Dr. Jack Cassell, 56, a Mount Dora urologist and a registered Republican, left a message for Obama supporters on his door: heal thyself or at least find a doctor elsewhere.
Cassell posted a sign reading “If you voted for Obama…seek urologic care elsewhere. Changes to your healthcare begin right now, not in four years.” Personally, I am not sure I want a proctological exam with a guy who is really pissed off at Democrats and liberals. Hint: when you visit Dr. Cassell bring a copy of Rush Limbaugh on tape, the exam goes much smoother.
Curiously, Cassell insists that telling Obama supporters to “seek urologic care elsewhere” is not denying them care: “I’m not turning anybody away — that would be unethical. But if they read the sign and turn the other way, so be it.”
This raises an interesting question. It would seem unethical to deny care based on political beliefs but state law only addresses race, religion,
gender, sexual preference or disability. However, as an ethical matter, it would seem rather clear but I am but a juris doctor.
To further his unique combination of politics and proctology, Cassell supplies copies of a health-care timeline produced by Republicans and added a sign that reads “This is what the morons in Washington have done to your health care. Take one, read it and vote out anyone who voted for it.”
For the full story, click here.
Byron,
I wouldn’t recommend putting too much stock in the words contained on a Wikipedia page. Those words didn’t even appear on the page until Dec. 22nd 2009. They were added by user “BHenry1969”. A quick review of the contributions to Wikipedia by this user indicates that he/she spends much of his/her time editing Wikipedia pages. Most of the users other contributions had nothing to do with the accurate reporting of history.
Here’s a link to the “BHenry1969” contributions. They go back into 2007.
http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Contributions&dir=prev&limit=500&target=BHenry1969
When looking at information on Wikipedia (especially contributions that do not quote the cited author, but are the user’s own words) look to the source. A citation that is not quoted is the users summary. If the user supplies no credentials, it should be given no weight.
While Wikipedia is fine for directing people to a place where they can get some general information, it should never be relied upon as a definitive source.
Careful, Byron.
You’re attracting some “interesting” companions.
Byron*
Bryon: yeah, Hayek sorts it out nicely.
Byron,
“How is posting the 25 tenants of National Socialism in an effort to prove my point about whether or not the Nazis were socialists propaganda? It is their party platform. They appear to be a cross between Neo-cons and Neo-dems.”
No shit?
Then I suggest you re-read this definition of Nazism real careful, Byron.
“Nazism (Nationalsozialismus, National Socialism) was the ideology and practice of the Nazi Party and of Nazi Germany. It was a unique variety of fascism that involved biological racism and anti-Semitism. Nazism presented itself as politically syncretic, incorporating policies, tactics and philosophies from right- and left-wing ideologies; in practice, Nazism was a far right form of politics.” [cites omitted][emphasis added for the hard of understanding]
First, there are roughly 600,000 words in the English language. I do not expect you to know all of them, but are you familiar with the word syncretic? Or did you do (and in all fairness 99.9% of people would make this error) hit a word you didn’t know the meaning of and just keep on trucking?
syn·cre·tism \ˈsiŋ-krə-ˌti-zəm, ˈsin-\, n.
1 : the combination of different forms of belief or practice
2 : the fusion of two or more originally different inflectional forms
syn·cre·tist \-tist\ n., adj.
syn·cre·tis·tic \ˌsiŋ-krə-ˈtis-tik, ˌsin-\ adj.
It is clear then by the definition I first provided, it is correct by your own admission.
“And how does saying the Jews were German change anything? The Nazis were virulently anti-Semitic and used the Jews as a whipping boy to further their agenda.”
Because it illustrates what divisiveness was utilized for by the Nazis. To use an internal population to ostracize and vilify as “the other”. Like tea baggers and racists. It’s a tactic as old as the Greeks.
os·tra·cize
Pronunciation: \-ˌsīz\, t.v.
Etymology: Greek ostrakizein to banish by voting with potsherds,
1 : to exile by ostracism
2 : to exclude from a group by common consent
It’s called scapegoating in modern parlance and applies to the alienation of political enemies real, imagined or created for an end – like leading a populace into war.
The road to Germany’s aggression was paved two-fold:
1) with the vilification of the Jews as somehow being the root of Germany’s economic and social problems (when in fact those were results of the loss of WWI and the subsequent draconian restrictions placed on the country as punishment) and
2) the idea of German exceptionalism as an excuse to bring “all Germanic peoples” under the rule of the Reich by doing things like . . . invading Poland.
The road to America’s aggression was paved two-fold:
1) the vilification by the Far Right of all of Islam as somehow being responsible for 9/11 when it was in fact only that most radical of theocratic states, Saudi Arabia. FACT: not a single Iraqi was involved in the planning or execution of 9/11. But they sure had that oil that Bush’s buddies wanted, didn’t they?
2) the idea that “we’ll bring democracy to the Middle East!” Bullshit. Democracy is like true happiness – it can only come from within. If the idea is superior (which democracy is far and away better than theocratic despotism), it will eventually win out.
To be clear here, in the battle for the soul of American democracy and the ideals of the Declaration, I don’t seek the exclusion of conservatives like yourself from debate or even duh but rather to render your modes of operation obsolete by illustrating your tactics are a destructive and self-fulfilling prophecy – in your misguided attempts to “protect your individual rights” you are inviting despotism and tyranny and, eventually, anarchy. And let’s be clear about anarchy – uncertainty is a bad thing. In the instant case, anarchy by encouraging fascism by your childish notions that corporations and free markets should be above the law. This country is founded upon the principle that the rule of law is not only prime but that it applies to ALL. Including the wealthy. Including the artificial “persons” that are the legal fiction of corporations.
See the above previously provided definition of fascism and how it relates to the Jews. A definition which, despite your insane protestations, is 100% accurate. But the bottom line about the tactic is this: it weakens a state whether used for democratic or despotic purposes as it fosters the illusions that there are “others” when in fact we are all one – travelers on Spaceship Earth.
“It is there in black and white for you to read, it isn’t their propaganda it is their core set of beliefs.”
B, a political platform is by definition propaganda. That is why one defines a political system not by it’s stated function, but it’s actual function. Which is why Nazis are fascists, not socialists.
“If you want to call them Fascist go ahead and be my guest but I would be careful to do that, Duh was pointing out that many of their policies are part of our government.”
Again, no shit?
How many times do I have to explain the relationship between K St. graft and corruption until it gets through your skull? I’ve said before that the fascists, on the Left and the Right, have caused our current situation – Bush drove the car into the ditch (for personal profit in the business world) and the Obama set the car on fire (by letting graft influence his decision not to hold the unconstitutional war criminals of the previous administration accountable for their crimes).
I’ve said it before so I’ll say it again: Graft is the cause of corruption in both parties as it is where the rubber of monied special interests meets the road of corruption and the usurpation of the legislature from acting on behalf of citizen voters and placing that representation in solely in the hands of THOSE WHO PAY BRIBES (corporate and wealthy individual campaign contributions) TO FURTHER CONSOLIDATE “THEIR POWER” – which consists of nothing more than their own ego worship and self-estimated over valuation of their worth to society and as ethical humans while ignoring their simple and base greed. Greed, which by it’s nature, means you are taking from others. If you take enough, from enough people, they will rise and kill you where you sleep be you King, President or Prominent Industrialist. This is the exact kind of elitist arrogance that led to Louis and Marie losing their heads. And pay attention to that part about ethical, because the goal of the Founding Fathers wasn’t just a secular representative democratic government but a government that worked toward to good of all and not just whims of the wealthy. The wealthy, who by in large, are interested in only one thing: money and how they can get more of it, screw who gets in their way.
Let them eat cake!
Byron, you insist in siding with the Right and demonizing the Left. Trollish stupidity (no matter which side instigates it) and quite frankly I expect better from an intelligent person like yourself. The enemy is extremism, be it economic or political philosophy, be it from either “side”. Extreme communism (the Far Left) was an failure. Extreme capitalism (aka fascism, the Far Right) is failing right now.
Now maybe you can see why I’ve called that partisan shell game bullshit from the start. Why I have no party affiliation or loyalty but rather describe myself as a Jeffersonian Constitutionalist. Maybe now you will see why actual socialism is neither but simply a middle path that seeks to put social safeguards in place that ensure the health and stability of ALL society, not just the plutocrats.
Probably not as you too are blinded by your own love of money and the propaganda of the far right fascists you so willingly swallow. The Bible may have a lot of suspect bullshit in it, but one thing they got right was this: “For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.” 1 Timothy 6:10 (KJV). And if you’ve proven anything over the last few days it’s that you love your money.
You keep living in that dreamland where you can justify your greed as capitalism like capitalism is an excuse for evil as long as someone profits, preferably you.
You keep living there until it bites you on the ass.
Say “Howdy!” to duh as you are both being frogmarched off to the guillotines along with the PNAC Neocon Nazi pols you are oh so willingly the lap dogs for. Believe it or not, I’m trying to prevent this outcome – not just for your sake – but everyones. As Buddha said, “When we harm another, we harm ourselves.” If you doubt this, then you’ve never known a killer. They are ever damaged afterward unless they are sociopaths or psychopaths – in which case they were damaged to begin with. I know this from not only knowing criminal psychopathic and sociopathic killers, but from knowing that my grandfather – a decent and honorable man I hold in the very highest regard – felt horrible responsibility for his part in helping deliver an atomic weapon that was used on, not the enemy troops, but civilians. As one of the men in “The Pacific” said, “It’s one thing to reconcile what you’ve done with God. It’s another thing to reconcile it with yourself.” But it’s all good for you this time around, isn’t it? Because the war’s blood in not directly on your hands. But make no mistake – there is blood on all our hands until the day Cheney and his PNAC cohorts are tried for high treason as they should be. Justice for all or justice for none.
Anarchy. Make no mistake that is what you are inviting by siding with fascism (call it capitalism if you like, but you are way off the beaten trail here, buddy). Because that’s where the path you are on will lead. Maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow, but when people are hungry enough and tired enough and have taken just one too many rations of your fascist bullshit to not want your blood as payment for the suffering your lot will have (and is) causing them.
The Nazis were fascists in operation, socialists in name only. Deal with it. Or not. Ignorance is a choice. And I’m all about freedom of choice.
[Sidebar – If you are not watching “The Pacific”, you should be. I will watch every episode even though by the end of each one, I feel missing my grandfather like a boat anchor on my heart.]
Tootie:
you are right it really doesn’t matter what you call it, they are basically all the same in that the state is supreme and individuals subservient.
Rut Row, an argument between what is fascism or socialism?
Let a genius settle it:
“The various kind of collectivism,communism, fascism…all differ from…individualism in wanting to organize the whole of society and all its resources…[by]…refusing to recognize autonomous spheres in which the ends of the individuals are supreme. In short, they are totalitarian…”
Friedrich Hayek, Nobel Peace Prize winner, The Road To Serfdom [which is what socialism, which is what Democrats promote which is why I say they are neo-Slave Drivers], page 63.
Obamacare is totalitarian and I’ve said this since the beginning.
And this totalitarianism is what has become of the left in America. When I was young, the left was about freedom and letting people “do their own thing”. It was practically their motto. And the left was about nature and embracing it, not forcing others to.
Their offspring have become the spawn of dictatorship, so much for freedom that masquerades as license.
The democrats are the new totalitarians. Or as Richard Bernstein writes in his book the Dictatorship of Virtue:
“Whereas before the oppressive force came from the political right, and had to do with a particular view of patriotism, standards, and traditional values, the threat of ideological tyranny now comes from the left, and it now has to do with collective guilt, an overweening moralism, and multiculturalism. The danger to such things as free speech and genuine diversity of opinion is no longer due to conservatism; it is due to the triumph of a modish, leftish, moralistic liberalism…”
This is exactly what medical care in America will come to Obamacare.
Good luck if your surgeon finds out which political party you belong too, espeically if you don’t belong to the Communist Party, er, I mean, the Democratic Party.
Good luck to you all and thank the Democrats.
Oh, and this all about death panels, the good doctor is just getting ahead of the game. It has to be about death panels because there is NO money for this as our economy has been destroyed by both parties, in particular the Democrats who have plundered our wealth through welfare (a thing the constitution does not provide) and through the Federal Reserve (another Democratic Party criminal activity).
Nancy Pelosi recently lied when she said health care (government sponsored, obviously) was a “right”. If it is as she claims, then no one can ever be denied any level of health care previously and hitherto available to Americans before the system was taken over by the fascists.
Since that will happen, and she knows it, she is a liar. They all are, except Ron Paul, um, Doctor Ron Paul.
Byron Do you really thing a long term capital gains rate between 5 and 15% is confiscatory? That is the current rate.
Goneville:
How is posting the 25 tenants of National Socialism in an effort to prove my point about whether or not the Nazis were socialists propaganda? It is their party platform. They appear to be a cross between Neo-cons and Neo-dems.
And how does saying the Jews were German change anything? The Nazis were virulently anti-Semitic and used the Jews as a whipping boy to further their agenda.
It is there in black and white for you to read, it isn’t their propaganda it is their core set of beliefs.
If you want to call them Fascist go ahead and be my guest but I would be careful to do that, Duh was pointing out that many of their policies are part of our government. So I will assume then that you agree the following ideas are fascist:
10. The first duty of every citizen must be to work mentally or physically. No individual shall do any work that offends against the interest of the community to the benefit of all.
Therefore we demand:
11. That all unearned income, and all income that does not arise from work, be abolished. [tax capital gains and monies from dividends and bonds]
12. Since every war imposes on the people fearful sacrifices in blood and treasure, all personal profit arising from the war must be regarded as treason to the people. We therefore demand the total confiscation of all war profits.
13. We demand the nationalization of all trusts.
14. We demand profit-sharing in large industries. [this actually isn’t a bad idea but the government has no right to demand anything, kind of like saying you have to purchase something]
15. We demand a generous increase in old-age pensions. [at whose expense, obvious parallel to today]
16. We demand the creation and maintenance of a sound middle-class, the immediate communalization of large stores which will be rented cheaply to small tradespeople, and the strongest consideration must be given to ensure that small traders shall deliver the supplies needed by the State, the provinces and municipalities. [ our government is talking about protecting the middle class. Notice how the state is paramount there is no concern for the individual]
17. We demand an agrarian reform in accordance with our national requirements, and the enactment of a law to expropriate the owners without compensation of any land needed for the common purpose. The abolition of ground rents, and the prohibition of all speculation in land. [over reaching eminent domain without trial or compensation, sounds like Kelo v. CT to me except for the show trial]
18. We demand that ruthless war be waged against those who work to the injury of the common welfare. Traitors, usurers, profiteers, etc., are to be punished with death, regardless of creed or race. [who sets those rules? Sounds like government regulation on steroids]
19. We demand that Roman law, which serves a materialist ordering of the world, be replaced by German common law. [sounds like they want to get rid of their constitution and institute their own]
20. In order to make it possible for every capable and industrious German to obtain higher education, and thus the opportunity to reach into positions of leadership, the State must assume the responsibility of organizing thoroughly the entire cultural system of the people. The curricula of all educational establishments shall be adapted to practical life. The conception of the State Idea (science of citizenship) must be taught in the schools from the very beginning. We demand that specially talented children of poor parents, whatever their station or occupation, be educated at the expense of the State. [this is exactly what is going on in schools today]
21. The State has the duty to help raise the standard of national health by providing maternity welfare centers, by prohibiting juvenile labor, by increasing physical fitness through the introduction of compulsory games and gymnastics, and by the greatest possible encouragement of associations concerned with the physical education of the young. [the parallel is so patent]
22. We demand the abolition of the regular army and the creation of a national (folk) army.
23. We demand that there be a legal campaign against those who propagate deliberate political lies and disseminate them through the press. In order to make possible the creation of a German press, we demand:
(a) All editors and their assistants on newspapers published in the German language shall be German citizens.
(b) Non-German newspapers shall only be published with the express permission of the State. They must not be published in the German language.
(c) All financial interests in or in any way affecting German newspapers shall be forbidden to non-Germans by law, and we demand that the punishment for transgressing this law be the immediate suppression of the newspaper and the expulsion of the non-Germans from the Reich.
Newspapers transgressing against the common welfare shall be suppressed. We demand legal action against those tendencies in art and literature that have a disruptive influence upon the life of our folk, and that any organizations that offend against the foregoing demands shall be dissolved. [and people wonder why conservatives get so upset when censorship of the Internet, talk radio or Fox news comes up. We don’t call for the censorship of the liberal press]
24. We demand freedom for all religious faiths in the state, insofar as they do not endanger its existence or offend the moral and ethical sense of the Germanic race. [so the state determines which religions are acceptable and which are not, there are many in this country who wish to silence Christianity and would given the chance]
The parallels are there and it is rather disturbing that many in this country would, as Duh pointed out, agree with many of these tenants. There are many neo-cons/conservatives that would agree with some of these and there are many neo-dems/democrats that would agree as well.
On the whole I would say our country is closer to Nazi Germany than to our founding based on those 25 points. And democrats and republicans are to blame because in the rush to create a better future they forgot about the individual and his place in society-paramount.
Why you gots to bring me into it boss? I aint dun nuttin
While I’m at it, I’d like to thank you for being today’s bad example. Usually bdaman does that job.
Byron,
goneville has your number in this instance.
You’ve truly gone off the deep end.
And you provide six sources for proving the Nazis weren’t fascist to contest the many more than six I’ve already provided and then I’ll consider going to the attic and digging through my text books. Until then. Dodging the ball is still dodging the ball. Telling me you want me to throw you another six balls is only going to make me laugh. You’ve got plenty. But you’ve just made it clear that plenty is not enough for your capitalist standards. So be as wrong as you like. I’ll still try to stop the American Neocon Nazis when they come to get ya!
Byron,
More importantly, think of how most U.S. citizens would have responded to those 25 points 30 years ago, and how many would respond today. While I don’t think you would find overwhelming support, I think you would find many more people today to be in favor of a number of them. Many more would be in favor with some mild tweaking.
Byron. Thanks for repeating the same lies the Nazi’s told to sell their Fascist dictatorship to a gullible public.
Only one answer to your reprinting of Nazi propagandist material as an argument on your behalf.
The Jews were German people.
Buddha:
then give me the names of a couple of your text books, just pick 6 at random. If I am wrong I am happy to admit it.
But from all the statistics that I have seen the majority of professors are not enlightenment liberals, they may have been up to the mid 70’s but not so much after that.
You are as biased as you say I am about Nazis and socialism. Did you read their 25 points? Sounds like a cross between Neocons (on the immigration) and neo-democrats (on the economics).
We haven’t had capitalism for a very long time, we have had its bastard cousin and that is what is not working. Look at all the regulations, look at the money spent on lobbying, caused I might add by the increase in regulations. Companies are trying to curry favor with elected officials to grant them favors. When the first company gave money to congress to look favorably on their business that was fascism.
You don’t like free markets and I don’t like regulated markets. You think regulated markets prevent graft and corruption and I think they cause corruption. How do you know my version isn’t correct? You don’t, you are making conclusions based on what you have learned, how do you know what you learned is correct?
As you say there are many paths to enlightenment, how do you know you are on the right path? You think greed and selfishness is bad, I don’t care to define it that way. I think self sacrifice is wrong. The philosophy I adhere to has created great wealth and prosperity for most people. The poorest man in America is a rich man in most other countries. I believe individual freedom and free markets are necessary for human beings to function properly.
You have to have consistency in law and economics so that people can make long term plans. It cannot be whimsical. Consistency is not the hobgoblin of small minds when it comes to these. Socialism is not consistent and so people cannot plan for the future.
You believe government to be beneficent, I think it is dangerous. History is on my side.
Byron,
“I hazard a guess that most of those history and poli-sci books were written by Marxists or at least people who lean to the left.”
Totally incorrect. History and law and poli sci instructors come in all political flavors. I had poli sci teachers that marched with MLK and poli sci teachers that were appointed ambassadors by Bush the Original Criminal. Both polar extremes. And the same goes for textbook authors.
You are mistaking cause and effect again too. There is a connection between education and liberalism. It’s the same connection that resulted in the Enlightenment which spawned such terrible people as Thomas Jefferson. The difference between “education” and “liberal education” (without which we’d still be British subjects) is the same difference between “information” and “knowledge”. One is data. the other is data with context. In this case cultural context obtained by comparative studies (which by definition include all sides of any given argument). One cannot derive the best course of action unless one knows as many paths as possible. Education causes liberalism not from inherent bias in instructors as you get that bias from both sides but from exposure to logic and the use of secular ethics as a proper logic based tool for the analysis of right and wrong. It does this by not only showing you “one side of the blade” but both unless you go to some wingnut indoctrination academy like Regents or Oral Roberts which have proven track records of producing substandard performers with (usually Christian right wing) biases so thick they can be cut with a knife. An education that isn’t well rounded, i.e. presents both sides and lets the students decide their own opinions, is only half an education.
And goneville is correct in his assertion that your take that everyone’s knowledge of history except you and blatant revisionists like tea baggers is some how controlled by Marxist is a load of crap. If you should know anything about me by now it’s that I think Marxism was an abject failure as I’ve said a statement similar to this, oh, I don’t know, maybe a hundred times here: Communism failed because it disregarded human nature but capitalism is failing right now because it appeals to the very worst in human nature. I approach history like a science. Always have, always will. Which, ergo, requires objective proof. I provided many sources above that confirm Nazism is indeed a form of fascism. Many more than your Von Mises single data point. Your request to essentially provide you with a list of every book I’ve ever read is also childish reductio ad absurdum. It’s in the high hundreds of titles for those two subjects alone. My degrees are my proof as no credible schools issue them without at a minimum completing the required reading. But in the alternative I’ve given you multiple data points. You’ve given one. Pick up your game. That’s like building a table with one leg. I returned the ball to your court. Multiple balls in fact. And you want to know what books I’ve read. Do you want to know the names of all the women I’ve slept with too? Way to avoid the ball(s)!
You should also know Von Mises is widely considered wrong in academia, including by my Bush ambassador/poli sci instructor who considered him “an extremist cuckoo on par with Marx”. And this guy was somewhere to the right of Attila the Hun. Which, by the way, belies your assumption that Von Mises is not taught and that all professors are liberals – especially in poli sci and law. Von Mises is taught alright. Just not well thought of. Being published in academia does not make one correct. It makes one published. Even Rush Limpbaugh is published. Doesn’t make him any less full of shit. Hell, Hitler was published and look how right he was.
And the attempt to control the definitions is play #2 from the Rove handbook of Neocon Propaganda and General Weaselry. You believe that nonsense about the Nazis not being fascists all you like. You too can be wrong, but don’t try to blow that smoke up my skirt unchallenged. You’re smart enough not to call my logic childish so you ought to be smart enough to know I don’t let bullshit go unchallenged. You find half the number of sources I provided above that say Nazis were socialists and not fascists and then I might consider backing down. Until then? You’re full of shit on your definitions. Plain and simple. Just as wrong as if you thought concrete was bamboo.
“one of the problems with socialism, capitalism is “illegal” but in a capitalist system socialism is not ‘illegal””
Another definition problem. Socialism is capitalism with higher taxes to ensure critical infrastructure important to national survival are maintained independent of the markets as public trusts. Or you can try to tell the owner of Ikea that the Swedes (Socialists) don’t allow capitalism and private property and free markets. He’ll laugh his extremely wealthy laugh right in your face. Of course they allow free markets. Just regulated ones for critical infrastructure like health care. Ikea boy can sell his stuff back home with probably less regulation than he faces here. Let’s go to our ‘best friends’ the Brits. Ask Richard Branson how much the British government stops him from being stupid wealthy as they provide health care for every one. If you can get him off the beach and para-sailing with nude models. “Healthy citizens are the greatest asset any country can have.” – Winston Churchill. FACT: If your people are sick they can’t create, work or fight. So how does monetizing a system critical to national survival benefit us all? It doesn’t is how. It benefits the parasitic insurance companies is all it does.
“Seems to me that is all one needs to know about the 2 systems.” Seems you’re wrong once again too. Half an education is a dangerous thing. “Half knowledge is worse than ignorance.” – Thomas B. Macaulay. You know Tommy, don’t you, B? In legal circles he’s considered the father of Western copyright, that subject so beloved by Capitalist everywhere. There are two ends to a screwdriver. One turns a screw or stabs if you don’t know how to use it properly. The other is only good for beating on things if you don’t know how to turn it.
While we’re at it, goneville was right about the tea baggers central philosophy being “I’ve got mine, Jack!” It’s the one tenant they all do share. Not all of them may be racist per se, but they are all selfish creatures. “No tax money for anyone but me! And I don’t want to pay any taxes!” How about making sure corporations pay taxes no matter where they base their offshore subsidiaries for a start? If you only made GE do that you could pay for de-fucking-luxe health care for every man woman and child who is an American citizen many times over. But no. Let’s stomp our feet and not address the real problem – inequity in tax burdens. However, if greed wasn’t criticism enough since in your myopic eye any amount of greed is excusable if it’s called capitalism, let’s go back to that racism issue. When exactly does racism become a problem for you then if not as a huge if dis-articulate part of a political platform? When the camps go up? When the ovens fire up? Racism is the only damning critique needed to cause all reasoned intelligent and educated (and I mean “well-read and rounded” regardless of degree status) people recoil in horror from the tea baggers. Tacit approval of racists and racism by acceptance is still approval and acceptance. Nazism started with racism as a justification for dehumanization and then industrial mass murder. It doesn’t bother you that that path also led to the deaths of many ill people in the name of eugenics? Like people with CF? Say it doesn’t and I’ll call you a liar because I know you love your children dude. But fringer racists is exactly how Nazism gained hold in Germany. One small mind at a time. List off that Nazi propaganda all you want. The analysis that they were fascists comes from their mode of operation, not what they claimed it to be. I’ve already stipulated they were socialist IN NAME ONLY. Look into the relationship of the Party and those companies I listed. Go on. It’s all well documented. Cozy as bugs in a rug until, as I said, it was too damn late. Unless you think Ferdinand Porsche wanted to go to prison in France for war crimes. Add Daimler-Benz of companies to look into as well. Hitler’s staff car wasn’t a Chevy.
And getting duh to agree with you isn’t going to help your case. Do it if you like, but it’s not going to help. He’s swallowed a logic bomb and can’t get up.
Duh:
what do you think of those 25 points? “Vaguely” familiar arent they?
gONEVILLE:
So please explain to me how the Nazis weren’t socialists? Just because you exclude a group of people doesn’t mean you aren’t socialistic. It is not the kind or amount of people that make an economic theory what it is, it is the theory.
Here are the 25 points of the Nazi Party:
The 25 Points of Hitler’s Nazi Party
1. We demand the union of all Germans in a Great Germany on the basis of the principle of self-determination of all peoples.
2. We demand that the German people have rights equal to those of other nations; and that the Peace Treaties of Versailles and St. Germain shall be abrogated.
3. We demand land and territory (colonies) for the maintenance of our people and the settlement of our surplus population.
4. Only those who are our fellow countrymen can become citizens. Only those who have German blood, regardless of creed, can be our countrymen. Hence no Jew can be a countryman.
5. Those who are not citizens must live in Germany as foreigners and must be subject to the law of aliens.
6. The right to choose the government and determine the laws of the State shall belong only to citizens. We therefore demand that no public office, of whatever nature, whether in the central government, the province, or the municipality, shall be held by anyone who is not a citizen.
We wage war against the corrupt parliamentary administration whereby men are appointed to posts by favor of the party without regard to character and fitness.
7. We demand that the State shall above all undertake to ensure that every citizen shall have the possibility of living decently and earning a livelihood. If it should not be possible to feed the whole population, then aliens (non-citizens) must be expelled from the Reich.
8. Any further immigration of non-Germans must be prevented. We demand that all non-Germans who have entered Germany since August 2, 1914, shall be compelled to leave the Reich immediately.
9. All citizens must possess equal rights and duties.
10. The first duty of every citizen must be to work mentally or physically. No individual shall do any work that offends against the interest of the community to the benefit of all.
Therefore we demand:
11. That all unearned income, and all income that does not arise from work, be abolished.
12. Since every war imposes on the people fearful sacrifices in blood and treasure, all personal profit arising from the war must be regarded as treason to the people. We therefore demand the total confiscation of all war profits.
13. We demand the nationalization of all trusts.
14. We demand profit-sharing in large industries.
15. We demand a generous increase in old-age pensions.
16. We demand the creation and maintenance of a sound middle-class, the immediate communalization of large stores which will be rented cheaply to small tradespeople, and the strongest consideration must be given to ensure that small traders shall deliver the supplies needed by the State, the provinces and municipalities.
17. We demand an agrarian reform in accordance with our national requirements, and the enactment of a law to expropriate the owners without compensation of any land needed for the common purpose. The abolition of ground rents, and the prohibition of all speculation in land.
18. We demand that ruthless war be waged against those who work to the injury of the common welfare. Traitors, usurers, profiteers, etc., are to be punished with death, regardless of creed or race.
19. We demand that Roman law, which serves a materialist ordering of the world, be replaced by German common law.
20. In order to make it possible for every capable and industrious German to obtain higher education, and thus the opportunity to reach into positions of leadership, the State must assume the responsibility of organizing thoroughly the entire cultural system of the people. The curricula of all educational establishments shall be adapted to practical life. The conception of the State Idea (science of citizenship) must be taught in the schools from the very beginning. We demand that specially talented children of poor parents, whatever their station or occupation, be educated at the expense of the State.
21. The State has the duty to help raise the standard of national health by providing maternity welfare centers, by prohibiting juvenile labor, by increasing physical fitness through the introduction of compulsory games and gymnastics, and by the greatest possible encouragement of associations concerned with the physical education of the young.
22. We demand the abolition of the regular army and the creation of a national (folk) army.
23. We demand that there be a legal campaign against those who propagate deliberate political lies and disseminate them through the press. In order to make possible the creation of a German press, we demand:
(a) All editors and their assistants on newspapers published in the German language shall be German citizens.
(b) Non-German newspapers shall only be published with the express permission of the State. They must not be published in the German language.
(c) All financial interests in or in any way affecting German newspapers shall be forbidden to non-Germans by law, and we demand that the punishment for transgressing this law be the immediate suppression of the newspaper and the expulsion of the non-Germans from the Reich.
Newspapers transgressing against the common welfare shall be suppressed. We demand legal action against those tendencies in art and literature that have a disruptive influence upon the life of our folk, and that any organizations that offend against the foregoing demands shall be dissolved.
24. We demand freedom for all religious faiths in the state, insofar as they do not endanger its existence or offend the moral and ethical sense of the Germanic race.
The party as such represents the point of view of a positive Christianity without binding itself to any one particular confession. It fights against the Jewish materialist spirit within and without, and is convinced that a lasting recovery of our folk can only come about from within on the principle:
COMMON GOOD BEFORE INDIVIDUAL GOOD
25. In order to carry out this program we demand: the creation of a strong central authority in the State, the unconditional authority by the political central parliament of the whole State and all its organizations.
The formation of professional committees and of committees representing the several estates of the realm, to ensure that the laws promulgated by the central authority shall be carried out by the federal states.
The leaders of the party undertake to promote the execution of the foregoing points at all costs, if necessary at the sacrifice of their own lives.
Seems like a mixture of nationalism and socialism to me. He mentions all the people so long as they are German.