Bizarre, Politics, Society

Dumb and Dum-Dumer: Homeland Security Orders Huge Delivery of Hollow Point Bullets As Part of Military Buildup

DeptHomelandSec220px-JSP_and_JHP_bulletsFor months, conservatives and conspiracy theorists have been flogging a story of a huge arms buildup within the Department of Homeland Security. I was a bit taken aback by the purchase of roughly 2 billion rounds by the DHS as well as a report of the purchase of 2700 light-armored vehicles. However, it seemed like the coverage was over-wrought and that such bulk purchases could be viewed as efficient contracting to get the lowest possible price. Yet, now the DHS has reportedly ordered 360,000 addition rounds of hollow tip bullets (sometimes called Dum-Dum bullets) in addition to huge prior orders. I do not understand why such an arsenal has to be created within this one agency, particularly the use of these bullets designed to maximize damage to the human body.


DHS put out a call to purchase 360,000 rounds of “Commercial leaded training ammo (CLTA) Pistol .40 caliber 165 grain, jacketed hollow point.” The bullets are to be sent to the Federal Law Enforcement Training Center in Artesia, New Mexico, which already received 240,000 hollow point rounds just last month.

220px-.38_Special_mushrooming_side_viewI am not sure why our federal agents are practicing with hollow tips in the first place. Some have argued that these bullets reduce the risk of bullets traveling through suspects or material and hitting bystanders. However, international agreements have long identified such bullets as cruel and sought to bar their use. This includes the Hague Convention of 1899, Declaration III, that prohibits the use in international warfare of bullets that easily expand or flatten in the body.

I would like to understand why DHS is on such an overall buying spree of bullets and weapons. I do not subscribe to the conspiracy theories of a takeover or any of that nonsense. However, as a civil libertarian, I am concerned with the expansion of a security state in the United States with what is becoming a fully functional internal police army. This goes beyond the hollow tip bullets, which may be better for training (though the number is breathtaking). It reminds one of other countries where internal police are paramilitary organizations. It is part of the new normal. We are now getting accustomed to seeing automatic weapons and military-style forces on our streets. We have discussed recurring stories of overkill where local police seem eager to attack homes with armored vehicles purchased as part of the “anti-terrorism” budget. What is surprising is that there is little discussion about the implication of this militarization of our society.

What do you think?

70 thoughts on “Dumb and Dum-Dumer: Homeland Security Orders Huge Delivery of Hollow Point Bullets As Part of Military Buildup”

  2. “So ya
    Thought ya
    Might like to go to the show.
    To feel the warm thrill of confusion
    That space cadet glow.
    Tell me is something eluding you, sunshine?
    Is this not what you expected to see?
    If you wanna find out what’s behind these cold eyes
    You’ll just have to claw your way through this disguise.”

    Repeal the Patriot Act.
    Dismantle DHS.
    Our country was founded upon the usurpation of tyranny.
    It’s the American thing to do.

  3. Does anyone happen to have the bullet orders from similar organizations? Or what they’ve been in the past?

    I mean, how many times in the past 6 years have we been told breathlessly that Obama’s been doing something horrible and literally using the tax payers money as toilet paper, when it turns out that he uses two ply instead of the Three Ply Bush the Younger insisted on?

  5. Under the recently authorized Trespass Bill, H.R. 347, protesters that allegedly disrupt occurrences acknowledged by the DHS of being a National Special Security Event will be charged with a federal crime. As the DHS gains more and more ground in fighting terrorism domestically, the US at the same time has turned the tables to make its definition of terrorist way less narrow. With any American blogger or free thinking on the fringe of what the government can go after under H.R. 347, or the National Defense Authorization Act that allows for the indefinite detention of US citizens without charge, the DHS could just be blasting through what’s left of its budget to make sure that its roster of agents across the country can get in their target practice over the next few years.

  6. The Trouble With “Homeland”

    It’s a creepy, morale-sapping word. Let’s drop it.

    By Mickey Kaus
    June 14, 2002

    http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/kausfiles_special/2002/06/the_trouble_with_homeland.html

    Excerpt:

    1) It’s Un-American: “Homeland,” as Noonan notes, isn’t a word Americans have been used to using. It’s word Germans have been used to using. “Heimat,” a common German word, means home — and not home as in “home and hearth” either (that’s “heim”). “Heimat” means “home” as in a place or nation that’s home. “Heimatland” is the literal analog of “homeland,” as I understand it. It’s not specifically a Nazi word — it’s a general patriotic and sentimental word. It was used during World War I, for example. My mother, who was born in Germany but fled at age 10, can sing from memory a pre-Hitler song with “Heimatland” in it. Still, Nazi or not, the word is uncomfortably Teutonic-sounding. (And you don’t think the Nazis appropriated it?) My raw sentiments are these: I’m an American, not a German. My father fought in a bloody war so I wouldn’t have to be a German. Why is the Bush administration telling me I need to be German now?

    “Homeland” is un-American in another way: it explicitly ties our sentiments to the land, not to our ideas. Logically, this step makes no sense (presumably we want to stop terrorism even if it targets Americans and American institutions abroad). It also misses the exceptional American contribution that’s worth defending. People throughout history have felt sentimental attachment to their land.

    We’re sentimentally attached to something less geographic: i.e., freedom.

    End of excerpt.

    And it would seem that we’re stuck with it… and all that has followed…

  8. It is an alien concept, just as “homeland” is. -Dredd

    What’s in a name? A lot, apparently.

    “Rudy’s Duty
    Plus: Homeland ain’t no American word.”

    by Peggy Noonan, 2002

    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122418750653241949.html

    Excerpt:

    “The name Homeland Security grates on a lot of people, understandably. Homeland isn’t really an American word, it’s not something we used to say or say now. It has a vaguely Teutonic ring–Ve must help ze Fuehrer protect ze Homeland!–and Republicans must always be on guard against sounding Teutonic.

    As a brilliant friend who is also actually an intellectual says, “I think it’s creepy, in a Nazi-resonating way, any time this sort of home-and-hearth language is used by people who are essentially police. When police honestly call themselves police, or ‘domestic security,’ I salute and say ‘Yes officer.’ When they call themselves ‘Protectors of the Hearth’ I get the creeps.” …

    Who could argue? Not me. (end of excerpt)

    …and I don’t often quote Peggy Noonan.

  9. Well if you believe the US government is intent on effectively repealing the second amendment, the dollar is a doomed fiat currency given the fact the US debt is past the point of no return. The government can spy, rendition, assassinate, torture and commit crime with no recourse, then you probably don’t see that civil unrest in the US is a distinct possibility. The debt alone has the potential to collapse the dollar at pretty much anytime. Yes some naive Keynesian’s will tell you everything is fine, the federal reserve can just print dollars, so did Germany after WWI, Aegentina many times, Zimbabwe most recently, monetary history does not favor this course of action. So given any of these circumstances, dollar collapse, drones killing Americans, torture etc, it is plain to see that mass protest or riots could become normal. The US government is bent on hegemony, there own population seems to be being conditioned for a police state, it’s not conspiracy to see it happening. As the article states the police are becoming increasingly militarized, with constant news stories about police brutality, muder and corruption. The government has become fascist in many respects and regards its power and secrecy above that of its own population, this trend is not new, most of it began in the so called “progressive era”, under Wilson. Many no doubt will say this is merely contrarian, or conspiratorial, but any honest account of government power, once checked by the constitution has been destroyed purposely for government power.

  10. A national strike and retail boycott should suffice to cripple the economy and force govt resignation. No need for violence

  11. “I do not subscribe to the conspiracy theories of a takeover or any of that nonsense.”

    That is because you are socially constrained, because it would ruin your career.

    The fear to speak out is contoured according to social standing.

    That aside, one cannot “takeover” what is already obviously taken over.

    How long would it take to produce a competent report detailing how to take over a city or state within the U.S. … days, weeks, months, or years?

    The answer to that is the answer, in part, to the nature of the following report:

    A new report by the U.S. Army War College talks about the possibility of Pentagon resources and troops being used should the economic crisis lead to civil unrest, such as protests against businesses and government or runs on beleaguered banks.

    “Widespread civil violence inside the United States would force the defense establishment to reorient priorities in extremis to defend basic domestic order and human security,” said the War College report.

    The study says economic collapse, terrorism and loss of legal order are among possible domestic shocks that might require military action within the U.S.

    (Phoenix Business Journal, “Ariz. police say they are prepared as War College warns military must prep for unrest; IMF warns of economic riots“, emphasis added). The news report is dated Dec 17, 2008.

    Senator John McCain had said not long before that, during the presidential election of that year, “what economic problems.”

    There were no economic problems of a magnitude that would legally allow the military to take to the streets of America back then, so it begs the question, how long does the military take to produce such an all encompassing attack plan, and train the police accordingly?

    That answer gets worse the further back it goes, i.e., the longer it takes to produce such a comprehensive report and then deploy it to USNORTHCOM.

    Going back in time to when there was a government budget surplus (~2000) and low unemployment, and contemplating having to put troops in the streets to put down an economic rebellion raises questions.

    What information could they possibly have that such a massive economic collapse was going to take place?

    Thus the question, “what is the difference between ‘planned together’ and ‘conspired together’ in this context?”

    The answer is the result intended as the reason for the “collaboration.”

    If the result is a legal one, then it is “planned together”, but if the result is a crime then the proper term is “conspired together”:

    The concept of criminal conspiracy has its earliest roots in fourteenth century English common law. At that time, it saw limited use as a legal theory. It became more broadly applied in the United States in the nineteenth century, though still the scope of prosecutions was not wide. Today, however, conspiracy is a far-reaching legal principle, embracing antitrust actions, an enormous number of more traditional criminal cases, and even tort lawsuits. It is the basis of prosecutions dealing with, among other crimes, drug violations, securities fraud, murder for hire, bank robbery, and extortion.

    … Conspiracy is an agreement by two or more people to commit a crime.

    (Conspiracy Theory, Law). What can transform a “conspiracy theory” into mere “planning together” is to make what was once criminal no longer a crime.

    Where there is no crime, there cannot be any criminal conspiracy theory advanced by a prosecutor.

    Seen any repeal of laws relating to financial regulations, banks, etc. during that time frame?

    If so, then you are correct to disparage those who would allege conspiracy, because where something is no longer a crime, no such conspiracy can take place.

    However, does that erase a problem or create a worse one?

    Will people one day say “bring back the conspiracy theory” please?

  12. And to think they want to regulate citizens ownership of guns and weaponry….

  14. The reason that hollow points are good for law enforcement use is that you get less collateral damage when using them in a civil setting. I had hollow points for my pistols when I lived in an apartment complex because I did not wish to kill my fellow residents five doors down if I had to use my gun in self defense.

    Then you forget that this place is where the Air Marshalls and armed pilots are trained, and those people NEED those kinds of bullets since you want the bullet to stop in the body of the target or have lost enough energy so as not to punch through the aircraft skin after having been fired. Police work and military operations are quite different and have much different requirements which is why the Hague conventions do not apply to police. I have no problem with that at all.

  15. One seldom uses hollow point bullets with which to train. “Hardball” solid rounds offer a better round for training since they cost less. Perhaps the “Homeland” security types remain stupid or “uneconomic” or misinformed or intend something other than training. While “hardball” may pass through the intended victim, hollow points offer a much more harmful wound and, therefore, international law prohibits their use in warfare. Of course, I would not use international law as a guide: it allows the flame thrower…in my opinion, a much more horrible weapon than a pistol loaded with hardball or dumb dumbed bullets.

  16. “I do not understand why such an arsenal has to be created within this one agency, particularly the use of these bullets designed to maximize damage to the human body.”

    It could just be a massive subsidy program like most “defense” spending. I mean, if not to keep the Cold War defense funding structure intact, what could the War on Terror be about (if not an all-out fascist coup)?

  17. If it’s at a training center, it may be to lessen the damage to the back wall of an indoor firing range. Other options (“wad cutter” bullets for example) are much lighter in weight and wouldn’t have the trajectory or recoil characteristics of the 165 grain bullet.

  18. Ah, the gun culture … dum-dums for everyone!

    To quote from an earlier JT posting:

    “The question remains why hollow points are standard equipment for domestic federal law enforcement. The Hague Convention of 1899, Declaration III, prohibits the use of bullets which easily expand or flatten in the body. This is a provision governing the weapons used in “warfare.” Notably, England fought to keep dum dums legal in the Hague in 1899, but only one country supported it . . . the United States (which wanted to use them in the Philippines). The vote was 22-2.”

    http://jonathanturley.org/2012/08/15/dumb-and-dum-dummer-noaa-clarifies-that-it-is-not-buying-hollow-points-for-weatherman-just-fisheries-personnel/

  20. “I do not understand why such an arsenal has to be created within this one agency, particularly the use of these bullets designed to maximize damage to the human body.”

    No rational American can understand it because it does not make American sense.

    It is an alien concept, just as “homeland” is.

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