The media is quickly moving to learn more about Gov. Sarah Palin. Now, the video below has emerged that gives a glimpse into her belief in the convergence of politics and divine prophesy. In a speech only a couple of months ago, Palin speaks at the Wasilla Assembly of God where she refers the Iraq war as part of God’s plan. For his part, Pastor Ed Kalnins is a controversial figure who has referred to political adversaries as presumptively damned and claims political allies as divinely blessed. Various policies on drilling etc are not just a plan from the GOP but GOD.
Speaking before the Pentecostal church, Palin tells the faithful to “Pray for our military men and women who are striving to do what is right. Also, for this country, that our leaders, our national leaders, are sending [U.S. soldiers] out on a task that is from God. . . That’s what we have to make sure that we’re praying for, that there is a plan and that that plan is God’s plan.” This will remain many of George Bush’s past suggestions that he has spoken to God on the question.
Palin routinely invokes God’s plan on issues like oil rights and drilling. I will confess to be a critic of the intermingling of God and politics by both Democrats and Republicans, here.
For a recent posting, click here.
Gotta admit, she woulda made a very cute V.P., regardless of her politics..
“Either God wants to abolish evil, and cannot; or he can, but does not want to. If he wants to, but cannot, he is impotent. If he can, but does not want to, he is wicked. If God can abolish evil, and God really wants to do it, why is there evil in the world?”
Because there is something going on that is much bigger than our momentary happiness, something much larger than our personal discomfort with evil. God can – and will – abolish evil. Just because he does not do it according to your timing and your wisdom only proves that evil is inside you (for what creature has the right to question the creator?) and thus, if he wiped out all evil right now would need to wipe you out – and me!
There are answers to all questions, but the creature cannot demand answers from the creator. And people can’t handle that. Somehow, all the suffering anyone has ever gone through has been according to plan – although God does not cause it – and it will one day be made plain. But probably not today …
That doesn’t take into account the concept of free will as it is put forth in the New Testament, that supposes God is an absentee landlord essentially, as was taught in several parables, the least of which was the Parable of the Talents, which literally paints God as an absentee landlord of a vineyard.
The idea is simple, but apparently a difficult one for many Evangelicals and Atheists, who both ignore the basic theme of the New Testament and free will. The concept Jesus taught, was man was responsible for mans actions, not God, and thus man must decide for himself exactly “what” the world he lives in will be.
Evangelicals and atheists both struggle with this simple concept that whether or not you believe in the New Testament, you cannot just dismiss as it is the prevailing theme of the ministry of Jesus, and since Jesus is the source of Christianity, supposedly, it would seem that Christians would get it, even if atheists do not. Jesus taught God was omnipotent in the since he created the earth and the cosmos but what we do with it, was our call.
According to Christian theology as presented in the 4 Gospels, man is the temporary caretaker of all before him, a job that includes a critical review at his termination interview.
Thats whats in the Gospels, so looking at the concept of God and demanding either he be in complete control of every thing that happens or he must be insignificant or impotent. If you bother to include the Gospels as they appear in the New Testament then this bi-polar view is not being forthcoming with the other beliefs out there that do not include atheism or fundamentalist evangelicals.
Gino:
“But, if you believe that God is omnipotent, omniscient, and omnipresent, as most Christians do, then nothing that happens is outside of God’s knowledge or control; thus, everything that happens is according to God’s will and his plans.
I dunno. Maybe Mespo’s quote book can clear this up.”
*****************
“Either God wants to abolish evil, and cannot; or he can, but does not want to. If he wants to, but cannot, he is impotent. If he can, but does not want to, he is wicked. If God can abolish evil, and God really wants to do it, why is there evil in the world?”
— Epicurus, as quoted in 2000 Years of Disbelief–the Epicurean Paradox.
I’d be careful using the word “heretic” anyway Cindy.
Given the Suppression of Heresy by the mother Church for over 1700 years and more recently, the Protestant churches during the reformation and early settling of North America I’d not want to use that word lightly.
Cindy,
Which is the Church (starting with a capital C) that you refered to above? I do know many liberal christians who do not think of Bart Ehrman as a heretic, although anyone would say, as he openly admits, that he’s an agnostic. Certainly anyone should call Richard Dawkins an unbeliever, as he himself would.
My point to you is this. Why must christians only read other christians? Bart Ehrman is a very knowledgeable biblical scholar. He studied this subject for many years. He has read the texts in their original languages. He does not speak disrespectufully of christians or fail to associate with them in the present. He systematically addresses the different views of evil in the bible. You may not agree with his views but that doesn’t make him a heretic and it’s no reason not to read his work. I was also wondering what you mean when you call someone a heretic?
Thanks,
Jill
Jill, thanks about your suggestion about reading agnostic lit, and I do, fearlessly, read stuff by nonbelievers all sorts, mostly from the library, though I own a bunch too, as my personal library visible at LibraryThing under the user name EncompassedRunner indicates (my profile showing that just a few days ago I entered several “Counterfeit Christianity” books into my library). I don’t come a thumping without information, as I used to be a skeptic, even a critic myself. As for which Christians view Ehrman as a heretic, it’s to the point that it’s the general consensus, no one particular denomination, it’s that bad. Entire books have been written against his stuff. It’s like saying Christians view Richard Dawkins as an unbeliever, which ones? most.
Cindy
1, September 3, 2008 at 4:42 pm
Jill (@4:07), about that reconciliation of the problem of evil with God’s sovereignty, to understand what Christians believe about it, I’d recommend instead a book by, uh, a Christian — not someone like Ehrman who is widely viewed by the Church as a heretic. I recommend instead “When God Weeps” by the Christian quadriplegic Joni Eareckson Tada, she’s sorted through these things biblically, good appendices, too
Reading a book by a Christian about what Chrisitans should be believing is like reading a book by a 4th grader about what 4th graders should be studying in school.
If you want to comprehend the concept of “why bad things happen”, in context of Christianity as taught in the Bible, you need look no further than the 4 Gospels. Jesus taught that free will determined what would happen to a man, not some sort of pre-destination as most Evangelicals teach.
Most people familiar with the life of Christ and his teachings, (supposedly Christians)should be aware of the concept of free will, which gives each individual endless options for chosing diverse actions under a lifetime full of situations. If someone runs into your car, its not because “God willed it”, but because someone either chose to drive into your car, or is a really crappy driver.
If someone gets murdered, its because someone chose to murder them, not because God decided to control someones mind and make them murder somebody.
Evangelicals teach their own form of Christianity not found in the 4 Gospels, but instead that takes its articles of faith from the Torah, and the Epistles, and wildley misinterpreting the book of Revelations. In the 4 Gospels, we learn from many passages, including this one, that free agency and random occurance are the catalysts of events in mortal life.
for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust -Matthew 5:45
Try getting away from the grips of your pastor for a few weeks, and read the 4 gospels, then compare that, to the version of Christianity you hear in the mega churches and from the Evangelicals.I think you’ll see the two concepts are poles apart.
Cindy
1, September 3, 2008 at 4:32 pm
CroMagnum @1:10, nope, you’re wrong again, Palin did not make a declarative statement that our leaders are sending U.S. soldiers on a task from God, rather the “task from God” part is part of a clause,
I concur that I was launching a straw argument in that the context was more implied that verbally stated.
You are correct, that she was petitioning God that the Iraq war was his will, and that we were executing it faithfully.
But our paths diverge at the point of her implications I think, in that it is clear to me that her intention was to suggest it was, otherwise why ask that it is?
Her statements like a son telling his father, “Dad, I painted the garage red…. HOPE thats what you wanted”.
To ask for something to be Gods will AFTER the fact, is to simply tell God you did what you THOUGHT he wanted, hope it was ok.
She clearly believes the Iraq war is the will of God, as do the bulk of Evangelical Christians, if not all of them.
Jill
1, September 3, 2008 at 2:20 pm
CroMM,
I still disagree with you that Palin should teach Sunday School or head the PTA. I hate to think of the PTA lead by anyone who advocates creationism in the schools. I’d hate to see a Sunday School teacher passing on the lack of understanding of knowledgeable Biblical scholarship and some really ignorant/counterproductive social teachings that she advocates
Jill.
After reading your disagreement with me I now find I agree with your disagreement, thus, find myself disagreeing with myself.
You are correct, and Palin belongs no where near any position where children or parents might take advice from her.
Cindy,
Don’t be afraid to read things by agnostics. Bart Erhman is not hateful or disrespectful of christians. He used to be an evangelical christian and his wife remains christian. I read books by christian writers and evaluate what they are actually saying. I also don’t know what Church you are refering to–there are so many who do consider him a heretic. Even so, that’s just name calling. If your faith is strong you should not be afraid to read anything by anyone.
Bob, the reason I’ve now moved from the fence (I’d even been considering Obama for a while) to McCain is precisely because by choosing Palin, he’s now distancing himself from the neocons, whose foreign policy I abhor.
Jill (@4:07), about that reconciliation of the problem of evil with God’s sovereignty, to understand what Christians believe about it, I’d recommend instead a book by, uh, a Christian — not someone like Ehrman who is widely viewed by the Church as a heretic. I recommend instead “When God Weeps” by the Christian quadriplegic Joni Eareckson Tada, she’s sorted through these things biblically, good appendices, too.