In Missouri, prosecutors are considering criminal charges against Ronald Long after he shoot his wife, Patsy, in the chest while using his .22-caliber handgun to try to put holes in a wall.
Ronald Long appears to have been frustrated after several unsuccessful attempts to to put a hole in the exterior wall of their house. It was the second shot that hit and killed his wife. It is often hard to decide whether criminal charges are warranted. I tend to take the view that this is negligence and he is already paying dearly for his mistake. For a column on other such cases, click here. The big difference here is the fact that it was an exterior wall where someone might have been hit on the other side.
Notably, this follows a number of police officers who have killed their wives in such accidents, though none involved home improvement projects. Click here
For the full story, click here
Mespo, you’re just more adventurous in “direct engagement” than I am. And you’ve obviously had more experience in doing this without it becoming a verbal battle, which is an advantage. Maybe I just need more practice in walking the verbal tightrope. It certainly can’t hurt for me to try. 🙂
Not that he needs my 2 cents for defense … but I must complain that Jay has been maligned here for no reason. Whether I agree with him or not, he’s always been civil, passionate and thoughtful. As far as I’m concerned, Jay’s comments have usually been provocative, sometimes argumentative and always reflective of his reasoning. I most respectfully take umbrage in his being lumped in with the ‘usual suspects.’
Well, I do give them a handicap score in view of their ideology.
Mespo.
Substitute “vituperative” for “articulate” and I might sign on to that opinion.
As to the entertainment value. Yes they do add to the mix. But I have yet, outside of Jay, hear them mount a sustained articulate argument.
Susan:
I personally enjoy having Jay, msnbcer, kermudgeon, and niblet in the mix. They are articulate advocates of their positions despite their occasional meandering style of argument,and they do show many of us how the other side thinks. While I have no problem challenging their assertions with some good natured sarcasm, discouraging their right to speak would detract from the liveliness of the forum, not that anyone has even suggested that. Welcoming dissent separates those who think like I do from the typical neo-con. I agree with Justice Brandeis that sunlight is the best disinfectant, and I think all of our ideas need to be held up to the light so that all the flaws can be seen. Argue on!
I agree with you as always Susan. They are inept at argumentation. But their role models on the national stage share a similar ineptness so they don’t have any good mentors.
This is not to say the conservative movement lacks good minds on its side. They have them. Jay Sekulow is one such. But they are decidedly exceptions.
DW, I LIKE to see the ultra-conservatives questioned and challenged, so there are no mea culpas necessary. 🙂
As for some of the visitors, I’ve noticed the same thing you have; the minute our host writes a column that is in any way critical of guns, religious extremists, law enforcement officials who are a little TOO aggressive “in the line of duty” and cross the line from investigation into persecution, they come out swinging. “Niblet’s” first response to this column is hard evidence of that fact. Then they go off on their usual tangent, which is as you stated, with no real discussion of the issue or topic.
Why do they work so hard to distract us from the topic, I wonder? Are they so afraid of disagreement with their views they have to squash it whenever they see it? From what I’ve seen, my answer to my own question is an unqualified YES.
Jay, if someone can accurately punch holes through his wall with an archery set, they’re skilled enough to where I’m not worried too much about their aim. 🙂
No amount of laws can fix stupid. Take away the guns, and the same guy might just use a bow and arrow instead. And no amount of laws can fix crime.
Somewhere between criminals and idiots, there’s the rest of us. I hope no one is arguing that guns aren’t important, because common sense tells us guns are important, useful, and necessary.
Susan,
I have been falling prey of late to the temptation to get adversarial rather than establish dialogues. So mea culpa.
I really did hope we could get the visitor(s) to talk issues but there is an agenda of pillorying our host and MSNBC and Keith Olberman while posting anti-Obama news clippings and that’s the game for them.
Vince Caminiti had a theory that they were paid shills who do this kind of thing for a commission…could he be right? Who can say?
I’ve often noticed that it is the usually the die-hard “conservatives” that go into “attack” mode whenever someone challenges or criticizes them on anything. It doesn’t matter whether it is gun issues or the separation of church and state. Funny how that works.
Gotta have a thick skin in this line of work Niblet…
The half dozen of you sure like to attack when put in a corner. Kids do that.
Correction: It was you, Niblet, who suggested carry and conceal as the solution for campus shootings!
Sorry Kerm.
DW
Ok, I am a gun owner and have been for almost 50 years. And I completely support gun control and the idea of regulating gun ownership.
Kermudgeon on the Virginia Tech thread suggested arming everybody on campus. Well that’s a swell idea! Words fail.
Niblet, you object to liberal social engineering: Well you better change your tune. Without liberal “social engineering”, your children would be working in mines, you would be working 6 day weeks with no sick or retirement benefits, period. You would be working for peanuts, that is if your employer saw fit to pay you even that. The food you ate would be contaminated with ecoli and no government testing. The medicines you took would be made in China and no restrictions on their content either. You wouldn’t have a right to protest any firings or evictions, or convictions. You would just be a nice industrial peasant.
You ought to get down on your knees and give thanks to God that He sent liberals to do His Work down here!
What work you ask?
Compassion, love of neighbor. “Hoc est preceptum meum…” Jesus would never have written the Bankruptcy Abuse Prevention and Consumer Protection Act! He would have scourged those GOP Senators from the hall!
Ok, rant over. 🙂
niblet:
Churchill said that “a man is about as big as the things that make him angry.” Is this comment I should measure you?
Oh, and niblet, don’t hate on Keith O just because he’s living the dream. Just because you’re not doing as well with the ladies doesn’t mean you have to feel inadequate. Buck up, little shooter!
niblet (just a little corny): your problem is that you’re reflexively in favor of anything that sounds like it leads to more guns.
That’s not a philosophy, that’s a fetish.
JT includes stuff like this because people like you and groups like GOA frequently make arguments about gun rights that, frankly speaking, are absolutely insane in their permissiveness. There is no absolute right to gun possession and ownership, any more than there’s an absolute right to speech. Here we have a case of a guy killing his wife because he thought a .22 was the same thing as a power tool–doesn’t that make you think about what exactly was meant by the term “well-regulated militia”? Do you think the 2nd Amendment is meant to protect his right to use his gun for a drill, at the expense of his wife’s safety? GOA would likely argue that, whether it’s meant to or not, it does and there shouldn’t be a debate about it. I bet you’d agree with that.
How about yesterday, when you claimed without evidence that having guns in a tiny percentage of airplane cockpits has prevented terrorism? That was like saying your computer monitor prevents Ebola–you have no reason to think what you do, except your fetish compels you to. “Post hoc, ergo propter hoc,” homeboy.
But…….what would Keith Dolbermann & his live in 24 year old girlfriend do?
JT, what kind of problem do you have that stories about firearms always seem to get posted here? Are you afraid of guns?
I took my firearms training in 1965 at my High School in the 8th grade. We brought our rifles to school each day there was firearms training and kept them in our unlocked school lockers. Kids would have their firearms on the school buses and if there was live firing at the firearms training they would have ammunition with them and that would be stored in their school locker also. This was a school of hundreds of kids; there was NEVER a problem in the 30 years this went on until the firearms training was moved to the National Guard Armory because they had a firing range there.
Yes, you liberals have given us one heck of a world with your stupid social engineering. I hope we all survive it.