The Right’s War on Women Continues…at the State Level

Submitted by Elaine Magliaro, Guest Blogger

On the National Level

In late January, I wrote a post titled Rape Redefined and Brought to You by the US House of Representatives in which I talked about members of Congress—mostly Republicans—who were attempting to “redefine” what the only REAL kind of rape is—that would be “forcible rape.” (I wasn’t aware there was any other kind of rape.) These Congressmen were proposing legislation that would no longer consider the following types of sexual assault as rape: The rapes of women with limited mental capacity and rapes in which women were drugged or given excessive amounts of alcohol.

Last week, Lawrence Rafferty (rafflaw) wrote a post titled The Right’s War on Women in which he discussed legislation proposed by Rep. Mike Pence (R-Indiana) that would eliminate the entire budget for Title X. Lawrence wrote: “Rep. Pence and his fellow Republicans are trying to defund Planned Parenthood because it receives millions from Title X funds to assist women in their family planning and health matters. In order to try to end abortions without testing the strength of Roe v. Wade in the courts, the sponsors and backers of this bill don’t care if low-income women suffer by not getting the health care that they so desperately need. Many of these same legislators also backed the repeal of the Affordable Health Care act which would also assist low-income women get affordable health care.”

And Now from the State of Georgia

Just yesterday, I read about State Rep. Bobby Franklin of Georgia who is introducing legislation in his state that would require proof that a miscarriage—aka a spontaneous abortion—was the result of natural causes. If this legislation passes, there would have to be proof that a woman’s miscarriage was the result of natural causes. If a woman can’t prove that—she might face felony charges!

From a piece in Daily Kos: “Franklin wants to create a Uterus Police to investigate miscarriages, and requires that any time a miscarriage occurs, whether in a hospital or without medical assistance, it must be reported and a fetal death certificate issued. If the cause of death is unknown, it must be investigated. If the woman can’t tell how it happened, then those Uterus Police can ask family members and friends how it happened. Hospitals are required to keep records of anyone who has a spontaneous abortion and report it. Yup, we’ve been waiting for someone to suggest this–and Franklin has.”

Here’s the link to Franklin’s bill:
http://www.legis.ga.gov/Legislation/en-US/display.aspx?Legislation=31965

There are millions and millions of American women who suffer/have suffered miscarriages through no fault of their own. Suffering a miscarriage can be an emotionally wrenching experience for a woman. Imagine losing a much wanted pregnancy–and then having to prove the miscarriage was the result of natural causes. How does a woman do that, Rep. Franklin? Can you explain to the women of Georgia how they should go about gathering evidence to prove that they haven’t committed a felony when they have a miscarriage?

By the way, Rep. Franklin also introduced a bill to change Georgia’s criminal codes so that  victims of rape, stalking, and family violence could only be referred to as “accusers” until defendants have been convicted.

FYI 

Here are some statistics on miscarriage for you:

From WebMed

Frequency of Miscarriages in the United States

The overall miscarriage rate is reported as 15-20%, which means 15-20% of recognized pregnancies result in miscarriage. The frequency of spontaneous miscarriage increases further with maternal age. With the development of highly sensitive assays for hCG levels, pregnancies can be detected prior to the expected next period. When these highly sensitive hCG assays are used early, the magnitude of pregnancy loss significantly increases to about 60-70%. Late implantation by the conceptus beyond the usual 8-10 days after ovulation also has an increased risk of miscarriage.

About 80% of miscarriages occur within the first trimester. The frequency of miscarriage decreases with increasing gestational age. Recurrent miscarriage, defined as 2-3 pregnancy losses, affects about 1% of all couples.

From American Pregnancy Association

Miscarriage is the most common type of pregnancy loss, according to the American College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists (ACOG). Studies reveal that anywhere from 10-25% of all clinically recognized pregnancies will end in miscarriage. Chemical pregnancies may account for 50-75% of all miscarriages. This occurs when a pregnancy is lost shortly after implantation, resulting in bleeding that occurs around the time of her expected period. The woman may not realize that she conceived when she experiences a chemical pregnancy.

Sources

Daily Kos

Huffington Post

Washington Monthly (Political Animal)

Democratic Legislative Campaign Committee

262 thoughts on “The Right’s War on Women Continues…at the State Level

  1. Great article Elaine. Almost every family has had to suffer through a miscarriage. For this fanatic in Georgia to come up with the “pregnancy police” idea is unbelievable. The huge numbers of miscarriages is evidence of how pervasive and invasive this Georgia Rep’s “investigations” might be. Could religion be creeping into Georgia’s governmental affairs? Let’s hope that he doesn’t have a wife, daughter, sister, etc, who has to go through a miscarriage and his subsequent investigation, should his bill be passed. How can a bill like that be constitutional?

  2. Elaine,

    Great piece…..Some peoples lack of intellectual skills or clear lack of understanding to a woman and her support group in a time such as this shows that the possibility of retroactive abortion needs attention, how do we go about that without violating the jackasses and Jennyasses Due Process……

  3. Elaine M:

    Excellent. This issue needs to be in the forefront – daily.

    I’m sure you’ve already heard about this, but it bears repeating:

    This is what “pro-life” means?
    By Rebecca Traister
    C-Span.org
    Rep. Jackie Speier (D-Calif.)As part of their stated mission to focus on jobs (specifically, the job of preventing women from getting healthcare), House Republicans this afternoon voted 240-185 to bar federal funding for Planned Parenthood.

    This is a big win for Rep. Mike Pence, the Indiana Republican whose deficit-minded crusade against Planned Parenthood hinges not on the argument that taxpayer money shouldn’t pay for abortions (the Hyde Amendment put a stop to that in the mid 1970s), but on the conviction that taxpayer money should not go to organizations that provide abortion services, regardless of what else they might do.

    Pence’s plan, which will likely stall in the Senate, would mean the end of federal support for an organization that each year provides more than 800,000 women with breast exams, more than 4 million Americans with testing and treatment for sexually transmitted diseases, and 2.5 million people with contraception, which, not for nothing, is the stuff that prevents unintended pregnancy, and thus abortion, to begin with.

    In Friday’s Washington Post, former Catholics for a Free Choice president Frances Kissling suggested that the current, harrowing onslaught against reproductive rights should force the pro-choice movement to alter its path and redirect what has indeed become a slightly stale message.

    Though I’m not sure I see eye-to-eye with Kissling on which particular path to take, I agree that now is the time for women and men who believe in women’s rights, health and liberty to reclaim the language of morality and life, long coopted by abortion foes, as our own. Because what the Republicans have made clear in the weeks since they took over the House is that there is most certainly morality at play here, there are most certainly lives at stake: the lives and the moral value not of the unborn, but of the living, breathing women of this nation.

    Continue reading
    Pence and his fellow Republicans are not simply taking aim at a particular medical procedure — one that, I would nonetheless submit is an integral component in women being able to control their bodies, their health, their careers and thus their economic, social and political freedom. But this isn’t simply about the question of abortion itself. What Pence and the House of Representatives did today was devalue women’s lives, women’s rights and women’s ability to participate fully in the democracy. The excuse used by Republicans is that we are saving taxpayer money. Saving money in exchange for breast exams, cervical cancer screenings, STD testing and care: Welcome to the movement that has long billed itself as “pro-life.”

    In the midst of the House battle, two congresswomen underscored precisely these points, and in doing so, offered vivid evidence of why, exactly, it makes a difference to have a governing body that includes members of differing genders, races, classes, perspectives and experiences.

    In response to Rep. Chris Smith, a New Jersey Republican, who had taken to the floor to read aloud a description of a second-trimester abortion procedure he’d found in a book, Democratic Rep. Jackie Speier of California described a second-trimester abortion procedure she’d had in her life. Speier told of a procedure she’d had at 17 weeks pregnant, when something went wrong with her pregnancy. “For you to stand on this floor and suggest that somehow this is a procedure that is either welcomed or done cavalierly or done without any thought, is preposterous,” Speier said, directing her comments at Smith. “Planned Parenthood has a right to operate. Planned Parenthood has a right to provide services for family planning. Planned Parenthood has a right to offer abortions. The last time I checked, abortions were legal in this country … I would suggest to you that it would serve us all very well if we moved on with this process and started focusing on creating jobs for the Americans who desperately want them.”

    Meanwhile, late Thursday night, Georgia Republican Rep. Paul Broun had trotted out the old canard about Planned Parenthood being a bunch of eugenically motivated abortion enthusiasts, pointing out that “there are more black babies killed through abortion proportionally than there are white babies or any other colored babies.”

    Responding to Broun’s deep concern for the well-being of black babies (a concern that apparently ends when those black babies grow up to need breast exams or cervical screenings) Wisconsin Democrat Gwen Moore said, “I know a lot about having black babies. I’ve had three of them. And I had my first one … at the ripe old age of 18. An unplanned pregnancy.”

    Moore told the story of her labor, of not having had a phone or a cab or the money for a cab to the hospital. She went on, “I just want to tell you a little bit about what it’s like to not have Planned Parenthood. You have to add water to the formula to make it stretch. You have to give your kids Ramen noodles at the end of the month to fill up their little bellies so they won’t cry … It subjects children to low educational attainment because of the ravages of poverty. You know, one of the biggest problems that school districts have in educating some of these poor black children who are unplanned is that they are mobile; they are constantly moving because they can’t pay the rent … [P]ublic policy has treated poor children and women who have not had the benefit of Planned Parenthood with utter contempt. These same children, it has been very difficult to get them health insurance through CHIP.”

    This is rhetoric that must now be blasted from the rooftops. Those of us who have been raised on and come to rely too heavily on the limp language of choice must listen and then yell it as well. Opponents of reproductive rights are working — successfully, today — to prevent women from receiving the healthcare that they and their families require; they are working against the well-being of women.

    Morality is not the exclusive domain of the unborn, whatever we have been told for decades. Morality is on the side of women, on the side of children, on the side of a society that offers aid to its impoverished and to its young and does not discriminate against half its population. In Moore’s words, “Planned Parenthood is healthy for women, it’s healthy for children, and it’s healthy for our society.”

    Here’s video of Rep. Speier’s remarks:

    http://www.c-spanvideo.org/videoLibrary/assets/swf/CSPANPlayer.swf?pid=298072-1&start=52350&end=52531

    Rebecca Traister writes for Salon. She is the author of “Big Girls Don’t Cry: The Election that Changed Everything for American Women” (Free Press). Follow @rtraister on Twitter. More: Rebecca Traister

    —————————————————————

    If only the men and women on the Right had a fraction of the courage Representative Speier has.

  4. Stamford Liberal,

    I posted the video of Rep. Speier speaking on the House floor on one of the other threads. It took a lot of courage for her to do that. I also saw Speier’s interview on MSNBC last night–but I can’t recall on which program. My head is reeling from trying to keep track of all these crazy “anti-women” bills being proposed by state and national legislators.

    Thanks for posting that piece by Traister.

  5. There is something seriously wrong with this man and now that his constituency is aware, there is something seriously wrong with them if a recall is not immediately put into action.

    And speaking of constituencies, here’s a little tidbit: According to Bureau of Justice Statistics, Rep. Bobby Franklin’s state of Georgia ranks 11th out of the 50 states and Washington DC, for incidences of forcible rape. (http://bjsdata.ojp.usdoj.gov/dataonline/Search/Crime/State/StateCrime.cfm)

  6. Elaine,

    Sorry I missed your post on another thread.

    I learned of Rep Speier’s last night on “The Last Word.” :)

  7. Stamford Liberal,

    Thanks. I had forgotten it was “The Last Word.”

    Do these men who are proposing these bills really hate women? It seems so. It also appears they think women should be treated like second-class citizens.

  8. Seems like the defeat of Pelosi as speaker and and of democrats nationwide sent a powerful signal to these republican legislators.

  9. Elaine M.

    This is an important post. What is needed is a national clearing house which would be a source for information about this type of legislation. Blouise is correct to remind us that the local venue is where the rabid right and their Iagos, the Tea Party movement, are burrowing underneath everyone’s civil rights.

    Does anyone know of such an organization? It IS dizzying to try to keep up. Thanks in advance for any information.

  10. Elaine, Just don’t listen to people when they tell you a blue dog pro choice democrat who will caucus for Pelosi is just as bad as an anti-choice republican who will vote for this legislation. Glad you posted this subject again. Have to run and meet some friends for lunch.

  11. I would suggest that anyone who is interested should google this guy and discover what other laws he wants to institute or change.

    For instance: he wants to do away with driver’s licenses. “Franklin told CBS Atlanta News that driver’s licenses are a throw back to oppressive times.”

    “State Rep. Bobby Franklin (R-east Cobb) says the state is in violation of the law for failing to conduct transactions in gold or silver. has authored HB 3, the Constitutional Tender Act, which would require state transactions to be conducted in gold or silver.”

    On homosexuality:”The Bible says it’s a capital offense,” Franklin said of homosexuality. “You want someone with unrepentant criminal behavior? (gays serving in the military”

    And my personal favorite: “Franklin doesn’t take kindly to county restrictions on what kind of animal you can have in your yard. So he introduced HB 2, which prevents local governments from interfering with a resident who wants to raise chickens, rabbits or goats.”

    By the way … the good citizens of east Cobb have been sending this republican dude to represent them in their State Legislature since 1996. I think that tells us all we need to know about them.

    (http://www.mdjonline.com/view/full_story/11295596/article-East-Cobb-Rep–Franklin-s-take-on-gays–gold–goats-and-God?instance=home_news_left)

  12. I was just reading about the defunding of Planned Parenthood on CrooksAndLiars.com, and read the following question by one of the commenters. Could Professor Turley answer this?

    AlwaysADem — 2/19/11 9:39am
    “Maybe a Constitutional scholar out there might know the answer to this:

    “Once a law becomes law, should defunding that law be considered unconstitutional? If it’s the law of the land, it would seem anything that keeps that law from being enacted should be considered unconstitutional, including defunding, until the Supreme Court deems the entire law unconstitutional.”

  13. Blouise:

    “By the way … the good citizens of east Cobb have been sending this republican dude to represent them in their State Legislature since 1996. I think that tells us all we need to know about them.”

    Perhaps this area was founded by the patients of a local mental institution that was closed back in the day. It’s the only logical reason I can come up with for such lunacy.

  14. Elaine:

    “Do these men who are proposing these bills really hate women? It seems so. It also appears they think women should be treated like second-class citizens.”

    Well, according to their literal translation of the “good” book, women aren’t equal to men so …

  15. Elaine,

    This is one of the many reasons I like our guest bloggers and the subjects they bring to the table.

    This guy has been in a position of power for years. It is important to know where he comes from and if the people who put him in power support his actions. Obviously the citizens of east Cobb do as they keep returning him to power. Would you want to buy a house there, send your kids to school there, go to church there? I certainly wouldn’t.

    Over fourteen thousand people voted for this guy. Multiply that number by every district in every state and one begins to understand the mental makeup of the Republican/teabagging Party.

  16. Know what the difference between Sharia Law and the hodgepodge of Fundamentalist based, sex-preoccupied laws that are exemplified by this bill? Sharia Law allows contraception. Apparently, the possibility of an unwanted pregnancy shouldn’t interfere with the sacrament of lawful sex. Whoda’ thunk it?
    ***
    Elaine:

    “Do these men who are proposing these bills really hate women?

    Yes, yes they do. Would they dare to propose a bill that bans all government funding to the research into and treatment of Sickle Cell Anemia? And if they did would it be tolerated, let alone passed? I think not.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_sexual_jurisprudence

  17. Mrs M.:
    “My head is reeling from trying to keep track of all these crazy “anti-women” bills being proposed by state and national legislators.”

    Just this whole situation where you have neighbor turning against neighbor,and everything geared to keeping you down,spiritually,financially and someone is sitting back LTAO at it all.

    The so called tea party folks are going to wake up holding a big bag.

  18. eniobob
    1, February 19, 2011 at 2:08 pm
    Mrs M.:

    ………………..

    The so called tea party folks are going to wake up holding a big bag.

    ================================================

    Yep … if they actually knew and understood history, they’d be prepared for what’s coming … but they don’t, so they aren’t … the shock to their systems and the whining that will then ensue is also guaranteed.

  19. Women’s History at AFSCME
    A Part of History: Women in Unions

    Explore the challenges women faced becoming union members, achieving better work hours and conditions and finding pay equity. This online program covers early working women at the Lowell Mills to the recent passing of the Lilly Ledbetter Act.

    http://afscme.org/issues/25229.cfm?__utma=1.1027031472.1298050795.1298050795.1298050795.1&__utmb=1.2.10.1298050795&__utmc=1&__utmx=-&__utmz=1.1298050795.1.1.utmcsr=%28direct%29|utmccn=%28direct%29|utmcmd=%28none%29&__utmv=-&__utmk=125623946

  20. eniobob,

    Don’t you find it incredibly interesting that the Republicans chose going to war against women as their winning tactic for 2012?

  21. Ms.B:

    I just wonder how much longer before folks are going to wake up and realize that they have voted against their own self interest.

  22. eniobob,

    We are talking about folks like the 14,000 Georgians who keep sending Rep. Bobby Franklin back to his seat of power. These people are in a self-induced deep coma … waking up is not an option.

  23. eniobob,

    Voting AND fighting against their own self-interest. I know there are some tea partiers who are fed up with at least one of the largest tea party groups–Tea Party Patriots. Mother Jones has a three-part series in the subject.

    Here’s a link to Part 1 and a brief excerpt:

    Tea Party Patriots Investigated: “They Use You and Abuse You”
    Pricey political consultants, constant fundraising, fame-seeking leaders: A grassroots group cozies up to the DC establishment and alienates the activists who put it on the map.

    http://motherjones.com/politics/2011/02/tea-party-patriots-investigated

    As TPP’s leaders entrench themselves in Washington, local activists the group represents have accused them of exploiting the grassroots for their own fame and fortune while failing to deliver any meaningful political results. “Tea Party Patriots? I can’t attribute one victory to them at all,” says Laura Boatright, a former TPP regional coordinator in Southern California who has become an outspoken critic. “Where’s the success with what they’ve done with all this money? My view is that it’s just a career plan” for its national leaders—namely Jenny Beth Martin, who in 2010 was named by Time as one of the 100 most influential people in the world, and Mark Meckler, now a regular commentator on Fox News. (Meckler and Martin did not respond to a request to comment for this story.)

  24. OS:

    “I wonder if this is really about protecting the profits of companies that make formula and baby bottles.”

    Never know,whats that saying?”for every action there’s a reaction”

    Considering:

    FLASHBACK: Palin Proclaimed Oct. 2007 “Breastfeeding Awareness Month”

    February 17, 2011 4:43 pm ET by Sarah Pavlus

    http://mediamatters.org/blog/201102170043

    These people seem to forget that in this age of information,if you said it some one has it on tape or in print.

  25. eniobob,

    “These people seem to forget that in this age of information,if you said it some one has it on tape or in print.”

    I don’t think they really care. They know most people aren’t going to check out what they’ve said in the past. Besides, a lot of people want to believe the propaganda they are fed by Faux News, Breitbart, Coulter, et al. Truth isn’t always important to all of us.

  26. I am glad to see the interest in keeping an eye on these fanatics who are attacking women around the country. Elaine and eniobob, I don’t think alot of the Tea Party members will back out because even though some may be realizing that they have been voting against their best interests, look at the Republicans who voted for Bush twice even when they were not wealthy and their interests weren’t being taken care of. Plus. I think many of the Tea Party members were motivated by race and not economics. No evidence except the lack of diversity in their numbers.

  27. Elaine and eniobob,

    Remember how the Republicans used the Christian Right and once those “leaders” within the Christian Right died off or quit, all of a sudden the rank and file began to complain about how they were used.

    Well, Elaine’s post above is just another illustration of that tactic but this time using the so-called teabaggers. The leadership of the movement might be complicit and making all sorts of money in the process (early back-room meetings)and the rank and file are getting used again. The 14,000 in George who voted for Franklin are a perfect example of those open to such targeting.

  28. I am going to suggest, for your consideration, that the Republican’s War Against Women is a definite threat and should not be ignored, but that it is also a diversion from the real war which is that which we see going on in Wisconsin … Corporate America benefits greatly from the Republican’s Wisconsin War … not as much from the Republican’s War Against Women. I suggest this from the stand point of “following the money”.

  29. Blouise,
    you have point that the Republicans have a financial interest in the union bashing, but the attacks on women are all part of the same plan. They need their base riled up as much as possible and they are using multiple approaches to soliidify power at all levels of governmetn.

  30. It ain’t no mo shame fo a black womez to nurzz ah baby than it is fer a wit men to nurz froma a black womez. U wit azzed honkies.

  31. Blouise is absolutely right about not taking ones eye off the ball regarding the use of women’s issues (actually, health issues) to distract from the economic conflict/class war (if I may shade your statement B.) that is going on.

    All of these bills that the Republicans have brought forward in the House that are not economic/jobs/budgetary in nature are too run out the clock on a buget bill and funding the government. They have the virtue of payback and pandering to the most rabid of the base but they also manufacture a continuing budgetary crisis.

    It should be easier for the Republicans to force votes on a (bad) budget bill by making it an emergency to pass something to avoid a government shutdown or to re-fund a shut down government. The Republicans are probably doing exactly what they had planned to do all along.

  32. Tootie
    1, February 19, 2011 at 4:07 pm

    “Suffering a miscarriage can be an emotionally wrenching experience for a woman.”

    Why?

    **********

    Suffice it to say–I know whereof I speak, Tootie! Are you really so hard-hearted that you cannot understand how a woman could suffer emotionally after the loss of a pregnancy? Maybe you think Rep. Franklin’s proposed legislation is a good idea?

    *****

    From American Pregnancy
    After a Miscarriage: Surviving Emotionally
    http://www.americanpregnancy.org/pregnancyloss/mcsurvivingemotionally.html

    Excerpt:
    What are emotions I might feel after a miscarriage?
    Women may experience a roller coaster of emotions such as numbness, disbelief, anger, guilt, sadness, depression, and difficulty concentrating. Even if the pregnancy ended very early, the sense of bonding between a mother and her baby can be strong. Some women even experience physical symptoms from their emotional distress. These symptoms include: fatigue, trouble sleeping, difficulty concentrating, loss of appetite, and frequent episodes of crying. The hormonal changes that occur after miscarriage may intensify these symptoms.

  33. Lotta, Elaine et al,

    As Buddha, mespo, Mike Spindell and many many others on this site have constantly pointed out … Corporations are the bad guys and it is those guys that are running the show.

    We have to fight this Republican Party War on Women but be ever mindful of what is going on behind those Corporate doors as our politicians slink in and out of the rooms.

    Hey, if they could reduce the status of women and thus their earning power and political clout … so much the better but I believe their main goal is to bust the only real organized group standing in the way of their greed … Unions. They co-opted the U. S. government a long time ago.

  34. Tootie
    1, February 19, 2011 at 4:07 pm

    “Suffering a miscarriage can be an emotionally wrenching experience for a woman.”

    Why?

    ============================================

    TootieBy,

    Any woman who has to ask that question ain’t a woman thus another small piece of the puzzle falls into place … he/she

  35. Blouise,

    I know about the machinations of corporations–but I feel we have to hold individuals like Rep. Franklin personally responsible for their actions and call them out in public. The corporations would not have the kind of power they do if they didn’t have dupes or water carriers to do their dirty work for them. Besides, I think some of these legislators actually believe in what they are doing.

  36. Elaine-

    If Tootie were a woman, instead of a male prison inmate, “she” might have some understanding of the psychological effects a woman would suffer after a miscarriage.

  37. HenMan,

    If Tootie were a Male Prison Inmate maybe they are hoping for one….It must be hard….to be that misdirected and misinformed….. I wonder if it chemical, organic or biological?

  38. Ms B.Ms B.

    You are so right I had to type your name twice:=)

    “Remember how the Republicans used the Christian Right and once those “leaders” within the Christian Right died off or quit, all of a sudden the rank and file began to complain about how they were used.”

    Have not heard the phrase “religious right” in a very long time.

  39. Anonymously Yours 1, February 19, 2011 at 4:27 pm

    “Tootie,

    Get a real life…”

    ======

    You are afraid to answer the question?

  40. Tootie
    1, February 19, 2011 at 4:07 pm

    “Suffering a miscarriage can be an emotionally wrenching experience for a woman.”

    Why?

    **********

    Suffice it to say–I know whereof I speak, Tootie! Are you really so hard-hearted that you cannot understand how a woman could suffer emotionally after the loss of a pregnancy? Maybe you think Rep. Franklin’s proposed legislation is a good idea?

    [you didn’t answer my question]
    *****

    From American Pregnancy
    After a Miscarriage: Surviving Emotionally
    http://www.americanpregnancy.org/pregnancyloss/mcsurvivingemotionally.html

    Excerpt:
    What are emotions I might feel after a miscarriage?
    Women may experience a roller coaster of emotions such as numbness, disbelief, anger, guilt, sadness, depression, and difficulty concentrating. Even if the pregnancy ended very early, the sense of bonding between a mother and her baby can be strong. Some women even experience physical symptoms from their emotional distress. These symptoms include: fatigue, trouble sleeping, difficulty concentrating, loss of appetite, and frequent episodes of crying. The hormonal changes that occur after miscarriage may intensify these symptoms.”

    =========

    You didn’t answer the question. Now I’ll ask another one: Why is she crying? (and it is note because the hormones made her do it)

  41. “Blouise 1, February 19, 2011 at 5:11 pm

    Tootie
    1, February 19, 2011 at 4:07 pm

    “Suffering a miscarriage can be an emotionally wrenching experience for a woman.”

    Why?

    ============================================

    TootieBy,

    Any woman who has to ask that question ain’t a woman thus another small piece of the puzzle falls into place … he/she

    ********

    My response:

    Blouise, and yet you did not answer the question. Why is it emotionally wrenching and why are you avoiding a direct answer the question?

  42. HenMan 1, February 19, 2011 at 5:18 pm

    Elaine-

    If Tootie were a woman, instead of a male prison inmate, “she” might have some understanding of the psychological effects a woman would suffer after a miscarriage.

    =====

    Why is the woman having “psychological effects”?

  43. Tootie,

    You wrote: You didn’t answer the question. Now I’ll ask another one: Why is she crying? (and it is note because the hormones made her do it)

    *****

    I left you a link and an excerpt from the American Pregnancy site. If you can read, the answer to your question should be clear.

    I’m not sure who the “she” you refer in your comment is. Can you explain?

  44. And FYI, the role of Sister Ruth (Nun with guitar) in the film “Airport 75″ was played by Helen Reddy.

    It’s important to know these things.

  45. Bob,Esq.,

    So, Bob, are you one of us old timers? I haven't thought of that song in many years. I wonder: What ever happened to Helen Reddy? She was Australian, wasn't she?

  46. Tootie
    1, February 19, 2011 at 4:07 pm

    “Suffering a miscarriage can be an emotionally wrenching experience for a woman.”

    Why?

    ============================================

    TootieBy,

    Any woman who has to ask that question ain’t a woman thus another small piece of the puzzle falls into place … he/she

    ********

    My response:

    Blouise, and yet you did not answer the question. Why is it emotionally wrenching and why are you avoiding a direct answer the question?

    =========================================================

    TootieBy,

    Why is the sky blue, why is the grass green, why do bad things happen to good people, why is cat spelled with a “c” instead of a “k”, why did he/she have to die, why was he/she born, why is thunder so loud, why does TootieBy think that he/she will have all his/her questions answered, why do my wheelchair wheels squeak, why did I take that damn camel into the bar …

    So many questions … so little time …

    Why so many questions, why so little time, why isn’t there mouse-flavored cat food, why don’t sheep shrink when it rains, why is the #2 pencil the most popular, why isn’t it called #1 … why is Blouise quoting George Carlin …

  47. If TootieBy has multiple personalities and he/she threatens suicide, are the rest of him/her hostages?

    It’s time to put in a movie.

    By the way … where are all our trolls … can’t they post from the bus?

  48. Elaine M. 1, February 19, 2011 at 5:26 pm

    HenMan & Blouise,

    I heard Tootie once had a starring role in the play “Guise and Dolls.”
    ;)
    ————————————————–
    HAahahahahahahaha!

    Most Excellent! Good 1!

    still laffing…..hahahahahaha!

  49. Elaine:

    I read your post and the info you copied. And it does nothing to change my point. You still haven’t answered the question as to why a woman would cry after a miscarriage. You quoted what someone else says but that does not tell me what you understand to be the reason for it.

    And the “she” refers to the woman in your own quote. It reads:

    “These symptoms include: fatigue, trouble sleeping, difficulty concentrating, loss of appetite, and frequent episodes of crying.” (The “she” I was referring to is the person in the quotation marks who is “crying”)

    Answer, in your own words if you can, why does a woman cry after a miscarriage?

    And I am not looking for the scientific explanation of how tear ducts work.

  50. Blouise 1, February 19, 2011 at 8:14 pm

    Blouise writes:

    “TootieBy,

    Why is the sky blue, why is the grass green, why do bad things happen to good people, why is cat spelled with a “c” instead of a “k”, why did he/she have to die, why was he/she born, why is thunder so loud, why does TootieBy think that he/she will have all his/her questions answered, why do my wheelchair wheels squeak, why did I take that damn camel into the bar …

    So many questions … so little time …

    Why so many questions, why so little time, why isn’t there mouse-flavored cat food, why don’t sheep shrink when it rains, why is the #2 pencil the most popular, why isn’t it called #1 … why is Blouise quoting George Carlin.”

    ———

    In the time it took to post your nonsense, you could have answered my simple question. It would seem you did not answer it because it would admit to something you cannot openly admit: that abortion is the killing of a human life and you support it.

    That no women here will answer my question appears to be because they advocate a form of murder (as Camile Paglia refers to abortion) and to admit that miscarriage is overwhelming because of a loss of human life is to prove it.

    It has nothing to do with anyone not liking me. And it has nothing to do with me thinking incorrectly that I ought to get answers to my questions.

    I already know what left wing women think about abortion. My question was a rhetorical one to which you and I already know the answer. It was meant to high-light that answer we already know. I meant to highlight was a wuss left winger women are when challenged.

    It would appear that left wing women are afraid to answer questions, but not afraid to murder their own or urge others to do so.

    And the men at the blog don’t have the guts to challenge these women and stay silent for self preservation. Their women are hags and they know it. They are going to let their evil witches eat their own because, well, who else are they going to have for potential mates?

    Unless, well, that is another topic.

  51. Blouise: “Hey, if they could reduce the status of women and thus their earning power and political clout … so much the better…”

    Your observation is correct they get a twofer or threefer with these attacks on women’s rights and even if they don’t accomplish the maximum benefit they hardly lose anything in the trying.

  52. Tootie: You have, by your insistent question, “…why does a woman cry after a miscarriage,” proven beyond any reasonable doubt that you are functionally incapable of empathy.

    In case you do not know what that means, there are three personality disorders that are more or less incapable of empathy: Antisocial (e.g., psychopath/sociopath), Narcissistic and Borderline. Anyway, no matter what the reason you are unable to feel empathy, you seem to be in some pretty miserable company.

    Since you appear to be unable to experience empathy (which explains a lot about your previous postings, BTW), no amount of explanation will reach you. A few years of psychotherapy may begin to make a dent in your armor, but I doubt it. Personalty disorders are amazingly resistant to developing insight. There is no need to respond to me; I will not respond. Dealing with sociopaths is too much like my day job and I come here for something new and different.

  53. Elaine.

    At least you tried. But your answer begs the question: why is she sad?

    I know you know the answer. I’m just playing with you all.

    I was just painting with words. There is that fellow who covers the environment with orange fabric. And there is me, the annoying crank who has just covered the white pages of this blog with little letters asking questions for answers everyone already knows.

    Like my bad attempt at expression or not, everyone has now seen it who has seen it.

    And everyone knows why the women cry.

  54. Otteray:

    You write:

    “You have, by your insistent question, “…why does a woman cry after a miscarriage,” proven beyond any reasonable doubt that you are functionally incapable of empathy. ”

    Empathy about what? (and don’t say empathy about the miscarriage).

  55. I find it amusing that the person here opposed to intentional “miscarriages” (abortion) is the person here condemned for a lack of empathy.

    Okay. Amusing is an understatement. It is insane.

  56. Elaine:

    I doubt you speak for everyone, but I would not be surprised that you may feel you do. And many young people (some of whom might read this blog) are not sure who is right or wrong about this issue and could benefit from the little demonstration.

    The fact is that the women here who avoided the question proved they don’t have what it takes to admit to what they promote. And unless I asked it, the evidence would not be there as witness against them.

  57. Elaine:

    I would consider anyone insane who believes snuffing out the lives of 50 million unborn humans is a good thing that cannot be admitted to publicly.

    Of course, I don’t think it is a good thing.

  58. Tootie,

    Those women and I didn’t avoid the question. We understand why women are sad and cry when they suffer a miscarriage. We assumed most people would. Evidently, you don’t understand. I would assume that people like Rep. Franklin suffer from the same lack of empathy.

  59. 2T: “…it has nothing to do with me thinking incorrectly that I ought to get answers to my questions.”

    2T, I was going to answer your question but Raff beat me to it, maybe the other women here just weren’t going to go along with your presentation because the real issue has been argued here before.

    It’s not about human life until certain biological requirements are met. Spontaneous abortion, miscarriage, in the main does not act on a fetus that meets those requirements. That people in general often cry at the feeling of loss, for the actual or potential object of desire, weather it is the potential for new life or a big promotion, it an not be used to prove the fetus is a human life from 0 to 13 weeks or so.

    I cried with joy when Obama was elected, it didn’t make him a good liberal. Same principle.

  60. Elaine,

    I’m just a few months older than Buddha. I was a kid when the song came out.

    I’ve got no idea whatever happened to Helen Reddy. But I do remember the Helen Reddy craze; and the Helen Reddy show; and her stint on the Muppet Show.

  61. Helen Reddy is now 70 years old. She has an autobiography out called, The Woman I Am.” I have read that she is not in good health, with Addison’s Disease, which means that her adrenal glands are failing. The disease requires constant monitoring and treatment. I do not believe she has made any television appearances in at least five or six years. She has returned to Australia and is living in Sydney.

  62. TootieBy,

    ” I’m just playing with you all.” … Yeah … and look at the subject you decided to play with … miscarriages … ain’t you just a barrel of laughs.

  63. […] The Right’s War on Women Continues…at the State Level – From a piece in Daily Kos: "Franklin wants to create a Uterus Police to investigate miscarriages, and requires that any time a miscarriage occurs, whether in a hospital or without medical assistance, it must be reported and a fetal death certificate issued. If the cause of death is unknown, it must be investigated. If the woman can’t tell how it happened, then those Uterus Police can ask family members and friends how it happened. Hospitals are required to keep records of anyone who has a spontaneous abortion and report it. Yup, we’ve been waiting for someone to suggest this — and Franklin has." Read more on JonathanTurley.org. My question: what gives this jackass the right to think he can investigate the tragedy of a pregnancy gone wrong? […]

  64. Blouise,

    Here’s a story about another bill Franklin introduced recently:

    From The Colorado Independent (1/25/11)
    Arizona shooting spurs Georgia lawmaker to introduce ‘church carry’ gun rights bill
    http://coloradoindependent.com/72789/arizona-shooting-spurs-georgia-lawmaker-to-introduce-‘church-carry’-gun-rights-bill

    Excerpt:
    In the wake of the Arizona “Congress on Your Corner” shooting spree, Americans began to talk again about the nation’s gun laws. In Arizona Jared Loughner, a mentally unstable man with a record of disturbing public behavior and drug use, opened fire with a semi-automatic handgun he bought in a strip mall. He killed six people and injured at least a dozen others. Some of us talked about the need to keep crazy people from buying guns. Others of us talked about how we should be able to take our guns everywhere– like into the nation’s capitol– to protect ourselves from the crazies. In Georgia today, a gun rights group is celebrating the introduction of a bill that would lift a state law banning weapons in houses of worship. Unarmed worshipers, they say, are ripe for attack. They call the bill “church carry” but there are an estimated 100,000 Muslims living in Atlanta who will refer to the bill as “mosque carry,” which may not be looked upon as favorably by the bill’s sponsor.

    Republican Rep. Bobby Franklin introduced “church carry” House Bill 54 Monday. According to the legislature home page, Franklin is a graduate of Covenant College in Lookout Mountain, where he earned degrees in Bible Studies and Business Administration. He notes that he’s “an active member of the Reformed Presbyterian Church” and that “he has been called the ‘conscience of the Republican Caucus’ because he believes that civil government should return to its biblically and constitutionally defined role.”

  65. Elaine M.,

    I suppose you are correct…. Lets just say when it offends my sense of decency and I have seen a lot of crap in some of the finer so called homes and some places you’d rather not be at anytime… But I think MFM and Tootie crossed the magic line into depravity….. its kind of like porn…you know it when you see it… but its hard to define…. I may not agree with what someone has to say…I may not have to read it either… But there are something that would even offend Dalhmer I am sure…

  66. “I find it amusing that the person here opposed to intentional “miscarriages” (abortion) is the person here condemned for a lack of empathy. Okay. Amusing is an understatement. It is insane.”

    “I would consider anyone insane who believes snuffing out the lives of 50 million unborn humans is a good thing that cannot be admitted to publicly.”

    Tootie,
    You have proven your lack of empathy by everything you’ve written here, including your dislike of Government providing social services. As an anti-abortionist you profess to care so much for the fetus, but don’t think that society has any responsibility for that fetus after its’ birth. Empathy? You? B.S.!

    Just where do you all get that “50 million” figure that you bandy around so much. I think it overstates your case dramatically and is typical of the stuff those who you lionize pull out of their asses. Lying is a particular skill of those you slavishly follow. By the way I’m not calling you a liar, you are merely a dupe.

  67. Mike S.,

    I think stooge would be a better choice of words for tootie….but I would not want Larry, Moe, Curley or Shemp to be offended to be placed in the same sentence….

  68. It is funny how up in arms you fundamentalist Liberal Nazis get when it comes to your own pathetic views.

    You pass your bigoted judgments upon a multitude of people, all because they do not agree with your views.

    Not all that you choose to denounce consider themselves as right or left, Republican or Democrat, Liberal or Conservative, but yet that is the bigoted standard that you choose to measure the rights and wrongs of an entire nation.

    The clear majority of Americans see themselves as individuals, with the only exceptions being the fundamentalist.

    Not all who identify with the so called liberal agenda maintain their fundamentalist’s Nazis ideology, nor do all who identify with the so called conservative agenda maintain their fundamentalist’s Fascist ideology.

    Those of us born with a moral conscious cannot rationalize how anyone could seek to justify the cold blooded butchering of innocent babies as an act deserving of any degree of compassion. If they deserve anything, it would be the compassion of having them institutionalized to get the help they surely need for their mental disease, less they be held accountable as the evil sociopaths that they are.

    Fundamentalists always appear to be whining and sniveling about having to take responsibility for their own incompetent actions? They want to throw their childish tantrums to get their way, even if that way involves the cold blooded murder of an innocent being.

    This authors arrogance in addressing this issue as though she speaks for all women, says more about her self-centered nature than all the vile words that spew from her demented mind.

    Not all women in America see the world as something that must revolve around them, and especially not from this authors warped perception of life.

    Why should someone be deemed guilty before they are convicted of an act? Because some mentally @ morally deficient females or males, such as this author says that they are? The last time I checked we are not immune from the affliction of self-servient lying.

    Why should a man be justly condemned to life in prison for such a heinous act as Rape, while a woman who falsely accuses a man does not face an equal punishment?

    Why should we receive favorable treatment under the law, when we demand equality in every respect that serves our wants and needs?

    How many wrong choices do we get to make, before we are held lawfully accountable for those choices, especially when that choice requires the death of a child as a remedy?

    Why should we be trusted to make the right choice, when it was our failure to make the right choice that requires such a choice to again be made?

    Why do we need laws and judges to end a marriage, but not to end a life?

    Why should we believe anything this Congresswoman says, after all she has maintained her deceptive silence until now.

    WHY did she feel the need to deceive her constituents? She is not answerable to any voters but those in her district, so does she think so little of them as to lie to them in this regard. What other forms of deception has she perpetrated against her constituents?

    How dare she stand as the hypocrite that she is, and try to dump the issue of jobs on these newly elected officials, when they did nothing to remedy the problem themselves? Her record is one of a person not worthy of any trust.

    Only fundamentalist Liberal Nazis or Conservative Fascists would deem the exposure of ones lies and deceptions to be an act of courage, rather than an unethical act of deceit.

    How is it that you denounce this gentleman from Georgia for speaking honestly, and exalt a Deceptive Liar to the level of a courageous hero? Are you saying that it is OK for a woman to be such a despicable excuse for a human being, but not a man who speaks honestly, simply because it might not be a truth we wish to hear?

    At least he has been honest with his constituents, something this excuse of a representative can never claim.

    In choosing to condemn tens of millions of Americans by the acts of the few, you expose yourself to be nothing more than the Bigot that you are, for it is upon the foundation of mass judgments that all forms of Bigotry must be erected, and the justifiable grounds given for all of its genocides.

    While abortion has served as the bigots tool of choice to perpetrate their genocides upon the poor and disenfranchised minorities in modern history.

    In most nations of Africa, women who speak as you speak would be put to death for expressing such unnatural views toward human life.

    If abortion were about the woman’s body it would be understandable, but it is not the woman’s body that is being ripped apart by these butchers.

    Why should those who feel no moral obligation to the rights of an innocent child, be deemed to have any rights at all.

  69. Elaine,
    That is one scary video of the esteemed State Rep. from Georgia! Holy cow!
    Pangea,
    It might surprise you but your mixing of Nazi’s and the term liberal are not accurat, but I bet you know that. Rep. Franklin is not being honest with his constituents because he is declaring that women are second class citizens. For one who would seem to be a conservative, your small government motto is quashed by this Representative’s desire to have an entire investigative force designed to make sure women are really having miscarriages. Not to mention the conservatives claim for personal freedom is also extinguished by this State Rep.and his reckless legislation. I don’t think Jesus would consider that honesty.

  70. I smell a worn out tootie…..or a different tragedy by MFM….

    The only valid issue brought up either is equal treatment for a false claim….just as well as a Prosecutor should suffer sever sanction for going forward on a case when there is no doubt that the Defendant/Accused is innocent….. I am personally aware of 4 cases where even the Detective cautioned the Prosecutor of the possible innocence of them….in one case the Chief Detective was told to shut up and they should not forget who they work for…. In this one the Cop went to the Attorney General, Attorney Board and the Defense Attorney with the evidence that had been cut out of the Defense report….. the only thing that the Prosecutor lost was his appointment with the elected official….in that case it was wrong, wrong, wrong…..

  71. “Why should those who feel no moral obligation to the rights of an innocent child, be deemed to have any rights at all.”

    Why should your choices in morality – a religiously based construct as opposed to the logical constructs of ethics – be allowed to determine who does and doesn’t have rights?

    Oh yeah!

    It doesn’t!

    1st Amendment – Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

    So unless you’ve got a better argument than “I think it’s immoral”? You lose. It’s not your right to pick and choose the ethics and morals by which other people choose to live their lives. We have a secular government specifically to keep that kind of tyrannies at bay. If you’re against abortion? Don’t have one. End of story.

  72. Pangea Maszi,
    Before you bandy the words fascist and NAZI about you should understand their history and meaning.

  73. Mike Spindell

    You write:

    Mike Spindell 1, February 20, 2011 at 12:00 pm

    Mike says:
    You have proven your lack of empathy by everything you’ve written here, including your dislike of Government providing social services.

    My response: I contend, and it is a fact, that the FEDERAL government has NO authorization to provide social services. What you are whining a sniveling about is that you don’t like the Constitution and expect ME to usurp it along with you. You act like providing social services something that doesn’t occur at the end of a gun. Naturally.

    Mike says:
    As an anti-abortionist you profess to care so much for the fetus, but don’t think that society has any responsibility for that fetus after its’ birth. Empathy? You? B.S.!

    My response: I took care of my offspring. I expect everyone to take care of their own offspring. Doing unto others, in this case, as I am doing and expecting of myself. I belong to a religious organization that helps the disadvantaged, including the children of an orphanage. It has done this for decades. I’m not saying you are lying about me in this regard. You are just evil and cannot help the vile things you say.

    “Just where do you all get that “50 million” figure that you bandy around so much. I think it overstates your case dramatically and is typical of the stuff those who you lionize pull out of their asses. Lying is a particular skill of those you slavishly follow. By the way I’m not calling you a liar, you are merely a dupe.”

    My response: I’m going by estimates from the last time I looked at the numbers. For example, this link:

    http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0904509.html

    It says in the year 2000 that there had been 39 million abortions since 1973. It is now 11 years later. And since there are about one million abortions per year I just figured the number is probably very close to 49 million. I rounded up. If you wish, you can chide me for not saying “about” 50 million” lives snuffed out by self-righteous, blood-thirsty, pigs who accuse me of having no empathy.

    Look. I realize that Democrats and liberals are too stupid to know how this sex stuff works and so they are surprised that sex often produces another human being. At least the dumb southern hick knows what happens after sex even if they are bare-footed thereafter and subject to ridicule from you.

    And I realize that Democrats and liberals are really so utterly disgusting that they feel compelled to rid themselves of the product of their coupling. I get all that. I really do. I get it because I’m empathic. I also sympathize with liberal men. They don’t want to be connected with such horrible disgusting women and have to deal with her through their child. It is understandable. I’m sympathetic. And the same goes for the women. What other choice do they have? I mean: YUCK!

    I sympathize with both of them. But I sympathize with the innocent babe more.

    I’m thinking by the standards of the left, your mom made the wrong choice.

  74. Blouise 1, February 19, 2011 at 11:50 pm

    TootieBy,

    ” I’m just playing with you all.” … Yeah … and look at the subject you decided to play with … miscarriages … ain’t you just a barrel of laughs.'”

    My response:
    Blouise, why is miscarriage so somber a topic that I should not play?

  75. Elaine M. 1, February 19, 2011 at 9:24 pm

    “Tootie,

    Those women and I didn’t avoid the question. We understand why women are sad and cry when they suffer a miscarriage. We assumed most people would. Evidently, you don’t understand. I would assume that people like Rep. Franklin suffer from the same lack of empathy.”

    Those women are avoiding the question and any reasonable person reading this blog knows it.

    There is one reason why a miscarriage is sad and it is the same reason why an abortion is sad: a life is lost. One through death and the other by killing or murder.

    If you advocate abortion, it is likely that you know that what I say is true and cannot admit it because you would have to face who you really are. If so, it is probably too horrifying for you to contemplate or deal with. But there is a way out: Jesus Christ.

    You can be forgiven for lending a hand to abortion and he can heal your heart and soul and help you live with what you have advocated or done.

  76. “Answer, in your own words if you can, why does a woman cry after a miscarriage? “~Tootie
    =======================================

    1.She cries because when a pregnancy is over there is a rapid denouement of hormones. [Pregnancy involves a massive increase in hormones to sustain it… well, as a woman, you know…]

    2.She may not done crying from the fact of being pregnant in the first place….do rapists and coercers think it is a gift?

    3. It is a loss. The very state of pregnancy is a loss in a womans life for the duration of that pregnancy and any changes that are incurred on that womans’ life(and that mans if he is decent and still in the picture..).if it was not chosen or was forced. Some people plan for and welcome the changes a pregnancy brings…this leads to less conflict and happier and probably healthier children and more stable families…so I do hope the party of ‘family values’ is capable of listening.

    4. Pregnancy makes a woman extremely vulnerable so maybe she is scared…maybe the abortion will keep her safe in her circumstance…maybe she is crying because she is saddled with a shitty circumstance and abortion is necessary to keep her safe…

    5. Maybe the father was someone with attitudes and behaviors like Tooties and if she keeps the pregnancy she will be stuck with a Tootie….it’s not like a womans rights are supported and enforced despite whether she is pregnant or not…

  77. Taliban Tootie & Pangea:

    If you don’t like abortion, don’t have an abortion. It’s that simple.

    As far as miscarriage’s go, I always understood from the rabid religious types that miscarriage’s are gods will. Since the instances of miscarriages far outnumber the instances of abortion, I’d say your god is the King of Abortions.

    Funny how science doesn’t enter your arguments regarding abortions, particularly when it comes to ending a pregnancy to save the life of the mother. Yet, science is a very convenient tool when it comes to infertility. To wit, the newly pregnant parent’s proclaim it a “miracle,” and “god’s will.”

    Thy name is hypocrite.

  78. Although statistics can vary slightly from one source to the next, here is a general account (based primarily on information provided by the March of Dimes) of the frequency of miscarriages in the United States:
    There are about 4.4 million confirmed pregnancies in the U.S. every year.
    900,000 to 1 million of those end in pregnancy losses EVERY year.
    More than 500,000 pregnancies each year end in miscarriage (occurring during the first 20 weeks).
    Approximately 26,000 end in stillbirth (considered stillbirth after 20 weeks)
    Approximately 19,000 end in infant death during the first month.
    Approximately 39,000 end in infant death during the first year.
    Approximately 1 in 4 pregnancies end in miscarriage; some estimates are as high as 1 in 3. If you include loss that occurs before a positive pregnancy test, some estimate that 40% of all conceptions result in loss.
    Approximately 75% of all miscarriages occur in the first trimester.
    An estimated 80% of all miscarriages are single miscarriages. The vast majority of women suffering one miscarriage can expect to have a normal pregnancy next time.

  79. Stamford Liberal,

    Some people only perceive things as black or white. They can’t see shades of gray.

    They think it unspeakable for a woman who was raped to take a “morning-after” pill so as not to become pregnant.

    They’d force a twelve-year old rape victim/victim of incest to carry a pregnancy to term.

    If you’re a woman with an ectopic pregnancy and need some type of medical treatment–they’d suggest you forget about it.

    I’m pro-choice. I’m not pro-abortion. Some people don’t see a distinction. Some people don’t consider the exceptional circumstances some girls/women find themselves in through no fault of their own. Some poeple don’t have any empathy for those girls/women.

  80. Woosty is a cat:

    “5. Maybe the father was someone with attitudes and behaviors like Tooties and if she keeps the pregnancy she will be stuck with a Tootie….it’s not like a womans rights are supported and enforced despite whether she is pregnant or not…”

    That comment strokes both ways, I am sure a good number of people would abort liberal embryos if they could figure out the gene for that particular form of imbecility.

  81. Elaine M:

    Most people on the right, shall we say the conservative not hard core religious right think pretty much the same way.

    But in reality the hard core “religious right” are more closely aligned with the hard core left in their desire to control people’s lives.

  82. Valuing Pregnancy: A Matter of Legal Protection

    ‘Protection for women who are pregnant cannot be provided without the support of a legal and policy framework. Some of the most obvious laws and policies include establishing a minimum age for marriage, criminalizing violence against women, prohibiting harmful practices such as female genital mutilation, and enforcing birth registration. All countries have ratified at least one (and many have ratified all) of the international human rights treaties. These place the legal obligation on countries to take measures to ensure that their citizens’ rights are protected and fulfilled, and provide a starting point for effective protection.’

    ‘Many women intend to get pregnant. Each year an estimated 123 million succeed. But a substantial additional number of women – around 87 million – become pregnant unintentionally. For some women and their partners this may be a pleasant surprise, but for others the pregnancy may be mistimed or simply unwanted ( 77 ). Of the estimated 211 million pregnancies that occur each year, about 46 million end in induced abortion (see Figure 3.2) ( 78 ). ‘
    http://www.who.int/whr/2005/chapter3/en/index1.html
    ——————————————–

    So why defund an agency that actually EDUCATES and works to
    prevent the unintended pregnancy? If you are so f*****g concerned about abortion?

  83. “That comment strokes both ways, I am sure a good number of people would abort liberal embryos if they could figure out the gene for that particular form of imbecility.” Granny Rue
    ——————

    sorry Granny, that comment was not directed towards liberal or conservative ideology…it was directed at bigotry, hatred and other pre-cursors to violence…

    I believe that liberalism is less genetic than you may think…perhaps you should look into it….maybe the ‘miscarriage police’ could do some sort of pre-natal genetic testing to make sure that ALL embryos have their proper fundamentalist conservatist genes and/orindoctrination prior to….oh let’s say the end of the first tri-mester…

  84. Restricting health care to women,and even men, of child bearing years and even of child rearing years, which often includes grandparents, is exactly the same as restricting health care to children and particularly to fetuses.

    One of the most important things that Planned Parenthood does is ensure that pregnant women have adequate prenatal care.

    If the Republican love fetuses so much why deny them health care during the time when it is most vital to them.

    Or isn’t it that Republicans hate women more than they love fetuses.

  85. “What you are whining a sniveling about is that you don’t like the Constitution and expect ME to usurp it along with you.”

    Tootie,
    I love the Constitution, but the difference between you and me is that I have some understanding of it, rather than that of a traitor loving faux religionist, who claims to want to limit government but also wants it to delve into the most personal aspects of our lives. By the way I don’t snivel or whine. That’s because I’m a real ma, not like those you hook with, who need their guns to make up for their deficient sexual skills.

    “I contend, and it is a fact, that the FEDERAL government has NO authorization to provide social services.”

    You might contend it but you are wrong. The government is to provide for the general welfare of the people.

    “My response: I took care of my offspring. I expect everyone to take care of their own offspring.”

    The BS continues and exposes the thought processes underneath.
    I would expect the difference is that you wanted your offspring and were not forced to have them. Was it though that you just didn’t understand about birth control and that man you hooked up with didn’t either, so your one minute of fun turned into a baby nine months later. Religious convictions BS. You want to punish the woman for having sex whether consensually or through force.

    “I belong to a religious organization that helps the disadvantaged, including the children of an orphanage. It has done this for decades. I’m not saying you are lying about me in this regard. You are just evil and cannot help the vile things you say.”

    Isn’t that precious you belong to an organization. No doubt a bunch of self-righteous bigots such as yourself. As far as my being evil tootie, I’ll face your conception of God anytime and if there is an eternal reward for a life well lived then I’m in simply because I’ve striven to follow the”Golden Rule.” It ain’t about Faith, it’s about Acts. As for the vile things I’ve said there is a written record to look back on. You came onto this blog purposely saying vile things about people who believe as I do. Now you whine that people are not being nice to you. Your actions have been returned in kind and that to hypocrites like you seems so unfair.

    “Look. I realize that Democrats and liberals are too stupid to know how this sex stuff works and so they are surprised that sex often produces another human being.”

    You are projecting your own ignorance onto us, tootie. We have had sexual education either from our parents and/or schools. The sex education where you come from consists of the abstinence movement that leads kids to believe that condoms are evil and so results in high rates of STD’s and unwanted pregnancy.

    “And I realize that Democrats and liberals are really so utterly disgusting that they feel compelled to rid themselves of the product of their coupling.”

    Tootie, I’ve had more sex in my lifetime than your “old man,” or men as the case may be. None of its’ been disgusting and no women who had sex with me had an unwanted pregnancy or STD. Why. Because I cherish women, more than my truck, guns or beers that characterize the men you hang with. you know who I’m talking about the “one minute” wonders in bed, “wham bam thank you maam,” types that infest where you live. They believe in keeping you females “barefoot and pregnant,” while comparing their guns and trucks to each other over cases of beer. You think and live by stereotypes, so I’ll respond with them.

    “I also sympathize with liberal men. They don’t want to be connected with such horrible disgusting women and have to deal with her through their child.”

    There you go again tootie, exposing what’s beyond your phony concern for the fetus. You and your kind want to punish women for having sex outside of a man’s control. You may be a woman, but even that’s in doubt, but that doesn’t mean you can’t hate them. In contradiction of you Christian beliefs tootie, you are a hater of extreme proportions and that bespeaks a bitter person whose life hasn’t turned out as she expected and blames others rather than looking at herself.

    Finally, as an obvious ploy you asked why a woman cries after a miscarriage? Your point was that you equate the loss of one’s fetus to the abortion of a fetus. Most miscarriages occur in women who want to have a child and so there is disappointment and despair, when the birth terminates. Some women have ectopic pregnancies where the fetus must be removed to save the child’s life. I’ve gone through both these experiences as a husband and a father and I cried at the outcomes. However, as someone who worked for 37 years in fields that touched upon the results of unwanted pregnancies I am pro-abortion, by experience of the destruction unwanted pregnancies can cause.

    The difference twixt you and me tootie is I have empathy for my fellow humans and am not guided by a false religious belief that I want to impose on everyone. I say false because my religion believes that the life of a child begins with its’ first breath and I choose to follow that belief. The difference between my beliefs and yours is also that my religion doesn’t believe someone has to follow it to be considered pleasing to the eye of God, even Christians can be righteous people in the eyes of God.
    You don’t believe that and thus think of God blasphemously and
    anthropomorphically because you align God with your own prejudice. Now I know your thinking that you follow the words of your bible, but by the hatred you spew I know you have no understanding of what those words mean.

  86. Mr. Spindell, Tootie,

    “… and that bespeaks a bitter person whose life hasn’t turned out as she expected and blames others rather than looking at herself.”

    Have tried hard not to state those very words, but they are the thoughts that occupied my mind as I saw Tootie lashing out over and over again.

    This is my attempt at remedying my past address to Tootie, “I don’t usually read your stuff but I do enjoy it on rare occasion :) ” Not any more, but I am glad your here and standing up for what you believe, even though your anger makes me sad.

  87. Mike Spindell:

    “Tootie, I’ve had more sex in my lifetime than your “old man,” or men as the case may be.”

    Hey big boy.

  88. Woosty:

    are you refering to me? I am not Tootie, nor do I wish to be so.

    I am Grammy Rue-Barb, the sage of Big Beaver Lick, KY.

  89. “I am Grammy Rue-Barb, the sage of Big Beaver Lick, KY.”~Grammy Rue-Barb

    No Kidding! We used to be neighbors! I lived on a wee spit of land on a couple of boulders in Big Bone Lick. One day those rocks shifted and that bit of land dropped like a bad souffle’……..I never could get that there cabin to stand up again….but it was a purty place….

  90. Elaine M,

    “I’m pro-choice. I’m not pro-abortion. Some people don’t see a distinction. Some people don’t consider the exceptional circumstances some girls/women find themselves in through no fault of their own. Some poeple don’t have any empathy for those girls/women.”

    Here, here! If life were as black and white as some seem delude themselves into thinking, life would be far easier than it is. But it is not. That’s why reasonable individuals see the grey and people like Tootie continue to fall off the turnip truck.

    —————————————————————-

    Mike S,

    Great post @ 11:56 ;)

  91. Thanks everyone for the nice comments on my post. I must admit that in my re-reading it, there were many macho aspects expressed. Sometimes I believe that when faced with such tactics in others, one needs to reply in kind, even though you may have to go over the top to do it. Sexuality is not about prowess, agility or size. It’s about respect for one’s partner and the mutual enjoyment of one of the great benefits of being alive. The definition of manhood likewise, is not about false measures of “toughness,” or even penis size. It is about how one takes care of their responsibilities and their dealing with others, which when you think of it is the same for women also. The differences that society/religion create between male/female hood are for the most part false dichotomies.

  92. Mike Spindell,

    I like nearly everything that you say…but this time I must say, like doesn’t even come close….Thank you! for showing us that there are real, compassionate, and rational men in the world….you put the ‘man’ in manly!

  93. Mike & Woosty,

    One thing’s for sure–I’m not going to go looking for any “real” men in the ranks of Republican politicians. That said, I don’t think I’ll find too many in the Democratic ranks either.

    Where have all the real men gone?
    Long time passing
    Where have all the real men gone?
    Long time ago
    Where have all the real men gone?
    Where should one look today??
    Not down in Washington!
    Not down in Washington!

  94. Elaine M,

    Whenever Jon Stewart talks about Bachmann, he always gets a “pained” look on his face and I cannot do anything BUT laugh! She is quite a prize, isn’t she? Does she EVER get anything right?!

    I sure did see that segment and thanks for the link – I just watched it again!!

  95. From Mother Jones (2/24/2011)

    Nebraska Resurrects “Justifiable Homicide” Abortion Bill
    A state legislator pushes a bill that’s even more sweeping than the South Dakota proposal that sparked a national controversy.
    http://motherjones.com/politics/2011/02/nebraska-justifiable-homicide-abortion-bill

    Excerpt:
    Just when abortion rights supporters thought they had beaten a controversial bill they believe would legalize the killing of abortion providers, it has cropped up again—this time in a more expansive form that has drawn the concern of law enforcement officials.

    Last week, South Dakota’s legislature shelved a bill, introduced by Republican state Rep. Phil Jensen, which would have allowed the use of the “justifiable homicide” defense for killings intended to prevent harm to a fetus. Now a nearly identical bill is being considered in neighboring Nebraska, where on Wednesday the state legislature held a hearing on the measure.

    The legislation, LB 232, was introduced by state Sen. Mark Christensen, a devout Christian and die-hard abortion foe who is opposed to the prodedure even in the case of rape. Unlike its South Dakota counterpart, which would have allowed only a pregnant woman, her husband, her parents, or her children to commit “justifiable homicide” in defense of her fetus, the Nebraska bill would apply to any third party.

    “In short, this bill authorizes and protects vigilantes, and that’s something that’s unprecedented in our society,” Melissa Grant of Planned Parenthood of the Heartland told the Nebraska legislature’s judiciary committee on Wednesday. Specifically, she warned, it could be used to target Planned Parenthood’s patients and personnel. Also testifying in oppostion to the bill was David Baker, the deputy chief executive officer of the Omaha police department, who said, “We share the same fears…that this could be used to incite violence against abortion providers.”

  96. House Bill Would Decimate Women’s Health Care in Cities and Rural Areas, Governors and Mayor Say
    Tuesday 22 February 2011

    by: Jodi Jacobson | RH Reality Check | Report

    In a conference call today, the Governors of Connecticut and Vermont and the Mayor of New York City described the devastating effects the GOP’s cuts to Title X and Planned Parenthood would have on women in their states as well as on the fiscal health of their region.

    Juxtaposing the needs of women in one of the nation’s largest cities (New York City) and in Vermont, one of the nation’s most rural states, the Mayor of New York City, Michael Bloomberg and the Governor of Vermont, Peter Shumlin spoke today about how cuts to both Title X and to Planned Parenthood would undermine the health of the populations they represent. Each of their concerns were echoed by Connecticut Governor Dan Malloy.
    Last week, the GOP/Tea-Party-dominated House of Representatives passed both a Continuing Resolution (CR) that effectively eliminates funding for Title X programs, and the Pence Amendment to the CR that specifically targets Planned Parenthood Federation of America (PPFA), prohibiting federal funding of preventive health care services provided by the organization.
    Over 90 percent of services provided by Planned Parenthood clinics are made up of preventive care, including breast and cervical exams, testing and treatment of sexually transmitted infections, and contraceptive supplies. PPFA clinics serve more than 5 million clients across the country each year. If the House budget and the Pence Amendment are passed by the Senate and signed into law by President Obama, literally millions of women and men will lose their only source of health care.
    “[Cuts to] Title X and the Pence are not about fiscal responsibility or cutting the U.S. budget,” said Mayor Bloomberg. “These cuts are purely about politics. And they will have serious consequences for women’s health care across New York City and the nation.”

    In fact, rather than reducing government spending or the deficit, both governors and the mayor underscored the dramatically increased financial burdens that would arise from cutting preventive care, which in turn means more and more expensive illness down the road.

    More than 8 million people live in New York City, for example; more than half [20] the population is 25 years of age or younger. And over 15 percent of the population lives at or below the poverty level. Planned Parenthood provides access to essential preventive care to more than 50,000 residents of New York City each year, conducting more than 79,900 tests for sexually transmitted infections (including HIV), 12,000 life-saving cervical cancer screenings, and 56,000 contraceptive visits.

    “These clinics are often the only place where poor and working women can see someone for care,” said Bloomberg.
    Moreover, he noted, increased access to contraceptives has reduced the rate of abortion in New York City in the last decade. “Our numbers are going in the right direction,” Bloomberg stated. But, he continued:

    “If you want to reduce unintended pregnancies and abortions, cutting funds to Planned Parenthood is not the way. It would take us in the other direction, and it would cost us money. Everyone is talking about how the government is spending too much money, but cutting [preventive care provided by Planned Parenthood] will cost more money and lead to more unintended pregnancies and abortions.”

    Bloomberg also noted that the loss of funding for family planning services and the consequent increase in unintended pregnancies would adversely affect both infants and small children because without access to contraception, more women will have “more unintended pregnancies, more closely spaced,” which is harmful for both mother and infant.

    Governor Shumlin raised deep concerns about the effects these cuts would have on rural women in his state which is, according to the U.S. Census Bureau, “atypically rural.” Planned Parenthood of Northern New England sees more than 19,500 patients each year, and provides more than 24,700 STI tests (including HIV tests), 5,500 cervical cancer screenings, 9,600 breast exams and 17,000 contraceptive visits.

    “Here in Vermont, cutting Title X money would be devastating,” warned Shumlin. “In a small rural state like Vermont, Planned Parenthood clinics oftentimes are the only source of health care [rural] low-income women get and the only access they have to critical health care, not only to avoid unintended pregnancies but for general health care.”

    “This is more about politics than policy,” Shumlin stated.
    Connecticut Governor Malloy said he’d written to Connecticut’s congressional delegation, urging them to “come to their senses” when it comes to cuts to programs such as Title X and funding for Planned Parenthood.” Planned Parenthood of Southern New England sees more than 62,300 patients each year, providing more than 90,400 STI tests (including HIV tests), 16,700 lifesaving cervical cancer screenings, 5,200 breast exams and 55,300 contraceptive visits Shumlin and Bloomberg also stated they’d written to both their delegations and to House leadership.

    Eliminating these funds would, they all agreed, increase rates of undiagnosed and untreated cervical and breast cancer, leading to increased deaths among women, higher rates of infections, and higher rates of unintended pregnancies and abortions.
    “We have a choice,” Shumlin concluded. “We can play politics and cut off our nose to spite our face, or we can do the right thing and fund Planned Parenthood.”

    http://www.truth-out.org/house-bill-would-decimate-womens-health-care-cities-and-rural-areas-governors-and-mayor-say67997

  97. Stamford Liberal,

    Thanks for that post and link. I heard your governor being interviewed on TV last night. I was impressed. He made his points clearly and concisely.

  98. This is interesting!

    From Auburn Journal (2/20/2011)
    GOP War on Women
    http://my.auburnjournal.com/detail/172006.html

    Turns out Republicans really don’t mind spending taxpayer dollars on federally-funded reproductive health care after all.

    Rep. Dan Burton (R-Ind.) – who you may recall dissed President Clinton for a dalliance (he called the president a “scumbag”), while fathering an extra-marital child of his own – has introduced an amendment which would control the population of wild horses and burros using taxpayer-funded contraceptives. That’s right. Contraceptives. For horses. But not for women.

    It gets even more surreal. The family planning for horses amendment came to a vote on the exact same day that Rep. Burton and his fellow Hors… House Republicans voted to just say NO funding for programs that provide tax-assisted reproductive health care services – including contraception – to low income American women. Priorities, you know.

    I remind you that the horse birth-control amendment comes from the same party that brought us the “Let Women Die” bill because taxpayers should never, ever, under any circumstances – not even in a case of life or death – have to pay for reproductive health care for American women citizens because some taxpayers believe contraception is just like abortion, and abortion is murder, and murder is wrong (if the “victim” is an embryo; if the victim is, say, a doctor, then it’s up for grabs).

    Sure would be swell if Republicans like Dallying Dan Burton could be as concerned with the humane treatment of American women as they apparently are with horses.

  99. From RH Reality Check (2/16/2011)
    GOP: Yes to Contraception for Wild Horses, No for Women
    http://www.rhrealitycheck.org/blog/2011/02/16/votes-contraception-wild-horses-women-0

    Excerpt:
    During a month in which the anti-choice Republican and Tea Party majority in Congress and in many states have made it their priority mission to eliminate access to contraception for women here and abroad, and on the very same day that the House planned to vote to take away birth control for women living in poverty in the US and eliminate funding for international family planning, you will be happy to know that there is at least one group the GOP believes deserves access to contraception.

    Wild horses.

    Just a little while ago, according to reports from the House floor, a vote was held on an amendment introduced by Congressman Dan Burton (R-IN) to prevent the Bureau of Land Management from holding wild horses in pens and then slaughtering them.

    Instead, says Burton, they should pursue “a much less costly and more human option – immunocontraception…”.

    The amendment, as stated by Burton, is intended to reduce the Bureau of Land Management’s budget by $2 million and send a signal that the agency must reform its enormously wasteful and misguided program of capturing wild horses and burros and holding them in pens, rather than employing a much less costly and more humane option – immunocontraception to control herd size.

    “Despite objections raised by Members of Congress, BLM continues its round up and removal policy, and is currently holding approximately 46,000 horses in pens. Total holding costs in FY10 were $36.9 million.”

    Text of amendment: H.R. 1 OFFERED BY: MR. BURTON AMENDMENT NO. 485: At the end of the bill (before the short title), insert the following: SEC. ll. None of the funds made available by this Act may be used for the gathers and removals of free-roaming wild horses and burros, except for the purpose of fertility control.

    I agree that holding wild horses in pens is cruel and unusual punishment and that it is more humane to use this option.

    What mystifies me is this: Access to contraception and other reproductive health services for low-income women and women struggling in poverty in the United States saves nearly $4.00 for every $1.00 spent by the federal government. Programs like Title X, which Burton and his comrades in the House are intent on gutting this same day, offer essential preventive services–detection and treatment of sexually transmitted infections, screening for breast and cervical cancer, contraception to plan families, and a wealth of other otherwise unavailable health services. These programs reduce the need for abortion, allow families to plan, reduce disease, and save countless dollars in reduced mortality and improved public health.

  100. Elaine,
    Let me make sure that I understand your last post. Women can’t have contraception, but horses can? Wow. Kind of sums up the entire Republican approach to the “woman problem”, doesn’t it?!!
    Great job Elaine, Stamford, Swarthmore, et al!

  101. Elaine,

    Malloy was my mayor for 14 years – he’s a good egg!

    Thank YOU for the above articles. It is safe to say that if the Rabid Right does manage to defund PP and Title X, we nags can take comfort in that we can take … HORSE birth control.

    I’m guessing the Rabid Right does not get how utterly ridiculous they are … “Now, now. We’re not laughing WITH you, we are laughing AT you.”

  102. Stamford,

    Here’s a quickie verse. I admit it’s not my best effort.

    Women to GOP:

    Baa, baa, GOP,
    Can you help us gals?
    We need some contraceptives.
    Please be our pals.

    **********
    GOP Reply:

    Here’s one for the stallion,
    One for the mare—
    But none for you ladies–
    Whatsoe’er.

  103. rafflaw,

    Sadly, John of Orange’s tears will be flooding us later this evening.

    Couldn’t help but put my own spin on this:

    Tears of a Clown

    Oh yeah yeah yeah

    Now if there’s a sad look on my face
    It’s only there trying to fool the public
    But when it comes down to fooling you
    Now honey that’s a different subject
    But don’t let my sad expression
    Give you the wrong impression
    Really I’m glad, oh I’m gladder than glad
    You’re gone and I’m not hurtin’ at all
    Like a clown I pretend to be sad

    Now there’s some sad things known to man
    But ain’t too much sadder than
    The tears of a clown, when everyone’s around
    Uh hum, oh yeah baby

    Now if I appear to be worried
    It’s only to camouflage my gladness
    And honey to shield my pride I try
    To cover this joy with a show of sadness
    But don’t let my show convince you
    That I’ve been sad since you
    Decided to go, oh I don’t need you so
    I’m happy and I want you to know
    But for others I put on a show, ooh yeah

    Just like I always did
    I try to keep my inside hid
    Crying in the public eye
    But in my palatial room I smile
    Not the tears of a clown
    When there’s no one around, oh yeah, baby baby
    Now if there’s a smile on my face
    Don’t let my sad expression
    Give you the wrong impression
    Don’t let these tears I wear
    Make you think that I care
    When really I’m glad… Eh, I’m not hurting so bad……

  104. Currently in many states, women seek out Drs. who perform illegal abortions. Drs. will perform these illegal abortions for hefty fees. These Drs. will also perform live births for these women and then kill the babies after the births.

    The women know that these Drs. are breaking the laws and know the Drs. are killing the live birth babies. HOWEVER, under many state laws, women are not legally held accountable for these illegal abortions and killings of babies. Only the Drs and medical people are held responsible. In other words, the women get away with legal murder. And the medical staffers are paid killers for the mother.

    From my initial reading of this bill, these legal changes will hold women accountable for the deaths and murders of these babies. There will no longer be any loopholes for the women. They will be prosecuted for the illegal babies murders, just as Drs. and other medical professionals are already being held for babies deaths.

    The women will not be able to claim “ignorance” either. If they try to claim they didn’t know the Drs were performing illegal abortions, they will not have a legal defense. Ignorance of the law is never a defenese anyway.

    So after my initial reading of this bill, this is what this REALLY is about. This is not about investigating every miscarriage. This is not about creating a “Uterus Police” force. It is about giving the state to look into highly suspicous “miscarriages” that are really illegal abortions and murders of live born babies. It is about stopping certain women from getting away with what is currently legal murder for them.

    And this post? This post is about misrepresenting the facts, whipping up the base, and getting women confused, and allowing certain women to keep illegal abortions and killing live birth babies, unfettered.

    The American holocaust of the unborn will be stopped.

  105. Question : Should women be allowed to hire Drs and medical staff that perform illegal abortions and killings of live babies?

    If the Drs are caught performing these illegal abortions, if Drs are caught killing live birth babies, are only the Drs. legally responsible?

    Should women not be charged with crimes if the Drs perform known illegal abortions and live birth murders?

    Should women be allowed to get away with murdering babies?

  106. http://articles.nydailynews.com/2011-01-19/news/27088082_1_abortion-clinic-late-term-abortions-aborted-fetuses

    Philadelphia abortion doctor Kermit Gosnell charged with murdering 7 infants with scissors

    BY LAUREN JOHNSTON

    DAILY NEWS STAFF WRITER
    Wednesday, January 19, 2011

    Jan 27 2011, New York — A doctor who ran a “house of horrors” abortion clinic has been charged in the deaths of one woman and seven babies who prosecutors say were born alive then killed with scissors.

    Dr. Kermit Gosnell, who treated mostly poor and immigrant women, was arrested Wednesday along with nine employees from his West Philadelphia Women’s Medical Society – among them a high school student who performed medial treatments with no license.

    Gosnell, 69, raked in millions over 30 years performing illegal and late-term abortions, prosecutors said.

    Officials described his squalid clinic like something out of a horror movie

    “There were bags and bottles holding aborted fetuses were scattered throughout the building,” said Philadelphia District Attorney Seth Williams. “There were jars, lining shelves, with severed feet that he kept for no medical purpose.”

    Gosnell has been named in at least 10 malpractice suits, but Williams said state regulators ignored complaints about his clinic and that the office hadn’t been inspected since 1993.

  107. Oh please people, stop the dramatics. No one is interested in a 4 weeks pregnancy.

    What authorities are interested in are women who are 7 ..8…9 months pregnant, going off to Philadelphia (or wherever) to illegal abortion mill, and get an illegal abortion or give birth and then have the baby killed.

    And then these women come gack to GA (or where ever) and suddenly, after their so called “spontaneous” fetal death, their unborn baby is just gone?! Hmmmm, women never lie, right? Every 7 …8…9 month pregnant women ONLY loses babies to natural causes, right? Never to illegal abortion mills, right?

    Similiarly, if a 2 month old born baby goes missing, don’t you think the authorities have a right to investigate where it went?

    So why don’t authorities have right to know what happened to a baby in it’s 8th month if it suddenly goes “missing” or dead(aka w/o medical attendance to confirm no foul play)??

    Oh please, stop the baloney. Even when an adult dies, if not in the hospital for under medical care for 48 hours, most state medical examiners hold the body for days and do an autopsy!!

    You think the state isn’t interested also in 8 month unborn babies and they aren’t interested in confirming there was no foul play?

    Please, please, please, the hubris and arrogance of women, protesting reasonable safeguards for unborn babies is UNBELIEVABLE!! UNBELIEVABLE!!

  108. chuckCharles,
    Can I just call you Double Chuck? first of all, you are mixing up abortions with miscarriages. The Georgia legislation is concerned with miscarriages that the good Rep. thinks might actually be self inflicted abortions. If you have doctors who are breaking the law, put them in jail. Few if any would have a problem with that. Secondly, the uterus police is going a little too far, don’t you think. How about if we have a gun police to check every man in Georgia to make sure he/she has a legal permit for the gun? That check would be met with a little resistance in Georgia, don’t you think?
    Respectfully,
    rafflawRafflaw

  109. rafflaw,

    Thanks for that response. I’m not sure how people extrapolate from what I wrote that I’d condone the actions of doctors who were breaking the law. A miscarriage should not be equated with an abortion.

  110. I have always thought that the men leading the assault on women’s health and reproductive rights were abusers. That is the effect of their actions and “Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them”. They are what they do. Their preoccupation with controlling women, most easily through health/reproduction, has always left me with a queasy feeling, there’s something unhealthy motivating it.

    This is an interesting article and it’s a cultural phenomenon that needs more study:

    “Report Details Sabotage of Birth Control
    By RONI CARYN RABIN
    Published: February 15, 2011

    Men who abuse women physically and emotionally may also sabotage their partners’ birth control, pressuring them to become pregnant against their will, new reports suggest.

    Several small studies have described this kind of coercion among low-income teenagers and young adults with a history of violence by intimate partners. Now, a report being released Tuesday by the federally financed National Domestic Violence Hotline says 1 in 4 women who agreed to answer questions after calling the hot line said a partner had pressured them to become pregnant, told them not to use contraceptives, or forced them to have unprotected sex.

    The report was based on answers from more than 3,000 women, but it was not a research study, those involved said.

    “It was very eye-opening,” said Lisa James, director of health at the Family Violence Prevention Fund in San Francisco, which worked with the hot line on the report. “There were stories about men refusing to wear a condom, forcing sex without a condom, poking holes in condoms, flushing birth control pills down the toilet. …”

    http://www.nytimes.com/2011/02/15/health/research/15pregnant.html?_r=1

  111. Lottakatz,

    Excellent post. As I’ve always suspected, and this post confirms, much of this war the GOP is waging against women has absolutely nothing to do with defending the unborn and absolutely everything to do with control, similar to how rape is not a crime of sex, but a crime of control.

    Your post does not surprise me one bit.

  112. From RH Reality Check (2/24/2011)
    Miscarriage-as-Murder Bill Center of GOP War on Women
    By Amie Newman, Managing Editor
    http://www.rhrealitycheck.org/blog/2011/02/23/prenatal-murder-bill-center-women

    Excerpt:
    Sigh. This is what happens when you find someone who’s earned an undergraduate degree in both “Biblical studies” and “Business Administration,” have him run for state representative unopposed in 2010 (although he’s been part of the Georgia House of Representatives since 1996) and then allow him to revel in a nation-wide political assault on women, led by the Republican party, of which he’s a member.

    Rep. Bobby Franklin (R-Marietta) of “rape victims should be classified as accusers and not victims” fame – or the “Lone Ranger” as he’s been called and has taken to calling himself – has most recently introduced a bill to criminalize miscarriages, renaming the process “prenatal murder.” Oh, they say, no. It’s only miscarriages where the cause cannot be determined – not all miscarriages. Well, folks, that’s most miscarriages.

    Here’s the thing: you’ll need, as others more witty than I have deemed them, a team of Uterus Police Officers – to suss this out as a crime.

    Ask my midwife why I miscarried with my second pregnancy. What was the cause? The cause was my body behaving as the female human body will sometimes behave. What do you mean – what’s the cause?! Was there human involvement in the causation of the event? Of course my body was “involved in the cause of the event.” If the female body itself is criminalized – something this bill would do – we may as well throw all girls and women on an island somewhere far away and let us fend for ourselves in all of our evil glory. Sadly, that does not sound so horrible at this point and time.

    HB 1 creates a new legal classification for pregnancy termination – “Prenatal Murder,”

    ‘Prenatal murder’ means the intentional removal of a fetus from a woman with an intention other than to produce a live birth or to remove a dead fetus; provided, however, that if a physician makes a medically justified effort to save the lives of both the mother and the fetus and the fetus does not survive, such action shall not be prenatal murder. Such term does not include a naturally occurring expulsion of a fetus known medically as a ‘spontaneous abortion’ and popularly as a ‘miscarriage’ so long as there is no human involvement whatsoever in the causation of such event. (c) The act of prenatal murder is contrary to the health and well-being of the citizens of this state and to the state itself and is illegal in this state in all instances. (d) Any person committing prenatal murder in this state shall be guilty of a felony and, upon conviction, shall be punished as provided in subsection (d) of Code Section 16-5-1. The license of any physician indicted for an alleged violation of this Code section shall be suspended until resolution of the matter. The license of any physician convicted of a violation of this Code section shall be permanently revoked. The provisions of this Code section shall be in addition to any other provisions relating to the killing of a fetus or any other person.”

  113. From Move On:
    Top 10 Shocking Attacks from the GOP’s War on Women
    http://pol.moveon.org/waronwomen/?id=26177-9315970-1VrUTWx&t=3

    1) Republicans not only want to reduce women’s access to abortion care, they’re actually trying to redefine rape. After a major backlash, they promised to stop. But they haven’t yet. Shocker.

    2) A state legislator in Georgia wants to change the legal term for victims of rape, stalking, and domestic violence to “accuser.” But victims of other less gendered crimes, like burglary, would remain “victims.”

    3) In South Dakota, Republicans proposed a bill that could make it legal to murder a doctor who provides abortion care. (Yep, for real.)

    4) Republicans want to cut nearly a billion dollars of food and other aid to low-income pregnant women, mothers, babies, and kids.

    5) In Congress, Republicans have a bill that would let hospitals allow a woman to die rather than perform an abortion necessary to save her life.

    6) Maryland Republicans ended all county money for a low-income kids’ preschool program. Why? No need, they said. Women should really be home with the kids, not out working.

    7) And at the federal level, Republicans want to cut that same program, Head Start, by $1 billion. That means over 200,000 kids could lose their spots in preschool.

    8. Two-thirds of the elderly poor are women, and Republicans are taking aim at them too. A spending bill would cut funding for employment services, meals, and housing for senior citizens.

    9) Congress just voted for a Republican amendment to cut all federal funding from Planned Parenthood health centers, one of the most trusted providers of basic health care and family planning in our country.

    10) And if that wasn’t enough, Republicans are pushing to eliminate all funds for the only federal family planning program. (For humans. But Republican Dan Burton has a bill to provide contraception for wild horses. You can’t make this stuff up).

  114. “Maryland Republicans ended all county money for a low-income kids’ preschool program. Why? No need, they said. Women should really be home with the kids, not out working.

    7) And at the federal level, Republicans want to cut that same program, Head Start, by $1 billion. That means over 200,000 kids could lose their spots in preschool.”

    Elaine,

    your hits keep coming. Bravo!

    Considering how many married women there are in the workforce, who rely on child care, these positions are suicidal. They will either destroy the Republican Party, or destroy the country. I’m betting on the former. This doesn’t mean that overall the Democratic Party is appreciably better these days, just that they’re smart enough not to take these losing positions.

  115. “I have always thought that the men leading the assault on women’s health and reproductive rights were abusers.”

    LK,

    On target as usual, it’s about control. In the same way and with equivalence to the fact that rape isn’t about sex.

  116. “Oh please people, stop the dramatics. No one is interested in a 4 weeks pregnancy.”

    Chuck,

    Do you realize what nonsense you’re spouting. This issue is about all abortions and birth control. The proponents say that themselves. Judging by you compassion for and understanding of women.

    “Please, please, please, the hubris and arrogance of women, protesting reasonable safeguards for unborn babies is UNBELIEVABLE!! UNBELIEVABLE!!”

    I would say given you’re outlook you’re either lousy in bed, or gay. I would go with the former, since most gay men understand and sympathize with women more than you do.

  117. “A doctor who ran a “house of horrors” abortion clinic has been charged in the deaths of one woman and seven babies who prosecutors say were born alive then killed with scissors.”

    Chuck,

    These deaths are to be laid at the doorstep of you and the people who believe as you do. You are responsible because you all have in your misguided zeal made abortion and birth control harder for women to procure. Murderer!

  118. Wow, Mike.

    That was some thumpin’ you just administered.

    Truly, impressive.

    I’m not even related to the guy and it made me dizzy.

  119. Mike S.,

    Thanks for all your comments on this thread. You probably noticed that chuck didn’t respond to the questions that I addressed to him. I’ll repost them here for your convenience:

    chuck Charles,

    Did you read my post? Do you have any response to what I wrote about?

  120. Elaine/Blouise,

    This is OT, but I thought I would share it with you anyway. I was over at TED amusing myself (thanks again, mespo! man I love that site) and I stumbled upon this talk. I think it illustrates what a strong intelligent woman can add to politics as a contrasts to Madness of Michelle Bachmann and the poseur antics of Caribou Barbie who don’t do anything substantive to aid women’s rights and in fact hurt women. It’s titled “Madeleine Albright: On being a woman and a diplomat”. If we had 1000 like Maddie, the Right wouldn’t stand a chance.

  121. Elaine,
    Great job and a great Monty Python link! that is one of their funniest clips. I think Double Chuck may be recreating himself.
    Mike S,
    Wow! You are on fire tonight!

  122. Elaine, after you post the link cut off the “[youtube ” and it seems to work.

    MikeS., Good work. Absolutely correct. How can one not see the blood on ones own hands?

  123. Buddha,

    We have a thousands like Madeleine Albright and one of them is going to make it to the White House … we will help her get there.

    I have two daughters and Elaine has a daughter … trust me Buddha, the young women coming behind us are an amazing bunch fully deserving of our sacrifices and our support.

    Thanks for the link … and I laughed long and hard at her quip about those who think only women should run the world having forgotten what high school was like.

    One can understand why Republicans have declared war on women but, as usual, they are a day late and a dollar short.

  124. Elaine,

    Superb discussion in your last video posting … Republicans are nuts if they think they are going to able to keep women like those we watched down on the farm taking care of the chickens.

    I swear, these republicans are looking more and more like the Taliban. I think it’s time to take a stick to ’em.

  125. From The Iowa Independent (2/24/2011)
    Iowa bills open door for use of deadly force to protect the unborn
    http://iowaindependent.com/52869/iowa-bills-open-door-for-use-of-deadly-force-to-protect-the-unborn

    Excerpts:
    Two bills sponsored by Iowa House Republicans could have significant public safety consequences, and perhaps the most unnerving of those potential outcomes would be the justifiable use of deadly force against abortion or family planning providers.

    When the two pieces of legislation are combined they create a situation where a fertilized egg would be considered a person, and allow for the public execution of those who would threaten such a person.

    If passed into law, the two bills — House File 7 and House File 153 — would offer an unprecedented defense opportunity to individuals who stand accused of killing such providers, according to a former prosecutor and law professor at the University of Kansas, and are something that might have very well led to a different outcome in the Kansas trial of the man who shot Dr. George Tiller in a church foyer.

    *****
    Also included in the proposal is a new section to the Iowa Code that would provide automatic criminal and civil immunity to a person who uses deadly force, unless a police investigation proves that the person was not acting “reasonably.” Also key to the immunity clause is the fact that law enforcement would likely be barred from arresting a person at the scene of an incident “unless the law enforcement agency determines there is probable cause that the force was unlawful under this chapter.” If law enforcement does make an arrest, and if that person is later found to have used reasonable force by a court of law, taxpayers could be on the hook for the reimbursement of the person’s attorney fees, court costs, compensation from loss of income and other expenses.

    *****

    Todd Miler, a criminal defense attorney in Des Moines, agrees that these two bills, when combined, create a situation that could lead to someone claiming the killing of an abortion provider or a family planning worker was reasonable use of deadly force.

  126. Elaine M. 1, February 25, 2011 at 9:23 pm

    From The Iowa Independent (2/24/2011)
    Iowa bills open door for use of deadly force to protect the unborn
    ============================
    Good grief!

    ok, is there a lawyer out there who can introduce a bill that makes all forms on non-consensual sex punishable by the surgical removal of the perps penis? (preferably sans aenesthesia…)
    I just think it’s time to mirror up to these weirdos how ridiculous they are acting….

  127. All of these anti-women bills are all part of the Right’s plan to attack the left from as many angles as possible. It won’t stop until they are thrown out of the state houses and in Washington.

  128. Looks like Bobby Franklin has a problem with uterus’s, but has no problem with penis’s. Is it the water in Georgia??

    Georgia Republican Votes to Allow Sex Offenders to Photograph Children

    By Dustin • on February 28, 2011 • Filed under: Uncategorized

    Georgia Republican Bobby Franklin today voted against a measure that would ban sex offenders from photographing children without the Parents consent.

    HB 162 would have made it illegal for a sex offender to photograph children without the consent of a parent. Bobby Franklin voted against the measure, which would have protected children. Franklin frequent cites “the proper role of government” as a reason he frequently votes against measures. However, one must wonder what a more proper role of Government could be than protecting children from sex offenders.

    http://gapolitico.com/?p=17599

  129. Swarthmore mom,

    I had to read that one twice just to make sure I got it – will miracles never cease?!

  130. SL. If republican women are going to stand up to the good old boys, we should give them credit. This is the only instance of this that I have read about. I wish it would spread, but most republican women run on an anti- abortion platform so it probably won’t.

  131. SM,

    “If republican women are going to stand up to the good old boys, we should give them credit. This is the only instance of this that I have read about. I wish it would spread, but most republican women run on an anti- abortion platform so it probably won’t.”

    Absolutely! I give these two women major kudos. It is highly unusual to say the least.

    I find it interesting that it appears to not be an issue of being pro-life, but of being pro-privacy.

  132. From The Nation
    The War on Women’s Futures
    Melissa Harris-Perry
    March 3, 2011
    http://www.thenation.com/article/158981/war-womens-futures

    Excerpt:
    Using small-government, libertarian rhetoric, the Tea Party ushered in a new crop of Republican leaders under the banner of fiscal responsibility. But the aggressive antichoice legislation coming from the new GOP majority in the House makes perfectly clear that belt-tightening deficit reduction is entirely compatible with an older social agenda committed to pushing American women out of the public sphere.

    These initiatives are well coordinated and poised to make an enormous impact on women’s lives. House Republicans, joined by ten Democrats, passed Mike Pence’s bill to eliminate federal funding for Planned Parenthood, which in addition to pregnancy termination provides basic reproductive healthcare, STD testing, birth control and cancer screenings to millions of American women. The Republican Party has also proposed eliminating more than $1 billion from Head Start’s budget. As a result, 157,000 children may go without preschool care.

    Meanwhile, the South Dakota legislature has considered a bill justifying homicide in the case of imminent harm to a fetus, a law that critics believe may in effect legalize the murder of abortion providers. Republicans in Arizona have proposed different birth certificates for children born to women who are not US citizens in order to nullify the birthright citizenship established by the Fourteenth Amendment. And Wisconsin Governor Scott Walker is poised to eliminate most of the collective bargaining rights of public employees, including nurses, teachers and other pink-collar workers who are disproportionately women.

    These may seem like disparate policy efforts, but they are not. They are the product of the ethnic and economic anxieties of conservative white Americans whose determination to “take our country back” has been a rallying cry since Barack Obama’s election. Women’s bodies and lives are the terrain on which this conservative movement is making its stand.

    Since the introduction of the birth control pill and the legalization of abortion, women in America have significantly reduced the number of children they bear. This decrease in fertility has been particularly striking among white women. Fewer white women marry, most marry much later than in previous generations, far more get divorced and the size of their families has decreased dramatically. Along with these changes, white women’s educational achievement has soared, their participation in the workforce has increased and their health outcomes, lifetime earnings and political participation have improved. Today, more than three in five American women work for pay outside the home.

    However shrouded in the language of fiscal austerity, the GOP’s social agenda intends to undo these changes, forcing women back into the domestic sphere. While leaving abortion nominally legal, cuts to family planning services and the legalization of terror against abortion providers would create an environment of compulsory childbearing. Women who can’t control their fertility will be unable to compete for degrees or jobs with their male counterparts. Likewise, without affordable childcare women would be less likely to work outside the home. And without basic rights to organize, women teachers, nurses and other public sector workers would be compelled to accept lower wages and harsher working conditions, shoving many women out of the workforce altogether. In the Republicans’ future America, women will be encouraged to marry younger, to stay in difficult (even abusive) marriages and to rely on male wages.

    For white women in particular, this would mean a retreat to the home, where they would be encouraged to bear more children so as to reclaim the racial character of the nation. Immigrant women, however, would be discouraged from having children. Hispanic women have had the highest fertility rates for more than a decade, but efforts to roll back birthright citizenship aim to deny their children access to public education and class mobility, leaving more space for the children of white Americans.

  133. Sigh … South Dakota’s at it again:

    South Dakota forces women to obtain religious counseling prior to abortion
    by: rachel_nygaard
    Wed Mar 02, 2011 at 16:55:40 PM CST

    South Dakota (home of the ‘legal to kill doctors’ bill) moves a bill on to the governor that forces women to obtain counseling from a crisis pregnancy center 72 hours prior to an abortion. This bill was pushed through under the guise of protecting women from coercion and ensuring that women don’t rush into a decision. Women don’t rush into these decisions and already have to wait 24 hours to receive this medical procedure. The legislature also already mandates counseling at the clinic prior to an abortion, this new bill simply adds yet another roadblock to a woman’s right to choose.

    The bill states that the doctor must obtain a signed document from the cpc stating that the woman went in and talked to a cpc counsellor. The bill also says that the cpc has no obligation to give a woman that form. CPCs are generally religious organizations that coerce women and push their own religious beliefs. Unfortunately, these religious organizations are not required to provide accurate medical information or referrals (even if asked) to medical clinics. This is yet another step backwards for South Dakota women.

    South Dakota forces women to obtain religious counseling prior to abortion
    Planned Parenthood press release

    The South Dakota Legislature passed a bill today that requires a woman who is seeking an abortion to first prove that she has received “counseling” from one of the state’s unlicensed, unaccredited and unregulated “crisis pregnancy centers.”
    The bill, the first of its kind in the nation, imposes a 72-hour waiting period for an abortion after a woman’s initial consultation with her doctor and requires a physician to obtain written proof from a patient that she sought counseling at a “crisis pregnancy center.” Physicians who fail to comply could be fined $10,000.

    “The voters of South Dakota, by resounding margins at the ballot box, twice have told their legislators that the decision to have an abortion is between a woman, her family and her doctor and that government should not intrude on that decision,” said Sarah Stoesz, president and CEO of Planned Parenthood Minnesota, North Dakota, South Dakota. “We know that women reflect, talk with friends and family, and consult with pastors and their doctors before making this difficult decision. This bill intrudes on those relationships, shows contempt for women and disdain for voters’ wishes.”

    Under the new law, there are no requirements surrounding the qualifications of the centers’ “counselors” and no rules or regulations governing patient privacy. Furthermore, the crisis pregnancy centers must have as their central mission a desire to dissuade a woman from having an abortion, no matter what her particular risks or circumstances. Studies have shown repeatedly that “crisis pregnancy centers” fail to give scientifically accurate medical information to women. In one congressional report, 87 percent of crisis pregnancy centers contacted by investigators gave false or misleading information about abortion.

    “In the name of ‘preventing coercion,’ this bill establishes state-mandated coercion of women into completing all pregnancies, and the hypocrisy is simply mind-boggling,” said Dr. Marvin Buehner, a Rapid City obstetrician/gynecologist who testified against the bill Monday.

    In addition, the South Dakota State Medical Association (SDSMA) issued a strong statement in opposition: “The SDSMA … believes that physicians should be offered the ability to treat and care for patients according to their medical training and evidence based medicine. Allowing the specifics of the practice of medicine to be subject to the whims of the legislative body creates a slippery slope that should be avoided.”

    The new law comes in the midst of other legislation to impose severe restrictions on abortion, including a proposal to expand the definition of “justifiable homicide” to create a legal defense for the murder of an abortion doctor.

    “We all want a society that protects and values a woman’s life and health. And we all want strong, safe families in which every child has a chance to thrive and prosper,” said Stoesz. “But South Dakota legislators persist in putting women and families at risk, intruding on personal decisions, and violating of voters’ trust.

    “We are prepared to protect and preserve reproductive justice in South Dakota, whether through grassroots organizing, lobbying, or litigating. We will not abandon women and families in the state of South Dakota.”

    http://www.mnprogressiveproject.com/diary/8563/south-dakota-forces-women-to-obtain-religious-counseling-prior-to-abortion

  134. GOP Campaign Against Birth Control Officially Too Crazy for Scaife
    Thursday 03 March 2011

    by: Lindsay Beyerstein | The Media Consortium | News Analysis

    We all have our limits. The GOP’s crusade against Planned Parenthood is officially too crazy for right-wing philanthropist and media baron Richard Mellon Scaife.

    In a recent op/ed column, Scaife broke with House Republicans over their resolution to de-fund Planned Parenthood and the entire Title X family planning program, Scot Kersgaard reports in the Minnesota Independent. Scaife writes that Margaret Sanger, the founder of Planned Parenthood, was friends with his grandmother.

    Sanger was apparently a good influence on young Richard. Scaife reminisces in the Pittsburgh Union Tribune:

    I met Sanger several times before her death in 1966 and was impressed by her intellect and her commitment to many issues, not the least of which was enabling every woman to be “the absolute mistress of her own body,” as she put it.
    As Scaife points out in his column, the campaign to de-fund Planned Parenthood is being orchestrated by anti-abortion activists, but abortion is only a small part of the organization’s mission. He notes that over 90% of Planned Parenthood’s budget goes towards preventing unplanned pregnancies. Furthermore, 0% of Planned Parenthood’s federal funding goes toward abortions.

    Peeping Toms

    Amanda Marcotte writes in AlterNet about the lecherous face of the modern anti-choice movement. Humiliating women in the name of saving fetuses has become a cherished project of the anti-choice movement. Since Roe v. Wade, states have been limited in their ability to directly restrict abortions. So, one tried and true strategy to separate women from their constitutional rights without actually banning abortions is to throw up as many degrading hurdles as possible.

    Some states force women to view their own ultrasounds before they can terminate their pregnancies. Others make health care providers deliver a canned speech about how abortion is killing a person. South Dakota, Marcotte notes, is weighing a bill to force women to attend so-called “crisis pregnancy centers,” which are not health care facilities at all, but rather anti-choice propaganda outlets.

    Marcotte also details a new bill in Kansas that would require minors seeking abortions without parental permission to submit to interrogation by a mental health professional–as if seeking an abortion were evidence of a mental illness. Ostensibly, this interview is to determine whether the teen is mature enough to make her own decision about abortion, but the real impetus seems to be to make the bypass process as humiliating as possible in the hopes that more young women will give up and bear children.

    The Larger Context

    Ilyse Hogue of The Nation explains why the right went after Planned Parenthood, ACORN, and the public sector unions:
    [W]hile it’s obvious that the right wing is out to break the back of the progressive movement, it’s easy to miss the strategy that guides their selection of specific targets. Their attacks are all carefully aimed at the same critical juncture: institutions that work for people in their daily lives and in the political arena, those that connect people’s personal struggles across the country to the political struggle in Washington. Once we recognize the critical role these progressive service organizations play in building progressive politics, the right’s broader strategy in Wisconsin and elsewhere becomes clear. Scott Walker is a soldier in the same army as James O’ Keefe and Lila Rose, the right-wing video pranksters who tried to smear ACORN and Planned Parenthood.

    http://www.truth-out.org/gop-campaign-against-birth-control-officially-too-crazy-scaife68178

  135. Stamford,
    Great Truth-out story. It really lays out what the Right is trying to do and how they are doing it. All of these skirmishes are part of one big war on the Left, women and the middle class.

  136. rafflaw,

    Thanks. One would need to be deaf, dumb and blind to not see what the party of old, rich white men are doing.

    It’s disgusting.

  137. Here’s more from The Nation’s Katha Pollitt:
    In Its Crusade Against Choice, Has the GOP Gone Too Far? (3/3/2011)
    http://www.thenation.com/article/158986/its-crusade-against-choice-has-gop-gone-too-far

    Excerpt:
    Has the GOP finally gone too far? I’ve long been skeptical of the argument that Republicans, once in power, would back away from restricting abortion for fear of waking the famous prochoice sleeping giant. That prediction assumed a monolith of single-issue prochoice voters and overlooked the way restrictions tend to work. With a few exceptions, like South Dakota’s proposed abortion bans in 2006 and ‘08, the antichoicers have become rather clever at geography and whittling: focusing on state legislatures in the most antichoice states, on aspects of abortion that don’t have a lot of popular support (so-called “partial birth abortion,” teenagers’ right to privacy), on driving clinics out of business one by one through targeted regulations and passing laws that seem reasonable on their face (why not punish the murder of a pregnant woman as a double killing?) but when taken together would build up the legal case for overturning Roe. Not many people are going to get active because there is now only one clinic in Mississippi when fifteen years ago there were six. Unless you’re deeply versed in abortion realities, a twenty-four-hour waiting period may not seem like much of a burden.

    But you know what the Bible says about pride. Puffed up with their triumph in the 2010 elections—and worried about keeping their ever more reactionary base on board—Republicans at the state and federal level are letting their misogyny, their fundamentalism and their sheer nuttiness show. When Congress gets rid of federal funds for birth control for low-income women and antichoice activist Janet Porter gets two fetuses to “testify” at a hearing on the Ohio “Heartbeat Bill” by projecting their ultrasound images on a screen in living color, a shark has been seriously jumped. What’s next—a vial of talking sperm? (Porter is not some marginal loony by the way; she was a co-chair of Mike Huckabee’s Faith and Family Values coalition during his 2008 campaign.) And maybe—just maybe—the sleeping giant is opening its eyes.

    On Saturday, February 26, demonstrations were held all around the nation in support of Planned Parenthood and reproductive rights. I went to the one at Foley Square in Manhattan. It was a lively gathering, and a pretty packed one too—according to the Gothamist website, 6,000 people were there. Lots of young people, belying the stereotype that twentysomethings take reproductive rights for granted. Lots of men. A stellar lineup of speakers, including Chuck Schumer, Kathleen Turner, Amanda Marcotte and the fiery Anthony Weiner. Lots of funny signs: Sex Happens. More Weiner Less Boehner and (on a giant pink penis) Why Are the Republicans Such Dicks??

    Yes, why? Not content with depriving women of reproductive healthcare, House Republicans want to starve them and their children too. Their budget cuts the Women, Infants and Children Health and Nutrition program by $750 million and Head Start by $1 billion. It cuts $50 million from a block grant that pays for prenatal healthcare for 2.5 million low-income women and healthcare for 31 million children each year. As Charles Blow writes in the New York Times, proposed cuts to medical research strike directly at efforts to roll back the US infant mortality rate, now the highest among advanced economies. The Republicans seem bent on proving the truth of the bitter joke that “prolifers” care about children only before they are born. As for caring about women? Even as fetal vessels, the ladies just don’t count. After all, one in five women has visited a Planned Parenthood clinic—often for routine gynecological care. Is the GOP going to set up a replacement network of clinics to provide Pap smears and breast exams and STD testing and such? Or is Jesus now the national gynecologist? What on earth is the matter with these people?

    Of course, it’s possible that the real point is to throw buckets of spaghetti at the wall and see what sticks. Even if most of these bills fail and the worst cuts don’t happen, the terms of debate will have shifted away from reproductive care as a social good. At the Los Angeles Times, Patt Morrison urges prochoicers to send a donation to Planned Parenthood in honor of Mike Pence and Joe Pitts—and drop them a note to let them know. It’s a great idea. The way things are going, Planned Parenthood will need every cent.

  138. As I’ve said before, but I think bears repeating, this whole thing is about insecure men who hate women and couldn’t get one were it not for their wealth and/or religion. They’re like the married guys who still have more fun with their buddies and want to huddle in their “Man Caves.” Sexual, or not, I’ll take a woman’s company, over a man’s anytime. But then I love woman for a hell of a lot more than their different genitalia. They are smarter, stronger and much more fun to talk with.

  139. Mike S.,

    I’m fortunate to be married to a man who is smart, strong, a great conversationalist, ethical, open-minded, and fun to to spend time with. He has a terrific sense of humor and great respect for women. He has been a wonderful husband and father. I hit the jackpot!

  140. “Well said, but I think many of these right wing men are just the American version of the Taliban”

    I think that they lack the “cojones” to be like the Taliban, who are smart and tough in their way. The people in the Conservative Movement are greedy, crazy and/or stupid, or any amalgam of same. As evil as they are, the Taliban at least risk themselve in an albeit evil cause. I truly believe that the faux Conservatives bluff well, but falter under attack.

    Now at times there are other motivations, Moar’s perhaps which seems masochistic to me. It is said of S & M types that they often switch roles. Moar attempts to be a “top,’ but eventually winds up a “bottom.”

  141. Mike S,

    “Moar attempts to be a “top,’ but eventually winds up a “bottom.””

    Lol – so true!!

  142. It is said of S & M types that they often switch roles.

    while repeating thank you sir may I have another.

  143. Sigh …

    Testifying Fetus Refuses To Cooperate
    by Jack Stuef

    by Jack Stuef
    1:21 pm March 3, 2011

    Because this is the United States of America, two fetuses supposedly “testified” before an Ohio legislative committee yesterday via projector from the womb for a bill that would make abortion illegal if the fetus in question has a heartbeat. Things were going just fine for the wingnuts until the nine-week-old fetus’ heartbeat failed to show up on the monitor or the speakers. “When we did this earlier the baby cooperated very nicely,” the pro-life activist said as she struggled to find the fetus’ heart with her laser pointer. Not cooperating? That’s contempt! That fetus should be thrown in jail! We totally called it. At the very least, this fetus’ crazy pro-life parents are going to immediately put it in a time-out when it’s born.
    OR it could be that it’s not always clear when a fetus does or doesn’t have a specific organ in the works. If this law passed and a woman needed to abort this fetus, would her doctor have to rush her over to a judge to get his opinion on whether or not there was a heart? Exactly.

    At the beginning of this video, the pro-life woman explains it would be easier to see the beating heart if they did a trans-vaginal ultrasound, but they didn’t want to do that sort of thing in front of everyone. The committee found this hilarious.

    “Yes, it certainly would be weird if everyone on this committee saw my mother’s vagina,” replied the half-inch fetus, forced to testify in the nude and against its will, unable to think or speak, and yet more intelligent than everyone else there.

    By the way, the pro-life woman also says they don’t know the sex of this fetus. So these wingnuts just assisted a witness dealing with some very personal gender issues. LGTB pride! [YouTube]

  144. Mike S. said, “But then I love woman for a hell of a lot more than their different genitalia. They are smarter, stronger and much more fun to talk with.”

    Yep. That about sums it up. That whole “they smell nice” thing is just gravy.

  145. SL,

    I must admit that sometimes I have to stave off despair when faced by the sheer stupidity of the anti-abortion movement. The use of “fetus testimony” at a legislative hearing shows the depths of stupidity these people indulge themselves in. That it is taken seriously at all by any in that legislature, wich it is, shows the quality
    (lack of same)of our political whores.

    The reality is simple to me which is stay the hell out of women’s personal choices when it comes to abortion. The only conclusion to be made by the continuing schreeching of the anti-sexual loonies is that they hate women. This is true of both male and female anti-abortion
    activists, though perhaps for different reasons. This explanation is reinforced when these same people also seek to discontinue birth control availability and information.

    The hypocrisy of this whole movement of fools positively
    astounds when one looks at the fact that these same people, for the most part, see Sara Palin as a heroine.
    This woman’s daughter became pregnant, no doubt because her parents emphacized abstinence over birth control.
    Today Bristol is a demi-celebrity, with a memoir soon to be published and a baby which is dragged around by her mother to show off their family’s morality in not aborting the fetus.

    My parents, who were quite open about sexuality and taught me that people of both sexes had normal desires and pleasures, continually gave me the caveat of not having sex without protection, so as not to cause unwanted pregnancy. While they were dead before I became sexually active, their lessons stayed with me as an adult and there was never an unwanted pregnancy in my single life, even in situations when my partner of the
    time tried to tempt me.

    Even though this was a lesson I took to heart, I can’t view those who have unwanted pregnancies harshly. Rather than fully explaining sexuality, its’ pleasures and its’ responsibilities most adolescents are faced with silent,
    embarrassed parents, or those who preach abstinence which
    is unrealistic for teens and young adults.

    As the father of daughters, now women, I never had any great interest in my children’s sex lives. We had imbued them with a sense of ethics and responsibility, besides providing them with any needed information. My wife and I knew them well enough to trust their judgments.They’ve done very well both personally and careerwise. I never “interviewed” their boyfriends, nor concerned myself with their romantic lives as teens (if any)because
    I always thought that fathers obsessed with their daughter’s sexuality, or lack of same, were “icky” and suspect.

    The great male hypocrisy of worldwide horror at a daughter’s sexuality, is to me a reflection of old prejudice, patriarchal beliefs and inappropriate thought.
    One sees this is hypocrisy in the mid-life male slavering
    over women half their age and more. The Trophy wives of the privileged and the diminishment of women over age forty as being no longer attractive. While my sex drive
    hasn’t faltered (but it sure ain’t what it used to be),
    and were I single (God forbid)I find many women my age to be perfectly fine and appropriate as to beauty.

    Isn’t it curious that the “Bible Belt” sexualizes pre-teens and teens in beauty contests, dresses the in overtly wsexual outfits to compet and at the same time preaches abstinence? Perhaps, this resembles the ideals of Morman plural marraige types, who want to reserve the pretty, young girls for the seniors of the cult.

  146. Mike S.,
    I really like your comment about the Bible Belt and beauty pageants! It is a very telling example of religious hypocrisy and how they value women on the Right.

  147. Don’t get me started on the stupidity of beauty pageants.

    Mike, you have been in A++ form lately too.

    Just giving a nod where a nod is due.

  148. Hypocrisy is right! They sexualize little girls by putting make-up on them, teasing and spraying their hair, etc., so they look years older…and nubile. It’s disgusting.

  149. From Huffington Post (3/9/2011)
    Indiana Bill Would Force Doctors To Tell Women That Having An Abortion May Lead To Breast Cancer
    By Amanda Terkel
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/03/09/indiana-women-abortions-breast-cancer_n_833388.html

    Excerpt:
    WASHINGTON — Hundreds of protesters rallied at the Indiana statehouse on Tuesday in opposition to restrictive abortion measures that would, among other things, require doctors to tell pregnant women about a controversial theory that says having an abortion could lead to an increased risk of breast cancer.

  150. I fail to see how this is a First Amendment issue. Additionally, I’m curious as to how this differs from state legislatures nationwide are subjecting forced ultrasounds on women, and forcing doctors to disclose scientifically unverified information to women? Bueller??

    Well, at any rate, good on Mikey:

    Mayor Signs Pregnancy Center Law, Setting Stage for Abortion Battle

    By Michael Howard Saul

    Mayor Michael Bloomberg signed into law a bill that will require crisis pregnancy centers to disclose whether or not they offer abortions, a move that abortion-rights opponents vowed to challenge in court.

    After listening to critics call the legislation a violation of First Amendment rights, the mayor said he has a clear conscience in signing it. He stopped short of saying whether he thought the law would survive a legal challenge.

    “In terms of the intent of the bill, I’m not in favor of abortion — I’m in favor of a woman’s right to choose. Period,” Bloomberg said. “I have the same moral questions that I think any rational person would have. But, in the end, you have to make a decision, and I’ve always been pro-choice.”

    The new law, which takes effect in 120 days, requires all pregnancy-services centers to disclose whether they provide abortions, emergency contraception and prenatal care. Those that do not offer such services will be required to make referrals to organizations that do. The information would have to be posted in English and Spanish, both at the centers and in any advertisements.

    Bloomberg emphasized that the new law is aimed at “providing information.”

    “Whether it goes far enough and whether it should cover other kinds of institutions is something that the City Council should consider, and if there’s appropriate need for further disclosure in other cases, we should provide it,” said the mayor as he prepared to sign the bill.

    As for the legality of the new law, Bloomberg did not attempt to defend it from charges that is unconstitutional. “You can challenge it in court,” he told opponents. “If it’s constitutional or not, I just don’t know.”

    Only two critics spoke at the bill signing: Chris Slattery, president of Expectant Mother Care Frontline Pregnancy Centers, which operates about a dozen centers in the city that would be affected by the law; and Tiffany Barrans, legal director for the American Center for Law & Justice, which is preparing a legal challenge.

    Slattery said he founded his company 26 years ago, and in that time more than 40,000 girls and women have chosen “life.” He added: “The process of putting together this bill, I thought, was one of the most intolerant, unscientific, biased campaigns that I have ever seen in my life.”

    Slattery said the majority of council members refused to meet with him, and no lawmakers or members of their staffs visited one of his centers.

    “I think this bill is an attack on the weak,” Slattery said as he stood at a microphone across the room from Bloomberg. “It does not comply with justice and it does not uphold the constitution of the United States.”

    A federal judge recently struck down a similar law in Baltimore on grounds that it violated the First Amendment. But Council Member Jessica Lappin, the chief sponsor of the New York City law, said she believes her legislation is sufficiently different.

    “This bill that the mayor’s signing today is about truth in advertising,” she said. “This bill only regulates centers that are deceiving women into thinking that they are in a medical facility when they are not. And there is a real harm and danger to a woman who thinks she’s being seen by a doctor or a midwife or a nurse when she is not.”

    Lappin said she is a strong proponent of First Amendment rights. “But you do not have the right to stand in scrubs and give medically inaccurate information to a woman who is seeking unbiased health care,” she said.

    http://blogs.wsj.com/metropolis/2011/03/16/mayor-signs-pregnancy-center-law-setting-stage-for-abortion-battle/

  151. Stamford,
    It is refreshing to see the right to life crowd on the defensive. I was unaware that some so-called clinics are just their to try to “convince” women to not have an abortion.

  152. rafflaw,

    “Stamford,
    It is refreshing to see the right to life crowd on the defensive. I was unaware that some so-called clinics are just their to try to “convince” women to not have an abortion.”

    Not only is it refreshing, but it’s about time. Oh, yes! The clinics advertise as places women can seek help – medical help from medical staff – just to be bombarded with anti-choice propoganda. Abortion and birth control are not discussed as viable options; women are told birth control doesn’t work and push “scientific findings” regarding abortion that have no basis in scientific fact whatsoever. They guilt women into continuing the pregnancy with religious dogma and highly misleading information.

  153. Jesus Christ – Franklin has severe mental issues with members of the opposite sex and it appears he has company:

    Georgia Bill Would Allow Wrongful Death Suits on Behalf of Sharon Lerner
    March 16, 2011

    Meet Stacey Abrams.

    As Georgia’s House minority leader, Abrams is one of the few things standing between the women of Georgia and some of the strangest and most awful antiabortion laws we’ve ever seen. Happily, she’s also “the smartest person in the Georgia legislature,” according Leola Reis, vice president for external affairs at Planned Parenthood Southeast in Atlanta. Since she’s been in office, she’s been quick and vocal in explaining how a string of proposed abortion restrictions would affect women.

    Members of Congress—including some who oppose abortion—are beginning to see recent attempts to defund contraception for what they are: attacks on the American family.

    Abrams has her hands full. Especially today, which is “crossover day,” the last day a bill can move from either the Georgia House or Senate into the other chamber. From the way Georgia political veterans tell it, anything can happen. I believe them.

    After all, the state has already brought us a bill that would allow women who miscarry to be prosecuted. Under that gem, sponsored by Rev. Bobby Franklin, women who have miscarriages and are unable to prove there was no “human involvement” could face felony charges and life in prison.

    The only comfort I have in thinking about this ridiculous provision is that, were it to ever become law, I’m pretty sure the woman I know who has experienced nine miscarriages—each more devastating than the one before it—would personally track down Franklin and shred him.

    The good news is that Franklin’s proposal, which is blatantly unconstitutional, would outlaw all abortions as well as IVF, and has been proposed to no effect in previous years, has virtually no chance of passing.

    The bad news is that while many of us have been spending precious time and energy pondering it, abortion opponents in Georgia have been cooking up other bizarre bills, some of which now have far better chances of succeeding than Franklin’s.

    Enter Georgia State Senator Barry Loudermilk, the author of what may be the strangest antiabortion bill to come out of Georgia yet, which is really saying something. I’ve been calling his most recent proposal the sue-if-you’re-displeased-with-her-choice bill. (It doesn’t have a better name yet, since, as far as I can tell, it’s the first of its kind to reach a legislative body.)

    Loudermilk’s bill, which is being considered today, would allow a woman—or the members of her own family, including an abusive husband—to file a wrongful death lawsuit against a doctor who has performed an abortion. The bill spells out that the damages for the wrongful death of the fetus would be equal to those for an adult person. And it would allow the suits even if the doctors involved followed all laws regarding abortion and if the women involved don’t consent to the suit. [Editor’s note: Loudermilk’s bill, SB 210, passed through Georgia’s senate in the evening of March 16, and now moves to the state’s House.]

    Loudermilk is the same legislator who recently did a bait-and-switch at a hearing at which legislators were supposed to be considering a fetal pain bill and suddenly found themselves considering a bill that would have shut all abortion clinics in the state by requiring that all abortions be performed in hospitals.

    That bill, thankfully, was tabled. But just in time for Crossover Day, he’s come up with the sue-if-you’re-displeased bill, something he managed to get passed out of the Senate’s rules committee only by getting some freshman representative who isn’t on the committee and had no idea what he was talking about to be present so he could have a quorum. The bill then went on to the next step of the legislative process with only a few minutes of discussion.

    Here’s hoping that Georgia legislators will soon give it a lengthier review and stop it from going further.

    These days, there seems to be an overabundance of guys like Franklin and Loudermilk, who push the legislative envelope to inflict their vision on women. (Here, just for fun, I’m making them so tiny you can barely see their ties.)

    But, over the past weeks, I’ve also been watching amazing legislators push back against this wave of extremists. So, since this is my last post on the subject for now, I want to end by recognizing just a few: Texas Representative Sheila Jackson Lee, who challenged Arizona Representative Trent Frank’s statement that pro-choice legislators support “killing children;” Wisconsin Democrat Gwen Moore, who testified about becoming a mother at 18; and California’s Jacky Speier, who spoke about the end of her own pregnancy.

    There are, thankfully, many more, including some who will surely fight back in this afternoon’s hearing on the Smith and Pitts bills in the House Ways and Means Committee. So, to them, Stacey Abrams and everyone else taking on the wackos for the rest of us, thanks. And happy crossover day!

    http://www.thenation.com/blog/159260/georgia-bill-would-allow-wrongful-death-suits-behalf-fetuses?rel=emailNation

  154. Stamford,
    Georgia is fast becoming the Arizona of the SouthEast. The inmates have taken over the mental hospital. This latest sue the doctor bill is one more example of the American Taliban. They are real and they are here and they are pushing to bring us to a rule of law based on their bible.

  155. rafflaw,

    Exactly. I don’t see any difference between the Christian fundies and the Islamic fundies … they are ALL bat-shit crazy.

    “The inmates have taken over the mental hospital.”

    As I was typing the intro to the article, I was thinking about padded rooms and white buckled jackets … thanks for voicing what I didn’t!

  156. whoops maybe socialized medicine isn’t such a good thing after all. You do know that is what will happen under socialized medicine if the moral majority ever have a majority.

    And I will be laughing my ass off. Yes there is a war on women being waged by both the Christian right and the left.

    The right and the left pushed for the Patriot Act and now look what we have. The left pushed for socialized medicine and look what we are going to get. The assault on individual rights from both the left and the right is never ending. And all because you yoyo’s don’t like free markets, unbelievable.

    So we have the right in our bedrooms and the left in our wallets. Maybe you will both kill each other off and the rest of us can live free and in peace. Nah, it’s too much to hope for. What will probably happen is you will join forces and create a totalitarian state. We are almost there now.

  157. Maury, what the hell has that IRS thing got to do with socialized medicine? That has to with the anti-choice/anti-abortion crowd trying to make life miserable for women, whether they seek an abortion or not. This insane legislation will not pass, of course, but if it did, more and more doctors would say to hell with it and go to the house.

    FYI, all medicine is socialized to one degree or another. Many doctors would not be able to stay in practice if they did not take Medicare and Medicaid patients. If it were not for those socialist programs, one of two things would happen. When you got sick and went to the doctor, there would be an “Out of Business” sign on the door. Or, conversely, as you left the office visit fee would be about five or six times as much as you are used to paying. I know about these things. We are a family of doctors and health care professionals. This is a dinner table topic.

  158. Speaking of medicine and insurance, here is what happens when regulation of the industry is suspended. Representative Brian Clem’s mother-in-law, Mrs. Suzuki, testified before Rep. Chip Shield;s committee about her experience with her insurance company. Seem that Regence Blue Cross Blue Shield of Oregon has decided that she is dead. She testified that she is not dead yet. Regence denied her major medical claim on the basis that she was dead. For seven years she gave the insurer evidence that she is not dead and they still wouldn’t pay.

    The meaty part of the testimony starts halfway throgh this fifteen minute video, at about 8:30.

    For all those who would rely on voluntary compliance with companies like this, be careful what you wish for. You might be dead and not know it.

  159. raff, One has to admire Rep. Clem’s forbearance, but I am afraid I would have been in the courthouse on this long ago. I am not particularly forgiving about stuff like this.

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