Below is my column in the Daily Beast on the fourth indictment of former President Donald Trump by Fulton County District Attorney Fani Willis. While I have said that this indictment presents a serious threat to Trump, I am still troubled by the implications of the indictment for free speech and future election challenges.
Here is the column:
Welcome to the Jackson Pollock school of prosecution. The 98-page indictment from Fulton County District Attorney Fani Willis is the legal version of Pollock’s style of throwing paint splatters on canvas as artistic expression. It basically makes every telephone call, tweet, and meeting a separate conspiratorial act.
There are 161 separate acts. Not surprisingly, everyone then becomes part of the conspiracy. The indictment covers 19 people, including Trevian Kutti (the former publicist for R. Kelly and Kanye West). Willis wants them all thrown into a single trial and let the jury figure it out.
But for all the disparate acts that Willis says constitute a criminal conspiracy, part of this emerging picture should worry Trump.
Pollock once advised confused observers that they needed to stop looking for objective meaning. The same may be true with the fourth Trump indictment. Willis simply treats every statement as a knowing falsehood and conspiratorial effort.
The indictment, to many, reads like the type of unabashedly biased spin that’s typically seen on cable television shows.
For example, the indictment relies on calls like the controversial one Trump had with Georgia officials—a call long cited as indisputable evidence of an effort at voting fraud. In the call, Trump pushed his demand for a statewide recount. Trump had lost the state by less than 12,000 votes. When officials insisted that there was little likelihood that such a recount would make a difference, he stated, “I just want to find 11,780 votes, which is one more than we have because we won the state.”
The call is still cited as one of those 161 individual steps toward the criminal conspiracy. Even though the indictment effectively repackages the same claims as the federal prosecution, Willis insists that Trump should be effectively tried twice under these allegations.
It is easy to dismiss such a Pollock prosecution as political gamesmanship. The timing alone in bringing the case (which should have been brought two years ago) is enough for many to discount this prosecution. However, it does represent a serious threat to Trump. It has “legs” as an indictment that is not likely to be dismissed in its entirety before trial.
IT’S GOT LEGS
There are three reasons why this indictment could be the most perilous for Trump, as opposed to the Jan. 6 indictments, which present serious threshold constitutional questions.
First, the racketeering cases tend to be iron-plated before trial because challenges concern the interpretation of facts, which are traditionally questions left to the finder of fact (in this case a jury).
Willis is likely to argue successfully that she should be allowed to prove the case. In the course of that prosecution, Willis probably hopes that one or two of the 18 other defendants will flip and turn state’s evidence.
Second, in D.C., special counsel Smith is essentially trying to create new law, or at least stretch existing case law to the point of breaking down. Conversely, elections are left largely to the states, and state prosecutors routinely bring election-based prosecutions.
Willis may be stretching the evidence, but she is not stretching the law. Racketeering laws are routinely used far afield from their origins in combating criminal gangs.
Finally, as a state action, this is not a prosecution that can be ended prematurely with a presidential pardon. If Trump is elected, he could grant himself a self-pardon, even a preemptive pardon before trial. Various GOP presidential candidates have indicated that they will also consider a pardon. That could put an end to the Smith prosecutions before any trial if the special counsel cannot try the case before the election.
There is no federal pardon option for Georgia. Indeed, it is even hard to secure a state pardon, which is not issued by the governor but a pardon board.
None of this means that the indictment is justified. While the indictment contains a litany of calls and meetings, there is no clear evidence that Trump did not believe that the results of the election could be flipped through these challenges. The concern is that the indictment criminalizes challenges to elections.
In covering decades of presidential elections for CBS, NBC, BBC, and Fox, every election has produced challenges, including many with little support. This coverage included multiple challenges by Democratic lawmakers to the certification of Republican presidents in Congress.
It has also included challenges to voting machines.
For example, Marc Elias, who served as Hillary Clinton’s campaign general counsel and played a role in the funding of the infamous Steele dossier on Russian collusion, has challenged past elections on such grounds. After the 2020 election, he challenged one New York election by claiming that “there is reason to believe that voting tabulation machines misread hundreds if not thousands of valid votes as undervotes, and that these tabulation machine errors disproportionately affected [the Democrat].”
That was no crime. Elias had every right to seek judicial review even though the claim was quickly rejected as unfounded.
Many of us disagreed with Trump after the election and publicly rejected the claims of systemic voting fraud. However, Trump had a right to not only challenge the election but to be wrong.
That is why the Willis indictment is a serious threat to Trump but also to our system of democratic process. Pollock once said that “when I am in my painting, I’m not aware of what I’m doing.” Unlike painters, prosecutors do not have the same luxury. What Willis is doing here is excessive and it is dangerous.
Professor Turley Writes:
“None of this means that the indictment is justified.”
“Trump had a right to not only challenge the election but to be wrong.”
………………………………………………………..
With today’s column, Professor Turley makes the case that Donald Trump is merely an often misunderstood, temperamental type. The over-exuberant guy who maybe says too much at times.
One might question if such a man is stable enough to be president.
But there is also the question of intimidating witnesses, smearing prosecutors and presiding judges.
On August 8th, in New Hampshire, Trump baselessly claimed that Atlanta prosecutor Fani Willis had had an “affair” with a “gang member” she was prosecuting.
On August 13, Trump promoted a post on Truth Social that falsely accused Judge Tanya Chutkan (of the Washington-based January 6th case) of having “admitted she’s running election interference against Trump”.
On August 14, Trump used his own Truth Social Media to warn Georgia’s former Lieutenant Governor, Geoff Duncan, that he “shouldn’t testify” in the Fulton County case. Trump called Duncan a “loser” who was “very unpopular with Republicans”.
***
One would like to ask Professor Turley if these baseless claims can be excused by Trump’s “right to be wrong”.
If indeed Trump has the right to be so misinformed, where do we distinguish between intimidation and sheer stupidity?
One would like to ask Professor Turley if these baseless claims can be excused by Trump’s “right to be wrong”.
Have you been living in a cave? The entire RUSSIA, Russia, russia fiasco was a Hllary lie spread by the entire,federal govt, all the Democrats and more than half the Republicans You tell me. Intimidation or sheer stupidity.
Yet more corrupt election interference by the Left, which then laughably pretends to be concerned about “our democracy.”
(That last phrase is code. Our means belonging to the illegitimate fascist cabal in power, you know, the puppeteers of the empty shell sometimes referred to as “Joe Biden.” Democracy is code for fascist dictatorship.)
I suspect that you haven’t read the indictment.
I can’t find a leg for Fani to stand on .. . a pot to pee in, nor a window to throw it out of.
Turley says IT’S GOT LEGS
“Willis may be stretching the evidence, but she is not stretching the law. Racketeering laws are routinely used far afield from their origins in combating criminal gangs.”
*if Trump is a ‘criminal gang’ .. . Biden is the Godfather.
What Willis is doing here is excessive and it is dangerous.
Aye – avast ye matey!
But alas all is fair in pursuit of he Orange Whale.
“Talk not to me of blasphemy, man; I’d strike the sun if it insulted me.” ~ Ahab from Herman Melville’s Moby Dick
Dear citizen are ye not entertained?
Dennis
Instead of posting anonymously just to call me a troll, why don’t you just man up and own your lie?
You challegened me to find a single lie in your previous posts, and that took me about 30 seconds. I have several more in the queue, and we could all move on if you would just cut and paste the statement I prepared for you.
I also note with great pleasure that Gigi isn’t here today licking your boots…wonder why???
Here it is again if you don’t wann look for it.
“Tom, you are correct in this instance. I did, in fact lie in the referenced post. I did it because I fell into the trap of the weak minded, and chose hyperbole to try to make the point that I couldn’t make with logic and reason. I have been guilty of the same thing in previous posts, so I would appreciate it if you didn’t yuk up the message board by posting them ad neauseum going forward.”
Poor Tom the Troll, you’d be lost if there were no liberals for you to complain about.
never end a sentence in a preposition. Trolls arent what they used to be
That’s the kind of mindless rule up with which one should not put.
“Poor Tom the Troll, you’d be lost if there were no liberals for you to complain about.”
Darren, he’s talking bad about me…..waaaahaaaaa! Make him stop!!!!!
Notice how Tom obsesses over what he perceives to be lies, harps on the same thing over and over again, but cannot come up with any substantive defense for the latest indictment of his hero, other than to engage in trolling and name – calling?
Hey Gigi
Do you still think Texas makes electricity from crude oil???
Best stop cutting and pasting from your daily democrat talking points email.
Texas Electricity by type
Natural gas 46%
Wind 23%
Coal 18%
Nuclear 11%
Solar 2%
“…perceives to be lies,…”
This is exactly the kind of manure that got you in the crosshairs, Gigi. I don’t perceive them to be lies. They are lies.
“I reject your reality and substitute my own”—-Gigi
“Gigi and I are not the same trolls”—Dennis
.Wow! I’m in your “crosshairs” ? That must mean I am scoring points, so I take that as a compliment. And WHO are you that I should care that you’ve put me in your “crosshairs”? I heard a report on NBC about petroleum being used to generate electricity in Texas which has increased demand and thus increased the price of crude oil, and I recounted that. This does not make me a liar, and whatever source you cited is probably based on prior statitstics, before the 2023 heat wave which has stressed the electric grid in Texas. Texas exports energy to Louisiana, too, which is also experiencing a heat wave. In any event, this was not my “opinion”, and neither you nor I have personal knowledge of what the current state of affairs is in Texas as to sources of electrical power. So, for you to lactch onto a statistic you got somewhere as proof that I am a liar who won’t admit to such is childish at best, and maybe a sign of either OCD or being paid to attack people like myself, Dennis and Fish Wings.
Gigi
Wow, just wow.
First off, you didn’t site a report. You stated it as a fact. Just like you have done literally hundreds of times. First of all “petroleum” and “crude oil” are 2 different terms. That should have been your first clue that indeed, you don’t have any knowlege on the subject. I DO have knowlege of the subject as I have previously explained. Natural gas is not made from, nor does it have anything to do with crude oil. Your source was wrong and you were wrong. Standing by your proven falsehood makes you a liar. Obfuscating with some horsesh!t about LA and still refusing to admit you were wrong is what is childish.
I do not consider this a proper response as requested to stop me from sh!tting all over your every post.
The word is “cite”. The nature of your vulgar rants expose what might be coprophilic tendencies, too. Take up your complaint with NBC.
What a lame response.
https://cdn.statcdn.com/Infographic/images/normal/24202.jpeg
If your complaint is me harping, you hold the key. Admit your mistake and we will all move on. Here, I make it easy….
“Tom, you are correct. In the referenced post I made a statement that was provably false. I didn’t take the time to learn a damn thing about the subject, but instead just parroted a narrative that I heard because it fit nicely with what I choose to believe. I have done this many times in the past, and I don’t really care to have you point out each one of them individually because it’s embarassing, even for me.”
You have the exact mentality as someone who is physically and mentally abusive: “you made me beat you because you wouldn’t do what you were told”.
And speaking of substituting your own reality, Gigi…how about you provide one quote of mine that would indicate that Trump is my hero??
Just because I find you full of gas (not natural, but not petroleum either), and am willing to point out the countless ways in which you are, does not mean I love Trump. Unlike you, I won’t sell my soul to the devil quite so cheaply.
“Notice how Tom obsesses…”
and this might be the richest lack of self awareness you’ve demonstrated yet…TRUMP TRUMP TRUMP (hear that voice in your head?)
LMAO
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Thought this guy Turley was supposed to be smart, not as smart as he thinks. And there are some morons on here that are even more ignorant than he is.
Look in the mirror if you want to see even more ignorant.
Not a single mention of Coffee County. Turley may be bright, but he sure is willfully ignorant of what happened in Georgia
https://www.lawfaremedia.org/article/what-the-heck-happened-in-coffee-county-georgia
“And there are some morons on here that are even more ignorant than he is.”
A “moron” lacks intelligence. Someone who is “ignorant” lacks information, not intelligence. The two words are NOT synonymous, you ignorant moron.
This might be one of the best posts ever!
Ralph: the words “moron”, “idiot”, and “imbecile” were actual clinical terms used describe the functioning level of persons with varying degrees of sub-normal intelligence–from “Merriam Webster”:
Idiots. —Those so defective that the mental development never exceeds that or a normal child of about two years.
Imbeciles. —Those whose development is higher than that of an idiot, but whose intelligence does not exceed that of a normal child of about seven years.
Morons. —Those whose mental development is above that of an imbecile, but does not exceed that of a normal child of about twelve years.
— Edmund Burke Huey, Backward and Feeble-Minded Children, 1912
From “Today I Found Out”:
In psychology, an idiot has the least intelligence on the IQ scale (this now is equivalent to someone who is mentally retarded or the more politically correct “mentally challenged”); an imbecile is not quite as dumb as an idiot and is now considered equivalent to moderate retardation; a moron is then the highest level of intelligence for someone who is mentally retarded, thus considered as being mildly mentally retarded. Specifically, those who have an IQ between 0 and 25 are idiots; IQs between 26 and 50 are considered imbeciles; and those who have an IQ between 51 and 70 are considered morons.
These terms were popular in psychology as associated with intelligence on an IQ test until around the 1960s. They were then replaced with the terms mild retardation, moderate retardation, severe retardation, and profound retardation. In addition to this, other factors besides IQ are now used in diagnosing these levels of mental deficiency.
These words were not intended to be used as insults.
“Ralph: the words “moron”, “idiot”, and “imbecile” were … These words were not intended to be used as insults.”
You are correct so from now on instead of using one of those terms one should use the term Gigis which describes a particular type of moron, idiot and imbecile without insulting the innocent.
So if she is lucky when this is over maybe Milton Bradley will buy it all, indictment, evidence, testimony, the lot of it, put it in a board game and call it “CLUELESS”
Professor Turley says that “Willis may be stretching the evidence, but she is not stretching the law.” I’d agree with that. Mangling and mutilating the law is more like it.
But Professor Turley is wrong about all of the fraudulent cases against Trump. They are only a threat if the Republicans remain weak, cowardly, passive, and compliant to the goals of the Uniparty by failing to impeach Biden and exposing his very real crimes.
If the Republicans do actually develop some courage and strength and impeach Biden, all the world will see for the first time just how criminal and corrupt the current regime is, as well as how corrupt the media is for backing this crime and corruption. The public will develop perspicacity and readily understand for the first time that the Democrats are merely projecting their own criminality onto Trump.
The cases against Trump will then be clearly seen by all as just the smokescreen that they are. And none of the other Democrat candidates waiting in the wings will be able to save the Democrats from being booted out of office. The Democrat brand will be damaged far worse than the damage done to the Bud Light brand. The Democrat Brand will be synonmous with the worst excesses of political corruption and criminality.
But it’s a big “if” that the Republicans will suddenly develop some courage and strength. So far, they remain all talk, and weak, cowardly, passive, and compliant to the goals of the Uniparty.
JT is way off in this analysis. The RICO case is on sound ground because our legal system provides proper avenues for contesting election results. These avenues are grounded in evidentiary fact, not wishful thinking or paranoia (Trump’s problem). To go outside and defy the authority vested in these official avenues is dangerous — it basically throws a middle-finger at our well-regulated, fair and nearly perfect processes because you didn’t like the result.
That gaming must be punished, because it is sure to be repeated if not.
JT’s notion of “free speech” is absurdly broad. Here’s a scenario that follows logically from his arguments in the Trump indictments.
JT argues a civil case for a client, and wins a substantial jury award for his client. However, the losing litigant uses broadcast and social media skillfully to assert that his side won the verdict. He sincerely believes he won the case — therefore he does not have to pay the liability found by the Jury. Right? We’re all entitled to our beliefs, and also to act on them. What is the point of freedom of belief if you cannot act consistent with your beliefs?
Comparing a theoretical civil case to a criminal charges is absurd. Apples and oranges.
I think so. Once you fall for the “you’re free to believe whatever you want (w/ no limits)”, official decisions like Jury Verdicts and Election results lose their authority. That invites anarchy. Yes, we need a wide berth for protected speech, and the thoughts behind the speech. But, ultimately, there are limits — mostly constraining the ability to wage deceitful frauds on the public for political or personal gain. Or the waging of falsehoods originating from paranoia, schizophrenia, hallucinations or other mental disorders. Or the continuation of a lie after its having been discredited by a unanimous Jury looking at factual evidence. A civil torts system (Public Frauds lawsuits (similar to defamation) is the way to go — not government prosecution.
“well-regulated, fair and nearly perfect processes”
Thanks for the comedy relief.
“He sincerely believes he won the case — therefore he does not have to pay the liability found by the Jury. Right? ”
So you’re saying Trump is still President.
That’s your analogy.
It’s funny how dim that was of you.
Dr. Mary Trump was interviewed last night, and she said that Donald’s biggest fear is humiliation–losing in 2020 is humiliating to him, and his delicate psyche doesn’t allow for failure or humiliation–so he will fight at all costs to protect that psyche. Does this mean he knows he lost? Probably. Does that mean he will ever adimit it? Definitely not–but since he has failed at all legal and illegal means to stay in power, he now has to be a “victim”–“victim” of the tyranny of a “deep state” that was always “out to get him”. All of the things Trump says and does are to protect that psyche–not based on truth, patriotism or altruism–so he constantly lies, attacks people who dare to challenge him–and even those who don’t. For example, Ruby Freeman and her daughter, Shay Moss, Fulton Co. election workers, were targeted by Trump and his cadre, accused of bringing “suitcases” of fake Biden ballots into a ballot tabulation center–all lies–the “suitcases” were official ballot carriers. Their lives were threatened, and they went through a lot of stress–all based on lies. The lies were also calculated to stir up the faithful, and the fact that Ms. Freeman and Moss were both black helps in this endeavor. Dr. Mary said that Donald has always been a scared little boy, and has always bullied and done everything possible to get his way–successfully up to this point. That’s about to change.
Gigi
Still think Natural Gas and Crude oil are the same thing???
Lets say Joe is on trial at some point for his taking of bribes to affect public policy. Do you think the judge would allow the hundreds of videos of Pedo Joe, sniffing girls and babies hair, touching children and women inappropriately, kissing women on the lips without their consent, as evidence of his pattern of using his office for personal gain?
And could the prosecutor then get a psych expert on the stand and ask “if the person exhibits this behavior in full view of cameras and microphones, might that person be capable of much worse in private? Even to the point of shoving his fingers in an aide’s vagina without her consent?”
Of course the psych expert might say “well, it could just be that he only does it on camera because he is demonstrating his power to do whatever the hell he wants and giving the middle finger to the entire world. We also see this in the way he parades his criminal scumbag deadbeat son all over the world with him.”
your hero….
Can’t help but believe that the democrats know the adverse implications for free speech but don’t care if they are in charge. Democrats are not generally in favor of real free speech per our 1st Amendment. They probably think that preventing, by any means they can get by with, the GOP winning in ’24 is “saving democracy.” IE., “saving democracy” = they rule.
Wow, no discussion at all about any of the underlying claims, just about the political ramifications.
Maybe Trump was right, in Turley’s mind, that he could commit murder in Times Square and get away with it.
Seriously, not even an acknowledgement that your initial take re: Coffee County was invalid? You stated that Trump was given voluntary access to confidential voting data. But that clearly wasn’t the case because no one with authority to do so gave the campaign that access. This to me is the clearest act to support the RICO charge and it has nothing to do with the First Amendment. Ironically it has to do with the security protocols associated with our voting systems, which the GOP (in every other context) seems to care about.
Wow, no discussion at all about any of the underlying claims, just about the political ramifications.
***********************************
Were the “underlying claims” are bullsharky so not much to saythere. They’re a conspiracy without a predicate offense. Sorta of like you and me “conspiring” to go to a Yankees game. As for the structural risks to society, JT does a fine job explaining that to folks who can see forest amongst the trees.
How is computer trespass the same thing as going to a Yankees game?
You and I watch baseball very differently.
Computer Trespass? Only if they weren’t invited to investigate the machines.
Invited by whom? Certainly not someone with authority to do so. Is it legal if I invite someone on to your property? That is still trespass.
The Coffee County Board of Elections said that the board neither knew about nor authorized the operations carried out in January 2021. The secretary of state’s office has publicly referred to the incident as “unauthorized access to the equipment that former Coffee County election officials allowed in violation of state law.”
Still no response? Do you now agree?
Trump and his supporters are mounting a diversionary defense: “Look at the Biden corruption!!”
Biden should be investigated for bribery / undue influence as VP. That’s a separate case. And he may be found guilty. But I can assure you one thing. He would never defend what he did as “Look at Ted Stevens did”.
PbinCA, Biden doesn’t have to do whataboutisms, he denies the obvious, has the media and Democrats deny the obvious and it all goes away.
PS. Ted Stevens was charged, found guilty, lost his seat and was later EXONERATED when it was found to be a political hit job.
PbinCA is writing nonsense. The left is misusing its power and the law while committing election interference. That is all outside of Biden’s corruption and the left’s attempt to hide it by blaming others.
Such use of diversion is typical of pbinCa’s type of animal.
Nobody has to do whataboutisms — if they can defend the conduct brought into question with facts and logic.
It’s a “tell” when defensive thinking turns to changing the subject to somebody else’s misconduct. You’re left wondering if corrupt behavior is to be tolerated if done for “your side” or a “cause” you support — i.e., the ends justify the means.
I’ll take another look at the Ted Stevens case, thanks.
Jonathan: Getting back to your column re DA Fani Willis’ indictments in Fulton county. You are in good company in your critique of the indictments. Marjorie Taylor Greene, part of the DJT cult, just posted this deranged comment on Twitter:
“Corrupt Fulton County DA Fani Willis’ investigation (WITCH HUNT) of President Trump [ notice how the MAGA crowd
erroneously refers to their leader as “President”–not “former president”] dragged on for two and a half years, just in time to
interfere with the 2024 Presidential Election. That’s not a coincidence. That’s election interference.”
Sound familiar? In your column you say: “The timing [of the indictment] alone in bringing the case (which should have been brought two years ago) is enough for many to discount this prosecution”. “Enough”? Really? John Durham took 5 years before he brought his two failed prosecutions. You didn’t complain back then. David Weiss took almost the same amount of time before he announced the now failed plea deal with Hunter Biden. And both were appointed Republican prosecutors under DJT.
So why do you think that the fact it took 2 years for DA Willis to bring her indictments is some how “enough…to discount this prosecution”? In Willis’ case there are 19 co-defendants, involving multiple jurisdictions in a complex RICO case and potentially a hundred witnesses. A RICO case takes time to put together. Durham and Weiss had rather simple cases in comparison. What is remarkable is that Willis brought her case so quickly!
So I won’t say you are in league with with MTG. But, on the other hand……
OK, big mouth Dennis, we will start with this one…
“Democrats also support the use of force–but for quite different reasons–” —-Dennis
“The only guy who is inviting violence these days is DJT!” —-Dennis
Both of these statements were in a single post.
One of them is a lie.
This gets posted above and below every post you make until you answer to it, then I will move on to your next lie.
Answer up, Dennis. Which statement was a lie?
C’mon Dennis, we all know the right answer. You can say it…
The left just hates it because the Republicans have one rep (MTG) who fills the shoes of the California delegation of SchifT, Swallowell, Con-ah, and Maxine all by herself.
David Weiss is a Democrat who was appointed at the urging of the two Democratic Senators from Delaware. Presidents routinely appoint people in these positions based on the Senators recommendations. The Weiss appointed by Trump bit is red herring. Only a fool falls for that. David Weiss also had no reason to wait years.. the recommendations from the IRS and others for felony charges have been sitting out there since 2018. While it might take time to investigate an issue… it does not take 5 years to take recommendations and charge someone.
CH Truth: Get your facts straight. David Weiss is not a “Democrat”. He is a registered REPUBLICAN–appointed in Delaware by DJT! Second, you just whizzed past the point I was trying to make in my comment. I was responding to JT’s false claim that Fani Willis should have brought her case much earlier–trying to bolster the claims by MAGA Republicans, like MTG, that the case is only about “election interference”. Next time read my comments carefully before boviating!
Next time read my comments carefully before boviating (sic)
Media Matters troll™ Dennis McSoTired is bloviating yet again, despite his contributions to carbon dioxide emissions PPM, as David B. Benson would bloviate
😂
OK, big mouth Dennis, we will start with this one…
“Democrats also support the use of force–but for quite different reasons–” —-Dennis
“The only guy who is inviting violence these days is DJT!” —-Dennis
Both of these statements were in a single post.
One of them is a lie.
This gets posted above and below every post you make until you answer to it, then I will move on to your next lie.
Dennis
First, which of your statements regarding violence was a lie?
Second, can you post the link to Mr Weiss’ voter registration card?
Such is the state we are in. I wish I knew how we could fix it; voting sure isn’t the solution. What a time to be alive. The trolls here exemplify every single thing that caused this and will perpetuate it. Do there really have to be only a few of us left for us to decide to try something else? Biden is not the POTUS, and I don’t mean that in an election denier way – he is so very crystal clearly the figurehead of a blossoming regime. Those flower petals fall like acid, and we will be too far gone to apply the counter-agent when enough people realize what is happening. These people don’t care about laws. Those of us that do can’t do anything about it but bluster. It’s better than nothing.
OK, big mouth Dennis, we will start with this one…
“Democrats also support the use of force–but for quite different reasons–” —-Dennis
“The only guy who is inviting violence these days is DJT!” —-Dennis
Both of these statements were in a single post.
One of them is a lie.
This gets posted above and below every post you make until you answer to it, then I will move on to your next lie.
Jonathan: The GOP and the MAGA crowd claim there is a “two-tiered” justice system–one for the Biden family and different one for DJT who is now facing his 4th criminal indictment. They claim the Biden DOJ has been “weaponized” to prevent DJT from becoming the next president. Never mind that Garland’s DOJ is continuing to investigate and possibly prosecute Biden’s son without interference from the WH. If DJT were president and the DOJ was investigating one of his son’s, does anyone doubt DJT would shut down that investigation fast?
Actually, DJT’s supporters are right on one point. Their cult leader IS being treated differently. Any other criminal defendant who threatens witnesses, judges and prosecutors would now be in pretrial detention awaiting trial. Not DJT. Last week DJT engaged in witness tampering and obstruction of justice by telling former Georgia Lt. Gov. Geoff Duncan not to testify before DA Willis’ grand jury. The Q is whether Willis will add to DJT’s indictment a charge under Georgia Code Section 16-10-93? She should.
When DJT was arraigned in Jack Smith’s indictment over Jan. 6 he was told by the magistrate judge, as a condition of release on bond, that he could not violate any “federal, state or local law”. DJT did that when he violated Georgia’s witness tampering statute. Judge Chutkan, own her own, could revoke DJT’s terms of release and put him in pre-trial detention while he waits for a trial date. Will Jack Smith file a motion to do just that? Hard to say. It appears unlikely given DJT’s status as a candidate for the presidency. So, yes, DJT is being treated differently. He is being given a privileged status that no other criminal defendant would be given.
The Bankman-Fried massive fraud case illustrates the dichotomy. Five days ago a federal judge revoked the FX co-founder’s bail and he is now in Brooklyn’s detention for attempting to tamper with witnesses. He will probably remain there until his trial in October .Anyone think DJT should be treated differently than B-F?
Presidential Immunity – are Dismissed
FYI : it’s not the Hunter Case – it’s Joe Biden selling out America BRIBERY , for personal financial gain. Amount know so far is $50 million.
“it’s Joe Biden selling out America BRIBERY”
it’s Joe Biden selling out America by his EMBEZZLEMENT on the Job
OK, big mouth Dennis, we will start with this one…
“Democrats also support the use of force–but for quite different reasons–” —-Dennis
“The only guy who is inviting violence these days is DJT!” —-Dennis
Both of these statements were in a single post.
One of them is a lie.
This gets posted above and below every post you make until you answer to it, then I will move on to your next lie.
Which one, Dennis?
Dennis McIntyre, do I believe you or the IRS whistleblowers. Do I believe you or the FBI whistleblowers. Easy call. Thanks for another shameless comment.
Dennis.. wow the ignorance in your post is astounding!! Where you not aware that the “prosecutor” assigned as special council is one in the same guy who tried to sneak the sweet heart plea deal into Hunters agreement plea agreement, only narrowly stopped by a pesky Judge. Were it not for the Judge we would have probably never known Hunter was to get the deal of a lifetime that ensured he could never be prosecuted for any and all crimes he may have committed up to that point. I find it laughable that you believe this is somehow normal justice and not two tiered.
Dennis writes: “The GOP and the MAGA crowd claim there is a “two-tiered” justice system–one for the Biden family and different one for DJT…”
Because that is exactly WHAT IT IS, you brainwashed fool.
What these people (Democrats, prosecutors) are doing to Trump and his allies IS a SUBVERSION of our DEMOCRACY.
These brazen political show trials and persecutions would make Stalin proud.
This is ELECTION INTERFERENCE that has nothing to do wtih “justice” or “the law.”
You have been thoroughly propagandized and indoctrinated by the fake news media.
Their ‘Trump-hate & Derangement Programming’ full of lies has been thoroughly washed into your brain.
How very scary indeed.
Dennis
Which of your statements was a lie?
This is exactly what happens in banana republics.
One more time…shouting it for Dennis the brainwashed, Trump-deranged fool:
THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT HAPPENS IN BANANA REPUBLICS.
Exactly who did he threaten, in what manner, and when? Are you referring to the incident after he overpowered the SS detail in “the Beast” and drove to the underground storage where they keep Marine One? He then overpowered the guards took off and headed to Fulton County. I realize a great deal of damage could have occurred if the M134 Minigun hadn’t jammed.
FWIW the M134 made an appearance in The Accountant and again in Alien and Red 2.
I hope I don’t get in trouble for compromising the weapons systems aboard Marine One.
” Judge Chutkan ” – not recused. Should be debenched.
@Turley,
The greatest magic tricks are illusions and misdirection.
The election was stolen.
While that seems like a bold and brash statement… its not.
The magic was done right in front of you and you’re just not capable of seeing it.
That’s the beauty of it.
What made it possible is the tight race and the con focusing on a certain few districts in hotly contested states.
Michigan is the most interesting.
If the allegations that the FBI buried an investigation into the fraud. (The Gateway Pundit is reporting on this…)
You have in part, a smoking gun.
While this may not be enough on its own… there were other things in play.
There wasn’t a single silver bullet.
It was a combination of things that taken as a whole moved the needle just enough to win those states.
Barr even admitted that fraud happens in every election.
The question is if its enough to move the needle. He didn’t think so.
And each of these acts on their own weren’t enough.
Also some were questionably legal. Aka Zuckerbucks. Changes in election laws where the changes themselves weren’t legal under those state’s constitution.
Having real time access to voter data.
Having groups reach out to specific voters to let them cure their ballots. But not to all. (e.g cure Dem voter ballots but not GOP voters)
Improper signature validations (AZ for example which in 2022 is still being litigated.)
Then the voting machines themselves.
You can’t hide the irregularities but you can always explain them away.
-G
Indeed, Gumby. One would think the professor, as an admitted defense attorney, would want every piece of exculpatory evidence available for his own client’s cases, but when it comes to Trump, specifically, the illusion must prevail.
“Barr even admitted that fraud happens in every election.”
Wow, what a guy, we should go to him for advice on how to stay alive in the fed pen. He even admitted it. Wow. He’s really reaching out.
“The question is if its enough to move the needle.”
Since homeland security master screeched it was the fairest and most honest election ever, who could think otherwise ?
“He didn’t think so.”
WRONG. He knows it was the dirtiest stolen election in our entire history. We have the clip of him flatly stating mail in ballots are rampant with criminal vote activity. Now, suddenly, he and his 51 fellow fat sow 3 letter criminal bros spew otherwise, for sure.
Joey was given just enough to win in the middle of the night in all 5 swing states in vote spikes no sane person can ignore, in the middle of night, the biden hockey stick goes straight up till it surpasses Trumps huge lead, the 100% steal charts are easy to find. No one who has looked has any doubt, and a middle school student can prove it.
👍
It appears the Biden disinformation politburo and their physician bootlickers have published an article in the Journal of the American Medical Association, whereby they accuse 52 physicians being responsible in spreading “misinformation”. Eric Topol MD, is now calling on X/Twitter, for those 52 physicians to be named publicly. Naturally he limits who can reply to his tweets
Eric Topol
@EricTopol
Yes, Tom, the list should be published
3:09 PM · Aug 15, 2023
People @EricTopol follows or mentioned can reply
https://twitter.com/EricTopol/status/1691527497488437249
Results
A total of 52 US physicians were identified as having communicated COVID-19 misinformation in the period assessed. All but 2 were or had been licensed to practice medicine in the US; the others were researchers.
Twitter’s elimination of safeguards against misinformation and the absence of federal laws regulating medical misinformation on social media platforms suggest that misinformation about COVID-19 and other medical misinformation is likely to persist and may increase. Deregulation of COVID-19 misinformation on social media platforms may have far-reaching implications because consumers may struggle to evaluate the accuracy of the assertions made.
Sule S, DaCosta MC, DeCou E, Gilson C, Wallace K, Goff SL. Communication of COVID-19 Misinformation on Social Media by Physicians in the US. JAMA Netw Open. 2023;6(8):e2328928. doi: 10.1001/jamanetworkopen.2023.28928
Dr Anthony Fauci, Dr Francis Collins, and all currently employed Physicians of the CDC-NIH-FDA should be very worried if this escalates into an all out war as they have spread the lion’s share of misinformation.
This will end badly for everyone but especially patients. Lawyers, OTOH, will make bank.
We know the score, the government and their agencies lied from day one, the 52 told the truth.
Ron Johnson (Wi. Sen.) held hearings a long time ago but Rachel Maddow did not attend.
Those who actually spread misinfgomation about Covid – or anything else – should be publicly shamed.
Unfortunately the greatest predictor of accuracy about covid – or almost anything else is being identified as spreading misinformation by social media.
I would be happy to know the doctors who allegedly spread misinformation about Covid.
Those are the ones who have proved right and the ones I would trust in the future.
I know this is a hard concept for those on the left – but the truth actually matters.
Another sign that the Republican Party is divided and the RINO swamp critters that are trying with all the might to destroy any semblance of unity to fight the dragon(s) that’s spewing fire and brimstone across the nation.
The parties who submitted an Amicus Brief, and their disdain for President Trump on display:
“BRIEF OF FORMER JUDGES AND SENIOR LEGAL OFFICIALS AS AMICI CURIAE IN SUPPORT OF GOVERNMENT’S PROPOSED TRIAL DATE AND SCHEDULE”. They are looking for a trial forth-with.
Donald B. Ayers: USA Today 4 years ago “Mueller report underscores dangerous Trump disdain for rule of law: Ex-GOP officials”
Steven G. Calabresi: New York Times 3 years ago “Opinion, I We Disagree on a Lot. But We Both Think Trump Should be Convicted.
John J. Farmer Jr.: The Hill 4 years ago “Trump’s ‘Apprentice’ debut was a window into our future”
Stuart M. Gerson: The Atlantic 1 year ago “The DOJ Must Prosecute Trump”
Alberto R. Gonzales: AZ Central 2 years ago “I urged Republicans to Stay. Now, months later, I’m leaving the party. Here’s why.
J. Michael Luttig: CNN 1 year ago “Opinion: The Republican blueprint to steal the 2024 election”
Richard W. Painter: Washington Post 1 year ago “Perspective; If Trump is charged, it should be for the worst of his
Crimes”
Jonathan C. Rose: nothing worth mentioning.
Paul Rosenzweig: The Bulwark 2 years ago “The Republican Party’s Partisanship Projection Problem”
The country – not just the Republican party is in the midst of a massive political shuffling. While this is most apparent in the GOP, it is effecting both parties.
As this progresses alot of republicans and even mlore democrats are going to have to decide if they wish to remain in a party that no longer reflects their values.
Both parties have ALWAYS had this problem – because no single political party can reflect the values of half or even 1/3 of the country.
The US is unique in the world in its two party system. In most of the world politics divides across multiple parties, and governments for when two or more parties that share a few values form a coalition.
There is a tendency of those on the left, of those in the media, od republican anti-trumpers to pretend that Trump created this.
That is false. The seeds of this reshuffling started before Trump with the Tea Party. They also started with the observations of Democrat analysts like Texiera that the Country would soon become minority majority and the expectation that would result in a permanent democratic majority. That analysis ignored the fact that parties are dynamic and ultimately act in self preservation.
On the right the power of the religious right has significantly waned. While they still have a voice. they are no longer king makers. They have been replaced by the core best reflected by the values of the Tea party – values that are more attractive to working class voters both right and left.
Increasingly the GOP is becoming the party of the working class. Overlapping this Republicans are increasingly appealing to many minorities or factions of minorities particularly Hispanics whose values are at their core conservative and an anathema to the democratic party.
You can run through the Trump 2016 Platform and find significant portions cribbed from Democratic platforms of the past 50 years.
Regardless we are seeing new political re-orientations emerge, and it is likely these are going to beocme more fixed and clear over the next decade.
Republicans are increasingly the anti-establishment party, The party of the working class, the party of patriotism, the party of state and local law enforcement, The party of economic nationalism, The party of a strong military, but also the party unwilling to use that military power short of clear objectives and national interests.
Neo-cons are returning to the democratic party. The democratic party is the establishment party. Increasingly the party of well educated whites – particularly white women. It is the party of a muscular but less clear foreign policy. The party of identity politics and grievances, The party of big business.
You can debate details of this reshuffling – but a reshuffling is without any doubt taking place.
Neither the republican nor democratic parties are what they were a decade ago.
While the specific shifts were not inevitable. Texiera’s more than a decade demographic political analysis required that some shift had to take place. It is unwise to think of political parties as static. In my lifetime what it means to be a republican or a democrats has changed significantly over time – though more so recently.
But this has also been true nationally and historically. At its birth the republican party was the anti establishment party, the progressive party and remained that through most of the 19th century.
Regardless, the inevitable shifts in BOTH parties will leave many politicians in both parties stranded. Some will leave. Some will make up minority voices within their party.
I would further note that historically national regional and local party values are frequently significantly out of line with each other. Both parties have had wings that were at odds with the parties national policies, but that could not be pushed out without losing any ability to form a national majority.
Many of the “anti-trumpers” within the GOP hold positions of power and influence, and I expect that at this time those who were going to leave the GOP have mostly done so. At the same time they do not and will not have the same power and influence they had in the past.
Contra the media narrative – this is not about Trump.
I attributed some of this to the tea Party and to demographic shifts – but these are not the only factors that drive this restructuring.
We are seeing related changes occuring Globally. The Russia Ukraine war is the last gasp of the Cold War alignments that controlled global politics for almost a century. Russia is quite obviously a paper tiger and but for the worlds largest collection of nuclear weapons barely has the power to protect power to its immediate neighbors much less the world.
China after decades of shifts towards greater economic freedom after Mao’s death has become increasingly nationalist, and authoritarian. It is unclear whether China is about to emerge as the 21st century supper power than the USSR was, or whether its internal problems are so severe as to tear it apart. Regardless NATO is concurrently becoming larger, more euro centric, and less relevant, while a NATO like coalition of states in the Pacific is emerging to contain China.
Concurrently – Globalism which emerged as a free market force was eventually transformed by the Davos crowd into a force for global governance and is now declining in consequence.
US interests with few exceptions do not lie with Europe, the mideast or Africa.
It is likely that in the next few decades US interests will few exceptions diminish with distance. Focused FIRST on the US itself, and then north america, the northern hemisphere, and then pacific rim.
Political persecution, corruption and “guilt” by venue.