Reports indicate that Attorney General Eric Holder is close to naming a prosecutor to look into interrogation abuse, but that he is going to structure the investigation to protect high-ranking officials from investigation for war crimes. While Holder admits that waterboarding is torture, he is reportedly going to allow only the investigation into whether some interrogations went beyond the torture guidelines set by the Justice Department — which allowed for waterboarding.
The investigation is being described as “narrow” and would exclude torture permitted by the Justice Department. It is a towering example of the conflict of interest in the Justice Department handling this investigation. The first thing that it will do is reaffirm its own legal analysis permitting the commission of a well-defined war crime.
It would essentially punish people who “tortured too much,” a standard that is not only shameful but in clear violation of our international obligations. It also reaffirms (as the Obama Administration has done before) that “just following orders” is now viewed by the United States as a viable defense to war crimes.
For the full story, click here.
Dear Buddha,
I had to laugh. After reading the story, but before seeing your comment, I thought to myself, this is just the kid of story that got me in trouble with Turley for using foul language a few months ago. There will be no rule of law anymore. Perhaps there never was for those with enough money.
Was Nixon really that bad? Watergate seems quaint compared to what went on with W. and the white-washing we all knew was coming.
And after you send the ACLU video to Holder send money to the ACLU.
Oliver Stone has put together a reading of the torture memos which is quite powerful (link below). This was done in conjunction with ACLU who is urging full prosecutions under the law. There is a link to some possible actions to take to ensure we honor our Constitution by prosecuting not just a few at the bottom, but those who authorized and tried to legally sanction torutre. Hearing these memos spoken makes clear the cruelty and gravity of what the president and vice president wanted done to other people, and what hacks they hired to try to justify it. It would be a great video to play at Yoo’s class each and every day.
“Send this video to Attorney General Holder and demand that he appoint an independent prosecutor to investigate those who committed and authorized torture — wherever the evidence leads.”
http://www.aclu.org/torturedlogic/
Fe Fi Fo Fum I smell a nasty Troll Dumb. I did not vote for Obama nor McCain. I did vote though. Looks like your stuck. What will you do without Cheney to guide you. Oh yeah you still have addicted Rush. Hum and you probably complained about Bill not inhaling!
Do all of you who believe there should be mass prosecutions all the way to Bush feel the same way about the New Black Panthers who blocked voting places last November in the Philadelphia. These guys intimidated voters by carrying police style nightsticks. They were indicted, but Mr. Holder has decided to not pursue prosecution. Why not? Why is this violation of election laws and denial of the right to vote any edifferent from the “torture” to which several posters refer. And for any of those who say Gitmo ought to be shut down right now, please tell me which of the detainees you will be taking into your own household?
Given that Obama has faced not one tough question from the media in now over three years of campaigning and being in office, I conclude that he conned many independents last year into believeing he was a “moderate.” That was the change independents voted for, not the left-wing idealogue and America-hating nitwit that has emerged since January. I am certain that all those independents now regret their votes. Is it any wonder that Obama’s approval numbers are dropping like a rock? These voters finally realize the “con job” and “are mad as hell and not going to take it anymore.”
This story is a trial balloon. I believe this to be a serious plan of Obama’s because it is entirely in keeping with his method of making the illegal, legal. It would benefit the administration to do these selective prosecutions but they will have to make some deals to do it. First of all, no one is going down on this unless they get a substantial reward. This would mean a short or non-existenet prison term for tens of millions of dollars. They will have to offer a deal because any CIA or MI or etc. or mercenary personel will immediately bring the OLC memos and Bush and Cheney into the court case (as well they should). Someone is always desperate for money, so I suspect they could make the deal and have the faux “prosecutions”.
These “prosecutions” will serve Obama well. I give him snaps for making lemonade out of lemons. Our law is quite clear. It isn’t illegal to waterboard after three free tries, it’s illegal period. All the techniques of torture will have shifted from being illegal to legal under the careful guidance of the fine attys. at the OLC. As JT pointed out, it will redefine the law in the use of, “I was just following orders”, for the first time in any war crimes trial of the modern era. These trials are a real danger to the rule of law and they should not be allowed to go forward with these restrictions. They will make torture legal. We should not allow this as a society. I think a general strike is a good idea, (for one). I don’t think we should follow the methods of the 60’s in the US because they are no longer effective. It is time to look at other cultures and other histories, as well as our own during the depression. Many cultures have faced down dictators. We should learn from them. The govt. is not as prepared for dealing with the push back we can learn from other societies or further back in time in our own.
Certainly pressure for a full on, independent investigation is warrented. Letting them believe they can get away with the plan outlined/leaked as a trial balloon would be a big mistake.
The special prosecutor may get all mavericky with it and like a Supreme Court Justice, kick over the traces a bit?
They would not have the nubs to fire him or her if so.
So, be warned Eric & The Holding Co., chose a true sycophant or you will sweat.
Here’s another example fo why the Obama administration may turn out to be EVEN WORSE than the Bush admnistration
Obama’s EPA plans final cleanup work at fewer toxic waste sites than did Bush’s
DINA CAPPIELLO
Associated Press Writer
5:35 AM PDT, August 10, 2009
WASHINGTON (AP) —For years, the Bush administration was criticized for not cleaning up enough of the nation’s most contaminated waste sites. The Obama administration plans to do even less.
Environmental groups and some Democratic lawmakers railed against President George W. Bush’s cleanup record. But this time, they’re shying away from speaking out against a popular president who’s considered an ally in the fight to clean up the environment.
In Obama’s first two years in office, the Environmental Protection Agency expects to begin the final phase of cleanup at fewer Superfund sites than in any administration since 1991, according to budget documents and agency records. The EPA estimates it will finish construction to remove the last traces of pollution at 20 sites in 2009 and 22 sites in 2010.
During the eight years of the Bush administration, the agency finished construction at 38 sites on average a year.
http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/politics/wire/sns-ap-us-toxic-cleanups-obama,1,1100668.story
I know deep down,no one is really surprised.
From the actual LA Times article:
“Current and former CIA and Justice Department officials who have firsthand knowledge of the interrogation files contend that criminal convictions will be difficult to obtain because the quality of evidence is poor and the legal underpinnings have never been tested.”
These former CIA and DOJ people worked under Bush and some might say have a vested interest.
“I don’t blame them for wanting to look into it,” said a former high-ranking Justice Department official familiar with the details of the program. “But if they appoint a special prosecutor, it would ultimately be unsuccessful, and it would go on forever and cause enormous collateral damage on the way to getting that unsuccessful result.”
Again, a former DOJ official who worked under Bush and may indeed be culpable
“Current and former U.S. officials interviewed for this article spoke on condition of anonymity because of the secrecy that still surrounds Holder’s deliberations and the details of the interrogation files.”
Of course we should trust them because after all they seem to agree with our already decided opinions.
I’ve read the entire article and it has all the gravitas of an article explaining why Brad broke up with Jen to go to Angelina, but is now returning to Jen. The article is totally gossip, whichever way you look at it and as such for it to be a topic of debate is ludicrous. Shouldn’t we all be tired by now of the leaking by anonymous officials game, whether it is played by the Administration, anti-Administration, or those with something to hide? Like President Obama, hate him, or all the gradations in between, I don’t care and that is not the issue. The real issue is that people should start to look askance at all political reportage as it is produced in this country and realize that the “inside source/anonymous official” and the entire leak game is just a method of propaganda and manipulation. Also one must consider the source and that source is the LA Times. Do some research about it and come back and tell me whether or not it is a paper of journalistic probity.
This is like prosecuting the enforcer rather than his mob boss.
That is criminal negligence and I’m not even an attorney. Anyone can read law at the law library.
As an American, I demand full prosecution of Bushists. The alternative is not going to be pretty. There are literally millions of Progressives who will make sure this gets finished.
And no, I’m not going for the piecemeal strategy for the sake of 2010 elections. Should Holder not prosecute each and every conspirator-torturer at the highest levels, he should expect a short term as AG.
Go ahead, try us. The administration ignores the fact that we are very close to revolution and that we will use the Internet and alternate telephonic systems to get organized and deployed in the open, all in the slack-jawed government’s face. We want to be seen coming.
Government computer hacks should know we are much smarter than they and outnumber the military 10:1 which I might add could actually stand with the People and the Constitution over governmental lawlessness.
Don’t even think of trying to shut us down. That option will likely produce an instant general strike and total shutdown of commerce.
The Administration has no option but to prosecute the Bushists in entirety. The recovery will depend on whether or not justice is served and served fully.
Mr. Holder,
Thanks to the U.S. and its use of torture, other countries like Iran are quickly following the U.S. example. But of course, they say no one died, so all is well that ends well…
_________________________________
Iran admits election demonstrators were tortured
Senior police commander says head of Tehran prison dismissed after evidence of abuse but denies anyone died
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/aug/09/iran-protesters-torture-election
_________________________________
Hello professor and others.
I am truly saddened/ outraged by this turn of events. I didnt vote for Obama, knowing that like most other presidents over the past 50 years or more, he was controlled by others who’s interests are not our own. I did hope a little that perhaps I was wrong and that we would see some change. Change is for suckers in the world of American politics. Is there no way these jokers can be impeached for this travesty?
On another note, I would love to get your thoughts on the momentous case of FBI whistleblower Sibel Edmonds, the ‘most gagged woman in American History.’ Just yesterday she was allowed to testify under oath and in public about corruption and blackmail of US congress. The Bush administration had gagged her using the bogus State’s Secrets order. The MSM has been typically quiet about it which is unbelievable given what info she put out. Only Bradblog is covering it. Please Please pick up this story. Patriots need to hear.
Added to a neutered Health Care bill, this conspired negligence designed to shield Bushists is unacceptable, it looks and smells unAmerican to the core.
Why is Obama doing this to America, subsequent generations, and to himself? Does he not know he will be gone in three if either responsibility isn’t fully satisfied?
Shall we begin with a general strike and go all out serious from there until he gets it, let it go and begin delegate selection for a C.C., begin the impeachment process, or all three?
It’s up to Obama. He can’t truly believe we would allow Holder to break the law without a severe response.
Think Jefferson and start summoning the courage to act like citizen-revolutionaries in the absence of leadership.
It would essentially punish people who “tortured too much,” …
Doesn’t Holder’s reasoning fall into the same category as “a little bit pregnant”? And how can you prosecute those who tortured without punishing those who ordered it?
The majority of this country voted for change, for restoring the constitution, and for a return to reason and accountability. That the new president now wants to “move forward” and not “dwell on the past” and stand behind an AG who wants to protect those who condoned torture is appalling. One might say they are still very much “dwelling on the past” by continuing the policies of the past administration.
THIS IS TREASON!
OBAMA AND HOLDER ARE TRAITORS AND WAR CRIMINALS!
OBAMA, HOLDER, ET AL NEED TO BE ARRESTED AND PROSECUTED!
To Buddha Is Laughing
You’ve said it all
I apologize to you in advance, Prof.
ERIC HOLDER!
SCREW YOU, FASCIST JACKASS! That goes for your lying sack of crap “we respect the rule of law” boss too. Way to wipe yourself with the Constitution. Did you learn that from Gonzo?
It’s now time to dismantle both parties and reclaim the government for We the People.
Anyone with an R or D affiliation should not only be run from office, they should be made social outcasts and pariahs.
My loyalty to the U.S. dies with the Constitution.
Thanks for telegraphing the coup de grace, Eric. And from me and my grandfather’s ghost a very sincere “Go fornicate yourself, traitor.”
When the feces hits the rotating oscillator, I’ll make sure your name is kept right out in front as an aider and abbetor to treason.
At the risk of getting banned but come on Huck:
http://books.google.com/books?id=goT5k4XX8o0C&dq=huck+and+tom+painting+the+fence&printsec=frontcover&source=bl&ots=5F8GhyYRyb&sig=Ztg0aTyko6UeLmFOCV-B238WYtw&hl=en&ei=xBWASp-hL4_UNeSo_e4C&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1#v=onepage&
q=&f=false
Mespo727272, this ones for you.
tom and huck want to paint a fence. tom can paint the fence by himself in 3 hours; huck can paint the fence by himself in 4 hours. at noon, they start painting the fence together. at some point, they fight for 10 minutes, and no painting gets done. after the fight, huck leaves and tom paints alone. if tom finishes painting at 2:25 pm, at what time did the fight begin?
Narrator : Max is watching Tom paint
the fence. Suddenly, Tom
had an idea.
Tom : You know what, Max?
Max : What?
Tom : Painting is fun.
Max : Really? It seems so. Can I try?
Tom : Well, maybe. (Looking like
thinking)
Max : Please, Tom. Let me paint the
fence.
I’ll give you my new blue marble.
Tom : Oh, really? I like painting a lot.
But you’re my friend and I like
you.
Go ahead. (Giving his brush)
Max : Thank you, Tom. You’re my
friend.
Narrator : Soon other friends saw Max.
Friend 1 : Hey, Max! Hi, Tom!
Link:
http://www.pearson.co.kr/bookinfo/CD_HHH/PDF/7_PlayScript/7_L6_PlayScript.pdf