Constitutional Law, Politics

Biden Repeats False Claims about AR-15 Velocity in Support of a Ban

We have previously discussed dubious constitutional and historical claims by President Joe Biden on gun bans. However, on Friday, he returned to a curious claim that he has made repeatedly: that “the bullet out of an AR-15 travels five times as rapidly as a bullet shot out of any other gun.” Conservative and gun rights publications have repeatedly shot down that claim but it does not seem to have any impact.  As with Biden’s false claim that certain weapons were banned from private ownership at the ratification of the Second Amendment, the President continues to make the same false claim on velocity speed.

A June 30 Field & Stream column on the “Five Fastest Rifle Cartridges”  listed the feet per second (fps) the five fastest rifle cartridges:

  1. .220 Swift — A 40-Grain .220 Swift round moves approximately 4,300 fps.

  2. .257 Weatherby Magnum — An 87-Grain .257 Weatherby Magnum round moves approximately 3,700+ fps.

  3. .30/378 Weatherby — An 165-Grain .30/378 Weatherby round moves approximately 3,400+ fps.

  4. .224 Clark — An 80-Grain .224 Clark round moves approximately 3,500+ fps.

  5. .22 Eargesplitten Loudenboomer — A 50-Grain .22 Eargesplitten Loudenboomer round moves approximately 4,600 fps.

AR-15 rounds move at approximately 2,700 – 3,100 fps. Even handgun bullets can reportedly reach around 2,000 fps (though that is rare).

Even the Washington Post has called Biden’s repeated velocity claim “bungled” and factually incorrect. An AR-15 round, at 100 yards, is only slightly faster than most hunting rifles.  However, when measured at the point of the departure from the barrel (as is commonly used on velocity), it is about twice the speed of a common hand gun. It is not the fastest (let alone five times faster) than other guns.

Those false statements can be dismissed as just another gaffe or “Corn Pop” story, but they refer to the factual foundation for gun control under the Second Amendment. Since President Biden is suggesting that such facts are material to a ban, there is a need for accuracy in such details.

The White House is ramping up the President’s call to ban “assault weapons” before the midterm elections.  The position remains unclear, including additional references to 9mm handguns are possibly next on the list for prohibitions.

In support of the ban on AR-15s, Vice President Kamala Harris declared: “Do you know what an assault weapon is? It was designed for a specific purpose, to kill a lot of human beings quickly. An assault weapon is a weapon of war, with no place, no place in a civil society.”

Courts likely would press the Biden administration on why it is seeking to ban this model when other higher-caliber weapons are sold. AR-15s can handle a variety of calibers. However, they are no more powerful than other semi-automatic rifles of the same caliber and actually have a lower caliber than some commonly sold weapons which use .30-06, .308 and .300 ammunition; many of these guns fire at the same — or near the same rate — as the AR-15. None of these weapons are classified as actual military “assault weapons,” and most civilians cannot own an automatic weapon.

President Biden showed the same disconnect as Harris between the factual and the rhetorical basis for some gun-control measures. He condemned “high-caliber weapons” like 9mm handguns and said “a .22-caliber bullet will lodge in the lung, and we can probably get it out — may be able to get it and save the life. A 9mm bullet blows the lung out of the body.”

Moreover, while other politicians like Texas gubernatorial candidate Beto O’Rourke have called for bans, there are obvious practical problems. With an estimated 393 million guns in the United States and an estimated 72 million gun owners; three out of ten Americans say they have guns. Indeed, gun ownership rose during the pandemic, particularly among minority households.

These weapons are worth hundreds of dollars. Owners would not only challenge such a law but might demand compensation for their seized weapons. There are also over 15 million such weapons in the United States. The ATF is a relatively small agency to carry out such a massive confiscation program. Even in Texas, a state confiscation plan would require an unprecedented law enforcement effort.

There are good-faith arguments for gun control, including arguments that the Second Amendment does not create an individual right to bear arms. We should continue to have that worthy debate but we should follow the rule of the late Sen. Patrick Moynihan that “everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts.”

 

142 thoughts on “Biden Repeats False Claims about AR-15 Velocity in Support of a Ban”

    1. and most civilians cannot own an automatic weapon. WRONG. Anyone that can legally own any firearm can pay $200 for a tax stamp and own any automatic weapon they choose (if they can afford it)

      1. That is still not MOST and the supply of full auto weapons has been capped at those made before 1986.
        If you’re going to try to show off, try to be right

      2. @Charlie Hallam…

        Ah sooo wrong.
        First, you have to live in a state that allows NFA designated weapons. For example, IL does not allow civilians to own NFA weapons meaning automatic weapons or suppressors.
        Second you have to jump thru more hoops. So depending on where you live, you may run in to issues.
        Third, there are different classifications of automatic weapons. Those manufactured before 1968. Those manufactured after 1968 but before May 1986 and those manufactured after May 1986.
        Not all automatic weapons are transferable.

        So please, when you go to correct someone get the facts straight.

        -G

  3. Biden focuses on an inanimate object as the source of crime rather than the Dems defund the police movement, and AGs soft on crime.
    MSM barely utters Chicago, or LA crime and shootings. Most shootings, handguns are used.

  4. For those who aren’t familiar with firearms, there are several factors that control the speed of the bullet/projectile.
    1) The amount of powder in the cartridge.
    2) The type of powder. Different powders burn at different speeds.
    3) Size and weight of the projectile.
    4) Barrel Length
    5) Shape (This is more the speed retention which will impact the distance and energy at impact.)

    The downside to speed is the impact on barrel life.

    The bullet coming from a semi-automatic would have roughly the same speed and accuracy as coming from a bolt action rifles.

    Joe is yet again full of it.
    -g

    1. Actually bolt action or any other fixed breech rifle will have higher velocities. Almost every modern semi auto is gas operated, meaning some of the exhaust gasses are bled off the operate the action.
      The bleeding off results in measurable drop off in muzzle velocity

  6. Etwas worden von dem .22 Eargensplitten Loundenboomer macher:

    Actung!

    Alles journalisten und Präsidenten der vereinigten Staaten!
    Das AR-15 is nicht für den Idioten und dummkopfen Politizian to sayen
    “es kann Bulleten mit 20.000 FPS abshooten.” Es kann also nicht der
    fasterest shootenest Waffe in der West geclaimen. Das AR-15 ist eine Gunn und nicht ein PanzerSchreckenMannKillerTerrorMaschine.

    Herr Präsident, Learnen Sie die Fakten und readen das freeken Manual bevor deinen Mouth geöpenen.

    Zo relaxen und watschen der Blinkenlighten on der Teleprompteren.

  7. Sorry I’m out of gas for now, but I remember this Fm Agent
    Joe Banister from years back.

    Too deep of Rabbit hole for me.

  8. Maybe all these loud mouthed democrats blabbering their stupidities should travel to their plantations and reap some gun control lessons, you know, the racial jungles Joey didn’t want his kids growing up in.

          1. @Steve Sims

            The only way to get them out would be to impeach them.
            You won’t see that happening until the GOP takes the House and the Senate. It would also take several Dems that would be honest in how they voted. (Facts over party lines)

            Then the speaker of the house becomes POTUS.

            It would take a lot to impeach both Biden and Harris, however some could argue that both could be impeached.

  10. Darren, I am not sure what is happening. I posted a link to PragerU twice and neither one went through. I posted it again to David Benson breaking the address into three parts and it went through.

    I don’t know what is happening but I believe YouTube has removed certain PragerU videos so I wonder it the WordPress filter is tied into a similar censoring device. The site broken in 3 is.

    https://www.pra geru.com /video/is- fascism-right-or-left

    Thanks.

    1. S. Meyer,

      I found the comment with the link to Prager University in the spam trap. The system shunted it for some reason. I restored one them for you.

  11. OT

    “END RACISM”

    That was published on the back of the football helmet at the game this weekend.

    I agree wholeheartedly.

    End the racism inherent in matriculation affirmative action, grade-inflation affirmative action, employment affirmative action, quotas, welfare, food stamps, minimum wage, rent control, social services, forced busing, public housing, utility subsidies, WIC, SNAP, TANF, HAMP, HARP, TARP, HHS, HUD, EPA, Agriculture, Commerce, Education, Labor, Energy, Obamacare, Social Security, Social Security Disability, Social Security Supplemental Income, Medicare, Medicaid, unfair “Fair Housing” laws, discriminatory “Non-Discrimination” laws, etc.

  12. We have previously discussed dubious constitutional and historical claims by President Joe Biden on gun bans. However, on Friday, he returned to a curious claim that he has made repeatedly: that “the bullet out of an AR-15 travels five times as rapidly as a bullet shot out of any other gun.”
    **************************************
    Ah … he’s a crazy ol’ man who either stole an election or had one given to him by a horde of stupid suburban white women who would rather be poor than offended — for others. So we’re not really paying much attention to him. Sorta like when your craze ol’ hippie aunt who shows up at Thanksgiving in a tie dye Mumu with lurid tales of partying at “Woodgrove” and her love of “Abby… er … Hoffenmeir” and “her” classic 60s work, “Steal This Book’! You just grin and wonder when it’s over.

    1. Gee Whiz,

      I was wondering why Prof Turley would post a 1st/2nd amd grabbing pieces today when considering all the things together?

      What could Obama/Susan Rice/Bidens goons-Hillary/John Podesta/Victory Nuland/John Bolton-Rinos/Klaus Shwab-UN-WEF,… what could they all be up to as they cut off the food & energy supply as they continue their WW3 against Russia, China, Iran,India/Brazil.

      I remember, before the Commie/Nazis Enslave the Citizens 1st they have to Silence & Disarm them.

      *********

      ***”We cannot continue to rely only on our military in order to achieve the national security objectives that we’ve set. We’ve got to have a civilian national security force that’s just as powerful, just as strong, just as well-funded.” He said that in 2008 in the campaign. ***

      ****

        1. 724 billionaires : 87,000 extra IRS agents

          120 extra IRS agents per billionaire.

          That’ll fix ’em!

          Unless Biden plans to use 87,000 extra IRS agents on us regular folks.

          Uh, oh!

          1. No where for those Anti-American Fa….. Pedo Friends of Biden/Dems & the Rinos, McCarthy/McConnell to hide Now!!!!

            ******
            I think it was Thomas Jefferson: The Beautiful thing about the 2nd amd is you never really it until the Govt comes to take it away.

            So why do you think the Biden Commies are poking every American attempt to provoke a fight?

            I think everyone just should stay cool… maybe go to the streets with lite candles in protest..

            One thing about those Aholes can’t stand is peaceful protest. Just look out for govt provokers again.

            ******

            BREAKING: Joe Biden Vows to “Ban Assault Weapons” in the US
            By Joe Hoft
            Published September 30, 2022 at 5:00pm
            1625 Comments

            https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2022/09/biden-vows-ban-assault-weapons-us/

            *********
            BTW: Those 15000 + hours of security footage from J6 & other exculpatory evidences, well, I guess now it’s all just Phk all that fair trial & due a process crap in the East/West Coast & most parts in between. Hell, no wonder now they can’t get anyone young to sign to an Oath everyone knows most of this current batch would be leaders have dishonored.

            EXCLUSIVE: DOJ DROPS A BOMB! Admits Federal Government Ran Informants Inside the Oath Keepers on Jan. 6 – Spring This On J6 Attorneys Less than One Week Before Trials
            By Jim Hoft
            Published September 22, 2022 at 9:00pm
            635 Comments

            https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2022/09/exclusive-doj-drops-bomb-admits-federal-government-ran-informants-inside-oath-keepers-jan-6-spring-defendants-less-one-week-trials/

            ********Sorry for any typos………..

        2. Ignorance is bliss I guess. CID (the ones with the guns) are only a small fraction of IRS agents. At most maybe 500 will end up CID. Another 2,000 or so will be either Revenue Agents or Office auditors. The rest will be in the service centers or the PODs providing support services.

          2. Let’s go back a bit. The IRS is licit, it’s the taxation that is illicit and unconstitutional. The entire communist welfare state is unconstitutional. The Constitution restricts taxation to the bare minimum. The IRS may be constitutional but it should not be necessary. Redistribution of wealth is a communist principle, distinctly not one related to the Constitution. Why don’t you review Article 1, Section 8.

            1. Oky1 says:
              September 26, 2022 at 1:45 AM

              Sorry I’m out of gas for now, but I remember this Fm Agent
              Joe Banister from years back.

              Too deep of Rabbit hole for me now.

    2. “There are good-faith arguments for gun control, including arguments that the Second Amendment does not create an individual right to bear arms.”

      Sorry Jonathan…you lost me right there. Anyone who purports there are good faith arguments for gun control when dealing with a nemesis who wants a unilateral complete ban, loses. And yes, there are winners and losers. It’s not whether or not there are good faith arguments, rather what one will be willing to sacrifice for non-compliance. And in and of itself, hope is not a strategy.

  13. One thing that does travel five times as rapidly as a bullet shot out of any other gun are the Democrats’ lies. Their lies have a velocity and distance more powerful than any weapon known to man.

    “Fama, malum qua non aliud velocius ullum.”–Virgil, Aeneid (Translation: Rumor, than whom no other evil thing is faster.)

    Best known modern evolution of the general concept: “A lie is halfway round the world before the truth has got its boots on.” (Often misattributed to Mark Twain or Winston Churchill, though I’m sure both would agree with the sentiment.)

  14. I think this is an important sign of what may happen in the midterms. Palm Beach County voted for Biden.
    —
    Top Florida Democrat Endorses Ron DeSantis, Says ‘Too Much Is on the Line’

    A top Democrat in Palm Beach County, Florida, endorsed Gov. Ron DeSantis for governor by saying there is “too much on the line” during the 2022 midterms.

    “Endorsing Gov. @RonDeSantisFL was the obvious choice this election cycle. Gov. DeSantis’ Dem opponent has called for reallocation of resources away from law enforcement. FL cannot afford people like Charlie Crist who wants to defund the police & make our communities less safe,” Dave Kerner, the commissioner of Palm Beach County as well as its former mayor, wrote on Twitter this week. …

    https://www.theepochtimes.com/top-florida-democrat-endorses-ron-desantis-says-too-much-is-on-the-line_4748036.html?utm_source=News&src_cat=News&utm_campaign=breaking-2022-09-22-3&src_cmp=breaking-2022-09-22-3&utm_medium=email&est=tjH%2FnLlVwgtgahZ365WlSTWXsM%2B%2Fow0b0h8pTJZ6WLmWsXQRW4h0rklCSFLLFl9Gy1k%3D

  15. Joe’s focus on the AR style rifles reveals that he is more interested in riling up his supporters than any public safety issue. Handguns are used in more crimes, but AR style rifles are owned by the rural voters he and his supporters despise. Joe is gun literate, but he knows his supporters are gun illiterate and that they will believe anything he says about muzzle velocity or whatever else he might concoct. In this are, it is also convenient for Joe that the “Armalite” company name, whose first two letters are the basis for that “AR” moniker, is so easy to turn into “assault rifle.”

  16. Would you rather have a demented meatball try to kill you with a handgun or an AR15?

    Don’t be intellectually dishonest that the AR15 ITSELF is a problem.

    My father was shot with an AK47. He would say these points — even made by his HERO Jonathan Turley — are silly. Velocities five times the speed of handguns? Three times? Who gives a shit when you’ve been shot by one.

    I think we should have a rule that you can only have opinions on gun control if you’ve been shot by war-grade weapons.

    1. I wouldn’t want to be shot by either.
      However the AR-15 is usually a .223 round. But because of its modularity it can be chambered in other rounds like 300BLK.

      Handguns? a .40 S&W or a .45ACP are going to put you down really fast.

      And there are more crimes committed w handguns than long guns. More dead in Chicago from handguns, than from all of the long guns in the US per year.
      Knives? also more dead.

  17. Thanks Joe, it certainly has truthiness.

    Truthiness is “What I say is right, and [nothing] anyone else says could possibly be true.” It’s not only that I feel it to be true, but that I feel it to be true.

    — Stephen Colbert, quoted in The A. V. Club, 25 Jan. 2006

    1. RE:”“What I say is right, and [nothing] anyone else says could possibly be true.” The essence of the Biden Doctrine as made clear in Philadelphia, PA. Anyone who disagrees with my view of the world, i.e. MAGA Republicans or others of their ilk, constitutes a clear and present danger to said view, and must be dealt with as such.

  18. To bad that the schools, like Sandy Hook, that had shootings didn’t implement the safety measures they were told to install.

    No doubt far fewer people would be harmed.

    Where did the Funds Go?????

    Why were the Doctors & Big Pharma putting the insane shooters on those mass m*rder suicide pills, SSRIs? It says on the label it causes it I believe.

    The old Media & the Politicians need to be Fired!

  19. Sen. Patrick Moynihan that “everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts.”

    COVID taught the world that the field of medicine is now prey to obsessive criticism by purveyors of political ideologies. Pro-Aborts have been doing this for decades with the more recent ad hominem provided by Stacey Adams in advocating her own “facts” with the killing of a life up until delivery of a live birth.

    World renown medical scientist and highly cited researcher, Dr John P. A. Ioannidis, and Oncologist Researcher, Dr Vinay Prasad, together wrote an excellent article on this topic.

    Biden and his handlers are lying with targeted intent. Theirs is no accident. Sen Moynihan would disown the Democrat Party if he were alive today.

    ###

    Prasad V, Ioannidis JPA. Constructive and obsessive criticism in science. Eur J Clin Invest. 2022 Jul 23:e13839. doi: 10.1111/eci.13839.

    Abstract: Social media and new tools for engagement offer democratic platforms for enhancing constructive scientific criticism which had previously been limited. Constructive criticism can now be massive, timely and open. However, new options have also enhanced obsessive criticism. Obsessive criticism tends to focus on one or a handful of individuals and their work, often includes ad hominem aspects, and the critics often lack field-specific skills and technical expertise. Typical behaviours include: repetitive and persistent comments (including sealioning), lengthy commentaries/tweetorials/responses often longer than the original work, strong degree of moralizing, distortion of the underlying work, argumentum ad populum, calls to suspend/censor/retract the work or the author, guilt-by-association, reputational tarnishing, large gains in followers specifically through attacks, finding and positing sensitive personal information, anonymity or pseudonymity, social media campaigning, and unusual ratio of criticism to pursuit of one’s research agenda. These behaviours may last months or years.

    Conclusion: Medical and academic disputes are as ancient as antiquity. Science naturally is a combination of specific facts, methods of inquiry and social dynamics of involved individuals and this is even more true for contested topics on medicine and health. One can perhaps learn from previous attacks on science under authoritarian regimes or from sensitive issues such as climate change,30 where scientists have been repeatedly targeted with obsessive attacks. Social sciences have studied some of these phenomena in the past and offer taxonomies and insights on how these types of “warfare” operate.31-33 Barnes et al. have found in experimental studies that ad hominem attacks may have the same degree of impact as attacks on the empirical basis of the science claims, and that allegations of conflict of interest may be just as influential as allegations of outright fraud,34 thus obsessive critics do have the power to cause major damage. While some of these problems have precedents, social media has created novel methods for dispute, which remain largely unmonitored and unchecked. At its best, social media is democratizing, capable of profound and biting criticism, disseminated in innovated and bold ways. At its worst, social media resembles a schoolyard, with bullying and harassment of individuals. We encourage others to study and contemplate this emerging problem. We suggest greater consideration into policies to help strengthen social media into a vibrant forum for discussion, and not merely an arena for gladiator matches. Institutions and journals can play an important role in reclaiming some portion of the dialogue to prevent excesses.

    1. Dr Prasad co-wrote a research article on “medical fact checkers” within social media. The findings were as predictable as one would expect in today’s age of rage and censorship

      Haslam A, Prasad V. Characteristics of Facebook’s third-party medical fact checkers. Digit Health. 2022 Aug 17;8:20552076221120318. doi: 10.1177/20552076221120318.

      We found that reviewers who were selected to review articles for Facebook and those whose quotes are included have large followings on Twitter and in at least one case, the reviewer had publicly stated their opinion of the article prior to the review. These findings are concerning in light of survey results from another study, which reported that social media was the biggest perceived source of Covid-19 misinformation among researchers, clinicians, and academics.2 Our findings are limited by sample sizes, but we included all articles and reviewers on HealthFeedback.org during our study time frame.
      The spread of misinformation on Facebook raises concerns. Current fact-checking processes appear to be strongly associated with large Twitter followings. Further, reviewers appear to be selected based upon a priori viewpoints that reach a large audience. It is unclear how articles are selected for review and how reviewers are chosen since the exact process for determining specific reviewers is not included on the website or in the articles themselves. Greater transparency in the process of determining misinformation is needed.

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