Now, here is a respondeat superior case: a tourist goes to a bar in Goa, India where he is beaten to death by the staff for being rude. This is what the family says happened to Austrialian John Kelly, 65, at the Club City Restaurant.
Goa has become a very dangerous place for tourists of late. 15-year-old British tourist Scarlett Keeling was recently raped and left for dead by two local men in Goa.
In Kelly’s case, the staff cited an “arrogant attitude” when he entered the barn around 8 am on the day that he arrived in the city. He probably thought “club” in Club City referred to a social gathering rather than a weapon of choice for the staff.
Security staff reportedly joined the attack in tearing his clothes and beating him. He died 10 hours after being attacked at the bar at Calangute. Police have denied accusations of a delay in taking any action in the case.
Not interested
– but, heres a blast from the past – Hah!… 🙂
‘… I haven’t wanted this to be competitive, but in my sport we do know victory is at hand when we get into the head of the opponent. We’re there and it’s vast, desolate, and scary. Yikes!’
*******
mespo727272 1, July 29, 2008 at 3:07 pm
Patty C:
Unless we see more, you’ve won with the “under” bet since he only went for 7 hysterical replies. I am guessing more is to come, but I am willing to concede defeat. I also think we should nominate Gyges for the Euphemism Award after our hero’s diatribe against him for something he didn’t say and in response to a question to someone other than our comical friend. “Wordy”, how’s that for avoiding the real thing? Bravo Gyges! I haven’t wanted this to be competitive, but in my sport we do know victory is at hand when we get into the head of the opponent. We’re there and it’s vast, desolate, and scary. Yikes!
jonathanturley 1, July 30, 2008 at 8:01 am
Patty C
1, October 12, 2008 at 9:51 pm
This is exactly what I mean.
First of all start from the beginning – by rereading who mespo was quoting ie NOT moi
Who mespo was quoting has nothing to do with you coming in, implying I am being rude and calling me foul names and racial slurs, then stating that you wish I’d “disappear, POOF”, and then in the SAME thread saying you think rude people should be killed.
There was no ambiguity there, and your providing both in the same comment made that clear.
I know you think you’ve got Professor Turley and others wrapped around your finger here, and who knows, maybe you do. But I’m betting that people are able to read your words and see the facts.
And the facts are you are stalking me and pre-meditatingly attempting to intimidate me into leaving what you feel is “your” blog.
Its clear you think you’re better than me, (and probably everyone else) and its clear you have no morals or scruples when it comes to harrassing someone in an attempt to either compel them to over-react or leave.
Unfortunately for you I am not intimidated by your harrassment, your racial slurs, your lynchmob mentality or your subtle death threats.
What I will do, is ignore you, as long as you ignore me.
And this constant calling me “APE” after I pointed out I grew up in SE DC and New York, appears to be a racial slur, meant to incite a strong reaction or intimidate me into leaving.
Something she’s pointed out she is trying to do.
Clearly Patty is unbalanced, and in dire need of professional help. “stat”.
She rests my case.
This is exactly what I mean.
First of all start from the beginning – by rereading who mespo was quoting ie NOT moi, but whose sentiments we echo – namely ‘Buddah is Laughing’/Obama-sama
Secondly, get a frickin’ life, ‘Ape’… 😉
The facts are, that I gladly ignore Patty in every thread I enter. I say nothing to her, and purposely go out of my way to not comment on anything she says.
But for some reason, she does not have this ability herself. Apparently she has a lack of self control, as evidenced in her comments about losing self control.
😐
For some reason, she cannot control herself long enough to keep from following me around from thread to thread and insulting me, ordering I leave, and now, even going so far as to suggest I should be killed.
She constantly tells me and others how I require “medical help”, and what a superior individual she is because of her profession in the medical field. She also points out how I don’t “belong here” among such intelligent persons as herself, yet it is she who is the one who instigates each and every exchange we’ve ever had, right up to the first.
I’ve never instigated so much as a single conversation or exchange with her, and she in turn does instigate each and every encounter, calling me foul names and now subtly threatening my life, simply because she doesn’t like a guy in a blog. All the while portraying herself as a friend of Professor Turley’s and a superior individual to myself.
Well it seems to me that while I’m certainly no angel, she’s got more than a few demons to contend with, and if she is indeed the medical professional she claims and a friend to Professor Turley, then if I were Professor Turley and someone I knew and cared for were in my blog, stalking another blogger by following them from thread to thread and launching tirades of profane insults, demands to leave, and now even alluding to murdering them, I’d be counseling them to seek professional help immediately, at whatever clinic or hospital she is apparently employed at.
Patty proclaims my “purpose” here with her own vain imaginings as if I was some sort of Dr Evil out with my “evil purposes”.
The truth is quite different, and much less fantastic. As I have stated, I’m just a blogger who watched Professor Turley on Countdown many times, and decided to try his blog. I figured it would be full of intelligent bloggers, some who had legal backgrounds, others who did not, but all who enjoyed good passionate debate, humor and levity, and examining new ideas and different points of view. And for the most part, I’ve found that here. Many people here I converse with regulalry I’ve found to be just that sort of blogger, and I enjoy our exchanges and discourse.
Patty however has a much different idea of what a blog should be. Apparently its only for the people “she” approves of, and then only if they tow “her” line. And while she preaches of high minded discourse and discussion, what she produces, is juvenile profane tirades of namecalling, outright insults and now, even what can only be construed as attempts to intimidate and threats of murder.
I however, will once more make Patty the same offer I’ve made on several previous occassions.
If she ignores me, I will gladly, ignore her.
I think thats a reasonable solution to her apparent “problem” with me.
The irony here is that it was Patty, who was the one who was “rude”.
I didn’t come into a thread and start calling her names.
She however walked into this thread, without me saying one single word to her, and out of the blue said;
—
Patty C
1, October 10, 2008 at 11:34 pm
Cro,
You are a #1, 1st Class A-hole ——— ape…,
Next to you, Dubya would look good
-except he neglected to get his GED…!
You have no sense at all.
The underlying scariness, here, is YOU, as before-
a/k/a ‘BARTELBEE” – taking up limited precious space…
I guess this is the “intelligent dialogue” she said demanded this blog only permit?
Patty C
1, October 12, 2008 at 7:47 pm
“I wish he would just ‘disappear’! Poof!”
“Like that…”
“My patience is limited.”
“Well I do” [consider rudeness justification for killing]
“adequate provocation can cause people to snap”
“Notions of voluntary manslaughter acknowledge that persons can be pushed too far and that at some point the animal in us will take over”
I’ve been threatened in blogs before, but this is the first time I have met someone so unbalanced as to actually suggest killing me.
But whats more disturbing is the threatening nature of her comments, apparently fueled by an irrational hatred of those who not only do not agree with her from time to time, but who likewise refuse to bow to her will in “her” blog.
Statements like these below are clearly the sign of an unbalanced individual.
Patty C
1, October 12, 2008 at 7:47 pm
I wish he would just ‘disappear’! Poof!
Like that…
And even more disturbing, her next comment.
She quotes Mespo, saying
“I don’t consider rudeness justification for killing in any circumstance.”
Then Patty replies;
Well I do
And she calls me the crazy one.
😐
She is clearly an unbalanced individual.
First Patty said…
Point taken JT
But in the next breath Patty continues with her insults and personal attacks…
What I know about BARTLEBEE and Cro magnun man is that he is not here for anything else but himself. He adds nothing to this Law blog
– Constitutionally or otherwise.
He has no legal training or experience, obviously, and simply does not reason the way those of who do, yet he has managed to inject himself into a forum which should be recognized and reserved for ‘intelligent’ Constitutional and legal dialogue.
So apparently, the “point” wasn’t taken.
Point taken JT, however my low opinion still stands – as it does from Day One with respect those who just show up and spew – looking for nothing more than to get a ‘rise’ here.
We used to have a nice little salon with regulars matching
DW’s caliber and sensibilities. I miss him.
A couple of weeks ago I awoke after a dream that our cherished DW was Paul Newman. I don’t remember my dreams much anymore – bits and pieces. For what it’s worth, what I know about myself is that I am very intuitive. Who knows what my dream means…
What I know about BARTLEBEE and Cro magnun man is that he is not here for anything else but himself. He adds nothing to this Law blog
– Constitutionally or otherwise.
He has no legal training or experience, obviously, and simply does not reason the way those of who do, yet he has managed to inject himself into a forum which should be recognized and reserved for ‘intelligent’ Constitutional and legal dialogue.
Forgive me. I’m not a sponge! My patience is limited.
I wish he would just ‘disappear’! Poof!
Like that…
*********
mespo727272 1, October 10, 2008 at 10:16 am
“Before I start, I’d like to make clear that I don’t consider rudeness justification for killing in any circumstance.”
***************
Well I do. Seriously, the law takes some notice that adequate provocation can cause people to snap. Notions of voluntary manslaughter acknowledge that persons can be pushed too far and that at some point the animal in us will take over. It is not justification for but only in mitigation of guilt and hence reduction in punishment.
Buddha Is Laughing
1, October 12, 2008 at 8:16 am
JT,
I’ll keep the troll baiting down to a minimum. It seemed appropriate for this article and garnered exactly the response intended. It was not intended as disrespect for or to you. As this is your space, I’ll do as you ask and play nice. Unless given a reason not to.
So your response to Professor Turleys request directed at Patty to stop with the personal attacks and name calling, was to call me more names?
Calling me a troll, while proclaiming your own moral superiority doesn’t exactly fit with his request I think.
Just because someone disagrees with you doesn’t make them a troll. Professor Turley has my email address and I’ve volunteered my personal contact info on several occasions. I am local businessman, and an independent voter. I attended local schools, local colleges and I work locally and have for the bulk of my life.
I am not a troll. I do not work for the right wing and I do not own handguns. All accusations made by you, as part of your “tough-guy” routine, that are simply false.
You’ve yet to retract these false accusations, so proclaiming moral or intellectual superiority is premature, given your own proclivities to fabricate slander against those whose positions disagree with your own.
Buddha Is Laughing
1, October 12, 2008 at 7:59 am
And I think I proved my point about rudeness
And how exactly did you accomplish that?
Your point was that rude people should be physically beaten. Kind of like the Taliban does.
But hiding from behind your keyboard talking tough about beating people up, didn’t exactly prove anything.
Other than you obviously feel better about yourself when you can act like a big man behind a keyboard. If that constitutes being tough in your neighborhood,…well, to each his own I reckon.
Please find encl. an Eye Witness account that contains the text of the signed eyewitness account ( signed by numerous individuals who were witness to the episode & available at Club City, Calangute, Goa.)This is being sent to the media as well –
Series of events prior to the unfortunate death of Mr. John Kelly; an Australian citizen on holiday/ temporarily residing in Goa prior to his death as per eyewitnesses of the incident.
Mr. Kelly was first spotted arriving at our licensed round the clock restaurant & bar at around 0800 hours on 8th, October; 2008; in a condition which can be best described as not in full control of his senses; which could be due to a wrong frame of mind/ disturbed/ depressed/ intoxicated due to substance abuse or any other reason which would be obvious to either those who knew him well or otherwise be medically/ otherwise investigated. He had his shirt buttons completely open & carried a couldn’t careless attitude towards others in general which is derived from the fact that he was not appropriately dressed & started impromptu conversations with anyone & everyone who was in his path/ vicinity. On arriving at a table of his choice, he immediately started a conversation with a group of people seated across who probably misunderstood his probing & intrusive conversation as mere friendliness n’ responded back in a cordial manner. He immediately called out to a waiter & ordered a round of drinks for them. He was loud, abusive, racially discriminating in his speech which was aimed at everyone in his vision which seemed like signs of a totally intoxicated person with not much bearing of his surroundings. On witnessing this, the others decided not to accept any drinks on his behalf & thus directed the waiter not to serve them any such drinks on his behalf. Most people preferred to stay out of his path as he seemed to be having some kind of mood swings as he oscillated frequently between friendly conversation & uncalled aggression in the form of physical movement, aimless murmuring, loud outbursts n’ targeted aggression including moving around the entire premise & stopping short of individuals who had no choice but to hear him out & wait it out till such time as he would move to the next target. In one such move he bumped into one of the cooks & pointed a knife (a foldable large knife) which he was carrying with him. He pointed the knife at the cook’s stomach while being unable to keep himself steady. The cook had no choice but to hold his ground & pray that he doesn’t strike. He suddenly apologised to the cook for his behaviour & moved back towards his table. This is when he shouted & abused at the waiter & summoned him regarding the drinks ordered for his neighbouring table. He abused at him left right n’ centre & the one sided conversation can be best described as outright provocation in the form of direct & indirect verbal abuse, racial discrimination n’ insult to everything that the individual stands for including his national pride. This is when the waiter who was not very articulate tried to match him for his words; to which Mr. Kelly responded by holding the waiter by his head & putting the knife to his throat & slowly exerting pressure. The waiter moved his head down to the table with the pressure of the knife & heard out another round of verbal abuse. Once Mr. Kelly had prolonged the situation to his full satisfaction he loosened a bit & temporarily the knife lost contact with the waiter’s throat. This was when the waiter found his opportunity to free himself from his grip & nudged him in the face. Seeing the chaos, the manager who was so far pleading to Mr. Kelly to let go of the waiter also got into the scuffle & simultaneously the Security guard got in too. In the scuffle that followed they managed to free the knife out of his hand, pushed & nudged him away. It seems that he tripped over one of the seats made of marble & landed near two other marble seats & a speaker in a tight corner where his ribs probably came in the direct path of the fall. As he was completely intoxicated & did not have control over his physical sense his reflexes probably did not allow him to break the fall; which meant that the direct impact would have come on to his ribs while landing. This is when the boys backed out & he got up & looked for his wallet. One of the boys found the wallet & handed it back to him. He then abused & shouted again & walked out of the premise. The manager rightly called up the Calangute police station from his mobile as it had been a major incident. After a very short while, the police turned up with Mr. Kelly along; whom they may have found walking along the road & heard out the details. They asked Mr. Kelly his version but Mr. Kelly by this time probably gauged how wrong he was through this incident & so decided to hush up the matter & just slip away the moment the police probed him about the knife. The police realized that Mr. Kelly was in the wrong & that none of the parties would probably be interested in taking this any further; told the boys to be available around the premise in case they were required while they look for him. We do not know what happened after this till such time as the police came back to us in the evening to round up all the boys involved in this incident as the news was that Mr. Kelly had died. We would not like to speak about any specifics which are under investigation & would thus not like to debate right from wrong at this stage but have already started the process of introspection so as to ensure that even though a repetition of such an incident seems very remote as most people would never land themselves into such a situation; we would still like to leave no stone unturned in contemplating how this could have been avoided. At such a moment our heart goes out firstly to the near & dear ones of Mr. Kelly who would feel completely shattered & to the boys who have got stuck into this situation which seems to be forced onto them & all our colleagues at our place of work who have had to go through the direct & indirect consequences of the incident.
In the end we would like to say that we come from a country that believes in the ideals of the Mahatmas who taught us to offer the other cheek if someone was to strike us at one but are sure that even they would have advised to react differently if someone was to keep a knife on ones throat & be fully capable of using it. We would also like to state that our bar at Club City is referred to as the ‘Boomerang Bar’ which effectively suggests our soft corner & affection towards the Australian way of life, ethos n’ the people in general & would continue to welcome our friends from Australia & other parts of the world to our land of plenty where we look forward to provide the safest possible environment to one and all as unity in diversity is not just a phrase for us but actually a way of life in India; a country with over a billion people from all walks of life imaginable.
when you go to another country – one has to behave decently and this does not look like a decent man who walks into the resturant early in the morning with your shirt open- drinking beer- threatening the staff with a knife and showing arrogant attitude.
When you are shown a knife by a drunk man what would you do in self defence -obviosly the staff have to save themselves.
And Bob, Esq. wins an apple pi for best joke.
JT,
I’ll keep the troll baiting down to a minimum. It seemed appropriate for this article and garnered exactly the response intended. It was not intended as disrespect for or to you. As this is your space, I’ll do as you ask and play nice. Unless given a reason not to.
And I think I proved my point about rudeness.
Sorry, couldn’t join in. Unlike some trolls, I have a real life that takes me away from computers from time to time.
Bob, that was funny. Mu to you too. lol