My home town of Chicago continues to be plagued by gang violence. Children are often the victim of drive by shootings and gang gun fights. However, the intentional killing this week of 9-year-old Antonio Smith Jr., known as “Fat Baby” and “Hamburger,” has shocked many in the city. The four men are reportedly members of the Sircon City faction of the Gangster Disciples street gang and murdered Smith because they thought he had warned their intended victims, rival members of the Pocket Town gang.
According to police, it was Jabari Williams, 22, (the first picture above from the right) who handed the .380-caliber handgun to Derrick Allmon, 19, (the second picture above) after they arrived in two cars at the scene. Also charged is Michael D. Baker, 19, (third) and Paris Denard, 19, (fourth). The four accused men had spotted two men from the rival gang while driving in the neighborhood.
When Allmon went into a back yard, police say that he saw Smith giving what he thought was a warning to the other gang and proceeded to kill him.
Allmon was just paroled from state prison in early August after serving about 1 1/2 year of a 3 1/2-year sentence on a weapons conviction. He has the word “Blessed” tattooed across his chest. Allmon allegedly threw the gun into a sewer as he fled from the shooting scene.
Adding to the anger over the crime is that fact that the gun used by in the crime was traced to a gun store in Indiana, which has less restrictive gun laws and does not require background checks, a waiting period or even a record of the transaction. Chicago has long complained that many of the guns used in such crimes come from Indiana.
It appears to have been Williams who led police to the others after being picked up on an unrelated gun charge and reportedly making “self-incriminating statements” about his involvement in the slaying.
Smith, in the fourth grade, was an honor roll student at Hinton Elementary School and played peewee football. Friends say that he was extremely smart and popular. He lived his short life along the dividing line of territory between the two gangs, a railroad track where his body was found.
At his funeral, they played his favorite song “Still Have Joy” by singer Tye Tribbett.
Thanks Paul- but excluding the ease of using a gun in possibly influencing the number of suicides or that it is less likely to have unintentional deaths from the misfiring of a gun vs. blunt object do not necessarily evidence complete statistics for gun deaths
Squeeky – thanks for pointing out to me that bicycles, bath tubs, etc…. were also designed specifically with the purpose to do harm to another. Or that boats are designed with laser sighted scopes and other equipment specifically intended to make them more lethal. Next time I’m in a boat or riding a bicycle (or have a car in my house – LMAO!), I’ll keep reminding myself how dangerous I am really am.
@Bill W
Well, I figured out how you are able to get stuff sooo wrong. . .You lack critical thinking skills. Here is an example. You said:
Really? Any chance you have statistics on the number of deaths from guns as compared to deaths from rocks? Based on your reply would assume the numbers are similar?
No, not at all. Based on the prior statements the concept was that IF guns were not available THEN other weapons would be used. There was no assertion of concurrent use. Jeeesh. Let’s try another example of where you spin into incomprehensibility. Let’s change your “fill in the blank” a little:
ftr – I enjoy driving as much as most. But with statistics showing a car in my house is more likely to result in a family member suffering a car related injury then I’d be__________ to have one.
You see, you left out the important concepts of necessity and the incidence of harm. I could just as easily used bicycles, kitchen knives, boats, or bath tubs. Each of these increases the possibility of a related injury, but you kind of need to know how much of an increase, and what the utilitarian value of each is.
Squeeky Fromm
Girl Reporter
“The gun is a tool, not the cause. It could just as well have been a rock that killed that young child.”
Really? Any chance you have statistics on the number of deaths from guns as compared to deaths from rocks? Based on your reply would assume the numbers are similar?
As for the breakdown in society. I’ll agree – just not that it is all due to the causes you list. So called free market (or rig the market with paid for politicians rewriting the rules) policies have been attacking the middle class and breaking down society for decades. Once single wage earners led families – now two wage earners struggle to put food on the table as Canada passes the USA in median wages. Once college was free or affordable – now most must go in debt for decades for a 4 year degree. Sadly for this country, conservative economic policies have been winning and also disintegrating families.
ftr – I enjoy going to the range as much as most. But with statistics showing a gun in my house is more likely to result in a family member suffering a gun related injury then I’d be__________ to have one.
Bill W. a knife in your house is more likely to result in an injury from a knife than from a rock. That said, here is a link to homicides by method.
http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0004888.html
Please consider that the real cause may not be guns or the evilness of those who murdered this child. It could be racism, hate, the need to put down others because of some definitive easily identifiable visible feature used to discriminate against them for all purposes, and a culture of historic victimization and epigenetics wherein violence has been the only viable defense to oppression and negative descrimination.
“gun rights instead of the loss of human life is an incredibly poor statement on American priorities.”
It is incredibly sad that grown men would murder a child. We have focused on the REAL cause of the criminality in the inner cities. It is the social welfare system and policies that encourage the disintegration of the nuclear family and creates a dependent mind set. Generations of people who have given up on the values that create stable families, morality, initiative and the desire to do better and rise into higher socio economic income classes. When everything is given to you and you feel entitled to be given money, food, clothing, housing, why bother actually working. Aimless, idle, unemployed, entitled and stupid from refusing to be educated all equal a disaster. One created by liberal/progressive ideology.
The gun is a tool, not the cause. It could just as well have been a rock that killed that young child.
As to gun rights….damned right I’m focused on those. It is MY right to have protection against just such animals as these. My priority is self protection and survival.
@Jill
You said If we wanted to, we could go very far in eliminating gangs by making a better society. One trillion dollars to feed, clothe, house and provide education and health care to every person sounds like a much better use of our money.
That kind of thinking is probably what is behind the growth in the black gangs. These guys had schools to go to, but I bet they had no use for education. That was probably too white for them. Their mother probably had food stamps, and public housing assistance, too. Overall, they seem pretty healthy, being able to hunt down and kill other black gang members.
I bet what is missing in their lives is a father and a stable family structure. If we try to discover what made an intact family such a rarity among blacks, we will find that it is the welfare system and all the efforts of Democratic Party leaders to swap welfare money for votes.
Like LBJ said after the Great Society stuff passed, “We’ll have the n!ggers voting Democratic for the next 200 years!
Squeeky Fromm
Girl Reporter
A horrible tragedy that a 9 year old child was killed. And that a parent will have to bury their child should leave all here with a feeling of sadness. That the comments on this thread instead focused on gun rights, gun rights, and gun rights instead of the loss of human life is an incredibly poor statement on American priorities. Although 4 guys with guns does seems to fit the well regulated militia definition that currently dominate the guns, guns and only more guns are acceptable discussion.
I am so sorry about this child’s death.
We must do so much better as a society. Today, USGinc. is willing to spend 1 trillion dollars to make more nukes. We already have enough of those to annihilate the world many times over. Why is USGinc. spending money on more crazy killing? Talk about the need for weapons control. Many on the left fully support “their” president on his never ending quest for war and weapons while decrying guns on the street. This is rank hypocrisy–the kind of hypocrisy I’ve come to expect from Obama’s followers. I would suggest stopping and thinking about the connection between a heavily armed govt. and heavily armed gangs. Neither cares one whit about the death of children. Maybe it’s time to start caring.
If we wanted to, we could go very far in eliminating gangs by making a better society. One trillion dollars to feed, clothe, house and provide education and health care to every person sounds like a much better use of our money.
I will also say that this is a lesson for all people, both black and white, who appear to think color determines whether a person is good or bad. Clearly, it does not. Actions determine this.
IANAL, so I am having some difficulty in sorting out the wording of the Indiana statutes, especially pertaining a requirement for a “permit to purchase” such as exists in Michigan. It seems lacking in Indiana….but Indiana can’t override federal requirements, so I am a bit in the WTF stage trying to learn. When I purchase a handgun in Michigan I must either individually apply for a permit to purchase, for each purchase, which goes through a State Police background check….or have a valid “Concealed Pistol License” (CPL) which has the State Police Background check and has to be renewed periodically. Then, when I actually purchase the pistol of my choice, a federal (FBI or ATF, not certain which offhand) background check is performed for each pistol. Because my name is only slightly more common that dirt I always have to wait 5 to 7 days for clearance at the federal level (rule is if no issues are discovered, you are cleared on the 7th day)…then I can go back to the store and pick up the pistol. I have the forms now to obtain yet another Identification Number (FBI), that identifies me as the unique good person among many with the same name, but haven’t felt a need to do so. I am a member of a range at the same store I by handguns from, since I am there weekly, no urgency occurs.
However, due to my varied experiences in life in Detroit, I can say with unequivocal certainty that a pistol or revolver can be bought off the street with little or no fan fare. I bet the same is true in Chicago. I bar tended nights in a ghetto bar (so the owner could take a long vacation trip) for a bit and I doubt a day went by that I wasn’t offered one handgun or another cheap and purportedly a “cold piece” (not used in a recent crime) for cash. I never took up any of the offers, mainly because I knew too many guys in the Felony Prevention Section who were experts at the “sting”, as well as I dislike buying anything that might be stolen, period.
My point is simple enough; overly strict gun laws do not impede the market of guns or the use of them. That is in the mind of man.
“This country needs all the laws enforced to the max”
Including the death penalty.
If subhuman thug #2 were still in jail serving his sentence, perhaps this might not have happened. Naaah….they would have found another thug to fill the slot. There doesn’t seem to be a shortage.
The gun issue is irrelevant. As others have stated there is also no shortage of weapons when people have the desire to murder. So….they had a gun somehow that was bought by? We don’t know who. Was the gun stolen?
I was a member of the NRA, until they started bombarding me with phone calls asking for more money and wads of mail solicitation, (stop bothering me). I fully support their push back on the mindless gun control crowd.
The issue is the social conditions, established by our liberal welfare state, that allows these soulless dead eyed criminals to exist. I think it is too late to change anything by more social engineering.
This country needs all the laws enforced to the max
@SteveH
Yes, I am sure the thugs in your scenario would never think of knives, baseball bats, hammers, machetes, chain saws, ropes, molotov cocktails, brass knuckles, rocks, etc.
Squeeky Fromm
Girl Reporters
Let’s imagine how this would have played out if guns were illegal, everywhere.
Thug#1: “Let’s kill someone in the other gang.”
Thug#2: “Great idea!! Let’s shoot him.”
Thug#3: “Love it!! Let’s go.”
Thug#4: “Not so fast my friends. We can’t kill him because we don’t have a gun. Remember? Guns are illegal. And even though we sell drugs, we have not been able to get a gun.”
Thug#1: “Damn! I really wanted to kill someone in the other gang.”
Thug#2: “Me, too. But what are we going to do without a gun?”
Thug#3: “How about this? We go out to the internet and cyber-bully him!! ”
Thug#4: “Fabulous idea!! Who’s got a user-ID?”
Thug#2: “You know, it’s a good thing guns are illegal. We might have done something we’d regret later.”
Steve H. – you realize that there are tons of things to kill with besides guns. Hammers, rocks, branches, knives, shoes, stiletto heels, pipes, etc.
Paul is correct, the gun purchase is tangential. Do you think these depraved animals would not have strangled, knifed, beaten w/ a baseball bat, etc.? JT has that east coast and Chicago mentality that guns kill people. Taking that to it’s logical conclusion we need to ban cars, prescription drugs, knives, baseball bats, rocks, how many do I need to list to show the lunacy of that mindset. Chicago has the most restrictive gun laws in this country. And, JT is blaming Indiana!!! What about the Dem machine that has created neighborhoods like this??
What is telling here is that the pro gun people jump on a side remark to take the focus off of the disgusting four. In fact the selling of guns as is done in Indiana is also disgusting and stupid. However, the availability of a gun to sub humans such as these is a valid problem.
The main issue is the control thugs like these have over the streets of Chicago and their distance from a reality that has obviously escaped them. They live in a world that preys on the innocent. Where is the law in Chicago? Why don’t they bring back the gallows? These goons are irretrievable.
Well, the obvious answer to this savagery is to disarm all the law abiding white folks and then get rid of stand your ground laws. Plus, sing a chorus or two of Kum Bah Yah. Oh, and more welfare payments!
Squeeky Fromm
Girl Reporter
I”m becoming increasing against the death penalty as we see more and more examples of bias and overturned convictions. But in this case, I think public execution of these animals is appropriate. Slaughter them like cattle in the old Chicago stockyards and leave them to rot in the sun.
I don’t care about the gun one little bit. It does not matter at all what weapon they used to kill a 9 year old boy. There is absolutely nothing redeemable about these flesh bags. Focus on the monsters, not the tool they chose.
Amazing stuff. The first comments are from the gun crowd that say nothing about the tragic loss of life but throw up the ‘guns don’t kill’ matra and rush to the NRA ‘how to respond’ handbook. As goes America. ….More support for more guns and less acknowledgement of human life.
Lloyd – so you are blaming the gun for killing a 9 year old child?
” The first comments are from the gun crowd that say nothing about the tragic loss of life but throw up the ‘guns don’t kill’ matra and rush to the NRA ‘how to respond’ handbook.”
It is unlikely that anyone will be effective protecting human life if they cannot figure out what the problems is.
It seems unlikely that Indiana’s lax regulation is the problem if federal law covers precisely the issues mentioned.
“acknowledge human life.” all you want to but it isn’t going to give you a clue about what is going off the tracks with gangs or how to get it under control.
BTW, I have never belonged to the NRA and I am pretty sure I never will.
I just get irritated by sloppy, uncritical thought, particularly when the subject is human life.
But there are those who would rather wax indignant, even if their remarks have nothing to do with the situation. I suppose it makes them feel better.
“Adding to the anger over the crime is that fact that the gun used by in the crime was traced to a gun store in Indiana, which has less restrictive gun laws and does not require background checks, a waiting period or even a record of the transaction.”
I thought federal law required gun dealers to keep records of their firearms sales, and that hand gun purchases required back ground checks unless the purchase was made through a private sale.
If that information is accurate then Indiana’s state laws don’t seem to be relevant to the fact that the weapon was obtained by gang members and used in a crime.
It would be interesting to me to know if the weapon was obtained with a straw purchaser.
Don’t get pissy about where the gun came from as long as it is legal, get pissy at who used a gun on a 9 year old. Let me add to the anger, this is from the city that has the President’s hand picked man as mayor. This is from the city that is home to the President of the United States.