There is a no stand-your-ground case out of Oklahoma where Alexander Feaster, 46 is claiming that he shot Kyndal McVey, 27, in the back while she ran away as an act of self-defense. McVey had just torn down Feaster’s Nazi flag and he claimed that he was in fear of an “imminent Antifa attack on his home” last June, according to a court motion in the case. 
McVey was attending a party across the street when, around 2:55 am, she decided to tear down the flag. Feaster (an Air Force veteran) said that he was ready with his AR-15 rifle after being warned by a neighbor of a “plot” by “antifa activists.” He shot McVey in the lower abdomen and legs as she ran away.
Feaster’s lawyers are relying on Oklahoma’s Stand-Your-Ground law to argue that he had a “sincere and reasonable fear of imminent peril of death or great bodily harm” that were supported in “the summer of 2020, with the media and left-wing activists drumming up riots and praising violence against their political adversaries.” They argue that his Nazi flags are protected First Amendment speech and that he had a right to defend himself under the law. It is certainly true that the flags are protected (if disgusting) expression of free speech. However, the reasonableness of this use of force is not supported by the facts cited in the defense papers in my view.
…
B. A person or an owner, manager or employee of a business is presumed to have held a reasonable fear of imminent peril of death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another when using defensive force that is intended or likely to cause death or great bodily harm to another if:
1. The person against whom the defensive force was used was in the process of unlawfully and forcefully entering, or had unlawfully and forcibly entered, a dwelling, residence, occupied vehicle, or a place of business, or if that person had removed or was attempting to remove another against the will of that person from the dwelling, residence, occupied vehicle, or place of business; and
2. The person who uses defensive force knew or had reason to believe that an unlawful and forcible entry or unlawful and forcible act was occurring or had occurred.
Notably, the law defines a dwelling relatively narrowly: ” “Dwelling” means a building or conveyance of any kind, including any attached porch, whether the building or conveyance is temporary or permanent, mobile or immobile, which has a roof over it, including a tent, and is designed to be occupied by people.” However, pictures show the flags attached to the house.
There is also a provision to use the SYG law outside of the home:
A person who is not engaged in an unlawful activity and who is attacked in any other place where he or she has a right to be has no duty to retreat and has the right to stand his or her ground and meet force with force, including deadly force, if he or she reasonably believes it is necessary to do so to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony.
Again, these provisions raise whether he had a “reasonable belief” that it was necessary to “meet force with force.” There is no disagreement that McVey was unarmed and running away.
Nevertheless, the defense insists that Feaster
“correctly thought that the men at the party were armed… and that all the persons there were highly intoxicated. An all too familiar pattern of events was occurring and Mr. Feaster reasonably believed his home was soon going to be attacked…‘Believing he was under attack, [Feaster]… used defensive force on McVey and… acted to deter others from similar conduct or deadly force. After he used such force, Feaster retreated into his home… and did not emerge until the Sheriff’s Deputy arrived.”
He is now charged with assault and battery with a deadly weapon. I do not see the reasonable basis for such a use of force in this case even under the highly deferential standards of SYG laws. It is based entirely on what Feaster claims to have been told by a neighbor.
McVay is also suing for $75,000 toward medical bills, lost time and negligence. I teach these cases in my torts class and they raise many of the same issues. Indeed, one of my criticisms of “Castle Doctrine” laws and SYG laws is that the common law already has ample protections for individuals in the use of self-defense.
The common law does not allow the use of force calculated to cause serious bodily injury or death in protection of property. In famous cases like Bird v. Holbrook, 4 Bing. 628, 130 Eng. Rep. 911 (1825), courts have ruled that “[n]o man can do indirectly that which he is forbidden to do directly.” Not only are such devices viewed as immoral (because human life is more valuable than property), but dangerous because such devices cannot tell the difference between friend and foe. The case however also has been cited for the long-standing rule that no property is viewed as more valuable than a human life. That does not mean you cannot take steps to protect your property and a case of protection of property can become protection of self (with the right to use higher levels of force) when the suspect resists or attacks.
When it comes to self-defense, the protections under the common law are ample. There are even protections for mistaken self-defense. In the case of Courvoisier v. Raymond, 23 Colo. 113 (1896), a man chased a group out of his home only to fire when a man approached him outside his home from the stone-throwing mob. It turned out to be a deputy sheriff but the court found that Courvoisier could rely on reasonable mistaken self-defense.
The common law has long offered ample protections even for reasonable mistakes. These laws are based on an urban legend that people are routinely prosecuted for defending their homes from intruders. The laws have produced perverse results as in the infamous case of Tom Horn in Texas. Yet, the popularity of these laws have spawned “Make My Day Better” laws that extend the privilege of lethal force to businesses and cars. Montana’s law had been invoked in workplace shootings.
IE: Men being Men Again
I think Atty Roberts Burns & others are correct that the biggest precedent setting case coming up will be the Kyle Rittenhouse case.
I don’t even know why there’s a case against him in the 1st place, but If the courts rule against him then it is thus claimed by the courts there is no more legal Right to Self Defence.
The videos of the scene make it apper to many of us there is no case against him.
Wow, another one seemed to have been flipped tonight. WP? UN thought police under the control of US’s SOS much?
“I think Atty Roberts Burns ” Atty Robert Barns
As far as the Nazi Flag, the current US Heath system & the Nuremberg 1 & 2 stuff I’ll likely be re-posting that later anyway.
just the facts, ma’m! “imminent peril” shot an unarmed woman in the back, while running away…what an effin’ psycho animal…over a nazi flag… dispicable…hope he gets 20 to life & y’know he probably will…so he’s an idiot, tooo
Have you people been watching South Africa descend into the pits of Hell?
You’re at the door right now!
Thankful we here, Ok, currently have a clear minded DA & maybe our new AG will be the same.
This below short video shows one of the out of control riots about the same time frame Feaster acted.
District Attorney Explains Decision To Not Pursue Charges Against Truck Driver
Join the conversation (
)
Friday, July 24th 2020, 9:23 pm
By: Erick Payne
https://www.newson6.com/story/5f1b97b0a717d00d80c3e8d3/district-attorney-explains-decision-to-not-pursue-charges-against-truck-driver-
BTW: Along with Constitutional Carry in Ok, because of riot attacks elsewhere in the US & here in the Tulsa area where the truck driver had no choice but to run over some people & flee the Commie/Fascist Antifa/BLM aholes. That in turn caused Ok Govt to make clear that it’s legal here run over rioters like antifa/BLM type aholes, etc., in certain cases.
Not only legal but commendable under certain circumstances. The Left truly hates men who act like men.
Who wants to bet against the fact that this American Nazi was a Trumpist?
Olly,
You are an American Nazi, you want to take that bet?
Jeff Silberman, American Marxist
I’ll wager that he wasn’t/isn’t a Trumpist. DT and most of his supporters are more American traditionalist than most of the/you Democrat Socialist Biden supporters. You sit around on your ass while the kneeling BLMers CRTers are turning USA into Sub-Saharan Africa.
Turning USA into Sub-Saharan Africa??
That accusation is despicable, but, I dare say, that no Trumpist on this blog will condemn it.
https://banned.video/watch?id=610054277fbfbe14da259f41
Oops,
Title of that last one.
Texas Police Issue Emergency Alert – Biden Dumping Illegals Sick with COVID on the Streets
48,762 views
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Jul 27, 2021
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The Alex Jones Show
The Alex Jones Show
Alex Jones and Tim Enlow break the news that the La Joya Police Department has issued an emergency warning that Covid positive illegals are being dropped off in public places.
Yes, and those illegals are ending up in the hospitals along with some of those they infected. Then localities start with mask ordinances and yelling at people who aren’t vaccinated.
Biden’s policies today are likely the cause of a lot of the up-tick in Covid cases.
S. Meyer,
I seen you responded last week to that funny Fauci video that Darren McBreen put together for Infowars ended up 118.7 k views.
42 seconds: https://banned.video/watch?id=60f873e18a359803b6852b6a
Here’s a new funny one, I think, from a different group infowars allows to put material up on their Banned.Video:
2:31 min
Pfizer Struck! AC/DC
37,332 views
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Jul 26, 2021
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Bill Gates Is EVIL
Bill Gates Is EVIL
You know the words, sing along! AC/DC (parody ) Greatest Hits Now Available with Proof of Vaccination. Credit @camus37 Twitter
https://banned.video/watch?id=60feea0353951f114e847b4d
Dan Lyman: The Excape from South Africa & the Collapse of Western Civilization:
Watch it all or just the 1st 5-10 minutes…….
https://www.newswars.com/dan-lyman-escape-from-south-africa-and-the-collapse-of-western-civilization/
Now you can see in this video Commie/Nazi Dem/Rino held sh*thole areas in the US are little different & just a couple steps away from complete collapse:
https://banned.video/channel/riot-footage
Oky1,
Whenever I read your posts, what immediately springs to mind is Private Pyle of “Full Metal Jacket” feverishly caressing and incontinently speaking to his weapon while sitting on the toilet in the head.
I feel sorry for you jelly doughnut people who’s moms never held them never breast feed them.
You are correct. I had just one argument with my mother, and it started when I was 5!
Exactly.
eb
The odds favor that Communazi Alexander Feaster voted for Biden, not Trump. Feaster has been registered as an Independent. And while Independents went narrowly for Trump in 2016 (by 4 points), they swung to Biden in 2020. In fact, Biden won with a 14-point lead among Independents nationally, the largest margin recorded among this group since Bill Clinton won Independents in his reelection bid in 1996. Similarly, Communazi Richard Spencer voted for Biden in 2020. The Communazis hate Trump because he was the most pro-Israel US president in history, hands down. The Democrat Party, on the other hand, is loaded with anti-Semites and Biden could be relied upon to reverse as many of Trump’s pro-Israel and anti-terrorist policies as he could. So far, Biden has lived up to those anti-Israel, anti-Semitic expectations. So, forget your nonsense, “jeffsilberman.” Your party, the Democrat Party, is the Party of racism, anti-Semitism, and hate.
And loving every minute of it!
Feaster (an Air Force veteran) said that he was ready with his AR-15 rifle after being warned by a neighbor of a “plot” by “antifa activists.”
Lots of questions for Feaster’s defense. It was 2:55am, how ready was he? Did he have his front porch light? Was he awake, lying in wait in the dark with his flag out as bait? Did he give McVey any warning, or did he simply wait until the theft occurred to open fire? Did he make any effort to contact law enforcement about the imminent threat he had been warned about?
This does not appear to be a reasonable use of force.
First of all, this antifa bull is out of control and MUST be dealt with as such. She and her comrades deserve to get shot. If they did not have financial backing they would be toast by now. As for the nazi flag, thats another bull crap issue of anti-American sentiment in this country being protected by free speech. If the British were to say death to America when the founders created this nation, they would have been shot or hanged on site. The commies have deluted the Constitution with the wrong interpretation. You are either an American or you are not.
Interesting to me that this happened in a area called Hunter Ok, say about 70 miles N of OKC & 70 miles west of Tulsa Ok, the Perp’s name was McVey. I see it reported the defendant’s attorney’s name is Stephen Jones. I’m not sure if it’s the same Stephen Jones that Phk’d up the Tim McVeigh OKC bombing case.
McVeigh was arrested close to Hunter Ok on I35 close to Enid Ok which is where last known Stephen Jones lives.
Anyway, at a glance something smells here. What do I say about Jones? A screw job about Flags & Narratives?
I don’t like using the untrustworthy site Wiki, but here’s what they have up. They show some of the flag stuff.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_Jones_(attorney)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Necessity_(criminal_law)
Also keep in special mind the national & local conditions of June/July, etc., 2020. The Commie/Fascist Antifa/BLM attempt to burn/riot in Tulsa 4 TIMES!, & elsewhere in Oklahoma.
Thankful the Nat Guard/ Gov/LEO shut their azzes down here.
His defense lawyer is just doing his job. Everyone, even Nazi murderers, are entitled to a zealous defense. From looking at the picture, the flag is attached to the house under an awning, or in other words a roof. The space where she must have grabbed the flag would be under that roof and in an area that could be considered a porch. So, the shooting may have taken place in a dwelling as defined by the statute. They say she was running away, but had she run a foot or two (still under the roof) or had she run ten yards (no longer under the roof). If he shot her while she was still under the roof, it might be a legitimate defense. Then it gets into his reasonable belief of what was happening.
Seems a bit far-fetched as a defense to an attempted homicide crime but I’d only charge him if our SJW actually got off the man’s property before the wounding shot and then only with littering.
Thankfully it appears that she lived as he has been charged with assault. There are no heroes in this case.
A drunken self righteous “liberal” who decided to suppress McVey’s (any relation?) speech because it offended her. A trigger happy Nazi nut job who decided to “teach them commies a lesson”.
We are watching the great American Experiment unravel.
I see this as case similar to the Stolen Pig where the Jury found the Man accused of stealing his neighbors Pig (said Pig found in the possession of the accused) “Not Guilty” but had to return the Pig to the Owner
Call it Jury nullification…..both parties were wrong under the Law.
Had the Woman respected the Man’s First Amendment Rights and also his right to privacy by staying off the property and not committing vandalism this whole sad affair would not have happened.
A Jury could instruct the Woman, the Court, and the Public about this by finding the Man “Not Guilty” but make him pay for her Medical Bills.
That would send a message to the Man….to the Woman….and to Society.
In my view if the Jury did that then Justice would be well served.
It would remind folks that we are responsible for our own actions.
I follow your reasoning but this was such a violent act that a civil penalty will not suffice.
The facts could turn out to be different than as reported and he may be not guilty but I oppose nullification of any sort as it perpetuates disparate justice. If the jury likes you, you walk if not it’s the slammer!
No thanks.
PS As of this writing he is legally not guilty. He may have a moral liability regardless of the law.
Ralph,
I think your opinion on this case is about as close to what should happen here.
I’m not aware of all the details here but I do know this region of the country. A person just doesn’t go intruding on someone else’s person, papers & property without the possibility of being harmed.
No more then one would phk with a bull in his pasture & be pissed afterwards when the bull give him the horn. That gal got the horn for her actions. I think she should pay her own medical bills, Apologize to the guy , pay for having his gun cleaned, any spent bullets & any other trouble she caused him.
The reason being is hopefully other Idiots in public will see/hear she has got shot in the azz, it sounds like, & then she had to pay so just maybe the next Idiots don’t get lawless & stupid like in DC, New York, LA, Baltimore, Chicago, South Africa, etc.
And a lot of people know about how some of the laws work, hell all they have to do is look at the current shape of outfits like the ABC agencies leadership, there’s nothing much left there but a large group of Biden’s Chicom Spies/Agents.
This version of the story says he shot 8 times. I’m interested in what happened in this.
https://twnews.co.uk/amp/gb-news/man-47-who-shot-a-27-year-old-woman-after-she-stole-a-swastika-flag-from-his-house-says-it-was-an-antifa-attack
A 46 year old American flying swastika flags is indicative of a very poor education and an even worse personality. A 27 year old fool who decides to rip his flags down while her armed drunken comrades are cavorting across the street is indicative of the same poor education, stupidity and inherent personality disorders.
They deserve each other, two sides of the same coin. Unfortunately the rest of us have to live among both types of ill educated loons.
One day the 27 year old Wokescold will leave her drunken armed comrades at the party, cross the street and rip your American flags down. What happens then?
Which is what makes this case important.
Why must one always portray such an act as one good guy and one bad guy. They were both bad.
The title says she was shot in the back, the body of the piece says she was shot in the abdomen and legs. Which is it? In any event, my guess is she won’t be going on anyone’s property in the future. Moral of the story….don’t go onto anyone’s property especially if they are a nutter, someone who flies that flag is a nutter.
American Nazi shoots party goer for vandalism and not liking what he said. Sorry, no protections under the law should be allowed.
eb
Olly,
I suspect that Turley presented this case and made these comments for your edification:
“They argue that his Nazi flags are protected First Amendment speech and that he had a right to defend himself under the law. It is certainly true that the flags are protected (if disgusting) expression of free speech. However, the reasonableness of this use of force is not supported by the facts cited in the defense papers in my view.”
Be warned.
This guy is an imbecile, he will be convicted of murder. I’m not sure what degree of murder will be appropriate in Oklahoma but it will be a murder conviction of some sort and a well deserved one.
Oops, I guess it doesn’t say that the shooting victim died.
It was an unreasonable use of force and he should be punished to the full extent of the law.
Two aggressive people tried to impose their wills on the community.
Both were wrong.
McVey has paid, Feaster will (very likely) pay.
Good.