There is a controversial shooting in South Carolina this week after York County deputy, Terrence Knox, shot Bobby Canipe, 70, during a routine traffic stop when Canipe reached for his cane. Knox said that he thought it was a rifle and his department is calling him justified in the shooting. Canipe (left) is a disabled Vietnam veteran.
The stop was for an expired license tag near the small town of Clover, South Carolina. After pulling over, Canipe got out and reached into this truck bed for his cane. Knox proceeded to fire multiple rounds and hit Canipe once.
York County sheriff’s spokesman Trent Faris has called the shooting “very unfortunate” but added that “[i]t does appear, at this time, that Deputy Knox’s actions were an appropriate response to what he reasonably believed to be an imminent threat to his life.”
Well, at this time, I would have to disagree. It would appear that an officer fired without a clear view of the alleged weapon or time for the suspect to drop the weapon. Moreover, I assume that, when reaching for a cane, you do show with one hand — an awkward position to use a long-barreled rifle. However, I would like to read the officer’s account and see the results of the investigation.
The matter will be investigated and I would have preferred that the department not issue such a statement before the full facts are determined.
Such shootings raise comparisons with other countries where police use potentially lethal force at a much lower rate.
Source: Washington Post
The next step for the police will be to trash the shooting victim as “combative.”
As Professor Turley mentions it would be good to have the full report on this before we make absolute conclusions here. Here are a couple of facts that might give an insight into what is faced on such a situation with the police.
It is very important to understand how little time officers have to make in situations, this one probably included. Yout DON’t have the option of sitting back and making a reconsideration, to do wrong can end the officer’s life or someone elses. I am showing these two videos to help foster an understanding of how short the time is to decide what to do and hopfully get it right.
A person getting out of a car upon being pulled over can be a dangerous thing. A great number of officers are killed by people coming out of cars and drawing weapons on the police. It is not an unusual situation where of these situations a person has pulled out a rifle and then began shooting at the officers. The officer has to make essentially a quick decision and his or her life is on the line for making the wrong decision.
Given this one has to look at the information available to the officer at the time of the shooting. We don’t know if the lighting conditions were bad or how quickly the man here retrieved his cane. Yes I know it was an older man and he had a cane not a rifle,. It might be helpful to understand what is out there before drawing conclusions quickly. Nobody is arguing this was a tradgedy but consider these two videos. They are very indicative of what police face with the time they have to consider the situation. A cane can resemble a rifle yes and no but it is key to focus on all the situation as is going to be in the final report in order to pass an appropriate judgement either way.
These videos can be upsetting but since we are talking about police shootings nothing about them isn’t.
The first video is of a traffic stop in Montana. Here the suspect walked back to his pickup, drew a shotgun and exchanged with the trooper. It seems trooper was hit twice. The trooper died as a result of this shooting. Notice the amount of time between when the suspect grabbed the shotgun and the shootout ensued:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eSxuhZ3HdQo
Now in this video of a traffic stop for running a stop sign the suspect pulls out an AK-47 and wildly begins firing. One officer only has enough time to yell out RUN. The suspect continues to fire at officer and point his rifle at officers despite being hit multiple times, even as he is crouched down. Two officers were wounded.
WARNING: THIS VIDEO MIGHT BE DISTURBING AS IT DEPICTS A SHOOTOUT BETWEEN OFFICERS AND A SUSPECT ATTEMPTING TO MURDER THEM. THE SUSPECT PERISHES IN THE VIDEO.
I have dereferenced the hyperlink
Darren, thanks for the videos. It certainly has made me rethink this situation.
There was a time when the best and brightest of scientists did not understand that the sun is approximately at the mass centroid of the solar system, partly because they also did not understand that there was a solar system as a small part of the local galaxy, partly because they did not understand that there was a local galaxy.
However, the times were a-changin’…”
There was a time when the best and brightest of scientists did not understand that the sun works mainly in the manner of a nuclear fusion reactor.
However, the times were a-changin’…”
There was a time when the best and brightest of scientists did not understand the social causation of addiction.
However, the times were a-changin’…”
There was a time when the best and brightest of scientists did not understand enough theoretical biology and enough applied theoretical biology to be able to solve the enigma of human destructive violence.
However, the times are now a-changin’…
Until humanity disenthralls itself from the viciously addictive errors of its past ignorance, the times may be a-changin’ at much slower than a deceased snail’s pace.
Perhaps it takes one of the worst and dimmest of scientists to understand the errors of past human ignorance.
When I was born, in 1939, serious to severe forms of mental impairment were of three scientific categories (see William S. Sadler, Theory and Practice of Psychiatry, C. V. Mosby, 1936):
Moron: I.Q. from 50 to 70
Imbecile: I.Q. from 30 to 50
Idiot: I.Q. below 30
In the spring of 1989, under the care of the best and brightest of scientific medical-model psychiatrists, I had developed an iatrogenic dementia that clearly put me in the oriented-times-zero realm of 1939 scientific jargon of that of a low-grade idiot.
In that manner, I learned to understand, through actually lived experience, what it is like to be, in 1930s psychiatric parlance, a genuine moron, a genuine imbecile, and a genuine idiot. My experiences with being a moron, an imbecile, and an idiot have given me a way to find no fault whatsoever with people who are, in any way at all, functionally in the moron, imbecile, or idiot realm.
On my fiftieth birthday, in 1989, courtesy of an iatrogenic dementia, I was far less functional than I was at on my fifth birthday, in 1944. I suppose that would make my I.Q. on my fiftieth birthday less than 10.
I sometimes imagine that I had to become exceptionally stupid before I could really understand exceptional stupidity.
hahahahah this logic is silly! im tired of these type of cases. http://tinyurl.com/lk25rt4
I wonder if Mr. Canipe while serving in the armed forces during the Vietnam war was wounded in action or if he had to wait 40 some odd years to be shot and wounded by the frightened and timid folk comprising the York County, South Carolina, sheriffs department?
In reading some of the police apologist comments above it would seem as if everything under the sun is responsible for Mr. Canipe being gunned down but the frightened deputy who shot first and asked questions later.
So much for rudimentary firearms training at the York County sheriffs department, so very professional.
Pretzel logic.
on 1, February 27, 2014 at 1:06 pmdavidm2575
So tired of hearing about these cases. Why can’t a police officer’s first reaction be to take cover if he is afraid?
Yes, that is what those who shoot people and seek to exonerate themselves under Stand Your Ground laws should do too.
Simms
No, not at all. Maybe on a rack behind the seat, or in a case behind the seat. But in an open bed? Great way for it to get stolen, or damaged from sliding around.
Cops are brutal ignorant beasts
Just out of curiosity, would any of you gun owners on this site keep a gun in the open bed of a pickup truck?
Regarding the 95 year old Illinois man killed by police firing beanbag rounds, here’s an update:
http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2014-01-31/news/ct-kass-met-0131-20140131_1_john-wrana-park-forest-police-riot-shield
…or young Keith Vidal
For the average, law abiding citizen in the USA, the most lethally dangerous element we have is the police.
Still no justice for John Wrana.
Perhaps the police should get to know the citizens whom they protect. If that’s impossible, best is to properly defense and I don’t mean firing at will. Any car could be equipped with bullet-proof material….it isn’t an exorbitant amount of money, nor science fiction.
Turley nails this one. It’s difficult to see how this shooting could be appropriate. Shouldn’t officer have been able to distinguish between a rifle and a cain? Shouldn’t officer if he thought it was a rifle yell for the guy to put it down? Maybe the fact will end up supporting the officer, but it’s far from obvious, and the police spokesperson makes it look like cops are either going to cover up or are pre judging any investigation by declaring the shooting was appropriate.
To everyone who feels sorry for the police and excuses their jumpiness….. My advice to the police is …
#1 Get another job
#2 Wear lots of protective gear
#3 Send a robot with remote camera to give out the ticket
#4 Don’t bother people for trivia
#5 Demand better working conditions see #4 Police are used for dumb purposes
Bobby Canipe got shot for no good reason !
99guspuppet
Psychopaths are drawn to places they can use as a front.
Gang mentality police forces that “protect their own” are sought after.
“Experience has shown that even under the best forms of government those entrusted with power have, in time, and by slow operations, perverted it into tyranny.” – Thomas Jefferson
“Men have brought their powers of subduing the forces of nature to such a pitch that by using them they could now very easily exterminate one another to the last man. They know this –hence arises a great part of their current unrest, their dejection, their mood of apprehension.” – Sigmund Freud
Too bad Bobby Canipe has to be the poster child for police over-reaction. As these incidents pile up , people will demand changes and will also realize how dangerous encounters with the police can be. 99guspuppet
I would like to see ALL officers involved in shooting, tazing and beatings be tested for steroids.
silly citizens, all shootings are justified.
This was a 70 year old disabled veteran. If this officer couldn’t outshoot this guy then clearly the officer needs more training as is evidenced by his poor marksmanship.