Poll: Most Voters In Swing States View Both Trump and Biden As Mentally Unfit

I have previously written (here and here) about the need to break the duopoly of power in this country by creating greater opportunity for other parties and candidates. Every presidential election, the voters are told that they have to chose between two candidates who garner little support in their own right. It is the continual replay of “choosing between evils” option for voters.  Now we have a new disgrace: a majority of polled voters in swing states view both Donald Trump and Joe Biden as mentally unfit but are told that they must chose between them.

The poll of 4,143 likely voters in the pivotal states of Arizona, Florida, Michigan, North Carolina, Pennsylvania and Wisconsin was shocking, even for those of us who have been long critics of the duopoly system. A 51% majority said Trump is mentally unfit to be president while 52% felt the same way about Biden.

Those figures generally track the rest of the country. In a CNBC/Change Research nationwide poll, 55% said Trump was mentally unfit and 52% said that Biden was mentally unfit.

They do not fare much better on physical fitness. Only 52% said Trump is physically fit to be president while 54% felt the same way about Biden.

Every four years we are faced with the same unpopular choices but we now have two candidates that most voters consider mentally unfit.  Every four years I hope that voters will finally get sufficiently angry to make real changes in our political system to break up the hold of the political establishment on our elections. We are a nation of over 300 million but have produced two candidates that the majority concerned mentally unfit. That captures the insanity of our times perfectly.

297 thoughts on “Poll: Most Voters In Swing States View Both Trump and Biden As Mentally Unfit”

    1. I know. They have been demonized for years and the public doesn’t know any better. You want a clean environment? Go nuclear.

  1. “A top aide to Connecticut U.S. Attorney John Durham, who is conducting a politically sensitive investigation into the origins of the federal investigation into potential ties between the Trump campaign and Russia, has resigned from the Justice Department amid mounting pressure from President Donald Trump and his allies to publish results from the probe before the November election.
    “Veteran federal prosecutor Nora Dannehy, who returned from the private sector to assist Durham in March 2019, exited the government Friday, according to a Durham spokesperson. … ”
    https://www.politico.com/news/2020/09/11/durham-aide-quits-russiagate-412699

    1. who is conducting a politically sensitive investigation…

      What? Oh the irony. Durham is conducting a criminal investigation of a fraudulent, politically sensitive investigation; and we’re supposed to be outraged it might influence an election? An investigation (Durham’s) by the way, that will once and for all prove to the voters that the Democratic party, DOJ/CIA/IC conspired to undue the last election and influence the 2020 election.

  2. Rational voters know that Biden is manifesting onset dementia and is decompensating rapidly.

    Irrational parasites seeking other people’s money, benefits, entitlements, foreign invasion and baby murder think President Trump is resistant to their demands and, therefore, not well.

    Fun Fact: The American Founders intended that 88% of them would not be allowed to vote.

  3. “The Trump administration admitted Friday to stripping millions of dollars from an FDNY fund that foots healthcare bills for 9/11 survivors and promised to try to put an end to the heartless practice. The administration’s about-face came after the Daily News exclusively reported Thursday that the Treasury Department has over the past four years siphoned nearly $4 million from the FDNY World Trade Center Health Program, which helps cover medical services for firefighters, EMTs and paramedics still suffering from 9/11-related illnesses. …”
    https://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/ny-trump-admin-apologizes-fdny-911-program-20200911-d63ohrqqljbpre434qpygp7rti-story.html

    Why has this been going on for 4 years?

    Trump said today that “More than 400 first responders gave their lives. Today we honor their extraordinary sacrifice and every first responder who keeps America safe.” But if Trump actually wanted to honor all first responders, he wouldn’t allow the Treasury Dept. to siphon $ from the FDNY World Trade Center Health Program

  4. A majority of polled voters is something like nine of ten doctors like Rogaine. How many groups of ten did they ask and what percentage of the medical community etc. We already know the pollsters continue to ignore the largest voting block just as the did in 2016. I give this whole ‘nothing’ a big thumbs down worth of nothing as Clinton proved in 2016 it is nothing.

  5. Some non-citizens and illegal immigrants are registered to vote in N.Y., election officials say

    “The state automatically registers them to vote unless they check a small box saying that no, they don’t want to get registered to vote,” says the Suffolk County elections commissioner.

    Continued with video https://justthenews.com/politics-policy/elections/some-non-citizens-and-illegal-immigrants-are-registered-vote-ny-election?utm_source=daily-newsletter&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=newsletter

  6. Trump is a national embarrassment and a international laughing stock, Trump’s lies have caught him as he is, mentally unfit for the job. Ask the families of the victims of Trump’s lies if he is fit. Ask the families of our war dead if he is fit to serve. Trump has done nothing for this nation as a whole, except build his wall between our neighbors, friends and loved ones.

    1. “Trump is a national embarrassment and a international laughing stock”

      Apparently in your head, but when one uses common sense and looks at the world they see things like this NYT news headline.

      BREAKING NEWS
      Bahrain will normalize relations with Israel, following the U.A.E., in another sign of dynamics that are bringing Arab nations closer to Israel.
      Friday, September 11, 2020 1:25 PM EST
      President Trump announced the news on Twitter, releasing a joint statement with Bahrain and the United Kingdom, calling the move “a historic breakthrough to further peace in the Middle East.”

      Now you can go back to sleep.

    2. Fishy says, “Trump has done nothing for this nation as a whole, except build his wall between our neighbors, friends and loved ones.”

      Wow. Nothing? But Obama, now HE did SOME big things that were good for the country as a whole, right? Of course he did. He told the lie of the year. That’s quite an accomplishment. Let’s ask the “families of the victims of Obama’s lies” shall we?

      President Trump is the first POTUS to not start a new war in his first term in the Oval Office for over forty years. What a joke, huh?

      Trump is such a ‘national embarrassment and a international laughing stock’ that he has been nominated for two Nobel Peace Prizes with the likelihood there will be peace agreements between Israel and Bahrain and possibly Saudi Arabia. What an embarrassment Trump is, huh? It’s not like he won a Nobel Prize for doing nothing, right? hahahaha.

      Obama was at war for his full eight years. His legacy? The country was at war longer than any other American president. How internationally embarrassing for Obama and the Nobel prize committee.

      Let’s not forget his wife Michelle who continues to tell the other biggest lie: “When they go low, we go high.” Hahahahahaha. Yeah, right. Democrats are freakin’ nasty, violent, lying, corrupt, war-mongering thugs and sore losers compared to Trump. Open your eyes, man.

      1. “What does it say that the conservatives and Fox News are nicer to me than the lefties are? What does it say that the left is as mean as they are? And I’m a lefty!”

      2. Obama quoted as saying, “I’m really good at killing people” referring to his regular drone strikes where over his eight years he killed thousands! Nobel Peace Prize winner? What an international embarrassment, eh?

  7. Prof Turley & many others must have missed this news conference by Acting DNI Director Ric Grenell correctly points out that the old dying media outfits like CNBC & their Polls are fake & have become relevant.

    Yes Trump has done some things I/others don’t like, but over all the real things he’s done he’s been excellent!

    https://www.washingtonblade.com/2020/09/04/ric-grenell-snaps-at-reporter-for-asking-about-decriminalizing-homosexuality/

    Here is a video of a real poll of Americans:

    https://banned.video/watch?id=5f5a49ecaf4ce8069e728dd3

    1. David, I think the ideal age range for new presidents is late 40 to mid 50’s. Those are the years in which leaders are physically young enough to handle the stress but mature enough to have the body of knowledge required.

      But honestly, anyone over 70 is too old for the job. Biden will almost certainly be a one-term president. Therefore Harris will be scrutinized like no Vice President before her.

      1. David, I think the ideal age range for new presidents is late 40 to mid 50’s.

        Nope. Our better presidents are older than that. The post-1974 crew are not fully in view, but the farther you get from the petty controversies of the day, the better Ronald Reagan looks. As for the period running from 1933 to 1974, you have a sample of six, three satisfactory, one largely a nonentity, and two poor performers. The better ones were in office on either side of 57, 65, and 66. The lesser ones were younger. The demands of the office were quite different prior to 1933 and life expectancy was notably lower. In re the post-reconstruction period, the more capable occupants were Arthur (on either side of 54, died at 57), T. Roosevelt (ca. 47, died at 60), and Coolidge (ca. 54, died at 61); the lesser occupants were the same age. During the antebellum period, all of the better performers bar one were elderly. Of all of our better presidents, only James K. Polk and T. Roosevelt were in your preferred age range.

  8. The source of the problem America has with its health care costs, lower quality of basic education, and electing of officials, can be found in its hubris. A collective feeling of ‘If it ain’t broke, why fix it?’ coupled with ‘We’re number one.’, holds America back where other democracies have advanced. Great Britain, Canada, and most other Western Democracies have all evolved from the two party system. Liberal or conservative still make up the directions but with multiple parties more voters get a say as more than two choices-one more than a dictatorship-force parties to cooperate if the margin gets slim enough. The other main difference is that America is the only country that has such disdain for its election system that it allows it to be a consumer product, something to be bought and sold on sizzle without understanding the steak. The control that concentrated funding has in the procuring of candidates makes the American system an oligarchy, not a democracy, republic or otherwise.

    In other countries when one party, usually the left or right of center party governs well, that party continues in power. That power represents the direction the populace wishes to travel. When the governing party’s mandate falters that party is forced to accept the aid of another party, thus widening its representation. This is a responsively democratic move. In America when the governing party governs poorly, the entire system is placed in a stalemate, or continues to do damage. There are check an balances in all systems. However, there is next to no democratic involvement in the US system. The issues are more than overshadowed by the ‘sizzle’. Pay attention to the statements made by Trump and Biden and notice how personal it has become. Instead of candidates focusing on the truth and proposals, we have name calling and lies. The preponderance of lies and name calling lies unquestionably with Trump.

    For far too many Americans a buffoon like expression of grandeur is more appealing than a knowledge of being correct. Trump appeals to his base not because he is correct or the best but because he is an idiot, a liar, a cheat, and laughs it off. Trump is that confidence man who gets away with it, a dark hero.

    The first step is to take the money out of the equation when choosing leadership and representation.

    1. Issac, you come from Canada so you can surely remember the suit between the government and a private concern where the Supreme Court of Quebec ruled against the government saying the way the healthcare system was being managed was inhumane and that is why the government lost.

      1. Yeah, Alan, we need to go back to those days when health insurance claims were DENIED under the auspices of endless loopholes insurers could invoke simply to ‘write people off’. Obamacare has gotten in the way of those ‘fixes’.

        1. PaintChips, when you go back you will find that government intervention caused insurers to change the way insurance was offered. Decades ago people didn’t lose their insurance and the insurance company paid the claims without the utilization review we see today. Even when one bought insurance the insurers didn’t ask that many questions in part because it cost too much to do and part because they accounted for a lot more in their premiums.

          You don’t know very much about the history of insurance so don’t pretend you do. There are many ways of managing those that get sick and therefore worry about premium increases and many ways of managing those that are uninsurable due to the premiums necessary to cover the risk.

        2. What are you talking about? Pre-Obamacare, out-of-pocket expenditures accounted for a single-digit share of all expenditures under the heading ‘health care and social assistance’. Our family went through the cancer treatment mangle in 2007-08 with ordinary employer-provided insurance. Out-of-pocket costs amounted to < 3% of all charges.

          1. Art Deco, you had what’s known as a ‘Cadillac policy’ and you imagine everyone was as lucky as you. They weren’t! There would have been no need whatsoever for Obamacare if everyone had had Cadillac coverage.

            1. Art Deco, you had what’s known as a ‘Cadillac policy’

              No, we did not. We had open enrollment every year and you had a choice of three policies, HMO or PPO. Had to go into the union in 2011, but we did not get better options than we’d had as non-union employees.

              1. Art Deco, when the 2008 Election Year began Healthcare (or lack of) was the biggest concern to voters. It was also the leading cause of bankruptcy and the leading cause of credit card debt. So again, you were luckier than most, or it wouldn’t have been an issue.

                1. It was also the leading cause of bankruptcy and the leading cause of credit card debt.

                  It wasn’t. Popular discourse on that particular study garbled it’s conclusions. It merely reported that x% of those seeking bankruptcy protection had medical debts, not that the medical debts were the cause of their bankruptcy (or even the largest share of their debts).

                  Your problem, Peter, is that there were and are real deficiencies in the financing of medical care. ‘Obamacare’ as enacted did flat nothing to correct them. It just set up a bunch of unstable actuarial pools.

                  1. Art Deco would have us believe that millions of people simply ‘imagined’ that lack of affordable healthcare was a problem.

                    In fact, ‘lack of healthcare’ is a lot like Climate Change; an issue Republicans can’t acknowledge.

            2. The middle class under Obamacare fared far worse than the years preceding Obamacare. That has been demonstrated over and over again

        3. Thousands of Canadians come to the US to get medical treatment that they cannot get in time under Canadian health care. Essentially no Americans go to Canada for treatment.

          Belinda Stronach, a member of the Canadian parliament and a supporter of the Canadian system flew to Los Angeles for treatment when she got cancer. That tells you most of what you need to know about socialist healthcare. It’s lovely until you are sick.

          The NHS in the UK is about the third largest employer in the world and is still chronically short of actual medical personnel and funds. They have lots of bureaucrats though.

          1. I’ve lived most of my life in Upstate New York. Yes, people do go to Canada for medical care for things unavailable in the US. The one case I can think of among people I knew it was for ophtamologic surgery. I think certain medications you also have to cadge from Canadian suppliers.

            1. Yes, that is why I said ‘essentially no’ Americans go to Canada. Lasik is a big one because it is cheaper there but it is not socialized medicine; it is not covered by government healthcare and can operate as a for profit clinic.

              I don’t know what happens if someone has cauda equina in Canada. In the US it is almost per se malpractice in some jurisdictions if it isn’t caught and operated upon in about 48 hours. Diagnosis often involves an MRI but the entire country doesn’t have as many MRI machines as the city of Pittsburgh does.

              1. Young, I believe American care is more spread out and Canadian care is more centralized which saves money. This was the essence of my argument with (If I remember correctly) Anonymous the Stupid a good while back that involved the death of Natasha Richardson after a skiing accident. Whomever it was never really understood the subject matter involved or the point of my initial comments and never got over it. Both systems are reasonably good but for more difficult problems the US is far superior but spends a lot more money.

                An interesting statistic a number of years back was that US women had far more mammograms and pap smears than those in Canada. The interesting part was that uninsured woman had an equal or slightly greater number of these early diagnosis tests. I’m not saying one is better or worse. It is just interesting to look at the numbers to see that prepaid healthcare isn’t a necessity for everything.

            2. It’s interesting. Canadians come to the US for treatment at lower prices than Americans can easily get. There is an industry that exists to get Canadians to good hospitals in the US at reasonable cost. On the other side of the coin at least a number of years ago cash was a big factor in Canada. An American could seek very good care in Canada at a relatively low price because Canadian facilities wanted cash and couldn’t generally get it from their own citizens. Thus it was a good deal for Americans without insurance.

              Prices are inflated in part due to too much insurance (and of course because of government). In many areas people looking for a good cash price for tests like MRI’s and CT scans could frequently get a better price than the insurers who have to tack on higher costs to their premiums. That is because the centers knew that their costs and profit were from the insurers. Anything paid by the individual above marginal cost was profit.

              1. Canadians also come to America to pay more for healthcare that they can get essentially for free in Canada but not in time to save their lives. Hence Stronach flying to LA to pay for treatment she would stand in line for in Canada knowing she would die standing in line.

              2. Once for a class I was teaching I checked the survival rates for serious diseases to compare between UK, Canada, and the US. US was better by a good measure. It cost more but you got to live.

                1. Young if you are interested go to the CONCORD study in Lancet. It is a bit old but there are specific tables that are easy to look at and tell you a lot. This article is free.

                  Go to https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanonc/article/PIIS1470-2045(08)70179-7/fulltext

                  The formatting has changed so it is more difficult than before and I can’t even copy it like my old copies.

                  Scroll to results and then scroll till you get to ** colorful ** horizontal graphs. The top on the left says women and on the right prostate. Look at where the countries are located when survival rates are compared (outcomes)

                  If you continue to scroll down there will be another data set. Colon women on the left colon men on the right.

                  Forget about Cuba as their data isn’t credible. Take specific note where the US lies and then note where the other western nations lie mostly doing better in some things and worse in others while the US remains in almost the same place.

                  If you have a problem and are still interested let me know. It’s hard to use this site for this article. I used my old copy to find these two graphs a bit quicker.

                  There is a lot more information but it is a very comprehensive study and quite long but it provides some interesting results

      2. Allan

        You need to look further than your nose or your bias. Supreme Court versus the Quebec administered health care system is how the system works. This is a good thing. In 1982 a new right wing government was elected in BC and BCMED wanted to up the co pay from $5 to $35. The federal government, which oversees the provinces, said no and a compromise was reached at $15. Your input only servers to strengthen my argument that the Canadian system, (which in actuality is a provincial system), is far more equitable, cost effective, fair, and produces a higher quality of health care 24th in the world than that of the US 35th in the world. I remember many confrontations between various parts of the government and the people/courts. Now tell me the last time an American won against a for profit, parasitical, US health insurance company. Instead of defending this disgusting system, perhaps you might rise above your level of American hubris and admit that America has faults and can learn from more successful paradigms.

        1. “You need to look further than your nose or your bias”

          Issac you make accusations before you even recognize the topic under discussion. In addition to the statement stating the law as being used was inhumane it was also said and this might be the exact quote “Access to healthcare is not access to a waiting list.”

          The case: Chaoulli v. Quebec

          Stop pretending you know about the US when you don’t even know about Canada.

    2. How about those Brits, many of years battling for Brexit, France major national strikes, Greece please cover our debt, Germany one leader for how many years or the EU one government, Japans economic challenges. These are all parliamentarian forms of Government with smaller populations. Take Israel how long have they been battling for Prime Minister? I’d rather have a President and legislative body have a predetermined period for service then arbitrary have a PM call an election.

  9. Yesterday Trump Essentially Admitted He Can’t Do His Job

    At his Thursday campaign event masquerading as a White House news conference, President Trump could not answer a basic question from ABC News’s Jonathan Karl: Why did he lie to the American public about the danger of covid-19? He claimed he didn’t, but we know he did. He told The Post’s Bob Woodward that he had downplayed the virus. We also know Trump was told the coronavirus pandemic was much deadlier than the flu and that he told the public the opposite. When pressed, he resorted to his “I did not want to panic people” argument — a confession of his inability to lead in a crisis.

    The Post’s Philip Rucker followed up by asking why he could not be both honest and calm, as German Chancellor Angela Merkel had been. That sent Trump into a long rant in which he falsely insisted the United States was faring better than the European Union. As he fumbled and mumbled, he hit upon a new excuse: If what he said was so horrible, Woodward should have gone to the “authorities.” Not only is the president the highest “authority” in the executive branch but, as Rucker pointed out, “Bob Woodward is not the president.” It was a truly bizarre moment, which only confirms Trump has no idea, after nearly four years, how to do the job.

    Edited from: “Trump Will Be In Big Trouble When He Can’t Walk Off Stage At The Debates”

    Today’s Washington Post

    1. That was the WP answer PaintChips. Trump answered the question quite well and any fair minded person would recongize that Jonathan was just trying to get a few words to write while leaving out the rest. Trump’s answer was excellent and went along with what the Pandemic Playbood recommended.

      Trump could also back up what he said and prove it even in articles written by WP.

      1. Alan, everyone outside the rightwing bubble knew Trump was in denial. So I don’t blame Woodward for ‘covering up’. It was as clear as broad daylight that Trump was playing down what would surely be a very serious crisis.

        1. “Alan, everyone outside the rightwing bubble knew Trump was in denial.”

          You may have thought that but only because you didn’t grasp the situation at hand. You still don’t grasp it today. You or some of your friends always brought up the pandemic playbook. You ought to read it. You will find Trump in this area was consistant with the playbook

          1. Alan, mainstream media covered the pandemic’s explosive spread in real time. We all saw it leap out of China to Iran and Italy, then ‘all’ of Western Europe. And all along the experts were saying it was ‘just a matter of time’ before the U.S. would be infected.

          1. Trump’s answer that he was only concerned about not creating panic is in keeping with his saying that he was being sarcastic when he idiotically suggested looking into injecting bleach, his laughing about grabbing pussy was only locker room talk, etc. Trump not only did not call to arms against the Covid-19 threat, he did nothing to stop it. It would have been one thing if he had acted during those six lost weeks yet played it down; but Trump did next to nothing. His playing it down was in fact him trying to figure out how it would make him look: confused, deer in headlights, stupid, etc. Trump has never placed the well being of the nation ahead of his ego. Count up how many times he was corrected for contradicting experts.

            1. Issac, you are conflating issues and not even being accurate when doing so. Your use of sound bites is atrocious and demonstrates a lack of academic interest in the subject matter. Your objective is crass wanting only to throw out statements that make another look bad whether or not what you throw out is on target or accurate.

              Listen to the interview again and quote the words you find offensive.

  10. Unless we change the Constitution and go to a parliamentary system, Turley’s advocacy of multiple political parties shows ignorance about how things work outside of academia in the real world and is likely why he is not on Trump’s list of possible nominees to SCOTUS.

  11. I agree with you 100%. I thought Trump v Clinton was bad, so voted for Johnson, not because I thought he could win, but because it was one vote to a percent allowing for federal campaign funds and a place on the podium during the debates in future elections. Now we have Trump v Biden, far worse than Clinton.

    Trump has done some good things economically, but has set a standard of behavior totally unacceptabe. Name calling, lying, bully behavior, all below any acceptable presidential behavior.

    Biden will not complete his term. Harris will be me president. Is Harris better than Trump?

    1. Just about anyone is better than Trump.

      Trump is a narcissist who regularly puts his personal well-being ahead of the country’s well-being. His handling of COVID-19 is a clear example of that.

      He’s a pathological liar, corrupt, he has committed felonies (and mostly isn’t being indicted because of the OLC’s opinion that a sitting president cannot be indicted) and is facing state charges, he can’t even run a charity honestly (his Trump Foundation was forced to close and pay a $2M fine for improper use of funds), he surrounds himself with criminals, he has corrupted multiple executive agencies by pushing out people who are loyal to the country rather than to him personally, he has harmed our relationships with most allies, …

      1. Sorry, I should correct the claim “he’s facing state charges”:
        To my knowledge, he hasn’t been charged criminally by any state. But he’s being investigated for criminal acts and is involved in related court battles (e.g., to prevent NY from obtaining his tax returns as relevant evidence re: state tax fraud and campaign finance law violations). He’s also facing civil suits.

        1. yes it is so scandalous that petty state Democrat persecutors are engaged in never ending fishing expeditions. so scandalous. yawn

          you are really pumping out a lot of boring content today CTHD but I know that is your schtick. super detailed boring content that just smothers anything worth discussing

            1. Book, I know you don’t welcome any compliments from me, but if all I had to look forward to for contrasting viewpoints here was Natch and CTHD, I would just quit.

              But I can have a real conversation with you and bugsy. You chaps have a spicy way with words that is stimulating rather than painfully bland and boring.

              So I bless you, Book, and all my other partners in worthy dialogue.

          1. Didn’t CTHD recently post a 5,000 word thesis on how Trump once tore the label from a mattress? Amonymous sources, of course but many links to Russian informers deemed reliable.

      2. “Trump is a narcissist who regularly puts his personal well-being ahead of the country’s well-being. His handling of COVID-19 is a clear example of that. He’s a pathological liar, corrupt, he has committed felonies…”

        Needs to be Committed has summarized virtually her entire worth in this post that has nothing but insultes. The rest that she posts at other times contains much of this plus some lies and distortions. Most already know that.

        1. Allan needs to be committed.

          He has summarized virtually his entire worth in this post that has nothing but insultes [sic]. The rest that he posts at other times contains much of this plus some lies and distortions. Most already know that.

          1. Continuing education for Anonymous the Stupid. It’s part of an entire file but this one might be useful to some others as well that don’t require remedial education.
            —-

            Timeline and list of government responses to coronavirus
            Here are the actions the federal government has taken in response to the coronavirus pandemic. This will be updated as new information becomes available.

            Timeline of Trump’s executive actions since January 31, 2020:

            January 31 – President suspends entry of people into the U.S. who pose a risk of transmitting coronaviru and who previously visited China, Hong Kong, and Macau.
            February 29 – Trump suspends entry of people into the U.S. who pose a risk of transmitting coronavirus, who had visited Iran.

            Continue at: https://justthenews.com/politics-policy/health/timeline-and-list-government-responses-coronavirus

      3. “Just about anyone is better than Trump.”

        That is a matter if opinion. Anyone that supports defunding police, return of the Paris agreements putting controls on America, but not China for 10-15 years, supports unfair trade agreements with china and dictates that you, I and every American has to buy a service or product from a private company in America, and other crappy political positions, is just as bad as Trump, but in different ways.

        Bad to me is bad. We are smart enough to have competent leaders in government. Since 41v Clinton v Perot, we have not had two competent people running for the presidency. And that goes for congressional leadership also. Seniority does not make one competent!

        1. Yes, Ron, it’s a matter of opinion, presumably based on a combination of facts and values. People’s values clearly vary. People’s knowledge of relevant facts also tends to vary.

          Re: “bad is bad,” I think some people are worse than others. I think there’s a continuum from wonderful to awful, and people can be in different places in the “bad” range. You may consider Trump and Biden to be equally bad, but I don’t. I think Trump is much worse.

          1. Commit – “I think Trump is much worse.”

            Of course you do. Bringing peace to the Middle East; few things are worse than that.

            1. According to the Committed Trump’s moving our embassy to Jerusalem would cause a major mid east war. It didn’t. It told the Palestinians that they had to deal and that enrichment of their leaders wasn’t helping them. Then peace with UAE followed by todays announcement of peace with Bahrain which will be followed by other countries.

              What did Obama do? Nothing. What did Obama do with Servia and Bosnia where Trump has been successful in obtaining mutual agreements? Nothing. What did Obama accomplish with Russia aside from giving up Crimea and parts of Ukraine? Nothing. What did Obama do to reduce China’s imperialistic tendencies? Nothing. What did Obama do in Libya? Got us into a mess like he did in other portions of the world. Obama, though some of his fine words were correct, IMO failed to adequately effectuate them. What is Obama’s legacy in foreign policy? Failure.

              … And who was Obama’s point man in China? Biden, another failure.

            2. Are you bad at math, Young?

              Do you think that if [A1 + B1 + C1 + … + Z1] << [A2 + B2 + C2 + … + Z2], then {A1, B1, C1, …, Z1} are all negative, or x < y for all x in {A1, B1, C1, …, Z1} and y in {A2, B2, C2, …, Z1}?

              1. Young’s math is fine.

                Trump: UAE and Israel peace +1, Bosnia and Serbia agreement +1 Bahrain and Israel agreement +1.

                Obama / Biden: loss of Crimea -1, Loss of portions of Ukraine -1, Libya -1

                Trump 3
                Obama/Biden -3

                A 6 point spread and we haven’t even gotten started.

    2. You might as well let the billionaires pick the President and not bother voting at all if you like Harris.

      https://www.businessinsider.com/kamala-harris-more-billionaire-donors-than-any-other-democratic-candidate-2019-11

      Silicon Valley already controls what we see and hear and discuss, why not let them pick the loser of the Democrat primary to be POTUS too in their sneaky yet clever way

      Im voting for TRUMP.

      but the match is TRUMP V HARRIS obviously.

      1. Like I said, I dont support either one Harris is worse than Biden. Bad is bad! Its like going to the store and choosing between bad beef and bad pork. Both will cause sh’tt3y outcomes. So I buy fresh fish.

    3. Ron, I would be careful of the world lying. Puffery is a better term for politicians and those that have to sell themselves. As far as truthfulness one can judge that by how much of their campaign promises they filled or tried to fill. Compare that with the promises made by Obama or GWB. Also mistakes aren’t lies and neither are opinions.

          1. Look at Venezuela before Chavez and after. He was the darling of the poor. He began with government taxing the rich, taking over industries, being the champion of the poor. He increased the number of judges and stacked the courts to support his agenda. He was supported by the media, following their progressive agenda. About the time of Chavez death, the economy of the country began to collapse, brought on by the decisions made for years.

            So there are comparisons of Biden/Harris agenda.

            1. So you’re claiming Biden & Harris’ agenda is comparable to Chavez how exactly (other than a broad proclamation that it’s true across the board)?

              1. I am new here, so no one knows what I support or not. I will say I am a Libertarian at heart, but a pragmatist in reality. So I support policies on both sides of the isle.

                To answer your question, the two things that Biden could say that would change my mind about Biden, but Harris would have to support it also ( since I doubt Biden will finish 4 years) are.

                1. “I will not support any healthcare plan with dictatorial mandates requiring any American to buy a private companies or givernment sponsored insurance product”. ( NO MANDATES this is suppose to be a free country)

                2. “China will have to match unit by unit reduction of CO2 in any climate treaty I sign. It is unfair to Americans to bear the cost of reducing while allowing China to increase through the 2030’s and not reducing until 2050 as allowed by the Paris Accords.”

                These two would be a good start showing a more moderate position

                1. Ron, let me give you some advice. We are in a low-intensity conflict. Success and survival require extreme teamwork and community thinking. Individualistic approaches to law and politics will fail at every turn as the heat gets turned up.

                  On the globalist / Democrat national leadership side, there is no regard for any liberal ideals from those who call themselves liberals. They are wholly pragmatic. They will discard any liberal idea in favor of a short term gain for power. I speak here about the leadership not our small fellow Americans who identify with the good parts of that party’s traditions.

                  The globalists and their Dem leadership mercenaries, all the way on down to street level agitators like BLM, will only use idealistic classic liberal or liberterian rhetoric to divide and atomize any resistance coming from the elements of the Republic Party that are still bedazzled by the liberterian schtick.

                  I used to be myself. I read von Mises and Hayek. I was an Ayn Rand acolyte for a time. I was up to my eyeballs in it.
                  Then I woke up and realize that there is no future in cowboy solo go it alone thinking. A gang will always beat the tar out of one lone defender.

                  The strength of the wolf is in the pack

                  EIS ANER OUDEIS ANER — one man is no man.

                  Learn the phalanx it is the analogy of every successful popular resistance effort in history

                  Your phalanx starts with the natural social associations which you have in your life, the simplest and most obvious things, that bind you together with similar folks in a pinch.

                  1. Mr. Kurtx=z, is this to say that there may not be middle of the road ideas that Democrats and Republicans could come to some agreement? As I said in an earlier comment ona different subject, I support many of the positions that Trump has introduced, including his trade policies that many on both sides of the isle have not. I support legal status for people brought to this country, raised american, a product of American schools and some American G,I’s. To me they are far more American than a person raised until their teens in a foreign country, brought to this country for the first time in high school and just because he had a piece of paper that said he was American, he became president. The two situations should be reversed, but we can’t! But there are many on my right that want these same people deported, all while we can not deport the real immigrant!

                    So when I say I am Libertarian, that is a small government libertarian. On many other issues, I bet I could be at odds with the right just about as much as being at odds with the left. But that does not mean I do not have a principled position in any issue. There was a famous man who once said “If you got seventy-five or eighty percent of what you were asking for, I say, you take it and fight for the rest later, and that’s what I told these radical conservatives who never got used to it.” And that is my position. I might even take 65% based on the issue.

                2. Cool…, welcome.

                  But you cited Chavez before and equated Biden policy with him. Maybe pick one and compare and contrast?

                  1. I thought I did.

                    I wrote out a longer comment concerning the way Venezuela went from a democracy to a dictatorship when the economy collapsed and could not fund the programs designed for the poor.

                    I can not find anything on WordPress with 50+ comments, so lets move on and when something comes up concerning Bidens poilicies I will comment. I know there will be many opportunities between then and now, and given my thinking, many after January 20th. Actually 4 years worth.

  12. Meanwhile, today is the 19th anniversary of the 9/11 attacks.

    Biden today: “I’m not gonna make any news today. I’m not gonna talk about anything other than 9/11. We took all our advertising down, it’s a solemn day, and that’s how we’re going to keep it.“

    Trump today, along with his statements about 9/11: “Congratulations to JPMorgan Chase for ordering everyone BACK TO OFFICE on September 21st. …”
    His ads are up.

    Meanwhile, Trump claimed that he didn’t want to panic the country about the coronavirus, but yesterday tweeted statements trying to panic the country about Biden:
    “On November 3rd, Michigan will decide whether we will quickly return to record prosperity—or whether we allow Sleepy Joe Biden to impose a $4 TRILLION DOLLAR TAX HIKE, ban American Energy, confiscate your guns, shutdown the economy, shutdown auto production, delay the vaccine, destroy the suburbs, erase your borders, and indoctrinate your children with poisonous anti-American lies!”
    “If Joe Biden is elected, far-left lunatics won’t just be running failed Dem Cities—they will be running the Department of Justice, the Department of Homeland Security, and the U.S. Supreme Court. No city, town or suburb will be safe.”

    He also lied at a rally last night, comparing his decision to downplay the seriousness and danger of COVID pandemic — despite knowing — to Churchill, claiming “When Hitler was bombing — I don’t know if you know this — when Hitler was bombing London, Churchill, great leader, would oftentimes go to a roof in London and speak and he always spoke with calmness. He said, ‘We have to show calmness.'”

    Churchill didn’t give speeches from the rooftops. That’s why we don’t know Donald’s imaginary scenario.
    Churchill was quite blunt about the hardships ahead: “We are in the preliminary stage of one of the greatest battles in history… I have nothing to offer but blood, toil, tears and sweat. We have before us an ordeal of the most grievous kind… many, many long months of struggle and of suffering.”
    Also Churchill: “There is no worse mistake in public leadership than to hold out false hopes soon to be swept away. The British people can face peril or misfortune with fortitude and buoyancy, but they bitterly resent being deceived or finding that those responsible for their affairs are themselves dwelling in a fools’ paradise.”

    Trump is the deceiver in chief.

    Asawin Suebsaeng: the Churchill “analogy would work if Churchill told the country that the bombs falling on them were a hoax created by the Labour Party to Get Churchill.”
    Tom Malinowski:
    “Things Churchill didn’t say:
    “- the Blitz is a hoax
    “- the Nazis will miraculously be gone by April
    “- going to a fallout shelter is voluntary; I don’t think I’ll be doing it
    “- I don’t take responsibility at all …
    “- If we have fewer radars, we’ll have fewer air raids.”

    1. REGARDING ABOVE:

      “Trump today, along with his statements about 9/11: “Congratulations to JPMorgan Chase for ordering everyone BACK TO OFFICE on September 21st. …”

      Trump has totally turned on New York City. Why should he care if Chase goes back to work?

    2. Oddly enough, the most scathing and cutting and sarcastic quotes about Covid (and everything Trump basically) just turn out to be objective reporting in these times.

    3. Commit: Trump is the deceiver in chief.

      ****

      Somehow Trump has managed to turn your head around backwards so you remind me of Linda Blair in The Exorcist.

      Come to think of it, you do seem possessed.

      1. Young, somehow Trump has managed to turn your head around backwards so you remind me of Linda Blair in The Exorcist.

        Come to think of it, you do seem possessed.

  13. High Profile Former Republicans Think Trump Is Unfit

    A group of 73 former U.S. National Security officials who served under GOP administrations, including former CIA and FBI chiefs, endorsed Democratic nominee Joe Biden in a joint statement on Thursday, joining the growing number of prominent Republicans to depart from their party for the 2020 election.

    “We are profoundly concerned about the course of our nation under the leadership of Donald Trump,” reads the statement, which accuses the president of lacking “character and competence” and engaging in “corrupt behavior that renders him unfit to serve as president.”

    Among the statement’s signees are officials who served under Presidents Ronald Reagan, George H. W. Bush, George W. Bush and Donald Trump, some of whom have served in the country’s top defense and intelligence roles.

    Former CIA head General Michael Hayden, former FBI and CIA chief William Webster, former National Intelligence director Michael Leiter and former Air Force secretary Mike Donley are among the officials now siding with Biden.

    The group accuses Trump of “[aligning] himself with dictators and human rights abusers,” such as North Korea’s Kim Jong Un and Russia’s Vladimir Putin, attempting to undermine the rule of law, failing to lead America through the pandemic, attacking and vilifying immigrants, and “gravely” damaging the U.S.’s role as a world leader.

    The former National Security officials say that while their policies don’t necessarily align with Joe Biden’s, they believe “he will restore the dignity of the presidency” and “reassert America’s role as a global leader.”

    “While we—like all Americans —had hoped that Donald Trump would govern wisely, he has disappointed millions of voters who put their faith in him and has demonstrated that he is dangerously unfit to serve another term,” reads the statement.

    The release of this letter coincides with the fourth and final night of the Democratic National Convention, which the Democrats have used to showcase the growing number of Republicans speaking out against Trump and siding instead with Biden as a preferred candidate. A number of high-profile Republicans and previous Trump backers have publicly endorsed Biden over the past few weeks, including former Gov. John Kasich, who spoke on the DNC’s first night, and Trump’s former White House communications director Anthony Scaramucci, who called his former boss “crazy.”

    Edited from: “Over 70 Republican National Security Officials Endorse Biden, Deem Trump Dangerously Unfit For President”

    Forbes, 8/20/20
    ……………………………………………………………………………………………………………..

    The fact that so many former Republicans consider Trump unfit is certainly an indicator of which way the wind is blowing.

      1. You have just crystalized the Fox News/Trump theme: pandering to non college educated people they’ve convinced to believe that educated people look down on them. They know that you don’t support Trump as much as you resent educated people, especially minorities and women. They’ve convinced you that you are being victimized by “the Left, the Dems, and the libs” who view you as inferior, and that Trump is your hero because he’s pissing off all of those you perceive to disrespect you. THEY are the ones abusing you, your trust, and your country. Trump is not fit for office, but somehow they’ve gotten you to overlook the arrogance, the failed economy, the unemployment, insults to those who served in our military, and most of all, the 6 million infected people and 190,000 dead people, most of whom died because of Trump’s incompetence. Don’t be a Trump Chump. Wake up and smell what they’re shoveling.

        1. As old Joe says: “If you don’t vote Democrat then you ain’t black!” That’s not condescendingly racist is it?

    1. yes of course the former CIA and NSA hacks don’t like him’

      these are the creeps who have their supercomputers reading and storing every single email and keystroke we make on the internet in their massive storage facilities in Utah

    2. A lot of powerful people on both sides of the aisle don’t like Trump because he is taking power and money away from them. When he spent ~$1Million on the embassy in Jerusuleum instead of $1Billion a lot of powerful people lost their perks because they believe part of the Billion is theirs and the million isn’t enough to line their pocketbooks or campaigns.

      Remember what Eisenhower said: “Beware of the military industrial complex”. The left used to cmpaign against it. We have it and Trump threatens it so a lot of powerful people in the military are upset.

      Makes sense, right? Who does Forbs represent? Who does National Review represent. Take a look at who supports them along with the leftist journals and who supports a lot of the think tanks. Many of them are supported by rich power groups that want their perks to remain. That doesn’t mean that all the journalists are hacks. What it means is journalists are chosen to help advance their interests.

        1. OK, so you don’t believe lobbyists influence our legislators and people in government and don’t provide any funds for reelection. You are entitled to be wrong but even your friends will look at you with a bit of surprise.

          No surprise there. There is little thought that eminates from the Bug.

          1. For, like, the millionth time, Allan…, when you’re trying to insult someone’s intelligence you *have* to spell the words correctly. It’s a really, really bad look when you don’t.

            So…, perhaps you can wager some of your single figure IQ points in a poker game to — somehow — try to win some more?

            1. You have a spelling fetish to such an extent you wouldn’t attempt to write a well known person’s name and you couldn’t even look it up.

              What I actually did was state your position which doesn’t sound like a position that an intelligent person from either side would hold.

                    1. No, it’s your cowardly way of not facing the truth.

                      By doing so Bug, you fell into a can of “Raid”. I’ll repeat the conclusion based on your initial response. “OK, so you don’t believe lobbyists influence our legislators and people in government and don’t provide any funds for reelection.”

      1. National Review had so much CIA fiddling in its operations over the decades it came to be regarded as a front organization by the assorted right wingers it denounced along the way

        But you got it right Allan. Look to the plutocrats. The people schlepping for them are just mercenaries.

  14. Meanwhile, back at the ranch, Biden’s campaign manager was asked in a news interview if the campaign staff had set up a TelePrompTer to feed Biden answers in press interviews and in Q & A with supporters. He flew up in a flurry of evasion. Wasn’t it amusing how his staff transported him 300 miles to answer softball questions in a nearly empty room at Carnegie-Mellon?

    1. “They do not fare much better on physical fitness. Only 52% said Trump is physically fit to be president while 54% felt the same way about Biden.”

      This is bizarre claim. Biden looks to be gasping for air, unable to give speeches, weak, and cognitively shallow.

      Trump is working 16 hours a day or more, large campaign rallies daily, speaks with authority and clarity, and literally acts like he could go on all day. Then plays golf all weenend.

      I think there might be a problem with that poll….

      1. I imagine their sampling frame stinks. They all do, these days. If what’s coming over our Fakebook wall is any guide, there aren’t many partisan Democrats for whom their conclusions are not to be found in their premises.

        1. Trump looks morbid and obese. To even compare him to Biden physically is about the biggest episode of ‘the emperor has no clothes’ in my lifetime. But I’m sure a lot of Trump supporters aren’t reading the image coming back at them in the mirror accurately as well. So there’s that.

          1. Bug, this vain fancy man from 5th Ave tweeted a photoshopped image of his head on a shirtless muscular body. Who does that? I think our fellow posters here who are Trumpsters imagine that pic when they say he’s in better shape than Biden. He’s not in better shape than his lover Kim.

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