Below is my column on Fox.com on the demand for roughly a $455 million dollar deposit or equivalent bond for Donald Trump to be able to seek appellate review of the recent judgment against him. The combination of the fine and the deposit rule highlight the confiscatory elements of this judgment.
Here is the column:
In the wake of the massive judgment against Donald Trump, many in New York are celebrating the prospect that the former president could be forced to sell off his property just to be able to appeal the $355 million judgment against him. While Trump has good grounds to object to this excessive fine, he still has to come up with close to a half billion dollars just to make his arguments to the New York Court of Appeals.
In order to file an appeal, the courts require a deposit for the full amount of the damages or a bond covering the full amount. Even with escrow options, the call for cash or collateral can be enough to put some executives in a fetal position.
It can be challenging enough for many companies drained from years of litigation. For Donald Trump, the demand for $355 million plus $100 milion in interest could force a fire sale on properties to pony up just the deposit.
Many of us have been critical of the ruling of Manhattan Supreme Court Justice Arthur Engoron who imposed the astronomical fine despite finding that Trump’s “victims” not only did not lose a single dollar but made handsome profits. Indeed, these banks testified that they wanted to continue to do business with Trump as a “whale” client, but Engoron is now barring them from doing so.
Putting aside the merits of this judgment, the threshold deposit rule magnifies the unfairness of this New York law that does not require that anyone actually lose money to claim hundreds of millions from a company.
One can argue that, if upheld, any insolvency is the fault of the company. However, this rule can force insolvency just to seek review of a judgment.
For Trump, even this fine would only amount to roughly 14-17% of his wealth. The addition of the recent $83.3 million in damages imposed in a separate New York courtroom for defamation would bring the demand to over half a billion dollars in deposits with interest.
So, by making the fine so large, Engoron not only makes an appeal difficult, but could guarantee that Trump will lose tens of millions even if his judgment is dramatically reduced or tossed out.
On top of this looming penalty, however, he already owes the writer E. Jean Carroll $83.3 million in damages from a separate defamation case that concluded in January. His legal fees are also mounting as he battles four criminal cases at the federal and state level.
There is already speculation of whether Trump will have to leverage or sell his iconic properties at distressed prices. He has 30-days to ante up with the court and buyers could use that deadline to their advantage. The added amount is due to another New York provision imposing a massive 9 percent interest rate on judgments.
That means that every day, Trump is being hit by roughly $90,000 in just interest increases.
Trump could secure a bond, but such a guaranty would come at its own premium price. However, a bonding company requires a defendant to put up 10% for the total and would lose that amount even if he prevailed. That is a roughly $45 million cost just to secure the right to an appeal. In this case, the cost could be higher given the judgment and the bar on Trump doing business for three years in New York.
Trump can move to ask the trial court (or the appellate court) to allow him to proceed without posting the money or bond. That, however, is up to the courts in granting an exception.
The expectation is that Trump can make the deposit or secure a bond to avoid what some gleefully called a “fire sale” on this properties. The deposit is now being celebrated as an added indignity and penalty.
However, as New Yorkers cheer this moment, many business are likely wondering “but for the grace of God go I.” Undervaluing or overvaluing property is a common practice, particularly in real estate. That is why representations, like the one made by the Trump Corporation, come with a warning that estimates are their own and that the banks need to make their assessments.
Faced with high crime and high taxes, the spectacle in Manhattan is only likely to accelerate the exodus of businesses and high-earners from the city. That prospect has already alarmed Gov. Kathy Hochul who declared “business people have nothing to worry about, because they’re very different than Donald Trump and his behavior.”
That sounds a lot like “you are fine so long as you are not Trump.” Yet, that is not reassuring to businesses who want a legal system that is based on something other than selective and arbitrary enforcement. Attorney General Letitia James campaigned on bagging Trump without even bothering to name the offense. She also sought to dissolve the National Rifle Association.
The line between doing business and a public execution appears to be the dubious discretion of Letitia James.
That is not the type of assurance that most businesses would accept in risking billions in investment. Despite the high taxes and falling services in New York, the city remained a draw for business as a commercial and legal center. The experience and objectivity of courts in dealing with business disputes was a selling point for companies.
That has been shattered by the James campaign and the Engoron ruling. Telling business to just “don’t be like Trump” is more menacing than consoling. Letitia James is now the face of New York corporate law — it is the “face that launched a thousand ships” . . . toward Florida. Businesses can get lower taxes, lower crime, better schools, and a better regulatory environment in virtually any other state. Fewer are likely to want to come for the shows, but stay for the disgorgement.
Shark Tank’s Kevin O’Leary said Monday that he would “never” invest in New York after this absurd judgment.
Creating an ad hoc business code for Trump undermines the city’s reputation as a premier jurisdiction for corporate and tax law. If the rate of exit increases, it will impact not just employees working for these companies (like the Trump companies) but the vast network of supporting businesses, including law firms.
As New York politicians campaigning on “eat the rich” platforms, the confiscatory Trump judgment leaves many in the city wondering if they could be the next course.
Half of Turley’s posts are “waah, the legal system is so hard on Trump it is unfair.”
The other half are “waah, the legal system goes so easy on Hunter and Joe it is unfair.” (These used to be “waah, the legal system goes so easy on Hillary it is unfair.”)
Occasionally we get something like “waah, election deniers and other liars are being silenced”
Heathcliffe your brains are made of coprolite.
No, his brains are NOT made of “coprolite”! They are made of “coproheavy”! 🙂
You forgot the new invading force of leftists doing what leftists do.
Find a civilized location and turn it to a sh!thole. That is all they do.
If you had any degree of critical thinking skills and objectivity, you would see this for the sham that it is.
Had this been Hillary Clintion, and the Republicans were going after her in the same way, with DAs running on “Get Hillary,” a obviously biased judge who was out to “Get Hillary,” changing the SOL laws to “Get Hillary,” I would say the same.
This is banana republic level stuff.
Lead by the DNC.
Professor Turley, you say:
Many of us have been critical of the ruling of Manhattan Supreme Court Justice Arthur Engoron who imposed the astronomical fine despite finding that Trump’s “victims” not only did not lose a single dollar but made handsome profits.
Unless I am mistaken, the lenders were victims in the sense that overvaluing the assets gave the illusion of less risk and thus less interest charge. So, although it is true that the lenders may not have “lost” money and may have earned some interest, they did not earn as much interest as they might (that’s have a fuzz word) had the overvaluations not affected their assessment of risk and thus required interest. I think that is what the Judge found. So the banks and their stakeholders (shareholders, depositors, etc.) were victims in an economic sense.
The problem here is that the “victims” themselves said they placed absolutely no reliance on valuations that came
from the Trump Org. Those values did not lead to lower interest rates. By the purported victim’s own testimony
“the “victims” themselves said they placed absolutely no reliance on valuations that came from the Trump Org” is false.
It’s good to be anonymous. No one can associate this idiotic claim with your person. Not that you care but the banks have good lawyers who can sue for damages if they are harmed. So why is it necessary for a morally-bankrupt politician conspire with a corrupt NYC judge to sue in place of the bank and gain half a billion for NYC? It isn’t necessary unless you’re corrupt and stupid.
The banks decide to loan or not and manage their risk. With pretty much any amount, but certainly at these amounts, the banks do their own evaluations. Professional appraisers are used on both sides. This is how business is done. The banks make the final decision whether to loan the money or not. The banks were happy and there is no victim. So it’s a totally BS argument that ‘they might have made more interest’. That is a hypothetical and not reality and pure speculation. Business cannot be done this way and this is way to much uncertainty. Who will want to risk billions in New York now? Who knows when the bells will toll for them!
What you ;said would be true if the lenders only relied on Trump’s values. Like Professor Turley pointed out, the lenders had their own appraisers whose values would have been used in approving the loans. The lenders were dealing with real estate assets whose values can vary widely depending on who is doing the appraising. Also, I have heard it said that there are more than one set of values for one property, e.g., loan vs. tax purposes. This is very common because the tax appraisal of a property used for property taxes and determined by the taxing authority is often less than the fair market value of the property. If you own your own property, just check the value that your property tax is based on and see if it’s the same as the current fair market value of the property. Personally, the appraised value set by our county is about one-half of the actual value of our home.
I think the “lost interest” argument is the hat the judgment is hung on. But, in order to assert that you have to assume that sophisticated banking entities simply took the loan seekers word for the value of his assets, That is insane. The lenders made their own assessments and testified that they were happy with the results For the NY DA and Judge Engoron to impose their own assessment is govt run amok.
Poor Anon,
You have no clue about banking or commercial loans.
DB testified that they wanted to do business w Trump.
Their risk model is their risk model.
The only material thing that they relied on is Trump’s list of the real estate used for collateral.
They did their own due diligence. It could include a title trace, along w their own valuation of the properties.
Trump could say that they were worth 2B. The bank could come back and say they were worth 1B and used that for their risk model.
Then added in intangibles. Like the added on business opportunities that having Trump as a client brought in.
So no, they lost nothing but gained from the transaction.
Note that the material information was the list of properties that Trump said he owned. Did he own them?
Then there’s no misrepresentation.
Did he frame them in the best possible light in order to get a high estimate? Absolutely.
But that’s part of the deal making process.
-G
Today I venture into Friedrich Nietzsche ‘Daybreak’: Book IV#248: “Dissimulation as a duty- Goodness has mostly been developed by the protracted dissimulation which sought to appear as goodness: wherever great power existed men saw the necessity for precisely this kind of dissimulation-it inspired a feeling of trust and security and multiplied the sum of actual physical power a hundred-fold. The lie is, if not the mother, then the nurse of goodness. Honesty has likewise been reared mostly by the requirement to seem honest: it happened within the hereditary aristocracies. What is dissimulated for a long time at last becomes nature: dissimulation in the end sublimates itself, and organs and instincts are the surprising fruit of the garden of hypocrisy.”
And on more item for the same publication: Number 358: “Grounds and their groundlessness- You dislike him and present many grounds for this dislike-but I believe only in your dislike, not in your grounds! You flatter yourself in your own eyes when you suggest to yourself and to me that what has happened through instinct is the result of a process of reasoning.”
When reckoning happens, and it will, these New York legal Beagles should be pilloried and hoisted on their own (petard)- hung with their own rope)!
Additionally, an example of the futile efforts to bring down President Trump from ‘Tobacco Road’” by Erskine Caldwell.
“Jeeter scraped up a lager pile of leaves, set it on fire, and began tossing sticks on it. The fire burned briskly for several minutes, and then went out under the weight of the green wood.
Jeeter stood looking at it, sadly. He did not know how to make it burn. Then Dude drew some gasoline from the tank and poured it on the pile. A great blaze sprang up ten or twelve feet into the air. Before long that too dies down, leaving a pile of blackened sticks in the ditch.
Well, I reckon that’s all I can do to that damn-blasted blackjack, Jeeter said, getting into the car. It looks like there ain’t no way to get rid of the durn wood. It won’t sell and it won’t burn. I reckon the devil got into it”.
Usually the columns of Squire Turley are extraordinarily astute and edifying. But quite often the key to a good day following the read is to avoid most of the comments, which have become loaded with trolls and legal wannabees showing what they read elsewhere. Every third or fourth comment can cause dyspepsia.
I can not speak for the trolls and shills, but personally, if I say something stupid, incorrect, ignorant or flatulence-inducing, please let me know. I am happy to learn new things, and I do not mind admitting when I am wrong! Like Robinson Crusoe said to Friday, “Gladly would I learn and gladly teach!”
If you say anything flatulence-inducing, we’ll be sure to let you know!
Thank you! Just no gaslighting, please! 🙂
Although the cost may be high to the Trump family, the cost to the people and our constitutional republic is much, much greater.
With any luck the cost to New York State will be much higher.
Hochul is already trying to paper over the oozing abscess. She only made it worse by making clear that if they don’t like you, if you are ‘special’ they will try to crush you. New York doesn’t even seem part of America now.
Didn’t her predecessor tell conservatives to leave the state?
Edwardmahl,
Oh, she did too.
We’ve come full circle from the past days of the American Revolution as the practices of the King of England are being played out in NY.
Not sure why my comment appears to have fallen thru the cracks.
@Turley,
You can say those two magic little words.
“Election Interference”.
Consider that James ran on a ‘Get Trump’ campaign pledge.
( I’m sure someone has a YouTube post of her campaign speech…)
But now we have Gov. Houchul now trying to do damage control. Kevin O’Leary makes a good case why businesses should flee NYC and NY.
In her statements… covered by Journalists including the Guardian… Houchul tries to calm business men that unlike Trump they have nothing to fear.
Trump is a crook, and that a Judge found him so… Yet … James charged Trump with what many in the business world know to be standard practice.
(O’Leary’s comments are spot on and hit home.)
The message from Houchul gets to the point. Unless your name is Donald Trump, you have nothing to fear about the state going after you.
Now lets focus on that.
Houchul changed a law so that a woman can make an allegation of a rape that occurred years ago, where there is no evidence and she can’t even remember any of the actual details…. just so she could get Trump.
Now you have James campaigning to get Trump and does.
Asks for millions in an excessive fine. Gets it and more…
Then you have the Governor tell everyone that its ok, as long as your name isn’t Trump, come to NY to do business?
All because Trump is running for POTUS.
If that’s not election interference… please tell me what is?
BTW, didn’t James go and take a meeting at the WH?
(Asking for a friend)
One also has to ask if SCOTUS can step in on this… if your information about NY requiring the penalty to be paid before one can appeal.
-G
Just to add…
Turley does point what I said in his blog post.
The only thing Turley doesn’t say that this use of lawfare is election interference.
Now why is that?
He did mention that Trump could make a request that the court grant him an exception but based on the bold actions of Engoron, do you think the courts would do that?
-G
This country has paid a staggering cost from Trump’s incompetency in his mismanagement of COVID and of his total lack of respect of law. And now Turley’s worried about his money. Don’t worry Turley he’s conning with sneakers now.
This country is still staggering the cost of the Biden lockdowns, the Bidenflation, the Bidenomics, we are closer to WWIII since the Cuban missile crisis and we are seeing the very real de-dollarization due to the incompetence of the Biden foreign policy.
The first three are going to take years if not a decade to undo no matter who is president.
We can only hope and pray Biden does not get us into a shooting WWIII.
That last one, to big, too much momentum to stop.
Useful idiot..
Got any facts? USA infection and death rates vs. comparable other nations would work. Or consideration of the fast track vax, and it’s value in combatting the disease. There are a lot of data, and a lot of “well, nobody really knew what we were dealing with at first” to be considered. A simple conclusory statement convinces of nothing.
Honestly you are STILL ranting stupidly about Covid ?
Lets see – not a single covid policy actually worked.
Further the actual majority of epidemiologists as opposed to government health officials as well as decades of data told us these interventions would not work.
And you somehow blame trump for the impossible ?
3 times as many peoplehave died from Covid under Biden than under Trump.
Further covid has become endemic – i.e. we will ALWAYS be stuck with it BECAUSE of the failed efforts to “manage covid”
Where is the 1918 Flu ? Gone forever. Why ? Because we allowed it to burn through the world quickly and we developed herd immunity which resulted in it dying off quickly.
Where are the myriads of other Flus that have come and gone – or are you so stupid as to think that it is the same flu that we see each year ?
Masks did not work
Lockdowns caused far more harm than good.
Even washing out hans and hand sanitizer did not work.
One of the major problems with contageous diseases – is that efforts to control them that fall short – MAKE THEM WORSE.
When it was revealed in Nov 2020 that the C19 vaccines were at best 90% effective, and that they had a half life of 6-9 months it was self evident that mass vaccination would make things WORSE not better.
In Nov. 2020 Delta was out which had a Transmission ration of 3.8-5. That would require a vaccine that was 99.95% effective and a global vaccination program that could be completed in less time than it would take for immunity amoung the vaccinated to decline by 0.5%.
Alternately it would require and absolute zero tolerance quarantine between fully vaccinated regions and partially vaccinated regions and between partially vaccinated regions and unvaccinated regions – something that has never been done before – and likely is impossible. A single infected person coming in contact with large numbers of vaccinate people after the effectiveness of the vaccine hd declined SLIGHTLY – would defeat the entire vaccination program.
Math is beyon you left wing nut nitwits.
The mathematics of the spread of diseases is well known and easy to model. Though I find it odd that the spophisticated models at los Almost and the Imperial College did WORSE than what an ordinary person can do with an excel spread sheet.
The spread of contageous diseases is EXACTLY the same as a computer program that anyone studying computer science is required to write at some point – “the game of live”.
Historically we have NEVER come close to stopping an airborne virus.
Humans have only ever eradicated ONE virus once it became endemic – Small pox.
Small pox has a low transmission rate, it is spread by coughing and sneezing – actual airborne transmission is rare, and difficult. The vaccines against smallpox are highly effective and have a half life of nearly 75 years
We are close to eradicating polio
Polio was spread through contact with fecal matter and that can be disrupted.
Polio has a low transmission rate and the vaccine is highly effective and has a half life of decades.
The original Covid had a transmission rate more than double that of the Flu – doubling the transmission rate exponentially increases the spread of the disease, and exponentially increases the degree of effectiveness of the measures needed to stop it.
All of the things that were tried to stop covid were with near mathematical certainty NOT going to work.
Masks have not ever worked against the flu – which is typically spread by droplets covid is airborn.
It was obvious to anyone with a brain that noting short of a N95 mask stood ANY chance of working – and the data strongly suggested N95 masks were not good enough.
Yet idiots like you want to blame trump for failing to do the impossible.
Trump DOES deserve some blame – but not for the Covid deaths – but for the mess that was made of the economy and all the other problems associated with our stupid efforts to thwart covid. These efforts assured that Covid would become endemic, while causing economic and societal harms that have killed 3 times as many pople as Covid.
For reference – 3 times as many people died from Covid whil Biden has been president.
The money worked. Not for us, but for Joe’s students and some other favorites. They’re still handing it out with no idea where it all went. There’s been no accounting for who got and who should not have. The payments to employers were rife with fraud with little in the way of repercussions.
Floyd, Trump kept saying the reason he wasn’t releasing his tax returns was because they were under audit, He promised to release them as soon as the audit was finished. When his tax returns were finally released, they revealed he didn’t pay any federal income taxes for 11 out of 18 years.
Which shows Mitt Romney was right when he said “There is only one logical explanation for Mr. Trump’s refusal to release his returns: There is a bombshell in them. Given Mr. Trump’s equanimity with other flaws in his history, we can only assume it’s a bombshell of unusual size.”
Are there any errors or even falsehoods in those returns?
It’s hard to know.
“In 2016, for example, when he paid just $750 in federal income taxes, he reported $30 million in earnings but also $60 million in losses. The big question is whether those losses are legitimate. “It’s the elephant in the room,” said Steve Rosenthal, a senior fellow at the Tax Policy Center. It’s hard to tell because it appears those losses began in years that predate the returns Democrats received. Rosenthal said lawmakers made a mistake in not demanding more of Trump’s filings from previous years, when the losses were first claimed. …
“There are multiple instances in which Trump may be improperly deducting money spent on personal activities and hobbies as business expenses. JCT says it found many filings that are used to report streams of income where his earnings and expenses exactly matched, or where there was no reported income at all — a sign of potential improper mingling of expenses. … It also found Trump deducting expenses — $342,182 in 2020 — for a single family home deemed a rental property that had no income associated with it. …
“in 2018 he claimed a foreign tax credit for paying $1.3 million to other governments. … The question here is whether those are legit. The IRS should be asking to see the receipts, says JCT. …”
https://www.politico.com/news/2022/12/22/red-flags-trump-taxes-00075198a
you need to show your work.
Have you ever heard of a “Net Operating Loss Carry Forward”. Look it up.
I did not write Trump’s statement for him. If he said it was because of the audit, then so be it. Maybe it was, in whole or in part. I don’t know. Personally, my OPINION is what I said, that it would only provide a ton of complicated financial issues, that most people do not understand, and would be easily spun, and falsely.
IIRC, one “lying spin” back then was, “Crooked Trump kept two sets of books!”
To the average Boobus Americanus, that would sound shocking, even criminal. But to a knowledgeable person, everybody keeps two sets of books or even more. It is both legal, and necessary, particularly when some forms of allowable tax depreciation is not GAAP allowable.
But a person like you, a paid shill, might start off saying it, “Trump keeps two sets of books!” because it was in your script, and you didn’t know any better, but even after you were corrected, multiple times, you would continue to say it. Because the truth is not in you, and you do not truly believe that you have an immortal soul. A person like you, thinks that is nonsense, so you think that you can lie and deceive with impunity. Who knows? Maybe you are right and God was actually an ancient alien, and the 10 Commandments are actually just a social construct, like gender. But I do not think so, and if the Hindus are right, I do not wish my soul to come back in the body of a dung beetle. Or, if there is a heaven, I do not want the other souls there to look at my soul fish-eyed, because I was a lying political shill. Or, if there is a Hell, I do not want to spend my time there in a cell with Joseph Goebbels.
Take it easy. There’s worse things than winding up a fish-eyed dung beetle.
Hillary said Trump didn’t pay no taxes all the way back in the 2016 debates .. . and Trump shot back: that makes me smart.
*and, so, a star was born.
Yes, I guess there are things lower than dung beetles. I could come back as Paul Begala. Shudder.
“There is a bombshell in them. Given Mr. Trump’s “
Trump’s taxes were released illegally and the bombshell was that Trump told the truth. His returns were honest. Those who made claims of illegality were proven wrong as usual.
The Detroitization of the nation and gaza and ukraine continues. Go dems!!!
Please clarify, Mr. Turley, since you did not cite any New York law requiring security for perfecting an appeal. I think that 45 can appeal regardless, he just cannot obtain a stay of enforcement via a writ of supersedeas without bond or collateral. https://suretyone.com/new-york-appeal-bond-supersedeas-bond And, of course, 45 is no stranger to Chapter 11, which allows for an automatic stay of enforcement, without any bond whatsoever. This is the kind of misleading “Opinion” piece that may play well to the NY Post readers or Fox viewers but fails any cursory scrutiny.
Yes, Professor Turley incorrectly states the law. Trump need not file a bond to appeal this judgement. The appeal bond stays collection efforts, it is not a prerequisite to taking the appeal.
This is a unique statute, with unique language. Such as there is no need for fraud, or an injured party. So I’m taking our host take on this, until I see a consensus form. This statute was designed to punish unscrupulus lenders. It has never been used to punish the borrower.
You are correct, Paul. Jonathan is usually very good, but this is a bad swing and miss. Anyone can appeal without a bond; the bond is required to stay the judgment pending appeal.
(Source: I do judgment enforcement in NY for a living — big judgments, eight figures minimum. You don’t hire my firm to chase the town deadbeat.)
@Paul M.
Ok… lets follow what you just said.
Trump can file Chapter 11, but while that could stave off the penalties…
What do you think would happen to his election?
The MSM still in the bag for Biden would have a field day trashing Trump.
This appears to be a well laid plan…
-G
Come on, Jonathan, Trump has a rich history with insolvency. He’s declared bankruptcy 6 times. When he filed for Chapter 11 with Trump Taj Mahal, the casino had nearly $3 billion in debt & Trump had $900 million in personal liabilities.
Trump is the only billionaire in history who relied on $50 million in donations from his supporters to cover his legal bills. Every week, he asks for more small dollar donations from his loyal supporters to cover his expenses. And let’s not forget that while he was President, Trump paid millions of dollars to high priced attorneys to stop the American public from seeing his tax returns. Why was Trump so panicked at the disclosure of his tax returns, JT?
Time for Turley to get back to exploring the $200,000 loan repayment Joe Biden received from his brother in 2018. And “the disclosure that a trusted FBI informant had conveyed an alleged bribe worth millions, paid to Joe Biden by a Ukrainian businessman.”
Come on, Jonathan, Trump has a rich history with insolvency. He’s declared bankruptcy 6 times.
Donald Trump never declared Bankruptcy
He’s never declared personal bankruptcy. But had declared business bankruptcy.
Was he on the caption?
DJT has never declared bankruptcy.
The number of bankruptcies compared to all others showed that Trump’s record of bankruptcy was rare. Why do you fools focus on your own misinformation”
Trump’s companies filed for bankruptcies 6 times. In July 1991, Trump’s Taj Mahal filed for bankruptcy & Trump gave up half his personal stake in the casino and sold his yacht and airline.
Within a year of his first Chapter 11 filing, Trump found himself in bankruptcy court again for Trump Castle. In March 1992, the Castle filed a prepackaged bankruptcy plan, and Trump gave up his 50 percent share in the casino for lower interest rates on $338 million worth of bonds.
The Plaza Hotel in New York, declared bankruptcy in 1992 after amassing debt. Trump Hotels and Casinos Resorts filed for bankruptcy again in 2004, after accruing about $1.8 billion in debt. Trump Entertainment Resorts also declared bankruptcy in 2009.
Have you & your friends made any small dollar donations to Trump, iowan2?
“Why was Trump so panicked at the disclosure of his tax returns, JT?”
That is a damn easy question to answer. Because the return is big, and complicated, and the Shills and Lying Spin Artists on the Democrat Left, will cherry-pick and misrepresent everything they can, to confuse people. Just like with this Engeron decision, whether there was a totally spurious finding of fraudulent activity, and all sorts of nonsense, that would shame any decent person to make.
Well trump did lie about why he did not release them. He kept saying he couldn’t release them because of the IRS audit. That was a lie. He could have released them any time he wanted to. They are his returns to release. You can release yours if you want. No IRS ruling prevents this. If they were so complex, release them with some PR person standing next to the returns to explain what is going on. trump lied about why he could release them.
He kept saying he couldn’t release them because of the IRS audit.
he said he would not release until after the audits. The audits would affect the taxes.
No, he said that he COULD not release them until the audit was over, which is a lie.
Example: “I’m being audited now for two or three years, so I can’t do it [release returns] until the audit is finished, obviously.”
Example: ”I want to release my tax returns, but I can’t release it while I’m under an audit.”
I bet you understand the difference between “won’t” and “can’t.”
Bob – tax returns are supposed to be confidential. Why should Trump invade his own privacy?
Bob, you are a nosy guy. Based on comments made someone should look into your own character. Why should Trump have to release his tax returns, and why should he if he was under audit?
The release showed that Trump conformed to the tax code and his returns were legitimate.
You don’t even know how to read a complicated form. You can probably fit your own on a postage stamp.
Or the $5,000,000 from China!
Or the millions from Burisma!
There’s only two possible rationales for this decision; either the State of NY is sending a very bold message to every business developer that the days of loose enforcement of the law are over, or this is a political hitjob of the highest order. Since Gov. Hochul already let the cat out of the bag that the former is off the table for anyone not named Trump, then the message is clear: the Regime will not tolerate any opposition.
Victims of Lawful Plunder
Men naturally rebel against the injustice of which they are victims. Thus, when plunder is organized by law for the profit of those who make the law, all the plundered classes try somehow to enter — by peaceful or revolutionary means — into the making of laws. According to their degree of enlightenment, these plundered classes may propose one of two entirely different purposes when they attempt to attain political power: Either they may wish to stop lawful plunder, or they may wish to share in it.
Woe to the nation when this latter purpose prevails among the mass victims of lawful plunder when they, in turn, seize the power to make laws! Until that happens, the few practice lawful plunder upon the many, a common practice where the right to participate in the making of law is limited to a few persons. But then, participation in the making of law becomes universal. And then, men seek to balance their conflicting interests by universal plunder. Instead of rooting out the injustices found in society, they make these injustices general. As soon as the plundered classes gain political power, they establish a system of reprisals against other classes. They do not abolish legal plunder. (This objective would demand more enlightenment than they possess.) Instead, they emulate their evil predecessors by participating in this legal plunder, even though it is against their own interests.
It is as if it were necessary, before a reign of justice appears, for everyone to suffer a cruel retribution — some for their evilness, and some for their lack of understanding.
This article just made me fill out my absentee for Trump.
Yes
Clearly a good basis for choosing who will be the GOP nominee.
I’m sending him a contribution.
Obviously our court system from top to bottom is worthless.
Is the court going to stand by if they decide to quickly execute Trump instead and rule after he is dead? You bet they would.
Many of the comments on this case simply conclude that Trump is a bad guy and, therefore, deserves whatever bad things come his way. And others think it is sufficient that a court found him guilty of fraud. The logic behind both the law under which he was tried and the opinion put forth by the judge, however, is nonsensical. The law calls for disgorgement of ill-gotten gains even in cases like this one where no one was harmed by the alleged deceptive valuations. And the judge, in declaring that Trump received ill-gotten gains of hundreds of millions of dollars, admits that no one who allegedly relied on the deceptive valuations was harmed. So where did Trump’s so-called ill-gotten gains come from? How on earth could he have pocketed so much money without someone else losing the same amount? If the banks lent him money at an interest rate that he did not deserve and the insurance companies charged premiums that were too small because of his deception, that means the banks were entitled to higher interest rates and the insurance companies were entitled to higher premiums. In other words, Trump’s unlawful gain came at the expense of the banks and the insurance companies. But, of course, the banks and insurance companies deny it and the judge does not dispute their denials. Sorry, but how can anyone accept this distorted reasoning. Furthermore, this is the same reasoning behind the statute that allows the state to seek disgorgement even when no one was harmed. It is beyond ridiculous to make such an argument. Trump’s ill-gotten gains, if there were any, had to come from the banks and the insurance companies. The only explanation for the lack of harm to the banks and insurance companies is that Trump did not pay interest rates or insurance premiums that were smaller than they would have been in the absence of any alleged deception. In other words, there are no ill-gotten gains to disgorge because even a financial whiz like Trump cannot squeeze money out of thin air. Stated simply, if no one loses money, there are no ill-gotten gains and no deception. Both the judge’s ruling and the law itself are logically and legally invalid.
The public was harmed by Trump’s actions; due to his fraudulent business practices, Trump paid less in taxes than he actually owed.
Trump paid less in taxes than he actually owed.
you need to show your work on this bit of ignorance. If you would have pain more interest and more insurance premiums deductable expenses are increased.
You beat me to it! What dumbassery on ShillAnon’s part!
Iowan2,
Well said.
Our trolls do not seem to know how finances work.
Then again, I would not expect them to.
They are still living with their parents, who pay all the bills.
More than compensated for by the increased values of the properties when stated at their actual values instead of the deflated values he used.
Love Trump or hate Trump, this was a bad decision and politically motivated. Who was damaged? Who lost money? If no bank or insurance company was damaged, who get the $350,000,000?
you have not sown your work. formula
Can New York be voted out of the Union?
I don’t understand why Trump’s lawyers did not seek to stop this case in federal court – either that or a declaratory judgment action as to the whether this consumer statute in NY is confiscatory or was otherwise violative of due process as there was no monetary loss to any party – that is the lenders and the insurance companies.
Trump got due process via the trial.
Hahaha!
No he did not.
A) trumps lawyers are incompetent
B) there is no path in Federal court
C) both of the above
Bill, re 2, why can’t he get to Federal Court under 42 USC 1983 claiming that he has been deprived of rights under the 8th and 14th amendments?
@Rick
Because this is a state of NY law.
And Trump can appeal the courts decision.
I suspect this case will continue for a long time…
Trump when he appeals, will win.
The interesting thing…
Since Engoron found him guilty and then set the damages to the tune of 350M… when Trump sues the state and James… (not sure he can sue Engoron) he will sue for damages which would be more than the 350M.
The blow back is already happening. Houchul screwed up.
-G
Jonathan: Yesterday was Presidents Day–not one of our bigger holidays. But MTG was quick to congratulate her MAGA leader: “Happy Presidents’ Day to my favorite President and yours. President Donald J. Trump”. MTG clearly wants to be DJT’s running mate. MAGA Speaker Mike Johnson did a one up. He flew to Mar-a-Lago to congratulate DJT–photographed next to him inside the catacombs. Many pointed out the irony of that photo-op because above the couple an “EXIT” sign was clearly on display.
As to MTG’s claim that DJT is our favorite President that is in dispute. Yesterday presidential scholars and social scientists released their “Presidential Greatness Project” that ranked all Presidents. Joe Biden placed 14th, Barack Obama in 7th, Bill Clinton in 12th, Ronald Reagan in 16th followed by George W. in 32nd place. Where was DJT on the rankings? Dead last! I’m copying that ranking and distributing it to all my MAGA neighbors.
what does this comment have to do with this column about the case?
Yeah, and you know the name of the dude who did the analysis, and I kid thee not:
Brandon Rottinghaus.
Irony to the power of 100!
In New Jersey you need to post $5000 deposit if you are a tenant and want to appeal a case, INCLUDING cases where landlord committed obvious perjury and never had a case to begin with. No evidentiary hearing, nothing. You are set to lose, no matter what, if you are poor. Game is rigged, table is tilted. That is clear due process violation, but who cares?
That “judge” is a crook, and would never be allowed to serve as juror in his own courtroom.