The Tea Party sees Thanksgiving as a morality tale about finding salvation in Capitalism. The Pilgrims were failed Socialists who turned to Capitalism for survival. Only after foregoing communal ownership of property and allowing private ownership did the colony prosper. (Communism could also have been used, but socialism is the bogey meme du jour.)
The actual historical details are much more interesting than the Tea Party myth.
The Pilgrims formed a start-up and the Merchants and Adventurers of London were their venture capitalists. The Merchants would put up the cash for the supplies and the trip to the New World and the colonists would put up the labor. They signed a seven-year contract in which all land, livestock, lumber, furs, and other trade goods were held in partnership. At the end of the seven year period, the company was to be dissolved and the assets distributed. The Pilgrims were more like shareholders in a corporation than socialists.
Interestingly, only one Pilgrim died on the 66-day voyage. This is attributed to the fact that the Mayflower had never carried passengers, she was a “sweet ship.” Seepage from previous wine cargos had impregnated the ship’s timbers and acted like a disinfectant.
The Mayflower landed in November of 1620 and the first Thanksgiving was held in 1621. The colony’s governor, William Bradford, abolished the communal land arrangement and gave each household a parcel of land, in 1623. It seems unlikely that a colony in the grips of a famine, caused by evils of communal property ownership, would host a three-day feast. The prospects of a famine would come the following year with a devastating summer drought and the seasonal migration of fish and fowl.
Agriculture did become more profitable in following years, in part due to improved cultivation techniques of corn, a crop for which the colonists had no experience, and in part due to the increase in each individual’s exertion on their privately held land.
Two attempts to make payments to the investors were met with pirates, who captured the ships bringing back furs and timber. The investors, fearing a total loss of their investment, settled with the Pilgrims for £1800 after an investment of nearly £7000.
H/T: NY Times, New American, Dictionary of American History.
-David Drumm (Nal)
Carbon in the atmosphere retains heat
Does water do the same?
How much carbon is in the atmosphere
How much water is in the atmosphere
Do clouds provide a blanket for mother earth and do the clouds actually help cool the earth like the sweat that pours from your body when you get hot.
How do sunspots effect the earths temperature
Stop blaming CO2 as the culprit of everything bad.
Buddha is Laughing:
I may point out that the South was a socialist/feudal society while the North was a capitalist society. The capitalist society ended slavery in the socialist society. Socialism is all about slavery and capitalism is all about freedom.
I guess you will now tell me freedom means freedom from want and that all men to be truly free must pay for other men to live. That is in direct opposition to our founding. But hey it’s a free country and if you want to believe that kind of BS go ahead.
(time for Mespo727272 to enter with some quote that is “appropriate” to the discussion to support your ridiculous premise)
There are no “human rights” only individual rights. Your example is that of a first grader taking his first steps at 1+1.
What mastery? Wikipedia and the Huffington Post?
Dude, you still make me laugh.
By the way we aren’t and weren’t talking about slavery in the US in the early years of our republic. Although as mentioned above it was capitalism that ended it.
Socialism is slavery by it’s very premise. It denies a man the basic right to his own life, which is his labor.
You a wanna be slave master boy/girl?
Order your book today so you can stop living in denial
http://www.slayingtheskydragon.com/
She also said
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“A detailed comparison of temperature data and the quantity of carbon dioxide captured in the ice shows, that sometimes it warmed up first and then the concentration of carbon dioxide increased, and sometimes vice versa, but on average the temperature changed first and some 700 years later a change in aerial content of carbon dioxide followed.”
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I’m not in denial for there is no more denying as more and more scientist who pushed this hoax come clean.
On November 22 Dr. Lucka Kajfež Bogataj a Slovenian climate professor and top East European climatologist, who shared the Nobel Peace Prize with UN global warming colleagues made a chilling announcement last month.
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Rises in Levels of Carbon Dioxide follow Rises in Temperatures
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She is no longer a believer of the Global Warming Hoax.
But thats o.k. you can keep living in denial if you want to.
Reagan’s Specter,
It is my very mastery that allows me to diffuse your bullshit.
Enjoy.
Bob,
Ownership of self (self determination) and ownership of chattel are not the same thing.
Oooo. Now the trolls try to distract with more climate change denial.
Carbon in the atmosphere retains heat, just like the glass of a greenhouse roof. The more carbon you add, the more heat is retained. The more heat you add to a system, the more entropy and chaos you add to that system. What happens if a greenhouse gets too hot? Everything in it dies. Ask the planet Venus. Once much like Earth, Venus is a hostilely hot planet (860 °F) and now has an atmosphere that is dominated by by CO2 and SO2 that originated with extreme volcanism filled the atmosphere with CO2 and SO2 – both of which retain heat. From a volcano or or from a factory, CO2 is still CO2.
Since actual history is beyond your puppet grasp, it should be no surprise that basic chemistry and physics are also beyond your grasp as well.
“Your property rights end where human rights begin.”
Actually, all rights relating to the individual’s self, e.g. privacy, owe their inception to the inalienable right of self ownership.
Unless of course you buy into that botched abortion of an opinion from Griswold.
Buddha is Laughing:
you are making me laugh, silly wabbit tricks are for children.
“Your strategy, on the other hand, seems to be argument by verbosity. A quantity of bullshit doesn’t change its essential nature as bullshit.”
God damn man/woman you are the master of verbosity and BS. I could only hope to scale your heights.
Obama
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“The Supreme Court never ventured into the issues of redistribution of wealth and sort of more basic issues of political and economic justice in this society. And to that extent as radical as I think people tried to characterize the Warren Court, it wasn’t that radical. It didn’t break free from the essential constraints that were placed by the founding fathers in the Constitution, as least as it’s been interpreted, and Warren Court interpreted in the same way that generally the Constitution is a charter of negative liberties, says what the states can’t do to you, says what the federal government can’t do to you, but it doesn’t say what the federal government or the state government must do on your behalf. And that hasn’t shifted.”
“one of the, I think, the tragedies of the civil rights movement, was because the civil rights movement became so court focused, I think that there was a tendency to lose track of the political and community organizing activities on the ground that are able to put together the actual coalitions of power through which you bring about redistributive change, and in some ways we still suffer from that.”
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Here the truth comes out.
UN IPCC official Ottmar Edenhofer, co-chair of IPCC Working Group III and lead author of the IPCC’s Fourth Assessment Report
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One must say clearly that we redistribute de facto the world’s wealth by climate policy. Obviously, the owners of coal and oil will not be enthusiastic about this. One has to free oneself from the illusion that international climate policy is environmental policy. This has almost nothing to do with environmental policy anymore, with problems such as deforestation or the ozone hole.
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“Michael Mann rewrote history by leaving out the Medieval Warming Period in the fame Hockey Stick Graph.”
Of course he did because he is a sick little leftist sh….t head.
Yeah, there can be no human rights without property rights . . . like the property right of chattel slavery has nothing to do with human rights whatsoever. Wasn’t there a domestic war fought about that (and a few other issues)? Your property rights end where human rights begin. If you don’t believe that, try blasting the volume of your property – stereo equipment – on your property and see how long it takes the neighbors to get the boys in blue to issue you a ticket for violating noise ordinances or file suit for your interference with the quiet enjoyment of their property.
That’s called reductio ad absurbdum – reduction to the absurd – a form of argument designed to highlight the absurdity of a ridiculous statements. Ridiculous premises like “To deny property rights means to turn men into property owned by the state” and “No human rights can exist without property rights” and “Remember that there is no such dichotomy as ‘human rights’ versus ‘property rights.'” It’s a beautiful form in execution because it can often demolish an argument based on ridiculous premises with an economy of words. Your strategy, on the other hand, seems to be argument by verbosity. A quantity of bullshit doesn’t change its essential nature as bullshit.
Just because you’re too stupid and/or venal to realize there is a dichotomy in that human rights and property rights are two distinct areas often in distinct opposition would be a problem with you, sport.
Michael Mann rewrote history by leaving out the Medieval Warming Period in the fame Hockey Stick Graph.
And don’t forget Global Warming/Climate Change/Global Climate Disruption.
The left are the ones who try and rewrite history for their own purpose.
The end justify the means comes to mind.
Testicles in a bind aka Xboxershorts:
You a wanna be serial killer (Nazi) or just a totalitarian (Marxist/socialist)? What kind of socialist are you?
Xboxershorts:
I think your briefs are too tight around your testicles for one thing. That’s probably why you want to puke.
I quoted verbatim and gave the reference for the quotation. There is no commons in what William Bradford said in his history. You are incorrect. And as far as the Indians go, if you actually read the history it shows that they were at a tenuous peace with them.
Squanto got something out of helping the people, he didn’t do it for any altruistic purpose. The left are the ones who try and rewrite history for their own purpose. Because, as ekeyra says above, socialism isnt evil it just doesn’t work. I don’t agree with that statement but it works well enough.
“The essential characteristic of socialism is the denial of individual property rights; under socialism, the right to property (which is the right of use and disposal) is vested in “society as a whole,” i.e., in the collective, with production and distribution controlled by the state, i.e., by the government.
Socialism may be established by force, as in the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics—or by vote, as in Nazi (National Socialist) Germany. The degree of socialization may be total, as in Russia—or partial, as in England. Theoretically, the differences are superficial; practically, they are only a matter of time. The basic principle, in all cases, is the same.”
“There is no difference between the principles, policies and practical results of socialism—and those of any historical or prehistorical tyranny. Socialism is merely democratic absolute monarchy—that is, a system of absolutism without a fixed head, open to seizure of power by all corners, by any ruthless climber, opportunist, adventurer, demagogue or thug.
When you consider socialism, do not fool yourself about its nature. Remember that there is no such dichotomy as “human rights” versus “property rights.” No human rights can exist without property rights. Since material goods are produced by the mind and effort of individual men, and are needed to sustain their lives, if the producer does not own the result of his effort, he does not own his life. To deny property rights means to turn men into property owned by the state. Whoever claims the “right” to “redistribute” the wealth produced by others is claiming the “right” to treat human beings as chattel.”
And the trolls are out in force today….n support of the historical revisionism of John Stossel, who is neither an historian nor respected author of anything remotely economical nor historical.
As was ably pointed out by Isabel Darcy above. The ventures undertaken by both the Plymouth and Jamestown communities were BUSINESS ventures, with contracts and bylaws under which they attempted to establish profit generating corporate entities.
Both ventures foundered at first as they operated under the bylaws drawn up prior to crossing the ocean. THIS is what Gipper’s Ghost is citing. The documentation in Bradford’s history that their business model, scripted for them even before setting sail, did not work. They followed the scripts written for them by their investors, and it failed and were forced to rely upon the good will (socialistic concept there) of their native neighbors just to survive.
It was not until both colonies adopted business operating models (how to farm, hunt and trap in the new world)under the tutelage of their socially conscious native neighbors that the colonies learned how to survive and prosper.
Both, Gipper’s Ghost and Ekeyra are being deceptively disingenuous (lying) through selective citations in order to make the same plutocratic point…That there IS NO SUCH THING as the Common Good. The concept of “The Commons” is what is being chipped away at here. And in 1 week, Stossels fact challenged editorial position has gone from FOX News, to Limbaugh radio and then into the congressional record.
Why?
Because taxes are used to support “The Commons”?
Your plutocratic masters absolutely hate the concept of doing anything to help support the undeserving masses. And you two idiots are gladly and giddily carrying water for them, regardless of the fact that the plutocrat’s assault on “The Commons” will ultimately, lower your standard of living and bring much more hardship and suffering into the world.
You two idiots are perpetuating evil.
Plymouth and Jamestown both, were business ventures who’s scripted business model was on the verge of catastrophic failure until they were bailed out by their neighbors who understood the real value of “The Commons”.
Failing business ventures, not demon socialism. Demon socialism actually saved them.
You fools make me want to puke.
Capitalism at its finest hours…You say they only paid 1.8 back out of a 7 investment…where is Barclay Math when you need it….?
But then again….this was pre-Lloyds of London so the loss was the ships and merchants…I have read where “Creditors” sometimes would have the ships robbed (Pirated) and still demand payments from the debtors….But I am sure that this did not ever happen on this side of the Atlantic…or the pond as I have read it is called as well…..