Things just keep getting rougher for average citizens in Europe. Some have faced government seizure of accounts to help fund government operations and requirements that they explain withdrawals to their banks. Now, the European Central Bank (ECB) is imposing a negative interest rate on banks for their deposits. So, you can keep your money under your mattress or put it in a bank where the bank will use it to earn money while charging you for the pleasure. This is of course the central bank which directly relates to individual banks as opposed to individual depositors. Those banks will now pay to park their money and those costs will be passed along to depositors. Banks are likely going to try to hide the fact that the interest rate is now negative through fees and other measures.
The ECB cut the rate on its deposit facility for banks from 0 percent to minus 0.10 percent. It also cut its main interest rate to from 0.25 percent to 0.15 percent as well as cutting the rate on its marginal lending facility by 35 basis points to 0.4 percent from 0.75 percent.
It is an interesting situation where banks will now be treated as solely a safe place for holding your money but you will pay for the service as a fee. Much like the airlines where aspects of what was once viewed as the basic service are being converted into fees, banks will now be treated as akin to a safety deposit box. However, unlike airlines or safety deposit boxes, the banks are making money off the deposits. It is a fundamental change in function of banks.
I have long been critical of the tax increases and measures in Europe that will likely have displacement impacts on investments and movement of citizens and businesses. In this case, I would expect people to look for alternatives from Internet banks to foreign banks.
I’ll give my answer to the poll.
I don’t want to pay more tax.
How about a poll. How many people here would like to pay more in taxes?
Darren, I want to pay LESS taxes so we can have a more civilized government and society.
Feynman ~ speaking of Romney, he tore down a perfectly respectable house on the beach here in La Jolla to erect a mansion w/an indoor elevator for his cars. Now that’s something we can all get behind 😉
paulette wrote: “… he [Romney] tore down a perfectly respectable house on the beach here in La Jolla to erect a mansion w/an indoor elevator for his cars. Now that’s something we can all get behind…”
You sound jealous, Paulette. Just think about all the jobs created, the extra tax revenue paid, and the additional money spent in the community because of that project. Surely you find some good in that, don’t you? Trickle down economics at work, but for some reason Democrats just won’t acknowledge it.
paulette and david – people tear down perfectly good houses all the time to build the house they want. It is not uncommon.
Definitely NO Reagan (traded weapons to Iran for hostages, paved the road to income inequality. closed mental health facilities) NO Thatcher (disdained working class and unions – went to war for the Falklands).
Karen
Here’s the deal… Romney, a multi-millionaire, has a tax rate of 17%. There are thousands more multi-millionaires that have the same, or lower, tax rate. Mine is considerably higher. My kids pay a higher rate. My friends pay a higher rate. None of my friends shelter their money off-shore. None have their own lobbyists. None of us are multi-millionaires – not even half millionaires.
And no one thinks a flat tax is fair. Oh. Except Steve Forbes. A multi millionaire.
I could get behind a flat tax as long as there are no exceptions in the tax code.
feynman wrote: “Romney, a multi-millionaire, has a tax rate of 17%.”
You are talking about an effective tax rate, because much of his money is earned from investments. Romney actually pays exactly the same tax as you or me on his salary. His labor is taxed at exactly the same tax rate as you or me making the same salary for our labor.
Does this all fit into the picture of Americans, along with other previously economically successful working class in the west, lowering our expectations on standard of living? I read recently that the global market goal is to get American wages down to the Vietnamese rate of 28 cents per hour. Of course, Europeans are in the same boat, but will experience a lot more “adjustment” after enjoying nationalized health care, high wages and quality standard of living and quality of life.
Karen S., I appreciate all your posts. Do debt- or deficit-minded folks have anything at all to say of the hemorrhaging of our tax dollars on world-wide military mis-adventures, creepy surveillance or homeland security? I’ve never heard anyone from your perspective ever criticizing or speaking out against all this grotesque military spending. That’s where a huge amount of our mandatory and discretionary budgets are spent.
BTW Karen, here are the stats from the 2013 cbp report on Who Pays Taxes in California which are more recent than your 2010 stats sacbee link. http://www.cbp.org/pdfs/2013/130411_Who_Pays.pdf
I would love to have a Lincoln, Reagan, or Margaret Thatcher. We need someone honest with a real talent for governing.
What feynman said.
Paulette
Abraham Lincoln. Why don’t they make Republicans like that any more?
feynman:
I am not interested in getting personal or snarky with you. I have never flamed anyone here, or gone after anyone. I have a problem with the tax and spend philosophy. Keep it about the issues and not the poster, please.
Paulette:
Do you consider the wealthy paying for 2/3 of the taxes in CA not paying their fair share? I don’t know how that myth got legs.
If you oppose Prop 13 then you have to consider that things will go back to how it was pre-Prop 13 – when the elderly got taxed right out of their homes. They bought decades ago, and their taxes kept going up up up until they folded. Especially with the real estate boom and bust, it would be impossible to determine how much mortgage you could afford if your property taxes could increase $7,000 in a year.
I remember when I thought the rich didn’t pay any taxes. The more I looked into it the more I realized the wealthy pay the freight here, and it still gets wasted.
You must know about our record potholes, and the gridlock that gives everyone angina on their commute.
Karen ~
When the owner of the PR firm where I worked remarried, his new wife would always refer to the staff as “you people.” You know, “you people” have no idea how hard it is to run a business…
This may be a little off topic but, WTH.
“Labor is prior to, and independent of, capital. Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is the superior of capital, and deserves much the higher consideration.” Abraham Lincoln
Paul:
http://www.polluterwatch.com/koch-industries
Karen:
I, too, live in SoCal and remember a time before Prop 13 when our schools were the envy of the entire nation – now, not so much due (in part) to the lower property tax revenue.
We in Cal have our fair share of the uber-wealthy. If they paid their fair share instead of off-shoring wealth and outsourcing jobs overseas, in davidm2575 words, “the economy would be running full steam, poverty would be non-existent, and government would have so much money we won’t hear anything from them for awhile about needing to raise taxes.”
Karen S
I said ‘sell’ your business – not burn it to the ground. Usually, the buyer will keep the staff on.
Why not try Texas or Mississippi? I understand the tax rates are very low there. And there is a bonus for you! They hate Obamacare. But do be careful not to live too near any fertilizer plants. And do be careful about Houston – air pollution, you know. Not good for your asthma.
My own opinions evolved when I married a small business owner. I had NO IDEA how much he had to pay, not only in taxes, but in extra costs of running a business. And year after year, Liberals want to add more costs, hurdles, etc. It’s a bad model for business.
I recall reading a story where a campground operator finally moved out of state. When he wanted to replace a rotting doc, it took 5 years and many thousands of dollars to get through the permit process. When he wanted to have a concession truck, he had to drill a hole in his paved parking lot and submit a soil sample from UNDERNEATH the asphalt. You’d think it was a skit from Monty Python, but it’s the actual experience of business owners in CA.
Michael Murray:
Exactly! “Casino Capitalism”
I remember clearly the day my manager complained that he wanted to turn down a promotion because it would put him in the next tax bracket. He would actually take home LESS money than before.
Sad.
Michael – it’s really easy to pass taxes on “other people.”
You know what would be fair? If everyone paid the same tax rate. We would raise Welfare to cover the difference. And then we would all be in this boat together. Everyone pay the same rate. Increase social services to make up the difference. And then there won’t be such a hurry to keep raising taxes again and again.
I’ll bet if it was EVERYONE’S taxes wasted, we’d care a lot more as a people when our money was wasted. We’d demand efficiency and accountability. But when it’s “other peoples’ money” who cares if we waste it, like on vacation trains to San Francisco while our streets honeycomb with potholes and fill with gridlock. Who cares? Not our money, right?
The rich would pay more in quantity but not percentage. And EVERYONE would be chipping in instead of hating the rich that pay for almost all of our bills.
Think it’s madness?
We already do that with the sales tax, for example. We ALL pay the same sales tax rate. There is no means test. The rich pay more because they buy more, but it’s all the same rate. And no one howls that it’s unfair for the poor to pay sales tax or gas tax etc. We all just do it.
Karen S wrote: “I’ll bet if it was EVERYONE’S taxes wasted, we’d care a lot more as a people when our money was wasted.”
Another thing is to stop making businesses be the tax collector and the government be the tax “refunder.” Everybody should write their own check to the government to pay their taxes. Then the poor would see who really is taking the money. It is not the businesses, but rather the government. Right now the government has a sneaky and deceitful way to collect taxes.
The American success story is only vilified by losers and those too stupid or lazy to achieve something in their sad, angry and pitiful lives.
david:
When did the American Dream Success Story become a vilified enemy? I mean people really HATE success. Despise it. Stay in school, wait to start a family, go to college, go to med school, take out student loans, intern, no one will date you for like a decade because you have no time, pay your dues – BAD! That’s NOT FAIR!
feynman:
“It is indeed horrible that you are taxed to death. I suggest you sell your business immediately. I hope it will provide you with the relief that you seek.”
So you hope my husband’s employees get laid off? Your concern for your fellow man is so moving. Love the Party of Tolerance and Compassion. 🙂