ABC News has been given a photograph that might make the difference between life in prison and a walk. For weeks, we have been discussing the case and the application of the Stand Your Ground law. As discussed earlier, I think the case was over-charged and I remain doubtful of a conviction. This picture will likely be the single most important piece of evidence in the case. It shows Zimmerman with significant blood on the back of his head — an image that supports accounts from the scene and will be used to corroborate Zimmerman’s account of a struggle with Trayvon Martin where he feared serious bodily injury. [UPDATE: Zimmerman granted bond].
Unlike the photos of Zimmerman at the police station, this photo was taken a few minutes after the fight. Zimmerman’s shaved head could prove Godsend for Zimmerman. Had he had longer hair, the injury would have not appeared so stark.
The photo shows both cuts and a contusion — injuries that would normally be defined as serious bodily injury by many courts in torts cases where head injuries are treated as inherently potentially serious. The original police report said that he was bleeding from the nose and head and that his clothes looked like he had been in a fight. Zimmerman claims that it was Martin who jumped him, punched him, and pounded his head on to the concrete sidewalk.
The prosecutors can still argue that they do not contest the fight but that Zimmerman started it. However, with this photo, the charge of second-degree murder appears even more excessive and undermines Special Prosecutor Angela Corey’s claim that she was not affected by the political pressure to charge Zimmerman. I can understand a manslaughter charge, even with the photo, but no reasonable prosecutor would consider the second-degree murder charge as based on this evidence. Corey clearly must have seen this photo and the reports before her charging of Zimmerman.
The photo should also assist Zimmerman in his efforts to get bail.
Zimmerman, 28, is still being held on charges of second-degree murder of Martin, 17. In my view, a denial of bail would be an abuse and unwarranted given the fact that Zimmerman cooperated at the scene and voluntarily turned himself in.
Source: ABC
that was something really strange, I never met before, I couldn’t finish my contribution either and I surely pushed no publish button, I simply renewed the page hoping it would disappear.
Suddenly the area was unavailable to me, highlighted with Textarea comment. Whatever that was, and nothing worked anymore.
anyway let me finish: … if I didn’t appreciate your contributions, I would have left long ago. And something about the case fascinates me deeply.
This time, I must have been inattentive, and not the proverbial civil servant who over here in Germany has the reputation to be mainly fast asleep. There is even a word for it: bureau-sleep. I have to hurry.
If you use a good search engine for ‘ Zimmerman “anger management”,
Lazy as I am, what would you recommend besides Google. I got tired to look into all the latest developments in Web3.
But please don’t misunderstand, this “pick” wasn’t to criticize your contributions, quite the opposite, I wouldn’t have paid attention to it without you. I firmly believe in “collective labor”. If I wouldn’t respect your, Malisha, and Tony’s contributions highly
“Sentinel” escaped me with whatever cluster of extra letters. I’ll have to leave.
Bosco, you have printed a bunch of statements to show that Tony C strongly disagrees with you and so your conclusion that he is “one-sided” is perfectly logical. He is on HIS OWN SIDE supporting what HE BELIEVES and he said that, over and over, and he made no bones about it.
You got a problem with that?
Now, if someone were to ask Tony C to be the judge in this case, and the defense counsel failed to object to that, I can understand that there would be reason to carry on about it. A JUDGE in the case should not be biased for one side or the other, but should start off believing only that his or her job is to judge fairly and lawfully. But commentators on blogs can believe their own SIDE and they can be one-sided.
You like to characterize your own opinions as being strictly impartial, but of course, they are not, they are YOUR opinions, and of course, you could not properly judge the case either.
Now if a litigant wants to recuse a judge off a case for comments he has made in the course of a trial, and rulings he has made as the trial proceeded before him, a list of rulings and statements that he made AGAINST ANY PARTICULAR LITIGANT do not count as reason to recuse him. He is allowed to FORM HIS OPINION as the thing proceeds, and if it is not prejudicial to anybody’s rights, he is also allowed to express them. So merely quoting even an exhaustive list of comments he made — that all basically show that he disbelieves one of the litigants and believes the other side — IF the judge is the finder of fact and not a jury — will not even show bias on the part of a JUDGE.
So the fact that Tony is CONSISTENT only proves that he really believes the results of his own evaluation of this situation. It may also prove that he doesn’t see things YOUR WAY but of course, he doesn’t have to, does he?
If you think the answer is significant enough to do some research, could you come back with links to official documents that tell us what program Zimmerman had to go on in order to avoid being prosecuted for assaulting an officer?
I actually I tried to find out more. But it feels there are general programs and variable ones to fit the candidates. It may well be these are customized treaties and you will not be able to find out specifics. Over here this would be totally anonymous anyway, personality rights. No chance for the curious.
It would be interesting how long he was controlled like that. The maximum is 18 month. If he has a temper problem this may have felt like forced labor. You either go to court or do what you are told, report regularly and be a good soldier in society Semiole county even gives numbers lie participants, returns per year. I wonder if it was part of his job to coach the black kids, that are now used to show his good soul for longer now. That could have been such a specific program. I guess Crump and partners could find out.
But in the article there is a link to the basic laws and regulations of the program.
I agree with you, the MSNBC article doesn’t doesn’t satisfy my curiosity either, the report is vague. The clash with his then girlfriend was in August, but they don’t give us a precise date when his pre-trial diversion program started and when it ended:
In 2005, Zimmerman, then 20, was arrested and charged with
The earliest article I can find on the Orlando Sententiel is of March 15th when he is already 28. It doesn’t seem to be an accident that both events occurred in 2005.
But of course you are right, some inattentive civil servant or magistrate judge, I forget who is in charge exactly, simply used the context of the original event, and later it was customized. That could be. I’ll look into this closer, seems interesting, but not now. 😉 profiling GZ 😉
Words said by Tony C. (Does he sound one-sided and biased?)
“It is clear (to me at least)….that Zimmerman was pursuing Trayvon, and confronted Trayvon, and instigated the struggle.”
“..It is consistent with Zimmerman confronting Trayvon”
“any injuries Zimmerman received are the direct result of his choice to instigate a fight with an unarmed KID..”
“I do not believe a close shot would exonerate Zimmerman in any way, he is still the aggressor”
“pre-meditated stalking and confrontation”
“In my opinion he has proven a mental attitude and lack of intelligence that makes him an imminent and demonstrable danger to society.”
“..a 6’3″ BOY at 150lb is a skinny rail with very little overt musculature; it seems very unlikely to me that Trayvon would be mistaken for an adult.”
“..what Zimmerman said on the 911 tape implicates him as the aggressor.”
“…Zimmerman started the fight.”
“Zimmerman clearly began the fight…”
“Zimmerman pretending he was some sort of super cop and intimidating kids on the street..”
“Zimmerman was picking a fight.”
“..Zimmerman stalking him.”
“Zimmerman was playing vigilante..”
“Zimmerman started it by stalking Trayvon..”
“He(Zimmerman) claims he was jumped; but he was NOT..”
“exchange between Trayvon and an aggressive Zimmerman..”
“his(Zimmerman’s) lie about how the altercation started.”
“It makes no sense that he(Martin) began the fight.”
“I think Zimmerman is guilty of murder..”
“there is no such thing as unbiased thinking”
“he killed Trayvon because he was a paranoid asshole and Trayvon was a teenager”
“Zimmerman’s paranoia interpreted that as Trayvon looking for trouble..”
“Zimmerman thought he could play the gun-fighting town marshal..”
“he stalked Trayvon, confronted or cornered him..”
“The investigation is “dropped” by default…”
“neighborhood WATCH is WATCHING, not confronting, not getting out of your car, not hunting..”
“Zimmerman was hunting for Trayvon in order to confront him…”
“Zimmerman confronting Trayvon with hostility..”
“I have no HIDDEN agenda…I think Zimmerman is guilty and a danger to society”
“Zimmerman lied..”
“I think Zimmerman knew before he started following Trayvon that Trayvon had no gun, that is why he felt safe following him.”
“I actually doubt Trayvon HAD his hand in his wasteband..”
“A obsessive paranoid individual with delusions of grandeur stalked, terrorized, fought and then killed an innocent high school kid for walking around in ‘his’ neighborhood..”
“Zimmerman terrorized an innocent kid..”
“I still believe Zimmerman profiled Trayvon as one of the black teenagers burglarizing his neighborhood..”
“Zimmerman was the aggressor and Trayvon was innocent of any crime”
“Zimmerman, clearly hostile..”
“This is about cowards and sociopaths murdering people..”
“As for “clearly hostile,” I am not making it up…”
“..Zimmerman in his paranoid state of mind and the only thing that would explain the scuffle that immediately follows”
“Zimmerman was abusing the 911 line in order to deny teens their right to walk public streets..”
“Zimmerman is reporting ALL teens to the police (or perhaps just black teens) as “suspicious,”
“..he was going after Trayvon, following him or hunting for him”
“Zimmerman lied about being jumped from behind..”
“..Zimmerman needs to label him “suspicious” and try to get him off the street.”
“It was Zimmerman acting suspiciously, not Trayvon”
“I am not JUMPING to conclusions..”
“..Zimmerman as an aggressive stalker.”
“..Trayvon was already entitled to use deadly force against Zimmerman”
“Zimmerman was ALREADY THE AGGRESSOR..”
“you say there may be extenuating circumstances: There are no imaginable, plausible extenuating circumstances that can erase Zimmerman’s paranoia from the 911 tape.”
“but it makes no difference if he stopped then.He WAS following Trayvon..”
“we do not HAVE to make any claims about Trayvon’s character..”
“Zimmerman was engaged in threatening behavior, and Trayvon was thenceforth justified in any action he took against Zimmerman”
“it makes no difference what Trayvon looked like or what his physical stature was..”
“@southernbelle: I don’t think Z had a desire to kill that man. Kill or be killed. tough choice.-“More bullshit”
“lose a fight” or “kill a KID”
“Zimmerman was intent on getting black kids off “HIS” streets”
“there is no such thing as GUILTY LOOKING”
“to my ears Zimmerman’s story sounds like very bad fiction full of holes. He was the aggressor and he is trying to hide it”
“you assume Zimmerman is telling the truth, on the tape and afterward. Zimmerman clearly wanted the police to come out and harass Trayvon. He could be lying on the 911 tape..”
“Zimmerman was an over-zealous, aggressive, frustrated paranoid, and I do not presume Zimmerman was telling the truth to the dispatcher, I think he was spinning it all with deniable lies”
“I think Zimmerman instigated the whole thing by following Trayvon in the first place, and from the INSTANT he left his car with a gun to follow Trayvon, he was the aggressor, with no right to claim “self defense.”
“Zimmerman DID have a motive for lying, he wanted the police to have a reason to stop Trayvon, search him, and possibly arrest him”
“Did Trayvon run? Only according to Zimmerman. I think it is at least plausible that Zimmerman lost sight of Trayvon and exaggerated that into “he ran” so the dispatcher would think Trayvon was running to escape a crime..”
“There is no such thing as ALL the fact..”
“Zimmerman’s guilt is evident on the evidence we already have, Sharpton has nothing to do with it. I am not RUSHING to judgment…”
“I believe Zimmerman profiled Trayvon..”
“Because of his profiling (which I personally believe was ‘black teenager walking the streets at night’) Zimmerman had already convicted Trayvon in his mind..”
“I believe Zimmerman was looking to punish one of the “assholes that always get away….to teach them a lesson about walking his streets without his approval.”
“I believe Zimmerman was telling deniable lies about at least some of this, in order to manipulate the police..”
“I think Zimmerman was already guilty of false reporting..”
“I believe Zimmerman profiled Trayvon without any evidence whatsoever..”
“I think Zimmerman was falsifying the report, in a deniable way, in order to get the police to respond..”
5) I believe Trayvon was alarmed, and he left the street or sidewalk because he was being followed by car. That would make sense, if you are being followed by a car and you are worried about a possible racist inspired drive by or some kind of assault, put some distance between yourself and the road. Take a route that the car cannot follow.
sorry, I should have checked, was I just using John, instead of Tony? Yes I did. That is the antipode to my favorite witness, actually. That’s probably why. I do not trust witness John.
But thanks, Tony, thanks a lot for the usage alert concerning roust. I wonder if that already made it into a dictionary? Hmmm? At least in none of the online ones, but I have to check all first. That’s interesting.
*********************************************************************
Strictly the car puzzles me for longer now. It’s usually assumed that Zimmerman himself just returned from a store. So one automatically assumes he drove the same route, he describes in a very complicated way to the dispatcher. But if he just drove this route himself, and parked were some assume, he somehow can’t be facing TM approaching, but exactly the other way. The only place he could watch TM approach is indeed on the “cut through” before Twin makes a right turn, facing cars coming in through the front gate. If he parked there he could indeed see Trayvon Martin approach.
The problem I have is, this would be pretty easy to explain, no? You come in through the front gate, stay on the same road as it turns left past the clubhouse, go straight ahead and before the street turns right you find my car parked straight ahead in the curve next to the cross-walk. He should be even able to estimate feet or yards straight ahead before the turn right.
In Google Earth that’s the only place were a car is parked in the street. These streets don’t seem to be made to park cars other than inside the garage or in front of the house, it feels. But that is private space Zimmerman wouldn’t use. Am I terribly wrong?
He lived there for three years, supposedly patrolled the community with his dog, and doesn’t know the four streets in the gated community?
What I wonder for a longer time now, is this: Did the police check were he parked his car? What do you think?
***************************************************************************
But interesting theory.
leander22,
You will note that I don’t consider significant the information on what precisely the outcome of shoving the officer was.
I’m quite happy to go with the MSNBC report, even though it does not produce any links to actual source information – which leaves open that they could be mistaken.
If you use a good search engine for ‘ Zimmerman “anger management”, you will find a large number of reports stating that this was what happened. They seem no more and no less credible than the MSNBC report.
The question is therefore open.
If you think the answer is significant enough to do some research, could you come back with links to official documents that tell us what program Zimmerman had to go on in order to avoid being prosecuted for assaulting an officer?
leander22: “Sling Trebuchet, this might of interest to you, you have to follow the link in the article below.
A closer look at George Zimmerman”
Thanks for that.
It doesn’t change anything much, other than Zimmerman may not have had any professional guidance in dealing with his anger issues.
Shoving an officer indicates an anger issue. He may have been drinking at the time, but the effect of alcohol is to remove inhibitions on behaviour, not to cause behaviour (other than falling over).
Everything I wrote above still holds, with the exception that while Zimmerman was ignoring good sense and NW rules, he was not ignoring formal Anger Management classes.
We have an angry and frustrated Zimmerman (These assholes, they always get away. F**king ****s”) carrying a gun and following a person he suspected might be an armed villain into the dark.
That’s reckless and dangerous.
Had it not been for Zimmerman’s recklessness, the shooting would not have happened.
When they met, we don’t know exactly what happened. The only witness,so far, to the exchange was Zimmerman’s girlfriend who overhead it. Her story contradicts Zimmerman’s as to what was said.
We also have indications that Zimmerman is capable of shoving an officer, never mind some punk kid.
Had the incident happened on the roadway beside Zimmerman’s SUV, there would still be uncertainty as to who provoked the fight.
However the incident happened about 200 feet away, down a pathway in the dark, and we know that Zimmerman was following. The kind of common sense exhibited in the NW rules tells anyone sensible that Zimmerman was being reckless in this and that he was the provocateur.
Two interesting article for my Zimmerman collection.
Sling Trebuchet, this might of interest to you, you have to follow the link in the article below.
A closer look at George Zimmerman
Why is it we alway hear it was anger management? MSNBC seems to have checked the real documents.
John C, you might be interested in this:
Who is George Zimmerman?
So while it is somehow puzzling to us that he reports the kids that play in the street–quite a mixed crew it feels, different hues and ages–to the police. He may really be trying to protect them from the evil out there, from which he himself was protected.
I know, I know, I know this may be simply rumor from two chance encounters with families that the Zimmerman kids wouldn’t have liked to play with anyway. But there you go, you take what you can.
@leander22: Why should he lie when he called 911, at that point he had no reason to do so. He obviously convinced the dispatcher to not only send one but several officers. …
I believe the result was the point and the motive for lying. But, in detail, here is the point by point:
1) I believe Zimmerman profiled Trayvon as one of the “assholes” committing crimes in his community, that is why he was cursing him and saying “these assholes always get away.”
2) Because of his profiling (which I personally believe was ‘black teenager walking the streets at night’) Zimmerman had already convicted Trayvon in his mind, and although he knew Trayvon was not doing anything illegal, he wanted to teach the asshole a lesson by getting him rousted by the cops.
You sound like an English speaker to me, Leander, but FYI the word “roust” technically just means “arrest,” but has the overtones of unfair or harassing arrest. You see it on TV shows when the police threaten to arrest somebody for some minor offense if they do not divulge information.
So when I say “roust” Trayvon, I mean I believe he wanted the police to interrogate Trayvon, search him, and by chance perhaps find drugs, or a gun, or that Trayvon was high, or had something stolen on him. Perhaps they would arrest Trayvon and bring him down to the station for prints, and he would spend the night in jail.
I believe Zimmerman was looking to punish one of the “assholes that always get away.” Not to kill him, but to teach them a lesson about walking his streets without his approval.
3) Thus, I believe Zimmerman needed some excuse to make the threat more than it was. So he told the police “he’s on drugs or something,” and “he’s up to no good,” and he implied Travon had a gun in his waistband. He told the police he was acting suspiciously, and “looking at all the buildings,” which implies looking for weaknesses to exploit for crime. He told the police Trayvon acted threateningly (by approaching him with his hand in his waistband as if there was a gun), he told the police Trayvon “ran,” and was “getting away,” both of which imply guilt of some crime.
4) I believe Zimmerman was telling deniable lies about at least some of this, in order to manipulate the police into rousting Trayvon, with the effect of both scaring and punishing one of the “assholes.” I believe that is a clear motive for lying.
5) I believe Trayvon was alarmed, and he left the street or sidewalk because he was being followed by car. That would make sense, if you are being followed by a car and you are worried about a possible racist inspired drive by or some kind of assault, put some distance between yourself and the road. Take a route that the car cannot follow.
6) I believe that when Trayvon made that move, Zimmerman thought he was going to lose track of him. Trayvon was going to “get away,” and Zimmerman’s rousting plan was falling apart. So to prevent that, Zimmerman parked his car and followed Trayvon.
That is the end of the point by point. I think Zimmerman was already guilty of false reporting, but I think when he exits his car with a gun, he becomes a vigilante and the instigator of the confrontation to follow, no matter how it transpired. I think Trayvon is already alarmed that somebody is following him, and if Trayvon confronts Zimmerman, that was Trayvon’s right in self defense under the SYG law.
In any case, I believe Zimmerman profiled Trayvon without any evidence whatsoever. Being roughly the same race and age as some criminal is not valid grounds for suspicion of wrong-doing, I have been roughly the same race and age as murderers and serial killers on the loose, along with ten million other men in this country, that alone is not grounds for interrogation, search, arrest or harassment.
So I think Zimmerman was falsifying the report, in a deniable way, in order to get the police to respond. I think he was worried when the dispatcher said, “Okay, he is just walking around the area.”
“Just walking around” is a minimizing statement; it implies Trayvon is doing nothing wrong. So I think Zimmerman starts to lie, in order to escalate Trayvon’s innocent activity into a threat and elicit the armed response from the police he wants.
And you have Professor Turley jumping to the conclusion that the photograph he posted at the top of this thread “shows serious injury on Zimmerman’s head.”
well, Malisha, I guess we are slightly heartless people. Heartlessly stubborn and prejudiced, ask you know who. Neither a broken nose, nor the “scratches” do convince us. Although this is at least slightly more convincing and colorful than the peculiar cross shaped scar in the enhanced video, that one surely didn’t look like a fresh wound to me. No doubt it hurts if you are hit on your nose. But I do not think it is very hard to break. Mine was broken too once.
This is my favorite witness. It feels this must be the teacher. She made sure the acoustics of the encounter were preserved for the world and criminology.
Personally, I am no fan of “the Dersh”. I would love even more to see him wrong than Zimmerman convicted. Honestly, I have no problem to leave Zimmerman to retributive justice or the goddess nemesis. Under the pressure of circumstances, admittedly. These sheet anchors of provable reality may well suffice. Although? Shouldn’t banging someone’s head on concrete result in brain concussions, and isn’t that somehow dangerously hard to recognize from the outside. When did he have his medical report done? The next day. ….
The “bloody head” will leave it’s imprint on the Jury. After all, how are they to judge to what extend he really felt in mortal danger? Almost impossible to tell. That’s why strictly the realization that he may have something to show could have triggered both first his scream and closely after or parallel the idea of SYG. If I shoot now, nothing can happen to me. Who are these demagogues that influenced me again? Poor demonized Zimmerman.
I am wondering at what point in his life he had the famous (drama and tragedy) theatrical masks tattooed on his left arm.
It just struck me how ironic and essentially silly this concern is about those of us on this thread who believe George Zimmerman is appropriately charged with murder having “jumped to conclusions before all the facts are in.” In light of George Zimmerman having initiated this national tragedy with his own conduct of (a) jumping to conclusions that Trayvon Martin was a criminal who did not belong in his neighborhood; and (b) jumping to conclusions that the police were not going to be able to handle the situation if he simply left it to them to do their jobs that night; and (c) jumping to — and this one I don’t believe but he brought it up so I’ll attribute it to him as well — the conclusion that if he didn’t kill Martin his own life might be forfeit.
It is also a bit silly to concentrate on the conclusions we (who believe George Zimmerman is probably guilty beyond a reasonable doubt) have jumped to “before all the facts are in” when the police (a) jumped to the conclusion that what the suspect told them on 2/26/2012 would be the only story they would have to deal with so they could accept it at face value; and (b) jumped to the conclusion that they did not even have to do any serious evidence-collecting because the victim was some throw-away kid who might remain a “John Doe” forever; and (c) jumped to the conclusion that there would be no further local interest in one dead Black kid so all they had to do was to come up with their illogical, official story and just keep the rest of the witnesses discouraged enough to continue to “say nothing, do nothing” and the problem would blow over.
Then you have Dershowitz jumping to the conclusion that the only evidence available to the prosecutor was the evidence we have seen in the news, even though he knows full well that SHE HAD THE AUTOPSY REPORT AND HE NEVER GOT A SINGLE SOUND BYTE ON THAT PART OF IT.
And you have Professor Turley jumping to the conclusion that the photograph he posted at the top of this thread “shows serious injury on Zimmerman’s head.” That was a heck of a jump, without any EMT or medical personnel’s official report dated 2/26/2012 after 7:30 pm to explain it or back it up.
Seems like in the race to “jump to conclusions,” we’re still not pulling ahead of the crowd.
Oh, and about “answering and answering fast” if you’re scared? That’s for subordinates who recognize that they are being interrogated by officials who have authority over them.
So, are we to assume, together with SouthernBelle and probably many of her gentle countrywomen (or his gentle countrymen) that Trayvon Martin should have jumped to the conclusion, upon seeing George Zimmerman approach him, that he was a subordinate being interrogated by an official who had authority over him? That’s an assumption from bygone years, Miss Belle. Lessee, 2012 minus 1864, oh, yeah, 178 of those bygone years, to be more exact. Yes ma’am.
sb; you sound like an unfeeling sociopath here. THE FACT THAT A YOUNG PERSON WAS SHOT TO DEATH IS THE MOST IMPORTANT CONSIDERATION. Obviously.
If you think TM “answering questions, and I mean answering fast” – Questions barked at him at night (by a stranger who refuses to say why he has been following him)
is more important? There is something really really wrong with you. jmho.
Hi, a couple of things. First, SouthernBell, your speech/writing pattern has sure changed recently! Wow.
Leander, I have known Jewish Zimmermans and non-Jewish Zimmermans. Same with most of the other “Jewish” surnames.
The reason for my concern about the Jewish surname was simply that a suggestion of grievous wrong-doing on the part of an individual usually makes a group, if they are a minority, worry about “retaliation” and the Jews are only too aware of that. I have tried to get rid of that reflexive response but no luck yet.
That brings up, however, the idea that “teen-agers believe themselves invincible.” I don’t believe studies show that Black teen-agers in the American South suffer from that core belief. At least their degree of presumed invincibility is probably much less than expected by the run-of-the-mill blogger. I’d ask Ottery Scribe to weigh in on the question before coming to my final conclusion.
matt. very intimidating for a young woman/girl and she had just heard a GUNSHOT. i don’t think we will hear all of what was said, might, if not exonerate z. but might not put t. in the best ligjht. I keep hearing ‘in hind sight’ whose hind sight. How could anyone look back later and come to a conclusion if the WEREN’T THERE ???? That is just plain stupid, and freakin’ funny for us to read, we’ve been laughing at some statements. been fun actually. Everyone said Z asked in a hostile voice, another haha, how did they come up with that one? AND IF MARTIN WAS AS SCARED AS SOME PEOPLE THINK. DON’T YOU THINK I WOULD BE ANSWERING SOME QUESTIONS, AND I MEAN ANSWERING FAST.
Some just won’t consider anything other then the fact that shot M. Well, after he attacked G, which is obvious, had the right to protect hisself. IN or out of his car, followed him to see where he went. George had the right to stand his ground.
And when I FIRST heard about the Zimmerman case, before I heard the details, read the articles, and started to study it, here is — very unfortunately — what I thought: “OH GOD I hope Zimmerman is not a Jew!”
I encountered that rumor early, on the Zimmerman supporting side. Somehow I wondered if the people below triggered or reacted to it. They only put it online on April 12. …
As a German I find it peculiar that “Jewish names” are discussed to the extend they are, even in the American Jewish community nowadays. Like on this site: Is George Zimmerman Jewish? I couldn’t resist to leave a hasty anonymous comment there. Fact is the Prussian king post emancipation wanted the Jews to remain recognizable, why not he thought via their names. So he decreed it, but his civil servants tried to ignore his order as much as possible, it was just too difficult, except of course for a series of typical Jewish names, like Cohen.
Odd blog, the address suggests it’s in Germany “blogspot.de”, but if you look it up that’s not were it is hosted but by Google and somehow Mark Monitor Inc
Remember Bob Dylan’s name is Zimmerman and Bob Dylan is Jewish thus shouldn’t it be a Jewish name.That’s the easy reasoning, I guess. It’s simply the German word for carpenter, a trade name like miller or smith.
Oh Oh Bosco, I’m CAUGHT and now I just CAN’T equivocate any more and avoid your direct and challenging questions and boo hoo I just HAVE TO ANSWER HONESTLY oh oh ouch oouch!!! There’s nowhere to HIDE any more and all those gallant minded prejudiced defenders of mine have abandoned me to my fate, boo hoo hooooooo! Oh well then if there’s no escaping my just punishment for being evasive so long on a subject so important, here’s my honest answer.
When I heard about Duke I thought, “Hey they fired a prosecutor? Cool! I wonder if he was related to Gribetz??”
When I heard about Brawley I thought, “OMG, what is Bosco gonna think about THIS ONE?”
Thanks for bringing this up Malisha
Malisha…1)What was YOUR HONEST take on the ‘Duke Lacrosse’ charge when you first heard and saw it in the news?????
2)What was your take and HONEST VIEW of the ‘Tawana Brawley’ case when it was unfolding in the news and Sharpton was doing the very same media manipulation as he has been on this case?
If I remember correctly one witness, the teacher, heard the argument, and again if I remember correctly, she heard the aggression on the side of the older male. Now it is always a question to what extend the stories change with more information. I would have immediately sat down and written what and how I experienced it. I guess not many people do.
To answer your question, yes, if Zimmerman reacted impulsively, he would have needed to come up with a story really fast. He knew the police was on the way. I never decided who actually screamed. I can even imagine that with Dee Dee still mentally present, Trayvon may not have wanted to scream to appear like a weakling.
There are different possible scenarios obviously. It would make sense from a neighborhood watch man to expect help from the community to arrest, to detain “the suspect” till police arrived. Just as screaming Martin could have triggered peculiar reactions in Zimmerman, would a criminal scream? What consequences would another assault have for him, to list just two examples.
If you invent a story there is a basic rule, always stay close to what actually happened. The confused Zimmerman walking up and down and not reacting to the questions of the two ladies could suggest such a scenario. Involved in a deep brainstorming.
*********************************************************************************
the witnesses from my point of view are the weakest chains to unravel the whole story, but that means both DeeDee and John and/or the scared female.
The problem I have is the female” is talking about somebody with a white shirt on top. Neither of both had a white jacket. Zimmerman described his hoodie as a “dark” hoodie, a gray hoodie. That’s not exactly white. Zimmerman wore a red jacket. Am I to assume Trayvon first pulled of his hoodie, was wearing a white shirt beneath it, than put it on again after he was shot?
Actually John is a scared too, I seem to remember from his 911 call: I am not going out there. Strictly it would have been helpful had he gone out, he could have prevented the shot. He doesn’t talk about the color but simply says: the one lying in the grass now is the one that was on top before.
Strictly John may tell a story to soothe his own bad conscience for not having helped, but instead going upstairs to call 911? Thanks god the man that screamed could help himself!
There are scenarios in which DeeDee’s motives could be eerily similar to Johns, and I am sure she will be grilled extensively by O’Mara.
I think, I’ve suggested this before. What if she asked, who do you think he is, and why is he watching you? What if she indeed showed curiosity at the time? Which may have pushed Trayvon into actions to prove to her he was a fearless man, actions he may not have taken without his girlfriend as a semi-witness, to satisfy his own and her curiosity, like confronting him. Would he have used the language Zimmerman tells us he used?
Why should you run if someone is watching you? Zimmerman wasn’t following Trayvon at that point. Could TM or DeeDee really grasp the danger he was in at the time of their her phone call?
The whole story–I told him to run–does only make sense if Trayvon’s and Zimmerman’s path had crossed before and suddenly he was there again. Had Trayvon noticed an unusual interest in his person from Zimmerman earlier? That of course would raise his alarm one notch. They had two phone calls. Isn’t it slightly unusual even for teenagers to call twice – 7:04 and 7:12 — in such a short interval. It would make sense under the above scenario. Is he still around?
Strictly; and I am not sure if I understand this correctly, over here we would be able to see the exact time, including seconds at which the call was disconnected on our mobile records. I read somewhere this is not the case in the US. This would mean the mobile phone records maybe cannot support her story to the second. Is there a chance to get it, is this only a technical trick to increase income via rounded up connection time, but somehow it is still recorded precisely somewhere? But maybe I misunderstood.
To what extend does or can the state of Tayvon’s phone support her story? Was it broken, would it be harmed by falling into the grass?
My ideal scenario in all this of course would be if one could trace the exact movements of both via their mobiles. But maybe that is not possible. Would be nice though. 😉