and thank you for calling this hearing on women’s health and for allowing me to testify on behalf of the women who will benefit from the Affordable Care Act contraceptive coverage regulation.

    My name is Sandra Fluke, and I’m a third-year student at Georgetown Law School. I’m also a past president of Georgetown Law Students for Reproductive Justice, or LSRJ. And I’d like to acknowledge my fellow LSRJ members and allies, and all of the student activists with us, and thank them so much for being here today.

    We, as Georgetown LSRJ, are here today because we’re so grateful that this regulation implements the nonpartisan medical advice of the Institute of Medicine. I attend a Jesuit law school that does not provide contraceptive coverage in its student health plan. And just as we students have faced financial, emotional and medical burdens as a result, employees at religiously affiliated hospitals and institutions and universities across the country have suffered similar burdens. We are all grateful for the new regulation that will meet the critical health care needs of so many women. Simultaneously, the recently announced adjustment addresses any potential conflict with the religious identity of Catholic and Jesuit institutions.

    When I look around my campus, I see the faces of the women affected by this lack of contraceptive coverage. And especially in the last week, I have heard more and more of their stories. On a daily basis, I hear from yet another woman from Georgetown or from another school or who works for a religiously affiliated employer, and they tell me that they have suffered financially, emotionally and medically, because of this lack of coverage. And so I’m here today to share their voices, and I want to thank you for allowing them — them, not me — to be heard.

    Without insurance coverage, contraception, as you know, can cost a woman over $3,000 during law school. For a lot of students who, like me, are on public interest scholarships, that’s practically an entire summer’s salary. Forty percent of the female students at Georgetown Law reported to us that they’ve struggled financially as a result of this policy.

    One told us of how embarrassed and just powerless she felt when she was standing at the pharmacy counter and learned for the first time that contraception was not covered on her insurance, and she had to turn and walk away because she couldn’t afford that prescription. Women like her have no choice but to go without contraception.

    Just last week, a married female student told me that she had to stop using contraception because she and her husband just couldn’t fit it into their budget any more. Women employed in low-wage jobs without contraceptive coverage face this same choice.

    And some might respond that contraception is accessible in lots of other ways. Unfortunately, that’s just not true. Women’s health clinics provide a vital medical service, but, as the Guttmacher Institute has definitively documented, these clinics are unable to meet the crushing demand for these services. Clinics are closing, and women are being forced to go without the medical care they need.

    How can Congress consider the Fortenberry, Rubio and Blunt legislation, that would allow even more employers and institutions to refuse contraception coverage, and then respond that the nonprofit clinics should step up to take care of the resulting medical crisis; particularly when so many legislators are attempting to defund those very same clinics?

    These denials of contraceptive coverage impact real people. In the worst cases, women who need this medication for other medical reasons suffer very dire consequences. A friend of mine, for example, has polycystic ovarian syndrome, and she has to take prescription birth control to stop cysts from growing on her ovaries. Her prescription is technically covered by Georgetown’s insurance, because it’s not intended to prevent pregnancy. Unfortunately, under many religious institutions’ insurance plans, it wouldn’t be. There would be no exception for other medical needs. And under Senator Blunt’s amendment, Senator Rubio’s bill or Representative Fortenberry’s bill, there’s no requirement that such an exception be made for these medical needs.

    When this exception does exist, these exceptions don’t accomplish their well-intended goals, because when you let university administrators or other employers, rather than women and their doctors, dictate whose medical needs are legitimate and whose are not, a woman’s health takes a backseat to a bureaucracy focused on policing her body. In 65 percent of the cases at our school, our female students were interrogated by insurance representatives and university medical staff about why they needed prescriptions and whether they were lying about their symptoms. For my friend, and 20 percent of the women in her situation, she never got the insurance company to cover her prescription. Despite verification of her illness from her doctor, her claim was denied repeatedly on the assumption that she really wanted birth control to prevent pregnancy. She’s gay — so clearly, polycystic ovarian syndrome was a much more urgent concern than accidental pregnancy for her.

    After months of paying over $100 out of pocket, she just couldn’t afford her medication anymore, and she had to stop taking it. I learned about all of this when I walked out of a test and got a message from her that, in the middle of the night in her final-exam period, she’d been in the emergency room. She’d been there all night in just terrible, excruciating pain. She wrote to me: “It was so painful I woke up thinking I’d been shot.” Without her taking the birth control, a massive cyst the size of a tennis ball had grown on her ovary. She had to have surgery to remove her entire ovary as a result. On the morning I was originally scheduled to give this testimony, she was sitting in a doctor’s office trying to cope with the consequences of this medical catastrophe.

    Since last year’s surgery, she’s been experiencing night sweats and awaking and other symptoms of early menopause as a result of the removal of her ovary. She’s 32 years old. As she put it: If my body indeed does enter early menopause, no fertility specialist in the world will be able to help me have my own children. I will have no choice at giving my mother her desperately desired grandbabies, simply because the insurance policy — that I paid for, totally unsubsidized by my school — wouldn’t cover my prescription for birth control when I needed it. Now, in addition to potentially facing the health complications that come with having menopause at such an early age — increased risk of cancer, heart disease, osteoporosis — she may never be able to conceive a child.

    Some may say that my friend’s tragic story is rare. It’s not. I wish it were. One woman told us doctors believe she has endometriosis, but that can’t be proven without surgery. So the insurance has not been willing to cover her medication, the contraception she needs to treat her endometriosis. Recently, another woman told me that she also has polycystic ovarian syndrome, and she’s struggling to pay for her medication and is terrified not to have access to it. Due to the barriers erected by Georgetown’s policy, she hasn’t been reimbursed for her medication since last August. I sincerely pray that we don’t have to wait until she loses an ovary or is diagnosed with cancer before her needs and the needs of all of these women are taken seriously, because this is the message that not requiring coverage of contraception sends: A woman’s reproductive health care isn’t a necessity, isn’t a priority.

    One woman told us that she knew birth control wasn’t covered on the insurance, and she assumed that that’s how Georgetown’s insurance handled all of women’s reproductive and sexual health care. So when she was raped, she didn’t go to the doctor, even to be examined or tested for sexually transmitted infections, because she thought insurance wasn’t going to cover something like that, something that was related to a woman’s reproductive health.

    As one other student put it, this policy communicates to female students that our school doesn’t understand our needs. These are not feelings that male fellow students experience, and they’re not burdens that male students must shoulder.

    In the media lately, some conservative Catholic organizations have been asking, what did we expect when we enrolled at a Catholic school? We can only answer that we expected women to be treated equally, to not have our school create untenable burdens that impede our academic success. We expected that our schools would live up the Jesuit creed of “cura personalis,” to care for the whole person by meeting all of our medical needs. We expected that when we told our universities of the problems this policy created for us as students, they would help us. We expected that when 94 percent of students opposed the policy, the university would respect our choices regarding insurance students pay for completely unsubsidized by the university.

    We did not expect that women would be told in the national media that we should have gone to school elsewhere and — even if that meant going to a less prestigious university. We refuse to pick between a quality education and our health, and we resent that in the 21st century anyone thinks it’s acceptable to ask us to make this choice simply because we are women.

    Many of the women whose stories I’ve shared today are Catholic women. So ours is not a war against the church. It is a struggle for access to the health care we need. The president of the Association of Jesuit Colleges has shared that Jesuit colleges and universities appreciate the modification to the rule announced recently. Religious concerns are addressed, and women get the health care they need. And I sincerely hope that that is something we can all agree upon.

    Thank you very much.

    http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2012/mar/06/context-sandra-fluke-contraceptives-and-womens-hea/

  97. Otteray,

    “If you found him the slightest bit amusing, you have a real problem, because only a person with a deep-seated sadistic streak would find that kind of drivel funny.”

    I’d say someone with a deep-seated misogynistic streak would have thought what Limbaugh said was funny.

  98. davidm2575 1, July 31, 2013 at 12:03 pm

    Elaine M wrote: “Other Reasons to Take the Pill”

    Did you know that according to Sandra Fluke’s testimony, 80% of the women who needed the pill for medical reasons were able to have it covered under their insurance? The other 20% were judged to be lying about why they needed it. Yes, she was upset about that 20%, but she and everybody else is ignoring the elephant in the room. Rush Limbaugh simply happened to talk about that elephant in a direct and honest way.

    *****

    Yes, we MUST question the mendacity of that 20%!

    Elephant in the room? Isn’t that Limbaugh? Wait…no, I’d compare the pompous pill-popping porcine provocateur to another animal.

    BTW, Limbaugh could afford to procure all the OxyContin he wanted when he became addicted. He didn’t need no stinkin’ health insurance. He’s a real hero!

    *****

    Rush Limbaugh Arrested On Drug Charges
    http://www.cbsnews.com/2100-201_162-1561324.html

  99. RTC wrote: “No, I would not agree that making it easier for single women to have access to birth control is immoral, sexually or otherwise. It gives them the same opportunities to enjoy healthy sexual activity with the same repercussions as those college boys must deal with.”

    Making women more like men by stripping them of their ability to reproduce is not good. It destroys an important aspect of Gender Diversity. Women have a gift, a natural ability that supersedes any ability of man. They are able to create children with the help of a man. This aspects makes them desirable to men, and removing this ability for the sole purpose of hedonism demeans them, making them less feminine and simply objects of sexual pleasure. Such a system causes men look at women with much less reverence and respect. It causes them to ignore their own responsibility, and it causes them not to look at them as partners necessary for the ability to create life through the institution of marriage. Your inability to see the harm that easy contraception causes reflects negatively on you.

    Yes, I had a two hour drive to make and it allowed me to listen to this particular Limbaugh broadcast. Yes, I thought it was funny, and brilliant too. Did you actually listen to it? If not, then causing you to look upon me negatively based upon the gossip you heard about it also reflects upon you in a negative way. I don’t know for sure if you would laugh at it or not, but I think there is a chance you might.

  100. “Making women more like men by stripping them of their ability to reproduce is not good. It destroys an important aspect of Gender Diversity. Women have a gift, a natural ability that supersedes any ability of man.”

    Oh, good grief! We must keep our babymakers–er, womben–barefoot and pregnant.

    Speaking as a female, I believe that women should have the right to decide whether or not they will have children…and if they do want children, they should have to right to determine how many offspring they will have. They should also have the right to decide WHEN they will have children.

  101. David,
    I don’t know where to start, but i do know where this will have to end, and that’s with agreeing to disagree.

    The only time I laugh at Limbaugh is out of derision. He is the spokesperson for the ignorant and boorishness that has come to characterize the American conservative.

    Far from stripping women of their reproductive responsibilities, I believe that making access to birth control more affordable actually empowers them; they can experience fuller, richer lives without the devastating life-altering consequences that men only face by choice.

    You strike me as someone who probably opposes abortion. Fewer abortions are possible if birth control is made more affordable. There’d be less child abuse and foster kids, too. I see great irony in your support of Limbaugh, in that he never has answer for his many mistakes and misstatements, and yet, you would insist that women live with theirs forever.

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