The Catholic bishop of Harrisburg, Pa., Bishop Joseph McFadden is being criticized for comments where he compares American public schools to the system that Hitler and Mussolini sought to create. I actually think that part of the criticism of McFadden is misplaced, though he is certainly worthy of criticism. McFadden’s controversial statements follow a call for Catholics to organize against President Obama and his health care program by leading Catholic leaders.
In an interview with the ABC affiliate in Harrisburg, McFadden was objecting to the lack of school vouchers in Pennsylvania and the lack of choice for many parents: “In the totalitarian government, they would love our system,” McFadden said. “This is what Hitler and Mussolini and all them tried to establish — a monolith; so all the children would be educated in one set of beliefs and one way of doing things.” The Anti-Defamation League has condemned the statement and said “he should not be making his point at the expense of the memory of six million Jews and millions of others who perished in the Holocaust.”
I understand the sensitivity to such a comparison, but I do not think that the Bishop was referring to the Holocaust. People should be able to make comparisons to aspects of prior totalitarian regimes without fear of being call insensitive to the Holocaust. The Nazi regime was a worldwide tragedy with many aspects and precursors that are the subject of historical and political discourse.
Where McFadden is wrong is that the comparison is wildly misplaced. First, Hitler was raised by a devout Catholic mother and many Nazis were taught in religious schools. Indeed, the Vatican was criticized by some for not doing more to confront the Nazi regime. Second, the fascists sought to use schools to indoctrinate children to accept narrow values to the exclusion of other values and the objectification of other people. American public schools do the opposite. They are motivated by pluralistic principles to help shape citizens who are tolerant and well-rounded. They are the antithesis of what fascists want from education.
Finally, this is about vouchers and whether the people of Pennsylvania should subsidize alternative schools, such as Catholic schools. With the church experiencing severe shortfalls in attendance and donations, they need more from the state more than ever. However, there are very good reasons for opposition to vouchers. I attended Catholic schools for part of my earlier education and I am very thankful for the education that I received in those schools. However, Leslie and I are committed to the model of public education. While we can afford a private education, we have kept our children in public schools where they are taught in a more diverse class. I have long been an advocate for public education, particularly in the elementary and middle school levels, as a critical part of shaping good citizens. While I have often been critical of the curriculum particularly on civics, I believe that the public schools have always been the key to maintaining a citizenry that is educated and tolerant.
The comparison to Hitler and Mussolini reflects less disrespect on the part of Bishop McFadden than it does a lack of understanding of the fascistic agenda on education: dogma and exclusionary learning. While I believe Catholic schools are excellent choices for learning, it is outrageous to compare fascistic systems to our public schools. Hitler and Mussolini would find our current curriculum in public schools to be a threat to their type of indoctrination model for children.
Source: ABC
Bron.
True stuff is obviously that part you don’t read.
But I think Gene H. gave a better answer. Why do you challenge him?
You are a perfect example, IMHO, of someone whose opinions were formed before knowledge was acquired, and you appear to lack the capability of considering ideas critical of your position. Would you agree to these opinions of your capabilities?
Anonymously Yours,
Hamilton was against the Bill of Rights. His argument leads to what we see today. He said; by enumerating the rights of the “persons”, that this would easily lead to thinking that rights not enumerated did not exist, and the people would not be entitled to them as well.
Well as a addition to satisfy and get ratification, the Bill was included.
And yet today, we have to fight like hell against those who would attack them, or remove them outright. Some even say, it would be better if we were ruled by a WISE and POWERFUL MAN. Well, how about appointing the governors as nobles with hereditary titles. So we insure the continuance of a good line like Phillip of Spain as rendered by Velasquez, in you’ve been to the Prado to see their inbred faces.
Others countered this idea, and the Constitution specifically says in one place that (or is it the Declaration) all power descendeth from the people,
The constitution does say that numerous other non-enumerated powers are so common and are also the peoples too, for them to determine. Not by government.
Not by government—–by not following that is where we went wrong, I feel.
We need public schools. It is somewhat analogous to the Post Office. Some folks prefer the United Parcel Service or Federal Express. Those could go away. We all need to be able to send a letter or package to some bumfuk town and if we live in that place be able to receive a letter from anyone. Some day the internet will replace this but right now we need it.
Public schools do keep a secular approach to education. Maybe it is milktoast sometimes. Milktoast is better than salmonella offered at some private schools. Vouchers are for grouchers.
AY,
You are right that the Right has been creating problems in order to cut them starve them and privatize them
Bonnie,
Take a look at this time line….
Historical Timeline Of Public Education In The US
http://www.arc.org/content/view/100/217/
“‘And that, Bron, falls under the category of “Duh.’
Obviously not because Clinton didnt get it and neither did Rubin or Summers.”
Did I ever say stupidity and greed was partisan biased?
No.
In fact, I’ve said many times that the root of the problem was the repeal of the Glass-Steagall Act under Clinton’s watch. A repeal that was driven by the certainly biased advice of Wall Street insiders – the very same people who push for deregulation every chance they get by buying favors from both parties in the form of “campaign contributions”. But you don’t want to hear the truth that the law and government itself as an institution isn’t the problem, but rather the problem is the government co-opted by corporate graft and distorted from a tool of and for the interests of We the People into a tool for furthering unfettered greed in the white collar criminal class on Wall Street. That’s just too contrary to your Objectivist/Austrian School religion, its faith in free-markets as a self-correcting mechanism capable of providing just outcomes, and your Libertarian “small government fixes everything” mantra. Too bad for you that your pseudo-philosophy and economics are based on fundamentally flawed assumptions about human nature and your “small is better” politic is based on the wrong metric for measuring the functionality of government.
Bonnie:
Jefferson said this in later life:
“7723. SCHOOLS, Government of.-If it
is believed that the elementary schools will be
better managed by the Governor and Council,
the Commissioners of the Literary Fund, or
any other general authority of the government,
than by the parents within each ward, it is a
helief against all expertence.-To JOSEPH C.
CABELL. vi, 543. ( 1816.)”
Bron and Bonnie,
I think Plessey and Brown v the Board of Education answers the question….for most recent time….the cases were expanded in the 60’s and 70’s….to the point that we take Free Public Education as a given….that has been chipped away so much that…it will come down to what each school district does…..
Just remember….if the State offers it…then it must be offered to everyone equally…then came the attempt at vouchers… magnet schools….etc…cutting services and money all along the way….
In the reality of it all…I think that they had Union Busting in mind….Now they have (the state legislators) created Mandated School take overs for failure to test adequately….to..taking them over for not being able to pay bills once they cannot make payments or they are in a financial crises….this has been extended to other Political Subdivisions….So far Michigan and Wisconsin have the ability to take over…Ohio if not there is on its way just like Indiana…
To me it is a very simple complex game of chess….the state creates the emergency….and them goes in and get rids of Union Contract….Teachers Contracts as well….Hmmmmm……
IDEALIST707:
what is the “true stuff”?
Bonnie,
If I may…Public Education is not one of those Rights we have spelled out in the Constitution….But if it is given by a state…it must not be done so in a discriminatory manner…
It is my understanding that the Founding Fathers….did not contemplate a system that is in place today….They were used to Private Schools and Universities….They may have had lots of space available but for the most part…You had to be selected to get it….
I may be wrong…but I think the above is right….mespo…do you agree or not?
Bonnie,
“The whole people must take upon themselves the education of the whole people and must be willing to bear the expense of it.” … John Adams
Jefferson’s plan for education asserted four basic principles ( preparation of the voter so that he might express his opinion by means of the ballot, thus insuring political liberty):
1. that democracy cannot long exist without enlightenment.
2. that it cannot function without wise and honest officials.
3. that talent and virtue, needed in a free society, should be educated regardless of wealth, birth or other accidental condition.
4. that the children of the poor must be thus educated at common expense.” … Padover, 1952, p. 43
I always thought that public education was considered a very important element in the formation of the United States of America by our founding fathers.
Bron,
Not derivatives, if “blue-dress spots” is right about derivatives.
I think his comment about the economic range and effects was quite enlightening; the first honest (to me of course) to come from that level.
But you are immoveable, I guess you did not get hit, nor your bank.
Or were they saved by the rest of us with TARP.
As for reading, I read the true stuff, not the austrian totalitarian stuff.
Bron,
Three crooks point fingers at each other. Do you really believe any of them?
We have that problem in criminal justice here when two murderers blame each other. They go free. True.
Apparently the American public believe these murderers too. And all three are still on free foot. And one recently resigned (?) as a Presidential adviser.
Sleepíng with thieves doesn’t bother our man, but maybe it comes with the job.
Bron,
They chose NOT to “get it.” They were drinking the no regulations/the market will take care of itself Kool-aid.
Bron,
You’re amazing. Don’t your spots feel odd in these striped quarters.
You are perhaps enjoying the attention of center-stage and are just trolling us for fun and mischief.
In all sincerity and respect for your innocence, please go back to your ivory tower and build economic models to dream about.
If you want free markets, truly lassez-faire, then go to history, and read, read, read. Tell us then what you found.
I’ll take “blue-dress spots” word in this instance.
And yes Elaine, Greenspan was crazy, obviously.
Being smart, as the present FED one proves, does not mean you produce or back the right theory.
As any scientist knows.
Mike S.
“Such a nation has a centrally planned economy, which is what all politicians with a lust for power desire.”
As well as all people who don’t want to live in a survival of the fittest jungle controlled by wealth and power.
=============================
They actually are not fittest in my opinion. They just have connections and no ethics—-and know all the tricks, it comes with the upbringing.
I was invited to an exclusive party once, an informal gathering. All they talked about was money, in all its forms and aspects. They even gossiped about the host whose business was said to be doing badly. Nice folks.
Lot’s of culture too. Broad minded (ha!). If I was Dylan I’d do a song about them.
Idealist707:
market is regulated, by thousands of SEC rules, CFR regulations, Federal Reserve controls interest rates.
Maybe you need to do some reading as well.
“And that, Bron, falls under the category of “Duh.””
Obviously not because Clinton didnt get it and neither did Rubin or Summers.
Bron said:
“Do you really believe we have a free market which failed? We have a controlled system which failed.”
Amazing how you are so ill informed and wrong, wrong, wrong.
CDC’s derivative market was OTC in that no reporting OR control was exercised by regulators. Check it out. That market in itself was a hundred times larger than the stocks and bonds. It was gargantuan. No wonder when the Ponzi scheme blew up the banks sank too..
Read up on it . You’ve got a lot to learn.
H. Skip Robinson,
said: “intended purpose of solving the problems of high truancy and dropouts rates.”
Where do you get that from? Those problems are social problems for society to solve. Schools are for education; neither for entertainment nor for locking up the students. Take responsibility for your life and those of your kids.
Our last black maid (once a week) was the proud mother of 3 college graduates, and expecting 2 more within a few years. And that was before 1954. My drama group at NCSU hosted for the first time a multi-racial one-act play festival with “student original” manuscripts. We had three black colleges competing; more would have liked to have a spot.
Social influence and parental support means a lot.