U.S. To Merkel: Don’t Worry A Functionary Ordered Your Surveillance

PresObama220px-Angela_Merkel_(2008)As the world joins in opposition to the U.S. attack on privacy worldwide, President Barack Obama has to face awkward meetings with world leaders of allied countries who were subjects of his surveillance. Some reports have stated that Obama personally approved the monitoring of Angela Merkel’s telephone three years ago. Now, the National Security Agency (NSA) is insisting that Obama did not order the monitoring personally. I am not sure what is worse: that Obama ordered interceptions of allied leaders like Merkel or that the surveillance state is so large that functionaries now have the discretion to order such surveillance. Merkel may not find it as more assuring that Obama didn’t order her monitoring than the notion such she is just another target delegated to discretion of lower level officials. It is also not clear if Mike Rogers is going to suggest that Merkel should also thank us for the monitoring.

NSA and the White House will only say that it is not currently monitoring Merkel’s phone calls as opposed to prior surveillance of our ally. The most chilling aspect of the response is the suggestion that this is just another delegated act from Obama. After all, he delegated the decision of which citizens should be killed on his unilateral authority under his Kill List policy. It is all part of our new Security State. Killing citizens, surveilling allied leaders, seizing the records of Americans from email and phone systems . . . it is all the new normal of delegated presidential authority. I have previously written about the dangers of the Imperial Presidency established by Obama. However, what is even more chilling is how absolute presidential powers become delegated absolute presidential powers. Such delegation not only gives presidents like Obama some deniability in scandals like this but allow for the expansion of such programs under a thousand faceless functionaries. Of course, the Administration is also pursuing a scorched earth policy against reporters and whistleblowers in the hopes of avoiding any future need to explain itself to anyone.

Even in the face of global condemnation, the cult of personality surrounding Obama continues to silence any significant opposition from Democrats. We have allowed the creation of a security state employing hundreds of thousands with hundreds of billions of invested public funds and giant annual budgets. It is a system that is designed to be used, not to remain dormant. We are not just the protected class but the targeted class of such surveillance. It is a system that runs on any source that could be a threat or reveal information of a threat — a standard that allows monitoring of friends and foes alike.

The Germans are of course upset because such surveillance happens to violate German law, but that has hardly proven a barrier in the United States. In expanding these programs, we appear to have transcended the rule of law to embrace a new model of a security state. We have gotten to the point that we not only treat our own laws as increasing discretionary but treat the laws of other nations as equally discretionary. Diplomatic principles are no more inviolate as civil liberties in the new world being fashioned around counter-terrorism. Once transparency has been achieved in the United States, it is inevitable that the world will then look unacceptably opaque to our security forces.

What is most striking from comments like those of Rogers is that we appear completely clueless or willfully blind to the view of our actions by other nations. Since we do not doubt our motivations, we cannot understand why anyone would be uncomfortable with our actions. As with drone strikes and assassination units, our view might change if other countries engaged in the same actions by ordering special forces to kill targets in the United States or unleashing drone attacks or seizing all of our phone records. As we break down legal walls and limits, we are returning the world to a diplomatic version of the state of nature. At that point, we will be left with the simple rule of “might is right.” It is the original law of the jungle and it is perfectly sustainable for the strongest amongst us. Having realized Nixon’s dream of an Imperial Presidency, Obama seems to have moved on to extending Teddy Roosevelt’s Big Stick policy to cover the world and the world leaders.

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Source: National Post

124 thoughts on “U.S. To Merkel: Don’t Worry A Functionary Ordered Your Surveillance

  1. I am not sure what is worse: that Obama ordered interceptions of allied leaders like Merkel or that the surveillance state is so large that functionaries now have the discretion to order such surveillance.” – JT

    Bingo.

    The epigovernment hypothesis grows a bit further away from the military NSA “conspiracy theorists” database.

    Who is governing the military NSA if the Commander In Chief is not?

  2. Authority is always delegated, this has been a looming problem since these programs were set up. It also works to the benefit of the principles because the authority can then be diffused to the point that there is little or no accountability. As if we weren’t predicting this on this blawg years ago. This is an engineered failing.

  3. “In expanding these programs, we appear to have transcended the rule of law to embrace a new model of a security state.” -Jonathan Turley

    We have. And the worst of it is yet to come.

  4. lottakatz 1, October 28, 2013 at 11:12 am

    Authority is always delegated …
    ===================
    Or usurped.

    When the “authority” can’t be granted it also can’t be delegated as a matter of law.

    It becomes rogue and ultra vires.

    As an example, think of “delegating authority” to launch nuclear weapons.

    I take it that example shows that, as a matter of law, certain things cannot be delegated.

    This military NSA invasion of the privacy of governments and citizens of friendly nations is so over the top it is not easily grasped.

    It is as serious as a heart attack.

  5. While I am continually ticked off with Obama this may not be his fault. What I have read from several sources this morning is that as usual this crap was started under Bush. What I don’t understand is why Obama continues so much of the garbage dished out by Bush/Cheney.

    Then there is the problem that so many people expect Obama to know everything that is going on with every agency in the government. Brings back those old visualizations/cartoons of Obama walking on water.

  6. Magginkat (@Magginkat) 1, October 28, 2013 at 11:28 am

    While I am continually ticked off with Obama this may not be his fault. What I have read from several sources this morning is that as usual this crap was started under Bush. What I don’t understand is why Obama continues so much of the garbage dished out by Bush/Cheney.

    Then there is the problem that so many people expect Obama to know everything that is going on with every agency in the government. Brings back those old visualizations/cartoons of Obama walking on water.
    =======================
    Where does the buck stop now?

  7. > is governing the military NSA if the Commander In Chief is not

    The NSA is peculiar. It was created by executive order, but Congress has never passed a single law defining the Agency’s scope.

    According to the New York Times:

    “The power of the N.S.A., whose annual budget and staff are believed to exceed those of either the F.B.I. or the C.I.A., is enhanced by its unique legal status within the Federal Government. Unlike the Agriculture Department, the Postal Service or even the C.I.A., the N.S.A. has no specific Congressional law defining its responsibilities and obligations. Instead, the agency, based at Fort George Meade, about 20 miles northeast of Washington, has operated under a series of Presidential directives. Because of Congress’s failure to draft a law for the agency, because of the tremendous secrecy surrounding the N.S.A.’s work and because of the highly technical and thus thwarting character of its equipment, the N.S.A. is free to define and pursue its own goals”

    http://www.nytimes.com/1983/03/27/magazine/the-silent-power-of-the-nsa.html

    There have been acts of congress with respect to the NSA, but these acts are just as curious as the lack of interest in oversight.

    For example, the National Security Agency Act of 1959 deals almost exclusively with employee compensation, and includes strange caveats like:

    “Sec. 2. (a) The Secretary of Defense (or his designee) is
    authorized to establish such positions, and to appoint thereto,
    without regard to the civil service laws, such officers and
    employees, in the National Security Agency, as may be necessary to
    carry out the functions of such agency”

    and

    “(b)(1) In order to maintain necessary capability in foreign
    language skills and related abilities needed by the National
    Security Agency, the Director, without regard to subchapter IV of
    chapter 55 of title 5, United States Code, may provide special
    monetary or other incentives to encourage civilian cryptologic
    personnel of the Agency to acquire or retain proficiency in foreign
    languages or special related abilities needed by the Agency.”

    Maybe Obama has lost control.

  8. And so it goes. These are the important questions of the day. Who is really in charge? One of the reasons why Jesse Ventura only did one term as MN Governor is because he could not figure out why the CIA is embedded with state governments. Folks do not believe for a minute that the village idiots: Bush and Obama make foreign or domestic policy.

  9. The president was unaware that any of this was going on.
    He learned about this just the same as the American people by reading about it in news papers.

  10. He knew about Fast and Furious but only after someone sent him a message to his blackberry while he was on his way to the 19th Hole.

  11. He also was unaware that the IRS was targeting conservative T-Party activist. He was told by his top agent on the back 9 it was a localized thing and to not worry. The president finished + 1 on the back 9

  12. He also was unaware that his insurance plan is changing. He really likes his doctor but will not be able to keep his doctor.

    The doctor is Happy about this because the president is in good health because he is a basketball player..

  13. The president new nothing about spying on Fox News Journalist James Rosen and his family. He only learned about this after the presidential debate with Candy Crowley of CNN. She informed the president and who he should target next.

  14. I doubt that this President, or even George W. Bush controls the U.S. Intelligence apparatus. This is of course speculation but one thing comes to mind. Why did Dick Cheney, who was supposed to be in charge under Bush, set up his own intelligence operation working out of his Vice President’s office? Going back in time why did Richard Nixon need the “plumbers” when he had the FBI and CIA? Once answer is at least that the FBI, under J. Edgar Hoover, was not under any President’s control because of the dirt Hoover had in his private files.

  15. The president was shocked to learn that the Justice Department confiscated phone records of the Associated Press in reference to a terrorist attack and then scheduled a luncheon with Attorney Eric Holder and a round of Put Put Golf near the White House sources said.

  16. Good afternoon Mr. Spindle the difference is none of those whom you have mentioned currently retain the title as The President of the United States.

    This is certainly not change we can believe in. But he was right, he was 5 days away from fundamentally transforming the Divided States of America.

  17. “This is an engineered failing.” (lotta)

    Obama’s excuses sound just like what a candidate says when one of his/her aides are caught in a dirty tricks operation … “I had no idea he was doing that and certainly didn’t give my permission … it was just an over zealous underling who has been dismissed from the campaign.”

    If Merkel believes Obama, she’s a fool.

    From the AFP source:

    “The Social Democrats’ chief whip Thomas Oppermann told Bild that German MPs would now like to question Snowden in a new parliamentary probe of the affair.

    ‘Snowden’s accounts seem credible while the US government apparently lied to us about this matter,’ he said.”

    Apparently Bush started spying on Merkel before she was even chancellor … I wonder if they caught her plotting with Saudi terrorists or just plotting with Bush’s Saudi friends.

    Well, this summer she got a new secure phone which NSA cracked and monitored … some overzealous functionary, who shall remain nameless, run amuck and thus embarrassing poor, innocent, gosh-gee-whiz Obama. Why do we keep electing these naive fools who are so easily misused by their courtiers?

  18. The president was unaware that former terrorist Bill Ayers lived in his neighborhood and that he was in the same living room until he read about it in a magazine.

  19. The golf course shrink had to get George Bush in there. That guilt for being so supportive of Obama, volunteering for this guy when he could have been out helping the needy, is showing through that veneer of confidence.

  20. SwM,

    I showed your link to Tex before he left. As you know, he is a huge Hillary supporter and is still smarting over the manner in which she was pushed aside to make room for Obama.

    Any indication that she might be considering a run in 2016 perks up his mood.

  21. http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/10/28/usa-spying-cameron-idUSL5N0II2WQ20131028

    Britain’s Cameron says may act against newspapers over spy leaks

    LONDON | Mon Oct 28, 2013 12:33pm EDT

    Oct 28 (Reuters) – British Prime Minister David Cameron said on Monday his government was likely to act to stop newspapers publishing what he called damaging leaks from former U.S. intelligence operative Edward Snowden unless they began to behave more responsibly.

    “If they (newspapers) don’t demonstrate some social responsibility it will be very difficult for government to stand back and not to act,” Cameron told parliament, saying Britain’s Guardian newspaper had “gone on” to print damaging material after initially agreeing to destroy other sensitive data.

    (Reporting By Andrew Osborn; Editing by Ralph Boulton)

  22. Indigo Jones 1, October 28, 2013 at 12:12 pm


    The NSA is peculiar. It was created by executive order …

    =========================
    The military NSA was created by the Joint Chiefs of Staff of the Pentagon, neither by a President nor by Congress:

    … the Joint Chiefs created the Armed Forces Security Agency [AFSA] … AFSA was redesignated the National Security Agency, without change in personnel, funds, or facilities.

    (Origin of NSA, PDF). But yes, it is peculiar.

  23. I agree with Mike S. in that I don’t think any President can truly control the NSA and the CIA. However, it is far past the time when someone should rein in both agencies. Congress needs to pass a bill limiting the power and scope of the NSA.

  24. Since our host, Jonathan Turley Esq., is associated with George Washington University (GWU), and GWU has posted a history of the NSA, in addition to my comment just above linking to a document on the NSA website, perhaps the history of the NSA in that GWU archive is more appropriate to use for discussion in this thread (The National Security Archive, GWU).

  25. Appearances and Reality: Merkel Balks at EU Privacy
    By Gregor Peter Schmitz in Brussels

    Chancellor Merkel has put on a good show of being outraged by American spying. But, at the same time, she has impeded efforts to strengthen data security. Does she really want more privacy, or is she more interested in being accepted into the exclusive group of info-sharing countries known as the ‘Five Eyes’ club?

    Merkel, meanwhile, stated: “Unlike David, we are unfortunately not part of this group.” According to the New York Times, Germany has sought membership in the “Five Eyes” alliance for years, but has been turned down due to opposition, including from the Obama administration. But this could now change, the paper speculates.

    Link:

    http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/germany-impedes-eu-privacy-efforts-despite-outrage-at-nsa-spying-a-930488.html

  26. Personanongrata 1, October 28, 2013 at 1:52 pm

    Appearances and Reality: Merkel Balks at EU Privacy
    By Gregor Peter Schmitz in Brussels

    =====================
    That is really not authoritative, it is speculation.

    The official document from the European Council, signed by 28 governments, is the reality:

    Annex Statement of Heads of State or Government

    The Heads of State or Government discussed recent developments concerning possible intelligence issues and the deep concerns that these events have raised among European citizens.

    They underlined the close relationship between Europe and the USA and the value of that partnership. They expressed their conviction that the partnership must be based on respect and trust, including as concerns the work and cooperation of secret services.

    They stressed that intelligence gathering is a vital element in the fight against terrorism. This applies to relations between European countries as well as to relations with the USA. A lack of trust could prejudice the necessary cooperation in the field of intelligence gathering.

    The Heads of State or Government took note of the intention of France and Germany to seek bilateral talks with the USA with the aim of finding before the end of the year an understanding on mutual relations in that field. They noted that other EU countries are welcome to join this initiative.

    They also pointed to the existing Working Group between the EU and the USA on the related issue of data protection and called for rapid and constructive progress in that respect.

    (ACLU vs. Clapper, Alexander, Hagel, Holder, and Mueller – 6). You can be sure that about 35 governments are really pissed off because they do not like the specter of being blackmailed into doing things they would not otherwise do.

  27. I don’t care what his excuse is! Obama had an obligation to know what the NSA was doing AND he had an obligation to control them. It is not an excuse for the president to say the intelligence apparatus is too big. These are executive agencies and they are his responsibility. No mere “functionary” including General Alexander should be allowed to control this kind of power.

    On the issue of Alexander, Obama should have fired him as soon as he indicated that he felt journalists should be punished for informing the American public of the TRUTH!

    I don’t care who started this. It is now Obama’s responsibility.

  28. ap,

    re your post @ 1:22pm (and thanks for posting the link):

    I wonder who has been putting pressure on David Cameron :evil:

  29. And from ap’s post at 2:11pm:

    “Feinstein describes the program as data collection. Leahy calls it domestic surveillance.”

    Leahy is right.

  30. @Personanongrata – You are so right! What country was so torqued off by the Tallin Estonia invention of SKYPE for it’s unique almost unbreakable encryption methods? They (Germany) tried their darnedest to break the encryption but failed just like Russia, USA, and PRC did too. But leave it to USA’s NSA to figure out how… (and they did via some really tricky maneuvers to purchase the company via Ebay and now Microsoft).

    If Merkel wanted voice privacy SKYPE would have ONCE been the answer. However, not now. There are other methods she could use today if her BND spooks would inform her, which they wont. Why? Because there’s a reason why Mr. Obama or NSA is spying on her.

    Just have Blouise put her way-back-machine-memory in play. Remember post-9/11 Blouise? Remember Erik Prince’s admission to Vanity Fair magazine? Remember those beaucoup rendition flights out of Germany? Just do some due-diligence open source intel research on Google and piece it together. Merkel is murky! Her own people don’t know who she is really loyal too. I’m sure Gerhard Schindler appreciates Mr. Obama’s (NSA) nosy nature on Merkel. It allows him to keep tabs on his CINC (Merkel) and maintain his own plausible deniability (i.e. “Mr. Obama I am outraged by this spying on my Chancellor…”(wink wink)).

    And of course Mr. Obama (CINC) can not control the CIA (and maybe NSA too at times). What POTUS could ever do that? At one time we couldn’t even rein in the FBI under Hoover. The CIA was created under a strange mix of post-WW2 US Patriots and Oil Patriots (one of which is allegedly still in charge of things). It was to be a clearinghouse of intelligence operations. Somehow it evolved into a powerful paramilitary agency with it’s own enigmatic self-funding (wink-wink).

    No one was supposed to know about the NSA but that got out eventually. It too was just a bunch of number-crunching egg heads who could break USSR and PRC encryption in their sleep. Now with it’s enigmatic CSS division it is TOTALLY something else.

    Cheney tried to micromanage them both with his almost daily visits on the lead up to the Iraq invasion. At some point it occurred to him that to circumvent the true LOYALISTS in both groups was to introduce Douglas Fieth (i.e. Pentagon OSI?). They used these guys to do what the others wouldn’t (BTW which is not much). The OSI was also another alphabet-soup agency that allegedly secretly did things NOT on their mission statements. They did MUCH more than just Psyops. Donald Rumsfeld tried to obfuscate the OSI by using the “chicken little” comment and closing down the agency – which BTW is still operational only under a different name.

    SPECIAL NOTE: There are OTHER terrorist groups other than Al-Qaida? Ever heard of any German left-wing terrorist cells?

    What can you say about a woman that HATES dogs!!! Angela you should be ashamed of yourself! Putin is such a wise-azz… he put his Black Lab KONI right next to her chair when she visited Russia in 2012. Her discomfort was clearly evident. :evil: :roll:

  31. Here’s a little humorous anecdote. When watching the movie ENEMY OF THE STATE (1998), they mention the NSA and it’s huge invasion of privacy methods LONG before any of this happened. They also spoke of a Congressional bill which pre-dated the Patriot Act. And YES Mr. Obama can be excused from not knowing what the RIGHT hand is doing “If this was somebody’s unilateral wet dream, then that somebody is going to prison.”:

  32. SOTB, Great flick. Hackman sort of reprised Harry Caul in this flick and he and Will Smith had great chemistry. There’s a thread from Friday about a lesbian sex flick you might find interesting. I know that’s your favorite genre.

  33. sonofblundermoanenergy 1, October 28, 2013 at 3:25 pm

    SPECIAL NOTE: There are OTHER terrorist groups other than Al-Qaida? …
    ===========================
    Yep.

    Oil Qaeda DUH mudder of all mudders.

  34. SOTB,

    Yeah, but, calling Bush Jr. a “functionary” is just lame :cool:

    Unless President Obama was referring to Cheney … but, no … the military hated Cheney so NSA would never have listened to him. It’s back to Bush Jr. as Obama’s over zealous “functionary”.

    Anyway Merkel talking to terrorists of any kind, especially left-wing ones, is just ridiculous.

    NSA = No Sane Agents

  35. @Nick Spinelli – I particularly liked the part about the “corrupt unions” in the earlier part of the movie. I posted a full movie link up there if anyone wants to watch it. Very good movie and quite insightful.

    Harry Caul? You know you’re right! I still can’t see how Harry missed the introduction of the “laser mic” easily defeat-able by a common cheap digital camera and a electric razor.

    Lesbian sex flick? ROFLMAO!!! I guess pay back is a biotch huh? :-)

    @Dred – I feel ya’ bra’ but what up wid’ the perceived invective? i.e. “sonofblundermoanenergy” – I was going for the RED ARMY et al. Angela Merkel has a bunch of rowdy friends me thinks’.

  36. Justice Holmes: “No mere “functionary” including General Alexander should be allowed to control this kind of power.”

    I think we’ve come to the point where it’s valid to ask for whom is Obama the functionary. By extension, it’s worth now considering to what extent any candidate, let alone Obama’s heiress apparent, will discontinue these policies. Who will cede this power? Can it be ceded?

    A Congress With Fangs, please. U.S. Attorney’s earning their pay, if you will.

  37. @Blouise – I did not actually hear the “functionary” comment. I thought he meant some No Such Agency GLG-20 like “Fiedler” (aka Jack Black) in the EOS movie. (That GLG-20 link is way too funny!) :-)

    Yeah, Cheney visited Langley more than Ft. Meade. At least he could confab with onsite Mossad agents at Langley. No Such Agency doesn’t like foreign spy agencies to have operational offices in the Puzzle Palace. Kinda’ is a conflict of interest don’t ja’ know… :8-):

    I don’t really think Angela is talking to Red Army et al… I just threw that in for color commentary. I was hoping you’d get my drift about Erik Prince and the OTHER CIA (the oily ones?) that she is obviously talking too. I know: “WTF is the OTHER CIA?” This one:

    I wonder who the late Senator was talking about during Iran Contra hearings… :roll: 8-)

  38. I think Obama is a functionary and I think he was well aware of the tap.

    The most important thing people can do is stop excusing what is going on. America has a deep state. The deep state works through what are nominally called “democratically elected” officials. To get at the deep state our citizens need to stand up to the “democratically elected” officials.

    Obama is accountable for his lawlessness. Congress is accountable for their lawlessness. As most of our judiciary seems lawless, this leaves only the people and a small handful of elected officials and lower court judges to try and return our nation to the rule of law. We cannot do this with a population in denial.

    Believe me if enough people tell their elected officials that they will not tolerate their lawlessness, it will have an impact, even on the deep state.

  39. James Knauer 1, October 28, 2013 at 4:23 pm
    …let alone Obama’s heiress apparent…

    If you are referring to Mrs. Clinton, I assure you it won’t happen. Just as long as the Diebold voting machine hack is strategically NEVER fixed, and Ohio & Florida has Conservatives running the show, I can predict with almost 95% accuracy who that will be in 2016. The family legacy must live on don’t ja’ know.

    “The [American] people follow its leadership with determination, confident in its armed forces and ready to bear what fate demands. The year [2016] will be, I am convinced, the historical year of a great New Order. The program could not be anything else than the opening up of the world for all, the breaking down of individual privileges, the breaking of the tyranny of certain peoples, and better still, of their financial autocrats.” – Without my modifications in brackets Who Said This? The next POTUS-45 might say it too. His father (POTUS-41) and grandfather would encourage it I think.

    Not sure Angela Merkel agrees with this sentiment but WHO KNOWS who she is talking to? Obama knows!

  40. “The golf course shrink had to get George Bush in there. That guilt for being so supportive of Obama, volunteering for this guy when he could have been out helping the needy, is showing through that veneer of confidence.”

    Did I address you Nick? What happened to your promise to Professor Turley and your apology to him for your bad behavior? That happened only a few days ago and we see that the promise was yet another in a long series of lies from you.

  41. 2016 is way too late to address what is happening right now. The NSA has a history which predates even Bush. There is plenty of blame to go around. Speculation on 2016 is an excellent smoke screen to current reality.

    If you are interested in stopping this lawlessness you must take action now. You must let the current “democratically elected” “leaders” know you find their actions wrong and you will not tolerate them.

  42. @Jill – IF Mr. Obama was taping Angela’s BlackBerry Z10 (she thinks that’s secure?) then what law is he breaking? German law? Big deal. Israel spies on US daily. Where’s the angst about that? If Angela was smart she’d get the same phone Mr. Obama uses. This one: The anti-NSA Smartphone
    “Can you hear me now?”
    “NO!!!”
    “GOOD!” :-)

  43. You need to care about the rule of law. He is breaking EU law. He is also breaking US law. JT has explained this. It’s a very big deal because lack of rule of law is breaking down this society. I would hope everyone would care about the breakdown of society.

  44. sonofthunderboanerges 1, October 28, 2013 at 4:16 pm

    @Dred – I feel ya’ bra’ but what up wid’ the perceived invective? i.e. “sonofblundermoanenergy” – I was going for the RED ARMY et al. Angela Merkel has a bunch of rowdy friends me thinks’.
    ==========================
    Good point. Well said.

  45. Mike Spindell 1, October 28, 2013 at 4:59 pm

    “The golf course shrink had to get George Bush in there. That guilt for being so supportive of Obama, volunteering for this guy when he could have been out helping the needy, is showing through that veneer of confidence.”

    Did I address you Nick? What happened to your promise to Professor Turley and your apology to him for your bad behavior? That happened only a few days ago and we see that the promise was yet another in a long series of lies from you.
    ====================
    And Nick, you tried to lay that trip on me.

    Naughty boy nickola the nick meister nickum prohibitum.

    Mike S, he is only ball bursting.

    That was him that snatched your ball on the 12th hole such that you could not find it.

    He is getting as bad as the selfish gene.

  46. @Jill – The NSA does not predate Bush Sr. It got its start in 1952 when George was collaborating with Allen Dulles et al to overthrow Nicaragua and Iran to feather their oily nests. Of course according to George he was NEVER with the CIA before he was it’s director. Truman and Eisenhower couldn’t keep these “rowdy friends” in check. Maybe the NSA was stop-gap to also keep an watchful eye on internal affairs too (albeit illegally) – not just the Communists. So I find it difficult to understand how we the American people can do anything about this cabal of watchful eyes. To me it’s “status quo ante”. Like the wise man said: “Keep your friends close, but your enemies closer.” What better way than how NSA does it?

    @Nick Spinelli – Jezus H. Christ! I can’t take you any where any more! Use your outside pretext voice when you’re fibbing… :-)

    Please play nice in the sandbox… We all really do like you here – despite the ostensibly well-deserved vitriol. You remind me of the guy at grade school who was always saying “stop hitting your self…” and “you can’t help that you’re ugly and poor…”

    “I’m OK, You’re OK” – Thomas A Harris MD,

  47. “Did you shoot under 90 today?”

    I’ve already said I don’t play golf, but I know baseball better than you. Your comments today were way below the Mendoza line and you hit like Al Leiter. :)

  48. earsoftheworld 1, October 28, 2013 at 5:44 pm

    An NSA-certified “secure” smartphone. lol
    ==============
    I knew somebody was going to pick up on that. Just thought it would be Gene H. or Otteray Scribe… :D

  49. You may know baseball trivia better than I, but I would need some proof. But I played the game and coached it for 30 years. I know the game better than you, hopefully your ego can accept that. A baseball trivia competition would be fun. I sometimes just read old Baseball Encyclopedias. That was my birthday present annually for 7 or 8 years, until internet made it obsolete. I like cross cultural trivia questions like, how are Harmon Killebrew and Jerry Lee Lewis connected? This is a pretty easy one.

  50. @Jill – If a foreign dignitary is working in cahoots with some internal US intelligence cabal who arguably has been getting away with secretly undermining it’s own country since 1947 for it’s own financial gain, who do you think should listen to their Blackberry Z10 to see how far and deep the plot goes? How many times has this same organization smuggled illegal German NAZI scientists into America after WW2 after a DIRECT Presidential Order to not do that? How many times have we spied on the Germans since WW1 and through the Cold War period? There’s a valid reason to do such things even if it seems Machiavellian.

    In a perfect world we should trust all of our so-called friends. But just like President Reagan suggested about this IMPERFECT world “Trust but verify…”

    I re-read JT’s statement above about the “rule of law” and I can not see what US law NSA is breaking by spying on a foreign country (especially under FISA if she’s talking to other so-called Americans in a conspiratorial fashion?). Especially one that might be discussing things that negatively impact USA in some way.

    I can’t trust a woman who hates dogs. It looks like Russia doesn’t either. Putin loves his dog KONI. Angela doesn’t… :evil:

  51. SoTB,
    Missed that. Unfortunately, had to do something called work. I hear that if you do this “work” thing, people sometimes give you money.

  52. Otteray Scribe 1, October 28, 2013 at 6:07 pm

    SoTB,
    Missed that. Unfortunately, had to do something called work. I hear that if you do this “work” thing, people sometimes give you money.

    Yeah I knew you were out there. I lurk a lot too. Sometimes I stay away from obvious threads until someone invokes my moniker. Like saying Candyman three times fast – :-)

    Yeah buddy… I get ya’ on the work thing… Actually, as usual, I’m supposed to be working now myself. Something about JT’s blogs that attract me like a moth to flame. I can’t resist certain subject matter – I can see Blouise going: “Yeah I know just what that is too!” Yeah sister you’re right. I’m hooked on that stuff ever since Tom Clancy finished his bucket list. You know I’ve never finished any of his books? I’m about to wach OP CENTER on YouTube tonight. I hope it’s good…

  53. “@Blouise – I did not actually hear the “functionary” comment. I thought he meant some No Such Agency GLG-20 like “Fiedler” (aka Jack Black) in the EOS movie. (That GLG-20 link is way too funny!)” (SOTB)

    I’m sure he did mean an NSA guy/gal … I decided, all on my own, that he meant Bush Jr. … one can do that when the functionary is unnamed.

    As to terrorists and Merkel … I was just pulling your leg. After all, Bush Jr. helped all those Saudi’s fly out of the country on 9/11 … who knows how many terrorists or terrorist enablers were hiding in plain sight on that plane?

    Honest to god, I think the other CIA lives in the stand of evergreens in my backyard and, if the trash I find there every Sunday morning is any indication, they’re cheap drunks.

    BTW … where is Obama building his Library?

  54. Justice Holmes,
    “I don’t care who started this. It is now Obama’s responsibility.”

    I agree. It was wicked for Bush to start it, but what does that say about Obama’s moral compass for continuing it? Do these things make him equally bad as Bush or worse?

    “It is now Obama’s responsibility.”

    I’d also say, “And ours.” We need to clean house on the Hill.

    Is this, finally, an impeachable offense, the stuff of high crimes and misdemeanors?

    Sigh.

  55. “Yeah sister you’re right. I’m hooked on that stuff ever since Tom Clancy finished his bucket list. You know I’ve never finished any of his books? ” (SOTB)

    I knew it! We are kindred souls for I haven’t either … I get bored.

  56. @Nick – Yeah it was Yogi. That is one funny line though!

    Hey talking about golf, I do live near one, unlike Mike S. I like taking shortcuts through it but the cops have blocked off the road. It’s a very old one too. I think Samuel Colt use to play there. I really don’t play well. My boss got me into a “Scramble” and I told him not to depend on me competitively because I absolutely suck at it. But just like you I can fake almost anything for a while until exposed. Just like this guy: JARED

  57. SOTB, My neighbor was a pro @ Chipanee Country Club in Bristol, Ct. A lotta ESPN people play there now. The pro was a blue collar Pollack[and he called me wop] like me. He was a real mentor for me. I would caddy, clean clubs, shag balls on the range. Leo would give me the cheapskates to caddy because he knew I was good, and then Leo would give me a tip these doctors, lawyers, politicians would not. We would laugh @ the a-holes. Leo would give me soda, snacks, whatever. He always wanted to teach me to golf. He would have given me clubs, let me golf whenever I wanted. It’s a beautiful old course. Sadly, I never took him up on it. Golf was a job for me. I started when I was 12. I also umpired men’s softball games starting @ 12. Again, a great mentor, ex-Marine, would work the plate and I had the bases. It wasn’t until I was in my 30’s I realized how much I learned about people, adults people. I was way ahead of the curve on that. So, while I always thought it serendipitous that I became a PI, maybe it wasn’t. I played baseball and football in high school and CYO basketball. We’re of the age where you played ALL sports in your youth. I was a ham n’ egger b-ball player, but I liked playing, so CYO was my chance to play. No shame.

  58. @Blouise – To catch a CIA officer lurking in your backyard you can use a 60′ cabled X-10 with IR capability (x-10.com). They are really cheap and easy to hide. But if he/she is from the OTHER CIA just simply throw a bag of play money cash and some oil cans out there. If you hear a made dash to pounce on it then you got yourself an OTHER! :-)

    No seriously, use your tradecraft skills. There’s a kids game called CSI fingerprint kit at Walmart or Toys-R-Us. Just dust the bottles. Then after you print the neighborhood kids usual suspects (i.e. invite them to your house and hand them a bottle of soda-pop and make sure you get it back from them) then you have your culprits. Or you could just set your DVR to record your X-10 video feed. They also have PIR motion detectors built in. All under $100 bucks.

    Yeah my ADD prevents me from doing anything that takes more than 8-seconds of my attention. I know Nick could do stakeouts but I would be climbing the walls if it went beyond a day (BTDT). I’d me smoking cigars, drinking Java, and playing on Internet. Partner would say “Did you see that?” “No I didn’t… what did I miss…” “Oh just about everything!”

    I found a great “Q” like guy on YouTube. I swear he used to be a DS&T geek but he won’t admit to it. He invented these glasses that will block your face on any modern surveillance camera. You can’t see anything with naked eye but the camera sees a huge white flare around your face. He’s kinda’ goofy though… Google KIPKAY.

    Hey have you figured out the Kryptos riddle yet?

    You wanna’ know where Barry is gonna’ build his POTUS library?
    Google Earth coordinates: 41°47′23″N 87°35′59″W
    I lay good odds on it!

  59. @Prairie Rose – Wow you got this really Sarah Palin vibe going on about Barry huh? Imagine this: Remember that Chuck Norris movie in where the terrorists come to your neighborhood and shoot it up? Well Barry is ostensibly preventing this from happening. At least for now. Since it is likely that some people I call THE OTHERS may have played a very well-defined role in 9/11 I would think that we need to spy on anyone who has any dealings with them INCLUDING but not limited to Angela Merkel. I mean her country (et al) did try to take over the world once just some 68 years ago. It appears THE OTHERS are pro-‘that country’ (and party) and are not to be trusted even if some were once our Presidents.

    Aren’t you even curious as to who Angela was talking to so much that the NSA was interested? Under FISA at least one party has to be an American I think or at least talking conspiratorially about USA. Not sure… She should set herself free of guilt. Like Sybok said ins Star Trek V: The Final Frontier (1989): Let us explore it… together. Each man [woman] hides a secret pain. It must be exposed and reckoned with. It must be dragged from the darkness and forced into the light. Share your pain. Share your pain with me… and gain strength from the sharing. :cool:

  60. “He is getting as bad as the selfish gene.”

    Dredd,

    He doesn’t have the chops to have read Dawkins. Needless to say I don’t golf. I can’t afford it. :)

  61. Blouise 1, October 28, 2013 at 6:28 pm
    …After all, Bush Jr. helped all those Saudi’s fly out of the country on 9/11 … who knows how many terrorists or terrorist enablers were hiding in plain sight on that plane?…

    Yeah Phoebe (or is it feebee?) was really pissed about that little clusterphuq… I was pretty cheesed off too. After seeing Junior walking hand-in-hand with the sheik, his dealings with them at Arbusto Oil, Capitol Police guarding their embassy in DC, why would anyone not see the phuqing forest? Because of the gotdam trees? Can you imagine that what you said could be true? The WHOLE country GROUNDED not even a flying-squirrel could take off and here the bin Laden Family getting out of dodge post-haste! Talk about owing favors to someone! You think that coke-head and his heart-transplant partner-in-crime will ever face war crimes over this?

  62. http://thehill.com/blogs/defcon-hill/policy-and-strategy/330995-feinstein-blasts-nsas-spying-on-foreign-leaders

    Feinstein vows ‘total review’ of NSA

    By Jeremy Herb – 10/28/13 04:49 PM ET

    Senate Intelligence Chairwoman Dianne Feinstein (D-Calif.) on Monday called for a “total review” of all intelligence collection programs as she criticized the National Security Agency for spying on foreign leaders.

    “It is abundantly clear that a total review of all intelligence programs is necessary so that members of the Senate Intelligence Committee are fully informed as to what is actually being carried out by the intelligence community,” Feinstein said.

    Feinstein has been one of the NSA’s staunchest congressional defenders amid the uproar over its phone records surveillance, but she said that the spying on foreign leaders without President Obama’s knowledge was a “big problem.”

    “Unlike NSA’s collection of phone records under a court order, it is clear to me that certain surveillance activities have been in effect for more than a decade and that the Senate Intelligence Committee was not satisfactorily informed,” Feinstein said in a statement. “Therefore our oversight needs to be strengthened and increased.”

    Feinstein said that she planned to initiate a major review into all of the intelligence community’s collection methods.

    “The White House has informed me that collection on our allies will not continue, which I support,” she said. “But as far as I’m concerned, Congress needs to know exactly what our intelligence community is doing.”

    Feinstein said she was “totally opposed” to NSA collection of intelligence on leaders of U.S. allies.

    German Chancellor Angela Merkel and other leaders have expressed outrage over reports that the NSA was spying on Merkel since 2002 and that it spied on 35 world leaders.

    The Wall Street Journal reported Sunday that Obama was not told of the intelligence gathering on world leaders until this summer.

    Feinstein called for the president to be required to approve the kinds of intelligence collection on foreign leaders that was detailed in reports over the past week.

    “Unless the United States is engaged in hostilities against a country or there is an emergency need for this type of surveillance, I do not believe the United States should be collecting phone calls or emails of friendly presidents and prime ministers,” Feinstein said.

    The Senate Intelligence panel has been preparing to mark-up legislation to reform the NSA’s data collection practices in the wake of the uproar over its phone metadata collection.

    The House Intelligence Committee has the NSA director and other top intelligence officials testifying in a rare open hearing on Tuesday as they also prepare to craft legislation.

  63. Feinstein is the worse person in Congress regarding the NSA. The Senator one state north, Ron Wyden, is the best.

  64. NSA recruiters appeared at the University of Wisconsin last summer. The recruiting session didn’t exactly go completely wrong, but the NSA recruiters will not soon forget it. Audio of the session was recorded. Students peppered the NSA recruiters with some tough questions, and unlike the coiffed heads on Sunday morning talk shows, did not give up and did not cut the recruiters any slack. The tenor of the questons was on the order of, “When you say that, are you lying or just not telling the truth.” I particularly liked the part when the student worked on pinning them down on defining “adversary.” The audio has been posted on SoundCloud.

  65. @anonymously posted – So does that mean that they are going to take issue with Benjamin Netanyahu and Tamir Pardo having AMDOCS and COMSYS spying on US citizens and it’s leaders? Including Mr. Obama’s (et al) spy-proof phone too?

  66. Here’s Snowden’s problem. His life is in the hands of a soulless, murderous former KBG chief. I doubt Snowden sleeps well. Too bad he couldn’t have gotten to a better country.

  67. “A baseball trivia competition would be fun. I sometimes just read old Baseball Encyclopedias.”

    I don’t do baseball trivia, I do baseball statistics. I was a member of SABRE in the 80’s. As far as playing the game I played into my 40’s and got my second heart attack one afternoon while playing. You know about my heart condition don’t you Nick? The heart attack was on my old heart, you know before the new one that you want taken back.

    As far as coaching goes Chuck Dressen was a baseball manager for forty years and he was a smug ass, driven by ego, just like you. The Dodgers really came into their stride when a quiet man named Alston took over.

  68. Nick,

    “Too bad he couldn’t have gotten to a better country.”

    The question you beg is why should have Snowden “gotten” anywhere?

    Why could he not stay in this country while exposing the breaches of government?

  69. “Mike
    how could you not like golf? it sounds like so much fun”

    Pete,

    Most of my friends golf and it would be nice to spend time with them. however, it is far too expensive, people get up at unGodly hours to play and my days are too busy to cut out five hour blocks. Also leading up to my heart transplant most of my muscle strength atrophied and when I went out to a driving range I found I was lucky if I could hit a drive 35 to 50 yards.

  70. “You think that coke-head and his heart-transplant partner-in-crime will ever face war crimes over this?” (SOTB)

    Only if they get caught outside the country. I’m thinking Spain would be the best bet.

  71. Q U E S T I O N

    Isn’t it true, that IF Senator Feinstein was actually performing her duty as Chairperson of oversight, she wouldn’t have to claim ignorance in her role as Chairperson of the Senate Inel Committee?

  72. Blouise,

    Springtime for Bush in Paraguay?

    Who knows. I thought I’d archived news reports of confirmation of Bush’s land purchase, but after much searching locally on my 15TB of archived news I couldn’t find anything other than the above reference.

    I know I’ve read much more conclusive facts than I offer here, but this is the best I can do right now.

  73. Take a deep breath folks. [1] given the on-going “Euro cri$i$” it might have been a benefit to know what was being discussed by European leaders in camera; [2] any body out there who does not think that Germany, France, Russia, China, etc., do not spy on the US? [3] despite the Five Eyes agreement it is very likely each of the five spy on each other; and [4] it reassures Poland.

  74. The agency will learn — not the hard way, I hope — that knowing everything unfortunately means knowing nothing at all. -Eugene Robinson

    The out-of-control NSA

    By Eugene Robinson, Published: October 28

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/eugene-robinson-the-out-of-control-nsa/2013/10/28/49645872-4008-11e3-a624-41d661b0bb78_story.html

    Excerpt:

    “To me, all this is consistent with the NSA’s apparent goal of knowing, basically, everything. The agency collects information as massively and indiscriminately as possible on the theory that if you assemble a database of all the world’s communications, the few you seek — those involving terrorists — will be in there somewhere.

    This is not just a massive invasion of privacy that the people of France, Spain and other countries understandably resent. It’s also a mistake.

    While NSA analysts were busy sifting billions of phone records, they were unaware that one of their own contract analysts, some guy named Snowden, was about to spill all the precious beans. Big Data will prove more of an illusion than a panacea. The agency will learn — not the hard way, I hope — that knowing everything unfortunately means knowing nothing at all.”

  75. “One Day after Rolling Out “Comprehensive Review,” Feinstein Proceeds with Mark-Up Anyway”

    http://www.emptywheel.net/2013/10/29/one-day-after-rolling-out-comprehensive-review-feinstein-proceeds-with-mark-up-anyway/

    Posted on October 29, 2013 by emptywheel

    Excerpt:

    Yesterday, Dianne Feinstein announced, “a total review of all intelligence programs … so that members of the Senate Intelligence Committee are fully informed as to what is actually being carried out by the intelligence community.”

    Today, her committee will nevertheless conduct a mark-up of her bill to not fix the spying targeted at Americans.

    Umm, given that she just admitted she doesn’t know everything the NSA has been doing — and that she hasn’t been fully informed — don’t you think the comprehensive review should precede the new legislation?

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/oct/29/nsa-files-us-intelligence-officials-testify-in-congress-live-coverage

  76. nick spinelli 1, October 28, 2013 at 10:33 pm

    Here’s Snowden’s problem. His life is in the hands of a soulless, murderous former KBG chief. I doubt Snowden sleeps well. Too bad he couldn’t have gotten to a better country.

    Oh come on now… the Gray Cardinal (aka Putin) allowed him to stay if he kept his mouth shut. Well I guess he blew that so now we have to wait and see what the “soulless ex-KGB chief” will do now. Extend his “in-your-face Mr. Obama” Slavic hospitality or make him “hit the bricks” and “kick rocks”.

    He just had to tweak Angela Merkel. No she’ll keep harping on this and wont shut up. People who do that IMO are covering up for a guilty conscience. I know you’re familiar with that personalty-type in the field. You know the best way for a con-artist to deflect guilt is to get indignant and then cast blame unto someone else; in this case the NSA who is only trying to protect US from another 9/11 – which could come from ANYWHERE including Angela’s “rowdy friends” (not again???)

  77. “in this case the NSA who is only trying to protect US from another 9/11″

    Because shadowy men with too much information (which equates to leverage) and beholding to no one have such a good track record in looking out for a society instead of their own interests and upholding the law.
    :roll:

    I’m sure that many former “guests” at Soviet gulags have a different take on the matter.

  78. OK… Diane Fienstien can only work with the IC (intelligence community) only if they are willing to sit in a Senate chamber in executive session to talk about IC operations. Most of them cooperate but sometimes they don’t. They can’t be forced to talk about black ops if they say they don’t do black ops (which is common). The NSA and CIA are notorious for sending in the clowns who act like Johnny Tightlips from the Simpsons.

    @Blouise – Well I guess they won’t be using their passports any time soon. I know The Hague would love to meet them. The idea that the Bushes have land in Paraguay or Uruguay does not shock me. You know my contentions about ALL of them and where their TRUE political alliances really are. Those two countries have been harboring fugitives from WW2 for 68-years now! So a great place to FLEE to when the other shoe drops hopefully before 2016 when John or Neil take the oath of office in January. Did you know the younger sister was married to a KOCH? Wow!

    White House OK’s spying on allies? NSA has tons of pointless data to data mine for terrorists? I don’t see the problem. If 2,500 years ago General Sun Tzu had such resources his Art of War would had been even more phenomenal. And as you know the IC and our military still follow Sun Tzu’s advice. Know your enemy better than you know your self. With all that data who’s to say WHO the real enemies are? That way when you sift (or data mine) you may discover NEW enemies you never even knew about.

    James Spada is playing a really cool role in BLACKLIST (2013) about an ex-ONI spook who was being groomed as a Admiral. He goes freelance as a cobbler who makes shoes (or false flags in the parlance). He exposes enemies we didn’t even know we had. However, he’s working for Phoebe (FBI) and not CIA or NSA in the TV series. Why? Because he detests them. There is a CIA woman liaison-ed to FBI in the series though. She promptly EIT’s (aka tortures) a prisoner to set the stereotype that CIA officers are cruel and beastly people (well not all of them are) :-)

  79. @Gene H. – You’re right my friend, all that data could and was used for LEVERAGE as you say. Bush Jr. did. It’s debatable that Barry is though. I think General Alexander will do the right thing and be a proper “custodian” with all of those multiple-Terabytes of data he is crunching out in that Bluffdale Utah data center know as “Bumblehive”. They didn’t open 24 Sept due to an electrical fire which stopped the ribbon-cutting ceremony. I wonder if they’ll give the Gray Cardinal a tour? He’s a friend now and not an enemy any more – right? Harboring an enemy of the US state should not be a problem? Maybe they’ll let Snowden tag along during the tour too. Don’t get me wrong I do not have a man crush on the GC. I agree with Nick he is not a good person. And yes he is holding people in the Gulag including an American which no one in USA seems to be concerned about because they think he died in a plane crash. But that’s another story…

  80. If GBK has a 15 terabyte hard drive I must be way too low on the size of the acres of supercomputers and DASD space NSA has. Does anybody know the true size of the data storage capacity of Bumblehive? If not what’s bigger than terabytes? My nephew just bought one from Best Buy and I was floored. They actually sell stuff like that? What was he going to use it for I asked. He said photos and video images as he is a Hollywood producer/director. He said it was quite expensive. I’m still old-school and working off of 10GB drive. Call me old fashioned.

  81. @Blouise – Yes GBK’s story is very interesting. It appears that not only Jr. had his daughter close the deal but Rev. Sun Y. Moon has even bigger property at Chaco about 1.4m acres! On top of that Sr. purchased property near the Rev’s plot, also big! And to make things even worse the USAF opened a SpecOps base at Mariscal Estigarribia staffed with 400 men in 2005 (Coordinates: 22°2′0″S 60°38′0″W). The base is still operational. And to top even that off Paraguay has a war-criminal immunity stance. They granted ALL of the property owners and the troops at MEAFB the same immunity.

    Scuttlebutt is that it’s all about a Venezuelan invasion but has since stand-down due to Chavez’s mysterious death recently. However, that only covers MEAFB not Moon or the Bushes. I hope it’s not some “rowdy friends” reunion place. And Angela Merkel is related to them too.

  82. I must admit I never heard of a YOTTA. I did not know that NSA was that high in DASD space. To speed up your algorithm why don’t you take a lesson from Google and index the ENTIRE database (which will take several days probably) and then search via an index? Maybe you’re doing that already? I believe they use spiders and robots. But that probably wont work for you as you download everything first then search it right? I assume your using Linux? Do you take out all line-feeds in your code and make it just on continuous line of code? Or do you use an compiler versus an interpreter? Interpreters are very slow…

    Screen scraping? Are you following in the footsteps of the ill-fated Russ Kick’s memory hole? He was hacked in 2009 by the intelligence community and he never recovered. It would be nice to see another memory hole unlike WikiLeaks which is just an Israeli-funded propaganda machine IMO. Notice NOTHING is ever mentioned about their black ops. I wonder why?

  83. Oops!!! My bad…
    “This is a parody of nsa.gov and has not been approved, endorsed, or authorized by the National Security Agency or by any other U.S. Government agency. Much of this content was derived from news media, privacy groups, and government websites. Links to these sites are posted on the left-sidebars of each page.”

    It’s hosted by http://www.1and1.com owned by United Internet a German company.

  84. SOTB,

    Hopscotch … will find it this week.

    When I mentioned Spain I was specifically referring to a country that would bring those 2 boys to trial.

    Many, many years ago I was planning a trip overseas. Spain was on the list until I was told, in no uncertain terms, that it was not a safe place for me at that time because I would be vulnerable based on a my close relationship with a certain relative. If I didn’t cross Spain off my list, my passport would develop problems. Hand to heart.

  85. Dr. Turley,

    “Even in the face of global condemnation, the cult of personality surrounding Obama continues to silence any significant opposition from Democrats.”

    With all due respect, I find your repetition of this position tiresome.

    Complicit is the word, and thereby my utter uninterest in the group as a whole. No better than the other side they so vehemently condemn, in my humble opinion.

    When the rest of the world tires of the U.S. and disengages from it by replacing the dollar as the de facto standard currency…

  86. Nate,

    Not to speak for our host, but complicity is complicity whether directly active (and I do agree there is some of that going on, looking your direction Feinstein and Pelosi) or indirectly via another mechanism (such as the definite air of Cult of Personality the man so unjustly enjoys). You may differ on prime causes, but I think the observation of the result nets the same complicity.

  87. @Blouise – I was just listening to the war-criminal-#2 (i.e. Cheney) talking to Charlie Rose this past Tuesday about his new heart and how Mr. Obama is doing everything wrong as it applies to the NSA debacle. My hand had an autonomic reaction (palm to face?)… This cretin has the nerve to talk about ANYTHING at this point? I think the family should demand their child’s heart back. Charlie zinged him back though: “Might you have seen Iraq differently if we had more oxygen to your brain?”

    Yes Spain was one of the cry-baby NSA targets too. Come on! A lot of the tangos are in Madrid – right? What about the train attacks? Spain doesn’t have any room to balk at anything we are doing. It’s only to help them in the GWOT in the long run. Didn’t Spain’s own CNI have something to do with the NSA spying on 60 million Spanish citizens?

    This reminds me of the scene in Analyze This (1999) where DeNiro was mocking a hit victim crying like a baby. These European leaders are mostly all in bed with the “rowdy friends” and Mr. Obama needs to know where the next shoe is coming from. Machiavellian? Yes it is. But Ben Franklin once said “By failing to prepare, you are preparing to fail.”
    ==================== 2500 years ago ====================
    Thus, what enables the wise sovereign and the good general to … achieve things beyond the reach of ordinary men, is FOREKNOWLEDGE. Now this foreknowledge cannot be elicited from spirits; it cannot be obtained inductively from experience, nor by any deductive calculation. Knowledge of the enemy’s dispositions can only be obtained from other men. Hence the use of spies, of whom there are five classes: (1) Local spies; (2) inward spies; (3) converted spies; (4) doomed spies; (5) surviving spies. [and maybe (6) NSA PRISM?] When these five kinds of spy are all at work, none can discover the secret system. This is called “divine manipulation of the threads.” It is the sovereign’s [or Obama’s] most precious faculty.” – Sun Tzu – The Art of War – Chapter 13 verses 4-8.
    ========================================

    Persona non grata in Spain huh? Someone told me that the same thing applied to me but only in Moscow (or any where the Grey Cardinal rules) – unlike Snowden huh? No worries. Wasn’t planning on doing any overseas trips anyway. Canada and Mexico are my only trips recently and I’m fine now for the next decade or so.

  88. SOTB,

    I strongly suspect, though I was never actually told, that Arab terrorists were at home there at the time for this was shortly after the failed rescue attempt under Carter.

  89. “This cretin has the nerve to talk about ANYTHING at this point? I think the family should demand their child’s heart back. Charlie zinged him back though: “Might you have seen Iraq differently if we had more oxygen to your brain?”

    SOTB,

    I saw that Charlie Rose interview and when he asked that question I was blown away. As you might know I am three years out of a heart transplant after almost dying from Cardiomyopathy. People don’t really understand how much such heart disease affects judgment and the thought processes. I noe instance I even cursed my wife out when I was clearly very sick and she wanted me to go to the hospital. The lack of oxygen put me into a psychotic state and she was told at the hospital that she saved my life by calling 911 despite my ravings. I wrote a guest blog about my experience here:

    http://jonathanturley.org/2012/01/22/from-the-bottom-of-my-new-heart/#more-44298

    Charlie Rose’s question to Cheney was an insightful one. From my experience I learned that I couldn’t even make the right decisions for myself, much less my country. Cheney’s hubris wouldn’t let him see that or acknowledge that.

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