We have seen an increase in physical assaults on campuses in the last few years as some students and professors seek to harass or silence those with opposing views. The latest example comes with the criminal battery charge filed against FSU student Shelby Anne Shoup. She was captured on videotape as they threw chocolate milk on conservative students and kicked over a sign for Ron DeSantis. Notably, it was the FSU police who made the arrest. Notably, we also discussed a poll today showing that one out of three college students believe that violence is justified to stop what they consider to be hate speech. The incident raises a tough question whether such an offense warrants a criminal charge, though it is possible for a court to allow an expungement for some types of misdemeanors in the case of first offenders.
Shoup has every right to confront the students and disagree with them but she proceeds to throw and kick things as her way to dealing with the argument:
Shoup is reportedly an intern for the Andrew Gillum for Florida Governor Campaign.
She makes reference to the Pittsburgh shooting to accuse the other students of supporting Nazis.
Some schools have sent mixed messages on such assaults — often depending on the specific viewpoint being silenced. At the University of California at Santa Barbara, feminist studies professor Mireille Miller Young led her students in attacking pro-life advocates, stealing their display, and then committing battery on a young woman. Despite pleading no contest to criminal assault, Miller Young not only was retained but widely supported by faculty and students, including those who viewed the pro-life advocates as “terrorists” who should be kept off campus. This month, the University of Oregon gender studies department is featuring her as a speaker. Likewise, recently a Ryerson University employee attacked pro-life students on campus. Last year, Middlebury College professor Allison Stanger was injured by protesters after she merely accompanied a controversial speaker to campus.
Under Section 784.03, Florida Statutes, battery is defined as:
- Any actual and intentional touching or striking of another person against that person’s will (non-consensual), or
- The intentional causing of bodily harm to another person.
No direct contact is needed so throwing liquids or spitting can constitute battery under the provision. Mohansingh v. State, 824 So. 2d 1053, 1054-55 (Fla. 5th DCA 2002) (spitting).
This is generally a first degree misdemeanor in Florida that comes with up to a year in jail, or a probationary sentence not to exceed one year. It would be highly unlikely to have a jail sentence. Indeed, this is a minor form of contact. Do you feel this should be handled as a crime as opposed to a university offense? One argument for the arrest is the apparent need for both students and faculty to engage in free speech without resulting to physical assault.
There is also the question of how FSU should respond to the case. Again, this is not a serious physical attack and, despite the need for Shoup to learn fundamental concepts of free speech and tolerance (and a statement accepting responsibility), I do not see the need for an expulsion as opposed to a suspension for a term or some other form of discipline in such a circumstance. Do you agree?
She should be made an example of the consequences of resorting to any degree of violence, no matter how minor. She should spend a few weekends in jail, pay a fine, and if she stays out of criminal trouble, expunge her record in a few years to reflect that she is little more than a troubled adolescent at this time.
Locker her up. Treat it as a criminal matter. This sort of behavior has to stop.
Let her stay in school after a suspension. Then she can receive a degree in unemployment and with even more student debt.
I guess there is always the unpaid internship and being useful tools of politicians though.
She should be charged with whatever on the level of being a public nuisance. To enhance the charges to the level of hate this or hate that is to play into the hands of the right wing extremists, and for sure Trump. Trump doesn’t need reality to come up with scare tactics. It’s best to isolate the mutt and eventually, hopefully, more and more people will see what a liar and hate monger he is.
This girl does the rational core of America no help at all. As with most extremists, left and right, her hate, anger, frustration, or whatever is most likely sourced from something idiosyncratic. She’s not balanced. Perhaps not getting any, needs some good loving, needs to be grabbed, locker room talk stuff.
Isaac: You’re cro-magnon. And obviously an idiot. Still, you should get the fact that this young person was making an impassioned plea to her fellow students to NOT sit mutely and idly by and fail to make the connection between Trump/DeSantis savagery and the terrorism that struck the Tree of Life Temple.
You, Isaac, don’t have to care about the murder of Jews, but you should refrain from sexualizing the woman’s motives. Makes you look impotent.
Like I said, this is more, if not completely, all about the girl. There is an anger peculiar to her alone that found a target. She got her wires crossed. It very well could be that she needs attention in some other areas. Was she feeling neglected? Did she recently get dumped and is she feeling used and impotent herself? If she was more balanced and satisfied in her skin, would she have tossed the latte?
25 F bombs = “impassioned”.
Got it, thanks.
Lets go back to the facts of this particular incident from which this woman decided to break the law. She was angry that she believed that Trump was responsible for a crazy guy who killed 11 Jewish people (this guy actually hated Trump). This crazy lunatic believed that Trump was being too kind to the Jewish people so he would kill a bunch of Jews. She said that Trump was a Nazi (who I will remind you was not kind to the Jewish people). So where is the logic that someone who is kind to the Jewish people is held repsonsible for someone decides to kill the people Trump is kind to. Where is your common sense or logic that Trump hates in this situation. So where do you get your summation that Trump hates from in this particular incident.
Regardless of whether or not the lunatic that slaughtered the eleven worshipers in Pittsburgh hated Trump, this girl’s punishment should not reflect the hatred that Trump foments on a daily basis. Hatred is hatred regardless of which direction it is pointing and from which source it spews forth. Fine her or jail her for being a public nuisance. Again, people that step over the line with this sort of anger are basically angry for other reasons and piggy back their anger onto this sort of avenue. The balanced person votes, writes about it, converses, etc.; but doesn’t assault with a latte. The actions of the mentally unbalanced person that vents his or her spleen towards a specific group of people like Jews and kills them in their place of worship are those of insanity. That person doesn’t need any specific target. That is pure madness at work. That madman’s actions can be juxtaposed with someone who lynches a black man for no particular reason, kills school children on a rampage, kills gays in a night club, etc. This sort of madness does not merit any specific reason to give it meaning. Hate is hate, peculiar to the imbalance of the harbinger. To include the victims in the meaning of this madness desecrates them.
I watched this on a news program and thought nothing would happen, but to my happy surprise something has! She needs to continue her education, but when she has open time (weekends) she should do community service. Pick up trash or whatever else is available with no political ties. If the school has counseling, she needs to understand we all have a voice and this country we are encouraged to vote and work for candidates. She does not have the right to interfere with anyone helping someone with opposing views. It’s typical of our youth to think they know everything. Teaching them it is not true is where counseling might help.
Issac, this isn’t about Trump. Stay on topic.
I would sentence her to a misdemeanor with three months in jail; but defer the jail and allow for expungement of her record if she completes anger management and does not get in any trouble for a year.
Both reasonable and constructive. Thank you, TIN.
You have to nip this in the bud. The fact that she resorted any physical intimidation is wrong. If you look at a relationship where one party either throws some china against the wall or punches a door in. What they are saying is: “this time it is some china or a door; next time it is your face”. You cannot condone violence no matter what side of the political spectrum it comes from. Like they did in NYC, zero tolerance is the only answer. If you let it go; like a child, it will learn how far they can push it before it will be unacceptable. Best to stop it and nip it in the bud before it starts.
Somehow she needs to learn self-control, no matter the situation. I am proud of the other students for staying calm and polite. You really don’t want to get down in the mud with a pig.
When you resort to violence to settle a political argument, you’ve admitted that you lost the argument.
Throw the book at her. Whatever is the harshest punishment possible.
Definitely 1 year in jail to set an example and show that this form of harassment will not be tolerated. After she is jailed, her case should be presented on all college campuses with a warning that this type of behavior will not be tolerated. Let us hope that other campuses will follow the example of FSU.
A year on jail for throwing milk on someone seems pretty excessive. Ten days would probably traumatize her.
I believe this is one of her mother’s philanthropic projects:
https://www.gofundme.com/e79a6-write-now
If I haven’t misidentified her, she’s the daughter of one Scott Shoup and his wife Beth Elise Eriksen, who live in Tampa. Her parents are pushing 60 and she is the child of their dotage. It’s a passable guess that she is their one and only. There’s a knack to raising a child without siblings, but I doubt many people have it.
The actual issue here may be two fold:
1. While people whose emotional self-regulation is rather poor are common among the young, only in odd circumstances does it manifest itself in political language. It’s a reasonable wager that 97% of the students walked by that display and didn’t think anything of it. Twenty years ago, 99% would have thought nothing of it.
2. The Democratic Party has turned into a collecting pool of people with poor emotional self-regulation. Recall some of the Podesta e-mails. Podesta knows perfectly well that David Brock and much of the gay lobby are damaged goods. They’re still welcome at the highest levels of the Democratic Party. With scant doubt people working in Gillums’s campaign office know this girl’s a loose cannon and knew it before she went batsh!t over the display of ordinary promotional materials.
This in nothing new. Politics have always been used as therapy especially by children of wealth and privilege.
Politics have always been used as therapy especially by children of wealth and privilege.
When and where?
Let’s see, now: the reality TV star encouraged his disciples to “beat the crap” out of a protester, and promised to cover their legal bills. Faux News, his personal television network, claimed that wealthy Jews, including George Soros, were financing the “invasion” of a leprosy and smallpox infested caravan of migrants, so one of his disciples went to his local synagogue and murdered 11 Jews. One of his disciples mailed functional bombs to the reality TV star’s most vocal and high-profile critics. All this and you claim that “The Democratic Party” is a “collecting pool of people with poor emotional self-regulation”? Few to no Republicans stand up to the rodeo clown at whom United Nations delegates laughed out loud when he tried to boast of his “accomplishments”. The rodeo clown praises White Supremacists and identifies himself as a nationalist, a dog-whistle term for white supremacy. He calls migrants with brown skin “animals”, “criminals”, “rapists” and “murderers”. He pitches his racism to non college educated white men who resent the success of women and minorities. He calls Maxine Waters “stupid”, and claims that Stacey Abrams, a Yale law graduate, is “unqualified”. He puts innocent children in cages to punish their parents for seeking asylum, which, under U.S. law, they have every right to do. This is a POTUS who is the worst, chronic, pathological liar in American history. He brags about assaulting women and pays off porn stars and Playboy models while playing husband and father, and while his syncophantic,hypocritical side-kick, Mikey Pence, plays the Evangelical Christian.
I’d like to know how anybody supposedly qualified to go to college lacks the intelligence and moral values to publicly support any Republican, given how low this party has sunk under the rodeo clown See, it’s way, way more than just political differences. It’s integrity. It’s American values. It’s bringing together diverse people, instead of dividing them into tribes. Education is supposed to enlighten the mind, broaden the perspective, and help the student understand and appreciate that there’s a much larger world out there than your own little tribe, comprised of people who are different from you in appearance, culture and values. The mere sight of Agent Orange is so repulsive that it sickens me and many people I know. One week after the synagogue murders, this Jewish college student sees a supporter of a Republican candidate on her campus, and becomes incensed. I don’t blame her. BTW: they were taunting her, too.
I doubt I will educate you or enlighten you and I am probably wasting my time. But I will try.
Fox News never said any such thing that George Soros was financing an invasion of leprosy or smallpox infested caravans of migrants so one of this disciples went to a local synagogue and murdered 11 Jews. Please send me the link where Fox News ever said this.
Trump said he was a “nationalist” – meaning in case you don’t know – stands up for all Americans black, white, yellow, brain, green or whatever color. Being a nationalist is not color based but is Country based. Your comment is racist. At no time has he ever stood up for white supremacists (again show me where he has said this). Whilst some white supremacists may side with him, it cannot be tied to Trump; like in the same way that it would be a Bernie Sanders fault when a supporter who shot up a Republican baseball game and tried to murder 20 Republicans be blame on Bernie Sanders.
You are again bringing color into it when you say “brown skins and rapist and murderers. Trump never said “brown skins”. He is factual accurate that there are a number of people crossing the border illegally who do commit these crimes. But he never said color. You did. That makes you a racist buy insinuating that “brown people” would commit these crimes.
I suggest you look into Barack Obama’s history of locking up asylum seekers in cages. But the liberal media would report it when he did it – only when Trump did it. I suggest you try and be unbiased.
He is correct in saying that Maxine Waters is “low IQ”. Stacey Abrams is a liberal extremist. Trump has the right under the 1st Amendment to say that she is “unqualified” which I agree with his assertion.
So what if he pays off a porn star to keep her quiet. She lied anyway. Why would a a billionaire have unprotected sex (her words in her video on TV) with a fertile woman who could fall pregnant and then be forced to pay millions in alimony over 20 years for an illegitimate child. That would not happen. She is lying and used extortion and blackmail to get him to pay up.
I hate to burst your bubble but most Republicans are extremely intelligent. They didn’t go to Ivy League schools, colleges or Universities even though I’m sure a lot did. But they know common sense, a work ethic and are not living in their mothers basements. And also bursting your bubble. Diversifcation does not work. Look at Europe with the Muslims and Europeans. All diversity does is cause racial stress.
As far as this student who was arrested goes. She accused Trump of being a Nazi. Trump has done more for the Jewish people than the last 3 presidents. His son-in-law is Jewish; his daughter is Jewish; his grand-children are Jewish. he moved the Jewish Embassy to Jerusalem. So lets blame Trump instead of some nuthead (Democrat who happens to hate Trump for being nice to the Jewish people) on killing 11 Jews. Where is her logic and common sense. She broke the law and she should go to jail for this.
OK, Doug: I SAW the clip from Faux News where one of their guest commentators said the migrants had leprosy and smallpox. Afterwards, Faux News had to admit that this claim isn’t true, but how many people saw this? Faux News has since taken it down. I don’t have a clip.
The synagogue shooter has said that Soros and wealthy Jews were financing the migrant caravan, and he had to go stop the
“invasion”. Ask him what “news” channel he watches. What network harps constantly on George Soros and Tom Steyer?
When Heather Heyer was run down and killed by a white supremacist in Charlottesville, your rodeo clown POTUS said there were “good people” on both sides of the controversy. Look it up if you don’t believe me. And, we all know what he means when he uses the word “nationalist”.
Agent Orange doesn’t have to call out the color and ethnicity of the migrant caravan. We know what he means, and he has called them “rapists”, “murderers” and “gang members”. He is not factually accurate. Migrants commit fewer crimes than native-born Americans. There is no evidence that the migrants are any of these things. There is no evidence of any gang members traveling with the caravan, which has banded together as protection against gangs.
As to legally-elected PRESIDENT Obama, Agent Orange can’t have it both ways: he claims “Democrats” are in favor of “open borders”, but to defend Agent Orange, Faux News argues that Obama imprisoned children. It wasn’t done to punish their parents for seeking asylum, like Agent Orange does, and was only temporary. No Democrat has ever advocated for “open borders”. Never was true–just another lie to reel in suckers like you. President Obama deported more illegals than any of his predecessors.
I’m thoroughly sick and tired of the Faux News false equivalency comparing someone who was allegedly a Bernie Sanders supporter who shot a member of Congress at a baseball game and the pipe bomber. Bernie Sanders never incited anyone to hurt someone that doesn’t agree with him. Agent Orange has called on his supporters to beat the crap out of people, at a rally, he said that in times past someone would get beaten up for protesting, and he offered to pay their legal fees. He incites violence, and that is a fact.
Maxine Waters overcame an impoverished background to become a duly-elected member of Congress. She does not have a low IQ. Stacey Abrams is a Yale law graduate, a tax attorney, and also was duly elected to local office. She is far more qualified than a reality TV star who chronically lies about everything, who has serious emotional problems, and who doesn’t really understand how government works.
I hate to burst your bubble, but the Republican Party of today is not the Republican Party of Reagan. The fiscal responsibility is gone, replaced by an historically large and growing deficit due to tax cuts for the uber-wealthy that are not, and never will be, offset by any improvement in the economy, which is likely only temporary. Gone also are the regulations to protect the environment and consumer financial protections, which benefit all of us in the long-run. If Republicans take over both houses of Congress, they will cut Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid to cover the loss of revenue from the tax cuts. It is a demographic fact that most Trump supporters who aren’t billionaires are non college educated white men who resent the success of women and minorities. Trump panders to their prejudices and resentment, which is why he is bringing down the party.
Kushner required Ivanka to convert to Judaism or he wouldn’t marry her. Trump isn’t a Jew and the rhetoric about George Soros and other wealthy Jews financing the migrant caravan resulted in 11 Jews being murdered in Pittsburgh, and this is according to the shooter himself. Moving the embassy from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem pisses off other religious groups who also have a stake in Jerusalem. It is none of the business of the United States whether Judaism or any other religious group has priority claim to Jerusalem. Why should the U.S. symbolically side with Israel on this issue?
It really isn’t much of a stretch to believe that Agent Orange engaged in sex with Stormy Daniels. He brags about grabbing womens’ genitalia. He is not an admirable or respectable person, and Pence is a syncophant and hypocrite.
Anonymous:
You missed the talking point about Trump liking his daughter too much. I won’t tell Georgieboy if you don’t! Lol
Do you think a grown man who lusts after his own daughter isn’t sick? In your entire life, have you ever head a man attempt to praise what he thinks is the attractiveness of his own daughter by stating that he wishes he could date her? It’s all about the vainglory: “my daughter is so beautiful that if I could, I would f__k her”.
Natacha – what did Trump say about his daughter, exactly.
Anon:
you’re slandering trump. he never said he wanted to F his daughter. you’re sick for suggesting it
he praised her beauty and she is a real beauty, anybody can see that, and she’s a very powerful intelligent and accomplished woman, that anyone would be lucky to date
I would say the same thing of my daughter very smart and beautiful and any boy to date her, very lucky!
don’t be a sicko
don’t be a sicko
You’ve thrown water on her.
Maxine Waters overcame an impoverished background to become a duly-elected member of Congress. She does not have a low IQ.
Taking her capsule biographies at face value, the woman at one time had ordinary wage work. However, from the age of 28 all the positions she’s held have been species of political patronage. She attended the most troubled state campus in California (Cal State Los Angeles) and acquired a degree in a notorious subject (sociology). Exactly what the sociology department at Cal State Los Angeles demanded of her is a matter of conjecture.
There’s a doting obituary of her mother published in 2014. The woman certainly had some survival skills. You’re going to need them when you pop 13 babies by three different men between the ages of 17 and 40. ‘Cunning’ and intelligence are two different qualities.
With a photo:
https://lasentinel.net/rep-waters-mother-velma-lee-carr-moore-succumbs.html
You’re really a piece of work, Wretched.
Here’s the obit:
Velma Lee Carr Moore, known to everyone as “Madea,”transitioned peacefully on Wednesday, May 21, 2014 at Beauvais Manor Assistant Living, St.Louis, Mo.
She was born on December 14, 1916 in Cottonplant, Arkansas to Jack and Annie Mae Thomas.
Moore was the mother to 15 children, including Congressional Representative Maxine Waters. Rep Waters issued the following statement regarding the passing of her beloved mother:
My mother was an extraordinary woman who raised 13 children. Everyone lovingly referred to my mother, Ms. Velma Lee Moore, as “Ma Dear”.
She taught her children strong values and that hard work and determination will always gain respect and lead to success in whatever you do.
She lived to be 97 years old and we are all proud that our mother lived a fruitful and rewarding life. Her life lessons to her family will never be forgotten. We will all miss her love, her admonitions, her humor, and the support she gave to all of her family.” -end of obit
It’s time to Make America Safe Again. Jail time….
When conservatives start striking back at the attackers it might give these people pause. By the way with those eyebrows put one of those mustache cigar combinations in her mouth and she could pass for Groucho or would that be Grouchette.
The Great Zambini – If I remember correctly, Groucho put on his moustache with a grease stick, it wasn’t hair. As he grew older, I think he grew it.
Grease stick or hair she still could pass for El Groucho.
The Great Zambini – I loved that the girls did it and it is horrible that the school punished them for being clever.
My granny used to say “Those who don’t respect wisdom, DO respect pain.”
You’re right. When American Citizens who freely exercise their Constitutional Rights begin to defend themselves against this democrat sanctioned Kristallnachting, there won’t be enough crayons, puppies and lollipops in the world to supply the piss soaked safe spaces of these hate filled, violence loving, unhinged cowards.
Poll
89.999% believe violence is justified to defend themselves from vicious attacks by crazed, indoctrinated, goosestepping lunatics.
How about diversity training?
You a comedian in your spare time? Cuz that is funny!
Our country is in dire need of re-learning how to disagree with out disrespecting the other person. Just because they have a different opinion than you does not make OK to attack them or call them names. Civility is a lost art, time to start teaching it in the home and schools.
How about we start with the POTUS?
We are seeing more signs of violence to express opposition to a point of view.
Cannot have that in a civil society.
Up to the judge and the prosecutor to send a signal to all those who want to bring violence into civil debate.
I is/was a Gillum intern and a Commie. I am glad someone is taking this seriously.
She needs a weekend in the pokey and a compelled public apology if she doesn’t want a month there. The latter will hurt the most.
That’s a great idea. Not a long jail sentence but a public apology and probation as part of the sentence.
Probation does a great job…at providing employment for aspirant probation officers.
What is the point of a coerced insincere apology? When I was in grade school and 2 kids fought the idiot teacher made them shake hands as if that would magically resolve whatever led to the fight. A faux-apology might humiliate the irate princess but wouldn’t do anything else. Suspend her from school for one semester and give her 5 days in jail.
Compelled apologies are public shaming with the added benefit of the perp carrying out the sentence.
I don’t care for compelled apologies. A short time in jail and / or corporal punishment should be the order of the day: the birch, the cane, or the pillory.
Singapore will show you how it’s done:
Agree with the forced apologies business. It’s fake.
Probably a torture advocate, as well. This is to Wretched.
I approve of caning. So did Robert Heinlein.
Caning is not torture. Torture is torture.
Torture is also the American prison system that ignores tens of thousands of male on male rapes a year… and rapes of women in custody too
https://www.hrw.org/news/2007/12/15/us-federal-statistics-show-widespread-prison-rape
caning is a fast simple effective and not-costly solution to the epidemic of mass incarceration
it would be very good for things like DUI especially that are serious crimes that are not much helped by a month in jail. dangerous driving drunks need a strong and memorable physical correction to deter them from future bad acts— not a lot of time sitting around thinking about how to brew up more booze in the toilet from orange peels
“The countries that cane their convicts”
23 May 2017
“Caning is considered so barbaric that Amnesty says it could be considered akin to torture.”
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-39991606
OK, the poseurs at Amnesty don’t care for it. Why should any serious person give rip?
No to compelled public apology, that would be insincere. Yes to public shaming. Something equivalent to the dunce cap in the corner.
A compelled apology is public shaming with the perp carrying out the sentence. Satisfying on so many levels.