Below is my column in USA Today on the alleged attempted murder of Justice Brett Kavanaugh at his home outside of Washington, D.C. Less than 24 hours later, protesters were back in front of the Kavanaugh home as well as the home of Justice Amy Coney Barrett. In addition, pro-choice activists posted the location of the school of the Barrett children. It is all part of a national rage addiction where neither decency nor responsibility are relevant. Indeed, seven children of a justice are no longer even a concern in venting one’s rage.
Here is the column:
The arrest of a man near of the home of Justice Brett Kavanaugh early Wednesday is a chilling escalation in our age of rage.
Police said the man, identified in court records as Nicholas John Roske of California, had a pack carrying a Glock pistol, a tactical knife, pepper spray, zip ties, a hammer and a crow bar.
Roske, according to news reports, was angry that the Supreme Court may overturn Roe v. Wade this month. He faces charges of attempting to kidnap, murder or threaten a federal judge. (This incident came after a judge was recently zip tied and killed in his Wisconsin home; a former defendant in the judge’s courtroom has been charged.)
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Rhetoric raises heat against the court
Politicians and commentators rushed to condemn the threat. Few of them, however, are willing to admit that it was both shocking but not surprising. For months, critics of the Supreme Court have ratcheted up the rhetoric against Kavanaugh and his colleagues, including calls for protesters to be more aggressive outside the justices’ homes.
Politicians and pundits have raced to the bottom by discarding any sense of restraint or responsibility in denouncing the court’s conservative majority over a leaked draft of an opinion, written by Justice Samuel Alito, that made the case for overturning Roe.
Some of us expressed disgust at the threat made two years ago by Senate Democratic leader Chuck Schumer on the steps of the Supreme Court when he called out Kavanaugh by name: “I want to tell you, (Justice Neil) Gorsuch. I want to tell you, Kavanaugh. You have released the whirlwind and you will pay the price. You won’t know what hit you if you go forward with these awful decisions.”
If Kavanaugh had any doubts about the price before, he and his family now know.
The day before the arrest Wednesday, I testified in the Senate Judiciary Committee on new legislation in which Democratic members are seeking to force the FBI to prioritize the investigation of white supremacists for terrorism. In the hearing, senators attacked Fox News and political opponents for fueling terrorism with their rhetoric. (For the record, I am a Fox contributor.) Some of us were attacked in the media for noting that extremist violence, including lethal attacks, have come from both the left and the right.
While I believe that parts of the Democratic bill are unconstitutional and threaten free speech rights, I agree with the condemnation of extreme rhetoric. However, such condemnation should acknowledge the extreme language used on the left as well as the right.
Leaked Dobbs v. Jackson opinion
The leak of the draft opinion in Dobbs v. Jackson Women’s Health Organization was used as a license by many to unleash their anger on these justices. While some of us warned of the danger posed by groups targeting the justices, others expressed joy that the justices might be afraid to leave their homes.
“The View” co-host Joy Behar declared, “It also shows Alito what it feels like to lose your freedom of choice. He cannot leave the house easily. So maybe that’s a good lesson for them.”
Even law professors seemed to call for mob action. Georgetown law professor Josh Chafetz declared that “when the mob is right, some (but not all!) more aggressive tactics are justified.”
CNN’s Laura Jarrett’s take on those saying that targeting the justices’ homes was excessive and wrong: “I think for a lot of people a conversation about civility feels like it misses the mark.”
Some politicians have also taken lightly far-left militants Antifa, a large anti-free speech movement. House Judiciary Committee Chair Jerrold Nadler has called the 2020 Antifa violent protests in Portland, Oregon, “a myth.”
Others have been more direct in their support. Many of us were appalled when former Democratic National Committee Deputy Chair Keith Ellison, now the Minnesota attorney general, said Antifa would “strike fear in the heart” of Donald Trump.
Last year, Rep. Maxine Waters, D-Calif., told George Floyd protesters in Minnesota to “get more confrontational” if a jury found former Minneapolis police officer Derek Chauvin not guilty. And when Sen. Susan Collins, R-Maine, was threatened in 2018 because she had not opposed Kavanaugh’s nomination to the Supreme Court, Rep. Eric Swalwell, D-Calif., mocked the concern over her safety with “boo hoo hoo.”
For her part, House Speaker Nancy Pelosi spoke loudly when she failed to condemn left-wing mobs destroying statues and historic displays in her home city of San Francisco. Pelosi shrugged and said, “People will do what they do.”
The arrest near Justice Kavanaugh’s home frighteningly shows what some people will do.
Supreme Court’s legitimacy
While I do not believe that these politicians would ever countenance violence, they have spent months attacking the legitimacy of the nation’s highest court because they disagree with the justices’ rulings.
Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, D-N.Y., even questioned the institution’s value: “How much does the current structure benefit us? And I don’t think it does.”
Other leaders have supported the idea that, if the court did not yield to their demands, there is a license to take extreme measures like court packing. Sen. Jeanne Shaheen, D-N.H., issued a warning to the Supreme Court: Reaffirm Roe v. Wade or face a “revolution.”
This is no time for a partisan circus:Jan. 6 committee conducted a serious investigation
Those words may be heard by some as more than political posturing or pandering. It is heard as a legitimation of direct forms of justice, particularly by people who are mentally unstable.
Our national addiction to rage is reaching its inevitable end. But mobs are easier to incite than to control.
That is why the arrest of an armed man outside Justice Kavanaugh’s home shouldn’t surprise any of us. But it should be a sobering moment for all of us.
A jurist should not have to wonder whether he can both serve and survive on our Supreme Court.
Jonathan Turley is the Shapiro Professor of Public Interest Law at George Washington University and a member of USA TODAY’s Board of Contributors. Follow him on Twitter: @JonathanTurley
Turley– “While I do not believe that these politicians would ever countenance violence, ”
+++
Overall great and very much needed comment, but I suspect some our current crop of politicians and bureaucrats want violence so long as they can appear to have clean hands. It’s disgraceful that there is even room for a suspicion like that whether it be true or not. But they have made room for it.
They want to see one or two Justices killed, to preserve Roe/Casey and change the balance on the court. It is court packing by other means.
That, and failing murder, a desire to terrify the justices into compliance.
Something similar occurred during the French Revolution. Leftists seem not to have altered much since those dark days.
Roberts helped not at all by appearing to fold on Obamacare. He showed they will back down. Some of them. I don’t expect it from men of courage and principle like Thomas and Alito, but they are rare these days.
Who is “they”?
If you’re going to allege that some people “want to see one or two Justices killed,” have the guts to name them.
Who are you? Have the guts to name yourself.
… says a guy using a pseudonym.
…says the idiot with a bag on his head.
…says the guy using anonymous and pseudonyms.
Court Sides With Forces Who Employed Violence For Decades
March 10, 1993, marked the first-known time in the U.S. that an anti-abortion extremist committed murder. Michael Griffin joined an anti-abortion protest at a reproductive healthcare clinic in Pensacola, Fla., and then fatally shot Dr. David Gunn in the back as the doctor was walking into the clinic.
Just over a year after Gunn was murdered, Dr. John Britton and Ret. Lt. Col. James Barrett, a volunteer clinic escort and a veteran of World War II and the Korean and Vietnam wars, were gunned down in the parking lot of another Pensacola clinic. Barrett’s wife, who saw her husband and Britton murdered, was shot in the arm.
In December 1994, an anti-abortion extremist opened fire on two clinics in Massachusetts, killing both clinics’ receptionists—Shannon Lowney and Leanne Nichols—and wounding five others. In 1998, Eric Rudolph, who bombed the Olympic Games, a clinic, and a lesbian and gay bar in Atlanta, detonated a bomb at a clinic in Birmingham, Ala., killing off-duty police officer Robert Sanderson, who served as a security guard at the clinic, and critically injuring a nurse. In 1998, a sniper murdered Dr. Barnett Slepian in front of his family as he was standing in the kitchen of his home in upstate New York.
On a Sunday at the end of May 2009, Dr. George Tiller was attending services at his church in Wichita, Kan., when anti-abortion extremist Scott Roeder entered the church, raised a gun to Tiller’s forehead and shot him at point-blank range. Tiller had survived being shot in both arms by a different anti-abortion extremist in 1993.
Most recently, Robert Lewis Dear Jr. traveled to the Planned Parenthood clinic in Colorado Springs, Colo., with four SKS rifles, five handguns, two additional rifles, a shotgun, more than 500 rounds of ammunition and propane tanks, intending to wage “war” on the clinic because it offered abortion services. Dear shot at six peo- ple outside the clinic, killing two and injuring three more. He then shot his way into a clinic entrance while 27 healthcare providers, employees, patients and their companions attempted to hide, one of whom was shot during the course of the attack.
In the approximately five-hour standoff that ensued, Dear turned his weapons on law enforcement, shooting and killing one officer and injuring four more. In total, Dear fired 198 bullets during the attack. According to Dear’s documented interview with the police, he was “happy with what he had done because his actions … ensured that no more abortions would be conducted at the Planned Parenthood facility in Colorado Springs.”
The murders are, of course, the highest-profile examples of violence against reproductive health providers and clinics, but they alone don’t come close to telling the full story of the unrelenting, daily violence and harassment that anti-abortion extremists visit on providers and clinics. Attempted murder, death threats, stalking, kidnapping, bombings and arson are a routine part of life for providers and clinics.
Edited From:
https://msmagazine.com/2022/05/06/anti-abortion-violence-terrorism-roe-v-wade/
Are you suggesting that what anti-abortion extremists have done justifies the assassination attempt on Kavanaugh by a pro-abortion extremist? Violence is violence regardless of who commits it but what about the violence being perpetrated on babies still in the womb?
Stooge, come back when you’ve got a real question.
Demos-cracy is aborted in darkness. The Pro-Choice “ethical” religion denies women and men’s dignity and agency. The wicked solution (i.e. elective abortion, reproductive rites) to a purportedly hard problem: keep women appointed, available, and taxable, reduces human life to negotiable commodities for social, redistributive, clinical, and fair weather causes.
Major says:
“what about the violence being perpetrated on babies still in the womb?”
Until you Anti-abortionists stop calling us Pro-abortionists “baby-killers,” we’ll never be able to settle our differences. We will never agree that a baby exists at conception.
Who said anything about conception? Babies are being murdered in the womb. That’s a fact.
Lie!
People are convicted for murdering babies in the womb. The California Supreme Court interpreted “fetus” to apply “beyond the embryonic stage of seven to eight weeks” and according to California Penal Code187 “Murder is the unlawful killing of a human being, or a fetus, with malice aforethought.” The key word here of course is “unlawful”. Apparently California and most states recognize the right to life by prosecuting the murder of some unborn babies but for some reason they believe it’s okay to murder an unborn baby if the mother wishes. That doesn’t sound like equal protection under the law for unborn babies.
Here is the fill California Penal Code 187:
187.
(a) Murder is the unlawful killing of a human being, or a fetus, with malice aforethought.
(b) This section shall not apply to any person who commits an act that results in the death of a fetus if any of the following apply:
(1) The act complied with the Therapeutic Abortion Act, Article 2 (commencing with Section 123400) of Chapter 2 of Part 2 of Division 106 of the Health and Safety Code.
(2) The act was committed by a holder of a physician’s and surgeon’s certificate, as defined in the Business and Professions Code, in a case where, to a medical certainty, the result of childbirth would be death of the mother of the fetus or where her death from childbirth, although not medically certain, would be substantially certain or more likely than not.
(3) The act was solicited, aided, abetted, or consented to by the mother of the fetus.
(c) Subdivision (b) shall not be construed to prohibit the prosecution of any person under any other provision of law.
—————
This code 187 does not define a fetus as a human being. It’s “human being, OR a fetus”
They are not identical. The fact that abortion is not murder under this code proves that the fetus is NOT a baby because a mother cannot consent to kill a baby.
Case closed.
This code 187 does not define a fetus as a human being.
Please provide the genus, family, species, of a fetus, so the new Justice and I can sort this out.
Kiss my white pasty a$$
Let us stick to the science.
I’m sure were closer to agreeing if we can agree on the meanings of the words.
We could not agree on the time of day.
Jeff, looking for clarification here. And again, I am not anti -abortion. I think that viability has to be in the equation. Scott Peterson was convicted of a double murder in Modesto. He murdered his wife and his unborn child. How do you square that circle?
Paul,
I agree viability should be the dividing line. I don’t recall how old Peterson’s wife’s fetus was.
Jeff, Laci was 8 months pregnant.
So given the fact that she was 8 months pregnant, I would guess that would answer the viability question. Again, how do you square that circle?
If the fetus is viable, it’s murder. What’s the issue?
I don’t know about those that had abortions, nor will I comment about them, but one thing is sure, You are a baby killer.
How is this relevant?
Anti-[elective] abortion for social, redistributive, clinical, and fair weather causes, for closure of abortion and clinical cannibalism chambers, and for medical care to mother and child. Roe, Roe, Roe your baby (Planned Parenthood), your granny (Whitmer/Michigan/planned parent/hood) down the river Styx. The wicked solution, the final solution, is neither a good nor exclusive choice.
Without defending the actions you cite – your quoted article is still drowning in spin.
No one was engaging in violence against reproductive health.
They were engaging in violence over the killing of fetus’s.
If you can not accurately describe the facts,
why is the rest of what you say to be taken seriously ?
“the newspaper of record”: number 1 source of misinformation and left wing narrative
“If this had been a liberal Supreme Court justice that someone came to kill, it would’ve been on the front page….And that’s what so disappointing about a paper like The New York Times. Because they wear their bias on their sleeves and if it’s not part of something that feeds our narrative, f** it, we bury it.”
Stooge, let’s keep this harassment OFF the front page. Why encourage copycats?
So stooge, should shootings be kept off the front page? Why encourage copycats? I’m pretty sure the suspect wasn’t arrested for harassment.
Isn’t your name ‘Estovir’?
Why have you switched to ‘Sergeant Major’??
Wow Anomaly, you are really melting down tonight. Perhaps you should contact your therapist.
Perhaps you should take your own advice ashtRay.
Alyingninny:
You have absolutely no idea who anyone is here on the blog. Quit pretending that you do. It is incredibly hard to think any lower of you than we do already but let’s just say you rocketed down just past whale poop with this one.
LMAO
He is Carnac and the Wizard of Oz all in one. He has had so many names on here and mocked for each, that he has now settled for Anonymous. But his whiny voice is the tell
Mespo, I sent you an email weeks ago to your comcast address. FYI
NOT SURPRISING
“Oh, it’s happening, Sweetheart!”
__________________________
WASHINGTON — House Majority Whip Steve Scalise and three other people were wounded Wednesday morning when a gunman opened fire on members of the Republican congressional baseball team as they were practicing on a field in Alexandria, Virginia.
– NBC News
_________
Congress must retroactively appoint a June 14th Commission.
OT
Attention: Supreme Court
“…SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED.”
Mitch McConnell’s Senate GUN bill is unconstitutional, violates the “manifest tenor” of the 2nd Amendment, and must be swiftly struck down with extreme prejudice.
Sitting Justices swore an oath to support the literal, verbatim, actual Constitution and Bill of Rights of the United States, concluded December 15, 1791.
The Judicial Branch and Supreme Court have no power or authority to legislate, modify legislation, modify legislation by “interpretation,” or otherwise usurp constitutional legislative power.
By all means, Honorable Justices, please do your assigned and sworn collective duty, understanding that Americans posses the utmost capacity to read and understand the English language, including the Article and Section relating to impeachment and conviction of all officers of the United States.
Guess again. Even Scalia wrote that the 2nd amendment isn’t absolute.
2nd Amd hasn’t been working worth a crap against the Bio/Chem Weapons.
Even the US VAERS reports over 33,000 dead & that report is by Columbia & Harvard claim the report is 40 to 100 times under reported.
The labs below are Illegal.
https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2022/06/us-department-defense-finally-comes-clean-admits-public-document-46-us-funded-biolabs-ukraine/
*** Even the US VAERS reports over 33,000 dead & that report is said by Columbia & Harvard research shows the report is 40 to 100 times under reported. Their rate est. 1.32 mil to 3.3 mil dead ***
Forgot to add that bio-weapons killed far more then school shootings
The Supreme Court recently corrected a Supreme Court that was wrong, erroneous, illicit and unconstitutional.
Mitch McConnell will be corrected or the U.S. Constitution will have been formally nullified and abrogated.
The 2nd Amendment is absolute, or the 2nd Amendment does not exist.
If the 2nd Amendment does not exist, the entirety of the Constitution and Bill of Rights does not exist.
You may choose to be a fundamental-law-abiding, constitutional American, or you can be a direct and mortal enemy of the Constitution, Americans and America.
You are also free to emigrate as a personal protest against the U.S. Constitution and America.
The “writing” America obeys is that of the Constitution and Bill of Rights.
This is not the United States of Wally under the dominion of the Caterwauling of Wally and Friends; this is the United States of America under the dominion of the “manifest tenor” of the Constitution.
You, your allies and your sympathizers have no power or authority to amend the Constitution, outside of the constitutional amendment process.
Surely you too can read and comprehend this simple phrase, Shall Not Be Infringed.
__________________________________________________________________
2nd Amendment
A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.
______________________________________________________________________________________________________________
“…declare all acts contrary to the manifest tenor of the Constitution void.”
“Limited government can be preserved in practice no other way than through the medium of the courts of justice; whose duty it must be to declare all acts contrary to the manifest tenor of the constitution void. Without this, all the reservations of particular rights or privileges would amount to nothing.”
– Alexander Hamilton
With social progress, civil rights violations are rationalized with a Minority Report, and human rights violations under the Pro-Choice “ethical” religion and ancient rites.
I saw it mentioned above that someone felt the Republicans stole a seat when RBG died suddenly. With respect to Justice Ginsburg, She actually put the seat in play. I believe it was mentioned by many that President Obama suggested that RGB retire in 2014 so he could appoint someone to replace here while he still had control of the senate and he feared losing the senate in the 2014 midterms and he did. So it would seem to me that he was quite aware that in his final 2 years it would likely be impossible for him to get a new Supreme Court Justice appointed. I did not support President Obama but he was no fool and he was also a pragmatist. RBG was an outstanding Justice, although I did not support many of decisions. She had had several episodes of cancer and one in particular that persisted and required several episodes of treatment and she was as frail an Individual as I have ever seen in such a high office and she was clearly dying (any physician with experience could recognize that). It was no surprise that she died in office and yet she could have retired in 2014 and Obama could have appointed his Justice. She would have been the toast of the left and received well deserved accolades for her service even in retirement from both left and right. But she did not do that and that left it up to Trump.
War and Politics is about avoiding or minimizing loss and risk yet also seizing opportunity. And the Republicans seized the opportunity. The democrats would have done the same.
RBG’s family and friends should have counseled her to retire or her legacy would be at risk.
Much of the democratic rage is that they dropped the ball and the republicans picked it up and ran with it. The democrats know it but it is hard to admit.
It’s always hard to take the blame for our own mistakes but you have to own up to them if you are going to learn anything.
Ruth may have sustained her viability after an epiphany that changed her choice about human rights, about civil rights, and denied the choice of succession to Barack “burden” Obama. No more baby hunts. No more baby trials. Respect women and men’s dignity and agency, four choices and an equal right to self-defense through reconciliation. The wicked solution, the final solution, is neither a good nor exclusive choice that was normalized for social, redistributive, clinical, and fair weather causes to keep women appointed, available, and taxable.
Mr. Turley,
Your remarks fall short of the mark. Politicians and pundits generally always race to the bottom on almost all issues. Expecting them to show “any sense of restraint or responsibility” is to achieve a state of delusive contentment. As you would be the first to state, their words are protected by free speech rights which not only allow them to present their point of view (no matter how banal and wicked those words might be) but allow the rest of us the opportunity to listen to those words and pass judgement. However, the thin red line that that once crossed separates criminal activity from free speech lies in law.
Laws may be good or bad depending upon their constitutionality and one’s point of view. The remedy for bad law is to change it or eliminate it either through the legislative process or judicial review. For law enforcement to ignore the law is not only unacceptable because of failure to carry out their prime responsibility, such actions encourage further disrespect for law to include intentional criminal activity.
Rhetoric for or against the court, congress or the executive branch will wax and wane depending upon the issues involved and the points of view. However, attempting to influence a court is specifically addressed in 18 U.S. Code Part 1 Chapter 7 § 1507. It is Mr. Garland’s duty to enforce this law. It is the duty of the legal profession to demand integrity at all times on the part of all law enforcement officials including Mr. Garland. The failure to enforce the law threatens us all. In that light, the opinions of agenda driven politicians and media gossip hounds pales.
The inflammatory rhetoric and lack of enforcement of 18 USC 1507 are no accident. They are meant to intimidate the Justices and to create a climate for assassination. Killing one or two of the Justices comprising the alleged Dobbs majority would preserve Roe/Wade and change the balance of the court through Biden appointments. It is a different means to accomplish the objective of court packing, which they don’t have the votes for.
18 USC 1507 cannot be used against protesters because merely protesting is not seeking to influence a decision. The very definition of protesting is expressing an objection. Lobbying is seeking to influence. That’s why that law cannot be enforced.
18 U.S. Code § 1507 – Picketing or parading. “Whoever, with the intent of interfering with, obstructing, or impeding the administration of justice, or with the intent of influencing any judge, juror, witness, or court officer, in the discharge of his duty, pickets or parades in or near a building housing a court of the United States, or in or near a building or residence occupied or used by such judge, juror, witness, or court officer, or with such intent uses any sound-truck or similar device or resorts to any other demonstration in or near any such building or residence, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than one year, or both.”
“Targeted, stationary protest, solely and directly in front of a justice’s home, with the intention of influencing that justice’s opinion on a vote, could constitute a violation of Section 1507,” said Vera Eidelman, staff attorney with the ACLU Speech, Privacy and Technology Project, in an interview with PolitiFact. May 13, 2022.
Problem is merely protesting is not enough to charge a protester under 18 USC 1507. Proving intent is extremely difficult and you can’t arrest them without probable cause. That’s why the law cannot be enforced.
The intent of a protest is to influence others.
That’s what trials are for.
You can’t arrest someone without probable cause first. Merely protesting is not proof of intent. This is why they can’t arrest those protesters. There’s such a thing as due process.
Merely protesting is not proof of intent.
That’s what arraignments and trials are for.
But….. the govt CAN arrest a truck load of protesters on the way to a protest? But not protestors violating the precise language in a statute.
Again there cannot be an arrest without probable cause. Government cannot arrest protesters on their way to a protest.
Svelaz,
“You can’t arrest someone without probable cause first. Merely protesting is not proof of intent. This is why they can’t arrest those protesters. There’s such a thing as due process.”
Please share this with the J6 committee.
Ray, Jan 6 protesters were arrested while committing a crime. Tresspassing, vandalism, assault. That’s pretty clear probable cause. Protesting in front of a justices home on a public sidewalk without violence or vandalism is NOT probable cause to arrest since those actions are constitutionally protected activities. Trespassing and vandalism are not.
Should God destroy the world to destroy all of the bad things about it?
God already tried that by flood. Problem is he didn’t finish the job by letting Noah live. He made a mistake.
Svelaz says:
God already tried that by flood. Problem is he didn’t finish the job by letting Noah live. He made a mistake.
Don’t blame Noah. Maybe he should have left Ham at the dock. Ham as Noah later found was recruited into the notorious group known as The Demon-Crats. A nasty bunch of near do wells, rioters, vase snatch and grabs and goat fornicators. It was by accident this was revealed to Noah by God while selecting pine trees for his next boat, something like (Field of Dreams voice), “Noah check the outhouse”. That was the location Ham secreted his membership ID to The Demon-Crats.
So let’s leave Noah alone he tried his best to save us but like then like today our kids could screw up a Velveeta Cheese sandwich.
God smoothed the peaks, which may be a recurring phenomena; but, there is still a compelling cause to retain a proving ground for spirits with limited effect (e.g. all’s fair in lust and abortion) encased in souls. Mortal gods and goddesses are known to clear their accounts with progressive judgments, trials, and redistributive change not limited to recurring world wars (e.g. World War Springs or WWS). The revival of human sacrifice in religious (e.g. “ethical”) rites for social, redistributive, clinical, and fair weather causes has diverse precedents in secular sects.
“Even law professors seemed to call for mob action. Georgetown law professor Josh Chafetz declared that “when the mob is right, some (but not all!) more aggressive tactics are justified.”
More aggressive tactics against Supreme Court justices? These leftist professors are essentially endorsing domestic terrorism. Shameful, and they should be denounced.
Drumpf thought the mob he turned on the Capital should hang Pence! Thought he deserved it. You want to blame Democrats for the current state of affairs, yet make no mention of the main reason we find ourselves here. Try to be more serious…
Trump didn’t turn a mob on the Capital. In fact he told people attending the rally to “peacefully and patriotically make your voices heard’. Don’t you watch Rachel Maddow? Just two days ago she stated “Just a key point, that yes, there was a pro-Trump rally at which the president spoke. And we can absolutely talk about all the things the president said there. But the idea that that rally is the thing that got out of hand and that somehow resulted in the breaching of the capitol. That rally was very far from the capitol and the people who, as you say, did the initial breach, that allowed everybody else to come in, they never even went to that rally.”
There’s no evidence Trump said Pence deserved to be hung. It’s all hearsay.
Just more bombastic BS from another long time anonymous Turley troll.
“There’s no evidence Trump said Pence deserved to be hung. It’s all hearsay.”
Trump said it. He was gleeful about it too.
Major says:
“Trump didn’t turn a mob on the Capital. In fact he told people attending the rally to “peacefully and patriotically make your voices heard.”
Why didn’t the Trumpists listen to him? After all, these are the people who would vote for him had he shot someone on 5th Avenue! Stands to reason they would follow his orders.
Many of Trumpists did not fly-in from all around the country just to hear Trump speak which they could have watched on Fox. Many came purposely to attack the Capitol, e.g., the Proud Boys, etc. They were in D.C. because they had swallowed the “carnival snake charmer’s” Big Lie hook, line and sinker. By the time Trump told them to “peacefully and patriotically make your voices heard,” it was far too little and much too late….
——————
Major’s response to my comment will be his mindless go-to: don’t listen to this troll suffering from “Trump Derangement Syndrome” aggravated by reoccurring signs of “Turley Derangement Syndrome.”
“Why didn’t the Trumpists listen to him?” Maddow already provided you with an answer to your question.
You know damn well I mean the hundreds of rednecks who followed the Proud Boyd and the Oath Keepers after they breached the barricades. The fact that the militant thugs did not attend the Trump speech proves that they were on a mission from god to take back the country.
Turley is being disingenuous with the details and thus feeding the rage himself. What a massive hypocrite he is. Here’s what Turley is not saying about this man who “attempted” murder.
“ Montgomery County police arrived at the scene after the suspect, identified in court records as Nicholas John Roske, called 911 around 1:42 a.m., allegedly claiming to be armed, suicidal and that he came to “kill” a Supreme Court justice.”
The man turned himself in. He was mentally unstable and suicidal. Turley leaves out the fact that the man was rational enough to turn himself in. He wasn’t “caught”. Nobody knew he was even there until he called 911 and turned himself in. That should be a pretty important detail about this incident, but no, Turley got busy feeding the rage which he is railing about. Turley is one massive hypocrite.
Then he goes on to complain about the “extreme” rhetoric while ignoring the fact that it IS free speech and calls to condemn it. The irony in his complaint can be seen when students condemn and call for punishment on those on the right because of their own extreme rhetoric which Turley always defends as free speech, but this rhetoric from democrats is not as equally defensible despite being extreme?
Protesting is also protected free speech and doing it in front of justices homes is constitutionally protected. Doxing is not illegal. What Turley doesn’t realize is that this is just a consequence of exercising the 1st amendment.
Turley seems to want to punish those who are expressing this “extreme” rhetoric without saying it.
Turley is feeding the rage too and he knows it.
“Nobody knew he was even there until he called 911 . . .”
Except, of course, for the U.S. Marshals stationed outside Kavanaugh’s house, as the would-be-murderer approached it.
Some of the facts of this are unclear.
Do you have a source that Koske was detected before he called 911 ?
I am seeking further information.
Koske’s 911 call and turning himself in are irrelevant – if he knew he was going to be apprehended.
“ Koske’s 911 call and turning himself in are irrelevant – if he knew he was going to be apprehended.”
It is actually quite relevant because the charge of attempted murder would be difficult to argue in court if he turned himself in. He changed his mind. He didn’t know he would be apprehended. He was suicidal and wasn’t planning on being apprehended.
It also means he recognized that he was not well.
You keep reading his mind.
Have you talked to him ?
I would note YOUR arguments apply to those at J6.
There was a tiny bit of vandalism. there was no revolution. No one brought guns,
The only murders were by the police.
Your drowning in hypocracy.
John B. Say,
“You keep reading his mind.
Have you talked to him ?”
No, He literally told the police exactly what he was thinking. It’s easy to deduce the rest. It’s not rocket science or mind reading.
“Roske called 911 twice, though the first call was short as he said he would find a street sign to give his location, then called back.
“I’ve been having them for a long time,” Roske said of the thoughts he’d been having in his second call with an operator. “I’m from California. I came over here to act on them.”
Roske told the operator he intended to hurt someone else and himself. He said, “I brought a firearm with me, but it’s unloaded and locked in the case. … It’s in a suitcase. It’s a black suitcase. … I’m standing near it, but the suitcase is zip-tied shut. I just came from the airport.”
“Before confessing, Roske walked away from the scene, turned a corner, and called law enforcement to turn himself in. FBI agent Ian Montijo also interviewed Roske early Wednesday after he had confessed his plan to the police.
“I’m standing now, but I can sit, whatever. I want to be fully compliant,” Roske told the 911 dispatcher, according to a copy of the call released Thursday by the Montgomery County Police Department. “So whatever they want me to do, I’ll do.”
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/crime/911-man-accused-plot-to-kill-kavanaugh-called-police-himself
“I would note YOUR arguments apply to those at J6.
There was a tiny bit of vandalism. there was no revolution. No one brought guns,
The only murders were by the police. ”
Not really, because that would mean ALL Jan 6 rioters were mentally ill, Which I would think you don’t agree with that assessment
. It was a LOT of vandalism and theft. Smearing feces on walls and stealing laptops and documents. People did bring guns too. It’s all on record’
“Federal prosecutors say that Christopher Michael Alberts of Maryland was arrested on Capitol grounds on the evening of Jan. 6 while carrying a Taurus G2c 9 mm handgun with one round in the chamber and a full 12-round magazine. He also allegedly had an extra magazine in his pocket and was carrying a gas mask, pocket knife and first-aid kit.
Lonnie Leroy Coffman of Alabama was also arrested that evening after law enforcement found two firearms on his person, as well as what a federal judge referred to as a “small armory” in his truck, which was parked near the Capitol. According to the court, the government found “a loaded handgun,” “a loaded rifle,” “a loaded shotgun,” “a crossbow with bolts,” “several machetes,” “a stun gun” and “11 mason jars containing a flammable liquid, with a hole punched in the top of each jar.” According to the government, surveillance footage showed him “in attendance at the events at the Capitol,” though he has not been charged with breaching the building.”
“The only murders were by the police.”
Ashli Babbitt was not murdered. She was shot trying to breach a secure area where lawmakers were still occupying She was shot because made a very poor decision. That was not murder. I was no different than anybody else who doesn’t follow law enforcement orders.
You have quoted me out of context and apparently not even in the same Turley article.
I would suggest going back and reading exactly what wrote – the entirety of it, in context.
There still appears to be a significant lack of clarity regarding the FACTS.
Koske was observed by law enforcement getting out of an Uber and casing Kavanaugh’s home.
Unless you are claiming he called 911 (twice as you said) prior to being dropped off, you are incorrect in presuming we can know Koske’s intentions from 911 calls or conversations with the police.
In fact you are ALWAYS wrong when you presume to know what another person is thinking just because you know what they said.
From the moment Koske was beleived that law enforcement had noticed him – and there is no objective means of knowing when that was.
He could have beleived he was the subject of law enforcement scrutiny significantly BEFORE he actually was.
Regardless, from that moment, we can not accept as true anything he says about his own intentions – if we EVER can accept as true what others say of their intentions.
We KNOW the Koske planned a crime, gathered the materials to do so, and took significant efforts to put that plan into effect.
It is as you claim POSSIBLE that he changed his mind at the last minute – as he appears to have said.
It is also possible that he SAID he changed his mind in the hope of avoiding criminal charges.
Again – if you wish to push this bizarre nonsense – it would all apply even more to J6 defendants.
Nearly all of which were unaware they were committing a crime (because they weren’t). Regardless they certainly did not have the mens rea necessary for an actual crime – Koske clearly did. He went to Kavanaugh’s home with the intention of KILLING HIM – something he admits.
We generally take defendants against their own interests are likely True, while we generally take self serving statements that are not verifiable facts as likely not true.
Regardless, by any measure Koske is far guiltier than nearly anyone associated with J6.
If fact thousands of BLM protestors are far guiltier.
DOJ is letting off BLM protestors who fire bombed a police car – even though any arson charge has a 5 yr manditory minimum.
It reduced the plea agreement with the Attorney’s who fire bombed a police car with officers in it.
34 People were killed in the 2020 BLM riots. Thousands were injured, substantial amounts of arson were committed – including to local state and federal buildings. Billions of dollars in damage were done – yet of the thousands arrested, nearly all charges have been dropped, and where they have not been dropped – incredibly light sentences for very serious crimes have been imposed.
Conversely few of the J6 protestors are actually guilty of REAL crimes, and none of the consequence of BLM protestors who are not being prosecuted or being lightly prosecuted.
This is the end of the rule of law.
An the end of the rule of law is the end of legitimate government.
J6 was NOT an insurrection – nearly anyone can grasp that.
But actual insurrection against lawless govenrment is justified – read the declaration of independence
Or just think.
Over the course of the past few years we have watched the chinese government crackdown on its own people – in particular protestors in Hong Kong.
Many of those are facing the same harsh punishment that J6 protestors are. None are facing the slap on the wrist – if that given to BLM rioters.
Is protest of lawless and tyranical govenrment in Hong Kong justified – or do you stand with the chinese govenrment – that violated the laws of Hong Kong to crush political dissent.
If you do not wish to be compared to totalitarian states – do not act like them.
It was not alot of vandalism – prosecute those who actually committed vandalism the same as those who committed BLM riot vandalism – i.e. not at all.
The Feces claim was Debunked. If you can prove someone actually did that – prosecute them – again like BLM rioters.
Overall you make my point – you have exagerated J6 – as the left does with everything.
Few would have any difficulty of J6 protestors were treated the same as similar BLM protesters.
But that is not happening – and we all know it.
If you think otherwise – then lets have a REAL set of hearings on violence against govenrment in 2020 and 2021.
Lets compare apples to oranges.
With respect to your “gun claims” – it is already known that a few protestors brought Guns to DC.
There were a TINY number of guns found in cars or hotel rooms. NOT IN THE CAPITAL
I would suggest that you read Heller and McDonald – that is not a crime.
Being arrested merely for possession of a gun – would be a violation of the 2nd amendment.
I know that you BELEIVE that the mere existance of a gun ought to be a crime – but it is not. It is note even evidence of intent.
But the absence of firearms in the capital proves there was no attempted insurrection – or sedition.
In an era where th left adhered to the rule of law nearly all the J6 prosecutions never would occur.
There were no knives or firearms brought inside the capital that has been covered under oath by Both the FBI and the Capital Police several times.
No J6 protestor Used an actual weapon, No J6 protestor committed Arson – there was massive amounts of BLM arson. That is the primary cause of the 2B in damages from BLM riots.
All you do with these stupid arguments is prove that you arehypocritical and lawless – and that WILL eventually get you an “insurrection”.
Alishi Babbit was MURDERED.
There is law on the justified use of force by federal law enforcement. It requires an IMMEDIATE threat of neath or serious bodily harm to yourself or another.
There was no such thing. Tresspass is NOT a justification for killing someone. Breaking a window is NOT a justification for killing someone.
Had there been congressmen in the room Babbit was trying to enter – that would not even b close to justification.
If and only if there were congressmen in the room – which video shows they had left, either she would have had to have had a gun AND be aiming it at someone, OR she would have had to been on top of a congressmen with a knife.
Neither of which was True.
You are well aware of Police who have RECENTLY been convicted for killing actual criminals – even accidenally.
This officer Aimed and shot – it was no accident.
Further he officer was reckless – as there were other people – including other capital police officers – with guns immediately behind Babbit.
The Officer shot Babbit in the neck – in otherwords he nearly missed and could have killed another officer.
The former mayor of my home town has about 15,000 guns in his basement.
Owning lots of weapons is NOT A CRIME.
Were any of these weapons USED ?
Of course not.
Therefore there CLEARLY was no insurrection.
Within the past couple of months – 24 separate acts of arson or other violence targeting pro-life clinics has taken place – with left groups claiming responsibility.
That is just in a few months. Can you name a single instance of arson by a white supremacists group in the past 50 years ?
Was there any arson at J6 ?
There were no lawmakers in he room at the time Babbit tried to enter – the video is readily available. they had all left shortly before.
We do not murder people because the make poor decisions.
George Floyd made several bad decisions on the day he died that all lead directly to his death.
Are you saying he was not murdered ?
Svelaz – You are an obvious hypocrite.
It will always be easy to turn your arguments on their head to find counter examples of people doing things you support without suffering the same consequences.
Antifa rioters in portland blinded police with lasers – none of them were short. They through rocks at police – none of them were shot. They breached a federal courthouse and started fires in it – none of them were shot.
Why ? Because shooting them – just as shooting Alishi would be murder.
The officer who shot Alishi did NOT identify himself, Did not issue any orders. He just murdered her.
In fact – though I a not aware of capital police telling protestors to break down doors and windows, I am not aware of the capital police ordering protestors AT ALL. In fact there is video of them inviting protestors intot he capital.
Even Antifa John Sullivan’s video should encounters with capital police were they do not try to stop protestors only to stall them.
Repeatedly the capital police agree to allow protestors to move forward – if they will wait a few moments as the capital police clear the area thay are going to – and the protestors complied.
At the Alishi shooting – there are 4-5 capital police blocking the door – until the room behind is cleared.
As soon as the room is cleared, he capital police move out of the way to allow the protestors through – and right after that Alishi is murdered.
I do not care whether he was or was not well.
I do not care if he recognized that he was unwell.
What matters is whether he had the capacity to determine right from wrong and the ability to resist evil impulses.
He clearly did. That makes him mentally NORMAL with respect to the law.
That means he made informed choices – aparently driven by ideology – not compulsion such as most mass killers.
We are all glad that at the last moment he backed down,
and he deserves some credit for that.
But it does not change the fact that the actions of leftists risked the political assassination of a supreme court justice
You are not free to protest at peoples homes.
“But it does not change the fact that the actions of leftists risked the political assassination of a supreme court justice
You are not free to protest at people’s homes.”
No, it wasn’t the actions of leftists that “risked the political assassination of a supreme court justice”. It was one individual who had issues with mental illness. It’s no different than the reasoning the NRA or republicans use when they describe those who commit mass murder like those in schools and supermarkets. I don’t see you blaming or criticizing the right for their risky actions emboldening mentally ill individuals.
You can indeed protest at people’s homes provided you do it on a public sidewalk and within reasonable loudness or actions. It’s a perfectly legal and constitutionally protected activity.
Svelaz,
You said, “No, it wasn’t the actions of leftists that “risked the political assassination of a supreme court justice”.”
The record says differently; “In March 2020, on the day that the Supreme Court heard oral arguments in a case challenging the constitutionality of a Louisiana law regulating abortion facilities, Senate Democratic leader Chuck Schumer appeared at a pro-abortion-rights rally on the steps of the Court where he threatened Justice Neil Gorsuch and Justice Brett Kavanaugh by name.
“I want to tell you, Gorsuch, I want to tell you, Kavanaugh, you have released the whirlwind and you will pay the price!” Schumer shouted. “You won’t know what hit you if you go forward with these awful decisions!””
https://www.nationalreview.com/2022/06/schumers-reckless-threats-against-kavanaugh-and-gorsuch/
Your credibility is in the hole but, by all means, keep digging!
Ray,
That’s not an insinuation of political assassination. It’s expressing an objection. It’s simply free speech as any other that Turley defends every day.
“I want to tell you, Gorsuch, I want to tell you, Kavanaugh, you have released the whirlwind and you will pay the price!” Schumer shouted. “You won’t know what hit you if you go forward with these awful decisions!”
Tell me, Which part is clearly political assassination?
Weeks ago: “You won’t know what hit you “
Days ago Refusal to provide the Supreme court
Yesterday: Attempted murder of Supeme Court Justice
Today: More of the same
Tomorrow Supreme Court Justice murdered. The left celebrates its victory.
Svelaz, you are a first class A$$ and as stupid as they come.
Mr. Koske would not have known where to go but for the actions of other leftists.
NOT “one man”
I would note that left wing GROUPS – not individuals have claimed responsibility for the arson and other violence against pro-life centers.
We have already been through the mental illness thing before.
Do you have evidence that Anxiety or depression correlate with assassination or murder ?
There are strong correlations between many mental disorders and criminal acts.
Psychopathy, Schitzophenia, paranoia,
Should we start “Red Flagging” everyone with depression of anxiety ?
Would there be many people left ?
You keep making stupid arguments.
If you were depressed or anxious – and you committed murder – you could not even get into the psychiatric wing of a prison.
It is quite a different argument than the NRA or republicans or I use.
There are certain specific crimes that are strongly assoicated with specific mental disorders.
Mass Killers as an example pretty much all suffer from disorders that radically distort reality
Serial killers are all or nearly all psychopaths.
Political assassination is not associated with depression or anxiety.
No, he called 911 and turned himself in. He didn’t approach Kavanaugh’s home. He was met by police a few blocks from his home.
Initial statement from the security detail, said he was questioned when he got out of the Uber at 1:05.
I fear the media is burying the initial press release. I don’t have time look.
Are you being disingenuous or did you not know that the reason that the accused attempted murderer turned away from the home after being spotted by federal law enforcement?
This sick person planned this out. He purchased a handgun in California, which has some of the most strict gun laws in the nation, waited the mandatory time, purchased flex cuffs, and made arrangements to get to Maryland. Along the way, he had numerous opportunities to cool down and rethink his plans, yet he still ended up outside of a justice’s house. The only thing that stopped the murders was the presence of armed agents.
While I do feel empathy for the man, and I do believe that he was suicidal, he was trying to commit murder. To conflate his actions with the constitutionality protected act of demonstrating is not arguing in good faith.
He turned himself in only after realizing that Marshals spotted him getting out of a cab in front of Kavanaugh’s home at 1:00 a.m. Just more bombastic BS from Svalez the long time Turley troll and juvenile poster.
No, they didn’t “spot” him. He called 911 first and turned himself in.
How would the U.S. marshals spotted him not knowing he was armed? He wasn’t “spotted”. They were alerted to him by 911 dispatchers.
Who told you they didn’t spot him? You’re just making shit up. According to CBS “U.S. Deputy Marshals reported seeing a person dressed in black clothing and carrying a backpack and suitcase get out of a taxi that stopped in front of a current justice’s house at roughly 1:05 a.m., according to the affidavit. The person looked at the two marshals and turned to walk down the street, the FBI agent wrote.”
He called 911 only after US Marshalls spotted him.
Several questions need to be answered:
How did he afford these weapons and gear given he was unemployed since last year when he worked as an Asst Manager at a pest control office?
How he did afford airfare from CA to MD?
If he brought the gear in California, how did he smuggle them in the plane?
If he bought them in Maryland, how did he get these so quickly?
What what his timeline from departing California to arrival at Kavanaugh’s house?
If he has a mental illness, who helped him with accessing all of these tools?
Why did he state he was suicidal only after US Marshall spotted him as opposed to prior to being spotted?
Who helped him? what groups provided him assistance with guidance, planning, logistics, accessing weapons and gears, lodging, meals and transportation, particularly to Kavanaugh’s home past midnight?
What did his parents know?
What do his phone and internet records reflect as to planning and coordinating all of these affairs?
What communications has he received from the Left wing Pro-Abort violent groups like “Ruth Sent Us” who have a very visible presence on social media?
It is difficult to believe he acted solo at age 26 with such a sophisticated plan living ~3000 miles away.
Given the violent anarchy the Pro-Aborts are currently vocally encouraging on social media, Big Tech needs to be investigated thoroughly. These groups are more visible, more brazen, more numerous and more active than any supposed Q Anon, Proud Boys, Unite the Right/Patriot Front groups whom I have yet to come across despite living near Charlottesville, VA.
“ He called 911 only after US Marshalls spotted him.”
No. He called 911 before that, twice.
No questions have to be answered. He came to Kavanaughs house to kidnap or kill the Justice or a member of his family. This guy came here from California.
“ Who told you they didn’t spot him? You’re just making shit up.”
Nope. They only “spotted” him after he made a second 911 call telling them where he was getting off. They were already aware of him because he called 911.
“ It was just after 1 a.m. Wednesday when Roske, who is from Simi Valley, California, called the police on himself, saying, “I need psychiatric help.” He had called a cab to the home of Kavanaugh and arrived just one block away from the house before police arrested him. He told the operator that he had shown up to hurt “Brett Kavanaugh … the Supreme Court justice.”
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/crime/911-man-accused-plot-to-kill-kavanaugh-called-police-himself?_amp=true
“ Roske told the operator he intended to hurt someone else and himself. He said, “I brought a firearm with me, but it’s unloaded and locked in the case. … It’s in a suitcase. It’s a black suitcase. … I’m standing near it, but the suitcase is zip-tied shut. I just came from the airport.”
When he arrived at Kavanaugh’s Maryland home early Wednesday, he spotted a pair of deputy U.S. marshals, who were part of the Supreme Court justice’s security force.
Before confessing, Roske walked away from the scene, turned a corner, and called law enforcement to turn himself in. FBI agent Ian Montijo also interviewed Roske early Wednesday after he had confessed his plan to the police.
“I’m standing now, but I can sit, whatever. I want to be fully compliant,” Roske told the 911 dispatcher, according to a copy of the call released Thursday by the Montgomery County Police Department. “So whatever they want me to do, I’ll do.”
So he spotted the Marshals, walked away from the scene, and called 911. If he was able to spot the Marshals then why couldn’t the Marshals have spotted him as well? Well what do you know, according to the FBI the “Marshals reported seeing a person dressed in black clothing and carrying a backpack and suitcase get out of a taxi that stopped in front of a current justice’s house…” You said “No, they didn’t “spot” him.” Nothing you wrote proves that. If they were “seeing” him get out of the taxi in front of the house then obviously they spotted him.
Sargeant major,
You said U.S. Marshall’s spotted him. BEFORE he called 911.
He called 911 twice. The first time before being spotted then the second time after he got out of the cab and he spotted the Marshalls first. He walked away and called 911 again to report where he was and that he was surrendering himself.
It wasn’t the Marshalls who arrested him. It was the Maryland police.
Major says:
“Just more bombastic BS from Svalez”
Would his “BS” smell as bad as the BS that Bill Barr claimed Trump was shoveling?
Guess it would depend on who smells it but at least you acknowledge it was BS which you tend to shovel as well.
We all shovel it to some extent, but Trump is in a class of his own.
I am glad that Koske turned himself in.
But no that is not the most important detail.
Koske freely without coercion or inducement admits to intending to assassinate a supreme court justice.
There is not a single J6 protestor who freely admits to intending to commit a violent crime.
I am very glad that Koske stopped himself at the 11th hour.
Had he gone forward even unsuccessfully he would have torn this country apart.
Koske proves the moral bankruptcy of the left.
There are very very very few – and nearly all on the left who beleive that the assassination of others can be justified by political goals.
John B. Say,
“ Koske proves the moral bankruptcy of the left.
There are very very very few – and nearly all on the left who beleive that the assassination of others can be justified by political goals.”
No, Koske proves that there are individuals with mental illness and he recognized he needed help. He was THINKING about it, but ultimately didn’t go thru with it.
That’s not an example of moral bankruptcy of the left. That’s just pure partisan hackery on your part.
Jan 6 rioters where calling for hanging and “eliminating” lawmakers.
“ There is not a single J6 protestor who freely admits to intending to commit a violent crime.”
There were a few. Many wanted to hang Mike Pence. They even built a gallows.
“He was THINKING about it, but ultimately didn’t go thru with it.” Not only was he THINKING about it he had planned and prepared to go thru with it until he was spotted by Marshals.
According to CBS “U.S. Deputy Marshals reported seeing a person dressed in black clothing and carrying a backpack and suitcase get out of a taxi that stopped in front of a current justice’s house at roughly 1:05 a.m., according to the affidavit. The person looked at the two marshals and turned to walk down the street, the FBI agent wrote.”
Svelaz is a paid troll employed by Act Blue, a DNC aligned troll farm funded in part by George Soros.
You can spot the paid trolls by one classic technique they all use, which is why you should never engage them. Their technique is known as “sealioning”. Natacha, Enigma, Jeff, eb, Dennis, Svelaz/Sammy/Seth Warner/Enoch Poor (too many sock puppets to recall), BabyTrump, et al, ad nauseam, are notorious at “sealioning”. These trolls are paid to wear you out and sabotage the blog, which is to say they are seasoned pros at manipulating the many users on here who get suckered. The trolls would have no effect on the blog if not for those who engage the sealioning of these paid trolls.
https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Sealioning
Sealioning
A subtle form of trolling involving “bad-faith” questions. You disingenuously frame your conversation as a sincere request to be enlightened, placing the burden of educating you entirely on the other party. If your bait is successful, the other party may engage, painstakingly laying out their logic and evidence in the false hope of helping someone learn. In fact you are attempting to harass or waste the time of the other party, and have no intention of truly entertaining their point of view. Instead, you react to each piece of information by misinterpreting it or requesting further clarification, ad nauseum. The name “sea-lioning” comes from a Wondermark comic strip. “I spent five minutes asking polite questions, sealioning him into hours of writing until he got exasperated and told me to f*** off”
Estovir, you’re obviously being irrational as usual. When you can’t make a concise rebuttal you resort to insults and ranting.
Estovir.
Thank you for clearly classifying the tactic employed by our blog trolls who post under the names of Svelaz, Silbermann, Anomaly, Natacha, Dennis, et al.
To be clear, I am not claiming that these entities are all a single individual. Such a claim is not necessary if you adhere to Occam’s Razor because, as explained by Einstein, the only quantity that is certain to be infinite is man’ s capacity for stupidity.
Where is the proof about that Mike Pence story? I’ve never seen it anywhere. Sounds like bs to me, what did they belong to a three letter agency like many of the rest trouble makers? Ray Epps, John Sullivan’s dad?
They repeat it ad nauseam as if to convey they hold life sacred. That is how evil the Left is. They abide by no constant truths, theirs is a dictatorship of relativism, distorting facts and lynching, to quote Justice Thomas, anyone. That is, after all, their history.
Truth to be told, the Left regrets that they didn’t hang Pence, then had him drawn and quartered. Witness their vocal and blatantly violent pro-abort groups who relish stalking, terrorizing and instilling fear in the 7 children of Justice Amy C. Barrett. Witness too how they mock, ridicule and slander the Ecumenical Charismatic group, “People of Praise, including calling them a “cult” because they hold Christian truths as their guide. Justice Barrett belongs to such a group in Fairfax, VA. I used to belong to the Catholic Charismatic movement in the 1980s including attending a Mass led by Pope John Paul II. Then again the Left hated Pope John Paul II. These people are pure evil and should be called as such loudly. They certainly havent had s problem for calling Catholics far worse things
“Truth to be told, the Left regrets that they didn’t hang Pence, then had him drawn and quartered.”
It was trump supporters who wanted to hang Pence. They really wanted him to hang.
“They really wanted him to hang.” Protestors hang effigies of politicians all the time, set them on fire, and talk a big game but do they really want that to happen? Who knows? Most people just chalk it up as heated rhetoric like Schumer’s threat to Kavanaugh and other Justices on the steps of the Supreme Court.
not only is proof required – but specific proof – Nearly always those on the left pretend that what was actually said means something different than was actually said.
Like Musk being accused of supporting a white supremecists – because he voted for a legal female Mexican immigrant in the TX congressional race.
If Koske represented a person with mental illness grasping they need help – he would have sought help in California.
Anxiety and depression might lead to suicide – they do not lead to assassination.
There are many mental illnesses that result in people committing crimes but for the illness they would no do.
Anxiety and depression are NOT among those.
AGAIN nearly everyone that beleive that assassination can be justified by politics is on the left.
This should not be surprise as the left is the politics of the ends justifies the means,
It is an accurate observation of the real world.
“Jan 6 rioters where calling for hanging and “eliminating” lawmakers.”
And yet they did not bring guns, or other weapons.
While the violent rhetoric is greater on the left – whether you or I like what is being said – that is protected free speech.
Mr. Koske brought a weapon.
There is not only no evidence that the Language of J6 protestors reflects the intention to actually commit violence, in fact the absence of weapons and attempts to committ real violence demonstrate they engaged in nothing but speech – we can get violent speech from any democratic politician.
Fortunatelty Mr. Koske did not go through with his internded actions – though there is debate as to whether he really changed his mind or just got caught and claimed he changed his mind. Security was not going to allow Koske to take further steps before deciding that he was serious about his intentions.
I would further note that J6 protestors did not sneak to the capital in the middle of the night.
They did not Dox democrats and then confront them at their homes.
They did not bring guns.
The only people murdered at J6 were protestors.
If they had wanted to hang mike pence – he would have swung.
Of course they build a gallows – just like Kathy Griffin beheaded Trump and
A theater group staged Julius Caesar with Trump as Caesar and Cassius and Brutus slaying Trump.
You would think that they understood that Caesar is not the villian in Shakespeare and Brutus and Cassius are not the hero’s
None the less the violent speech and imagery at J6 was theater. Mr. Koske was not.
John ,
I think P Turley is going public on hating Anti-American Commie/Nazi Dim/Rinos.
The Gateway Pundit.com I find is a great site to follow:
*****
Law Professor Jonathan Turley Criticizes FBI Director and Dirty Cop Chris Wray for Labeling Jan 6 “Domestic Terrorism”
By Joe Hoft
Published June 11, 2022 at 5:00pm
331 Comments
https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2022/06/law-professor-jonathan-turley-criticizes-fbi-director-dirty-cop-chris-wray-labeling-jan-6-domestic-terrorism/
*****
https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2022/06/bipartisan-group-democrat-rino-senators-come-agreement-electoral-count-act-will-require-20-congress-challenge-states-electoral-votes/
Turley is slowly being red pilled by the left.
“There is not a single J6 protestor who freely admits to intending to commit a violent crime.”
Actually, they all freely admitted to committing violent crimes. They video themselves doing it. That’s why they have been arrested and charged accordingly. It’s funny how you make such an effort to minimize the fault of the right while ignoring the equal fault from the right. The proud boys and oath keepers both right-wing extreme militants engaged in violent activities in the capital and encouraged others to do the same.
It is funny that you continue to believe that we will believe the crap that you post.
Evidence doesn’t lie. What is telling is that nobody has refuted my posts yet? Are you able to?
What is telling is that you actually believe nobody has refuted any of your posts.
“nobody has refuted my posts yet?”
LOL, this Schmuck has been proven wrong so many times, that one starts to wonder about the numbers. What provides more wonderment is that this Schmuck has yet to learn it. LOL.
They freely admitted and video taped themselves in acts that YOU call crimes ONLY when those on the right commit them.
While your understanding of the constitution, the first amendment and what constitutes a crime is not only WRONG, but actually completely unworkable, and even greater problem is that you are not consistent, and therefore you are lawless.
Colbert producers broke into the capital after hours and paraded through it. If that is legal – nearly everything every J6 protestor did was legal.
If they are released ROR nealry every J6 protestor must be released ROR.
To the extent that the actions of one group were more egregious than the other – the Colbert Producers were worse – they broke in and paraded arround while congress was not in session – that is LESS protected by the first amendment.
I think the Colbert Producers should get a slap on the wrist. There actions were marginally criminal and they are atleast weakly protected by the 1st amendment. But everything the J6 protestors did is LESS illegal and MORE protected – yet they languish in jail some sentenced to as much as a decade.
The J6 hearings fundimentally revealed the the left thinks that disagreeing with them politically is criminal.
Grow up. Get over yourselves. J6 Could have and possibly should have been MUCH WORSE and would still have been legitimate.
Had the Proud Boys actually occupied the capital – that would be no different than democrats doing the same in the Wisconsin capital in 2010.
We constantly get this nonsense from the left that democracy is threatened.
Absolutely – BY THE LEFT.
You keep saying things as if they are facts.
The claim against the Proud boys is that they “planned” to occupy the capital.
If that is “violent” – then so was the democrats occupation of the Wisconsin capital in 2010.
There are specific individuals who CLEARLY incited violence – nearly all of those have NOT BEEN CHARGED – leading to speculation that they were FBI agents or informants.
Regardless, Why hasn’t the J6 committee put ANY of the people you claim “incited violence” under oath ?
There is no crime of being right wing.
There is no crime of being extreme
There is no crime of being militant.
Not that you have proved your claim that certain groups were “right wing extreme militants”.
Whether they are or not still remains up proven.
Regardless, Just like left wing extreme militants – such as the Kavanaugh confirmation protestors – political labels are NOT crimes.
Initiating actual violence is a crime.
Breaking into the capital when it is closed at night is a crime.
Trying to enter the capital while congress is in session to protest has NEVER been a crime before.
When you make up the law to suit your politics – you are Lawless, the rule of law is lost.
Violence is something that is actually real. An officer repeatedly kicking a woman while she is on the ground – that is real that is violence.
An officer shooting a woman for allegedly tresspassing – that is murder, that is violence, that is real.
Pushing past barriers that never should have been up in the first place – that is not a crime.
We now know that Trump WANTED the National Guard present and authorized them more than a week in advance.
We KNOW that Pelosi and Schummer were warned days in advance and did nothing.
The National Guard shouldhave been there – not to keep the capital closed, but to keep it OPENED,
So that protestors could protest, so that they could assemble and petition government.
The Crime was closing the capital while congress was in session.
The majority of the country is depressed and anxious – the consequence of two years of bad Covid policies, and 6+ years of the left constantly ranting that we are moments from totalitarianims.
Mental health issues as those are all too much the norm and are not an excuse.
The overwhelming majority of Mass Killers are psychotic, or have other mental health problems that dramatically distort their perception of reality, or their ability to understand right or wrong or their ability to make choices.
If Koske has those problems – rather than anxiety and depression – you may have an argument.
You can not draw political conclusions from the specific ideology that paranoid schizophrenics adopt.
But it appears more likely that Koske is more like Thomas Hodges and was actually driven by his ideology rather than his mental health issues.
The fact that the man was rational enough to turn himself in goes AGAINST your mental health argument.
Mass Killers – do not turn themselves in. They do not even conceive of it. They are living in an alternate realtiy.
It is Self Evident that Koske was living in ACTUAL reality, that he was driven by politics.
Anxiety and depression are among the few mental health issues that we understand reasonably well.
While some people are more prone to them than others. Both are within peoples control.
we can fight and overcome anxiety and depression. We can not overcome schitzophrenia.
Further Anxiety and depression NEVER justify harming others. They do not alter our moral judgement.
They do not alter our ability to know right from wrong or to resist doing wrong.
Koske turning himself in demonstrates that. But it also demonstrates as you said that he was still Rational
and that he rationally decided to assassinate a supreme court justice – even if thank god he stopped short of completing the act.
Making Koske Rational also makes him political.
“The fact that the man was rational enough to turn himself in goes AGAINST your mental health argument.
Mass Killers – do not turn themselves in. They do not even conceive of it. They are living in an alternate realtiy.
It is Self Evident that Koske was living in ACTUAL reality, that he was driven by politics.”
No, you WANT to make it about politics. That doesn’t make what happened here. You’re entitled to your opinion, but not your own facts. Mental illness is not just people who are psychotic or detached from reality. Many people with mental illness do have the capacity to recognize it and seek help, but often it is when they contact the police for help that things turn badly for them. This instance turned out to be the best case scenario.
Just because he made a rational decision at the last minute doesn’t make it proof that he was acting solely as political.
“Further Anxiety and depression NEVER justify harming others. They do not alter our moral judgement.
They do not alter our ability to know right from wrong or to resist doing wrong.”
No, anxiety and depression do alter moral judgments. They do alter the ability to know right from wrong. It’s no different than a person who is drowning pulling down the one who is attempting to rescue them. The man was clearly suicidal and was intent on ending his life. That doesn’t mean he won’t harm others. Mass shooters often kill themselves because they are already feeling suicidal. It has nothing to do with politics. He was emotionally upset and having mental illness issues compounds the problem. It’s not political.
“No, you WANT to make it about politics.”
I am not trying to “make” it about anything.
Koske made is about politics.
“That doesn’t make what happened here. You’re entitled to your opinion, but not your own facts.”
There is nothing in debate.
You are just wrong.
“Mental illness is not just people who are psychotic or detached from reality.”
Correct, but LEGALLY and in REALITY people who are not “detatched from reality” are responsible for their actions – whether they are depressed or not.
I admit the law on mential illness has been complicated by the fact that over the years we have moved towards holding people who are clearly not mentally competent legally responsible. But there has NEVER been a time where anxiety or depression were considered either as diminished capacity or actual innocence.
This is NOT my oppinion – it is the LAW, But it is MY OPINION that the law is CORRECT.
Paranoia, Psychosis, and a few other mental disorders all involving severely distorted perceptions of reality DO result in diminished capacity.
Anxiety and depression do NOT.
Mr. Koske is not suffering from severely distorted perceptions of reality. I am sorry than he is anxious. I am sorry that he is depressed.
But neither justify his actions, NOR do they alter the FACT that his conduct was politically motivated.
Those with reality distorting disorders often glom onto politics to justify heinous acts. But they pretty much always distort politics just as they do reality, They are xenophobic and eco terrorists simultaneousy. Or they are committing heinous acts based on misuse of grammar, or the presence of tree names in street names.
Mr. Koske does not fit any of that. He actions were POLITICAL and intended to be POLITICAL.
Just as the arson and violence against pro-life clinics is POLITICAL VIOLENCE.
“Many people with mental illness do have the capacity to recognize it and seek help, but often it is when they contact the police for help that things turn badly for them.”
Complete tangent.
“This instance turned out to be the best case scenario.”
Irrelevant and Wrong. koske traveled accross country with weapons and burlary tools.
He was observed by law enforcement getting out of an uber and acting suspiciously.
He also cased Kavanaugh’s home.
“Just because he made a rational decision at the last minute doesn’t make it proof that he was acting solely as political.”
Irrelevant and wrong.
Absolutely not committing a political assassination at the last minute is a RATIONAL action – for which Koske deserves credit.
It makes him innocent of actual assassination. It does not make him innocent of all violent crime.
Nor does it mean he was not acting politically.
I would further note that we do not have the full timeline yet.
We do not know whether Koske called 911 before or after Law Enforcement identified him as a threat and move to arrest him.
We do not know that Koske did not call 911 knowing he was about to be arrested.
Though YOU like all left wing nuts constantly assume you know more than you actually do.
“No, anxiety and depression do alter moral judgments. They do alter the ability to know right from wrong. It’s no different than a person who is drowning pulling down the one who is attempting to rescue them. The man was clearly suicidal and was intent on ending his life. That doesn’t mean he won’t harm others. Mass shooters often kill themselves because they are already feeling suicidal. It has nothing to do with politics. He was emotionally upset and having mental illness issues compounds the problem. It’s not political.”
I have quoted you so that you and everyone else can read it AGAIN.
You clearly know nothing about what you are toalking about and blurr things all over.
All drowning people are not suicidal. People drown that have no mental health issues all the time.
Drowning causes panic – and panic is a temporary distortion of reality.
That is true whether you are attempting suicide or not.
Koske was not “panicked” – he drove accross country.
Mass shooters are often suicidal – but all suicide is not the same. Mass shooters tend to want to end it all in a blaze of glory.
Not as a means of escaping mental pain.
Mass shooters have a long term distorted view of reality.
Koske did not drive accross county to assassinate rthe local gasngo clerk.
This was political.
Some people can talk but cannot think. You have done a good job in detailing his failures.
No one is condemning free speech.
There is a vast difference between saying you can not come to someones home and rant at 3am, and saying that you can not go to the capital to protest the certification of a dubious and lawless election.
Only the left seeks to stop speech they do not like.
Long ago we properly understood that you can not limit WHAT people can says.
But you can SOMETIMES limit Where and When people can speak so long as you do not infringe on their right to speak.
We recognize that some places – such as the US capital are the penultimate platforms for political speech.
While private homes are places where speech can be completely barred.
The issue is not WHAT is being said – but WHERE.
“Only the left seeks to stop speech they do not like.”
No, It’s not “only the left” it’s the right as well. DeSantis seeks to stop speech they don’t like by doling out punishment and banning discussions in school. Banning books, banning discussions, and making laws against different points of view because they don’t like it. Don’t pretend they don’t do this too.
“While private homes are places where speech can be completely barred.
The issue is not WHAT is being said – but WHERE.”
Protesting on a public sidewalk and street is not illegal. Protesting on a public sidewalk in front of a private home is constitutionally protected speech activity.
As long as it is being done on a public sidewalk and within noise ordinances it is perfectly legitimate and completely legal.
Do you think before you post ?
Schools are not government created forums for free speech.
Students are not adults.
Teachers are employed by the public to provide the specific education that we have deemed necescary for survival as an adult.
You are about as far as you can get from a legitimate domain for free speech.
No one has “banned books”. They have however decided that some books are not appropriate for schools to freely provide to kids of certain ages.
Societally we have done that all the time – try getting into an R rated movie without a parent, or an X rated one at all.
We call the people who initiate sexual conduct with pre-teens pedophiles.
Teachers who engage in sexual conduct with Teens are sexually violent predators.
None of this is NEW.
It is left wing nuts who are pretending that we can bring sex into the nursery without a long hard discussion and changes to our laws.
A discussion that you will lose, and you know it.
I am libertarain – Government has no business at all in schools PERIOD. That would solve nearly all of this nonsense.
Choices about the education of their children belong to parents.
Parents are not very good at that – but government is much WORSE.
We allow LIMITED involvement of government in raising of children – we allow government to step in when parents egregiously abuse their children.
And I use egregiously deliberately. Government has no business interfering with a parents decisions regarding the cloths a child wears or the name they are called. Whether those choices are made well or badly, they are the parents choice until the child is an adult.
When parents physically abuse kids – THEN we expect government to step in.
Government is NOT an alternate parent.
Nothing DeSantis of Florida has done precludes a parent from raising or educating their child as they please.
What Teachers and Schools were doing was interfering with the education of children.
Further, no sane person gives a schiff about the gender education of a child that can not read, write or perform fundimental math.
There is no moral equivalence between barring adults from coming to the capital to protest a stolen election, and teachers upset that parents control the education of their children.
Each of these teachers is free to protest in the capital to their hearts content – saying whatever they wish.
DeSantis has not prevented any adult or parent from buying any book or providing that book to their children.
“Protesting on a public sidewalk and street is not illegal. Protesting on a public sidewalk in front of a private home is constitutionally protected speech activity.
As long as it is being done on a public sidewalk and within noise ordinances it is perfectly legitimate and completely legal.”
Incorrect as to the law and the facts.
All public sidewalks are NOT the same.
In much of the country – homes do not have sidewalks.
Sidewalks in front of commercial properties are usually govenrment provided public sidewalks.
Those in front of a home rarely if ever are.
Free speech is about govenrment restrictions in public forumns. NOT private property.
I would further note that Roads generally ARE publicly owned – but you are not free to protest as you wish on the road.
We also have laws against harrassment, and stalking. Are those laws unconstitutional ?
J6 protestors walked on public sidewalks – moving aside government placed saw horses, and up public stairs and into a public building.
These sidewalks, stairs, and the building itself were the pre=eminent government created public forum for free speech and petititioning govenrment in the country.
Are you saying that If Kavanaugh had put out a few saw horses – the abortion protestors could be arrested, and held without bail ?
Are you saying that the J6 protestors mistake was in protesting at the capital – not Pelosi’s home the night before ?
You are an obvious hypocrite. You are trying to force reality to fit your politics – and warp the law to do so.
That is not going to work.
There is no way in the world that Koske’s actions are not more egregious than ANY j6 protestor.
There is no way that all abortion protestors actions are not more egregious than nearly all J6 protestors.
You are actively fighting to tear down the rule of law, and substitute your own politics as the arbitor of what can and can not be done.
No protesting at homes is NOT constitutionally protected.
Protesting at the US capital is.
Protesting at the Supreme court is.
As to the legality of doxing.
If you provide the address of a person to others – Knowing that it is likely to be used to commit a violent crime – you are guilty of conspiracy to commit that crime.
“No protesting at homes is NOT constitutionally protected.”
Yes, it is. There is NOTHING in the constitution that says where you can’t protest. Even in originalist and textualist interpretations. Nothing. Any public sidewalk or street is a public speaking venue. This is why you see “jesus freaks” with signs on street corners and they can be doing that on a sidewalk in front of a home.
“If you provide the address of a person to others – Knowing that it is likely to be used to commit a violent crime – you are guilty of conspiracy to commit that crime.”
That is a big “IF”. Given the difficulty in proving intent that would be very unlikely. This is why doxing is not illegal in the majority of instances. The point is it is not illegal.
Wrong again long time Turley troll. Protesting at homes is NOT constitutionally protected. In the past, the Supreme Court has addressed bans on residential protests. For example, in the 1988 Frisby v. Schultz case, the Supreme Court upheld a Wisconsin law that banned targeted picketing outside of a person’s home.
“ In the past, the Supreme Court has addressed bans on residential protests. For example, in the 1988 Frisby v. Schultz case, the Supreme Court upheld a Wisconsin law that banned targeted picketing outside of a person’s home.”
Unfortunately this case was about a WISCONSIN law. Not Maryland. It only applied to That Wisconsin town ordinance.
Maryland laws don’t have anti-picketing laws that apply to residential neighborhoods. Many are addressing the FEDERAL code which does not apply to the justices homes. In Maryland it’s legal to protest in front of justices homes from a public sidewalk as long as certain limitations are followed. This is why it’s not an illegal activity when they are restricted in time and manner.
The entire constitution is about GOVERNMENT.
There is no need for the constitution to address free speech on private property – because the constitution and first amendment do not apply their.
If you wish to keep up this ludicrously stupid argument about sidewalks that is trivial to deal with.
We will just tear up all the sidewalks. If a public sidewalk on private property limits the protection of property owners from harassment, then that public sidewalk is a 5th amendment Taking – and a violation of the property owners rights.
I doubt you are aware of this but in much of the country there are no public sidewalks. Public Sidewalks are a city and sometime suburban thing.
I would further note that all sidewalks are not public. If you walk on a sidewalk inside of an apartment complex or a private community – that is NOT a public sidewalk and you may be tresspassing.
You also fail to grasp that the capital protestors walked on public sidewalks, up public stairs and into a public building.
And you are arresting them for tresspass. How are they tresspassing and abortion protestors NOT ?
You seem to be clueless what the constitution is. It is a framework for government – defining the powers of government.
Regardless, you are arguing that the right to protest is absolute – then why are J6 protestors in jail ?
Are protestors allowed to murder people while they are protesting ?
Are they allowed to commit arson or other crimes of violence ?
Can they tresspass ?
Are you allowed to Jwalk if you are protesting ?
Unless the answer to these and many many other questions is YES – then your argument clearly fails.
Absolutely some laws limiting protest are constitutional an some are not.
You seem to think that all laws regarding protest are unconstitutional with respect to those on the left.
but constitutional when applied to those on the right.
That is pretty much exactly what the constitution BARS – the creation or enforcement of laws based on viewpoint.
“Any public sidewalk or street is a public speaking venue. ”
Would that not include the sidewalks at the capital ? The stairs leading to the capital ? The public hallways inside the capital ?
“That is a big “IF”. Given the difficulty in proving intent that would be very unlikely. This is why doxing is not illegal in the majority of instances. The point is it is not illegal.”
It is not all that big a reach. Nor is “intent” as you are using it necescary. All that is necescary is to know hat violence is probable – not to wish for it.
We have already seen that the result is attempted violence – Even if you can give doxers the benefit of the doubt in the past, they are not entitled to it in the future. Given that an assassination attempt has resulted – those providing addresses of ?justice NOW KNOW that violence probably will result,
They are NOW legally culpable even if they were not in the past.
There is no “head in the sand” exception to facilitating violence.
Your outrage would be less hypocritical if you were similarly defending J6 protestors.
Why would the J6 be the same? Those protesters went beyond protesting. They committed crimes of assault with deadly weapons, illegally trespassing in the capitol, vandalism, and theft. Protesters at justices homes just protesting from the sidewalk are not the same thing. If the J6 protesters stayed behind the barriers then their actions would have been just as defensible. There’s a distinction.
“Why would the J6 be the same?”
You are right – they are not the same – the J6 protestors were protesting at an actual govenrment created forum for free speech.
They were petitioning government AT the pre-eminent location to petition govenrment in the country.
“Those protesters went beyond protesting.”
Nope.
“They committed crimes of assault with deadly weapons”
nope. The only actual assaults we have are by the capital police.
“illegally trespassing in the capitol”
So you can somehow allowed to Tresspass ont he public sidewalk in front of Kavanaughs house – but not on the public sidewalks, stairs and public hallways of the US Capital ?
“vandalism, and theft.”
Those you actually have for either prosecute for those –
“Protesters at justices homes just protesting from the sidewalk are not the same thing.”
It is exactly the same.
” If the J6 protesters stayed behind the barriers then their actions would have been just as defensible. There’s a distinction.”
So if the police errect barriers on the sidewalks in front of Kavanaugh’s house that would make those protests crimes ?
I would note that:
Most of the barriers were removed before most J6 protestors showed up.
Often those barriers were removed by the capital police.
Hundreds of people entered the capital on J6. Nearly all of those walked in – without climbing through, or going arround any barriers.
Even inside the capital – the capital police blocked public doorways – telling protestors that they would be allowed in – in a few minutes.
And that is what happened at location after location. That is also what happened at the location where Alishi Babbit was murdered.
The capital police – officers on the same side as protestors blocked the doors while Congressmen exited the lobby, A few protestors broke some of the windows at that time. Then when the lobby was empty the officers stepped away from the doors, and Alishi started climbing through the broken window, and was murderd by an officer on the other side. That officer not only killed Alishi – when the lobby was already cleared, but he endangered the lives of other protestors as well as he other capital police officers who were behind Alishi at the time. The officer has a long record of reckless conduct with a gun and the murder of Alishi was whitewashed as it would detract from YOUR false narative.
It is self evident from the actual video Both of Alishi’s muerder and elsewhere on J6 at the capital – that had ALL of the capital police behaved as MOT of the capital police had – there would have been no vandalism, and no violence.
The Capital police at nearly all locations removed barriers and allowed protestors into the capital.
But Solely at the West Tunnel entrance the Capital Police essentially declared war on protestors starting a melee
John B Say,
I have read a few articles about the protesters outside of Kavanaugh’s home being hostile and aggressive towards Kavanaugh’s neighbors.
One quote I reacall, “F–k you! F–k your kids!” when a protester was asked to tame down their chants as the person asking was trying to get their kids to bed.
Unfortunately, the neighbor noted the LEOs on the scene providing security did not do anything.
Seems the neighborhood has taken on a atmosphere akin to those autonomous zones in 2020.
Some have noted, are the LEOs not being allowed to make arrests??
It is not merely the protests at justices homes – in instance after instance we have two standards of justice – the same laws mean two different things, one for republicans one for democrats.
That is the rule of man, not the rule of law and it must end or we are doomed.
My preference is for the law and constitution to be applied correctly for all.
But even if all we can get is for it to be applied the same to all that is a gigantic improvement.
Your argument answers itself.
Government can not decide which protests to allow and which to stop merely by choosing to put up barriers at some places and times and not others.
You say that the J6 Protestors tresspassed ? Had the barriers not been in place – would they have been tresspassing ?
If they had come on a different day – J5 when there were no barriers – would they have been tresspassing ?
Government can not decide what protests to allow by putting up barriers to prevent those protests they do not like.
Even the recently release Proud Boys so called plan of action – their “conspiracy” – merely seeks to occupy the capital and demand a new election.
That is still legitimate protest.
Can these abortion protestors occupy the Public portions of the supreme court demanding the decision they want ?
Could democrats occupy the Wisconsin State Capital in 2010 – demanding the republicans not pass specific legislation ?
There are actual limits on First Amendment rights. NEUTRAL constraints on time and place that do not interfere with protest itself are acceptable.
But those limits MUST be NEUTRAL – they MUST be applied uniformly.
You can not decide that people protesting Kavanaugh’s confirmation can run willy nilly through the capital – including taking an axe to senators doors.
While those protesting the 2020 election can not enter the building.
That is the TEXTBOOK defintion of a NON-NEUTRAL application of the law.
You can not allow Abortion protestors at the homes of supreme court justices – while claiming that you can put up a saw horse and prevent election protestors at the capital.
And YES, you can distinguish between public sidewalks in urban, suburban, and rural areas, at peoples homes and those in cities in front of government buildings.
The First ammendment is First and foremost about POLITICAL speech disfavored by govenrment at Government created public forums.
Election protests at The US Capital would be the #1 place where the First amendment would trump all law and regulation in the entire country.
You can not prevent people from protesting the election at the capital. You can not put them behind barriers to keep them away anymore than you can say – “You can protest the election – in Kansas”
You CAN however say “You can protest Court decisions – AT THE COURTHOUSE But NOT at Judges homes.
You CAN say “You can protest Elections – AT TH CAPITAL – but not at the congressmen’s homes.
Svelaz, this guy drove all the way from California to call 911. This is easily explained because there are no 911 operators in California. Your attempt to diminish the seriousness of the situation created by the release of the addresses of the Justices is short of logic and a breach of moral discernment. Brushing it off as just some guy with a mental disorder who was not influenced by the fanning of the flames by those on the left illustrates a failure to grasp reality. Mental disorder is a separation of ones mind from reality even when it’s in pursuit of an ideology.
Thinkitthrough,
“ This is easily explained because there are no 911 operators in California.”
Huh? There are no 911 operators in California? You’re a bad liar. Every state has 911 operators.
Besides he wasn’t in California. He was in Maryland.
“ Roske told the operator he intended to hurt someone else and himself. He said, “I brought a firearm with me, but it’s unloaded and locked in the case. … It’s in a suitcase. It’s a black suitcase. … I’m standing near it, but the suitcase is zip-tied shut. I just came from the airport.”
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/crime/911-man-accused-plot-to-kill-kavanaugh-called-police-himself?_amp=true
When he arrived at Kavanaugh’s Maryland home early Wednesday, he spotted a pair of deputy U.S. marshals, who were part of the Supreme Court justice’s security force.
Before confessing, Roske walked away from the scene, turned a corner, and called law enforcement to turn himself in.”
“ Brushing it off as just some guy with a mental disorder who was not influenced by the fanning of the flames by those on the left illustrates a failure to grasp reality.”
It’s no different than the NRA using the same excuse. He legally purchased a gun DESPITE having history of mental illness. That should be far more important than this individual THINKING about doing something and not going thru it.
He didn’t drive all the way there to call 911. He chose not to go thru with it and turned himself in.
Looks like the text of the full article didn’t get copied.
Here is the full article: https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2022/06/09/threat-against-justice-kavanaugh-sobering/7557278001/
When the Republicans take over….and they certainly will…they will probably roll over and play dead on these contraventions to our democracy. The Republicans stuck sticks in the spokes of Trump as they bent over and enjoyed the dirty tricks by the Democrats in the most perverse, sickening way. We the citizenry just sit back and watch the train wreck in slo-motion….You Sir are a beacon of hope in a cesspool of obscene dogma
Wouldn’t it be something amazing actually if the President woke up (like waking up) or someone woke him (again shaking, smacking to gain attention). He then turns to his handlers and msm (melted ice cream cone in hand) in that famous creepy whisper said: “Tell the AG and Nancy I want the Justices protected now”! How Presidential would that be not to mention drive the leftist weenies up a walls.
Sen. S. Schumer should have been given a facecloth to wipe the self-satisfied look off his face that he presented after his statement. Joy Behar is a submoronic twit. I saw that show once when I was sitting in a waiting room. It is annoying. The other day a “commentator” from some network suggested that we did not know if the man arrested in the area of Judge Kavanaugh’s house had any weapons, which was after I had heard on different news broadcasts the “list” of items he had brought. I don’t normally carry all of those items daily in my purse. Maybe she does and that is why she may not have considered them as weapons. It is a very sad state of affairs we have ourselves in. In the next election, I fear the correction could make it worse.
Turley thinks a possible assassination attempt warrants more coverage than the actual shooting of 19 kids in a school in Texas.
eb
And he is correct. There will alway be evil in this world such as the Uvalde shooting but we have been given a singular form of government that is the best so far by the hands of man and the dimdems are intent on destroying it at any cost. Yes, that is a far more important story and a far greater threat.
Nice attempt at deflection.
But it’s also insane. Our form of government isn’t even what it began as. How could it be? Political parties didn’t exist then. The corporate lobbying entity, while existing in large spice companies and monarchies, didn’t exist as it does now. Most people think we have a two party government (which has actually not shown itself superior to other forms of democratic representation actually) when really the corporate entity is the dominant party which completely owns the republican party and partly dominates the democratic party. So, in reality, our form of government has degenerated quite a bit. The corporate entity rules in a way it wasn’t meant to in the beginning….
But you know all that already, you’re just trying to skirt the issue of how bizarre it is that Turley wants to avoid tangible episodes of gun violence to ruminate on possible episodes of it. You took his lure.
eb
I doubt Turley thinks that but then again, when was the last assassination attempt on a Supreme Court Justice?
Joe Biden and Clarence Thomas high tech lynching
Left wing trash on left wing cable TV stations and blogs, with the tacit blessing of elected Democrats, are trying to rile up the modern day equivalent of a lynching party. The goal is to motivate someone, or a group, to assassinate a Supreme Court justice before the expected ruling is handed down. That will create a 4-4 ruling and preserve the federal “right” to kill human life based on its age.
Knowing the Democrats long history with black lynchings Justice Thomas is obviously most at risk.
Democrats are open Fascists…using Government, Business, Education, Terrorists, to gain power and money. The DOJ and FBI are 100% Corrupt. This has been obvious for a long time…the attacks against Trump are unparalleled in American History! Democrats are fighting a second Civil War…Independent and Republicans AREN’T Fighting. 75% of Federal Government should be cut…then 75% of the remaining in DC should be moved to the Heartland. A 5% Tax on all Financial Transactions Stocks, Bonds, Money moving offshore, options, Derivatives, Commodities, etc. We need to corral the power of Wall Street and FED….and Make Investing about INVESTING! NYC is run on Money PRINTED IN DC….and the USA 99% are being destroyed especially FLYOVER country. We need TWO MEN TO FIGHT this War Trump/DeSantis 2024 or Better DeSantis President….Trump AG. The idea of Biden’s Pelosi Clintons, romeny, McConnell and other Democrat families selling our government for family money is CRIMINAL!
The Republican Party has stolen a Supreme Court seat which rightly should have been filled by Obama.
We should not pretend that SCOTUS aid legitimate at this point when the people keep voting for Democrats and the court is heavily Republican. Republicans have only won the popular vote once in the last 34 years.
So I understand the sentiment of trying to add seats to the court; and can understand this guy’s rage.
Thank god that seat wasn’t filled by Merrit Garland. He’s nothing but a left wing hack.
Yes, I’m pissed at Sen McConnell about a bunch of issues, but I do have to give him credit for saving all of us from him on the SC.
“. . . can understand this guy’s rage.”
You should run for DA in a “D” city. Soros will bankroll your campaign (and your efforts to fend off a recall election).
Sam says:
“Soros will bankroll your campaign”
“After 1945 in the wake of the slaughter of six million Jews in the Holocaust, when being openly anti-Semitic became a crime, the name of Rothschild became a “code” to blame the omnipotence of the elites.”
“After the Shoah, open hatred against Jews was taboo,” the Jewish Forum for Democracy and Against Anti-Semitism said.”
“So right-wing extremists and other anti-Semites started finding code words for the alleged conspiracy of the Jews.”
https://www.france24.com/en/live-news/20220429-vienna-show-spotlights-rothschild-dynasty-conspiracy-theories
“Soros” is the newest code word for the alt-Right/Q-Anon/MAGA crowd.
Soros has been bankrolling lefty campaigns for decades. It’s no secret but somehow you managed to equate anyone pointing that out including Sam to anti-semitism. More bombastic BS from another long time Turley troll.
Major,
Are there no billionaire Christians who bankroll lefty campaigns? Why single-out a Jew as the conniver pulling the strings? You know why.
Because Jews have been convenient scapegoats ever since the Blood Libel. Go ahead, deny it.
Silverblob, if you look at certain organizations you will see the major donor is Soros and those organizations give to others. Soros is the biggest node when dealing in leftist circles.
Soros is a socio-path who helped the Nazi’s and took from his fellow Jews. Silverblob knows nothing of history.
The Senate is not required to take action on a Supreme Court nomination just like they’re not required to do so for lower court nominations or any of the hundreds of presidentially appointed positions requiring Senate approval. There are over a dozen examples for the Supreme Court and hundreds for lower court nominations.
You should educate yourself on why the Founders choose to create a Republic instead of a Democracy. Some clues. Alexander Hamilton wrote. “If we incline too much to democracy we shall soon shoot into a monarchy, or some other form of a dictatorship.” Thomas Jefferson lamented that “a democracy is nothing more than mob rule, where 51 percent of the people may take away the rights of the other 49.” James Madison argued that democracies “have ever been spectacles of turbulence and contention; have ever been incompatible with personal security or the rights of property; and have in general been as short in their lives as they have been violent in their deaths.” John Adams concluded that democracy “never lasts long. It soon wastes, exhausts and murders itself. There never was a democracy yet that did not commit suicide.”
“The Republican Party has stolen a Supreme Court seat” is utter Democrat nonsense, equivalent to another Democrat whopper they keep on repeating: The J6 protesters “almost toppled the U.S. government.”
It’s not a “national rage addiction” — it’s a Democratic party hysteria addiction. And it’s egged on by the Democratic leadership — Schumer, Mad Max, Harris, Biden and others. They think that just because their shock troops stay off the Capitol steps, they’re pure and virtuous. But there’s nothing virtuous about targeting children’s schools, especially after the Uvalde school massacre. Targeting kids in the name of abortion — now that would be something the media could run with, if it weren’t so far up the Democratic party’s you-know-what.
What is the government of the United States ?
That question makes no sense.