Various people have asked for a video of my debate this week at the Virginia Military Institute over the question of whether “the U.S. is experiencing a constitutional crisis.” I want to thank again the Steamboat Institute and our moderator, Kaylee McGhee White, for facilitating this important debate. I also want to express my gratitude to Professor Daniel Farbman, the McHale Faculty Research Scholar at Boston College Law School, who offered a substantive and civil case for the existence of a constitutional crisis. I have great respect for him and his academic work.
One of the bonuses of participating in the debate was the appearance of our blog editor, Kristin Oren, her husband, Brandon, and their friends. Kristin showed great restraint in not doing a live edit of my remarks during the debate. She also took some snaps of VMI and Washington & Lee that I wanted to share with you in case you have not visited the historic town of Lexington.
I could not recommend a visit to Lexington more highly. It is a wonderful town filled with friendly people and historic sites. It proved the perfect place for the debate.
While negative position prevailed in the initial (54%) and final vote (70%) in the debate, Professor Farbman offered a spirited case for a crisis. Here are the results of the vote:
The Washington Examiner’s Kaelan Deese covered the event.
Here is the video: The VMI Debate
Outstanding job, Professor!
Thank you for the extra commentary and great photos! ..not sure where the poll happened and who participated.. yet.. there is full agreement here.. as my original remarks show – I’ll repeat what I said after I watched the debate being streamed.. with an extra comment that I have the greatest respect for Prof. Farbman.. a true professional.. scholar and gentleman.. untainted by TDS while holding ground as To-day’s ‘Liberal..’ Oct.1: Prof. Turley, Congratulations! Prof. Farbman charged in with a ‘put up your dukes’ opening.. and.. with compassion, grace and reason (..presenting all the right facts…!) you brought enlightenment,, a Diplomatic tour de force… a Joy to watch………….. a true ‘debate..’ Appreciation for both participants. especially the ‘Victor..’ ..as much as you love Madison, this time you were pure Jefferson.
This was a good debate and a great example of carrying forward the tradition of a civil discourse in these divided times.
The weakness of Professor Daniel Farbman’s position was shown by his answer to a late question. That question essentially asked “If this is a constitutional crisis, how would you change the Constitution?” There was no coherent answer. On the other hand Prof. Turley seems to have a very narrow view of what is a Constitutional crisis. The only example that he brought forward was the suspension of Habeas Corpus buy President Lincoln. I would suggest that any time that the Constitution is amended represents the culmination of a constitutional crisis. The crisis may be just a national debate about the recognition (or not) of a weakness in the Constitution such that for this country to function properly there needs to be a Constitutional remedy or the public dissonance may entail violence. It took a civil war to enact the 13th, 14th, and 15th amendments. It seems that prior to, during, and just after the war, it was recognized that there were some elements missing in the Constitution. For a while, many people disagreed resulting in a crisis that, in this particular case, was resolved by the Union victory. On the other hand the 18th and 21st amendments clearly show that initially a Constitutional remedy for a perceived ill afflicting the nation was agreed but then it became apparent that the cure was worse than the disease. Before the 18th amendment and then before the 21st amendment, I would think that dissonance in public discourse was a Constitutional crisis.
Throughout the debate Professor Daniel Farbman danced around definition of what he thought was a Constitutional crisis. For a while I thought that he might come to recognize that Prof Turley’s “crisis of faith” and his genuinely felt unease with the current political environment were actually the same thing. But it seems that Professor Farbman did not want to concede the point.
Great job in the debate Mr. Turley, I watched both debates in their entirety.
Although Professor Farbman did a far, far better job than Michael Klarman of presenting arguments to support his side of the debate that we’re in a Constitutional crisis instead of Klarman presenting one anti-Trump political grievance after another. I do think Farbman’s arguments were stretched so thin and twisted so much that they were on the brink of complete failure if he stretched or twisted any further they would snap and the absurdity of the arguments would have been debate ending. As it was, Farbman’s sometimes started off with something reasonably solid and then stretched it to absurdity, so thin that they became quite transparent that he was really grasping at anything to twist into support his side of the debate. Yes Farbman did better than Klarman, but only because he didn’t come across as Trump Deranged, he tried but he failed.
If you went into this debate leaning heavily one way or the other your bias would have dragged you further to the side you leaned. If you went into this sitting on the fence, Turley would have convinced you that his side of the argument was the correct side. I went into these two debates thinking that if the side claiming that we are in a Constitutional crisis fixates on things Trump they will lose.
If someone were to choose to use what the political left has tried to undermine the core foundations of the United States in the 21st century, I believe they could very well have made compelling arguments that what the political left has been doing, and is doing, is going to drag the USA into a real Constitutional crisis. Turley actually went a little down this path a little bit when he discussed the Democrats trying to remove Trump and a slew of Republicans from the 2024 ballots, if the Democrats had succeeded in their efforts to cleanse the ballots we would have been in a full fledged Constitutional crisis and likely a shooting war as a result.
I agree with Jonathan Turley that overall we are in a crisis of faith in our system but not because of Trump but because of the reaction to Trump which has driven the left so far to the extreme left that they have become anti-Constitutional totalitarians. What’s great about our system of government supported by the Constitution is that it’s putting up a hell of a fight repelling the left’s extreme ideological shift.
Double dip: thank you Kristin. I know by now you all must expect a troll bombing of epic proportions, and your commitment does not go unnoticed. Thank you. Glad you all enjoyed your time.
“[Is] the U.S. is experiencing a constitutional crisis[?]”
– Professor Turley
_____________________
The singular American failure is the judicial branch, with emphasis on the Supreme Court.
The entire communist American welfare state is unconstitutional including, but not limited to, admissions affirmative action, grade-inflation affirmative action, employment affirmative action, quotas, welfare, food stamps, minimum wage, rent control, social services, forced busing, public housing, utility subsidies, CRT, DEI, WIC, SNAP, TANF, HAMP, HARP, TARP, PBS, NPR, Health and Human Services, Housing and Urban Development, Environmental Protection Agency, Agriculture, Education, Labor, Energy, Obamacare, Social Security, Social Security Disability, Social Security Supplemental Income, Medicare, Medicaid, “Fair Housing” laws, “Non-Discrimination” laws, etc.
Article 1, Section 8, provides Congress the power to tax for ONLY debt, defense, and “general Welfare”–ALL or THE WHOLE WELL PROCEED through governmental provision of security and basic infrastructure–omitting and, thereby, excluding any power to tax for individual Welfare, specific Welfare, particular Welfare, favor, or charity. The same Article enumerates and provides Congress the power to regulate ONLY the “Value of money,” “Commerce with foreign Nations, and among the several States, and with the Indian Tribes,” and “land and naval Forces.”
Further, the 5th Amendment right to private property was initially qualified by the Framers and is, therefore, absolute, allowing no further qualification, and allowing ONLY the owner the power to “claim and exercise” dominion over private property.
Government exists, under the Constitution and Bill of Rights, to provide maximal freedom to individuals while government is severely limited and restricted to facilitating that maximal freedom of individuals through the provision of security and infrastructure.
The Necessary and Proper Clause is nothing more than a perfunctory redundancy for the purposes of clarification—a reinforcement of that which was previously codified—and may not be wielded to amend and impose separate acts that do not represent but alter the letter and spirit of the Founders and Framers.
Karl Marx wrote the Communist Manifesto 59 years after the adoption of the Constitution because none of the principles of the Communist Manifesto were in the Constitution. Had the principles of the Communist Manifesto been in the Constitution, Karl Marx would have had no reason to write the Communist Manifesto. The principles of the Communist Manifesto were not in the Constitution then, and the principles of the Communist Manifesto are not in the Constitution now.
Knock out/ your opponent was outclassed and outmatched BRAVO!🙌
Geeeez. So many having the burning desire to be heard on center stage under the spot light yet appearing to be a ghostly, spineless creature . . . with no name other than ‘anonymous’.
Wow, this one is more akin to a real debate, which only further reflects poorly on the sad joke Harvard has become. Keep it up, Professor, it’s very important.
Great pics, Kristen. Did you happen to visit the plot outside the museum where Robert E. Lee’s horse,Traveller, is buried? I didn’t see a photo. He is a big deal to locals!
We drove to the Blue Ridge Pkwy in Virginia for peak season of fall foliage in 2018. It was our first visit to the area, and we were so enthralled with the natural beauty of America, that we decided to stay one night and continue our sightseeing next day. We had no hotel reservations, drove to the nearest town of our location at Chimney Rock Mountain Overlook, and stayed in downtown Lexington. No room at the inn so we stayed at the “Sheridan Livery Inn” where we heard all about Traveller, Robert E. Lee’s horse. But of course at a livery! It was also within walking distance to Virginia Military Institute, Washington & Lee University and the great shops of Lexington.
If you have never visited during peak fall foliage, consider going.
NB: the infamous “Red Hen Restaurant” in downtown Lexington that asked President Trump’s press secretary, Sarah Huckabee Sanders, and her party to leave the restaurant, closed in 2023. The owner, Stephanie Wilkinson, hurt the tourist industry of Lexington so much, with her rude gesture to Sanders, that the city had to invest significant monies to promote in marketing a welcoming city.
Tourism still suffering after The Red Hen denied Sanders
https://apnews.com/6bf7728436394d8b99dcbcfb408cdd60
Dear Prof Turley,
It’s a trick question. The constitution is a piece of paper .. . and ‘no paper can hold the iron, it must come men’s heart’ ~ Chief Ten Bears
Like the Pirates Code, the constitution is more like guidelines anyway.
It is sad when governments are cheaped by the devil tongue.
Obviously, assaults on the ideas and principles enshrined in the constitution did not begin with Trump. Or Obama. Or even G.W. Darth Cheney, Rummy the dummy, the Patriot Act or the AUMF.
{note. Sure, Abe Lincoln suspended habeas corpus during the civil war in violation of the constitution. .. today, Trump’s DHS Sec. Noam believes habeas corpus ‘is a right the President has to deport illegal aliens’.]
Just because Obama et al abused his powers of the President – e.g. assassination of US citizens without due process – does not grant President Trump those same untrammeled powers. A hundred wrongs don’t make a right .. . or left.
Imho, we are at the point where the distinction between habeas corpus and ‘criminal law’ has been subsumed by the arbitrary ‘national security’ imperatives of a Unitary Executive Authority. That’s a crisis by any standard.
The constitution will not ‘protect us from ourselves’. .. those who would sacrifice liberty for security will get neither.
https://www.treason.io/p/must-read-the-president-made-it-easier
60 days to go. Hold the line you two faced Rino’s.
Govt. shutdown, yea I voted for that. As far as the nasty memes, well who the sombrero fits, let them wear it.
Not left, not right, America first period. Don’t like it? Then leave, go to where you think it’s better. We don’t want you here if you stand against American.
I’ve been off mainland USA many times, we may not be perfect, but I would live nowhere else. American patriots, stay fit, armed, and aware as we approach the great reset.
Really good debate, Turls. Thanks for posting. Refreshing to see you get a question about what your actual belief about what would constitute crisis in your opinion. I take your answer to essentially be something along the lines of total collapse of the system…
But I found it really interesting that in the couple of instances in the debate of getting near one of the main causes of constitutional crisis now…emoluments violations…you both skirted it. Probably because you both, rightfully, fear what a public airing of that issue would entail…, total political intimidation directed at you by the president of the U.S.
Trump was found to be guilty of emoluments violations in his first term, but constitutionally there were no real punishments for it. And the case became moot when he left office. But he’s back and in full violation now. Huge constitutional crisis.
Answer of course in a practical sense would be to put some teeth in the law as a penalty.
Hey stoopid, are you so dumb to think all the anons here the same person? Geeezzz… and now we know why reps. are the dumbest ever.
Nice video from a veteran…
https://x.com/VetsForRL/status/1973195064319873034?utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email
“I hear the Democrats are going to be blamed and the Republicans are going to be blamed. I actually think the president would be blamed […]. If there is a shutdown, I think it would be a tremendously negative mark on the president of the United States. He’s the one that has to get people together.”
DJT – 2011
Hey, sometimes even a lying trump is right.
Lying Trump was a democrat in 2011
Bwahahahahahahahahaha
Trump figured out what the dem party had become and left. Just like Reagan… LOL
Wha… Trump figured something out? Na…..
Anon, you’ve created hell. It’s fruits will be seen in a few generations as the women will be shrouded and you and your kind won’t exist. That’s how it works sweetie.
So girls can become boys, but Democrats can’t become Republicans? Weird.
“Problems start from the top, and they have to get solved from the top, and the president’s the leader, and he’s got to get everybody in a room and he’s got to lead.”
DJT – 2013
Liar
Lets see the video
https://www.facebook.com/reel/2510534565983752
Facebook LMAO
Now we know where our little jester, lawn boy, gets all his little jokes.
His facebook feed. What a douche.
What did you think of trumps speech to the military on Tuesday?
Lets see the video
https://www.politifact.com/article/2025/oct/01/government-shutdown-Trump-Democrats-Obamacare/
Politifact LMAO
How about X.com?
https://x.com/OfTheBraveUSA/status/1973414750181589020?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1973414750181589020%7Ctwgr%5Eda41a4154dc4b4aac3ba2e8dd95077f3180cb1b5%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.huffpost.com%2Fentry%2Fdonald-trump-shutdown-history_n_68de3ba8e4b0c450ba654656
You believe trump so much. How is that war in Ukraine going? Over yet? Didn’t trump promise to end it on day 1 of his Presidency? or before he even took office?
How about food prices? Lower yet?
How are soybean farmers making out these days? They can’t sell there crop, to anybody.
“People are going to die if we shut down the government”
Chuck Shumer 2021
“People are going to die if we shut down the government”
Nancy Pelosi 2022
“People will die if we shut down the government”
AOC 2021
“People will die if we shut down the government”
Hakeem Jeffries 2022
“People will die if we shut down the government”
Jasmine Crocket 2022
“People will die if we shut down the government”
Kamala Harris 2022
The names, dates and quotes are all wrong.
Actually some strategists think Schumer shutdown the government to beef up his support. Schumer’s leadership is increasingly toxic among Senate candidates
https://www.politico.com/news/2025/09/24/schumer-majority-leader-senate-candidates-00577164
GOP shutdown messaging seems to resonate with the public, for once
“Some call it “The Schumer Shutdown” on their social media posts. But that’s a new breakthrough for the GOP, which has never been able to make Dems “own” a shutdown, and some are even backing away from the edge.”
There is also talk in Democrat circles about a possible run by AOC for Schumer’s Senate seat.
Talk in dem circles, how the f would you know, you’re just a chump on a blog who shovels shite all day long.
I assume you have shite for brains too.
Oh! Look at that!
AOC’s 2028 decision: Run for president or Senate
https://www.axios.com/2025/09/19/aoc-2028-democrats-president-senate
Dems push AOC to primary Schumer, furious over his support of Republican spending bill: report
https://nypost.com/2025/03/14/us-news/dems-push-aoc-to-primary-schumer-furious-over-his-support-of-republican-spending-bill-report/
Once again, I easily prove you wrong. Do you get tired of me, proving you wrong so often? It is almost as if, knowing your lower elevator level IQ, I set a trap for you and you stepped right into it. Then I come back and prove you wrong. For everyone who reads the comments to see. And that is a lot of people!
How marvelous!
Free Ian Roberts!
He can be Superintendent of Guyana.
The Steamboat Institute puts on wonderful debates – the questions were very good and there was just the right amount of time for the responses. Professor Turley clearly won as you can see/hear for yourself. Lexington is a charming town with two historic colleges well worth visiting. We toured VMI with our friends, one a VMI grad, and were glad to see the young men and women embracing the military school regimen – quite impressive! The first pictures are of the Stonegate B&B where we stayed. There is a trap door in the dining room where Robert E. Lee would quietly come and go when visiting his reverend friend, as often a crowd would gather outside when they knew he was at the house. The photos of Lee’s office and grave are from the campus of Washington and Lee.
Thanks Jonathan,
That debate was a huge improvement over the last one, very well done.
Bring on the clowns…
When one is a fool it is best to remain . . . . Anonymous.
“When one is a fool it is best to remain . . . . Anonymous.” So sez anonymous. geeezzzz….
Got it. Thanks.
Fool ^^^^
Ano
Bring on the clowns.
_________________
I take it, you are the ring leader.
Bring on the clowns.., and who suddenly shows up… dustoff. Precious.
Clown ^^^
Boom!
Clown replying to himself ^^^^
The only clown here is you Ano.
Not really, and yet here you are. Boom!
Well look at that! The annony moron shows up at 7:17 AM!! I just did a quick look at yesterdays column and you were here as late as 10:00 PM. You are here, for 15 hours a day, M – F! It is almost like you dont have any family or friends . . .