The respected Massachusetts-based group Physicians for Human Rights has published a report finding that 11 former detainees showed clear signed of torture in medical examinations following their release from Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, and Afghanistan.. The detainees were released for lack of evidence of terrorism.
The 121-page report details evidence of torture, including beatings, electric shock, sleep deprivation, sexual humiliation, sodomy and scores of other abuses. Retired U.S. Major Gen. Antonio Taguba, who led the Army’s investigation into the Abu Ghraib prisoner abuse scandal in 2003, wrote the foreword to the report and stated “There is no longer any doubt that the current administration committed war crimes. The only question is whether those who ordered torture will be held to account.”
The record on the American torture program is now comprehensive and unavoidable, including the recent disclosure that the Administration began work on the torture program long before any inquiry from the field, here — a direct contradiction of earlier statements from the Administration.
Despite the fact that interrogators and officials now admit to using torture, here, Congress continues to feign interest while withholding any substantive action against those who ordered a torture program.
For the full story, click here.
What is most striking is that these men were released for lack of evidence of terrorism. A recent study showed that the Administration continued to hold men for years after it became clear that they were innocent, here.
But what if we tortured someone who was innocent? Is there any recourse for that?
What if your brother was a bad person and you are arrested and detained for years and tortured because of your brother?
Even the worst of the terrorists deserve a fair trial. I’m sorry, I think that if found guilty they deserve the fullest punishment of the law but for us to torture people means that the terrorists are winning.
And when did thinking we should adhere to the Constitution (by giving someone the right of habeas corpus) makes me a traitor???
“Dissent is the highest form of patriotism.” I guess I don’t need to tell you who said that because you love america more than me…
whoolie bacon (what part of this makes you want to say, “whoolie bacon Batman!”),
Your paranoia is shining through. Do you actually believe the US government had something to do with 9/11? If so, please share why?
rafflaw,
So I guess your gibberish is the far left crap bomb? The right has as much right to voice an opinion as the left.
You are so naive. Do you really believe the general public needs to know every little action the CIA and FBI make? By disclosing certain information about disrupted terror plots, could quite possibly jeopardize others. Oh yeah, but you’re a liberal. You believe the janitor at Microsoft has a right to know everything Bill Gates knows.
As for torture and aggressive interrogation techniques, there is a fine line. But if it saves lives, even liberals, then I’m for it.
You said:
“Plus, you obviously have forgotten who was in charge when we were attacked on 9/11.”
My reply: Well obviously you just discredited your thought process. It is well documented that the planning took years, Bill Clinton was in office and had opportunities to eliminate this scum bag. Let’s all hope Obama isn’t elected, because terrorist will have an opportunity to build up and plan another attack on our soil. God forbid!
Why, exactly, is it that you are so angry that you feel you must torture, debase, and hold prisoners for years without any rights
while it is a bright, shining lie that Iraq is connected to 9/11.
9/11…a NeoCon Pearl Harbor. Sadly you continue to buy into their lies while they laugh at you because you are sheep-like and stupid.
NeoCons are white collar criminals clothed in choir robes. Nothing more nothing less.
They instill you with fear so they can steal you blind…they get deferments so you can fight, ignore Katrina victims because they mostly vote democratic, go to war with the army you have, an army that has to make its own armor, an army that is fed dirty water, an army that is given experimental drugs, an army exposed to depleted uranium from US armament, an army kept on active duty tour after tour, an army that never leaves, never returns home just “Something that’s not important”, vets that go homeless waiting for benefits, vets that rot in outsourced VA hospitals.
Add that wonderful slogan, if you don’t believe any of their crap, you are not Patriotic. You hate America.
Don’t ever forget that your statements put you in league with these people…you are what they are.
Wow,
I think this site is being attacked with a far right crap bomb. You don’t have to be in the military to know that torture is not effective. Just ask Colin Powell who has said it doesn’t work. Just ask the FBI that refused to use the techniques and reported the abuse up the ladder when they witnessed it. The Army Field Manual outlaws torture. The United States has laws against torture and we have signed international agreements outlawing torture. If torture has worked, why won’t the Bush Administration tell us the details. If they already stopped the alleged acts of terror, they should be able to disclose the acts and provide us the proof. The Bush Administration has already declassified information to out a covert CIA agent for pure political gain, so declassifying the terror plots that they have stopped should be no problem for them. Plus, you obviously have forgotten who was in charge when we were attacked on 9/11. And where is Osama Bin Laden?? Bush couldn’t care less because he was too busy in Iraq. All of you neocon wannabees should join the CIA and get involved in the torture. Oh, wait a minute, I forgot that the CIA has reportedly stopped these abusive techniques. Maybe you can just practice waterboarding on each other to maintain your edge.
oh okay you get to say what you want and your opinions, then the conversation is over? What does Fox News have to do with this? I am so sick of people, and I won’t say liberals because I am a liberal person, saying that anyone who doesn’t agree with them is misinformed. I never said that any of the terrorists had anything to do with Iraq, I said I am not sure about your claim that they didn’t. Actually I don’t think it was ever proven who they were working for, except that they were terrorists. You say you are offended about being accused of insulting the soldiers? Then stop doing it. You are insulting their intelligence by saying that they are willingly holding innocent people in prison. Congrats on your nephew in the military. I am sure that he loves the fact that you send care packages, put a yellow ribbon on your car and then go on-line complaining about actions his fellow military comrades are doing. Putting a yellow ribbon on your car is nothing if there is no meaning behind it. Soldiers and civilians alike are working like hell to get the right information to the proper people so that just decisions can be made, and I hope you are aware of the paperwork involved and of the analyzing of information given that must be done in order to detain individuals on terrorism charges. By saying that they are innocents who are unlawfully detained YOU are criticizing the military soldiers and civilians who obtained the information to hold the prisoners. The CIA is not the only ones who get information you know and their information is not the sole reason for holding the prisoners.
Only in AMERICA can we have these sort of conversations and no be worried about being shot or our family threatend in some way….THIS IS WHAT AMERICA IS ALL ABOUT….FREEDOM!!!
FastMovingCloud,
You said:
“Even CIA experts doubt that more than one third of those being held are actually involved in terror. So, about 70% of those we have held for 7 years or more have done absolutely nothing and should not be held. They have been tortured too. That’s the point. It’s not just the guilty that are suffering.”
My reply: So now you’re giving the CIA credit for correct information? How often have you critized them for providing wrong information to the President? Isn’t this part of the reason you’re saying Bush lied to the soldiers and Iraq? Huh, if it fits your agenda use it, if it doesn’t discount it. THAT is the liberal way!
FASTMOVINGCLOUD,
See you and I have a very diffrent opion of things. I have been around and involved in the Military all of my life, my Grandfathers both were lifers, my father, uncles, aunts, brother-n-law and Husband are all soldiers, so yes I understand how most soldiers feel about torture, thats why we dont practice torture! They also feel if interrigation is necassry to do to get infromation, then it will be done, and its not always soldiers that do the interrigation! They have been trained on tactics much like the FBI, CIA, or any police force, its not just any soldier told “hey privite go interrigate that combatant.” There are procedures, special trained individuals, and leagle methods used.
There were a few select individuals that choose to do the wrong thing either because they were sick, board individuals, or just plain stupid, who went agaist more than one policy and got caught in the act, and were punished by military courts. And by the way it was fellow soldiers that turned them in! The liberal thinkers out there try to lead other to think, “this is what all military is practicing” and its simply not true! Much as the same thinkers that spit on Veitnam vets returning from that war, called them “baby killers”, things of that nature.
Active Duty Soldiers are highly trained individuals,They train most of the year, are made to take class’s that not only pertain to their job duties but saftey, sexual harrassment, mental awarness, ect.. these men and women are tought to look out for one another. They are Professionals in what they do for a living, its more than a job to them, and they take what they do seriously, its not a game to them. They all want to come home in one peice. The last thing they want is to be shown or thought of as dumb, stupid, mean, uncaring individules, that dont know their jobs and just want to kick the crap out of an Iraq citizen for fun.
No I have never been detained in my life, then again I have never threatened to blow up or kill another living human being either! I am sorry, these people know what they are being held for, and they are being held because they have stated they want to kill AMERICANS! I do feel for their family’s, they are the innocent ones in all of this, much the same as our Soldeirs familys are! Just say we let one or 10 of these individuals go, we find them being held for no reason, then in a month from now we find out they walked onto a military post in the middle east and detonated a bomb, killing not only our soldiers but their own people then what??? What do you say to those people, I am sorry we were mistaken???
Can you tell that they are innocent, do you know for certain they are innocent people, would you take them into your home for a year, sort of like a probation period to make sure they are ok and not a terrorist? I wouldnt…So when they hold our Soldiers, or people from the press for no other reason than being in the country and having a AMERICAN uniform on, and then torture and kill them on tape, thats diffrent how? We are suppose to just forgive all that? We are not killing these combatants, we are not taping the killings and then showing to all of AMERICA..they are getting three hot meals a day, a bed a shower, any and all religous items they ask for, and now AMERICAN support with leagle issues, and they are not AMERICANS. Meanwhile our soldiers are lucky to get three hot meals a day, let alone a shower when they like. We are helping to clean up dead bodies in the streets of IRAQ when some nut decides to blow something up. Our soldiers are away from family for motnhs at a time, sometime with very little communication from home. Day in and day out sent out in harms way, never knowing if today is the day they might not make it back to the FOB, and this isnt a form of being held against your will, detained so to speak…torture is seeing dead bodys, that maybe yesterday you were talking with on the street. Or pulling a buddy from a blown up truck, and knowing you will never see them again.
Untill you have lived it, been there, had things such as this happen to you, and maybe you have…please dont say that these individules that are being held are inoccent of anything, if you can prove it then prove it, if not just keep it to yourself, becuse unless you have proof its just BS….
Well, I just read Donna’s most recent comment. The fact that you think Iraq had anything to do with 9/11 convinces me that I have wasted my time even trying to have a discussion with you. Only Fox viewers still believe that Iraq was involved and they refuse to give up on that lie. So, I’m finished! Continue spewing, if you must, but you will get no further responses from me as you are obviously fact-free!
Donna,
How exactly would you go about determining which detainees are guilty and should be tortured and which are innocent? Would you use torture to find out? Even CIA experts doubt that more than one third of those being held are actually involved in terror. So, about 70% of those we have held for 7 years or more have done absolutely nothing and should not be held. They have been tortured too. That’s the point. It’s not just the guilty that are suffering.
And, I have never for one damn minute accused any of our troops of being “monsters” and very seriously resent the accusation. I have a nephew who is on his third tour of duty and he is not a monster. He is disgusted with the way this theater has been sold and mismanaged and is exhausted but he continues to do, in good faith, what is asked of him. It’s the good faith part with which I take exception. Our soldiers have been lied to, too. I actually support the troops in more than just rhetoric and a ribbon on my car. I send care packages, not just for him but for eveyone in his unit. Just because they are good people making the best of a truly bad situation, doesn’t mean that we should be torturing innocent prisoners, along with the guilty.
Jill,
You said:
“The cheney administration is very scared of this report. Obviously they have sent minions to get out their talking points on this blog and many other places today.”
One other thing. You make the comment in your paranoid state of mind, that you believe Cheney Admin. has sent out people to refute these stories. I’m sure this happens a lot. But where did you come from with your extreme left views???? What you’re saying is, you can spew your views on sites like this as long as they are in line with the left.
You’re right, INTERESTING!
Very interesting!
John,
You missed my point.
You said:
We used to be a civilized nation. We used to be the greatest generation.
My reply: We are the most civilized nation and we are the greatest generation. Look at the billions of dollars of aid for other countries. Look at all the military support we provide all over the world. Come on rethink your view. Look at the bigger picture here.
Jill,
Why would the administration be scared? Sounds a little paranoid to say that I am a minion just because I believe in our soldiers and their decisions that are made.
Yes there was a problem with Iraq before 9/11, no one denied that. I am not sure about your claim that the terrorists, which they were terrorists, had no affiliation with Iraq. Are you claiming that they weren’t actually terrorists? Did they just decide to fly a plane into the World Trade Center for fun? No, not all terrorists are from Iraq, but most hate the U.S. Using the words torture instead of interrogation, is tricky in the second point you made. Many techniques were used in the interrogations at Guantanamo Bay, and information was obtained as I said earlier. Just because whatever media influence that you have has claimed that no information was obtained doesn’t make it true. Be careful not to fall into the false notion that our soldiers are against the country and the people of the United States by using inhumane techniques to obtain life saving information. Have you heard about the many arrests of terrorists made by our government? The information about the guilty people involved was obtained from somewhere, and I don’t think it was given freely, or with the promise of a lollipop at the end.
Jill,
5. Torture started at the top. The order to engage in torture came from the whithouse.
My reply: And what proof do you have? Must be from an extreme left wing blogger.
6. Acts of torture and debasemnet were not isolated incidents. They were routine.
My reply again: And what proof do you have?
7. Speaking the truth about what happened is not a sign of disrespect for our troops. Some people are just sadistic. most people are not. Many people will do things they would not ordinarly do when they are in a situation where their superiors are telling them it’s O.K., no one listens to their objections and they can be isolated for not following those orders, (which they were often falsely told, were legal).
My reply: Huh???? What??
Do you honestly believe Cheney cares about this left wing study? Come on.
1. None of the 9/11 hijackers were from Iraq. Iraq had no connection to the attack of 9/11. President cheneybush spoke of going to war against Iraq from the beginning of their administration, long before the attacks of 9/ll.
My reply; So what you’re saying is, because 9/11 hijackers were not from Iraq, we shouldn’t go to war with Iraq? So we should allow Hussein to run his sword through Kuwait and his own people? It’s so funny how liberals forget things. Look up the history of Iraq since the early 80’s.
2. Torture has never been shown to be a necessary condition for obtaining accurate information. In fact, it is quite unlikely to lead to this, as many studies have shown.
My reply: What studies are you referring to?
3. There are evil people in the world who hate Americans and would/have gleefully cut off our heads and tortured us at a moments’ notice. This fact leaves us with a moral decision to make. Who are we? What is our moral value system? Who do we become in the face of fear?
My reply: We are a country that stands up for the people that can’t defend themselves. That is who we are. Liberals always complain about our foreign policy, but we need to be involved with and in other countries. Our presence is a deterrent in unstable regions.
4.It further leaves us with a legal question. Is suspending the constitution the one and only correct response to this situation?
My reply: Our constitution is a remarkable document, because 99% of it still applies today. But there has been changes. Look at the amendments. Our Founding Fathers had no idea what 9-11 would entail.
5. Torture started at the top. The order to engage in torture came from the whithouse.
6. Acts of torture and debasemnet were not isolated incidents. They were routine.
7. Speaking the truth about what happened is not a sign of disrespect for our troops. Some people are just sadistic. most people are not. Many people will do things they would not ordinarly do when they are in a situation where their superiors are telling them it’s O.K., no one listens to their objections and they can be isolated for not following those orders, (which they were often falsely told, were legal).
The constitution and our ethics have to stand in difficult times. Keeping them in our hearts is easy when no demands are placed on us. They become most relevant when it is the most difficult to stand by them.
oh, of course I have a problem with detaining innocent people indefinitely. Innocent being the key word. For your information Fox new isn’t one of my favorite news shows but I do look at both sides and I don’t jump to the conclusion that our soldiers are all monsters so readily without the whole picture, like you seem to have. If there were people who wrongly tortured innocents then I am sure that our government will take care of that and punish those who did so. I trust that we have a just government.
Of course they have tortured US citizens. AND IT IS WRONG! If we also do it, we give them the authority to do it. (Eye for an eye, tooth for a tooth) This is neener neener, you hit me so I can hit you, so you can hit me so I can hit you so you can hit me mentality I see among 5 year olds. We are better than that. We used to be a civilized nation. We used to be the greatest generation.