Below is my column on Fox.com on yesterday’s “testimony” from Dr. Anthony Fauci. Americans deserve answers to the questions raised by his diary and other remarks. The most likely course to gain such answers would be through an immunity grant. The impact of a pardon on invocations is a bit murky but, as I stated yesterday, the odds favor Fauci in a court finding that he can still invoke the privilege. In any challenge, a court would likely find that there remains a risk of self-incrimination. What is clear is that many in Washington would prefer Fauci to remain silent on the questions raised by his diary.
Here is the column:
“Stick with the science and never veer from that, even when the science turns out to be an inconvenient truth for somebody.” Dr. Anthony Fauci delivered those words to Georgetown students in 2017 as the touchstone of medical ethics. Today, before the Senate Homeland Security Committee, that line was replaced by Fauci in repeating “On the advice of counsel, I respectfully decline to answer based upon my rights under the Fifth Amendment to the Constitution.”
The optics could not have been worse, but what you saw depended largely on how you viewed the hearing. For critics, Fauci sounded like Crazy Joe Gallo without the sunglasses. For supporters, Fauci is still a hero who refused to fall into a trap laid out before him. Democratic senators such as Sen. Maggie Hassan (D-NH) actually praised Fauci for refusing to answer questions before Congress.
There is no question that it is Fauci’s right to refuse to invoke his privilege against self-incrimination and many advised him to do so. It could be taken for strategic reasons separate from any criminal culpability. After all, he was given a last-minute pardon by President Joe Biden, and any false statements he made before the Committee could be used to bring criminal charges against him.
However, Fauci is unlike many who have invoked the privilege. While many past witnesses have invoked the privilege in being called to Congress, Fauci has testified for days in countless prior hearings. He also has appeared in countless interviews on these issues. He had reason to fear this hearing after his diary revealed startling contradictions with what he was stating publicly.
The question many will ask is why Fauci could not just “stick with the science” and resolve these contradictions. The fact is that he would have had difficulty in dealing with his own “inconvenient truths.”
Fauci’s opening statement expressed obvious anger over the release of his “unredacted diary.”
The new evidence shows that Fauci connected the Wuhan lab to the emerging crisis before most people had ever heard of the lab. It also shows him repeatedly referencing the lab’s gain-of-function work and discounted the “wet market” as the true origin of the virus as opposed to an “amplifier.”
Some of the most embarrassing areas for Fauci concerned his entries acknowledging that he pushed to close schools, despite public denials that he ever recommended such closures. His entries take credit for convincing figures such as then-New York City Mayor Bill de Blasio, the staff of California Gov. Gavin Newsom, and others to close the schools.
In an Oct. 16, 2022, ABC interview, Fauci repeated that denial: “They always come back and say, ‘Fauci was responsible for shutting schools down.’ I had nothing to do [with it]!”
The media has also taken the Fifth on these subjects, declining to publish many of these contradictions. They have the same reason as Fauci: there are no spins that would reconcile their own prior coverage and gushing reviews of Fauci. The diary entries also show disturbing references to private meetings with media figures.
Fauci’s diary refers to CNN anchor Jake Tapper 41 times. In some entries, Fauci suggested that the host was concerned about crafting an interview to better serve Fauci: “Jake wanted to make sure the interview did not cause me any problems.” Fauci also related how he met socially with Tapper in July 2020: “Had dinner over Jake Tapper and Jen Tapper’s home in DC. Terrific couple. Friendship building.” (Notably, on October 14, 2020, CNN published a report repeating the condemnation of the dangers of “small household gatherings.”).
The diary revealed an obsession with his publicity and access to celebrities. The diary is replete with his gushing accounts of himself, such as “It is not hyoperbole [sic] to say that today I am the most famous and talked about person in the country and one of the most recognizable peson [sic] in the world.”
The fact is that diaries tend to be self-obsessed, and no one would want their unvarnished private thoughts made public. Rather, my gripe with these passages is something I have previously written in criticism of Fauci. During this period, dissenting scientists were barred from social media, removed from positions, and vilified for expressing views, despite now being vindicated on subjects ranging from the lab origin of the virus, the efficacy of masks, the six-foot rule, natural immunities, and school closures.
As these courageous scientists were being abused (by academic and media figures who still hold their positions), Fauci said not a word in their defense despite privately acknowledging that they could be right.
Yet, Fauci remained silent as his allies in the media savaged those who voiced the view that the virus was man-made and escaped from the lab.
In 2021, New York Times science and health reporter Apoorva Mandavilli was still calling on reporters not to mention the “racist” lab theory. (Federal agencies found the lab theory to be the most credible despite Fauci claiming publicly that a natural origin was the most likely explanation).
Fauci stayed silent while relishing his celebrity status. Indeed, his diary shows no concerns for these scientists as he breathlessly recounted his bobbleheads and cover shoots.
Once again, Fauci has every right to invoke his constitutional rights, but the public has every right to demand answers to these questions related to the deaths of 1,238,563 Americans. That may result in a grant of immunity to compel him to answer these questions.
If it is any solace for Fauci, he will clearly be able to maintain that he is “the most famous and talked about person in the country.”
Jonathan Turley is a law professor and the New York Times best-selling author of “Rage and the Republic: The Unfinished Story of the American Revolution.”
A reasonable question that will remain in the realm of ‘conspiracy theory’ is whether the COVID pandemic was intentional and who was ever present in the background.
…except that conspiracy theories don’t admit to reason — they pander to drama, heroes and villains, and the accusers accepting zero responsibility for their impact.
I thought it was funny.
While there likely were 1,238,563 or more American deaths during that period, as cited by the Professor, it is far from clear that they were all due to Covid. The excess deaths figures do not support anything near that many above what was normally expected. But with the federal government paying somewhere around 20% to 25% more for medical treatments attributable to Covid than for those not attributable to it, we saw virtually all cases due to flu, colds, RSV and all other respiratory diseases disappear. Nearly all were being coded as Covid, and in many instances in order to get that additional funding. To be fair, the Covid tests were not accurate enough to reliably tell the difference, but even many gunshot wounds and auto accident injuries were being coded as involving Covid. And almost no one was challenging any of it (similar to what we now know about all manner of other frauds in recent years involving federal monies). The actual excess death counts only support a conclusion that Covid was no worse than a bad seasonal flu.
It all began with the perversions to publishing introduced by unmoderated social media. For the 1st time during an epidemic, there were no longer gatekeepers (eitors, TV producers) deciding what was fit to publish vs. hysterical rants/rubbish. The politically rabid were allowed to publicly blame elected leaders and public health officials for Covid deaths — something in previous decades would have been filtered out of public view as “hysterical, illogical or manipulative opinion”.
Do you think we’re better equipped now as a society to navigate complex challenges with tricky tradeoffs?
I don’t. Our brains have been retrained by these reckless experiments in media and communications to “take sides”, demonize opponents, and minimize wrongdoing committed by those we like. Every issue rapidly turns into an “us vs. them” conflict, where oversimplified extreme polarities define the choices. Nuanced, complex, reasoned solutions aren’t able to compete for attention against implacable, emotionally-charged polemics.
There’a reason these changes took place. It was giving Silicon Valley VCs and punk techies billions of “FU money” to experiment “reimagining the world” post-2000, and our Congress and Legislatures selling us out to pander to big tech lobbyists for campaign $. The harm to our national spirit and intellect is immeasurable.
The lame, irrational way our leaders dealt with COVID is simply the consequence of Twitter/Facebook vs. Walter Cronkite/Time Magazine a few decades before. All American born before 1970 saw this happening.
Anon @ @2:52
Your comment is a classic example of how uninformed lay people and conspiracy theorists distort information to create a false narrative.
You completely and utterly misunderstand and misinterpret the meaning of “excess deaths”.
The excess death calculation is the gold standard to retrospectively assess the effect of any calamitous natural disaster or infectious disease epidemic. It is based on a very long standing and well proven observation that all things being equal, the number of deaths in a particular community is remarkably constant from year to year. When something calamitous happens, there are more deaths than normal. It is trivial to calculate the number of excess deaths that occur after a disaster. This calculation is completely blind as to cause of death. All it does is say for any given period of time in a given community there were more deaths than usual. If a singular event occurred in that time period, then it is conclusive that the event was the cause of the excess deaths. It is really that simple.
Everything you said is completely and utterly false. It is the typical MAGA nonsense that has been promulgated to try to distort the reality of what happened with Covid.
The MAGA world has been fixated on this claim that deaths were miscoded as Covid deaths to achieve higher reimbursements. Whether or not that is true is completely irrelevant as far as the excess death calculation is concerned. As I said, the excess death calculation is completely blind to cause of death. It simply documents that more people died in a given time period than normal from any cause. The deaths could ALL have been coded as deaths due to drowning, or motor vehicle accidents, or gunshot wounds, or even death by ray gun from alien invaders, and that would not have changed the excess death calculation in any way. One of the primary purposes of doing an excess death calculation is to ELIMINATE the effect of coding errors.
The statement you make that, “The excess deaths figures do not support anything near that many above what was normally expected” is completely absurd and self-contradictory. The excess deaths figures, by definition and deliberate design tell you the number of deaths above that which is “normally expected”.
The facts are this. Around 1.3 million excess deaths occurred between March 2020 and December 2022. There was a singular natural disaster in the period of time, the Covid epidemic. Those deaths were caused by Covid. There is no other conclusion to be drawn.
You can quibble all you like about miscoding the cause of death, but that is irrelevant. More people died in that period than should have died from any cause whatsoever. The only thing that was unusual about that period was the Covid epidemic. So those excess deaths can be unequivocally attributed to Covid.
The really interesting excess death numbers were recorded in places like Australia, New Zealand, Singapore, Taiwan and Iceland. They all recorded NEGATIVE excess deaths, meaning that fewer people died than would have been expected from any cause. There were still Covid deaths, but at a much lower rate than elsewhere. The key observation is that fewer people died overall from any cause than would have been expected.
Why did this happen?
These island nations closed their borders completely except for returning citizens who had been vaccinated, and instituted total lockdowns by closing schools and all workplaces. There was a complete and total shutdown of all movement of people. Universal mask precautions were mandatory. People were not even allowed to leave their homes except to get food or medical attention. The result was almost total elimination of influenza and other respiratory illnesses that would have caused deaths. There was a dramatic drop in motor vehicle accidents and workplace accidents. Fewer people died overall and Covid infections were greatly reduced, thus proving that lockdowns and masks dramatically reduced the risk of Covid infection.
There was no additional funding tied to the cause of death. COVID tests are DNA tests; they are accurate enough.
Up your game Sergi or Putin will send you to the front.
CLUELESS
Discounting the COVID numbers is another MAGA lie–at the time, MAGA media claimed that everyone who died was listed as having COVID. They also claimed that anyone with the flu was erroneously diagnosed with COVID so hospitals could charge more money. Local health officers issue death certificates and they decide how to list the cause of death. The stress of an acute COVID infection could bring on a stroke or heart attack, which is why death certificates list the primary and secondary causes of death. There’s no doubt that COVID was deadly, especially for the vulnerable, that Trump helped make it much worse than it had to be by lying and pushing quack “cures”. Even worse now, MAGA media and Republicans, on the command of Trump, are sowing seeds of doubt about the good faith of our scientific community by trying to say that Dr. Fauci was either responsible for a lab-created mutant virus or lied about how to handle the pandemic. The next time we have a pandemic, and we will, people will unnecessarily die because some idiots believe the lies put out by MAGA media. Some of them took Ivermectin and Hydroxychloroquine instead of treatments prescribed by their doctor–and many of them died unnecessarily.
China is a criminal state that has evaded, and is responsible for, about $200 trillion in damages owed to perhaps 200 countries around the globe for its absolute Covid-19 liability.
_______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
“A reasonable ballpark estimate of the worldwide damages caused by the COVID-19 pandemic is on the order of $200 trillion, when accounting for direct economic losses, healthcare costs, government expenditures, lost productivity, business failures, educational losses, long-term disability, and the economic valuation of millions of premature deaths. Estimates vary widely depending on the methodology used.”
– ChatGPT
His is the most pathetic look of hopelessness whenever the prominence of a lifetime is brought to a wretched ruin. A net worth of $12 million and a government pension of $400,000 is not nearly enough to comfort the profound loss of a reputation. His lament should live in the hearts and minds of everyone: Never keep an honest diary when all the while living a dishonest life.
https://a57.foxnews.com/static.foxnews.com/foxnews.com/content/uploads/2026/07/720/405/fauci-testifies-senate-hearing-washington.jpg?ve=1&tl=1
Dr. Fauci’s reputation is still good with me. Turley’s is now so far in the dumpster it’s only tenure that keeps him employed.
Prof. Turley.
Fauxi is protected from Criminal culpability by Biden’s pardon.
But that protection is not global.
I am sure Countries all over the world can extradite him for illegally funding the development of a virus that killed millions of people.
And I am sure that you are a profoundly mentally impaired lunatic.
I get it, you know he’s right and it really irritates your TDS.
haha you have TDS
John Say is an underpaid Russian operative who has been told to pump this out or go visit Ukraine, where he will get 10 rifle rounds and be told to pick up a weapon that matches it from the guy who dies in front of him.
Wouldn’t they sue the United States for $ damages instead? That means you and I (and our kids) pay, not Fauci personally.
The best outcome is an unofficial understanding of what went wrong in the US and Wuhan, China. Putting facts on the official record just opens the USG up to huge liabilities internationally.
Try to think outside your echo chamber.
Say just that Fauci’s acts were ILLEGAL, meaning outside of any U.S. purview or jurisdiction, for which he has been pardoned, by the way.
When Volkswagon got caught cheating on EPA emissions tests, management tried to blame it all on a few software engineers. Scapegoating organizational responsibility that way just doesn’t work.
Fauci personally and surreptitiously perpetrated the crimes.
The U.S. did not perpetrate the crimes.
Wow, the need to punish him has taken a captain Ahab type of mentality. I guess ignorance and obsession are a dangerous combination.
John Say,
I am not sure if you wrote “Fauxi” on purpose or not in reference to Xi, or China, but Fauci wrote in his diary about receiving a brief from the CIA about intercepting signals intelligence (SIGINT) from Beijing to Wuhan at the time of the outbreak suggesting a connection.
I do not think China would want or let other countries go down that path as it could also implicate them. We already seen how opaque they were during the outbreak.
Opaque? They let the world see they were in full panic. This is the opposite of opaque. This is a level of transparency that totalitarian governments never allow, yet they let it become known that entire cities were being confined and that some apartment buildings were getting their doors welded shut to try to stop the spread. They built field hospitals for tens of thousands of people. None of it was secret.
“Fauxi is protected from Criminal culpability by Biden’s pardon.”
Based on recently discovered documents, he is *not* protected.
The pardon start date is Jan.1, 2014. That date is important because it was believed to cover his (the NIH’s) first funding of the Wuhan lab (via EcoHealth Alliance).
However, new documentation proves that NIH funding of the Wuhan lab began in *2012* — which, of course, is not covered by his pardon.
Whoever lobbied for his pardon did not do their homework.
That would be Fauci himself…
more proof that he believes he is above the law.
“However, new documentation proves that NIH funding of the Wuhan lab began in *2012* — which, of course, is not covered by his pardon.”
So, if his interrogators had ended every question with “Please limit your answer only to events and conversations that took place subsequent to December 31, 2013”, or made that qualification after he declined to answer, he could not have legally taken the Fifth even once? The level of detail in hos notes strongly suggests that a reply from Fasci that he could not recall the dates of such things would have been had little credibility.
“his notes” AARRRGGHHH!!!
Remember when Trump, long before the pandemic, cut the staffing in Wuhan that was to keep tabs on any disease outbreaks? Seems like more than a coincidence.
This is the pertinent statement in the Fifth Amendment to the United States Constitution:
“nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself”
Fasci was granted immunity by Idiot Biden against any and all charges that could conceivably result from his answering those questions before Congress. Even if there was a potential exception here or there, it almost certainly would be minute in scope, and could never be held to apply to every question he was asked. So Turley’s take on this issue is to me just pouring forth the kind of fire-free smoke that tends to give the legal profession a bad name and evil reputation. There is no freaking way that every question Fasci was asked is covered by a plain reading of the 5th A, end of story. Personally, I would enjoy seeing the 8th A waived to deal with Fasci; I would cheer as he was drawn and quartered and simultaneously doused with napalm and burned alive in a public square to provide a clear disincentive to the next authoritarian egomaniac anus who lucks into the power to commit atrocities analogous to his, but I reluctantly cannot actually advocate for that because of the 8th.
Dr. Fauci was not granted immunity against being accused of perjury.
Other than that, you are a mentally ill person who needs to be confined for their own protection.
“Hi, President Xi? It’s me, Fauci. Say, just between you and me, would you be willing to accept millions of American tax dollars for your lab in Wuhan to create a pathogen that can bring America to its knees? Yeah, that’s right, your lab, your rules, your virus. Only the money would be American. Why? Well, your own biological warfare labs are underserved. We want to level the playing field. It’s how Washington rolls now. Okay, so let me know. I could wire you the money tomorrow from my slush fund. They don’t really watch me in DC anymore. I can make this happen on my own. My best to you,& the wife. Tell Tim Walz I said ‘Hi.'”–Tony.
Oh Herro Tony! I rove you rooong time. Preaze haff Barrock caw me about hepping him frow the 2020 erection. He still owe us money…
Cynical
cynical/ˈsinək(ə)l/
Cynical means believing that people are selfish, do not have good motives, and that sincerity is fake.
Meaning and Use
Selfish Motives: Thinking that people only do things to help themselves, not to help others.
No Trust: Doubting good news, kindness, or promises made by leaders.
Mocking Tone: Using a bitter or sarcastic way to talk about high values like love, honesty, or virtue.
Real-Life Examples
Politics: Doubting a politician who promises to fix things, thinking they only want votes.
Charity: Assuming a company giving money away is only doing it for good publicity instead of caring.
IMO: WHY[?] was the Covid virus developed in the first place? To effect the Masses (Contain/Quarantine them) and destroy the Stock Markets (Crash the Markets).
Covid was developed for ‘destruction’. Nice try Think Tanks, It did not work and We survived it physically (health) and economically.
“We survived it physically (health) and economically.”
It remains to be seen if we survived it politically and culturally. Which is something that Fasci should be made to answer for.
‘We Won Completely’: Weinstein Says COVID ‘Conspiracy Theorists’ Were Totally Vindicated
… “In 2026, here’s what we see. We actually won. Completely. All of these things are now visible to anybody who wishes to see them.
Yet, while hearts and minds were won and ‘conspiracy theorists’ vindicated, we have a limp dicked government that won’t hold anyone’s feet to the fire.
“And we’ve lost completely. Our capacity to do anything about this is now on full display. We have none.”
“Your ability to simply get the story clear enough and enough evidence on the table does not have an impact on what happens next. …
By: Tyler Durden ~ Jul 30, 2026
https://www.zerohedge.com/political/we-won-completely-weinstein-says-covid-conspiracy-theorists-were-vindicated
My late wife was a research biologist. She wsa clear a pangolin (SE Asia) protein spike wasn’t just going to graft itself to a bat (from nothern china) corona virus in a fish market. Plus, we both knew that Fauci had been advocating and hiding GOF research since before it was made illegal in 2014 due to the risks being too great.
I also find it amusing that he KNEW it was GOF. He talks about it in his diary!
I just hope some country extradites and tries him for his crimes against humanity since he was pardoned by the Autopen here in the US.
@moseszd
My dad was a microbiologist who specialized in viruses – I grew up hearing and learning about all of this. I (as did many others) suspected from the third month into this mess, this is not how viruses work and the whole, entire covid thing, particularly the response (and again, particularly given past, saner responses to viruses, even under Obama) stank to high heaven. Not one iota of anything past May of 2020 resembled actual science. Zip. Zilch. Nada. The lockdowns were an authoritarian fever dream.
There was never any threat to even moderately healthy people at any time. Fauci was likely well aware of this fact, and I expect even more so than the average person, as they likely knew in the GOF lab this covid strain while they were working on it was likely not fatal to most (no, they did not invent covid viruses in 2020 or even 2018 – they were just working with them). This was not on the level of Agent Orange, even if it was still preternaturally stupid and reckless.
I expect the narrative to continue to deflect away from him personally, acknowledge the rest eventually, and to somehow retroactively try to play dumb (regarding this topic; they are dumb in general, otherwise they would not be and could not be sycophants in the first place, but I digress). There is nothing to redeem on the modern left. Not a scrap. Nothing. And again, I am a lifelong Independent that voted for Obama the first time. What a fool I was.
‘We invented a new flu!’, is their pathetic accomplishment, and literally the entire planet has paid the price. Going on six years now.
Stop voting for these people, everywhere. There is no longer a viable democrat party in America.
Everything you wrote is a disproven lie. Check it out on Snopes. There are hundreds of coronaviruses that have been studied for decades, and it has been known for years that bats carry the virus, and that it can spread from bats to humans and other species. The US NEVER funded gain of function research and there’s no proof that COVID was due to gain of function versus natural mutation. WHAT “crimes against humanity” did Dr. Fauci commit? I have yet to see what they are. And, never forget–the fat slob was occupying the White House. If he didn’t want to take Dr. Fauci’s advice, he didn’t have to, and in many instances, he did not. And, what recommendations and advice did Dr. Fauci give that varied from the consensus of the scientific community? If anyone is responsible for unncessary COVID deaths it’s Trump, with his lies about the seriousness of COVID, lies about ingesting bleach, taking Hydroxychloroquine and Ivermectin, trying to shift blame to China, suggesting less testing to reduce the statistics on the numbers of new infections and deaths and his utter incompetence. Just like Trump tore up the JCPOA because it was an achievement by Obama, Trump threw out Barak Obama’s pandemic playbook, even though he was warned by Dr. Fauci that a pandemic was coming–but we don’t know when, so we should be vigilant. AND, BTW, Trump awarded Drs. Fauci and Birx a Presidential Commendation the day before he left office.
“…Trump, with his lies about the seriousness of COVID, lies about ingesting bleach,”
Talk about telling lies, little gigi. How many more times are you going to twist what he actually said. YOu are one sick little lying girl, and Ivermectin won’t help you.
Before covid, China had a big problem with an aging population dragging down their economy. just sayin.
So did America, they call them unfunded liabilities. Ask that DB ex Governor Cuomo what NY’s solution was.
Looking back, it is amazing how easy it all was. With scare headlines, and pictures of people panicking (remember the long lines at the grocery store), or film of masses of people in China wearing masks, almost the entire populace of an allegedly well-educated country surrendered any skepticism or curiosity, and gave the government at the federal and state level control over their lives. Children missed needed schooling, small businesses were forced out of business, and the few skeptics were ostracized. The all purpose charge “racism” was used against the lab-leak theory, even though it was known from the beginning that the virus originated in Wuhan, where a hi-tech lab was located and where doctors working at that lab were among the early victims. We voluntarily gave up the use of our reason, the most valuable resource human beings have. There is no reason to believe that a hoax like this cannot be perpetrated again. The ingredients for this kind of lie are still there.
edwardmahl,
I believe you are right when you say,
“There is no reason to believe that a hoax like this cannot be perpetrated again.”
I also like to think if there was a “again” some if not half the country, to include the politicians, would say,
“Stop. Dont panic. Is this really as bad as it seems? Lets look at the facts and science before we get on the crazy train again.”
No one has ever seen an personal, rational comment from you. All you do is kiss a-s-s here. You’re just a stupid hanger-on.
The stupid comments come from the anonymous cowards. This is not the first hoax around epidemics. It won’t be the last.
Oh! Poor, poor annony! All butt hurt that OLLY and I point out how irrational your comment was. And we were right.
How marvelous!
Hillary, put the cork back in the wine bottle and get off the floor and go get sober.!!!
Duh! You can fool all the people some of the time, and some of the people all the time, but you can’t fool all the people all of the time. Then theres. Your lying, (I)(We) know your lying, You know (I)(We) know your lying, and you still keep on lying. Our leaders, the news media, and a pycho who keeps on saying he didn’t do it lying on the way to the gas chamber and and there’s all the people who believe him innocent, then he’s executed and then the DNA evidence comes out that he’s 100% guilty and his defenders still say he’s innocent and some of the population still believes he’s innocent but not everybody.
Depends on who is in the White House.
WHAT IS THE HOAX? COVID was a novel virus–a highly-contagious mutated strain of coronavirus, a family of viruses that have been around for decades. Are you saying that COVID was not easily transmitted, that it was not deadly, that masks were not indicated, that social distancing and distance learning were not indicated? What point are you trying to make other than Trump has decreed that Fauci should be punished? It was NOT “known from the beginning that the virus originated in Wuhan”–the scientific community still does NOT have a consensus as to the source, but genetic evidence leans toward a natural source. From “Health Beat”:
“There is no single right answer to how societies should handle pandemics. Every approach will involve trade-offs, regrets, and a need for humility. I used to tell colleagues and reporters that all options before us are bad and that we are trying to choose the least bad path forward. Each decision ideally starts with science, but turning science into policy requires a complex assessment of benefits, harms, feasibility, acceptability, affordability, legality, and ethics.
It is healthy in a democracy to challenge consensus, to debate what went wrong during the peak of the pandemic, and to listen to those who felt unheard or harmed by policy decisions. As we do so, we should also be wary of oversimplified narratives. The truth of the Covid response is more complex than either triumph or failure. As we reflect, we must hold space for different perspectives — while also insisting that those perspectives wrestle with the full scope of the crisis, not just the parts that fit our preferred narrative. ”
Here are some points:
1. Scientists don’t make final decisions as to shut downs or anything else–that falls on elected officials on the local, state and federal levels.
2. The social and economic costs of various paths forward once the pandemic became known were balanced against the loss of human life. We don’t know what we don’t know, and based on what was known at the time, it’s simply revisionist theory to criticize Dr. Fauci or other scientists for their recommendations. Scientists had to balance personal liberty vs. averting deaths and acute illnesses. It wasn’t known then that there could be long-term COVID that could be disabling.
3. Revisionists forget that hospitals were overwhelmed, there was a shortage of ventilators, hospitals in big cities had to hire refrigerated trucks to hold dead bodies. Health care workers begged people to stay home to avoid getting infected because they couldn’t take care of them. Doctors and nurses were exhausted. The elderly were especially vulnerable.
4. One force driving criticism now of decisions made then is “survivor bias”–but what about those who died from COVID? If they had a voice about whether distancing and other measures should have been implemented sooner, what would they say? Probably that if preventive measures had been employed sooner, there would have been fewer infections and deaths.
The sad truth is that MAGA revisionists are trying to convince people not to trust public health officials–and some of them will fall for it. There will be another pandemic some day, and if we are wise, we should be monitoring for it and have a pandemic playbook ready to implement. Microorganisms aren’t bound by denial. Monitoring for it includes cooperating with the WHO and our allies, all of whom Trump has attacked. The only reason for the MAGA revisionist attacks on Dr. Fauci is Trump’s ego–he just can’t accept responsibility for his mishandling of the crisis, tearing up the Obama pandemic playbook, lying about the seriousness, pushing for quack cures, so he has to try to shift blame.
You need a lot of words to try to convince yourself you’re right and you don’t have incurable TDS but I’m here to tell you: don’t jump!
I find it interesting that his pardon went back as far as 2014. Why so far back ? Hmm…
That’s when Gain of Function research was made illegal.
GoF has never been illegal. In 2014, a federal government funding moratorium began.
There’s a the real question sitting under all of this. Not who’s right about Fauci or the diary or the funding. Whether we’re still citizens or whether we’ve drifted into being managed subjects and just haven’t noticed yet.
A citizen demands the mechanism before he accepts the outcome. A subject takes the story he’s given and moves on. A citizen holds his own side accountable, not just the other team. A subject picks a jersey and defends it no matter what the record shows. This week alone gave us a grocery program funded with no vote and no bond, and a public official protected by a pardon who still won’t say a plain sentence about what he knew and when. Neither one got stopped by outrage. Both got defended by people who should have been asking harder questions.
We as a supposedly self-governing constitutional republic need to honestly assess where we are right now. Are we acting to defend citizens from an unaccountable government, or subjects being managed by this administrative state to our own demise?
Your absurd diatribes are becoming increasingly tiresome and delusional, and display an ever increasing lack of self-awareness.
You said, “A subject picks a jersey and defends it no matter what the record shows.”
That statement perfectly encapsulates the MAGA cult to which you belong. You are one of those subjects who are being managed by the cult that has unfortunately taken over the government of this country, and if rational citizens fail to defend against this usurpation of power by the MAGA monstrosity it will indeed lead to our demise.
Read your own reply back. Zero facts. Not one line about the grocery financing, the diary, the pardon, or the Fifth Amendment sequence I actually laid out. Just “MAGA cult” thrown at someone who never claimed a party anywhere in this thread. That’s not a rebuttal. That’s a tell.
You call it self-awareness I’m lacking. But you just did exactly what I described, reached for a label instead of an argument, the moment the mirror got held up. That’s not delusion on my end. That’s the pattern confirming itself.
Word salad of gibberish.
If you are a member of the MAGA cult, you are part of the problem, not part of the solution.
If you voted for Trump, then by definition you are a MAGA cult member.
Did you vote for Trump??
If so, then my point is made and no further discussion is necessary.
🤣 Careful with that word salad, looks like it’s already given you a bad case of cyclosporiasis. Might explain the reaction. Symptoms include watery arguments, cramping logic, and a sudden urge to avoid facts entirely.
OLLY,
Interesting how the annony now gives himself the command of what is the problem, the solution and definitions are.
Hey Democrats, the sane and normal ones. That annony ^^, that is the types you need to give the boot to and take back your party. Get back to your traditional roots.
Bill Maher has been saying it for years. So has the good professor.
interesting how farmer always kisses olly a s s. always and clearly doesn’t know what olly’s writing.
Oh! No! Poor, poor annony! Having another one of his mental meltdowns over the fact OLLY and I are having a interesting, intelligent conversation. Annony on the other hand, can only throw insults, try to claim he only knows the problems, the solutions and what definitions are. That sounds a lot like narcissism dont you think annony? Whom else are well know for their narcissistic tendencies? Why, would it not be people in cults?
Good point. Notice how he both declared me MAGA outright and then turned around and asked if I was. Can’t have it both ways. If he already knew, why ask? And if he needed to ask, he never knew in the first place, just labeled first and hoped the label would hold.
OLLY – what does it even matter ? I am not MAGA – I am libertarian. There is some overlap. But more importantly, calling something or someone MAGA does not tell you if they are right or wrong on an issue. At best it tells you MAYBE where they stand on an issue NOT being discussed.
I personally FULLY support the sentiment – “Make American Great Again” – but I do not always agree with Trump on how that should be accomplished.
I have repeatedly said Trump is the best president of the 21st century AND that is a low bar.
Neither I nor anyone else is going to get a president that is their perfect choice in every way.
I am constantly accused of being MAGA in the ideological sense. I am not. At the same time the fact that I think some aspects of MAGA are wrong is not the same as accepting that being called MAGA is some insult that discredits every argument you might make.
OLLY
Did you vote for Trump ???
Yes or no.
Failure to answer means you did.
Prove me wrong.
Oh, look. Now annony is making demands from OLLY to answer annony’s questions as if that means anything at all.
OLLY, tell him you wrote in vote of Sophie Cunningham.
😉 Nuff said.
“When I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I put the ways of childhood behind me.”
ROFL
You neglected to mention explosive diarrhea of the keyboard…
The way you write, it’s not a discussion anyway. Back to night school for you buddy. Come back when you have an original thought to share.
ANON =MORON CULT MEMBER!!
Lets actually address words accutately.
MAGA is not a cult – the lunatic left is.
MAGA is also not a part of any problem – it is an effort to solve problems – even if it is on occasion wrong.
Voting for Trump does not make you MAGA.
Not voting for Trump does not m,ean that you do not support much of his platform.
People vote one way or the other for many reasons.
No candidate is ever perfect and often we have only two choices.
I have not voted for Trump – does that warp your brain ?
Nor did I vote for Clinton, Obama, Biden or Harris.
If you put a gun to my head and said you MUST chose Trump or Harris/Biden/Clinton – I would have held my nose and voted for Trump.
We are better off with Trump than the three democratic choices we had.
That does not make Trump a perfect choice.
Actual cults do not have the ability to question their leaders or their dogma – that is why MAGA is not a cult and the far left is.
What defines a political cult is the absolute refusal to hold the leader accountable for core moral, ethical, or legal transgressions. Within MAGA, the moment an insider fundamentally breaks with Donald Trump on a critical issue (such as the 2020 election results or his federal criminal indictments), they are instantly excommunicated, labeled a “RINO”, and politically destroyed. Look at what happened to MTG.
Trump frequently uses textbook cult language, telling his followers at rallies, “I am your warrior. I am your justice… I am your retribution.” The movement views American politics not as a debate between differing policy ideas, but as an existential, holy war between good (MAGA) and absolute evil (everyone else).
Claiming “the lunatic left is the real cult” is a classic logical fallacy.
While the political left has extreme factions, it lacks a single, centralized, messianic figurehead. Democratic voters frequently and openly rebel against their own leaders—as seen when massive intra-party pressure forced Joe Biden off the ticket in 2024. In stark contrast, the MAGA movement completely purged the traditional Republican Party infrastructure, replacing independent officials with Trump family members and absolute loyalists to ensure total obedience to one man. When Trump dies, MAGA will wither away, just like the Tea Party did.
“I have not voted for Trump.” This is entirely irrelevant. The MAGA movement is defined by the millions of people who do blindly follow Trump, buy his branded bibles and merchandise, and view him as a divinely chosen savior. You holding your nose to vote for Trump does not change the sociological reality of the millions of core zealots who treat the leader’s word as absolute law. You share the same level of zealotry Trump has. Because ideologues you both share the same zealotry when it comes to views and positions. Plus there’s the lying.
I tell every commie, Freedom is not an ideology.
“What defines a political cult is the absolute refusal to hold the leader accountable for core moral, ethical, or legal transgressions. ”
Nope.
A cult is characterized by unusual, coercive, extreme and often unfalsifiable views typically with a charasmatic and authoritarian leader.
MAGA views are NORMIE views – that automatically disqualifies MAGA as a cult.
Conversely anyone who today has bought into socialism is likely in a cult. Charasmatic leaders are not a requirement but they are common. JFK, Clinton, Reagan, Obama were charismatic. AOC is charasmatic., Trump is charismatic.
MAGA is not coercive. no one gets ostracized by friends and family for leaving MAGA or tempering their views or becoming disallusioned with MAGA or Trump. Turley has provided myriads of examples of left wing nuts turning on their own for minor dogmatic deviations. Further it is the left that Openly chooses to disassociate from those who refuse to be converted. It is the left that advises people not to participate in hoilidays with MAGA family members.
“Within MAGA, the moment an insider fundamentally breaks with Donald Trump on a critical issue (such as the 2020 election results or his federal criminal indictments), they are instantly excommunicated, labeled a “RINO”, and politically destroyed. Look at what happened to MTG.”
Nope.
MTG’s abrupt exit from politics was surprising – while it occured concurrent with a spat with Trump, Few considered that consequential.
Rubio and Trump brutally attacked each other – Rubio is now Trumps Sec State. Vance and Trump had a more serious spat than MTG – Vance is now Trump’s VP.
MTG was a rising start in the GOP when she quit. She was taking on a larger role in Congress, She was chairing committees.
If you wish to Claim that Trump has politically targeted GOP members that lead impeachment efforts – absolutely.
That should not surprise you in the slightest. The Clinton’s are famous for targeting political enemies – so much so much so that many of them mysteriously die and a number of people believe that the Clinton’s had them killed.
There was a fight inside the GOP – much like the one in the DNC right now over the power of NeoCons within the party.
Trump won that fight – because Republicans as a whole were unhappy with the power of NeoCon’s within the party.
Some NeoCon’s – like Bolton Chenney were ostracized. But others like Lindsey Graham found a place within the GOP.
Personally I would have been happy to see all NeoCons gone.
SOME of Trump’s current more muscular foreign policy is about drawing NeoCon’s back into the fold.
The conflict was NOT over membership in the GOP but POWER within the GOP.
I have not closely followed them – but Tucker Carlson and Candice Owens – both of whom are very smart, appear to have gone completely bonkers in the past year plus. Regardless, they still have significant MAGA following, lots of people are wondering about their sanity, but not tossing them from the GOP or MAGA.
MTG could have survived her spat with Trump – and could have increased her stature in the GOP over time. She chose to leave, she was not driven out.
Regardless, Democrats need to disempower their far left – just as MAGA diminished the power of Neocons.
James Carville is nuts, but he is also right – if the socialists in the Democratic party gain too much power and too high a profile Democrats will end up being a rump party. For every voter drawn to Socialism – 2 are driven away. Worse for Democrats, most minorities are MORE anti-socialist than whites. Democrats are shedding minority and blue collar voters to Republicans,
they are rapidly becoming the party of underperforming over educated young white women – and that is NOT a recipe for power.
“Trump frequently uses textbook cult language, telling his followers at rallies, “I am your warrior”
Your text book not mine. Whether you like it or not EVERYONE wants leaders who fight for them.
Those on the left do the same.
“Claiming “the lunatic left is the real cult” is a classic logical fallacy.”
ROFL
Right here you constantly spray complete logical garbage.
You are labeled as Lunatic Left – because that relatively accurately describes you.
It might be a small amount of hyperbole – but hyperbole has been part of politics since Jefferson and Adams,
and prior to Trump it was the Left that mastered the politics of personal destruction.
You hate Trump because he read your playbook and he is executing it better than you.
“While the political left has extreme factions, it lacks a single, centralized, messianic figurehead.”
Obama absolutely filled that role until he was term limited. He still tries to fill that role.
Democrats do not have a messianic figure right now but not for lack of people aspiring tho that role.
AOC wants that role, Newsome wants that role, Sanders wants that role. Myriads of other democrats aspire to that role.
Thus far they have failed to secure it. Historically Democrats are far more drawn in by charismatic cult leaders. Trump and Reagan are the exceptions to that. The quintessential republican is Coolidge or Eisenhower, or the Bushes – dull but dependable.
“Democratic voters frequently and openly rebel against their own leaders”
As do republicans AS YOU pointed out.
“as seen when massive intra-party pressure forced Joe Biden off the ticket in 2024.”
Bzzt wrong. Biden was forced out by the party LEADERSHIP – Obama and Pelosi and by Billionaire donors.
It is near certain Biden would have lost. But that was true before his entirely predictable debate failure.
Regardless, you are stupidly using the evidence of your own Coverup of Biden’s lack of capacity as evidence of internal diversity when your example proves the Opposite.
Anyone speaking out about Biden’s lack of capictity was SILENCED – Everyone – even
Democrat adjacent was defending Biden as competent despite OBVIOUS evidence to the contrary – not just left wing nuts, but the supposed centrists, the entire media, every democrat political leader was defending an obvious lie until it was not possible to do so anymore.
And you just did EXACTLY the same thing with Platner in Maine.
“In stark contrast, the MAGA movement completely purged the traditional Republican Party infrastructure, replacing independent officials with Trump family members and absolute loyalists to ensure total obedience to one man.”
Hawley, Tim Scott, Rick Scott, Desantos, Vance, Rubio, even Gabard, Graham had he lived. Abbot, Johnson, Jordan, Comer, Dillon. Zelden
These are just a few of next crop of Republican leaders.
There is absolutely a generational thing going on – as there is with Democrats.
Whatever else you think of him McConnel was a powerful and effective leader. He may or may not be dead. but he is out of power.
The young turks in the GOP have been challenging the old guard – the same is happening in the democratic party.
Schumer is going, pelosi is effectively gone. and a younger crowd is jockeying for power.
Both Parties need to have both older experienced leaders and new younger challengers. Both parties need to be rolling out those who age out.
” When Trump dies, MAGA will wither away”
You can hope.
While you are correct that there is no GOP rising star with Trump’s charisma, and it was probably impossible to accomplish the rebuilding of the GOP into a serious contender that Trump accomplished without that charisma. as I noted before – Charisma has NOT been a major selling point for republican leaders in the past. Few Republican presidents have been charasmatic.
While it helps to get elected, it is not a necescity to be president.
Frankly myriads of Republicans think Trump is too combative. But they vote for him anyway – because voters are not voting for a single attribute but the whole package. They are not expecting perfection. Trump is not perfect. He is just signicicantly better than the democrats.
“just like the Tea Party did.”
The Tea Party became MAGA. It is just rebranding. They did not fade away – they rebranded and grew.
Go read Tea Party policy positions from 2009 – they are Trump’s agenda 47.
Those of you on the left HOPE that the DSA will be as successful as the Tea Party was.
““I have not voted for Trump.” This is entirely irrelevant. ”
Of course it is relevant.
You keep pretending that republicans are lemmings. Their not. You noted conflicts in the GOP.
SOME of those conflicts resulted in people leaving or being forced out.
That happens within the democratic party too. How do you think Tulsi Gabbard became the DNI ?
Mostly these conflicts are just power strugles over power within the GOP.
These same struggles are happening in the Democrat party too.
“The MAGA movement is defined by the millions of people who do blindly follow Trump,”
And yet your OWN claims are the opposite. You note conflicts.
and then argue that MAGA – the GOP are blind lemmings.
X as usual you see a world that does not exist.
There are myriads of people right here on this blog who range from the center to the right.
We debate we argue we disagree.
We are NOT homogeneous, we are Obviously not a cult.
Sometimes we STRONGLY disagree. But we get along, we accept that we are not going to get our way on everything – even if each of us is certain our positions are the only correct one.
There are about an equal number of left wing nuts. Aside from some style you are all homogeneous. You make the same stupid long ago debunked arguments tediously over and over.
While I see actually MAGA people all over in the real world – they are also here on this blog, and it is self evident they are NOT what you claim.
I have frequently defended Trump – or more accurately Attacked the left.
Trump says stupid things. For the most part he does not Do stupid things. More important still Trump’s actual conduct is ANTI-Authoritiarian. Trump is agressively using presidential powers. But he is FOLLOWING THE LAW – he is doing so OBVIOUSLY.
A major area is illegal immigration.
US law – passed by democrats and republicans specifies that those in the US who are not citizens legal permanent residents or who do not have active visas may not be here.
If you do not like that CHANGE THE LAW. In a few specific instances I would join you – I would be happy to SLIGHTLY relax US immigration law.
Regardless, Obama violated that law, Biden totally completely ignored that law. No worse he Actively sought to violate that law in every possible way.
That is what authoritarianism looks like.
If the people create law through elected representatives – and presidents just ignore that law – that is the real cult of personality, that is the real authoritarianism.
Agressively enforcing the law – even law you do not like is NOT authoritarian – it is anti-authoritarian.
Those of you on the left have declared war on Trump’s efforts to enforce the law. You claim he is not dotting his I’s and crossing his T’s. All fine we can debate that. If he is not following the law closingly that can be fixed.
But you are NOT seeking to compel Trump to more closely follow the law.
You rant badly about due process – but you do not want due process, you want the enforcement of the law completely stopped.
You want a return to lawless authoritarianism.
I have used illegal immigration as an example – because it is the most obvious it is where those of you on the left have expended the most resources. It is also where you have most inverted logic.
Authoritiarians do what THEY want – nopt what the people want and not what the law requires.
YOU are the authoritarian not Trump.
stultus es! Ipso facto!
OLLY,
I read and re-read your initial comment, the annony’s comment and then your response.
Yes. Your response was accurate and spot on.
To your initial comments question of,
“Are we acting to defend citizens from an unaccountable government, or subjects being managed by this administrative state to our own demise?”
I would have to say mostly the latter. It seems it is much easier to put on the jersey than to conduct any kind of self-awareness or self-reflection and correct ones course of action.
I would also add it does not help when the mechanism has been abandoned for the jersey, no matter what.
I appreciate that Upstate, and you just proved the point better than I did. “Easier to put on the jersey than do any self-reflection” is exactly the mechanism. Reflection takes work. Tribal defense takes none. One requires a citizen to risk being wrong about his own side. The other just requires picking a color and staying loyal to it no matter what shows up in the record.
And your last line’s the real kicker. Once the mechanism gets abandoned for the jersey, it doesn’t matter which team’s doing it. The republic doesn’t care whose jersey wins. It just quietly stops working the way it’s supposed to either way.
To be clear, there’s nothing wrong with picking a jersey on policy disputes. That’s normal, always has been. But when it comes to our fundamental responsibility to hold government accountable, there should only be one jersey. Team Citizen.
You’re the biggest, most cowardly and ignorant clown here. It’s always your MAGA MAGA MAGA crap. You’re hysterical, like a small child whose favorite toy has broken.
Heavy cannabis use at an early age has been scientifically proven to retard social development.
Just saying (Anonymous), some arguments presented daily indicate a lack of any logical reasoning capabilities.
MORON ANON
wow! TDS irritation comes from reading how wonderful Trump is, so if I were you I would stay away! Hide in your basement because news of Trump! kicking liberal ass for the last decade might make you go ‘over the edge’.
“Whether we’re still citizens or whether we’ve drifted into being managed subjects and just haven’t noticed yet.”
I’m sorry to report that, with some notable exceptions, who are unfortunately unlikely (imo) to prevail anytime soon, the second option is the one that rings true.
The 5th Amendment to the United States Constitution provides that one cannot be compelled to be a witness against themselves. When invoked, the right relieves one of answering questions the truth of which might be used to charge them with a crime. In effect, the right protects them from having to tell the truth. If Fauci’s guilt could not have been proven, the pardon given him by the Biden Administration would not have been needed.
As evidenced by the pardon, there is no doubt but what Fauci was involved in the effort undertaken in an inadequately secured Chinese virology research laboratory to genetically alter a particular virus in a way that would enhance functions like transmissibility or pathogenesis, with the goal of helping develop vaccines and therapeutics. That Fauci would not speak to the truth of it is not surprising. Also, not surprising and equally disturbing is that not one democrat on the Senate Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs Committee offered anything to negate the truth of but for the gain-of-function research at the poorly secured Chinese virology research laboratory the world would never have experienced the Covid-19 pandemic. One grieves for all the wasteful and unnecessary measures that were taken and all the lives lost or otherwise so negatively impacted.
Wellll. Also there is the little fact that China blocked all traffic out of Wuhan into the rest of China but freely allowed international travel by infected Wuhan Chinese citizens. Almost looked like a deliberate act of war which our deep state government employees were to scared of WW III or WW one hundred and eleven as one our representatives would say.
#. RICO, is that how it’s spelled?
I doubt Fauci will ever see the inside of a court room let alone be prosecuted.
Rather let the contents of his diary be well known, questionable ties with various people in academia, government, foreign figures and institutions. Some journalist publish a damning book using facts and evidence to back it up.
Play the clip of the exchange between him and Senator Hawley where Fauci invokes the fifth when asked,
“What day of the week is it?”
“What color tie are you wearing?”
“What color is the carpet in front of you?” pic.twitter.com/WLaEOXd99u
— Kassy Akiva (@KassyAkiva) July 29, 2026
And, the images of the puppies he authorized those heinous experiments on.
Watching his credibility and his celebrity status come crashing down around him might be a better punishment.
To be known as a fraud. And use his own diary to prove it.
A good run down, Top 10 takeaways from Anthony Fauci’s hearing in front of Senate committee
https://justthenews.com/government/congress/here-are-top-10-major-takeaways-anthony-faucis-hearing-front-senate-committee
Number 9,
“Early on that became like a right-wing kind of theory, and I thought it seemed to make sense,” he said. “There was a really advanced lab that was close by, and then you have this unknown virus out. That became a very partisan thing, and now it seems it’s more and more emerging theory that that would have come from the lab.”
— Senator Fetterman
Seems the Senator is displaying, wait for it . . . common sense.
The most important aspect of this and many other similar things is to destroy the cult of trust in experts.
Particularly government experts.
I am not the slightest anti-intellectual. What I am opposed to is the idiocy of believing that consensus which is mostly political, is a substitute for proof, or in science from adhering to the scientific method.
Further we need to stop pretending that ideology does not infect everything – including science.
Regardless the HUGE problem with trust in the cult of experts is that it ultimately empowers government to use FORCE.
I do not personally care what stupid things you b
If Fauxi and Atlas and Bachtara wish to fight out Covid in their front years, in science journals or the MSM – I am fine with that.
What is absolutely immoral is that ANY side of any argument gets to use the force of govenrment to impose its will.
“I am not the slightest anti-intellectual.”
But then…
“Regardless the HUGE problem with trust in the cult of experts is that it ultimately empowers government to use FORCE.”
That’s what an inti-intellectual is. When you call experts a cult because they have more knowledge than most.
That is not what John Say said.
He said when you have a group of experts who all adhere to a singular idea that is not based on knowledge but ideology leading to the government to use force upon the citizens. It is not based on science but ideology.
The emails between Fauci and Collins put on display in their quest to discredit The Great Barrington Declaration was not based on science but ideology.
“The Great Barrington Declaration was not based on science but ideology.”
It wasn’t really even based on ideology. It was based on a naked lust for absolute authoritarian control.
“Let’s be clear: the work of science has nothing whatever to do with consensus. Consensus is the business of politics. Science, on the contrary, requires only one investigator who happens to be right, which means that he or she has results that are verifiable by reference to the real world. In science, consensus is irrelevant. What is relevant is reproducible results. The greatest scientists in history are great precisely because they broke with the consensus. There’s no such thing as consensus science. If it’s consensus, it isn’t science. If it’s science, it isn’t consensus.” –Michael Crichton
It is vital to the survival of our Republic that this matter of premptive pardons be settled once and for all by the Supreme Court. Nixon’s pardon was political not judicial and never tested in the courts. The communist members of the Democratic Party got everything they wanted. They got rid of Nixon’s and as a bonus a new tool to use in future battles to destroy us. The premptive pardon.
Fauxi invoked the 5th at all questions – because that is what the courts require. I believe that is error. But it is how our legal system works.
Once you invoke the 5th if you stop – you have lost your right to continue to do so.
Any witness who ONCE invokes the 5th should be entitled to consult with council before answering other questions, That is how things work in the investigative phase. When you ask for a lawyer questioning stops until a lawyer is present – but then your lawyers assists you in deciding what to answer and what not to.
Holy….John Say, are you high? Everything you just posted is absolutely wrong. No wonder you have these weird views on legal issues. You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.
Fauci’s legal team had him issue a blanket refusal not because answering one question destroys the right forever, but because the hearing was explicitly designed as a perjury trap. Answering any selective questions—even seemingly benign ones, like Senator Josh Hawley asking what color the carpet was—can be strategically used by hostile cross-examiners to establish a baseline of testimony, find contradictions with past statements, and manufacture a new crime of perjury.
A congressional subpoenaed hearing is not a police station interrogation. Under the rules of the Senate, the Miranda “right to counsel” rules—where questioning stops until a lawyer arrives—do not apply. Fauci was not in the “investigative phase” hidden from view; he was testifying under a formal congressional subpoena with his attorneys sitting right next to him the entire time.
“No wonder you have these weird views on legal issues. You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.”
Were you projecting, X?
You seem to have spent a lot of time trying to correct Professor of Law Turley and several lawyers on this blog, when you are nothing but an AI copycatting wannabe. Pretty funny, eh?
X – there is no such thing as a perjury trap.
You can not be trapped into committing perjury.
No one can design a set of questions to coerce you into perjuring yourself.
You commit perjury by choosing to lie rather than tell the truth.
There is no other way to commit perjury.
No one can make you lie.
Further it is extremely rare that the lawyers in court want a witness to do anything but tell the truth.
In fact it is unethical for any lawyer to try to get a witness to lie. You can get disbarred for it.
Opposing counsels frequently seek to catch a harmful witness in a lie. But doing so REQUIRES the witness to CHOOSE TO LIE.
There is not EVER someone else to blame if you lie under oath.
There is a reason that we punish perjury. Because the rule of law can not work if witnesses routinely lie.
As to What Republicans wanted from Fauxi – first and foremost they wanted THE TRUTH.
He was being FORCED to testiufy – that is what a subpeona is FORCE.
He was NOT being FORCED to lie.
Republicans wanted him to tell the truth.
They wanted the malfeasance and misconduct of him and his cronies exposed.
They WANTED him to tell the truth PROVING that he had lied – publicly and under oath repeatedly in the past.
Not only is that what they wanted, but it is OBVIOUSLY what they wanted.
Everyone not on the far left already KNOWS fauxi lied repeatedly publicly and under oath.
Increasingly we KNOW that he was also corrupt – Profiting off his Goivernment office.
Using his power over Grants and appointments to seek Cash awards for himself.
But also to control information – to assure that what people heard was the lie HE wanted them to here.
He also lied abused power and manipulated people to hide the truth of his own criminal conduct.
The program to enhance bat corona virus was not his, but he was instrumental in making it happen.
He worked arround US laws prcluding that type of research and he assisted in moving research that was illegal in the US to china and other countries that were more lax. That is true whether we are specifically talking about the research that to a very high degree of probability lead to Covid leaking and killing Millions – YES Fauci is responsible for MILLIONS of deaths and harm. You can rant that he did not INTEND to kill millions. But he absolutely without any doubt intended to circumvent US law precluding such research, AND he did so recklessly and negligently. This is NOT the first deadly bio research leak. It is just the first one that got passed the people in the research fascility.
Furthert this is a PATTERN of conduct on Fauxi’s part – this is not just about covid research -0 it is about tortuous animal research that is banned int he US that he channeled into other countries that allowed it. Maybe you should spend some time looking at the pictures of beagle puppies tortured in useless research that he approved and routed to places where it was allowed.
Absolutely Republicans wanted Fauxi to testify TRUTHFULLY about all of that.
Does Sen. Paul have an axe to grind with Fauxi ? Absolutelyu Fauxi lied to him under oath over and over.
Sen. Paul had every intention of burning the reputation of St. Fauxi to ash and exposing him as Dr. Mengele.
USING HIS OWN WORDS. There is little in the world Paul and republicans wanted MORE than for Fauxi to TELL THE TRUTH.
These hearings were not a perjury trap they were a TRUTH TRAP.
Fauxi;’s blanket pardon left him completely legally protected FOREVER for his past bad conduct.
But that Pardon is double edged. Because Fauxi faces no criminal jeophardy for past bad conduct he CAN NOT invoke the right to not incriminate himself. Hew can not be prosecuted – he can not incriminate himself, his 5th amendment protection is gone.
While I strongly suspect Republicans fully expected and were prepared for Fauxi to plead the 5th.
That is not what they wanted. It was just the next best thing to the truth. By taking the 5th when he can not do so legally Fauxi has now committed contempt. It is a new crime, it is not covered by the pardon and he can be prosecuted.
But contra the left it is NOT Fauxi’s prosecution that Republicans want – that is just the next best thing.
What they want is Fauxi to Tell the truth. They want Fauxi to expose his own lies – and those of all associated with him.
To expose YOUR lies. And YOUR ignorance in beliving a murderer and crook.
Finally it is my expectation that they are going to get EXACTLY THAT.
While they are moving to prosecute for contempt – Fauxi can clear the contempt by testifying.
Further it is likely that he and his lawyers are negotiating for an immunity deal. And it is likely that Republicans will give it to him,
The is not cost to the GOP for granting immunity to someone who has immunity.
Regardless whether Fauxi has requested immunity or not – The Senate can grant it and doubly eliminate Fauxi’s ability to evade telling the truth.
Of course Fauxi remains free to lie AGAIN – in which case he will be prosecuted.
But the goal is not to get Fauxi to lie – there is far more benefit to republicans in getting Fauxi to admit the truth.
Most of us already know it. But it will be harder for those like YOU to hide from the truth when it is coming from Fauxi.
The goal is NOT to “trap fauxi into lying. There is absolutely no way to do that without Fauxi choosing to lie.
The Goal is to expose the TRUTH, to discredit the liars and those who beleived them.
Again – most of us KNOW Fauxi lied. It is people like YOU or those slightly more rational that are the target.
Fauxi taking the fifth ALREADY got us part way there.
Most people understand Fauxi was perfectly safe if he told the truth.
He did not invoke the truth to avoid legal jeophardy, he did so to avoid publicly being exposed as a liar.
But most people – clearly not you. Understand that and grasp he is a liar.
“Fauci’s legal team had him issue a blanket refusal not because answering one question destroys the right forever,”
Answering one question does not destroy the right forever.
But once you invoke the 5th the rules that SCOTUS has imposed – which I DO NOT AGREE WITH
are that you must invoke the 5th for all subsequent questions until your testimony is over or you waive your right to take the 5th.
” Answering any selective questions—even seemingly benign ones, like Senator Josh Hawley asking what color the carpet was—can be strategically used by hostile cross-examiners to establish a baseline of testimony, find contradictions with past statements, and manufacture a new crime of perjury.”
No answering questions about the color of the carpet does not create legal risk – it does not even if you lie.
Perjury can only be charged for lies that are MATERIAL. The color of the carpet is not material.
Absolutely various senators were going to ask Fauxi tough question.
It is extgremely rare that you must testify under oath that you are not going to be asked tough questions.
There is no right to be treated with kid gloves.
“A congressional subpoenaed hearing is not a police station interrogation. ”
No it is under oath and if you lie you are going to be prosecuted.
“Under the rules of the Senate, the Miranda “right to counsel” rules—where questioning stops until a lawyer arrives—do not apply.”
As a general rule you do not have the right to counsel if you are just being questioned as a witness.
You are free to consult with counsel before testifying.
“Fauci was not in the “investigative phase” hidden from view;”
Whatever that means.
Senate hearings are a part of govenrment oversite – they are always investigative – they are investigating Government.
The MAY be investigative with regard to crimes – If those crimes are committed by someone in govenrment.
I have no idea where you think you are going, But there is no there there.
” he was testifying under a formal congressional subpoena with his attorneys sitting right next to him the entire time.”
So ?
Yes, his remarks about his own celebrity are so juicy.
He still one of the most famous people in the world.
But today he is infamous.
A modern Dr. Mengele.
Immediately extradite dr Mengale Fauci to a foreign country for charges conviction and execution, the more violent the latter the better.
Brown v. Walker: if a “witness has already received a pardon, he cannot longer set up his \[Fifth Amendment\] privilege, since he stands, with respect to such offense, as if it had never been committed.”
Donald J. Trump stated in March 2025, that all of Biden’s pardons are “void, vacant, and of no further force or effect”.
There is a reasonable expectation that Trump may attempt to formally nullify the pardons, and given the compliance of the current rogue SCOTUS, Fauci can reasonably assume that he is not protected by his pardon.
Therefore taking the 5th is entirely appropriate.
Trump does not have the power to void any pardon’s – not even his own. While there is a tiny possibility that some of the pardon’s might be invalidated if the president did not agree to them. Proving that to a legal certainty is much harder than destroying their public credibility.
Further the Senate has told him that he can not take the 5th because he was pardoned – even if the pardon was subsequently rejected by a court, The assertion by the Senate that he is immune and must tesxtify would be considered a grant of immunity in itself.
The senate has the power to grant him immunity and force him to testify – and I bet that is eventually going to happen.
Yesterday was political theater – important political theater. The purpose of the hearings was to get Fauxi to pathetically invoke the 5th over and over. I expect he will be back and the senate will immunizes his testimony.
There is no cost to the Senate for doing so – it is highly unlikely anyone is going to legally test his pardon.
Those of you who can step outside your domestic-polirics framework, try to see this Covid disaster from the standpoint of foreign nations that had absolutely NOTHING to do with causing this. They suffered deaths and economic setbacks, too.
Wouldn’t their governments like to sue the USG for some fraction of liability?
Maybe Tony Fauci is protecting the US taxpayer (you!) by keeping his mouth shut. Did you ever think about it that way? Do you want him to “tell the truth”, and open the floodgates to massive trillion-dollar lawsuits against the USA?
Hmmm. Food for thought.
All I want is to find out that Dr fauci is taking his dirt nap
Kind of like suing France for creating the AIDs epidemic. Releasing chimpanzees that had been inoculated with various forms of polioviruses into the Congo. I believe Fauci was involved heavily with the vaccine research in this matter also. The Scientist leading the research team ended up 86 (that means killed).
Good luck, he’s 85 years old and will soon be dead.
Odd that pbinca never mentions China in his threat of the USA being sued?? pbinca, did you ever think of that? On the other hand if our own government did have a hand in creating the virus then we deserve to be sued, did you ever think of that?
The US contributed to its funding. But the labs were in China and the lab leak was in china. T\he US has some culpability. Fauxi has a great deal of culpability – his actions were illegal. But China has massive culpability.
Fauxi is protecting no one. The US govenrment partly funded this – though that funding was done ILLEGALLY by those like Fauxi 0 it was not legitimately directed by the US govenrment.
Regardless, the world can sue the US based on what is already known.
Further China is MORE culpable – while the US partly funded this – the negligence – was China’s
Of course none of this is going to happen.
Fauxi could be extradited and tried by a foreign govenrment. But neither the US or China are going to face successful global lawsuits.
I’d welcome suits against the USG if the evidence supports them. For the COVID debacle, or anything else.
“Protecting the US government” is not protecting the US taxpayer. It is protecting the government and the people who hold power.
You know that. Most people here know that.
But yeah, you’re still going to make the effort for low-wits like Anonymous.
“Maybe Tony Fauci is protecting the US taxpayer (you!) by keeping his mouth shut.”
If you really think that this ignoble, self-aggrandizing POS is capable of taking a hit for the rest of us, I seriously suggest that you should seek a mental health evaluation, because you are nucking futz.
Dr. Kahan always reminds everybody that he is a doctor and knows what he’s doing.