Pelosi: Obama Blessed by God

God may be technically an independent, but Speaker Nancy Pelosi has stated that he is the power behind the selection of Barack Obama as our leader. It was God who “blessed us” with the elevation of Obama — a remark that seems designed to justify a controversial video below on Obama being divinely chosen for good or evil.

At a California fundraiser, Pelosi called Obama “a leader that God has blessed us with at this time.” For the full story, click here.

This comes after Obama was criticized for statements that were portrayed (unfairly in my view) as claiming virtual divine status. These statements led to this controversial spoof video.

Given the fact that we just finished eight years with a president who believes that God speaks to him on such questions as invading Iraq, many voters are actually not looking for more divinely inspired leadership.

65 thoughts on “Pelosi: Obama Blessed by God

  1. Pelosi, like the Clintons is trying to undermine Obama. All three would prefer McCain, however only Hillary has been honest enough to actually say so.

  2. Why have a red phone when you can have the phone with a cloak of invisability? Evidently, this DARPA project has been installed in the current whitehouse for 8 years and now Congress just got one. Direct communication with the divine–way cool!

  3. I do agree with Andrew Bacevich (who was on Bill Moyers friday) that we have wildly unrealistic visions of both major party candidates. We maintain these delusions at our peril. Below is a short quote from Bacevich:
    “The Congress, especially with regard to matters related to national security policy, has thrust power and authority to the executive branch. We have created an imperial presidency. The Congress no longer is able to articulate a vision of what is the common good. The Congress exists primarily to ensure the reelection of members of Congress… As the Congress has moved to the margins, as the President has moved to the center of our politics, the presidency itself has come to be less effective…

    Because of this preoccupation, this fascination with the presidency, the President has become what we have instead of genuine politics, instead of genuine democracy… We look to the next President to fix things and, of course, that lifts all responsibility from me to fix things. So one of the real problems with the imperial presidency is that it has hollowed out our politics and, in many respects, has made our democracy a false one. We’re going through the motions of a democratic political system, but the fabric of democracy really has worn very thin.”

    What do you think?

  4. I think this might just be an unintentional misstep on Speaker Pelosi’s part. Certain phrases are just part of the American Political language, and get used without much thought. I think that “…God has blessed us…” probably falls in that category. As has been brought up before “God” is just a fall back answer, a large number of people just use the word to symbolize some guiding force in the Universe. She could have just as easily said “We’re lucky” or “We’re fortunate,” but the rhetoric is stacked toward the theological.

    I would like see this sort of thing eliminated. as Prof. Turley implied, it lays the groundwork for the abuse of religion to justify all sorts of things. People have a blind spot on the subject that could (and has been) easily used to the advantage of the power hungry. It would make it much harder to abuse religion if instead of being the norm, this sort of language was scarce enough to set off warning bells.

  5. Jill,

    I think a large part of the problem is just how people process things. It’s easier to view the President as a symbol of the United States, the Federal Government, and of his paticular political beliefs, then as a cog in a large, intricate, and complicated system. It’s also easier for the press to treat them as such. While this might be convenient and even a sort of short hand for those in the know (how many times have we used Bush as a symbol for the whole Neo-con movement?), it’s all to easy for our thinking to shift from “symbolizes” to “is.”

  6. Gyges,

    I don’t think this was an accidental slip-up. My understanding is that the evangelical vote is up for grabs for both parties in this election cycle. Both Obama and McCain have been courting them as have their respective parties. I think the increasing (cynical) use of religious language is deliberate. Both parties are trying to project an image of “morality” through the short cut of sickeningly pious language.

    I certainly agree that this language should be rare!

  7. Gyges,

    Sorry I didn’t see your other post first. I think I understand what you’re saying but there’s one part I’m not clear on. When you say, “then as a cog in a large, intricate, and complicated system” if you have time to expand on that now or later it would help me understand your point. Sorry if I’m slow today. I don’t assume it’s you being unclear!

    Thanks,

    Jill

  8. Jill,

    I always assume it’s me that’s being unclear, but that’s because I mumble. I used then instead of than, so that might be the problem.

  9. Isn’t this goal of all practicing Christians, that is to say – to invoke the name of God in everything including the prevention of droplet infection from sneezes?

    Jewish Orthodoxy forbids the use of G-d’s name, while Muslims and Christians use like Ketchup. Some religions don’t have a singularly Deity and some Deities have no religion.

    But seriously – Pelosi didn’t say God Blessed Obama – she said God blessed us by giving us Obama. With that sentiment sets ones head nodding in assent or wagging in dismay, any mention of G-d, God, or god – brings a certain legitimacy in many peoples minds. It’s the God – bump that everyone craves. Have you ever heard of successful Atheist politician ??? Not many of those around in the US. You must invoke a Deity on a regular basis.

    While I’m no fan of Pelosi – I’m sure she was using the political, highly secular usage of both God and Blessed in order to make a political point in a political environment for political purposes.

    For further clarity I feel obligated to pray for Christopher Hitchen’s to pop in.

    Guzentite* !!

    *see Pagans

  10. Binx and Jill,

    Your points are well made, but I still hold to my opinion that it was an unintentional turn of phrase. I do think I should clarify my position: By saying that it’s unintentional, I’m not saying we should ignore it. If anything the fact that it’s an unconscious gesture (like baby kissing) makes it that much worse. It means that politicians are so used to harnessing religion for their own political goals (versus being sincerely religious) that it’s become a second nature.

    You’re view is that Speaker Pelosi made a conscious choice to cynically use “God” to give her an certain air of holiness. I’m trying to say that the cynical use of religion has become institutional. Either way we agree that it’s wrong and should be stopped.

    So now the problem is, what do we do about it?

  11. Gyges,

    For my part I’m going to pray about it!

    I understand what you’re saying and agree it’s destructive any way you look at it. I don’t know if it’s really true that you have to be so overtly “godly” to be elected. I’m guessing the political focus groups say yes. Still there are many religious people who favor separation of church and state and there might be a great many of us who would, in fact, welcome less religiosity. Maybe if the press and the rest of us did not let them use religious codes as shortcuts/standends for thoughtful responses to issues but make them answer real policy questions with real answers, perhaps this would make religiosity not so useful to politicians.

  12. How about just asking them what they meant by such and such a statement. Make them explain what they said. Having to answer those questions could be uncomfortable and make the statements decrease.

  13. Nancy Pelosi, third in line to the office of president of the united states, is a very sick woman.

    Watch her on camera.

    She shakes.

    She stutters.

    She thinks she is saving the world.

    Nancy Pelosi is a very sick woman.

  14. Once again Granny Pelosi shows me why she is surely worthy of the mansion I’ve prepared for her in my kingdom.

    Spend 7 years condeming the Bush administration everytime they even hint at his presidency having anything to do with God or Jesus, and then declare her candidate is “blessed by God”.

    Hypocrisy.

    It’s always been my favorite sin.

  15. I think I will just pay attention to what Nancy Pelosi does or does not do in session. Things change when speaking to a group of people who are ready to throw cash at you. If she is sick, then I think it must be a result of not holding Mr Rove and others who are in-contempt of congress, in the dungeon of the people’s house. Apparently she has passed along her malady to Mr. Mukasey, a man looking for strong leadership.

  16. There are a handful of people on this site I was watching to see if we ever agreed on a single thing and russ was on the top of that list. We FINALLY agreed on something, on how “sick” Pelosi is, although I would have used the word twisted.

    Thank you russ for making my mission complete so that I can now concentrate on the things that are much more important to me.

    To take a phrase from MASH, GOODBYE.

  17. I believe that this was an intentional choice of words by Pelosi and it upsets me when the Dems start racing to the religous right when an election is near. I am an Obama supporter, but I do not want him pandering to the religious right and Pelosi is not making things easier. Her constituents need to vote her out of office for her incredible insane decision to take impeachment off the table. While I don’t agree with the Bacevich quote in Jill’s earlier posting that Congress thrust the extra power to Bush. They did sit by while he stole power from the legislative branch and the judicial branch, but Bush/Cheney took every step possible to increase presidential power. Including the use of presidential signing statements and secret Executive Orders. It is not surprising that the progressives are looking for Obama to clean up the mess. If he doesn’t take positive steps to correct FISA with a Senate that may have a filibuster proof majority and also to request the Justice department to look into the abuses of any politician during the Bush regime, he will have a peaceful revolt on his hands.

  18. How about just asking them what they meant by such and such a statement. Make them explain what they said. Having to answer those questions could be uncomfortable and make the statements decrease.

    ***

    ???

    We have determined those in office are ‘politicians’ – practiced in the art of dodging questions and the issues.

    Perhaps you mean insisting on opportunities for closer examination
    beforehand ie the opportunity to be more circumspect in the future, so as not to be faced, once again, with having favored these predictable types onto the ballots only to face dealing with the disappointing aftermaths of their (pen)ultimate election(a).

    It’s a little late for ‘that’ now…

    AND this IS our current dilemma, btw, as a result of our ‘current’
    system and vice versa. AND we still have to deal with it – now more than ever!

    This disastrous Bush Executive is an 8 year long Administration sickness which WILL metastasize to the Legislative Branch and beyond just like a cancer, unless it is excised, ‘successfully’, before this next election – with clear margins on all sides…

    Otherwise, even with additional ‘treatments’, our long-term Constitutional prognosis, as we know it, looks quite grim.

    I am much less concerned about ‘the candidates’ than I am about our Constitutional foundations and our republican form of government.

    I don’t understand why either candidate, especially Obama, thought doing any Pastor ‘JohnQ’&A’, would be an appropriate forum…!

    I didn’t watch it nor any of the follow up. The most I saw were snippets which looked exactly like what I thought it and why I skipped it – entirely.

    To me staged-events like these are similar to the Q&A portion of
    Miss USA – virtually meaningless in the overall scheme.

    If you want to be moved by some powerful words, try these on…

    ” McCain ‘can’t win’, AND Obama can still lose…”

  19. The liberal media is running from having to ask Nancy Pelosi, a very VERY sick woman that the Democratic party has put third in line to the Presidency, what exactly she meant with her God statement.

  20. Patty C,
    I am also not a fan of candidates for public office being questioned in a Church setting. The Constitution is the most important issue in this election and having politicians in a church setting is just pandering to the religious right at the expense of the Constitution.

  21. Rafflaw,

    One of my biggest unconcerns with Obama is his public declarations of his Faith (I don’t know about anyone else, but I hear that capital F). As I said earlier, I think that in some cases this is just part of the American political rhetoric (which doesn’t excuse, but does explain).

    Now I don’t have a problem with electing some one of any paticular religious belief. That’s assuming that they realize that they shouldn’t govern their beliefs onto others. I do believe that usually that the louder you have to say that you are something, the less likely it is to be true. His constant references to his Faith make me a little suspicious that he is purposely using it for his political gain, which is something I do have a problem with.

    I’m sure that another part of this type of speech is just in reaction to the stupid “Muslim” rumors that circulated early on. Isn’t that the sort of cynical use of religion we’re talking about? That having a religion other than one of the 31 Flavors of Christianity is seen as a political negative shows just how far we have to go in this matter.

    Also his adoption of the Bush’s Faith Based initiatives program is troubling. I would think that the for people truly concerned with others, the motivation behind the charity would be a moot point compared to the effectiveness of the charity. That’s under the condition that there aren’t any attempts by the charity to convert those in need as part of the process.

    McCain of course has similar problems on this issue, if not more. His insistence on getting into bed with certain well known “agents of intolerance” springs to mind.

  22. Gyges,
    There are elements of Obama’s campaign, such as faith, that bother me. However, I think that Obama has been forced to stay in the center because this is still a racist country and any person of color who seems too far Left will be maligned by the MSM and Village Pundits, as a wild eyed radical. As Patty and Rafflaw have expressed, the key issue of this election is a return to constitutional government. Every other issue is minor compared to this. McCain, and no other Conservative Republican (of current stripe) believes in truly Constitutional Government, much preferring an Imperial Presidency (as long as he/she is Republican) and a strong leader to follow.

  23. Michael,

    I can’t agree that Obama is a shoe-in for restoring our Constituion. An interesting discussion about the choice of a religious debate forum as the first meeting place Obama and McCain agreed on took place this A.M. on Diane Rehm. Several people pointed out that no other private groups had been able to call these candidates to a “forum”, not scientific groups who wanted a discussion on the critical scientific issues of our time, not women’s rights forums, not anyone but a conservative preacher in a mega church. The fact that we are a govt. of laws, not religious laws, the fact that Obama has said things like, he wants to bring the kingdom of god on earth, that both candidates make every effort to court conservative evangelicals is inimical to our Constitution. That along with his FISA vote to grant expanded executive powers to cheney/bush and potentially himself, should give people who believe he will restore our Constitution and its laws some real pause.

    Here’s the link:http://wamu.org/programs/dr/

    I think this goes to the heart of the idolatrous view of our president that Andrew Bacevich spoke of on Bill Moyers (excerpt in post above). I don’t think it is just the right who wants a strongman. The left is desperate and I think we need to be very careful not to seek a strongman of our own.

    Jill

  24. Jill,
    I can’t disagree with your points on Obama. I also believed the Warren debate was stupid from both a Constitutional and Political angle. The problem is I know enough about McCain to understand he will even be more dangerous to our country than Bush (Though it seems hardly possible) and might even be more ignorant. We only have two choices so Obama’s my guy and I hope he does the right thing. However, the fight for constitutional government is an ongoing one in the US. We can never view this struggle as achieved. The Warren Supreme Court had its’ time in the spotlight and then came Berger. FDR’s New Deal had a long run and then came Reagan. In all human history the battle between humanism and totalitarianism is a never ending struggle. The totalitarians have so far won more often, sad to say.
    Mike

  25. Mike,

    I can’t disagree with your ideas on McCain either! What worries me is that too many people keep saying things like, when Obama is elected…(fill in blank) will be fixed. I don’t think that is true and it’s where I most agree with Bacevich when he writes: “We look to the next President to fix things and, of course, that lifts all responsibility from me to fix things. So one of the real problems with the imperial presidency is that it has hollowed out our politics and, in many respects, has made our democracy a false one. We’re going through the motions of a democratic political system, but the fabric of democracy really has worn very thin.”

    I does seem people believe Obama will “fix” everything. I see no evidence for that. Beyond this, it is an abdication of our collective responsibility to take back our democracy by acting like one. That means to me that everyone has a part to play in fixing the horror that has gone on the last 8 years. It means turning away from any strongman figure who will magically “fix” things. That sound more like a dictatorship than a democracy to me and it makes me nervous each and every time I hear supporters of Obama speak that way.

    Many of the most thoughful, decent, intelligent people on this blog (whom I like very much) speak this way about Obama. I believe we must fix things together or we just won’t ever get back to a democracy.

  26. I can’t disagree with Jill or Mike. And I think we can all agree that the Speaker needs to shut her pie-hole on the religious-talk! Let’s talk about restoring the Constitution. If she would just do something other than occupy her seat and breathe the air it would be wonderful …

    With the economic and geopolitical problems facing this country I don’t envy the next president, whomever it may be.

    (Obama)

  27. Most delightful discussion. I just read the entire thread, and with the exception of the usual suspects, I find the civil discussion most heartening, even the sarcasm.

    Very best regards

  28. Let us pray “this week in god” stays as a segment on the Daily Show and off the political “hour of power”! Thanks for the clip, Bob and welcome back. I was concerned that you knew I was joking when I said you returned to the blog like a zombie to the mall! I’m glad to hear from you again! Nancy, you’re not getting my cancer money!!! I gave to Pat Robertson already and there’s nothing left!

  29. I have to agree with Mojo that Pelosi needs to go into hiding for awhile, unless she is going to allow impeachment to be discussed. I do believe that no President can “fix” the problems of a prior criminal administration, but Obama may have the opportunity to take over the White House with a substantial majority in the House and an improved majority in the Senate(without Lieberman in the majority) and would have a chance to do some important work to restore some of the damage done by Bush/Cheney. After he disappointed me on the FISA amendment, I cannot say that he will undo all of the damage done by Bush/Cheney, but I am confident that he will restore some of the damage to the Constitution. I also am hedging my bets with all of my fingers crossed.

  30. rafflaw –

    I think Obama and Co. are playing it very safe right now. They intend to win and given the other choice I hope they do. They’ve been pretty coy, and I’m hopeful (perhaps naively) that they will have a plan once in office to restore not only the Constitution, but much of the lost faith many of us are feeling in our political and justice system. This is supposed to be a government for the people, by the people, and not against the people.

    When the government is afraid of it’s citizens that is a democracy. When the citizens are afraid of their government, that is something else …

  31. Mojo,

    I’m not saying people should not vote for Obama. What worries me is the belief of many people of good will, such as you seen from your postings, that “they will have a plan once in office to restore… the Constitution…”

    I feel this is not a supportable conclusion concerning Obama’s actions. If the voters are lulled into a false sense of security, and believe Obama will “restore” our rights I believe we’re in for a rude awakening. Power is rarely given back. Our rights have been taken by cheney/bush with the help of a spineless legislature (including Obama) and a frightened populace. To take back our rights we cannot afford to believe someone will “restore” them. Our rights cannot depend on the munificence of the president. They are in our Constitution and when a candidate sells out those rights they don’t deserve being given the benefit of our doubt. Obama doesn’t just need his feet held to the fire if he becomes president. He needs clear eyed citizens challenging him every time he breaks faith with our Constitution as a candidate. If we keep making excuses as to why he has broken faith on this important issue or that, then he will take that as our assent to let him do as he pleases. That is a dangerous message to convey.

  32. Nancy Pelosi does seem somewhat (at times greatly) unstable. Perhaps she was installed as Speaker of the House because she would offer no material resistance to the existing agenda. The empirical evidence is that nothing has changed in any material way since the People voted for change.

    “Impeachment is off the table”

  33. Jill –

    Everything you said is right on, I just don’t type as much as I’d like to say because I could fill pages with anger at the spinelessness on both sides of the aisle. Obama has been right on a number of issues, and he’s gotten it wrong on some big ones, too. As I said, I’m hopeful even if it’s being naive. What else have we got?

    And besides, so long as nobody is paying attention to the myriad problems with the paperless e-voting machines and the uselessness of the electoral college, do our votes really “elect” anyone? I think all we’re really doing is giving our opinion.

    mnoble –

    When she announced impeachment is off the table my blood boiled. She is quite a worthless and pathetic figure and history will remember her as such.

  34. Did anyone see Bill Maher on Larry king last night?

    He speaks for me – in so many levels.

    I regret that Hillary is not the Democratic nominee.

    And I know Obama must use her AND he needs Bill Clinton ‘On Board’.

    Between all the rest of them, with the exceptions of Joe Biden and possibly Chris Dodd (and MOSTLY because I think his voice really IS heard loudest in the Senate) – she was the genuine article for THIS election.

    I look at McCain from 2000 to now and I don’t get it, either. I keep thinking – ‘what the Hell happened to him’?

    He scares the b’jesus outta me now and I can’t tolerate another four years of buffoonery.

    I honestly don’t think I can do it…!

    A warmer, cheaper climate is looking pretty good right now!

  35. Mojo,

    Sometimes I think we liberals are the “scared populace”, the press is the “spineless legislature” and Obama is the “I’ll take that power” executive. All three groups must be complicit (unless military force is at play–something I’d never put past cheney) in order for the executive grab to work. So we are terrified that McCain will get in. No one does their best thinking when they’re scared shitless, but we just can’t abdicate on sorting things out. Obama depends on left wing volunteers. If he wants to court the religious right, perhaps it is time to tell his website, not one more voluteer hour from the left until he stands up for the Constitution, national healthcare, etc. He needs people on the ground and if he finds he can’t count on them to be there for him unless he’s there for us, then this could make an impression.

    The left wing press could be a lot better at truly analyzing Obama’s positions on things, instead of going along with what he says, excusing one thing after another after another. If he isn’t called out to explain what the hell he’s doing, he won’t.

  36. At the risk of sounding hysterical, I believe that this election is the most important one in my six decade lifetime. If McCain wins the US will become a fascist police state. I don’t use fascist as an epithet for Nazism. I use it as the blending of oligarchic corporate power with the aims of the state. Such as China is today and where Russia is probably heading. McCain’s victory will solidify the concept of the Imperial, All-Powerful Presidency. Those supporting him represent the worst instincts of Corporate America and in fact are lobbyists for it.

    The scariest part is that at least Bush’s excuse for his attack on Iraq represents his need to prove himself a better man than his father. A horrid excuse to be sure, that has led to much unnecessary death and destruction. McCain, however, is a man locked into the Cold War mindset of his pre-captivity days. This is exacerbated by his years in captivity and the psychological need to redeem himself from breaking under torture.

    McCain also no doubt bears imperfectly repressed anger at the fact that the US never rescued him from captivity. Since after all his father, The Admiral, had rescued him constantly from the screw ups brought on by McCain’s partying sensibility and lack of intellectual depth. The man is seriously damaged enough that he could start a nuclear war. This makes him more dangerous as a leader than Bush, since Bush became bored by the whole President’s job, once he had Saddam hung, thereby proving he was a better man than his father. McCain, however, will revel in the power of being Commander-In-Chief.

    Making this further problematic, is that like Bush, McCain is surrounded by Corporate lobbyists, whose main interests are motivated by greed and whose world views solidified back in the 60’s. They are incapable of recognizing the nuances of international diplomacy. i.e.
    Talking tough on Georgia, when the US is powerless, save for nuclear weaponry, to “punish” Russia for its’ behavior. Under a McCain Administration we will see a continued degradation of the US economy and standing in the world. At the same time our barely recognizable social safety net will deteriorate and the inequality of the distribution of wealth will get worse. The continuance of the US’s slide into becoming a “banana republic.”

    I believe that Obama is smart enough not to travel these roads as shown by a flawless campaign and overcoming the great handicap of his skin color. Forget the MSM propaganda regarding polling. It is in their financial interests to keep this race close and in the end to have a Republican prevail. Most pollsters doctor their polls for their own gain and to reflect their own viewpoint. Zogby/Reuters for instance has always been pro-Republican.

    How does all this relate to the topic of Nancy Pelosi? Easily, since she was among the Democratic Leadership who signed off on Bush’s surveillance violations, stupidly believing in bi-partisanship and made up facts. She couldn’t impeach Bush, since she and other Democratic leaders were complicit. Let’s get the Republican’s out and then immediately begin the pressure on Obama to follow the constitution. We still may be able to save our country with our vote.

  37. Mike,

    I think Obama should follow the Constitution now and we should put pressure on him to do it. We have a right to expect this from him as a candidate and as a president. Again, I am not saying not to vote for him. He needs to hold faith with the rule of law, right now. Putting pressure on him will not keep him from being elected. I believe it would actually help as so many people are disillusioned with politics as usual, and don’t want that from him.

    Jill

  38. That’s why I say we have to deal with the primary ‘cancer’ now.

    It’s useless to entertain reinstating the Independent Counsel Rule, now, if we don’t first set that stage by impeaching those responsible for our current debacle at the hands of the Bush Administration,
    thereby limiting their continued influences, twofold – near term electin processes, and over our ultimate desire for recovery, Constitutionally, over the longterm.

    This is a potentially grave issue.

    We HAVE to ‘slice them out’, surgically, with a blade or by laser, and we have to do it now!

    AND in more ways than just this, we do have to take back our power!

    This is serious – no messin’ around, here.

  39. Jill,
    I totally agree with you. I think that his not adopting a stronger position on FISA, Surveillance, etc. is actually hurting him. Attacking an opponents positions is not going negative although the MSM, which prefers horse race to discourse, feels differently. He needs to clearly differentiate his positions from McCain’s positions and explain why McCain’s positions are bad for the country. In the parlance of the politico, that would indicate strength.
    Mike

  40. Obama was bought and paid for long ago by the same people who bought and paid for McCain long ago. He is a know nothing puppet, and all it take to figure that out is to listen to him speak: mindless drivel, stands for nothing, says whatever he thinks it will take to win. If you think Obama is going to save you, you are in for an unpleasant surprise. He will do as good of a job as his fellow Democrats like Nancy Pelosi are doing now.
    The Democrats and Republicans are one political party with two faces.
    Either we save ourselves or we are not going to be saved.

  41. “The Democrats and Republicans are one political party with two faces.
    Either we save ourselves or we are not going to be saved.”

    Mnoble,
    There is much in what you say that has the ring of truth. The country is currently a Corporatocracy and our individual rights are being eroded with rapidity. My question is though just what is meant by “save ourselves.” How do you propose we do that? What means of change do you foresee?

    I hope you understand that I am not naive. I know that our political system is rigged in favor of the Corporatists and those of totalitarian belief. However, my experience has taught me that positive gains can be achieved through our political and legal systems, as flawed as they may be.

    Racism in the US is still palpable, yet the lives of people of color have improved greatly. A woman’s right of choice still stands as the law of the land. There have been many more victories that have been achieved and also many sad defeats. The battle continues, however, at the polls and in the Courts. Am I satisfied with the progress that humanistically inclined people have made? I’m quite dissatisfied.

    So my questions to you above were not rhetorical. If you can suggest other viable means I’m interested, as would be many on this site.
    However, if you’re talking revolution, count me out (paraphrasing the Beatles). I lived through the 60’s and I still stand in the same political place, though I’ve learned some things through the years.
    One was that the Left, of which I’m proudly a member, can produce just as many egocentric leaders who are totalitarian in their hearts, as the Right. Obama, may not be politically all that I’d want, but my sense of him is that he truly believes in positive change and has the capacity to produce it.

  42. Thanks Gyges,

    I have been trying to post the following info under Pelosi sees no crimes, but it won’t go through. Perhaps it will go through here:

    The U.S. intelligence community buckled sooner in 2002 than previously reported to Bush administration pressure for data justifying an invasion of Iraq, according to a documents posting on the Web today by National Security Archive senior fellow John Prados.

    The documents suggest that the public relations push for war came before the intelligence analysis, which then conformed to public positions taken by Pentagon and White House officials. For example, a July 2002 draft of the “White Paper” ultimately issued by the CIA in October 2002 actually pre-dated the National Intelligence Estimate that the paper purportedly summarized, but which Congress did not insist on until September 2002.

    A similar comparison between a declassified draft and the final version of the British government’s “White Paper” on Iraq weapons of mass destruction adds to evidence that the two nations colluded in the effort to build public support for the invasion of Iraq. Dr. Prados concludes that the new evidence tends to support charges raised by former White House press secretary Scott McClellan and by the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence in its long-delayed June 2008 “Phase II” report on politicization of intelligence.

  43. Well it comes down to this I think.

    If we don’t vote Obama, we get McCain.

    And while Obama has made some really questionable votes recently, he at least is not CRAZY.

    John McCain is showing ALL the signs of “age onset DEMENTIA”. He is clearly slipping away.

    His mind is “shutting down”. He gets confused now on simple questions, like how many houses he owns, or who he spoke to last, or what he said to them.

    He’s a nice old guy that belongs with grandkids on his knees.

    He belongs NO WHERE near the White House, unless its on a tour.

  44. Cro,

    I don’t disagree with you, but I’ll make a point (that Jill’s been making as well). I don’t like everything Obama says and has done, and like Jill, I’m not convinced that he’ll just hit the “restore default settings” button on the Constitution. So what do we do to make sure he at least starts to?

    Well, we can stop fixating on the Presidency. It’s important, but so is Congress, and so are all the local elections. The President might nominate people for SCOTUS and Attorney General, but Congress has to confirm them. State Legislators are necessary for the Constitution to be amended. The Denver City Council is the body limiting protesters free speech. The School Board is generally in charge of which Principals get picked, and can be pressured removing one who tramples on students rights.

    So how can we get the right people in these positions? We can start demanding that our news stations do more coverage of other elections. We can start researching our candidates and vote based on actual positions and action not party affiliation. We can start donating to and working for individual campaigns rather the political parties. We should learn from the Prohibition Movement, effective social changes grow from the local to the national.

  45. Gyges,

    I read your link (thanks for it) and I think you’ve made specific suggestions that would really help out. Obama and other Democrats could help restore some faith in their intentions about the Constitution by speaking out about Denver. I think it will be another significant blow if they do not.

  46. “Thanks Gyges,

    I have been trying to post the following info under Pelosi sees no crimes, but it won’t go through. Perhaps it will go through here:

    The U.S. intelligence community buckled sooner in 2002 than previously reported to Bush administration pressure for data justifying an invasion of Iraq, according to a documents posting on the Web today by National Security Archive senior fellow John Prados.”
    *****

    This is not ‘news’…

    The same obvious facts in evidence have been the basis for several best-selling books – including the late one by George Tenet, himself.
    I remember watching horrifying sworn testimony from people who were still in a position to know, televised on CSPAN, during a quietly held, retired CIA anlayst hearing in response to obert Novak’s Valerie Plame (Mrs./Ambassador Joe) Wilson leak very early on.

  47. Gyges, I notice your article’s author uses my use of health and science applied toward government, particularlymy recent cancer (metastatic growth) analogy when speaking of ‘presidentialism’… :)

    He’s from ‘Copley News Service’ in Boston where Harvard Medical School and my training hospital is located, so I will take it either as a compliment or simply a result of being exposed to some of the the best Health-Care in the world.

    Harvard #1 – yes!

  48. Dear Michael Spindell,
    Go tell the improved part to the people of color who have recently been tasered, shot, and otherwise murdered by some of the police. I think they would disagree if they could, but they can’t because they are dead.
    And as for what I mean by save ourselves I mean the people should stop deluding themselves into thinking that some messiah is going to save them. “a leader that God has blessed us with at this time.” is delusional.
    And exactly what did Obama do to make you think he truly believes in positive change and has the capacity to produce it? From what I have seen he does not have any capacity to do anything. He is a demagogue and a downright embarrassing one at that. Purely a product of the machine bought and paid for. I hope I am wrong but the evidence says otherwise. I regularly meet white liberals who think that since Obama is black they can vote for him to make themselves feel good about themselves.
    And my question is not rhetorical either, please direct me to at least one speech he has given where he speaks in other than vagueness and feel good rhetoric. Oh I did hear a speech were he clearly said the problem is that the People need to be coerced into volunteering their free time to the government and that would solve our problems (funny I thought the government being run by crooks wasting trillions of dollars was the problem, silly me). Oh and I did read his book the Audacity of Hope which amounted to, gee wouldn’t it be neat if I were President.
    Yeah he might be better than King George Jr. or John 10,000 years in Iraq McCain but you couldn’t set the bar much lower. Want something positive to do then sign the impeachment petition at http://kucinich.us/index.php and get your friends and neighbors to do so as well. At least one person in Congress has guts.

  49. “Go tell the improved part to the people of color who have recently been tasered, shot, and otherwise murdered by some of the police.”

    mnoble,
    Nowhere have I said that racism is no longer a part of the American scene and if your read my statement that was obvious:”Racism in the US is still palpable, yet the lives of people of color have improved greatly.” But if you don’t think that the lives of people of color have improved greatly from the past, you have no sense of history. Understand this, I am fully aware of all of the problems faced by people of color and while I’m not one of them and so can’t fully feel the yoke of hatred, I have spent a career and a lifetime of more than six decades fighting those evils. At personal risk and personal loss to myself and family.

    “If you sense defensiveness in that statement, you miss the point, which is that I don’t accept lecturing from someone who doesn’t take the time to seriously read what is being stated, preferring instead to project his own angry feelings onto to those who don’t fully agree with him.

    “what I mean by save ourselves I mean the people should stop deluding themselves into thinking that some messiah is going to save them.“a leader that God has blessed us with at this time.” is delusional.”

    Didn’t you read the comments of myself and most other posters on this thread saying the same thing? I don’t believe that many people, like myself, who support Obama see him as a Messiah. Pelosi’s statement, like many of her others, was stupid and does not reflect the views of Obama supporters. However, there is a qualification to that in that many Hillary supporters and the McCain Campaign have tried to paint Obama supporters in this light, is that where you are coming from?

    “And exactly what did Obama do to make you think he truly believes in positive change and has the capacity to produce it?”

    I’ve already stated quite clearly my belief in the urgency of Obama’s election and they have little to do with anything more than the urgency of defeating McCain and the right Wing. But since you ask I’ll name one, of many. As Summa Cum Laude at Harvard and as editor of the Law Review, Obama could have gotten a starting salary of $200,000 a year at any major law firm and a bonus to boot. Instead he chose to go to Chicago and work at the successor to Saul Alinsky’s Community Organization Program. Google Saul Alinsky if you don’t know the name it may be instructive to you.

    “Want something positive to do then sign the impeachment petition at http://kucinich.us/index.php and get your friends and neighbors to do so as well.”

    I signed that petition the day it came out and a few other petitions as well, such as Robert Wexler’s, the ACLU, MoveOn, etc. I also sent them to my friends and family to sign.

  50. Wow, so after 60 years of fighting you live in a country where the police regularly kill people of all colors for little reason and the President is King George Jr. who has gotten us into two Vietnams and bankrupted the country. I stand corrected, you have seen great progress.

  51. mnoble,
    Are you sure you’re not channeling Zakimar under a new identity? You utilize the same style of ignoring points being made and setting up answers that beg the question. Your style of irony is also quite similar and lacking in maturity. In the end though all you expose is the inability to actually read what is being stated. Had you done so you would find that I am clearly not a fan of George Bush, his wars, or his economic policy’s. You’ve chosen to ignore that though, because this is all about you expressing your pent up anger and little about changing anything.

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