Russian Lawmaker Vitaly Milonov is promising to arrest Olympic athletes found to be in violation of the country’s new abusive anti-gay law. The “gay propaganda” law has led many to call for the games to be shifted from Russia since the host country would arrest athletes who are openly gay. In the meantime, a boycott of Russian vodka has picked up steam around the world in protest of the crackdown on gays and lesbians.
Milonov says that he does not know any gays and insisted that Russia is merely “defending children from the propaganda of non-traditional values.” He added that “I’ve spoken to US politicians, and they support my stance.” That might have been Sen. Larry Craig (R-ID) who already maintained a wide stance on such issues.
The greatest moment however came with Milonov explaining that the government has no choice but to arrest athletes since it would be selective prosecution not to. So the crackdown on journalists, protesters, and lawyers is not selective prosecution? It is just uniformly prosecuting critics of Vladimir Putin.
Milonov appeared to stress that being gay is not needed for some sports like figure-skating: “I can say that the best figure-skating in the world is the Soviet school of figure skating . . . All of our people have been brought up in a very traditional way.”
The Russian law is not only discriminatory but absurdly written to cover any act or effort “to spread information about non-traditional sexual behavior” to minors (under 18).” What that means is anyone’s guess but, since these games have many children interacting with athletes, an openly gay athlete would be at obvious risk. The law is part of an unholy alliance between Vladimir Putin and the Russian Orthodox church.
The comments by the way contradict an assurance from the International Olympic Committee that athletes would not be subject to the law. It certainly sets up a perfect repeat of the Berlin games with Jesse Owens and another authoritarian leader. In this case, it will be homophobia rather than racism but the scene has not changed much otherwise.
Source: IB Times
@ squeeky since your not a parent i guess i have to explain it to you. first of all i took my kids because they asked to go. i didnt make them go they heard some other children talking about their family members going and they wanted to go. i explained to them exactly what the parade is and was about and still they wanted to attend. and FYI the parade is not only about the LGBT community . many aids organizations march, many youth groups march. so my kids received a lesson in diversity of the best kind. as for your research and stats they’re laughable for the simple reason those stats are written by heterosexuals who like you and others have yet to grasp the fact that how people choose to live their life is NONE of YOUR BUSINESS. unless their lifestyles or activities affect you in any way.
As for my kids they learned respect the best way. my children say yes sir/ma’am no sir/ma’am please and thank you. they walk the streets everyday passing by people who may or may not be in the life. but you will never catch any of my kids thinking they have the right to go around beating up on anyone for any reason other then they were hit first. unlike other children out here who feels its their given right to beat up people because their black, chinese, muslim, jewish, or any race,religion, or creed.
as for raunchy dont put different meanings in my words thank you. when i say raunchy i do not mean the people are having sex in the streets and im sure you know that. by raunchy i mean that its the one day a year those who have to hide their sexual identity for 364 days get that one day to come out and be proud. and yes some of them come out a little to much. but its nothing more then whats seen on tv, in movies or videos everyday all day.
Seeing as how you like stats so much look up this stat and give the names of gay males who are known as pedophiles. not downlow men like those in the corporation formerly known as the govenment but out gay males and females. Oh and another FYI catholic priest do not only molest and rape little boys. there are many stories out about the young girls who were molested and raped some even impregnanted by the priest. now i will admit that the corporation is using the LGBT community at this point in time for their own agenda and that is to break up the family stand or nuclear family as they call them. its all about the chaos and one world corporation that is also well known by those who choose to accept the truth of what is going on. now lets move on to your statements about the inner city.
First do you live there? i doubt it you’re going by what you see on tv. which is ok for you i guess but you definitely have it all wrong. so again let me explain it to you.
Fortunately for us black women we DO NOT FEEL THE NEED TO STAY IN ABUSIVE RELATIONSHIPS just because we have a child with a guy. as for anyone who still believes their taxes pay for welfare all i can do is shake my head. the truth about welfare was written back in 1991
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,974473,00.html
and when the recession hit. the truth came out big time about which race is the majority on welfare. when will people get tired of being lied to? but then again they will never get tired of the lies about blacks because they think its put them above us. you said we’re undereducated. and yes we are but that too was a deliberate cause just as slavery was deliberately put into place by the pope. there is a reason for it and its serves the so called powers that be to keep us under educated and locked into OUR PLACE. can any of what i say be proven. of course it can. will the corporation ever admit it. NO they will not. but undereducated does not mean uneducated. i graduated from high school. so did my 3 oldest children. no we dont get science labs and they dont give us enough books to go around. yes they stuff anywhere from 35-45 kids in one class. the newest thing is to stuff all the schools into one building. the teachers are now being snatched out of college and they are no longer even pretending to teach our kids to read much less write. . if you don’t believe that then read THE DESTRUCTION OF AMERICAN EDUCATION.
the school to prison pipeline. and what charter schools are really about.
YES there are some black girls and women out here who are stupid when it comes to men and have babies by different men but so do white girls and women. the thing is white girls get a tv show teen mom while black girls get called savages and other derogatory names. yes crime is committed in the inner city. we black people get a few lines in the newspaper or 10 secs on a news show. crimes committed in the suburbs and mansions have a whole channel dedicated to them. the bs about black on white crime is hilarious. many thousands of white people work in the inner city all day everyday and they arent killed. yes once in a while one may run up on a crass lazy good for nothing black person who will rob and beat them. but kill? not many. how many blacks can walk in the suburbs all day and night and not be accosted either by good for nothing bigots or the police? now lets discuss them. there is a reason for locking up so many black men and women everyday for nothing. now we get arrested for standing on the side walk. they call it loitering. and that reason is private prisons and the generated income from free labor also to keep us out of the good jobs. AND NO IM NOT MAKING EXCUSES im speaking the truth. and that to can be found if you really want to know. but like millions of others the truth doesnt matter because it just might knock the high and mighty off their pedestals and make them realize they are no better or worse then we are. you really want to know about gays and lesbians and pedophiles go to youtube and watch 2 videos
the boystown scandal and the franklin coverup
Lottakatz
We should be free to be you and me.
David regarding the statement on innate gender diversity, I knew exactly what you were meaning and how you were saying it. I disagree with your premise. I just altered a couple of words to make it fit what is actually happening with the Swedish attempt to broaden gender perception beyond body type/sex. Gender and sex are not the same thing. You are talking about sex based stereotypes. The Swedes are talking about something else. So are bunches of people here in the US.
At a lower, less agenda driven level of marketing, why shouldn’t girls be shown with nerf-guns? I wanted cap pistols at that age. Why shouldn’t boys be shown using household cleaning products? Surely you can’t believe that only little girls should be taught to clean house or iron their own cloths.
Bigfatmike:
Thank you for your thoughtful response, and if you see numerous misspellings, it is to avoid the filter thingy. First, the whole Gay thing is not a very important issue to me, so I don’t have links to a lot of sites or anything. To me, the whole Gay Outrage thing is just silly and ridiculous hamming it up. A Theatre of the Absurd production.
To analogize, it would be like if all the Liberals could get to actually live out their deepest fantasies, and go back in time to the 1950s and 60’s, where they could become Crusading Freedom Riders seeking the right for Blacks to vote. Then, after they won the right to vote for them, maybe only 5% or so of the Black population actually bothered to register to vote. And out of that 5%, only 2% actually voted. I mean, wouldn’t something like that kind of make you wonder, “Gee, what was all the fuss about???”
Sooo, if you think I was being snarky in my remark about Gay relationships, google “monogomish” and maybe something called NARTH that showed up, if you want numbers. I also just found this blog, which has some links:
http://joemygod.blogspot.com/2010/07/gays-and-monogamy-here-we-go-again.html
If you need the Hoff thingy, I just downloaded it and I can shoot you the link.
Now, as to the pedophilia thing. I guess there are two kinds of people in the world: ONE, Those who first want see a scientific study confirming some sort of Gay Pedophilia Proclivity before they would be sooo biased and prejudicial to eschew sending their kids into the woods with a Gay Scoutmaster. AND, TWO, those who simply don’t send their kids into the woods with Gay Scoutmasters. Or priests.
If I ever have any kids, which I don’t plan to because I can’t stand men, and I can’t stand being in relationships with the messy stupid little beer-drinking idiots, but if I did, I would be unashamedly a Type Two mother.
But, I fully support the legal right of Type One parents to experiment with their Little Otto, Jr.! Personally, after having seen a few of those “raunchy” parades mentioned above, and from some acquaintances, I am not at all convinced that Gays have a whole lot of [sixual] impulse control. (Plus, to that lady above who took her kids, “Why in the world would you ever let your kids watch that kind of sick nonsense???)
Now, as to the main point, I think that many people use the word “consenting” as if it were a magic fairy wand that just made everything A OK! However, we don’t use that wand when it comes to some poor schlub and Vinnie the Loan Shark. Nope, 50% interest every week isn’t A OK, even if the adults consent.
Society makes those decisions based (rightly or wrongly) on how the underlying behavior affects society at large. Hence, a large number of “consenting” behaviors are taboo, including but not limited to, prostitution, polygamous marriage, drugs, working people at less than minimum wage, childhood labor, etc. etc. Sooo, to the “consenting” behavior qualifier, we now add either “socially beneficial” or a “not-socially detrimental” qualifier. Your choice.
When it comes to our bedrooms, sadly what goes on in the bedroom often doesn’t stay in the bedroom. If you doubt this, simply visit your local poor black inner city neighborhood. These children are the product of consenting relationships. Yet, they are under nourished, under educated, and too often grow up to perpetuate the cycle which caused them. Sooo, to the “consenting” qualifier, we must now add a “responsible” qualifier.
Now, with some extra qualifiers, let’s go Back to the USSR! The Ruskies seek to remove Gay Activism from the public discourse. As I said, the country is having some birth rate issues. Sooo, is Gay Activism socially beneficial, and responsible in light of those problems??? And, in light of the Russian legal system. I think that’s the relevant question.
It is my opinion that such considerations are what started the whole Biblical “abomination” thing several thousand years ago. The mechanics of Gay male [six] tends to result in a lot of funky diseases, even in modern times. In pre-Antibiotic times, ascending urinary tract infections could conceivably wipe out a tribe, and/or ruin fertility in women. It probably didn’t take but a few such instances and people caught on to whose tent the disease first began in.
Sooo, I’m guessing they had a choice. Either permit the free [sixual] expression of the tribe members, or continuing with that little little thing called “life.” They chose wisely, or we would not be talking this. That’s my GUESS how the whole original prohibition came about. Which, let the AIDS virus go through a few more mutations, and maybe become spreadable by mosquito bite, and we will be right back there again as a society.
Now, as far as “data” and all that stuff. IMHO, the search for “Data” is worthless on many issues. I don’t know how you would even construct a study on the ill effects of pornography, for example. Yet, I am convinced that it is bad and harmful.
Sooo, I tend to base a lot of my opinions on what I see. If your experience is that Gays are just fantastic, then what do I care??? As for me, I think they do make many fine contributions to life, particularly in the Arts. But, I also see a silly, ridiculous, overly-dramatic, narcissistic, and labile side to them. And with Lesbians, often some really overly-maudlin affect. I also see some real sexual issues, which look a lot like they are trapped in some sort of perpetual adolescent funk. They seem to lurch about from crush to crush. And among the males, it seems to pretty much just be about sex. Which is why monogamy is sooo optional.
What I don’t see, is any particular reason why I should spend a whole lot of time worrying about them, one way or the other, or why I should pretend that their obvious abnormalities and particular problems are neither abnormal nor problems.
One of my friends used to be a Lesbian, but when she was 27 she decided she wanted to get married and have babies. The way she puts it, she just finally grew up and quit playing around. Now almost three years later she calls marriage and [heterosix] a “happier kind of unhappiness.”
Go figure.
Squeeky Fromm
Girl Reporter
@Squeeky Fromm, Girl Reporter
I always try to treat girls named Squeeky with respect. My ex-wife who could stay awake longer, work harder, cover more material and write clearer prose than anyone else I ever met kept an 8X10 color glossy of Squeeky Fromm taped to her mirror. But don’t let that go to your head. She also slept with a loaded .357 S&W mod 13 under the bed.
In any case, you have my attention.
“This is not a “Is Gay Sex Ok?” thread, which would be a very fun food fight, but instead a, “Lookie What Russia Did!!!” thread. ”
That is an entirely plausible remark. But I observe that at this web site, the conversation frequently takes tangents and further the tangents are sometimes as interesting as the original subject.
What ever the topic of the thread, I don’t see that the topic changes or mitigates my criticism of your remark in any way.
Davidm2575 and I had been discussing ‘sexual liberation movements’ and whether there is a reasonable basis for the state to suppress them. I remarked that “I see no threat to children from adults being themselves and living without fear.” My reference was clearly to the LBGT community and allowing consenting adults of sound mind make their own decisions in regard to personal relations.
To that remark you responded ” “Uh, didn’t you ever hear of Jerry Sandusky??? Or all those Catholic priests???”.
To me, it is not absolutely clear what you meant here. But the only interpretation that I can think of is that, by innuendo, you are claiming that the LBGT community poses a special threat of abuse and sexual abuse to children.
If I am wrong and that is not what you meant then I think you should correct my mis-understanding clearly and unambiguously here.
But if you are making that argument then you should present your data and make you argument directly so that we can all evaluate your evidence and your argument.
BTW, I claim the suggestion that the LBGT community is a threat to children is the vilest sort of slander that must not be allowed to pass without opposition.
In addition, that anyone would make that outrageous attack by innuendo shows that the claim is without foundation and makes the claim even more despicable.
Later in one of your comments you tell us that Russia has “REAL problems, including a weak birth rate, and alcoholism, and the last thing they need is a bunch of narcissistic drama queens out prissing around trying to further weaken the societal fabric. …”
Your argument here seems to be that real problems justify suppression of the LGBT community. I think it helps if we disaggregate that argument and look at your ‘real problems’ a piece at a time.
I am going to have to guess here. But over many societies over time the LGBT community might constitute maybe 7% of the population, certainly less than 10%. The suggestion that gays are responsible for a low national fertility rate doesn’t seem reasonable. We have good studies that demonstrate that national fertility rates are related to standard of living. I would guess that an additional factor would be the size of the birth cohort for age groups, say, 18 thought 45. What we see in this country is that when we make society safe for the LBGT community they start to form families which should tend to raise the national fertility rate. And I am not aware of any data that would suggest that criminalization of homosexual activity plays any role what so ever in the national fertility rate. Changes in the national fertility rate cannot be a justification for suppression of the LGBT community.
Are you seriously suggesting that gays are responsible for alcoholism in Russia? Based on my limited reading of Tolstoy, Dostoyevsky, and more recent history of the USSR under communism, I would argue that alcoholism in Russia is more like a traditional national sport – with or without the LGBT community. When one considers the size of the LGBT community it is clear that even if every one of them were alcoholics, and we rehabilitated every one of them, there would be little difference in the overall rate. Again the significant problem of alcoholism cannot justify suppression of the LGBT community.
What data do you have to demonstrate that gay adults ‘weaken the societal fabric’?
The limited data that I have suggests that the LGBT community is as capable and responsible as any other community in the nation. There are studies to show that gay families as a group are as strong as other families and raise children as well or better adjusted as hetero families. Anecdotal evidence suggest that gay individuals are among the first to invest in their own homes and in projects to recover blighted urban neighborhoods. The contributions of gay members of the military are well documented, at least as far back as the second world war. One only has to look as far as the evening news to see stories of members of the LGBT making contributions in business, religion and politics. Are there social and personal problems in the LGBT community? Of course there are. But the claim that the LGBT community ‘weakens the societal fabric’ is contradicted by numerous pieces of evidence from all aspects of our lives.
The stereotypical image of “narcissistic drama queen” would be laughable except that it is a lie that has the potential to mislead those who may have no idea of the real contributions that gay citizens make in all walks of like. Do I really have to take the time to dig out true stories of gay parents who calmly persevere for their families during times of great economic stress, gay first responders who step into the breach, or gay military who sacrifice themselves under fire?
“Which, based on the length of most Gay relationships, seems to last until the new wears off. ”
And your calculation of average length of gay relationship is based on your study of how many couples?
My very quick Googling suggest there is a real lack of quality research on the length and quality of gay relationships. It is my understanding that Family Research Council has published some controversial material related to gay relationships. I note that US Census publishes information related to Number, Timing, and Duration of Marriages and Divorces. But I don’t see that the Census publication collects any data regarding gay relationships. I did find an old survey study based on nearly 1300 couples that found average male relations of nearly 7 years and average female relationship of nearly 5 years. That does not sound like ‘until the new wears off’ to me. But I have to wonder if anyone has any current, reliable data. If you know of a good source of data or a good study, please share.
Finally, you have some interesting ideas as well as some prejudices. I don’t want you and people like davidm2575 to be quiet. I want you to get more data and better data The data is going to be more convincing than any argument that I could possibly make.
BigFatMike wrote: “And your calculation of average length of gay relationship is based on your study of how many couples?”
There are several studies that demonstrate gay relationships do not typically last long. This is not surprising because the purpose of sexuality in gay relationships is not reproduction, but rather sexual pleasure.
The data presented in “Homosexualities: A Study in Diversity among Men and Women,” by Alan P. Bell and Martin S. Weinberg shows that among 574 white male homosexuals, 97% had already had at least 3 sexual partners, 75% had one hundred partners, and 28% had at least 1000 sexual partners.
There are many other studies which show typical length of relationships being 1.5 to 3 years. I remember a Dutch study reporting that men with a steady partner actually had an average of 8 sexual partners per year.
Rather than presenting an anthology of studies, I think it is rather clear, to anyone who has even briefly attempted to review the research on this subject, that a man’s sexual relationship with a man is NOT equivalent to a man’s sexual relationship with a woman.
In regards to the Russian law, it is clear that their law concerns propaganda aimed at minors. I think this is totally appropriate. I wish our country was wise enough to pass similar laws that would restrict not only homosexual propaganda, but sexual propaganda of any kind that is directed toward minors. Sexuality is a very intimate and sensitive thing. It should not be thrust upon children.
David2575, I’m actually kind of familiar with the ‘gay agenda.’ To borrow from your second posting, it seems like they want us to recognize the truth of gender diversity that is innate in every person. I don’t have a problem with that. Don’t get me started on appropriate toys, kids should be allowed to play with whatever kind of toys the want to play with.
lottakatz wrote: ” To borrow from your second posting, it seems like they want us to recognize the truth of gender diversity that is innate in every person. I don’t have a problem with that.”
I think you misread my statement to be the opposite of what I said. I said, “It seems like they want us to deny the truth of gender diversity that is innate in every person.”
I said “they want us to DENY the truth of gender diversity,” not “RECOGNIZE the truth of gender diversity.” Males and females are different from each other in many ways. The sexes are different not just in physical attributes like muscle strength or genitalia, but also in the way we think and process thought in our brains. The brains are physically different as well, which is not surprising at all. So males and females, even from a young age, react differently to the environment. There are some who want to try to eradicate gender diversity, to make it out like there are no differences at all between male and female. This is an assault on Nature and creates many problems in society, especially among children who are being taught not to cooperate with their innate nature but rather to rebel against it. I do not agree with doing that.
And do not fly over and flush. And don’t fly over and land. Putin mea