Karl Rove is promising to defy the subpoena issued by John Conyers — citing instructions from Bush lawyers shortly before the end of the Administration. The statement may indicate that President Bush is preparing for a novel fight: asserting executive privilege against the position of the sitting president (who would presumably support Congress in this matter). In the interview, Rove compares himself to the Great White Whale in Moby Dick.
Appearing on O’Reilly this week, Rove had the following exchange:
Rove: I have been directed, again on January 16, by the outgoing president’s legal counsel, not to respond to a subpoena, exerting privilege on behalf of the former president and his close aides.
O’Reilly: So you’re not even going to show?
Rove: No, and —
O’Reilly: What if they hold you in contempt of Congress?
Rove: Look, this issue is — let’s step back for a minute. This issue of whether or not I should show up — I’ve never exerted any personal privilege, I’ve never said I have a personal right not to show up.
O’Reilly: No, but you’re a counselor to the president, it’s executive — I got all that. But let’s go beyond the argument. I know your argument. Say Conyers says Mr. Rove is in contempt of Congress. What happens then?
Rove: Well, look, this issue is before the United States Circuit Court of Appeals in the District of Columbia. Rep. Conyers could have waited until they resolved the issue one way or the other, gave guidance to him and gave guidance to the former president and to the current president. But instead, he decided to go forward with this — I don’t know if I want to call it a witch hunt, I don’t think of myself as a witch, but I’m certain — this is a guy who went to the cloak room and said, ‘Somebody has to get his –‘ and then filled in a crude way to describe my posterior. He’s sort of like Captain Ahab and I’m the whale.
This could be extremely interesting. While Obama appears (again) eager to avoid a fight over such issues, Conyers to pushing ahead. It will force Obama to take a side. If he supports Conyers, he would waive any executive privilege claims. This would leave Bush as asserting the privilege while the current president sees no need to protect the information. This is precisely the plan that Bush lawyers have clearly discussed with Rove, who noted ” “It’s generally agreed that former presidents retain executive privilege as to matters occurring during their term. We’ll solicit the views of the new White House counsel and, if there is a disagreement, assume that the matter will be resolved among the courts, the president and the former president.”
It would also put pressure on Eric Holder to lift the bar on the submission of the criminal contempt charge to a grand jury.
For John Conyers, I suggest that he explain the reason why he has chosen to go forward to force this testimony. Here is the relevant quote:
Captain Ahab: Speak not to me of blasphemy, man; I’d strike the sun if it insulted me. Look ye, Starbuck, all visible objects are but as pasteboard masks. Some inscrutable yet reasoning thing puts forth the molding of their features. The white whale tasks me; he heaps me. Yet he is but a mask. ‘Tis the thing behind the mask I chiefly hate; the malignant thing that has plagued mankind since time began; the thing that maws and mutilates our race, not killing us outright but letting us live on, with half a heart and half a lung.
The “malignant thing that has plagued mankind” is scheduled to appear in the House Judiciary next week or facing a new harpooning by a criminal contempt sanction.
For the story, click here.
I actually did not mean it that way. It wasnt a challenge I was actually admitting that I probably desrve an ass kicking.
And no Semen I would not want to be your friend.
I should have figured that you would not understand that either.
Oh and Puddha is Knocking Queequeg did die you fucking idiot. If I had to live in your head I would kill myself. Actually I would have drowned myself as a kid as a service to mankind so I would not have to grow up to be a useless liberal.
Just a hunch but I still say Bron98 is our own WB/CMM/BB
aka Gaylord Focker, who as WB’s ‘clone’ was an ‘adopted’ child.
The drama continues.
—-
from his Greatest Hits:
Mike Spindell 1, August 31, 2008 at 5:31 pm
Last Reply,
“Anyway, if you’re going to start blubbering again, then I suggest you stop engaging with me in debate.”
“My father was also 6′2, and right around 220. He was the “runt” of the litter.”
“But since you didn’t raise two little boys, but two little girls by your own admission, you haven’t a clue apparently about difference, a few micrograms of testosterone make.”
crommy,
Is that the best you’ve got. You know very well what I said, but as usual you interpret what you want. You then resort to “macho” insults like “blubbering” to try to impress upon me what a tough man you are. Runt of the litter to imply your Dad was tougher than my Dad. You use testosterone alot in your material and it leads me to believe you’ve got some manhood problems. By that I’m not referring to sexual preferences, but the need to prove somehow that you’re tough…
…
seamus,
rofl
“I am the 6’6″ 250lbs. guy…”??!!!? O.K. I’ll meet you by the red lockers at 3:15. That way everybody getting on the school bus can see our fight. If I win I like totally get to call you a fag for the rest of the year and you have to sit by yourself during lunch. If you win I’ll do your homework for the rest of the quarter, and I’ll promise to be your friend next year in 4th garde, you fucking tool.
I should also point out that in my 30 years of martial arts, I’ve seen dozens of teenage girls capable of taking out an opponent your size and weight. Easily. Without breaking a sweat.
I also believe I indicated there was a possibility that you’d come back with threats of physical violence just like your weaker counterpart we disposed of a couple of weeks ago.
Have you gotten a clue yet?
Your mind is an open book and your psychology laid bare to many of us. You might as well be fighting a psychic because so far, we’ve all been at least two steps ahead of you. So go ahead and quote Sun Tzu some more – it’s obvious your understanding of his principles is flawed at best. We KNOW our enemy as evidenced by how handily the verbal trouncing has gone (as Mike pointed out). Much better than you know us apparently. If you think a physical confrontation would end any differently than the verbal ones, you’re wrong. Again. Most here, including myself, prefer peaceful solutions, but if you insist on taking the path of violence you’ll find none of us doormats either.
We’re the kind of people that can and will defeat you before you even know we are coming.
“I anyone wants to come and kick my ass I am the 6′6″ 250 lb guy.”
Bronnieboychik,
As Jimmy Cliff sang “The bigger they come, the harder they fall..one and all.” I’ve had to deal with a lot of very tough people in my time, some bigger than your claimed size and not one of them ever referenced their size as a threat. In fact most really tough guys that I’ve known don’t come off that way. They don’t have to because they know they’re tough. You on the other hand, militarist w/o military service, have continually boasted about your toughness, one way or another. It leads me to believe that you do so because you’re bluffing and insecure. Maybe you are that big, though I doubt it, but frankly that doesn’t scare me. Although I’m 5 inches shorter, more than fifty pounds lighter and have disabling heart disease, you come off like a bully and bullies are easy to handle. That’s because they’re ignorant and overconfident that they won’t have to back up their bluster. You’ve been taken to school in many ways, by many people on this website and that is only in argument. As Buddha has been saying, now your true Nazi side comes out. Will you be there in your fake SS uniform and jackboots so we can recognize you? Be a person of your word and get lost.
The willfully evil should expect no mercy.
And the best public service you could provide, short of suicide, you know – take one for the team, is simply to go away.
Wow. You can’t even read literature correctly. I’m thinking your the kind of person who thinks Dracula is the hero or the primary tenet of Christianity is “every man for himself.”
Thanks too for coming BACK after you said you were GONE to PROVE AGAIN HOW STUPID YOU ARE. That makes a liar on top of being a CONFESSED evil PNAC Nazi boot licking troll not that that is a huge leap.
So by all means, keep “helping” your boys the Neocon Nazis. With friends like you, who needs an enema?
It’s going to make locking your type up that much easier if you keep on spouting your evil nonsense in public. I bet you don’t even know what TRACERT or tracepath means, do you? And I know you’re not smart enough to spoof your IP. So keep lending a helping hand. Just don’t cry like a little girl when the FBI kicks in your door when rounding up the traitors and their supporters.
And your ignorance in general is profoundly funny. Thanks for the entertainment.
As a public service I am pasting this. It is at GW so Hopefully JT wont mind. It actually looks like it will be interesting. I believe Dr. Yunus is responsible for micro-loans to women in third world countries to give them capital to start small businesses.
I anyone wants to come and kick my ass I am the 6’6″ 250 lb guy.
The Washington D.C. Vanderbilt Chapter
would like to notify you of an upcoming public talk
featuring
Muhammad Yunus, Ph.D’71
2006 Winner of the Nobel Peace Prize and
1996 Recipient of the Vanderbilt
Distinguished Alumnus Award
“Creating a World Without Poverty
Social Business and the Future of Capitalism”
Wednesday, February 4, 2009
7:00pm
Muhammad Yunus was born in Chittagong, a seaport in Bangladesh. The third of fourteen children, he was educated at Dhaka University and was awarded a Fulbright scholarship to study economics at Vanderbilt University. He then served as chairman of the economics department at Chittagong University before devoting his life to providing financial and social services to the poorest of the poor. He is the founder and managing director of Grameen Bank and the author of the bestselling Banker to the Poor. Dr. Yunus and Grameen Bank are winners of the 2006 Nobel Peace Prize.
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Admission: $15 General Admission or $25 General Admission and book
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(One block from Lisner Auditorium)
Cash food/bar
Questions? Please contact John Haskell for more information.
Mike S.
That is a good reminder. We may see a punt and that would be quite disturbing from any number of angles. This issue shouldn’t just go away. We can’t be a nation of laws without being a nation who follows the law, even/especially for the most well-placed individuals.
Isnt literature grand!
I like the part where Ahab ends up going down with the whale. But before that Queequeg gets his too. Although Queequeg is just doing Ahabs bidding. Kind of like all of you on this web site.
Buddha:
“The whale was much smarter.”
**************
Cut a more handsome jibb, too.
How quickly the MSM forgets Watergate in reporting this story and in speculating on Rove’s being brought to heel. Had executive privilege been a valid claim, Dean, Butterworth, etc. don’t testify and Nixon burns the tapes. Precedent is established 4 decades ago and still I hear, even from Keith, speculation on whether Bush had executive privelege, or some vestigial remains even now. On Keith I hear Rep. Ted Nadler (D.NY) equivocate on whether this power exists or not. Let me put it simply: If executive privilege viv-a-vis congressional testimony is a real presidential power, then the president is really above the law and the executive rules. I don’t believe that’s the case from a constitutional standpoint, but these last 8 years have prepared me for the possibility of legislative and judicial cowardice.
Blogo is Ghandi and Rove is the whale–good grief. Do they really see themselves as oversized tragic figures? Oversized travesties is more like it.
The Obama administration will have to make a choice on this matter. I hope it is for the rule of law as I do for war crimes.
You would think by now Congress would have come up with a clear way to deal around this by arresting Rove themselves and holding him in the Capital. You would also thik the courts would deal with this absurb assertion of Privliage in a more forthright way. So far Rove has made a joke out of Congress and they seem ready to continue to be that Joke. It is truly disturbing!
When it comes to personal responsibility, the recurring theme of the Bush administration appears to be, “It’s not my fault. He told me to do it.” I decided to abandon that defense around the age of, oh, 12, having grown weary of my mother’s reference to sticking my head in the toilet on another’s instructions.
Mr. Rove’s whale analogy is accurate only physically. The whale thought for himself. If there is a “malignant thing that has plagued mankind” in this play, it is the Bush-Cheney beast.
Finally, I do not believe that a claim of privilege in any context should be permitted to be raised except in response to specific questions. The blanket assertion in advance fairly reeks of bad faith.
To the last, I grapple with with thee . . .
But I think this quote, also from Moby Dick, is appropriate too.
“Evil is unspectacular and always human, and shores our bed and eats at our own table.”
Evil? Certainly. But evil doesn’t always mean smart – Bush proved that. Rove’s just too stupid to figure out we’ve got his number and there is no escape. The whale was much smarter.
I suspect Conyers feels like second mate Stubb as he contemplates a confrontation with Rove:
“Is he mad? Anyway there’s something on his mind, as sure as there must be something on a deck when it cracks.”
And I’m hoping Conyers takes Stubb’s steely approach too:
“Starting at the unforeseen concluding exclamation of the so suddenly scornful old man, Stubb was speechless a moment; then said excitedly, “I am not used to be spoken to that way, sir; I do but less than half like it, sir.”
“‘Avast!’ gritted Ahab between his set teeth, and violently moving away, as if to avoid some passionate temptation.
“No, sir; not yet,” said Stubb, emboldened, “I will not tamely be called a dog, sir.”
I love Moby Dick.