Saudi Arabia has long been one of the most vocal countries to object to any insult or restriction impacting Islam in other countries. However, it continues to deny the free exercise of religion to non-Muslims. That oppressive record was on full display this week with the report of another series of arrests of Christians who were merely trying to pray. The infamous Morality Police (Commission for the Promotion of Virtue and Prevention of Vice) raided the prayer meeting and arrested everyone for the crime of praying to another God.
The 28 Christians had gathered in the home an Indian national in the eastern city of Khafji and families say that they have not been heard from since.
All churches are banned in Saudi Arabia which believes only in the freedom of religion for Muslims. That position did not stop the Obama Administration (and Hillary Clinton) in working toward an international blasphemy standard for countries to criminalize insults to religion, as we previously discussed.
The Saudi government has denied knowledge of the raid, but the English-language newspaper, The Saudi Gazette, as well as several Saudi Arabic-language news outlets, have reported on the arrests.
Source: Daily Mail
Annie,
You’re not understanding what unalienable means. When I speak out against Z’s opinion it is not an infringement of his right. When I take action in some way to restrict or prevent the speech, then that is an infringement. This is what I explained in the “Air Force” thread:
The distinction of rights being unalienable is about WHO has the power over them. Unlike other rights that are a construct of the social contract and government, unalienable rights exist by the mere fact we exist. They come from no person, including ourselves and as a result, they cannot legitimately be taken away, not even by ourselves. They will always be under the risk of infringement because there will always be others giving in to their own human nature. This is why within the social contract, governments are established to provide security for these rights.
Tolerating the intolerant is irrational, and deadly.
Bigotry against the intolerant is warranted, even demanded of us.
Toleration of evil is either collaboration or cowardice.
Olly,
Actually, I’d defend his right to say it even if his right to free speech were alienated, just because it’s the decent moral thing to do. Belief in Natural Rights or God isn’t necessary to recognize basic human decency.
No, I don’t agree with what Z said, but I’ll defend his right to say it, unless that right is alienated. No right is unalienable. If it’s a natural right, for people to have their own beliefs and it’s unalienable, guess what, they were just alienated. Hence the fallacy of an inalienable right. If they had man made laws ensuring a right to their beliefs, they wouldn’t be sitting in some Saudi prison now, or would have legal redress.
Annie,
You have the unalienable right to your own beliefs but that does not extend to action that infringes the natural rights of others. The suggestion nuking Mecca would solve “enumerable ills” takes bigotry to a whole new level. Of course it was hyperbole but it goes to a state of mind that suggests the problem will go away if we eradicate “believers”. This is not only naive, it’s pure ignorance of why this nation was founded.
Do you agree and support zarathustraSmiles’ comments?
what tstraus said
Olly, are you indicating that those who denigrate all religions (or certain religions) are acting in a way similar to theocrats in Saudi who would force participation in a state religion and punish those who veer from he state religion, as in this case? Don’t we have freedom of expression in this country? We don’t have any anti blasphemy laws, so we’re able to express anti religion sentiments, no?
Conscience is a right? I thought it was more like something we learn when we are taught right and wrong. Rights can be taken away, remember? No one can take away your conscience.
not one drop of American blood, not one cent of American’s remaining, tenuous wealth should be lost to defend this nation. They must reap what they have sown-radical Islam/Wahhabism was birthed with the mutual understanding of the Saud family and Sheikh Wahhabi in a symbiotic relationship whose time coming to an end. Let the sand fall where it will.
“Right, Ginger………… IMAGINARY!!!!”
zarathustraSmiles,
That attitude is not far different than those “morality police”. As a matter of fact, it’s worse. You don’t limit your condemnation to certain faiths, you condemn them all.
Just more evidence that the Right of Conscience is not secure from those without any sense of humility.
Reblogged this on Citizens, not serfs.
Either there is no God, in which case religion is just a handy stick for beating people with, or there is a God, in which case I wonder what God thinks about it. What would be the spiritual status of a people who oppose God’s Messiah, or who think there has only ever been one prophet and reject the revelations of the others. Alongwith subscribing to mutilating the body which God designed?.
We’re not as civilized as some folks seem to believe, but the U.S. is full of the willfully blind.
https://www.ted.com/talks/margaret_heffernan_the_dangers_of_willful_blindness?language=en
The strength of a conviction or a religion is measured inversely by how strongly it prohibits any other conviction or religion. Social evolution is a slow process but it is happening. Remember the Spanish Inquisition.
The Bush family’s good buddies. Bush said Islam is a religion of peace.
Right, Ginger………… IMAGINARY!!!!
Time to leave Saudi Arabia.
Saudi Arabia is just one name on a long list of countries who deny or limit the civil rights of their citizens, as we define civil rights. We must be realists,though. We cannot force them to change, to adopt our morals and standards. Like it or not, we have to work with them on dozens of bilateral and international issues. The best we can hope for is for them to slowly move THEIR culture toward OURS, just as our culture is evolving. Can we influence them? Probably very little.
One small Hydrogen Bomb over Mecca, would cure enumerable Ills in that area of the World!!!
I thought the god of Islam and Christianity (and Judaism) was the same god.