Below is my column in The Hill on the expected indictment this week of former President Donald Trump and the danger of prosecution by plebiscite. I have been critical of the indictment, which is reportedly based on a highly dubious use of a New York misdemeanor charge to revise a long dormant federal election law charge. We will have to wait to confirm the details on the indictment but this remains, in my view, a blatantly political prosecution.
Here is the column:
“The moment that we are waiting for, we made it to the finale together” — those familiar words from “America’s Got Talent” — could well be the opening line for Manhattan District Attorney Alvin Bragg next week, when he is expected to unveil an indictment of former President Trump. With Trump’s reported announcement that he expects to be arrested on Tuesday, it would be a fitting curtain raiser for a case that has developed more like a television production than a criminal prosecution. Indeed, this indictment was repeatedly rejected only to be brought back by popular demand.
Trump faces serious legal threats in the ongoing Mar-a-Lago investigation. But the New York case would be easily dismissed outside of a jurisdiction like New York, where Bragg can count on highly motivated judges and jurors.
Although it may be politically popular, the case is legally pathetic. Bragg is struggling to twist state laws to effectively prosecute a federal case long ago rejected by the Justice Department against Trump over his payment of “hush money” to former stripper Stormy Daniels. In 2018 (yes, that is how long this theory has been around), I wrote how difficult such a federal case would be under existing election laws. Now, six years later, the same theory may be shoehorned into a state claim.
It is extremely difficult to show that paying money to cover up an embarrassing affair was done for election purposes as opposed to an array of obvious other reasons, from protecting a celebrity’s reputation to preserving a marriage. That was demonstrated by the failed federal prosecution of former presidential candidate John Edwards on a much stronger charge of using campaign funds to cover up an affair.
In this case, Trump reportedly paid Daniels $130,000 in the fall of 2016 to cut off or at least reduce any public scandal. The U.S. Attorney’s office for the Southern District of New York had no love lost for Trump, pursuing him and his associates in myriad investigations, but it ultimately rejected a prosecution based on the election law violations. It was not alone: The Federal Election Commission chair also expressed doubts about the theory.
Prosecutors working under Bragg’s predecessor, Cyrus Vance Jr., also reportedly rejected the viability of using a New York law to effectively charge a federal offense.
More importantly, Bragg himself previously expressed doubts about the case, effectively shutting it down soon after he took office. The two lead prosecutors, Carey R. Dunne and Mark F. Pomerantz, resigned in protest. Pomerantz launched a very public campaign against Bragg’s decision, including commenting on a still-pending investigation. He made it clear that Trump was guilty in his mind, even though his former office was still undecided and the grand jury investigation was ongoing.
Pomerantz then did something that shocked many of us as highly unprofessional and improper: Over Bragg’s objection that he was undermining any possible prosecution, Pomerantz published a book detailing the case against an individual who was not charged, let alone convicted.
He was, of course, an instant success in the media that have spent years highlighting a dozen different criminal theories that were never charged against Trump. Pomerantz followed the time-tested combination for success — link Trump to any alleged crime and convey absolute certainty of guilt. For cable TV shows, it was like a heroin hit for an audience in a long agonizing withdrawal.
And the campaign worked. Bragg caved, and “America’s Got Trump” apparently will air after all.
However, before twelve Simon Cowells can vote, Bragg still has to get beyond a series of glaring problems which could raise serious appellate challenges later.
While we still do not know the specific state charges in the anticipated indictment, the most-discussed would fall under Section 175 for falsifying business records, based on the claim that Trump used legal expenses to conceal the alleged hush-payments that were supposedly used to violate federal election laws. While some legal experts have insisted such concealment is clearly a criminal matter that must be charged, they were conspicuously silent when Hillary Clinton faced a not-dissimilar campaign-finance allegation.
Last year, the Federal Election Commission fined the Clinton campaign for funding the Steele dossier as a legal expense. The campaign had previously denied funding the dossier, which was used to push false Russia collusion claims against Trump in 2016, and it buried the funding in the campaign’s legal budget. Yet, there was no hue and cry for this type of prosecution in Washington or New York.
A Section 175 charge would normally be a misdemeanor. The only way to convert it into a Class E felony requires a showing that the “intent to defraud includes an intent to commit another crime or to aid or conceal the commission thereof.” That other crime would appear to be the federal election violations which the Justice Department previously declined to charge.
The linkage to a federal offense is critical for another reason: Bragg’s office ran out of time to prosecute this as a misdemeanor years ago; the statute of limitations is two years. Even if he shows this is a viable felony charge, the longer five-year limitation could be hard to establish.
Of course, none of these legalistic problems will be relevant in the coming frenzy. It will be a case that is nothing if not entertaining, one to which you can bring your popcorn — so long as you leave your principles behind.
Indeed, some will view it as poetic justice for this former reality-TV host to be tried like a televised talent show. However, the damage to the legal system is immense whenever political pressure overwhelms prosecutorial judgment. The criminal justice system can be a terrible weapon when used for political purposes, an all-too-familiar spectacle in countries where political foes can be targeted by the party in power.
None of this means Trump is blameless or should not be charged in other cases. However, we seem to be on the verge of watching a prosecution by plebiscite in this case. The season opener of “America’s Got Trump” might be a guaranteed hit with its New York audience — but it should be a flop as a prosecution.
Jonathan Turley is the Shapiro Professor of Public Interest Law at The George Washington University. Follow him on Twitter @JonathanTurley.
Gabbard/DeSantis
Or DeSantis/Gabbard, or Trump/Lake, or Trump/Gabbard
The only likely Republican presidential contenders are Trump and DeSantis.
Everyone else is a vice presidential contender really.
And all of them are improvements over Pence.
Agreed. You’ll notice all of my suggestions has one of those two at the top of the ticket.
My TOP concerns are:
In 2016 I was an Anyone But Hillary voter. I did not vote for Trump.
In 2024 I will be an anyone But Biden Voter. I would probably vote for Bernie Sanders over Biden. Sanders is just an impotent socialist.
Cleaning up the dirty politics that we have going on that has permeated much of the executive branch as well as democrats in power across the country.
And the last thing, and possibly the most important of all, but not unfortunately within the power of any president,
Is to end the mathusian doom and gloom that is destroying the mental health of those on the left,
and causing massive cognative delusions.
I linked to the article by Prof Haidt, citing his own work and that of numerous others demonstrating a trend that is incredibly destructive.
Over the past decade we have had a trend towards increasing mental health problems, increasing anxiety and depression.
There is little doubt that Social media is a major factor in this – but it is not alone.
But beyond that Trend – in detail – the increase has been more than twice as large in Women than in Men.
And it has been more than twice as large in those on the left than the rest.
And it has been more than twice as large in those under 30.
A young female democrat under 30 has about a 70% chance of suffering from anxiety and depression.
A 50yr old conservative male has about a 16% chance.
For conservatives – anxiety and depression have barely increased.
Further they decrease with age.
This is huge PROBLEM.
again wile it is not the only factor – this is a major factor in the rise in violence, suicides, drug abuse.
It is a significant factor in the rise in gender dysphoria and the rise in transition regret.
Anxiety and depression form a vicious circle.
They are caused by and in turn cause negative cognitive distortions.
As I stress repeatedly – we are – or atleast have been in the best moment in US and world history – except tomorow.
That has been true for most of the past 400 years.
Everything has been improving everywhere at a rate never seen before.
Name a problem, it has improved globally and in the US over the past century, or decade.
But if you ask those on the left – that is not true.
According to them we live in the worst world ever and we must blow it all up and start over.
THAT is a massive cognative distortion.
That is mass psychosis on the left.
That is a vicious cycle that leads to ruin.
If the leaders on the left are not doing this deliberately – they are stupid.
If they are doing this deliberately – they are evil.
Besides the blatant political persecution and prosecution, which is not a surprise from the same people who convicted Ghislaine Maxwell of trafficking while never even questioning anybody on Epstein’s list, I don’t see how the security concerns are not paramount here. We have a former president who has the right to be and is surrounded by secret service and they’re now expected to just hand the president over to a bunch of keystone kops who hate his guts with monitoring cameras that fail at opportune moments? And this isn’t a concern? It’s unfortunate that so many of your readers seem unable to differentiate between their emotions and justice; however, this is the way it’s been heading for years. Maybe it’s even preferable that the charade of justice is definitively dropped and we can just openly admit to living in a dictatorship.
. . for Republican politicians in and around New York City and Washington DC, it is very much like a dictatorship.
OFF TOPIC
Which Ticket would you like to see:
President/Vice President
Trump/Desantis
Trump/Haley
Trump/Gubbard
Trump/Pompeo
Desantis/Trump
Desantis/Haley
Desantis/Gubbard
Desantis/Pompeo
Haley/Trump
Haley/Desantis
Haley/Gubbard
Haley/Pompeo
Gubbard/Trump
Gubbard/Desantis
Gubbard/Haley
Gubbard/Pompeo
Pompeo/Trump
Pompeo/Desantis
Pompeo/Haley
Pompeo/Gubbard
–
Your Secertary of State in 2024:
Trump
Desantis
Haley
Gubbard
Pompeo
Trump/DeSantis, Trump/Lake, or Trump/Gabbard
Anyone but Biden/Harris – ANYONE.
What do I WANT in 2025 ?
Clean house at DOJ/FBI/DHS/CIA, ….
end the war in Ukraine – quickly.
Finish the Border Wall
Enact real immigration reform legislation.
My preference would be to get government OUT of legal immigration as much as possible – anyone who has a private sponsor can come here, but Sponsorship must have meaning. No benefits or entitlements for immigrants – and cost must be carried by the Sponsors.
Alternately we must increase legal immigration to atleast 2M/yr and possibly 4M. But we should be favoring immigrants with some skills. People who can read and write – in any language.
End Qualified immunity.
Reinstate nearly all Trump EOs – especially the requirement that for every new regulation enacted two old ones must be rescinded.
Cut federal Spending.
Close the Department of Education.
Get rid of DEI and Woke nonsense throughout government.
Move Federal agencies OUT of DC.
If Federal agencies are going to continue to exist – and most should be shut down, the people in those agencies should have to live with the people they are regulating.
We need to address Social Security and Medicare. We need to find the way to end them while keeping as much of the porise we made to those depending on them. Regardless, it is going to be painful.
NYC Not Amongst 20 Most Violent Cities
The twenty cities with the highest violent crime rates (number of incidents per 100,000 people) are:
St. Louis, MO (2,082)
Detroit, MI (2,057)
Baltimore, MD (2,027)
Memphis, TN (2,003)
Little Rock, AR (1,634)
Milwaukee, WI (1,597)
Rockford, IL (1,588)
Cleveland, OH (1,557)
Stockton, CA (1,415)
Albuquerque, NM (1,369)
Springfield, MO (1,339)
Indianapolis, IN (1,334)
Oakland, CA (1,299)
San Bernardino, CA (1,291)
Anchorage, AK (1,203)
Nashville, TN (1,138)
Lansing, MI (1,136)
New Orleans, LA (1,121)
Minneapolis, MN (1,101)
Chicago, IL (1,099)
https://worldpopulationreview.com/us-city-rankings/most-violent-cities-in-america
……………………………………
The rightwing talking point is, ‘Alvin Bragg should focus on his city’s high crime’. Yet New York City fails to crack the top 20 here.
Oh well– Alvin Bragg is Black and supported by George Soros. That makes Bragg a Made-For-Fox villain. So let’s embellish and say, ‘New York’s crime is out of control’. That will sound accurate to any Trumper.
Crime is Crime[.] It should be focused on everywhere. The ‘Grey-Areas’ of Civil Infractions and Moral Infraction are what is going unchecked and non-consequential. In the Layman’s colloquial terms: “They are getting away with murder”.
The: Politicians, Administrators, Fiduciaries (Banks &Brokers), Mothers & Fathers (Parents), Community, … Their ‘Theft of Service” (Duties) have been abandoned, and the real injury is the Theft of INTEGRITY.
They have stolen your Integrity, raped you of the true honest opportunity to be unencumbered by judgment-and-conviction, and sentenced you to the consequences of Their ‘wrong-doings and not-doing’ the correct things.
Simply stated – Their Winning, it is taking a toll on Mankind and the World as a whole.
NYT Headline (1/5/23) – “Major Crimes Rose 22 Percent in New York City, Even as Shootings Fell”. Although NYC has not yet risen to the very top of the crime list, it is working on it. The city was far safer when Giuliani was mayor.
To be filed under: “Lies, damned lies, and statistics”
“The rightwing talking point is, ‘Alvin Bragg should focus on his city’s high crime’.”
From the NYT:
“Surges in robbery, burglary and other crimes drove a 22 percent increase in overall major crime in New York City last year [2022] compared with the year prior . . .”
That “surge” in the city’s crime was under Bragg’s watch.
“Christopher Herrmann, an assistant professor at John Jay College of Criminal Justice, said that — setting aside the figures for murders and shootings — the overall picture painted by the 2022 statistics was that ‘crime is up in New York City, and it’s up quite a bit.’”
That “up quite a bit” was under Bragg’s watch.
(From the _NYT; nytimes.com/2023/01/05/nyregion/new-york-crime-stats.html)
“We need to pray for our country and where it is headed. The left in Washington and across the country just can’t get their fill of attacking Donald Trump. They are so paranoid of him. The onslaught against him is continual. There’s no question, the media and the left manipulated the last election, and they are scared to death of Donald Trump’s possible return. So, night after night, the media runs negative stories about former President Trump. Now they’re talking about the possibility of arresting him in the hopes that this would prevent him from running for president again—this would be a huge mistake. The charges against him are definitely politically motivated.
I would like to ask Christians across this country to pray specifically for former President DonaldTrump that God’s hand would be upon him, protect him, and direct him in every step he takes—and that God’s will be done. We need to work together to strengthen this nation—not divide and destroy it.” @Franklin_Graham
Turley: “Bragg is struggling to twist state laws to effectively prosecute a federal case long ago rejected by the Justice Department”
“Half the truth is often a lie in effect.” Turley is being deliberately dishonest here. Barr killed the SDNY case. Read Geoff Berman’s book.
The question is WHY Turley is being dishonest.
lawdog1666 – So, you admit that the DOJ, when Barr was AG, did close the case. The SEC did the same. Even if the SEC had successfully pursued the case, the result would have been a fine, as in the stronger case against Hillary Clinton’s campaign.
There is a racial nexus here. Emmet Sullivan was the Afro crack pot judge in the kangaroo court of Gen Flynn, refusing to end the trial “just because”. There is a sense of “entitlement of repression” here that is now being used to settle many generation old deeds by ancient white settlers by those put in power by foreign enemies of justice like George Soros.
Chuckiechan: While I cannot disagree with what you said, racial victimhood will soon be so passe; if you listen/read/watch media sources today, you would think it’s being replaced with LGBQT victimhood.
Tucker Carlson interviewed Bob Costello this evening about his testimony to the Grand Jury. He appears to have severely impeached Cohen. If Bragg is smart he will now decide not to prosecute. If he goes ahead, Trump will have Costello as a very powerful witness. Even a NY jury may find it difficult to convict. An acquittal of Trump, or even a hung jury, during the campaign will only help Trump.
He isn’t smart. He has an ax to grind with whitey, as if they at fault for our current crime wave.
Three questions: (1) Isn’t it true that a Trump/DeSantis 2024 would win in a landslide? And given DeSantis’s discipline and skill as a politician, he would be set up for 8 years as POTUS after Trump. (2) How is that not what all conservatives should be hoping for? (3) And won’t this ridiculous Soros-funded political prosecution only help that to become a reality?
If Trump runs again, he’ll lose again.
Elon thinks he’s a shoe-in
ROFL
What is likely over the next 2 years:
More bank failures,
More economic problems.
Either inflation or a recession likely severe.
More and more and more revlations regarding Biden.
More insane nonsense like Prosecuting Trump.
Those of you do not seem to grasp that even “getting Trump” is a lose lose for the left.
You are so transparently political in this you are destroying peoples trust in government, in law, in the judicial system.
You win – you lose.
You lose – you lose.
The only thing I can possibly see that might help the left is that they actually incite political violence from the right.
That might give them something to hide behind.
But that is a huge gamble, the J6 insurection narative is fading fast, and additional peaceful protests will undercut it further.
And it is not Like Antifa is not engaged in violence all over.
“But where says some is the King of America? … in America THE LAW IS KING … in free countries the law ought to be king; & there ought to be no other.” Thomas Paine
Trump is not King. Biden is not King. If either committed crimes, he should be indicted and tried.
If the law is Kind they would be looking at Biden who is a crook and never was investigated, not Trump who did nothing wrong and was investigated with nothing found countless of times.
The above is the cowards way of speaking while trying to appease both sides, hiding his true intent along with himself.
If anyone committed crimes they should pay, but there is evidence Biden committed serious crimes, including the selling of America’s security. We need not appease one side or act as cowards. Investigate Biden. There is no moral equivalency.
Agreed.
But a crime is an ACTUAL crime. Not – we want to get you we will make up any ole thing.
There is a world of difference between Trump and Biden.
With Biden – we have OBVIOUSLY repugnant activities – self dealing with foreign adversaries – that we may or may not be able to prove were criminal
It is possible that Biden engaged in the deals he made with all kinds of shady foreigners without ever violating the law.
That makes it LEGAL. It does not make it MORAL. Voters were entitled to know everything about his foreign dealings that could be legally ferreted out.
And that is alot, and it is pretty bad. We can debate whether the efforts of the Biden campaign,. the DNC, the PRess, and other democrats to keep all that secret were legal. They were not MORAL. They were Election rigging – if not outright Fraud.
With respect to Trump – he is an often offensive Blowhard. He dishes back to those on the Left the same insults they dish at him – and he is better at it than they are. However you may wish to judge his life – who he is, is no secret. His public and way too much of his private life are out there for all to see.
Vote accordingly.
The Efforts to prosecute him are NOT based on any Legitmate suspicion of underlying crime – despite the deeply held beleifs of those with TDS.
All the efforts to prosecute Trump rest on trying to find some “technical” way that he MIGHT have violated the law.
ALL require bending folding and mutilating the law to arrive at a crime.
Trump legally Paid for Daniels silence. She was free to say not to the money. He did not steal the money she was paid with.
Braggs claim is that he did not handle it precisely the way that Bragg believes he should have.
Worse still Bragg has a fundimental problem in that he is also claiming that Had Trump done it as he should have,
It would STILL be a crime.
When you have a legal act and you are trying to criminalize tiny details of the precise way the transaction was conducted – your abusing the law.
I do not want broad readings of the law as a means to prosecute Biden, Nor Trump.
The law must always be read narrowly. Where there is no actual harm – there is no crime, and government does not belong.
It is entirely possible that inquiry into the Biden syndicate will not yeild any crimes.
That does not make it a witch hunt.
The Biden inquiry has resulted in and will likely result in more conduct that is immoral if not illegal,
And voters are entitled to know.
The Trump Russia inquiry became weaker the longer it went on. Whatever you may think of Trump he did not collude with Russia – for any purpose.
Several people were persecuted and more were jailed to find evidence of something that those investigating KNEW did not exist from the start – that was wrong.
That was IMMORAL.
Leave witchunts to the press.
LOL, Yeah Right! Yellan & a bunch of others need Flushed.
https://twitter.com/WallStreetSilv/status/1637604869292056576
Presidential Extramarital Affairs – You Don’t Say???
“JFK, Monster,” By Timothy Noah
“I knew that John F. Kennedy was a compulsive, even pathological adulterer, given to taking outlandish risks after he entered the White House. I knew he treated women like whores. And I knew he had more than a few issues with his father about toughness and manliness and all that. But before I read in the newspaper that Mimi Alford’s just-released memoir, Once Upon A Secret: My Affair With President John F. Kennedy And Its Aftermath, described giving Dave Powers a blow job at JFK’s request and in his presence, I didn’t know that Kennedy had an appetite for subjecting those close to him to extreme humiliation.”
___________________________________________________
“Clinton pays Paula Jones $850,000”
Associated Press
Wed 13 Jan 1999 13.15 EST
“WASHINGTON (AP) – Paula Jones is awaiting the arrival of an $850,000 cheque from President Clinton, bringing an official end to the four-year saga spurred by her allegations of sexual harassment.”
________________
“FDR and His Women”
“… she was deeply wounded to discover that Franklin had been having an affair with her secretary, Lucy Mercer.”
___________________________________________________________________________________________
Bill Clinton as enabled by Hillary Clinton
1. Eileen Wellstone (1969) Allegation: Sexual assault
2. Anonymous female student at Yale University (1972) Allegation: Sexual assault
3. Anonymous female student at the University of Arkansas (1974) Allegation: Sexual assault
4. Anonymous female lawyer (1977) Allegation: Sexual assault
5. Juanita Broaddrick (1978) Allegation: Rape
6. Carolyn Moffet (1979) Allegation: Sexual assault
7. Elizabeth Ward (1983) Allegation: Unclear
8. Sally Perdue (1983) Allegation: Unclear
9. Paula Jones (1991) Allegation: Sexual harassment
10. Sandra Allen James (1991) Allegation: Sexual assault
11. Christy Zercher (1992) Allegation: Sexual assault
12. Kathleen Willey (1993) Allegation: Sexual assault
George, LBJ was the most amoral man we put in the whitehouse in my lifetime. The Kennedys and Clinton have nothing on this guy.
All NDAs across America are now utterly null and void.
I always felt those NDAs were unconstitutional yet functioned as bridge to settle legal issues.
Corporations like JPMorgan , convicted of at least 5 felonies & still allowed to be in biz use NDAs all the time.
Corps’ will settle with one customer over a crime the corp commented against the customer/society & the corp & the customer agree for money or consideration to keep their mouths shut to the other thousands of customers that were harmed by the corp’s actions.
And the Judicial system allows that hiding of the evidence.
Thus many people may not even know the were harmed.
The Trump issue is much larger. If the local DA pushing these issues it immediately throws the US into just another confirmed 3rd World Banana Republic.
After far more then 7 yrs of continuous govt investigations I felt like Trump’s lawyers should have asked the courts for restraining orders to protect him & his companies from Lawfair & from other abuses of Govt authority.
Mueller, what was it? 200 skilled lawyers, 400 FBI agents, 22 months, 32 million in govt money & Trump comes up clean.
How can anyone get involved with this type govt?
https://wallstreetonparade.com/2021/07/after-jpmorgan-chase-admits-to-its-4th-and-5th-felony-charge-its-board-gives-a-50-million-bonus-to-its-ceo-jamie-dimon/
Jonathan: Some on this blog think you are a “liberal democrat” and not a Trump supporter. I would submit this column is proof positive that when push comes to shove you have always been in Trump’s corner. You opposed Trump’s 2 impeachments, mocked the Jan. 6 House investigation of Trump’s role in the insurrection–and now the possible Bragg indictment. In the latter you think it is “legally pathetic” and basically a political prosecution. Isn’t this what Trump has been claiming for weeks? The only difference is that Trump uses the phrase “political witch hunt”. Except for that you have provided a echo chamber for Trump’s claims.
As I have pointed out in previous comments the Bragg indictment will be a warmup for the more serious charges coming down the road–the one in Fulton County, Georgia where Fani Willis has the smoking guns. And then there is the ongoing investigation by Special Counsel Jack Smith that portends even more serious charges against Trump. Even if Trump escapes from the NY case he still faces the others. That’s why you had to add the qualifier that “[n]one of this means Trump is blameless or should not be charged in other cases”. This doesn’t mean you are not in the Trump camp. I don’t like to make predictions. But I think if Trump is indicted by Fani Willis you will echo the claims by Trump’s attorneys in that case and you will argue against prosecution by Jack Smith. Your track record so far indicates you are in the Trump camp. If you support indictments in Georgia or by Jack Smith I will eat my hat–the one with buttons that read: “Support LGBTQ rights” and “Jail the Trumpster!”. So there!
JT isn’t on Trump’s side; he’s on the law’s side
@Mespo,
I found Denis to be either a sock puppet for Svelaz or just as ignorant.
I agree that Turley is pro-law. He’s liberal, not a Trump supporter, but also he’s someone who would defend Trump, like anyone else who’s getting a raw deal.
-G
There is so much wrong with Dennis’ understanding of the law that it is impossible to correct him in a single response.
The best way to respond is to undress him so one can see “there’s no there there”.
Start with why shouldn’t one object to the first impeachment of Trump? (we can go one at a time) Was there evidence? Was there a crime? Wasn’t this contrived, or is Dennis simply unaware of the events of the day? Yes, Dennis is unaware.
“the Bragg indictment will be a warmup”
Since when are indictments used as warmups? Does Dennis have any idea of what he is talking about? No.
” mocked the Jan. 6 House investigation”
Dennis, tell us why it shouldn’t be mocked. Did they interrogate all the important parties? Why did they do much of it in secret? Why did they need a producer? Dennis, do you know what you are talking about? No.
Dennis – he can’t be a “liberal Democrat” anymore. He is too fair and honest.
The writer of the ‘Dennis McIntyre’ postings still doesn’t get it. The Trump obsession.. the Trump fetish.. the Trump addiction.. bewildered and blinded by their Trump infatuation, the writer cannot see the higher level at which Prof. Turley operates…. which has nothing to do with any person/persona per se… but has everything to do with the handling of The Law in our Constitutional Republic…
RON DESANTIS ON MARCH 20, 2023, USING A PRESS CONFERENCE ABOUT ALVIN BRAGG AS A VEHICLE TO TAKE A SHOT AT TRUMP
“‘I don’t know what goes into paying hush money to a porn star to secure silence over some type of alleged affair — I just, I can’t speak to that.’”
What shot? He just stated the reality. Unless you live on some planet where Trump didn’t bleep Daniels and then pay her not to talk about it.
If the objective of Desantis was to lose support among the base of the GOP and allow people like Ted Cruz, Kash Patel, Elise Stefanik, Ric Grenell, and Devin Nunes to become prominent in 2028, the governor did just what he needed to do.
Why should he lose support over that? You think most of the base likes men cheating on their wives with porn stars and paying them not to speak about it?
pecos – wishful thinking on your part. Support for DeSantis (notice the spelling) is sold, based on his record in Florida. He is a doer not a talker.
Don’t forget the number of times he said “Soros.”
Trump – DeSantis 2024!
“paying money to cover up an embarrassing affair”
It wasn’t an affair. Just sex.
OT: Huge victory today in Missouri v Biden. The court comprehensively and compellingly rejected the Government’s motion to dismiss, except for the request for injunctive relief against the President himself (it did however allow the request for declaratory relief against the President himself). In the course of this the court held that joint participation, encouragement, subsidisation and other conduct, and not only coercion, were sufficient grounds for finding state action. A big win for the First Amendment!
Great news, Daniel! I believe that you and a handful of others were the ones that agreed with me when I said months ago-from the get-go, that government coercion/threat was not a necessary element, -but that mere collaboration/support/encouragement was all that was needed. YAY! Thanks for letting us know. The consequences could be significant.
And how much do you want to Bet that will NOT shutup Gigi or Svelaz, or ….
Who continue to claim that the Government asking private companies to censor is not a violation of the First amendment ?
A judge rejecting a motion to dismiss =/= a judge deciding in favor of the plaintiff.
The judge determined that the Plaintiff had demonstrated that Governments involvement was sufficient to meet the threshold standard of government violations of the first amendment.
It ABSOLUTELY means that There is UNDENIABLE proof that Government Participated in censoring people.
No, the judge determined that the case should go to trial instead of being dismissed.
Correct – because the Plantiffs had met the standard necescary to go to trial.
They PROVED That Government engaged in censorship. They PROVED that claims of government coercion were plausible.
Whether you like it or not this was a major loss for the government and the left.
The case is going to trial – because the evidence is sufficient to go to trial.
If there was not evidence of government censorship and coercion, there would be no trial.
Dismissing for lack of standing – does not mean there was no election fraud.
Dismissing for mootness – does not mean there was no election fraud.
Dismissing for timeliness – does not mean there was no election fraud.
Dismissing for laches – does not mean there was no election fraud.
Dismissing for lack of ripeness – does not mean there was no election fraud.
..
JohnB: Very important point you are making, and I hope certain others here are reminded of it. You will recall that the operative language throughout was an emphasis on the word “widespread,” -as in, “there is no evidence of widespread fraud.”
“No corpus delicti, no murder.”
“No corpus delicti, no murder.”
Absolutely. But for rare exceptions the DA should not be able to file murder charges without a body.
That does not preclude a murder investigation when someone has disappeared suspiciously.
Todate there is no PROOF beyond a reasonable doubt of widespread 2020 Election fraud.
There is however a great deal of evidence of possible wide spread election fraud that has had very little investigation.
There is also absolutely damning evidence that our elections were conducted like Crap.
That alone is a major reason to investigate.
There is a War in the courts in AZ over the 2022 Governor’s election. So Far Lake has NOT been able to prove that it is more likely than not she won.
She has NOT been able to prove that it is more likely than not there was actual fraud.
But she has absolutely totally completely proved beyond a reasonable doubt the election was a complete disaster.
That this is not the first time.
It is my view that she – and anyone else in elections conducted that badly is entitled to a “do over”.
You are free to disagree.
But what we SHOULD be able to agree on, is that we CAN NOT continue to have elections conducted this badly.
The legitimacy of government rests on Trust. We measure that Trust through elections.
If we can not trust the elections – the government is not legitimate.
Bush V Gore in 2000 was a disaster,
The outcome of the presidential election hinged on about 200 votes in a state where there were thousands of problems effecting ballots and counting.
I do not care whether you are republican or democrat – there is no reason to trust the outcome.
I have been fighting for better elections since.
We got rid of punched cards and butterfly ballots and mechanical voting machines – all good.
We introduced OCR Scanners – which CAN be an effective means to count – If there is a proper closed loop system in place to validate them and to provide a disincentive for fraud.
We introduced Voting terminals – a huge mistake – which atleast my state has eliminated.
Lots of state effected Voter ID laws – which have super-majority support.
And the left has fought that tooth and nail.
We have slowly been interoducing mailin voting – which is a huge mistake and will bring back the massive fraud problems of the 19th century.
You can not secure an election when ballots leave the oversight of election officials – it just can not be done.
Mailin voting will NOT result in significant fraud in elections where everyone knows ahead of time who will win.
But an increasing number of elections are within 1% or less and the closer an election the greater the incentive for Fraud.
GA and several states have automatic runnoffs for elections where the winner has less than a 1% margin.
There are lots of questions about the GA 2020 and 2022 Senate races – but no significant credible challenge over Fraud.
We can and must do better.
Even outside of General elections – we have had several democratic primaries with massive problems – some of those problems were not likely fraud, but they still undermined the trust in results.
The NYC Mayors race was a mess and an embarrassment. There is very solid proof of fraud sufficient to tip an election in LA that is being prosecuted right now.
The 2020 Democrat Primary in Newark had over 200K ballots tossed.
The Cyber Ninja’s 2020 audit found nearly half of AZ Ballots with serious problems – that legally should have had them tossed,
And almost 50,000 duplicate ballots that were counted.
I can go on and on.
We have massive problems all over – that should not occur.
We should not be fighting over who won, when there are significant problems.
We should correct the problems and run the election over.
The standard for an election is NOT “You must accept the result short of proof beyond a reasonable doubt of fraud”.
The standards is the overwhelming majorioty of voters – including those who lost, should be able to trust the election results even if they do not like them.
(oops. that was me.)
The government is not asking private companies to censor. Pointing out certain content that may be violating their policies is not asking. It was the Trump administration and republicans upset at being mocked who were demanding twitter censor content. It’s a distinction you keep failing to understand.
You are an idiot.
Svelaz – the government has the ability to harm the social media companies. Being “asked” by the FBI is somewhat like being “asked” by the mafia.
The court decision means there is more than sufficient evidence to that Government WAS doing more than ASKING for censorhip.
But COERCING others to censor.
I Do not care Whether “Trump” was doing it or Biden. It is WRONG.
That said – aside from the mutterings of some Twitter executives – there is no EVIDENCE That the Trump WH engaged in consequential Censorship.
Regardless, I will be perfectly Happy to ban every single person in government who participated in consoring social media from EVER holding a position in government again. Including Trump.
Are you prepared to agree to the same ?
I am not here to defend Republicans. They are at best the lessor of two evils.
But I Will and Do constantly correct idiots like you who make FALSE claims – whether of Republicans or Democrats.
I find the “mockery” claim hillarious. When I was much younger – it was Republicans who had no sense of humour.
Today it is those on the left.
It is those like YOU who are bitterly upset over being mocked.
(Actually, what I said previously, -that, IMO, gov/t coercion or threat was not necessary– was refined by the fact that my comment was addressing what I believed to be collusive activity between FBI and Twitter. I did not mean to imply that mere support/encouragement- without collusive activity/coordination/collaboration, etc. was sufficient. I do not save my old posts and do not know how to recover them…but some of you may recall me making that argument.)
Trump supporters are planning bank runs to protest. Really? They are nuttier than I thought. Stupider too.
“Some supporters of former President Donald Trump are calling for nonviolent forms of protest in anticipation of a Trump arrest in Manhattan this week, suggesting that his base participates in a national bank run instead of demonstrating on the streets.
“Driven by false flag paranoia,” Trump supporters have increasingly advocated for a bank run in recent days as a “nonviolent form of social disobedience” against a Trump arrest, according to the George Washinton Institute (GWI), an organization dedicated to combating disinformation.”
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/trump-supporters-plan-bank-run-to-protest-his-arrest/ar-AA18RN7C?cvid=629e796dbaf14f2280bcd2ef1f2e75f4&ei=18
They really don’t think things through.
Wow! Another lying, cheating, morally corrupt Republican… What a surprise!
Corrupt Republican you say???
“JFK, Monster,” By Timothy Noah
“I knew that John F. Kennedy was a compulsive, even pathological adulterer, given to taking outlandish risks after he entered the White House. I knew he treated women like whores. And I knew he had more than a few issues with his father about toughness and manliness and all that. But before I read in the newspaper that Mimi Alford’s just-released memoir, Once Upon A Secret: My Affair With President John F. Kennedy And Its Aftermath, described giving Dave Powers a blow job at JFK’s request and in his presence, I didn’t know that Kennedy had an appetite for subjecting those close to him to extreme humiliation.”
_________________________________________________________________
“Clinton pays Paula Jones $850,000”
Associated Press
Wed 13 Jan 1999 13.15 EST
“WASHINGTON (AP) – Paula Jones is awaiting the arrival of an $850,000 cheque from President Clinton, bringing an official end to the four-year saga spurred by her allegations of sexual harassment.”
________________
“FDR and His Women”
“… she was deeply wounded to discover that Franklin had been having an affair with her secretary, Lucy Mercer.”
___________________________________________________________________________________________
Bill Clinton as enabled by Hillary Clinton
1. Eileen Wellstone (1969) Allegation: Sexual assault
2. Anonymous female student at Yale University (1972) Allegation: Sexual assault
3. Anonymous female student at the University of Arkansas (1974) Allegation: Sexual assault
4. Anonymous female lawyer (1977) Allegation: Sexual assault
5. Juanita Broaddrick (1978) Allegation: Rape
6. Carolyn Moffet (1979) Allegation: Sexual assault
7. Elizabeth Ward (1983) Allegation: Unclear
8. Sally Perdue (1983) Allegation: Unclear
9. Paula Jones (1991) Allegation: Sexual harassment
10. Sandra Allen James (1991) Allegation: Sexual assault
11. Christy Zercher (1992) Allegation: Sexual assault
12. Kathleen Willey (1993) Allegation: Sexual assault
And what is the “George Washington Institute”‘s credibility?
The Newsweek article offers nothing plausible whatsoever of a viable and concerted effort to pull off a bank run. “Some supporters” is your first indication that you are likely being propagandized. It also needs to be noted that what Newsweek offers is not a link to the George Washington Institute, but rather a link to a George Washington Initiative tweet. The two organizations are quite different. With George Washington Initiative touting activists like Nina Jankowicz, one must wonder if what they have done in this instance isn’t DisMis itself.
All of these columns about a pending Trump indictment are stupid.
He has not been indicted, and unless/until he is indicted, no one outside the DA’s office know what the possible charges are. Everyone is making guesses and analyzing their own guesses. They should stop guessing and develop patience. Time will tell whether he’s charged, and if so, what the charges are.
Trump posted on his social media platform,
“THEY’RE KILLING OUR NATION AS WE SIT BACK & WATCH. WE MUST SAVE AMERICA! PROTEST, PROTEST, PROTEST!!!”‘ He added that America is “now third world” and “dying,” where “American patriots are being arrested and held in captivity like animals.”
Crazy Don is losing it. If you this isn’t an attempt at incitement I don’t now what it. Clearly he is beseeching his crazies and MAGA nutties to act. That is not a good combination. The right is already buzzing with violent scenarios and calling for the murder of former President Obama. The right’s violent tendencies as they always have are not holding back on their crazy rhetoric,
Yes – an incitement to “protest.”
And from their online comments, some of his supporters clearly include violent protest, just like they did on J6.
Even if that were true, it would be irrelevant. Trump is not responsible for anyone’s conduct but his own.
So what are these purportedly violent online comments ?
As of yet, I have not seen a comment even regarding J6 advocating violence.
You’re right about one thing, you have no clue what “incitement” means, because this isn’t even remotely like it.