AEK Athens midfielder Giorgos Katidis is the latest celebrity to embrace that “I’m a moron” defense in the wake of a scandal. In celebration of a goal against Veria last week, Katidis did a Nazi salute. It would be an outrage in any country but the Germans in World War II killed as many as 800,000 of his countrymen — though the precise number has been recently debated. He has now been banned from the national team.
Katidis’ teammates also appear unconcerned by the Nazi salute though Brazilian-born teammate, Roger Guerreiro, looked at him in surprise.
In the aftermath, 20-year-old Katidis insists that he was ignorant of the meaning of the salute. A grown man in a nation occupied by the Nazis had no idea what the salute meant? Really. I am not sure what is worse claiming to be a complete moron without any sense of history or being a fascist loving creep. I find the notion that Katidis never went to a World War II movie, let alone read a history book rather unbelievable.
This is not free speech issue. The team has every right to ban racist and offensive gestures, particularly in a country ravages by the Nazis.
48 thoughts on “Greek Soccer Star Banned Over Nazi Salute”
cross out the “no” in the middle. my proofreading bites.
one of many reasons i no haven’t watched nascar in several years.
Ol’ Ralph (Not Ralph From New Orleans) may be a lot of things, most of them most unflattering to the species, but at least he is consistent. Or it could be a “leftist” plot to get him. Either he’s the worst propagandist in the world or he’s drank so much kool-aid that he only buys pairs of shoes with two right feet. I suppose the two are not mutually exclusive.
Such an inconvenience, raff.
I read that comment too fast to catch the gimmick. Went back and re-read and, yep, you caught what I missed. That kind of thing will get a user banned at most blogs.
as I have said before, those little fact thingies just keep getting in the way of the opinion.
Come on, Ralph. If you’re going to use sockpuppets to manufacture false consensus like a good troll, you shouldn’t use unique (and meaningless) neologisms like that in cross posts.
Really. That’s amateur night.
Plus, it’s highly unlikely to run into two people so close in time, identical in writing style and both equally so stupid about political science as to think the Nazis are anything other than far right on the political spectrum.
And as far as “leftist” nations go? Yeah. That Sweden sure is a shit disturber. Picking on Norway and selling Volvos. Those b@stards.
Thanks for the chuckle though.
The HFF is similar to every other sports sanctioning body around the world. It is neither left or right. However, just as the NASCAR press release regarding Denny Hamlin says, they will not allow their athletes to do or say anything that brings disrepute to the sport. Or cost them fans or sponsors.
Now who is the subcretin? Or “stunod.” Not sure what ‘stunoid’ is, but I hope it’s not contagious.
The soccer team is controlled by the Hellenic Football Federation. The HFF is based in Athens, and operates under the rules of the Fédération Internationale de Football Association (FIFA). The HHF probably can be best compared to sports organizations such as the NCAA, PGA or NBA.
The role of FIFA is one step up from the HFF, being an international sanctioning and rule-making body. In such an organization, the rules of speech can be outlined by the organization not the government. There was one such incident involving a NASCAR driver last week.
NASCAR driver Denny Hamlin made the following comment to a reporter on pit road following the race at Phoenix last week:
NASCAR reacted immediately by fining Hamlin $25,000. NASCAR issued a press release, saying:
Hamlin will not contest the fine, nor was anything said about the First Amendment.
Gene, are you really so stunod? Or are you a subcretin who is merely posturing as a naive twit (assuming you are capable of aspiring to that level)? All the leftist nations have the same commonality. They want authoritarian control, the elimination of freedom, and when they really get the power, to perform wholesale murders—just like the Nazis they idolize. Whether it’s expressed as attempts to ban soda in its mildest form, or beheadings and worse in the extreme leftist muslim nations, it’s all part of the same cancer. YOUR kind of cancer.
Here’s what the Greek Constitution (as enacted in 1975) has to say about freedom of expression:
1. Every person may express and propagate his thoughts orally, in writing and through the press in compliance with the laws of the State.
2. The press is free. Censorship and all other preventive measures are prohibited.
3. The seizure of newspapers and other publications before or after circulation is prohibited.
Seizure by order of the public prosecutor shall be allowed exceptionally after circulation and in case of:
a) an offence against the Christian or any other known religion.
b) an insult against the person of the President of the Republic.
c) a publication which discloses information on the composition, equipment and set-up of the armed forces or the fortifica-tions of the country, or which aims at the violent overthrow of the regime or is directed against the territorial integrity of the State.
d) an obscene publication which is obviously offensive to public decency, in the cases stipulated by law.
4. In all the cases specified under the preceding paragraph, the public prosecutor must, within twenty-four hours from the seizure, submit the case to the judicial council which, within the next twenty-four hours, must rule whether the seizure is to be maintained or lifted; otherwise it shall be lifted ipso jure. An appeal may be lodged with the Court of Appeals and the Supreme Civil and Criminal Court by the publisher of the newspaper or other printed matter seized and by the public prosecutor.
5. The manner in which full retraction shall be made in cases of inaccurate publications shall be determined by law.
6. After at least three convictions within five years for the criminal acts defined under paragraph 3, the court shall order the definitive ban or the temporary suspension of the publication of the paper and, in severe cases, shall prohibit the convicted person from practising the profession of journalist as specified by law. The ban or suspension of publication shall be effective as of the date the court order becomes irrevocable.
7. Press offences shall be subject to immediate court hearing and shall be tried as provided by law.
8. The conditions and qualifications requisite for the practice of the profession of journalist shall be specified by law.
9. The law may specify that the means of financing newspapers and periodicals should be disclosed.”
Just so nobody has to guess anymore. As you can see, it’s quite detailed about freedom of the press, but their law as it applies to individual citizens is as vague as ours and presumably filtered through jurisprudence and laws to shape exceptions like defamation, etc.
I think it is important to recognize that politics is like the prostitution business, always jumping from bedfellow to bedfellow in search of screwing someone for money or position. It’s only a matter of price, and who ends up on top.
Britain fought numerous wars against France but both later joined forces along with Serbia, Italy, Russia and Japan to fight Germany in WWI. Then, Italy and Japan allied with Germany in WWII. Then France, Israel and the UK launced an action into Egypt during the Suez Crisis and it was Blocked politically by Russia and the US. Israel attacked the American ship USS Liberty in ’67. Germany fought along with Britain, the US, and France against the Serbs in Kosovo and on and on and on.
Despite all of this, most ordinary people just wanted to live an ordinary and peaceful life, and would have done so quite well otherwise.
Right on Krakken. Good point. It is good to point that out to a professor of law who knows about the Constitution. This dog agrees with you.
All you’ve really done, Ralph, is display that you are completely and utterly ignorant about political science. “All of the predominently Muslim nations are proponents of the left”? Yeah, those Saudis beheading people and beating their women are sooooooooo liberal. Same goes for the theocratic state of Iran. They’re just a bunch of progressive lil’ snuggle bunnies.
I get the feeling you watch a lot of news, but understand very little of it.
Gene, I never implied that I know that Katidis is ignorant. I merely said that such ignorance would be plausible in his particular case, and then he could easily have learned about the Nazi salute from constant exposure to leftist media–which by its very nature is anti-Semetic.
And as I’ve explained countless times, the leftists ARE the new fascists or Nazis. All of the predominently Muslim nations are proponents of the left, as are Argentina and Cuba. And they all hate Jews and Israel with unmittigated venom that would warm the heart of any storm troper from yesteryear. Maybe you’ve heard about the threats being made by Iran?
Unfortunately, Professor, I must disagree with you. This is indeed a free speech issue. Free speech, as we have discussed here over and over again, protects not only those with whome we agree, but it also protects those with whom we disagree. It is really irrelevant whether or not Greece (the founder of the first democracy in history) has a ‘First Ammendment’ like ours.
Rafflaw at 11:40, Right.
It’s almost a shame that there are such trappings with which to identify political movements. For a politician or pundit, anything short of showing up in a white hood and frock allows them to claim the views they espouse are not racist; anything short of authors and supporters of legislation goose-stepping around an auditorium and giving the Nazi salute allows them to claim their laws are not fascist in concept or execution. The symbols distort the public dialogue. The public face of fascism (and in America, racism) is so set in ones mind that to raise the question over any government policy espoused or legislated without those obvious trappings is to shut down discussion and brand yourself a ignorant radical.
He is a Greek citizen. Not an American citizen with protection under our Constitution. Greece may not have a Constitution with a parallel First Amendment provision. But, assuming he was an American and did this at Wrigley Field on the Fourth of July and was saluting the President of the United States for being a White Sox fan who was sitting there in a White Sox fan shirt, then perhaps his firing for petitioning his government for redress of grievances could find protection in a court of law under the First Amendment.
But, he was in Greece and this was soccer and not baseball and the Cubs would have beaten the White Sox, salute or no salute.
All from here.
And how exactly do you know Katidis is ignorant?
It’s not like WWII wasn’t in all the papers, Ralph.
And if you want to talk partisan polar love affairs? Nazis were as far right as it gets. They were fascists. You know. You’re people.
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