Philadelphia police officer Richard Nicoletti, 35, has been charged with three counts of simple assault after a video showed him spraying peaceful, kneeling protesters with pepper spray during recent protests. The case could present some challenging elements for prosecutors, but I was particularly appalled to see Nicoletti pull down the goggles of one protester to spray her in the face. Such a close saturation of pepper spray is in my view excessive and unwarranted, particularly when none of these protesters were threatening officers.
Here is the video:
The challenging element for the prosecution will be the fact that the order was given for the deployment of pepper spray, which is allowed to clear areas following the issuance of proper warnings. I do not see why the use of the pepper spray was needed rather than arresting the nonviolent individuals. What was particularly concerning was that one of the suspects appears blinded and was walking near opposing traffic.
Most police departments, like the department in Baltimore, do not approve the use of pepper spray on those “who are compliant or who are exhibiting only passive resistance.” These three protesters are clearly not compliant but only showing passive resistance.
That however leads back to the decision to give the order for pepper spray. Nicoletti’s supervisors are not charged in ordering what Philadelphia District Attorney Larry Krasner is now charging as a criminal assault.
That will present a defense for trial. However, an order to use pepper spray does not give license to use it indiscriminately or excessively, particularly on those showing passive resistance. That brings me back to the young woman who had her googles pulled down. Nicoletti was spraying oleoresin capsicum directly into her eyes and nose from a few inches away. That was as unnecessary as it was dangerous.
Philadelphia Mayor Jim Kenney and Police Commissioner Danielle Outlaw have publicly apologized for the deployment of tear gas during the protest and declared to end the use of pepper spray to disperse crowds in these circumstances. However, that will not prevent Nicoletti from raising the order as a defense point. While Krasner hyperbolically called this the “Nuremberg” defense, it is a valid issue for the jury to consider. Police officers rely on superiors to green light the use of nonlethal force. They are often unaware of what is unfolding on a scene beyond their vision (particularly when wearing protective gears). While the rules have now changed on the use of the such spray, he was following the orders and guidelines at the time in the authority to use the spray.
Where I agree with the prosecutors in the inappropriate way that the spray was used. Just as officers can use their batons to push back a crowd, they can still use such force excessively. Indeed, I recently testified in Congress on the controversy surrounding the clearing of the area around Lafayette Park. While I concluded that the order to clear the area was lawful and that the Park Police complied with the guidelines on warnings, I still believed that the charging of the line appeared excessive and certainly the attack on an Australian news team was unlawful.
According to The Philadelphia Inquirer, Nicoletti was suspended from the department for 30 days with intent to dismiss.
How many times will we fall for carefully curated videos that advance a political narrative of victimhood?
The criminal who blocked the highway made a deliberate decision to harm as many innocent people as she could for as long as she could. The innocents the real victims, like the 83 year old car crash victim who had the misfortune of being transported to a trauma center during a BLM protest in Boston. His ambulance had to be diverted when the BLM protesters deliberately snarled rush hour traffic. What about his rights? Don’t they matter?
https://www.bostonherald.com/2015/01/15/officials-2-ambulances-diverted-thanks-to-i-93-protesters/
“The criminal who blocked the highway made a deliberate decision to harm as many innocent people as she could for as long as she could.” Maybe, but is it possible we’re giving these people too much credit? I heard someone the other day describe them as “mindf***ed,” and it’s the best description I’ve heard so far.
I’m not sure they have the capacity to determine right from wrong right now. You remember that girl that wanted to marry Manson a few years before he died? They remind me of her.
Maybe we’ll hear more about Nicoletti in the coming days. He was involved in the following incident back in 2011.
“Philly settles suit over suicidal man’s death, continues police crisis training”
BySarah Whites-KoditschekJanuary 10, 2014
https://whyy.org/articles/philly-settles-suit-over-suicidal-mans-death/
I’d be more upset if the cop DIDN’T remove the goggles first.
That would’ve been a waste of perfectly good pepper spray.
Seriously, Leftists, don’t come sobbing and shrieking to us over a little owwy spray. We’ve been watching your lot throw hate for years. How about a concrete milkshake in the face? Would you have preferred that?
Way to dehumanize “the left”, em!
That’s a positive attitude that’s sure to foster good rapport and solutions.
Bless your heart.
“rapport and solutions” with leftist insurgents…
Don’t make me laugh.
“Don’t make me laugh.”
Right back atcha, em.
The past bad conduct of a group does not justify present bad conduct to a member of the group.
Under the circumstances, the officers use of pepper spray as a means of clearing the area are not a crime.
But removing the woman’s goggles to spray her is.
John Say, that makes no sense. If she hadn’t been wearing goggles when he sprayed her, would that have been a crime?
You’ll have to show me the law that states officers can only pepper spray people who are not already wearing goggles, and that officers may not remove goggles in order to pepper spray someone.
I disagree. If I see a group doing the same bad thing a hundred times then I am completely wise to take notice and act accordingly
I see blm for example and them leading about 100 different riots which result in destruction of law abiding peoples’ property and cops other people getting attacked and so forth?
Based on fact patterns, yes, I “PREJUDGE” THEM
i prejudge them as rioters and insurrectionists based on facts, habits, and their known methods, demands, and goals.
When that 101st blm rioter comes to cause mischief, only a fool would not understand where it was heading.
So, John, “examine your premises” about groups and how to deal with them wisely. Just a suggestion.
The cops ought to have some loudspeakers out there blaring out rational voices like Thomas Sowell, Sam Harris, Candace Owens, Ben Shapiro, Bevelyn Beatty, Michael Knowles, Charlie Kirk – you name them.
If these campusborn leftists want to sit around all day. May as well let them hear some truth.
But speech is violence, so that would be harmful to the ‘mostly peaceful’ folks.
Candace Owens! That’s a great selection. She’s a real master of history.
Bunch of babies. You wanted your Twit award. You got it. If this country was anything like what you intend to make it, they would have run you over with a tank like your comrades in China.
Protesters. Bah. Tiananmen Square. THEY were protesters.
Jonathan Turley: ” I was particularly appalled to see Nicoletti pull down the goggles of one protester to spray her in the face. Such a close saturation of pepper spray is in my view excessive and unwarranted, particularly when none of these protesters were threatening officers.”
Agreed.
Frank Serpico, Retired Police Detective:
“A policeman’s first obligation is to be responsible to the needs of the community he serves…The problem is that the atmosphere does not yet exist in which an honest police officer can act without fear of ridicule or reprisal from fellow officers. We create an atmosphere in which the honest officer fears the dishonest officer, and not the other way around.”
https://www.americanswhotellthetruth.org/portraits/frank-serpico
Clean house. The good cops need to root out the bad cops.
Guys like this one:
“Derek Chauvin, fired Minneapolis police officer, and his wife charged with tax crimes”
“According to the charges, Chauvin and his wife failed to report more than $464,000 in joint income between 2014 and 2019”
https://www.foxnews.com/us/derek-chauvin-wife-charged-tax-crimes
Anonymous – I am sure they have enough deductions to cover all $464K
Union protection.
He worked pt as a security guard and she had a small business she ran out of her den in the shabby little house they lived in. The person who fancies they were pulling in $75,000 a year from these endeavours I want to sell bridges to. Are there any non-crooked prosecutors in Minnesota?
“The complaints allege that they also failed to pay proper sales tax on a $100,000 BMW purchased in Minnesota in 2018. Prosecutors say the Chauvins bought the car in Minnetonka but registered it in Florida, where they paid lower sales taxes.” from the Fox article
They bought a BMW for 100K.
She sold real estate and they own a second home in Florida. I’ve heard about a third piece of property.
You love to misrepresent things, when it’s convenient, TiA. Bone up on the facts before you comment.
Yeah, pretty much everything you read in government charging docs is the gospel truth. Especially in a politically motivated prosecution. Its much more likely that the prosecutors are concerned about actually having to prove their murder case. Tax charges are a lot easier to prove, with the side benefit of character assassination and additional pressure on a lengthy prison term.
A little class envy never hurts either. What better example of privilege and a surefire way to get rich than a cop moonlighting as a bouncer. Just think, someday he could have owned as many homes as Bernie Sanders.
@anon-
Meanwhile, as Minneapolis descends further into lawlessness and waits for the Feds to bring murder charges against one of the mostly peaceful rioters . . .
Local prosecutors in Minneapolis are hard at work filing new charges against Derek Chauvin and his wife. They allege that Chauvin didn’t report the income from his night job as a bouncer. Like every bouncer at every club in the history of the planet.
The tax investigation started shortly after Chauvin was arrested and charged in the Floyd case. As the WSJ so delicately puts it, ‘it wasn’t immediately clear what initiated the investigation.’ Imran Ali, the county’s criminal division assistant chief who is co-prosecuting the case, said the information came to the attention of the local tax department, but otherwise declined to comment as to who or why.
No, we know exactly what is going on.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/former-officer-charged-in-george-floyd-killing-faces-felony-tax-charges-11595462396
What happens if Chauvin gets acquitted? Stranger things have happened.
@IB- remember the Michael Brown situation in Ferguson? The narrative started with ‘hands up don’t shoot’ and devolved into nationwide rioting. A subsequent investigation by the Obama/Holder DOJ found that Brown tried to take the officer’s gun and was shot in the front while he was charging the officer. The grand jury declined to return an indictment against the officer. So far, we can’t be sure that we know the story in the Floyd case. That is why a thorough investigation and due process are so important.
serpico was in retirement in europe and somebody brought him back just in time and “rehabilitated” him
wonder who…
serpico’s been back for 40 years, Kurtz.
Seriously, what if an ambulance has to get through?
These people intentionally try to wreak havoc by repeatedly and illegally shutting down highway access into and out of Philadelphia. I do not consider this to be valid peaceful protest. Perhaps the police had other ways of dealing with the situation, but I have very little sympathy for these miscreants, especially given that they had been ordered to disperse. As for the police officer involved, if he was ordered to use pepper spray but violated protocol for its use, that is probably worthy of a reprimand, perhaps a severe one if there is a history. Prosecution, however, is out of bounds. If mayors and prosecutors keep pulling this kind of thing, we are going to have no effective police force very soon.
I don’t know why the DAs are not charging the Rioters, I mean “Peaceful Protesters, lol, ya Right” , but anyway some truckers were say a few weeks back that if the mayors/police couldn’t control their streets/highways the truckers would just start turning down loads into those dangerous commie/fascist held areas like Philly.
Firehoses. They could move the people with firehoses.
Or chiggers in a can. I like that even better than pepper spray.
What’s Wrong With This Picture?
America is at war.
If we boil the situation down to the lowest common denominator, America is at war. America is at war with an enemy of hyphenate invaders which is attempting to conquer it. Americans are vanishing due to a fertility rate in a “death spiral.” Hyphenates are being allowed by Americans to massively increase their numbers. Feminazis got the vote and America got a death sentence. In ~ 100 years, there won’t be an American left in America. It’s not eminently moral and just “diversity,” it’s forced extinction of Americans and America. Americans are too blind to see. The enemy’s goal is to complete actions aimed at “…fundamentally transforming the United States of America.” Look around you – how many actual Americans do you see? Would Japan or China allow the complete displacement of Japanese or Chinese people by random foreigners? Somehow I doubt that. The Founders created America to consist of “…free white person(s).” Lincoln planned to compassionately repatriate the freed slaves to Liberia. Insidiously, immigrating Marxists gradually redirected the actual design of America into a Progressive evolution into communism. Communists are on the verge of total victory. Soon, the conquering hyphenates will demand that the “statue” of America be torn down and the “…fundamentally transformed…” America be renamed “HyphenAmerica.”
America is at war…
and Americans don’t know.
So many here arguing those protesters were not peaceful and advocating for violence against them. First of all stopping traffic on the highway is not violence. It’s obstruction. Simply stopping traffic doesn’t even meet the definition of violence. They weren’t in danger either because they successfully STOPPED traffic. All they were doing is obstruction. It may be annoying and frustrating to watch. But it IS a form of protest. Farmers used to block highways with slow moving tractors occupying all lanes. Truckers have done that too. Stopping traffic is no different.
The police officer had already intended to commit an act beyond procedure when pulling down the goggles and directly spraying pepper spray into the eyes and face of the protester. There was nothing professional about that decision. This is exactly why there are protests against police. Because many are just not “professional” enough to mans good judgment calls regarding an order. They already have an “us vs them” mentality that allows them to be very loose with the rules. They are no longer “professionals” when they cross that line.
Physically arresting the protesters without the use of pepper spray was the easiest thing they could do. If they were concerned about their own “safety” for not choosing to arrest then they were clearly not doing their jobs. Harm and risk of harm ARE part of the job. It’s the very reason why they are trained, wear body armor, and carry weapons. Because their job involves HIGH RISK. If they are too scared of getting hurt by kneeling protesters they have no business being police officers in the first place.
First of all stopping traffic on the highway is not violence. It’s obstruction.
And properly deemed unlawful and dealt with harshly.
Absurd just because it is unlawful it doesn’t justify that they be treated harshly. It’s counterproductive. Officers are not there to punish the protesters by beating them up or inflicting unecessary harm. Their only job is to remove the protesters and arrest them. Punishment is dealt with by a judge.
They have the capacity to physically arrest those people, especially when they are either sitting or kneeling.
You’re advocating for police officers to use violence, the very thing they are being accused of. There’s no real need for it.
Absurd just because it is unlawful it doesn’t justify that they be treated harshly.
Oh, yes it does, Peter. These hooligans have no legitimate purposes. Make it hurt or it doesn’t stop.
TiA: “Make it hurt or it doesn’t stop.”
Yep. How do we stop violence and illegality on the part of the police?
“Make it hurt or it doesn’t stop.”
Those in power need to learn that lesson.
They need to fear us — and not the other way around.
No. You need to fear your next door neighbor. You need to fear the suburbs and country lanes bristling with guns. Right now, only the cops stand between you and them. They’re not going to pepper spray you when you come for them. They don’t have pepper spray. They have buckshot. You need to fear the farmers who keep your leftist dominions fed, and fear the average jane and joe who deliver everything to your doorstep.
Right now, only the cops stand between you and them.
Not in Richmond, VA. Call the cops and nothing happens.
Fear is everywhere in Richmond: university students are scared of a virus that won’t affect them because the university has convinced them it will kill …everyone. Black on black violent crime is historically very high in Richmond given 60% of the population is Black American, but now the violence is through the roof. VA is an open carry state so thankfully people are restrained in day time hours. After sunset, however…..lots of noise on the streets and not in a festive way.
We stopped training at the university gym because they have been closed since March. I initially trained in a park early mornings with resistance bands with another gym bunny, but the crime had us very concerned. I broke down and bought a Gold’s Gym membership where the gym is open 24/7 and today we trained at 4:30 AM….tons of people in the gym as well.
crazy situation. the cops aren’t responding, the bad guys know it, and if this isn’t like the Old Wild West, we are pretty darn close.
fun times
not
Well, Mayor Stoney DID say it was, “time to reimagine public safety.” I imagine he thinks everything’s peaches.
Stay safe as you can.
everywhere we go, we go strapped and ready., it was that way before the year of the rat, and it will be after
First of all stopping traffic on the highway is not violence. It’s obstruction. Simply stopping traffic doesn’t even meet the definition of violence.
_______________
We’re living in a world where students are taught that words can be a form of violence.
Here is a NY Times article arguing how speech can be violence: https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/14/opinion/sunday/when-is-speech-violence.html?_r=0
These protesters are the very type of people who support this kind of nonsense, and as such they would have to agree that their ‘non-violent’ protest is really a form of violence. But of course, they would also argue that sticking up for the oppressed can never be act of violence.
Yes, lots of mental gymnastics with that crowd but that’s what you’d expect from someone sitting on the freeway wearing goggles during a weekday ignoring commands from the cops to leave, and then whining about unfair treatment.
another armchair quarterback this svelaz
plenty of “armchair quarterbacks” on this blog.
svelaz happens to get it right, though.
says, “svelaz happens to get it right, though.”
You mean, “left.” Svelaz get’s it Left.
Leftists are never right. By definition.
So Svelaz, let me get this right:
you support protesters blocking traffic
you do not support police
and you are a Democrat yes?
OK. Folks, if you want to be able to use the roads we taxpayers pay for, vote Trump
if not vote Biden
if you want police to keep order, vote Trump
if you want to defund the cops and trust BLM as your new cops, vote Biden
make your choices folks, figure out where you stand. lines are drawn, pick your sides. Chaos, vote biden. Law, vote Trump
I do not care if protestors are sitting, kneeling, or lying flat on their stomachs
IF THEY ARE BLOCKING THE INTERSTATE HIGHWAY SYSTEM WHILE DOING SO
especially after they have been ordered to disperse.
If you are opposed to pepper spray, may I suggest just opening the freeway to traffic, and let them fend for themselves?
Just call it the “Summer Taylor” solution.
Unless, of course, they are in the “passive lane”. >facepalm<
I agree with you. I don’t take that as peaceful, it’s force, after they have been given a lawful order to get out of that public space. Especially if it’s a road. https://youtu.be/Q8oxgn4xrso?t=47
It’s not force if they are not doing anything but obstructing traffic. No force is necessary to impede traffic.
Not heeding lawful orders doesn’t justify spraying pepper spray point blank in the face. Especially when the officer can just make a physical arrest.
You guys are clowns. The good news is, your insanity has driven my gold and silver stocks through the roof.
LOL Even my inventory of toilet paper seems now to a tier one asset.
In the meantime these Chinese officers were promoted to General for a job well done:
• He Weidong
• He Ping
• Wang Jianwu
• Li Qiaoming
• Zhou Yaning
• Li Fengbiao
• Yang Xuejun
I’ll bet these guys know how to handle demonstrators!
This situation highlights the problem with police and how they are trained–the “us vs. them” mentality: “shoot them before they shoot you”. They are not taught that they are public servants, accountable to the people they are supposed to serve, including those who break the law. They are not taught to be problem-solvers or to have empathy for people in crisis who get into situations that involve law enforcement. They are not trained in conflict resolution. Instead, their training emphasizes how to cuff people, how to use batons, how to tear gas and shoot people. Couple that with racism and you have a George Floyd situation. And, the training toward using violence against the public is escalating. Police departments more and more are going paramilitary: helmets, shields, armored vehicles, machine guns, assault rifles, bulletproof vests, riot gear, looking for head to bust. Their presence escalates the violence, and regardless of what some “supervisor” says, no officer can attack someone who is not a threat to them and who is not being violent.
Now, you have a fat coward who lied to avoid military service encouraging violence, shoving an illegal paramilitary force with no insignia into cities where they aren’t wanted and against the wishes of the mayors of these cities. All for political theater: he’s behind in the polls, so he’s trying to go all Nixon: “Mr. Law Enforcement”. Hey, fatty, we see through you.
the usual unsupported blather.
move along.
Lorenzo, Natasha’s points are well supported police officers are not trained to think. They are trained to mindlessly follow procedures. That’s a recipe for problems down the line.
That’s one of the dumbest things I have see you express, and considering the source, that’s quite an achievement.
Cops might not be expected to split the atom while on patrol, but they certainly are trained to evaluate situations and respond accordingly. That’s what thinking is and I suggest you try it sometimes to find out how it works.
I don’t buy that at all. Public policy decisions are made by those well above the officers on the ground. The officers are sent in to enforce those decisions, not to have a lively debate with miscreants attempting to wreak as much havoc as possible upon their fellow citizens.
natch, you know nothing about how police are trained. this dreck you say proves yet again how arrogant and presumptuous one person can be, even while being clearly ignorant of the things she attempts to address
I have mixed feelings about this. The police are using a non-lethal means to remove protesters from the street and the protesters are using counter measures. The only logical outcome of counter measures are counter-counter measures. That’s the history of all conflict.
What are the police supposed to do? Is it reasonable to expect them to physically drag all of them off to the side of the road, especially when that makes them vulnerable to attack? And if they can’t be detain, how can the police keep them from returning to the road and creating a safety hazard?
I don’t know if I agree with the tactic of removing the goggles, but I can see the argument for it since the goggles are a tool being used to prevent the police from doing their jobs in an already unsafe situation.
Plastic wire-tie them to the highway railing until a paddy wagon/SUV arrives to move them to jail.
Meanwhile, the federal government is facing multiple lawsuits re: the actions of federal law enforcement that Trump has sent to multiple cities. There are also DOI, DOJ, and DH Inspectors General investigations for federal LE actions in more than one city. Yesterday, in response to an ACLU suit in Portland, District Judge Michael Simon issued a 14-day temporary restraining order (1) blocking federal law enforcement from arresting or using force against journalists or legal observers unless the federal officers have probable cause that the journalists/legal observers committed a crime, (2) allowing journalists and legal observers to remain in an area if federal officers issue an order to disperse, and (3) prohibiting federal officers from seizing a journalist’s press pass or equipment unless they’re being lawfully arrested. If you watch videos, a number of federal LE are out of control, attacking people for no reason. The Oregon A.G. filed a lawsuit against multiple federal agencies and John Doe officers for violating people’s First, Fourth and Fifth amendment rights after the officers seized and detained protesters without probable cause.
Andrew Crespo (Harvard Law School): “on TV, the Deputy Director of the federal paramilitary force in #PDX discussed the infamous van video. He described a textbook example of an unconstitutional arrest. But… he doesn’t seem to know it. That is a BIG PROBLEM. Let’s unpack this. It’s important. (thread) …”
https://twitter.com/AndrewMCrespo/status/1285738001004482561
We have:
DHS Secretary: Acting, not confirmed, currently an illegal appointment due to having exceeded the 210-day limit for “acting” positions, violating the Vacancies Act (in fact, it has been almost 500 days since we had a confirmed DHS Secretary, and Trump hasn’t even nominated anyone)
DHS Deputy: Acting, not confirmed, also in excess of 210-day limit
CBP Head: Acting, not confirmed
ICE Head: Acting, not confirmed
US Marshals Deputy: Acting, not confirmed
These are only a partial list of Trump’s attempted end-runs around the law requiring Congressional confirmation for various positions.
And too many commenters here seem totally fine with the federal government breaking laws as long as they approve of the ends.
Federal law enforcement officers are in many cities and have been for the legitiamte enforcement of federal law but CTHD apparently doesn’t know that. Attacking a federal building is a federal crime something CTHD also doesn’t realize. Federal officers are supposed to arrest people that break federal laws but CTHD doen’t know that either. One of the more famous videos is one that was cut showing federal LEO’s taking a man off the street and putting him in a car. What they left out at the beginning of the video was he ran and refused a lawful request, but CTHD probably doesn’t know that either.
However, CTHD is happy when certain democrat governments do not fulfill their primary objective of protecting their citizens from looters, rioting and killing. That is because people like CTHD only care about their political objectives which in his case mirrors those of the Stalinists and Maoists evern though he may be totally unaware of who they are.
Two cunning Chinese PLA Colonels published a book in 1999 called “unrestricted warfare.” It’s on the internet in English.
it recommends attacking the USA with among other things, hacking, urban disorder, and LAWSUITS and other “legal operations”
well, i dont think the PLA is behind BLM, but maybe BLM has read their book!
I have, have you?
https://www.c4i.org/unrestricted.pdf
BLM didn’t file the lawsuits.
The ACLU isn’t BLM. The state A.G. isn’t BLM. …
I support the right to peaceably assemble, freedom of speech, and freedom of the press. I disapprove of rioting and vandalism, and I also disapprove of the government violating people’s civil rights. Lawbreakers — whether the public or the government — should be held accountable when they break the law. That’s a key difference between us and China, where the government isn’t accountable. Surely you don’t want us to emulate China in allowing the government to be unaccountable.
CTHD you dont get it …
you could read Unrestricted Warfare and you probably still wouldnt get it. geopolitical factors always matter, and international class conflict is always a factor too.
factions may vary, but certain tactics will appear in different places, initiated from different factions, but alike in intention and effects.
the key is that the financiers of BLM and ACLU and the Democrat party– yes, Geo Soros is the second biggest financier of the Democrats in 2020 after Tom STeyer per FEC data.,…. and he has also financed BLM and I would bet, ACLU– but Soros and his ilk want to break down sovereignty and national borders
probably you like that
the PRC doesnt like that. they actually hate Geo Soros and consider him hand in glove with CIA. Color revolutions and all
but that is a manual of strategy not history. it recommends methods which work.
destabilization and weakening campaigns against America they propose include, hacking, encouraging urban disorder, and also– what we call, “lawfare”
you see it as “open society” stuff like Geo Soros
I see it as sedition. at this juncture, plain and simple, seditious conspiracy to instigate insurrection.
I don’t need to convince you. events speak for themselves. and you will chose for yourself. lines are being drawn. you are a patriot or not.
blm has brought a welcome dynamic in my opinion. they do not appeal to logic. they use mass intimidation tactics and appeal to fear. ok, enough talk!
I welcome the end of these feckless debates. let the dynamic unfold, we embrace it.
Mr K,
Tulsa OK DA basically told BLM to get Ph’d yesterday (Thks DA) & would not not charge to truck driver that drove through the BLM Rioters trying to hijack the driver, his family & truck/equip on I 244 in the middle of Tulsa in a very hazardous spot. I wish I could have found the good videos of it today.
Now I hope the DA pivots fast & charges the BLM/Fascist Antifa Rioters criminal next week.
Soro’s Goons attempting to Burn down Tulsa 4 times in the last couple of months is more then enough for most of us.
Do you like the blues? I like this 1st one @ least.
Glad the Oky DA has his/her head on straight. It’s sad that the driver was even in any jeopardy. The Left keeps promoting crime and violence. By their actions condemning the truck driver for escaping the mob trying to get into the horse trailer, and his vehicle, it gives the impression he would rather they’d been dragged from their vehicle. That’s crazier than 2 left shoes.
All my horse friends about blew up when that video of the rig escaping went viral.
If we complain about violence from protesters, we need to be just as vigilant about police violence. Pepper spray used INSIDE goggles can cause damage to the sclera of the eyes. The protester did nothing I can see to justify escalating that encounter to chemical injury. Enouigh’s enough.
Clearly, some form of escalation was necessary for the police to do their jobs. What should they do?
No no no. Escalation is not the answer the police should deescalate. Pick them up and arrest them is the correct course of action.
I guess I’d be okay with that if it’s actually practical to take control of each of them. I think there are some practical, mechanical difficulties that could be resolved by people following any lawful commands.
Picking them up IS a form of escalation. And it’s certainly not a form of de-escalation for crying out loud. Are you even trying to think through your ideas?
Arrest or crowd dispersal is escalation.
Ceding full city blocks to anarchy is deescalation. They were not going to leave until forced to. Meanwhile, this road block prevents first responders from getting to patients and hospitals, etc. DRAG them off the road if you have to, by their ears, but get them off.
Negotiations!
Secure each illegally present protester to the highway railing with plastic wire ties, chain, whatever is necessary until they can be transported to jail and charged by a magistrate.
I’m assuming since they’re intelligent enough to put on their own socks and shoes that they know by now how to shut their eyes.
If someone’s going to sit there and gaze soulfully down the nozzle of a can of riot-grade pepper spray – well it would explain a lot.
I’m just waiting for one of the leftist fanatics popcorning all over the forum to start explaining how these poor Victims’ children’s children will be emotionally scarred because this brutally traumatizing and dehumanizing event has been imprinted on these poor innocents’ dna.
So you morons think it’s peaceful protesters when they’re doing things like hitting a FEDERAL OFFICER in the HEAD WITH a 4 POUND HAMMER????
Apparently your crap Fascist news isn’t showing the videos the rest of us are seeing, we’ve seen them & the picture of that 4 Pound Hammer today.
You best hope they take you out right there because if I’m on the jury you’re not getting out!
These “peaceful protestors” are blocking a freeway. Cops were allegedly ordered to use pepper spray to clear the road. The protestors saw they were using pepper spray, and still sat there, having their tantrum.
As an asthmatic, no, I hate that pepper spray is used for crowd control. It would kill me. I even had a problem once riding by a farmer’s field when it had set a pepper that looked like jalapeño. Just the amount of capsaicin in the air irritated my lungs.
While I would like police departments to use other means for crowd control, I vehemently disagree with charging a police officer for following a lawful order. One can wish he had just arrested them. One can wish the protestors would have just obeyed the command to clear the road, that they were blocking everyone else from lawfully using.
The protestors came prepared with goggles, which means they were willing to subject themselves to pepper spray.
Honestly, it is getting to the point that cops should retire, quit, or peacefully protest themselves by walking out. Since they are essential services, they are not allowed to strike. But it might be unConstitutional to try to force cops to stay on the job, when they could get arrested for doing that job.
On another note, deep Blue Los Angeles is working to remove protections for cops, so they can be personally sued. A cop’s salary is not going to cover the projected unending wave of frivolous lawsuits. Get your knee scraped while fighting with a cop for his gun? Sue. Cut your hand on a chainlink fence you jumped while being pursued by cops? Sue.
Democrats are creating a dystopian, lawless society, pandering to criminal behavior.
Vote responsibly, unless you want anarchy.
“The protestors came prepared with goggles, which means they were willing to subject themselves to pepper spray.”
No, that just means the expected tho cops to use it. If the protested came with kevlar vests that does not be they were willing to be shot.
The combination of having the goggles AND refusing to leave is proof that they expected to to be sprayed.
Try again.
MollyG”
You said, “no, that just means the expected tho cops to use it.”
AND they sat in the freeway anyway AND remained there when they saw the cop apply pepper spray EVEN AFTER the cop pulled away goggles.
Obey a cop’s commands.
For your analogy to be correct, they would have to come wearing Kevlar vests, engage in activity that would lead to shooting, AND remain in place after the shooting starts, for them to be willing to be shot.
its clear from Molly and Natacha that Joe Biden’s cheerleaders not only hate Trump, but they hate police officers too. And law and order
Voters: chose Trump for law and order, and to support the police,
chose Biden for chaos, riots, and “f *** the police.”
there is no other choice. and not voting means you vote for more chaos.
Cops all across the country in Democrat states should all call in sick, or retire, or quit, en masse, all together.
Democrats want anarchy that bad, leave ’em to it.
The Democrat Platform for 2020
https://youtu.be/Q8oxgn4xrso?t=47
America 2.0… minus the heaps of corpses.
The officer “just following orders” doesn’t shield him from prosecution if he exercised poor judgment in applying that order. The officer is still responsible for determining whether applying that order is reasonable given the circumstances. Physically removing the protesters and arresting them was not an impossible task.
His order didn’t include physically removing a protester’s goggles and shoot pepper spray point blank at the face. “Following orders” is not an excuse to abuse the intent of the order.
Very well said. And when, inevitably, the violent crime rate rises in the inner cities, the lefties will scream about how the police (what is left of them) are not doing their job and attribute it to “racism”. The left in this country has become a scourge whose only real motivations are power and destruction.
Karen,
I understand that breathing issue very well also. It’s annual hayfever season here as everything is being cut now from Texas to Canada so it doesn’t mater which what the wind blows, lol.
If I recall correctly the winter of 2007-2008 there was one hell’uva ice storm hit most of Northeast Okla. Worst I’ve seen.
It was so slick, yards, roads, etc, I think it was the DA at the time went on the radio & said LEO was so overwhelmed they couldn’t respond to everything so the citizens should do what they can to take of their own families, that if we citizens found someone were they didn’t belong doing things they shouldn’t be doing just take care of it by whatever means appropriate & they’d sort things out later.
I’ve been thinking we across the country are in that place again.
In a lot of ways, we’re all on our own. Those who aren’t prepared are going to have a rude awakening.
When police budgets get cut, rural patrols are some of the first to go. It always takes a long time for cops to arrive and find their way on dirt roads. It has been estimated that with the cuts, it may take 45 minutes or longer for the police to arrive. The very idea of getting rid of gun ownership because people can just call the cops has always sounded ludicrous to rural people. Now the rest of the country needs to do some preparing except, instead of hoarding toilet paper, they need to come up with a defensive strategy.
I honestly think the cops all need to quit or walk out en masse for a while. They can’t be forced to stay on the job with the constant threat of incarceration over their heads. It’s not worth it. If it goes to anarchy, towns may just form their own militia.
I hope to God Democrats don’t win the White House and both Houses come November. Look at the mess they’ve made with the power they already have. They sunk the country into chaos and lawlessness.
Cop deserves a medal. These protesters are Communist thugs, nothing more.
Pepper spray doesn’t work on googles.
Mayor: You cant arrest protesters.
Police Chief: clear the Protesters out.
Commands given to clear the area several times with adequate time to vacate.
Protester uses goggles to circumvent the use of pepper spray.
Cop removes goggles as he has no power to use force or arrest protester but is under orders to clear the area.
This would be no different than removing a gas mask meant to subvert tear gas use.
You dont note, but I imagine that the protest was declared an unlawful gathering. By remaining, they are violating a lawful order and the act of sitting there is resistance. But the cop is only allowed to disperse, not arrest. That is an untenable position.