Ashcroft Defends Waterboarding — Congress Calmly Discusses the U.S. Torture Program

With the Democratic leadership continuing to block any impeachment effort or any serious effort to hold officials liable for the U.S. torture program, Congress was free to hold another bizarre hearing today to calmly discussed our use of torture. Even though current Attorney General continues to evade the question, former Attorney General acknowledged and defended water boarding.

This is not the first hearing where the value of our use of torture was addressed as a routine matter of discussion, click here. Indeed, we have now gotten to the point where we openly compare our acts of torture with those of other nations, click here.

Thus, it was no surprise to see members bantering about on the use of a war crime today like it was some chicken subsidy going to mark up.

For his part, Ashcroft fulfilled his stereotype as more general and attorney. When asked if he felt that other nations could legitimately waterboard our own soldiers when captured, Ashcroft did not contest that possibility. Instead, he gave a non-answer: “Well, my subscription to these memos, and my belief that the law provides the basis for these memos persisted even in the presence of my son serving two tours of duty overseas in the Gulf area as a member of our armed forces,.” Some could easily read that response as affirming that it would be permissible to waterboard our own soldiers when captured.

With the International Red Cross informing the Administration that high officials could be tried for war crimes over our torture program, here, many of us are left with this out-of-body sensation in watching these hearings unfold. Just yesterday, Speaker Pelosi reaffirmed that (no matter how strong the evidence might be that President Bush committed crimes, including war crimes, in office) she would not allow impeachment proceedings to begin. So, instead, we just sit around and calmly discuss war crimes like some interesting factoids and conversation points.

For the full story, click here.

139 thoughts on “Ashcroft Defends Waterboarding — Congress Calmly Discusses the U.S. Torture Program”

  1. Patty Said…

    I never said I was superior. I don’t need to


    but then Patty said…

    My ancestors were superior

  2. The irony is that terrorism (“the systematic use of terror especially as a means of coercion.”)is defined almost precisely as counter-terrorism when, if fact, torture as a means of coercion defines itself as terrorism.

    In torturing terrorists, doesn’t this administration then become terrorists?

    Torture is torture. It is premeditated. Once done, cannot be undone. It is a heinous, depraved, craven act overshadowed only by continuation of an illegal war..for profit.

    This is simply not an administration that can be trusted to honestly weigh the moral question of inflicting torture on another human being.

  3. I never said I was superior. I don’t need to.

    My ancestors were superior because of who THEY were and I will not tolerate your insults of my dead ancestors who came here as settlers
    and were among those at the first Thanksgiving table.

    You can go to Hell.

  4. Bartlebee:

    “How about that?”

    I think that I shall never see….

  5. Patty C
    1, July 18, 2008 at 11:12 pm
    I want you to leave…

    We know.

    You said that the first night I came in the blog, when you attacked me right out of the blue, when I had never spoken word one to you.

    So I guess you’re just gonna have to “suck it up”… ay?

    Because this is a public blog. And I don’t see any rules posted anywhere putting you in charge of other peoples rights to comment.

  6. No Patty.

    YOU “get a clue”.

    You’re the one who starts it each and everytime.

    You come in, run your big fat mouth, and then cry when someone dares stand up to you.

    You bring up your ancestry, like a little child trying to prove she’s better than the new kid in class, and boast of your profession, your intelligence, and now apparently your scholastic achievements, and then cry foul when someone makes a little sport with them.

    After all, do you have any idea how pompous you sound, declaring “my ancestors came over on the Mayflower”…. or “I save lives all day” ?

    Do you understand those things had nothing to do with anything?

    Your profession does not make you superior to anyone.

    Your ancestors coming over on the Mayflower do not make you superior to anyone.

    Your schooling, does not make you superior to anyone….or apparently smarter.

    And attacking another blogger, each and everytime you see them, insulting them FIRST, out of the blue, then crying foul when they make a little sport of your pompous blowhard hypocrisy, makes you pretty much a kook.

    So once more, I suggest you crawl back into whatever mental ward you crawled out of, tell the doctors to up the dosage, and chill.

    Because you don’t get to tell me what to do.

  7. Bartlebee – get a clue!

    You have insulted me, my noble, dead, Mayflower Society, DAR, SAR – worthy ancestors, in every conceivable way.

    You can have nothing more to say – as far as I am concerned!

    I want you to leave…

  8. mespo727272
    1, July 18, 2008 at 10:44 pm
    How about less volume, less histrionics and, most assuredly, less smiley faces?.

    13 comments, out of 95 is not “volume” Einstein.

    Its reasonable posting. And none of your business last time I checked.

    In fact, you’re probably the one on this blog with the most comments of anyone I’ve seen.

    So I got a better idea.

    How about less blind side unprovoked attacks from you and your trained seal friend there, Patty? How about that?

    How about you keep your insulting comments to yourself when no ones talking to you? How about that?

    How about you, and your blog bully compadre both leave me, and my comments alone if you don’t like them. Because last time I checked, this was a public blog and you’re not the “decider”.

    How about that?

  9. I said it once to you two punks, and I’ll say it again.

    You don’t like me, you don’t have to read my posts or talk to me.

    But each time, and I do mean EACH time, you two assclowns, come looking for trouble, you’re going to get back exactly what you put out.

    Don’t like looking for it dickheads?

    Then don’t come looking for it.

  10. mespo727272
    1, July 18, 2008 at 10:44 pm


    I will only say that in your short tenure on the blog you have managed to completely alienate most of us who are “regulars.”

    And here we have the messpot, stumbling in behind to shore up the blog nanny’s blindside attack.

    Notice, that Bartlebee was having a general conversation, on topic, and completely polite, merely responding to responses from other bloggers, most of whom were agreeing with him.

    Then, in comes the “regulars”…. like two turds in a porcelin tank, just attacking completely unprovoked, with no cause or justification.

    Just Patty C (wonder what that stands for) and her mascot, the messpot, waltzing in and attacking.

    Two studid goons, trying to set themselves up like the blog bosses.

    Well, fortunately, they’re not the “deciders”, and since Bartlebee did nothing to be attacked, Messpot, like his idiot friend, can both pucker up, and kiss Bartlebee’s rosy red ass.

  11. Patty C
    1, July 18, 2008 at 10:00 pm

    Fuck off

    Thank you Eva Nightingale.


    However since you don’t decide who posts here, and who doesn’t, and since you once more just stumbled in and attacked me without any provocation, how bout you take your own advice?


    How bout that?

  12. Bartlebee:

    I will only say that in your short tenure on the blog you have managed to completely alienate most of us who are “regulars.” That may be an achievement you strive for, but to most of us it is sort of pathetic, especially given that we agree with much of what you say. How about less volume, less histrionics and, most assuredly, less smiley faces?.

  13. Patty C
    1, July 18, 2008 at 10:00 pm

    Have you ever heard of Harvard – Medical School?


    I have.

    Why, are you the subject of a study they are doing?


    Hopefully it involves some sort of antipsychotic medication of some sort.

  14. Patty C
    1, July 18, 2008 at 10:00 pm

    I was completely accurate as to the time frame – having checked in later

    You weren’t even accurate about math sparky.

    As for the “time frame”… well, as I said I wasn’t aware someone elected you “blog post comment decider”.

  15. Fuck off – I was completely accurate as to the time frame – having checked in later.

    Nothing has changed.

    Not only had you taken a malodorous dump on our doorstep – you sprayed your verbal diarrhea all over our porch…

    Have you ever heard of Harvard – Medical School?

  16. Patty C
    1, July 18, 2008 at 6:17 pm

    I see all that is available for posts is 8 out of a possible 15 comments belonging to him – with 6 out those 8 being on the same article…

    I don’t have time

    But if you’d like, perhaps you could explain to me sometime,your particular version of homeschooled math.

    See, there were 95 comments at the time you posted this little integer implosion.

    And only 13 of them…..were mine.

    13 comments, out of 95.


    So not only was that not overposting, but it doesn’t seem to have anything to do with the…er….figures you produced.

    Perhaps your folks taught you something other than Base 10 mathematics?

  17. Patty C
    1, July 18, 2008 at 7:50 pm

    It’s rude.

    No Patty.

    You’re rude.

    In fact, you’re one of the most rude, ignorant and illiterate of bloggers I’ve ever had the misfortune to encounter in a blog.

    You’re rude and ignorant, each time you attack me out of the blue, acting like some sort of blog-nanny, and decided what new bloggers can say, and comment on.

    You’re rude and ignorant each time you attack me, and act like you have some sort of moral higher ground, when in fact, you’re just an ignorant spoiled blog bully who tries ordering around anyone who dares come into “your” blog.

    And each and every time you and your ignorant attitude decide to attack me out of the blue, you’ll get back, exactly what you put out.

  18. Patty C
    1, July 18, 2008 at 7:50 pm

    One could follow it, especially if you’re a regular, ie who was responding and
    to what.

    We can’t do that with your machine-gun approach to the same article.


    Too fast for you ay?


    I thought you had to be smart to go to law school.

  19. Patty C
    1, July 18, 2008 at 7:50 pm

    ‘we’, managed to conduct a fairly polite and orderly exchange.

    So coming into a thread, and completely unprovoked, attacking another blogger like a rabid weasel, insulting him without end whenever you see him, without any provocation whatsoever while demanding that he not be able to comment with the other commenters, “fairly polite”?


    If thats what you call polite and orderly, I’d hate you see you when you’re being rude and ignorant.

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