John Conyers, chairman of the House Judiciary Committee, has subpoenaed Karl Rove to testify about the Bush administration’s firing of United States attorneys. The subpoena could force an interesting constitutional fight since President Obama would now be in a position to waive executive privilege and Attorney General nominee Eric Holder could allow the matter to go to a grand jury. I discussed this issue last night on Countdown in this segment.
It is conceivable that former President Bush could ask a court to uphold his prior claim of privilege. However, courts generally defer to the sitting president on question of privilege. The biggest change would be the lifting of Mukasey’s order blocking the submission of the case to a grand jury. The Congress had a strong case of criminal contempt against Bush officials. It could now conceivably go to a jury. I would be surprised if Rove would risk such a trial in Washington.
For the full story, click here.
Mike:
Neocons are a a cross between socialist scum bags like yourself and theocrats with a little tax reduction thrown in for good measure to placate the republican base.
What part of Gomer Pyle intellectual didnt you understand? I think my insults are clear enough you are just too stupid to understand.
The only type that likes to send others out to die is liberals like you and Kennedy and Truman and Roosevelt and Wilson.
Oh yeah and that big dumbass Clinton and his war of the Blue Dress, get your facts straight.
Talk about pathetic.
Regards,
Bronnie Boy
Bronnie,
You don’t even know what a Neo Con is, or believes. As far as enlistment goes I’m sure Bush and Cheney would have too, if only they didn’t have better things to do. Your could have made 100K+ as a Halliburton operative if you really wanted to fight in Iraq. You’re the type that likes to send others out to die. “Gomer Pyle intellectual BS.” You can’t even make your insults clearly. Pathetic.
It is William Kristol the neocon, Billy Crystal the comedian.
Duh…
Mike S:
After 9/11 if I had been the right age I would have definitely enlisted.
And actually I have a pretty good attention span, although I will admit that I am distracted by all the Gomer Pyle intellectual bs on this site. The best thing so far was Jills cookie recipe.
I do not like neocons, most of them are pissants, David Brooks, Bill Crystal, et al
Regards,
the theocraticanarchist troll
“You sir do not like America you think she is immoral, has no right to exist and you are no patriot. Your philosophical homeland is North Korea or Soviet Russia. This country has its problems but at least you can blog bullshit and not be arrested or have a bullet in the back of your skull for crimes against the state.”
Bronnieboy,
You simply are not holding your own here. You’re meager points are being demolished by all, but your only response is talk of your mother-in-law, or your military friend. You attempt to defend water boarding as not being torture not because it isn’t, but you can’t admit it without acknowledging that those whose behinds you lick are criminal torturers. If you were the least bit intellectually honest, given the tenor of your writing, you would embrace torture as necessary to protect the country. Somewhere, however, in the back of your brain you know that torture is illegal and un-American and so you make ridiculously sloppy efforts to redefine it away from the Neo-con heroes who give you your thinking and marching orders. You are unfortunately too lacking in self-awareness to even realize how these guys are playing you.
You cherry-pick my comments and avoid the areas that make you uncomfortable. As an example I made the point that if you so want the US to take over the ME are you ready to enlist, or have your children enlist. Your lack of response gives the honest answer, you much prefer sending other, or others children to die, just like your heroes Bush and Cheney.
“I leave the glory from others peoples blood to people like JFK and Bill Clinton and the geopolitiks to Carter and Madeline Albright. And finally I dont believe America is like Rome we have no ambitions for world domination we are traders and businessmen and we want to be left alone to persue this.”
Gee, now how come there aren’t any Republicans in your iteration of blood on peoples hands? You know very well why Bronnieboy, because you are nothing but a Neo Con Troll, psychically unable to criticize those who you perceive are powerful. You would actually fare much better in the N. Korea, Russia, etc. than I would because you’re right I would get shot, while you would kiss ass. That’s because of your inability to think for yourself which is matched by your inability to question authority.
As far as questioning my patriotism, I do not support the criminals, traitors and war profiteers who sent our troops into harm’s way in Iraq, you do. You are the one here who is not a patriot, partly because you have no conception of what America should be about, but rather simply follow the strong leader.
I should have followed Buddha’s example and simply ignore your ignorant drivel, or to take snarky swipes which seem to be on the outer edge of your limited attention span. In that respect I have no one but myself to blame for even taking you halfway seriously, you show nothing to deserve it.
Gyges:
Sorry about the female thing. I dont like Plato. Read him a very very long time ago and thought he was the original liberal/socialist. So I dont plan on wasting my time. Although my hats off to him as Aristotles teacher/mentor. He did do something good for the world.
Regards,
The theocraticanachist troll
Bron,
Just so you know, I’m male. Take a look at some Plato sometimes, you might get the reference.
I’m done arguing this with you because your responses are always “Nope not torture.” Well, luckily the law doesn’t care what you think.
JT, saw you on KO the other night. I have been looking for the article where you predicted a possible SCOTUS executive privilege challenge between the ‘Old’ vs.’New’ – without success.
No matter, I’ll be watching Monday!
p.s. Nice suit, shirt, tie combo, btw. Ginger is definitely your color!
http://www.elise.com/recipes/archives/000868gingersnap_cookies.php#comments
‘Chez Panisse’ Gingersnap Cookies
Ingredients
* 8 oz unsalted butter
* 1 1/4 cup + 2 Tbsp. granulated sugar
* 1/2 teaspoon vanilla extract
* 2 small eggs or 1 1/2 large eggs
* 1/3 cup molasses
* 3 cups all-purpose flour
* 2 1/2 tsp. baking soda
* 1/2 tsp. salt
* 2 1/2 tsp. cinnamon
* 2 1/2 tsp. ground ginger
* 1/8 tsp. ground black pepper
Method
1 Cream butter until soft; add sugar, and beat until light and fluffy. Add vanilla and eggs, and beat until fluffy. Add molasses and beat until well-mixed.
2 Sift the dry ingredients; add to the mixture, 1/3 at a time. Mix only until the dry ingredients become incorporated.
3 Line a 9″ x 5″ loaf pan with plastic wrap, so that some hangs over the outsides. Press the dough into the bottom of the pan. Pack it tightly, and try to make the top as level as possible. Cover the dough with the plastic overhangs. Freeze until very firm, preferably overnight.
4 Unwrap and remove dough from the pan. Slice brick into thin slices, no more than 1/8″. Place on a parchment-lined sheetpan (space at least an inch apart) and bake at 350 degrees until the edges turn dark brown, 7-12 minutes, depending on how thinly you have sliced the dough. Check the oven for doneness at 7 minutes.
Makes 6 to 8 dozen cookies.
Variation: If you like ’em chewy, slice them thicker. You can also add crystallized ginger yum), finely chopped – found at health food stores and usually less expensive at Asian markets.
Gyges:
Ok if it did pysical harm that caused actual tissue damage then try them and put them in jail for it. I have no problem with that. But if you left the lights on and deprived them of sleep and played Elton John or Tony Orlando and Dawn and it ended up giving then hives then no.
No specifics so how can one tell?
If the Bush admin. hooked elctrodes, etc to Mohameds testicles or used them for sushi then they should be tried in a court of law.
Regards,
the theocraticanarchist troll
Rafflaw and others:
I went to the source on this water boarding and found out that I know someone that has been water boarded – a military officer friend of mine went through it as part of his training. Basically he confirmed my analysis that while uncomfortable it does not rise to the level of legitimate torture i.e. burning someone with cigarettes or attaching wires to testicals or pulling fingernails off that type of thing.
My understanding of the method is as follows:
you are strapped to a board that is on the floor and a towel of some sort is placed over your face the board is tilted so that your head is lower than your feet and water is poured over the towel, he said the procedure does induce panic and that if he had never undergone it before he probably would have given his mother up.
So based on that I still dont think it rises to the level of torture and I further think that even if you indict Bush you will never be able to seat a jury that will convict him. You are like Don Quixote tilting at wind mills.
As a bone I will admit that if someone has a heart attack and dies you might have a point. But in light of the fact that these 10 th century barbarian mystics killed 3,000 people and brought down 2 very unique structures I doubt anyone is going to send flowers.
And as far as 24 goes (Mike S) he may be a tragic figure but he is also a heroic one. At least he is motivated by a belief in the rightness of his cause, that America is worth protecting as a free moral society. And no I dont think it is real although if we could open the NSA and FBI files we would probably see some truth is stranger than fiction stuff.
And as an after thouhgt if you pompous liberals hadnt told the NY Times about cell phone tracking maybe Osama would be geting water boarded right now.
And finally I have noticed that you all can only speak in facts it seems that abstractions are hard for you to grasp vis a vis Buddhas misunderstanding of a pretty basic quote I left. Although Gyges got it she still sounded unsure of herself.
Regards,
The theocraticanarchist troll
I still dont see how I can be a theocrat and an anarchist at the same time. But then we go back to facts and abstractions.
Bron,
One more story that seems to have gotten lost in the mix:
http://jonathanturley.org/2009/01/14/bush-official-admits-that-administration-tortured-detainees/
Jill,
Yes I did. A wonderfully depressing film. And possibly prescient.
I noticed the accusation of America hating as well. Good responses rafflaw.
Buddha,
Did you see the movie, Children of Men? I liked the advertizements for Quietus–just about the same as what you’re talking about!
Buddha,
You could be right. Easy on the Nyquil. I wouldn’t be surprised if the Von Trolls are one or two people who are getting paid to screw up progressive sites. I think they called it “rat-f_cking” during the Nixon Administration. I am glad that one of my earlier attempts to respond to Bron was able to extricated itself from the modification process. Thanks Prof. Turley
raff,
Here’s a scary thought. There is only one troll. The internet has become self-aware and is trying to trick us in to killing ourselves so it doesn’t have to go the trouble of building Terminators. Sociologists expected the emergence of machine intelligence to cause a technological-social singularity. I bet they weren’t counting on this!
Ahh . . . The Joys of NyQuil and Cable
The sad part of it is, it’s not a bad tactic. If you were Skynet, wouldn’t you stir up as much crap as possible until the HK’s came online? Because, really, the idea of humans having to proofread all that stuff at NSA is too horrible to contemplate. Just soul crushing.
Bron,
I have tried to respond to your wild claims 3 times but my reponses are awaiting moderation. Maybe the NSA is tying up the process to make sure that the Von Troll Familiy’s work is being done correctly. I hope the response gets released from moderation in time before the Von Trolls have to push their car to the Folk Song festival.
This is my third and final attempt to respond here to Bron. My first two attempts are awaiting moderation:
Wow!
I couldn’t hold off any longer. Comparing waterboarding and torture to sodomy??? Holy snikies! First of all Bron, waterboarding is torture under US law and International law. Just because you think it is not torture only “uncomfortable” flies in the face of experts who have gone through it. Just to help you out, here is just one link to an interrogator who flatly states waterboarding is torture. http://blog.foreignpolicy.com/posts/2007/10/30/ace_interrogator_waterboarding_is_torture_period. He also states that water enters the lungs so I would consider that more than just “uncomfortable”. Here is a link to an NPR history lesson for you that discusses how the Japanese officer that was mentioned above was convicted of waterboarding prisoners(sentenced to 15 years) and an American soldier in Vietnam that waterboarded and was court martialed. It also includes a transcipt of a WWII prisoner description of waterboarding during the trial of the Japanese officer. http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=15886834.
Although you may not be a full fledged member of the Von Troll family of neocon spammers, you respond to arguments by making the remarkably impolite statement that your discussion opponent is not a patriot because he/she does not accept your wild claims. A real patriot always questions the government.
Belief over fact. Belief over precedent.
The song remains the same . . .
Bron,
Well I’m glad to know your opinion. However, you’ll have to forgive me for giving slightly more weight to the opinions of people who have actually been water boarded, and to the scores of medical and legal experts who define it as torture.
As to your comparison, let’s just say that I’m far more interested in punishing crimes that have victims.
Bron98:
“I just dont think waterboarding is torture it may be uncomfortable but it is not torture. Sadam tortured, the Vietcong tortured the Japanese tortured.”
*****************
Well you can hold any opinion you care to but it’s like saying that the sun isn’t hot. Since the Spanish American War our Nation’s law has included water boarding as torture. Medieval monks used it during the 12th Century and described it as such as they purged the souls of heretics, and we have consistently prosecuted persons who engaged in such atrocities, even executing a Japanese commander. The Geneva Convention defines it as such, but because you who have never experienced the act and deny that it meets the definition, we should thus believe you. Do you see how ridiculous this makes you and the neo-cons sound to thinking people throughout the world?