We previously discussed the questionable advice of Vice President Joe Biden for people to fire shotguns out of windows to scare off possible intruders. He added “[if] you want to keep someone away from your house, just fire the shotgun through the door.” I suggested that such acts would raise criminal and tort liability issues. There now appears a man who followed the same approach and found himself criminally charged. In Virginia Beach, Trevor Lamont Snowden, 22, is charged with reckless handling of a firearm after fired his gun through a door and out his window to scare off intruders.
A woman at a Parents Magazine town hall asked Biden “Do you believe that banning certain weapons and high capacity magazines will mean that law-abiding citizens will then become more of a target to criminals as we will have no way to sufficiently protect ourselves?”
Biden immediately did what he does best: put his foot in his mouth and then shoot himself in the foot. Biden chuckled and responded: “As I told my wife — we live in an area that’s wooded and somewhat secluded — I said, ‘Jill, if there’s ever a problem, just walk out on the balcony, put that double-barrel shotgun and fire two blasts outside the house,’” Biden said. “I promise you whoseever [sic] coming in is not gonna — you don’t need an AR-15. It’s harder to aim, it’s harder to use, and in fact you don’t need 30 rounds to protect yourself. Buy a shotgun.”
In the Virginia case, the man actually saw two masked men leaning into his bedroom window. He fired through his door and fired several time at the window. No suspects were found and no one was injured.
The Virginia code states:
§ 18.2-56.1. Reckless handling of firearms; reckless handling while hunting.
A. It shall be unlawful for any person to handle recklessly any firearm so as to endanger the life, limb or property of any person. Any person violating this section shall be guilty of a Class 1 misdemeanor.
Even in the context of a hunting party, the act of shooting without a clear target or consideration of unknown individuals in the area is the basis for negligence per se. Schlimmer v. Poverty Hunt Club,
268 Va. 74; 597 S.E.2d 43 (2004). We have also seem prosecutors and others charged for firing warning shots or discharging weapons in their home. Even in a rural area, it is possible to hit neighbors or trespassers crossing property (a common practice) or others like police, firefighters, or public employees on the land lawfully. We recently saw a case of a man shot while cutting across a rural estate.
Unfortunately, this is debate often comes with a strong political bias. If Rick Perry had suggested sticking shotguns out windows and firing them, he would have been ridiculed and widely condemned. The advice is both dangerous and ill-conceived by Biden or anyone else. Yes, there are ways to fire a shotgun in the air to avoid hitting someone but casually advising the firing of guns out windows is neither responsible nor wise.
Source: Hampton Roads
You got it Bron. Restrictions on gun ownership, types of guns, background checks, and liability insurance is exactly what we need.
Not to worry. I don’t need to wear a gun to protect myself against folks walkin’ around, or to prove my manhood.
Besides, guns don’t kill people, people kill people. That’s why the Army sends soldiers into battle without firearms. They’re people, so they can just kill others, if necessary, by thinking about it. “If looks could kill…”
Bob Kauten:
Yeah, that’s all I’ve got — logic, facts, reason, maybe occasionally a wee bit of knowledge concerning the things I write about — the things we lawyers use to make arguments that are designed to persuade the reader.
I don’t know why you “bother”, either.
Porkchop:
I see Bob still doesnt agree with your well thought out, well presented arguments for gun ownership.
I guess those fantasies of blowing people’s brains out, or did he almost blow some one’s brains out, caused him a scare. And now like an alcoholic he wants to outlaw whiskey so he can save his soul.
Thinking about it, maybe we ought to have gun control, a bunch of out of control people like Bob running around wanting to blow out people’s brains with guns is a really scary thought.
Porkchop:
That’s all you got?
I don’t know why I bother.
Bob Kauten:
You should read what you write.
Your moral and intellectual superiority is obvious only to you.
SlingTrebuchet,
“God-given rights” reminds me of a caller into a radio talk show. He said that Ronald Reagan “was elected by god to lead this country.” This led to my pondering which polling place god used to cast her vote. Does god’s vote count more than mine? Does god live in one of the nearly unpopulated states, with two Senators? Then her vote truly does count more than mine.
Porkchop,
Your witty rejoinder again deeply impresses me with the depth of your intellect. What a zinger!
I was merely quoting St. Stupid to further propagate the tenets of the national religion. I was hoping you’d be grateful. Alas, the seed fell on barren ground.
I made no reference to millions of gun-owners. You did. I have no idea how many gun-owners have religious/sexual relations with their guns. If the truth fits, bear it.
St. Stupid’s most admirable trait is his self-awareness. He knows he’s Stupid.
Bob Kauten:
Wait — you are not a therapist, but you are more than willing to make long-distance, armchair diagnoses of millions of gun owners you have never met. You simply assume the worst about the people you disagree with and dismiss their arguments as the fruit of stupidity and sexual perversion. It’s not argument or rational discourse or even a good polemic — it’s just crap. That last post pretty much proves the point.
SlingTrebuchet:
“Carrying weapons may lead people to get themselves into situations that they would not have gotten into otherwise. It’s heading into vigilantism.”
That is sometimes true; but, generally, the converse is true. One of the things taught in my concealed carry class was that one should take extra care to avoid such situations, because, while it may be one’s right to defend one’s life with lethal force under some circumstances, the consequences of doing so are still likely to be very unpleasant. Tempting fate is not the norm. The proof is the miniscule number of actual crimes committed by concealed carry holders, and the even more miniscule number of crimes involving firearms committed by concealed carry holders.
In another place (largely a right-wing echo chamber), in a discussion ( i.e. they jump on me 🙂 of the Zimerman case, I posted something that included:
A response to that bit was
To my mind, there is something more than a little OTT about “God-given right”.
” In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with Gun, and the Word was Gun. The same was in the beginning with Gun. All freedoms were made by Gun; and without Gun was not any freedom made that was made. In Gun was death; and the death was the manhood of men. And the death glories in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.
The Gun is my Shepherd; I shall not think.
Gun maketh me to lie down in blood-red pastures:
Gun leadeth me beside the still bodies.
Gun destroyeth my soul:
Gun leadeth me in the paths of paranoia for delusion’s sake.
Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death,
I will fear no evil: For Gun art with me;
Thy magazine and thy barrel, they comfort me.
Thou preparest a grave before me for mine fantasy enemies;
Thou fillest my head with power; The blood runneth over.
Surely blood-lust and macho shall follow me all the days of my life,
and I will dwell in the House of paranoia and delusion forever.”
-Gospel of St. Stupid to the NRA
Lorkchop,
Um…I’m not the one with a gun fetish, remember? Let’s try to focus on who belongs on the couch.
Bob Lauten:
When rational argument fails, resort to bizarre faux puritanism and psychobabble to condemn those who disagree with you.
“I’m not a licensed therapist.”
No, but you should talk with one.
SlingTrebuchet-
You are the adult in the room.
Remember the SNL advert, selling “it’s a floor wax….AND a dessert topping!”?
Gun worship is porn…AND a religion! Your insight into gun porn is right on.
As to religion:
The irony of the first two amendments to the U.S.A. Constitution finally struck me.
The first amendment says, in part,
“Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof…”
Having said that, the second amendment provides the one true state religion of the U.S.A.
Our firearm fetish “stiffens one’s resolve” so well, that the fetish has been transformed into a religious object.
Very much like someone’s observation that “If men could get abortions, abortion would be a sacrament.”
And, not being religious, myself, I’m not getting into any more “logic vs. dogma” discussions. I’m not a licensed therapist.
I generally don’t like sticking out in the crowd. Having had to wear a uniform for so many years, and it being like a magnet for everyone looking at you or coming up and asking questions, talking to the uniform etc, I had my fill.
OS —
Only two problems with that:
Drawing unnecessary attention to yourself and walking through crowds
P
I would like to be on a jury that hears this case. I would like to prosecute the prosecutor for filing the charge.
It might have something to do with Blackwater having a reputation for opening fire on civillians.
I note that some YouTube videos showing some of this sort of activity have been hit by copyright issues.
Sample story:
http://www.cato.org/publications/commentary/lessons-blackwater-indictments
P.S. “They hate us for our freedoms”.
I wonder if Blackwater contractors and subcontractors accessorize?
Porkchop,
I have a friend who is a deputy sheriff. He took a temporary job with Blackwater in Iraq, where his assignment was personal protection (aka bodyguard) for visiting VIPs. He brought me a Blackwater ball cap when he came back. Cap is desert tan with the bear foot logo embroidered on the front in black. I rarely wear it, but on the few occasions I do, it is interesting to watch people edge away from me. When I walk through a crowd, I understand how Moses felt when he parted the waters.
I also have a US Coast Guard tactical ball cap, but when I walk through a crowd wearing that, I don’t get the same reaction from people. It’s a mystery.
“There seem to be lies, dammed lies and statistics.”
From DOJ reports we know that from 1993 through 2001 nonfatal firearms violence declined 63% and firearms homicides decreased 41% (see page 9 and 10 respectively in:
Weapon Use and Violent Crime, 1993-2001
Craig A. Perkins
September 1, 2003 NCJ 194820. You can access the full pdf from the DOJ web site here: http://www.bjs.gov/index.cfm?ty=pbdetail&iid=570 )
Yet there does not seem to be any reasonable basis to believe that the Assault Weapons Ban had anything to do with the declines in those two statistics. There are several good reasons to believe the AWB had no effect on the large decline in gun violence. One compelling reason is that AWB did not regulate most of the types of firearms used in gun violence.
Other reports including Koper’s assessment of the federal assault weapons ban (you can access it here:
http://www.sas.upenn.edu/jerrylee/research/aw_final2004.pdf )
conclude the ban had little or no effect on lethality and injuriousness of gun violence – which I take to mean that while we know that the rate per thousand declined, the type and distribution of wounds remained pretty much the same.
The fact that wounds are much the same would suggest that the weapons, calibers, powder charge, bullet weight, bullet design, and other factors, related to wound characteristics, are very much the same.
This is just another way of saying that the AWB had no effect.
I think the only reasonable conclusion is that the AWB had little or no effect on any aspect of gun violence: not on the rate of violence per 1000 of population, not on the kinds of wounds, not on the fatalities.
Yet the best, most authoritative statistics we have demonstrate conclusively that gun violence declined during the period that the AWB was in effect.
One has to wonder what caused the decline in gun violence. What changed? What accounts for the fact that both injuries and fatalities due to guns declined so dramatically? And what can we do to replicate those effects to further reduce gun violence?
It would seem that those who care about lives and gun violence would demand answers to those questions.
SlingTrebuchet
“The AR-15 looks cool, but if I accessorize it, I’ll look extra cool while I’m fighting for survival. This is important to me – to look cool while I’m crapping myself.”
It’s actually more important to have the right sunglasses and tactical ball cap in order to look appropriately cool.
SwM,
Check the IOC wrestling thread … left a post for you