For months, conservatives and conspiracy theorists have been flogging a story of a huge arms buildup within the Department of Homeland Security. I was a bit taken aback by the purchase of roughly 2 billion rounds by the DHS as well as a report of the purchase of 2700 light-armored vehicles. However, it seemed like the coverage was over-wrought and that such bulk purchases could be viewed as efficient contracting to get the lowest possible price. Yet, now the DHS has reportedly ordered 360,000 addition rounds of hollow tip bullets (sometimes called Dum-Dum bullets) in addition to huge prior orders. I do not understand why such an arsenal has to be created within this one agency, particularly the use of these bullets designed to maximize damage to the human body.
DHS put out a call to purchase 360,000 rounds of “Commercial leaded training ammo (CLTA) Pistol .40 caliber 165 grain, jacketed hollow point.” The bullets are to be sent to the Federal Law Enforcement Training Center in Artesia, New Mexico, which already received 240,000 hollow point rounds just last month.
I am not sure why our federal agents are practicing with hollow tips in the first place. Some have argued that these bullets reduce the risk of bullets traveling through suspects or material and hitting bystanders. However, international agreements have long identified such bullets as cruel and sought to bar their use. This includes the Hague Convention of 1899, Declaration III, that prohibits the use in international warfare of bullets that easily expand or flatten in the body.
I would like to understand why DHS is on such an overall buying spree of bullets and weapons. I do not subscribe to the conspiracy theories of a takeover or any of that nonsense. However, as a civil libertarian, I am concerned with the expansion of a security state in the United States with what is becoming a fully functional internal police army. This goes beyond the hollow tip bullets, which may be better for training (though the number is breathtaking). It reminds one of other countries where internal police are paramilitary organizations. It is part of the new normal. We are now getting accustomed to seeing automatic weapons and military-style forces on our streets. We have discussed recurring stories of overkill where local police seem eager to attack homes with armored vehicles purchased as part of the “anti-terrorism” budget. What is surprising is that there is little discussion about the implication of this militarization of our society.
What do you think?
ap,
Appropriate to you 😉
Of course you could ask your blog mates for suggestions … lol
My contribution:
http://img.izismile.com/img/img5/20121221/640/these_funny_animals_1109_640_14.jpg
Raff,
It’s amazing how many times “Obama’s doing X” turns out to be “Obama’s doing the same thing that’s been done in the past.”
Here is the link to the Think Progress article actually quoting a Fox News debunking of the whole bullet purchase issue. http://thinkprogress.org/media/2013/03/25/1771591/oops-fox-news-pedals-conspiracy-theory-it-already-debunked/
I will have to find the link, but I read earlier today that the amount of bullets that DHS was actually less than the prior year or years. I will have to find the link.
Darren, I agree with all you’ve said and will add that the number seems excessive. (vehicles and ammunition). Of course the DHS could become the national LE ammunition distributor, which would ease some issues with rogue Colorado Sheriffs going off-script: “Toe the line, or have empty guns – your choice Boss.”
Only civil liability issues require LEOs to qualify with hollow-point bullets. Even then, a single “qualification” shooting session and not the run-up practice/training requires the use of “Issue” or “Duty” ammo.
Re: armored vehicles? VIPR for a start.
Secure patrol vehicles with an eye towards a 1 to 100 force multiplier.
100 cops, put down a student loan protest by 10,000 with no LEO injuries.
I’m feeling like we’re seeing preparations for a Northern Ireland police-presence, right down to the surveillance, warrantless seizure/apprehensions and Bloc prisons.
Reeks of one-party rule: The Monied Party.
Shut-up, pay, stay out of my way… or I’ll have you tossed in The Hole.
Little ap,
Blouse is correct… Some will and do use others names… Sometimes intentionally, sometimes unintentionally…. But then again, there’s no penalty for staying the way you are….
Blouise,
“find an appropriate pic” 🙂 made me smile for some reason… what? ar you thinking that I’ll post an inappropriate one?? just kidding…
in all seriousness, though, thanks. it’s time, i suppose.
ap,
Set up an email for blog only … find an appropriate pic then go to https://en.gravatar.com (notice the s after http indicating secure site) … register the email and upload the pic. then sign into the blog. It only takes a minute or two and protects you from those who would either purposely or mistakenly usurp your id.
What Otteray Scribe Said.
Jacketed Hollow Point (JHP) is the the de facto standard police bullet in the United States. .40 caliber is the most common size, followed by 9mm
For training purposes, it is a matter of the situation as to whether JHP or Full Metal Jacket (FMJ) is issued, or less commonly Round Nose (RN) or Semi-Wad Cutter (SWC) which are more or less lead bullets with or without a small copper jacket.
Generally RN is cheaper, but there is a growing concern of using this within indoor ranges due to the lead dust problem, plus it gums up the pistols easier, requiring a bit more cleaning.
FMJ is the second cheapest generally and works in indoor ranges, but there are some issues using metal targets because of deflection, breaking the target, and it can cause divots to form in the metal target which can redirect subsequent bullets in unpredictable directions. It is not an issue for paper targets
RN or JHP are good for metal targets (except the dust issue with RN) Metal targets are becoming more used but it is also a matter of cost efficiency. If a department bought a large shipment of JPH it might be close enough in cost to FMJ to offset a bit the savings vs versatility.
It can also be argued that training with the same ammunition that is used on duty is a better training situation, but cost benefit tends to favor in most cases using “range ammo” which is cheaper to use for training.
For usages, it is not unusual at an academy to go througth 5,000 rounds per rookie. I would estimate that at 600 rounds per year is not unusual for yearly qualification per officer and probably 100 more rounds for equipping that officer. (I carried 49 rounds in my magazines and pistol when I was at work)
It should be explained why DHS is asking for billions of rounds. Look at the numbers and make judgements based upon their personnel. The number of armoured cars seems excessive to me though.
This may be somewhat off topic, but there has been a lot of discussion on the internet about automatic rifles. Some Federally licensed shooting ranges have full auto weapons to rent onsite, legally. It is interesting and fun to shoot a machine gun at an old refrigerator, but most true assault rifles shoot between 600 and 1,200 rounds per minute. Given that ammunition may run from 75 cents up to about $2.50 per round, I have no desire to burn through two or three hundred dollars worth of ammo in 15 seconds.
There are a small number of places where one can rent a “Gatling gun” type mini-gun for target practice. They fire up to 6,000 rounds per minute. That means one brief trigger pull can cost over a thousand dollars.
Even for the most avid hobbyist shooter, that is far too painful to contemplate. There was a TV documentary recently about a company that makes armored vehicles for VIPs, from the President on down. Typically, in a convoy of VIP escort vehicles, one or more of them will have a retractable mini gun. The brief video below was produced by the company that builds these armored (and armed) escort vehicles. Those who know how many of these exist aren’t talking.
Dum Dum bullets and hollow points are two different things. “Dum Dum bullets,” are named for the Dum Dum Arsenal where they were invented in a town near Calcutta, India in the late 1800s. They are soft-nosed projectiles, not hollow points. That means they do not have a hollow point, but the nose of the bullet is made of a softer metal that expands or flattens when it hits something.
Hollow points have a hollowed out nose, often with notches around the hollow nose. Their purpose is to cause the bullet to fragment whenever it hits any object. That means it is less likely to pass through a Sheetrock wall, the skin of a pressurized airplane, or through a living target and kill somebody behind.
Hollow point ammunition has never been illegal or proscribed for law enforcement, and is permitted as a hunting round. As most of the regulars here know, I have worked with law enforcement for decades. This is old news to me. As for target practice, the average person is often surprised at how many rounds an officer or sport target shooter will use in target practice. I just bought a box of 500 pistol rounds for my daughter. She will probably go through most of them in one afternoon at the range. Large quantities of ammunition are needed for practice. Practice is important for an officer. Their lives may depend on it.
As for the quantity purchased by DHS, I have no idea. That number would have to be divided by the number of agents who will be using them to get some idea of whether this is a practical number or not. It really seems like a lot. The downside is that the huge purchases have created an ammunition shortage. The shortages have negatively affected local law enforcement agencies as well as sporting shooters, not to mention driving prices sky high.
Lt. Dave Grossi (Ret.) writes a column for Law Officer, and his column for May 2012 is online. Lt. Grossi addresses both the history of these rounds and explains why they are preferred for law enforcement use. He also addresses the Geneva Convention rules.
Lt. Grossi’s article is at the link below. It is not long, but informative for those not familiar with these rounds.
http://www.lawofficer.com/article/tactics-and-weapons/short-history-hollow-points
Clarification:
I post as “anonymously posted”, not “Anonymously posted”, FWIW. 😉 I – lower case “ap” — didn’t post the “Foster Gamble”… comment.
Foster Gamble, creator of the Thrive documentary on the Global Domination Agenda (GDA)–yes it’s a conspiracy theory, but one worth paying attention to–also raised questions about these bullet purchases in his 3/19/13 blog. In the background of the Patriot Act destruction of constitutional rights, surveillance drones, FEMA camps, NDAA indefinite detention, cancellation of Posse Comitatus and railway cars with shackles, these bullets give one more reason to wakeup and ask what’s going on. Read his blog at:
http://www.thrivemovement.com/bullet-points-ammunition-might-be-used-against-you.blog?utm_source=Why+does+the+US+Domestic+Security+force+need+1.6+Billion+bullets%3F&utm_campaign=Eblast-+Bullets+Blog&utm_medium=email
Arthur Randolph Erb 1, March 26, 2013 at 9:35 am
… hollow points are good for law enforcement use … I have no problem with that at all.
===============================================
Doesn’t that beg the question “what law is being enforced?”
Tyranny has its laws too.
I have a problem with enforcing the laws of tyrants.
Gene H. 1, March 26, 2013 at 10:17 am
“So ya
Thought ya
Might like to go to the show.
To feel the warm thrill of confusion
That space cadet glow.
Tell me is something eluding you, sunshine?
Is this not what you expected to see?
If you wanna find out what’s behind these cold eyes
You’ll just have to claw your way through this disguise.”
Repeal the Patriot Act.
Dismantle DHS.
Our country was founded upon the usurpation of tyranny.
It’s the American thing to do.
==============================================
Pink Floyd.
We need to get our national sanity back by doing what you said following that colorful colloquy.
@marty
Ok…Now im really concerned about all this militarization when its not a right wing nut talking about it.
Whatever else may be said about quantity etc understand something important about hollow point rounds: The deflect much less than fully jacketed ones.
If you are firing in an environment with lots of hard objects for bullets to ricochet off of then they actually make for a safer situation for by-standers.
Now why they need them in these numbers? Well I have no idea, maybe they require constant practice (they should!) and buying at this level would be cheaper. Anyone know how many rounds the FBI buys? Years ago I took a tour of their place in DC & they showed us the barrels (yes, barrels!) of expended casings from just a week of mandatory practice for their DC agents.
Repeal the Patriot Act.
Dismantle DHS.
Our country was founded upon the usurpation of tyranny.
It’s the American thing to do. -Gene H.
Yep.
…and then came the fusion centers. More money well spent. Dumb and dumber, to be sure.
Homeland Security ‘fusion’ centers spy on citizens, produce ‘shoddy’ work, report says
By Michael Isikoff
NBC News
http://openchannel.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/10/02/14187433-homeland-security-fusion-centers-spy-on-citizens-produce-shoddy-work-report-says?lite
Excerpt:
“The ranking Republican on a Senate panel on Wednesday accused the Department of Homeland Security of hiding embarrassing information about its so-called “fusion” intelligence sharing centers, charging that the program has wasted hundreds of millions of dollars while contributing little to the country’s counterterrorism efforts.
…
The fusion centers, created under President George W. Bush and expanded under President Barack Obama, consist of special teams of federal , state and local officials collecting and analyzing intelligence on suspicious activities throughout the country. They have been hailed by Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano as “one of the centerpieces” of the nation’s counterterrorism efforts.
But Sen. Tom Coburn of Oklahoma, the ranking Republican on the panel, charged Wednesday that Homeland Security had tried to bury evidence of problems at the centers.
“Unfortunately, DHS has resisted oversight of these centers,” he said. “The Department opted not to inform Congress or the public of serious problems plaguing its fusion centers and broader intelligence efforts. When this subcommittee requested documents that would help it identify these issues, the department initially resisted turning them over, arguing that they were protected by privilege, too sensitive to share, were protected by confidentiality agreements, or did not exist at all. The American people deserve better. I hope this report will help generate the reforms that will help keep our country safe.”