Texas State University is this week’s ground zero in our campus speech debate. The most recent controversy was triggered by an opinion column by student Rudy Martinez on November 28th in The University Star titled “Your DNA is an abomination.” While insisting that he cannot by definition be racist, Martinez declares that “white death will mean liberation for all.” Martinez is a racist and the column is deeply disturbing. However, as will come as no surprise to regulars on the blog, I still support his write to publish such views. My concern is that universities continue to be selective in affording free speech rights to students. It is doubtful that the university would be so circumspect if the the column called for the death of minorities. UPDATE: The student columnist has been fired by the newspaper.
Martinez told The College Fix that “[t]hough my language, especially when I claim to have only ever met ‘12 decent white people,’ could be deemed as hyperbolic (just barely), it has accomplished its goal: starting a conversation and outing racists.” He continues with a position used by racists on campus across America: that they cannot be racist because only white people can be racists:
“… Was the piece racist? Nope; racist attitudes come from a position of power. The only group who have ever held true power in this nation are those who call themselves ‘white.’”
It is a transparently convenient and entirely unsupportable claim made by non-white racists to excuse their open racism. Racism is not about power; it is about prejudice. Martinez has clearly met more than a dozen “decent white people” but he could not see that decency past his own prejudice. It is the same reason why he thinks that it is ok to denounce an entire race as having flawed DNA and better off dead.
Martinez’ column no doubt was thrilling to read for those who relish racist rhetoric:
“Ontologically speaking, white death will mean liberation for all … accept this death as the first step toward defining yourself as something other than the oppressor,” Martinez wrote in his column. “Until then, remember this: I hate you because you shouldn’t exist. You are both the dominant apparatus on the planet and the void in which all other cultures, upon meeting you, die.”
Martinez says that she is satisfied that she has forced people to think about race. That she has but not in a way that faculty and students would have hoped. There are real and pressing issues of racial discrimination that need to be addressed and discussed. People like Martinez offer racism to combat racism and keep that dialogue from occurring.
Martinez, a self-described Marxist, has previously shown the same lack of judgment in his view of the ideal government in calling for a Marxist/Leninist government that ruined the Russian and imposed authoritarian rule over much of Eastern Europe. A Bolshevik Revolution, according to Martinez, is “the only way to achieve a lasting peace and avoid oppression.”
In the end, Martinez is just another racist on campus. I do not support calls to defund this newspaper. Students should be allowed to write and read divergent, even disturbing views. The concern is not the impact of such low-grade writing but the response to it. Universities continue to treat speech differently in declaring some writings like Martinez’ to be obnoxious while declaring other writings to be hate speech. The result is a de facto system of censorship that deals more harshly with views on one end of the spectrum of speech. As I have previously said, I continue to believe that the solution for bad speech is more speech — not speech regulation. Martinez’ racist views will fail because they are low-grade and hateful. The same can be said for those expressing prejudice against minorities. They all belong in the ashcan of history. However, they will only be defeated when free speech prevails for everyone regardless of viewpoint.
Cigarette smoking is dangerous. Kills millions every year. Get it?
Your dna probably tells us if you are a dumb smoker. Sorry. Dumb smoker is a two word way of saying dumb shit.
Who didn’t write and say stupid things when he was a college student?
I’m sure glad the internet didn’t exist when I attended college back in the bad old days of the 60s.
There is a difference between being stupid and hateful. This guy is typical of the leftists of the 60’s that actually killed or maimed people.
Or the early 70s, such as Patricia Hearst. Read Jeffrey Tobin’s book.
Yeah, he is a total communist.
Who didn’t write and say stupid things when he was a college student?
I don’t recall any of my colleagues advocating genocide.
Off Topic. Prof. Turley—you called for the removal of Judge Roy Moore, not once but in two blog posts for something done 40 years ago.
Senator Al Franken and Rep. Conyers have committed sexual assaults in the performance of official duties, on the job. Where are your posts, Prof. Turley, demanding these guys resign? Where? I see you hold a double standard, one for conservatives and another for liberals. Ted Kennedy, Bill Clinton, Conyers, Franken—all paragons of the Democratic Party. No say?
Martinez declares that “white death will mean liberation for all.”
Martinez should take note that virtually all immigration is non whites leaving their poverty stricken, crime ridden, run down pieces of heaven. . . . to live with and among the white oppressors. Surly they must be doing Something right or you would stay in your own homes and lands. You ungrateful invaders want all our benefits without pledging loyalty, adopting our ways or language. Diversity and those who encourage it are abominations
I wonder if this guy can tell the difference between a white liberal and a white conservative?
Hmmmm..maybe armbands are in order.
Humor is always the best medicine.
https://youtu.be/O7VaXlMvAvk?t=4
A message from The Editorial Board
By The Editorial Board – Nov 30, 2017, 5:06 pm 56 0
Correction, Nov. 30 at 5:28 p.m.: The author of this column has jeopardized the atmosphere of inclusivity at this university and will no longer be published in The University Star.
Dear readers,
We screwed up.
As editors, we allowed a hateful column to be published and hurt our community that deserves better. Texas State is a place where every student should feel safe learning and growing.
This is a student-run independent newspaper that enjoys the full rights and responsibilities of the First Amendment. Our newsroom is a learning space that gives us the ability to grow into our profession. It is a place where we make decisions and live by their consequences. The author of the column has jeopardized the atmosphere of inclusivity at this university. We have taken action and fired the individual.
Since the column’s publication, we have received hate mail and numerous death threats. Additionally, there have been calls for several members of The University Star to resign with individuals threatening to defund the student publication if demands are not met. We have received a lot of constructive feedback that, as students, is invaluable to us.
Texas State is a university that is dedicated to providing opportunities for growth to its students. Student media, such as The Star, provides indispensable experience to take with us beyond our undergraduate careers and into the real world.
We fully acknowledge the repercussions of our actions in allowing for such an incendiary and divisive column to make it into print. We were unequivocally wrong in printing it. It was neither constructive nor appropriate. We failed our readership and damaged Texas State’s profound tradition of inclusivity. Although it will take time and hard work to restore, that tradition is something that we will work tirelessly to uphold and rebuild.
One of our former editors and President of the United States, Lyndon B. Johnson put it best: “Yesterday is not ours to recover, but tomorrow is ours to win or lose.”
Moving forward, we fully intend to win the battle against divisiveness, one that we unfortunately helped fuel. We intend to foster community and a more positive atmosphere on campus through the same platform from which we have been doing so since 1911.
The University Star is here to stay, but not without making necessary changes to ensure that our core values will not be overlooked again. In the following days, we will be developing comprehensive plans to guarantee that the upcoming semesters are guided by truth, transparency and diversity of thought.
In these plans we will create more rigorous guidelines that all content must meet in order to be published, and we will create points and methods of oversight to make sure that all content is more critically edited. We, as student journalists, strive to become better in our profession and believe taking these measures is the right thing to do.
We invite the community that we respect so dearly to join us in this process, and will be making plans accessible to the public for feedback and conversation. In our next issue– which can include in print or online– we will publish letters to the editor in regards to the column.
Thank you,
The University Star Editorial Board
Is this guy one of those dreamers who want instant citizenship because they had no say in coming to this great nation? If he and so many dreamers have so much hatred for white people go to a nation that has the color of people he likes. If he is a dreamer don’t hate white people hate those who brought you to this great nation and return to wherever. That is if he’s a dreamer and who is picking up the cost of his tuition, white people??
well at least now we know what he was dreaming about.
No. So what if he was. Next.
This is to “I’ll ramble about irrelevancies whenever” zambone
“We are five days away from fundamentally transforming the United States of America.”
– Barack Obama
The barbarians are not “at the gate,” the barbarians are inside the city. America has been invaded and the enemy is in place. Europeans follow their families to America. Parasitic hyphenates come for the “free stuff.” Gullible dupes allow it to happen and cannot perceive the threat. Mexicans/Latinos viscerally and dogmatically believe in their claim of “Reconquista” of Aztlan, the American Southwest, by “La Raza.” The American Founders left the nation “…to ourselves and our posterity,…” Look around. Do you see their “posterity?” The American Founders, three times, passed a requirement in naturalization acts that citizens be “…free white person(s)…” Freed slaves required deportation because their legal status changed from “property” to “illegal alien” requiring their deportation.
“…whatever tends to a discordant intermixture must have an injurious tendency.”
The American Founders admonished against “multi-culturalism” per the words of Thomas Jefferson and Alexander Hamilton:
Thomas Jefferson –
“Suppose 20 millions of republican Americans thrown all of a sudden into France, what would be the condition of that kingdom?”
“If it would be more turbulent, less happy, less strong, we may believe that the addition of half a million of foreigners to our present numbers would produce a similar effect here.”
Alexander Hamilton –
“The influx of foreigners must, therefore, tend to produce a heterogeneous compound; to change and corrupt the national spirit; to complicate and confound public opinion; to introduce foreign propensities. In the composition of society, the harmony of the ingredients is all-important, and whatever tends to a discordant intermixture must have an injurious tendency.”
“…TO OURSELVES AND OUR POSTERITY,…”
Rich. Please post more of the revealing material.
This is to “I’m in a disguise because I’ve uncovered a cabal” georgie
The backstory on this might prove more notable.
Why did the newspaper decide to feature this article so prominently if it was of low literary quality?
How much support did the author receive from the newspaper or university officials?
Still, it is becoming obvious that many universities and colleges are now the face of institutional racism in this country as indicated by hatred expressed by both students and faculty.
Here is a quote from the Chaplinsky SCOTUS decision of 1942, upholding a community’s fair interest in regulating speech toward “social interest in order and morality”, especially its ability to use law to prevent “fighting words”-style public discourse:
There are certain well-defined and narrowly limited classes of speech, the prevention and punishment of which have never been thought to raise any constitutional problem. These include the lewd and obscene, the profane, the libelous, and the insulting or “fighting words” those that by their very utterance inflict injury or tend to incite an immediate breach of the peace. It has been well observed that such utterances are no essential part of any exposition of ideas, and are of such slight social value as a step to truth that any benefit that may be derived from them is clearly outweighed by the social interest in order and morality.
— Chaplinsky v. New Hampshire, 1942
How is a newspaper piece calling for extermination of the white race not “fighting words”?
Presumably there are laws and statutes agaisnt harassment, incitement, assault, battery, rape, murder and other acts that result in injury and/or property damage. No law or “decision” against speech is constitutional. That a court “decided” anything establishing a “precedent,” does not make it constitutional.
Which holds dominion. the 1st Amendment to the U.S. Constitution or the “decision” of a motley collection of corrupt liberal egoists on a court; any court? Any entity which attempts to illicitly modify the Constitution outside of the amendment process is subverting the Constitution as a treasonous act and must be impeached.
You may find it appropriate to familiarize yourself with the phrase “MANIFEST TENOR.”
The Founders wrote the Constitution to stand in perpetuity as do the The Ten Commandments.
___________________________________________________________________________
Alexander Hamilton –
“[A] limited Constitution … can be preserved in practice no other way than through the medium of courts of justice, whose duty it must be to declare all acts contrary to the manifest tenor of the Constitution void. Without this, all the reservations of particular rights or privileges would amount to nothing … To deny this would be to affirm … that men acting by virtue of powers may do not only what their powers do not authorize, but what they forbid.”
1st Amendment
“Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.”
Because they were not uttered face to face.
Martinez’s ideas seem familiar.
I could have sworn I read rumors about a country in central Europe that, about eighty or so years ago, adopted values similar to that of Martinez.
Is there any truth to these rumors? Did anything bad happen as a result?
“I could have sworn I read rumors about a country in central Europe . . .”
Yes, please. I am eager to here the details of this.
Something about a guy with a Charlie Chaplin moustache. Something about Crystal Nights.
also from”The Fix” “University event highlights 14 ways ‘whiteness’ oppresses society ”
“A “Whiteness Forum” at Cal State San Marcos on Tuesday prominently displayed 14 poster boards detailing different ways in which students say whiteness in America oppresses people of color and society.
For 15 years and “going strong,” this annual forum has taken place as a part of Professor Dreama Moon’s “Communication of Whiteness” course, the scholar said as she kicked off the two-hour event inside a large multipurpose room.”
https://www.thecollegefix.com/post/39489/
The article is great for starting a discussion but I’m not sure of its value otherwise. I agree with the author that racism must have a component of power. The author is clearly biased (as we all are) and even bigoted due to lumping most white people into the same pot. But racism is the lumping of the people of a particular demographic into the same pot and discriminating against them due to power, e.g. hiring, housing, money, opportunities, etc.
The gender of the author isn’t clear. Rudy is both a female and a male name. In none paragraph Rudy is “she”, in another paragraph Rudy is “he”. Is Rudy questioning? If so, how does JT know that?
“racism must have a component of power”
Were white people who squirted ketchup all over blacks peacefully protesting at lunch counters bigoted or racist?
Someone being a jerk, trying to intentionally demean someone else based on that person’s race is trying to exercise power over that person. Isn’t that the whole micro aggression argument?
So David Duke ceases to be racist if he steps off a plane in Nigeria?
“racism must have a component of power. ”
Minorities have a component of power when they exert such power. Therefore any race can promote racism anywhere at any time.
“I agree with the author that racism must have a component of power . . . ”
You’re a clod.
Isn’t it a fact that this man is funded by Putin? NPR informs me that many people who hold unapproved ideas have income and that even though no one can prove anything, it must certainly be true that Putin is funding them. It’s clear to me that this is the work of Putin, no further question in my mind!
He is funded by Transylvania.
Jill, yes! Styxx is a Kremlin operative. Putin sends him tins of caviar and cases of vodka which is sold on the black market to ensure his loyalty
HA–just as I thought!
Another Putin stooge.
Too much of a goof to be a Putin stooge.
Openly calling for the extermination of a race?….those are “fighting words”. They are not protected forms of free speech. And, considering where a counter-campaign of fighting words leads to, I disagree with JT’s position that moderation and rational debate can be guaranteed to restore itself as the norm, once fighting words are afforded 1st Amendment protection. It could easily go sideways.
Seems to me somebody tried that in Germany back in the 30s. The time to defund these mockeries of institutions of education is way past due. Sure, they can say what they like, we are not obligated to support them.
Fighting words doctrine removes protection from words that tend to cause a verbal or physical altercation by their mere utterance. This is very seldom going to be an issue with a news paper column or internet posting. Hate speech is protected. That’s it.
More red meat for the deluded trumpists. This idiot is nothing more than that. This person rightfully deserves ridicule; not serious responses.
No, you got it backwards. Rudy’s Rant is pretty typical of the Democratic Party race-baiting, identity politics narrative. You know, the whole “White Folks are to blame for all the problems of Black and Brown peoples” schmear.
That stuff is the “red meat” thrown to white liberals, and their black sycophants.
Squeeky Fromm
Girl Reporter
That’s it Squeeky keep those TIKI torches filled and lit.
Rudy isn’t any more a unique phenomenon than the Muslims who act our brutal plots are a marginalized element of that ideology. Rudy is allowed the platform because what he is saying is a very common discussion among the young Communists being reared in the Universities.
But the new lefty talking point that Trump is responsible for sexual escapades of John Conyers over the last four decades, that’s reasonable, right? And you think it’s Trump voters that are deluded.
The level of sanctioned racism and harassment of whites and conservatives is frightening. The hard Left is becoming in teasingly Fascist, racist, and intolerant. God help us and our country if they ever seize control of Congress and the White House. We see what their utopia is.
Worth based on skin color. What a disgusting premise rearing its head again among Democrats.
Here’ the best rap video on race relations I’ve ever seen with an uplifting ending BUT MOST DEFINITELY NOT FOR THE SQUEAMISH (bad language, racial epithets, etc):
I liked the first part when the white guy was giving the black guy hell. But when the black guy went into his side of things, it was exactly what the white guy said – – – a bunch of excuses. Nobody has to sell drugs to feed their family unless they are using the Food Stamps to buy hair weave, booze, or drugs. And who is going to hire some saggy pants freak who looks like a grown up Buckwheat caricature???
As much as it is tempting to say that there are two sides to every story, sometimes there just isn’t two sides. Sometimes, one side is just flat out wrong, and we have to get past our innate desire for compromise and just realize the real situation. Black poverty may have been rooted in slavery back in the 1800s, and to a large degree into the 20th century. But things have moved on. Except for blacks who are still addicted to the excuses they had in 1920.
Krauts and Japs rebuilt in less than 20 years after being demolished in World War II. Jews, in less time than that after an actual, real-life genocide. But here blacks are, in 2017, popping out illegitimate little heathens to beat the band, and blaming white people for their own screw-ups.
They get no sympathy from me.
Squeeky Fromm
Girl Reporter
I’m not even going to bother challenging your racist rant. You have a personality disorder, and, like Chump, like to stir the shit storm by saying outrageous things just to get attention. You are pathetic and depraved. Can’t fix stupid, so no reason to try.
However, as usual, you have your facts wrong. Germany wasn’t fully rebuilt following WWII until the 1980s. Neither the “Japs” or the “Jews” reacquired the population of those who were killed in WWII in 20 years’ time. A lot of the “Jews” went elsewhere, including newly-formed Israel. What was there for them to “rebuild” anyway? They were citizens of Poland, Germany and elsewhere, not a nation to themselves. Their possessions were stolen from them and although there have been efforts to trace and reclaim some of the non-cash items, like art objects, that effort is by no means complete, and is still going on.
“Reacquired the population???” Since when is that the standard for rebuilding a nation. The Japs and Krauts rebuilt their cities, and had electrical plants up and running, building rebuilt, and navigable highways. People lived indoors and had sufficient food supplies. Children got educations. That is what rebuilding looks like, ding-a-ling.
As far as blacks, they seem to take already functioning cities and turn them into Third World Hell Holes, like Baltimore! Where, the various savage black tribes have managed to run off children from the rest of Blue Maryland:
Sooo, maybe Maryland needs a new state song? I humbly submit the following for consideration:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BLZTOiKBHVA
Squeeky Fromm
Girl Reporter
Ordinarily, I’d suggest that someone like you get help, but your problems are refractory to help. You are not very bright, you are not very well-educated, you are severely xenophobic and you have a personality disorder, borderline or full-blown. Maybe the latter. Someone like you can only be helped if you want help, but you don’t.
Are you even aware that calling Germans “Krauts” and Japanese people “Japs” is offensive? Well, you’ve been told, but I doubt it’ll sink in. Millions of Jews were exterminated in WWII. That population has not yet been restored. Jews didn’t have their own country to restore. Property stolen from them will likely never be fully recovered, but there are still efforts underway to locate and return items.
Recently, the History channel did a program on WWII and rebuilding, and they showed examples of how Germany was not fully rebuilt until the 1980s. Yes, by priortizing, they recovered some essential services and things relatively quickly, but Germany had not completely recovered until about 40 years after the war. Of course, you know more than them, so whatever.
hmm, I grew up in West Germany in the 70s and it seemed rebuilt to me – intact infrastructure, trains, sunbways, buses, Autobahn, manufacturing expansions,functioning farms and vineyards, Excellent schools, thriving cultural institutions, hospitals, sports facilities, amusement parks, zoos, ski resorts, spas, indoor/outdoor pools, a plethora of small businesses, etc.
Indeed, Germany is the largest economy in the EU.
Pre WW2, Soichiro Honda started his business of designing and building better pistons and piston rings, with his lovely family delivering them to Japanese industry via bicycle. The black and white image of this era of Honda’s history is surreal in its beauty. The smiles on the family’s wonderful faces tells the story.
As expected, WW2 utterly destroyed Honda’s industry, converting it to dust. Soichiro and his family started again, with less than the first time.
When Soichiro finally retired, he disallowed his senior son from taking over. Soichiro believed his son had not exhibited the proper fortitude and perseverance for the high calling.
Honda has recently designed and now sells a spectacular jet for private use. May 2017 Forbes posted Honda Motor market cap @ $54B.
My math formula: the greater the personal attacks (i.e. against Squeeky), the less is the logical argument against the target, and the less is the will and/or ability of the poster to formulate an argument.
IMO there are at least two primary forces, sources, and powers preventing blacks from improving their lot in American life. The Democratic Party has vested interest in keeping blacks on the so-called Democrat “Plantation,” reason being the DNC’s identity politics exhibits hatred toward non-protected classes like whites. Lacking black and illegal citizen support, the DNC may cease to exist. The other is American industries including the abortion industry, clothing, and entertainment industry.
The abortion industry has huge financial interest in maintaining black baby genocide of filicide. The clothing and entertainment industry’s make billions of dollars by maintaining black memes such as “it’s all whitey’s fault.” Without such meme, Colin Kaepernick’s name would be unknown.
It almost seems like the primary purpose of the black lifestyle meme is to separate them from whites, to prove they are different, to make them not assimilate, as if that is a bad thing. There is an obvious desire to have money like whites have, to glorify money, but a simultaneous glorifying of everything that keeps blacks from achieving wealth, acting like idiots, acting like criminals, glorifying criminal activity, etc, etc.
How many blacks know, have been told this simple truth: the more likely you fail HS and have children out of wedlock, the more you are mired forever in poverty?
Exactly on point. It seems like the modern day definition of racism, outside of just being a conservative Republican, is saying anything bad or negative about blacks. Which is why black conservatives catch holy hell from the Left.
But sometimes, bad and negative things need to be said. I do not believe it impossible that one day blacks will wake up and start realizing how they are their own worst enemies, that their disdain of education, and their embracing of the baby daddy culture has devastated them. I think it is even possible that they will one day come to a full recognition of how the white liberal Democrats have royally screwed them over for their votes.
That day will come sooner if the “idiot wind” stops blowing out of people like Natacha’s mouth. Speaking of which, here is an alternative version of Dylan’s song.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fMzcwlmhfws
Squeeky Fromm
Girl Reporter
You may be right about all of this (I’m not in a position to say), but you’re not going to convince too many people by citing the History Channel as an authority. These are the bozos that continue to run the widely derided “Ancient Aliens” series, along with much other programming of questionable historical value.
JAY – don’t knock Ancient Aliens. They are out there, you know. One of the Russian cosmonauts just reported capturing some. You can knock Pawn Stars, etc. they deserve it, but not Ancient Aliens. 😉
yup, infotainment passing as legit facts. “History” channel is owned by Disney. Nuff said
I thought it passionately but fairly laid out the respective positions and wasn’t afraid to use strong language to accomplish it. The tension was relieved when both sides got it off their chest. Just another beautiful argument in favor of unfettered free speech.
Squeek, Could to see you back.
Thank you NickS! I haven’t really gone away this time, just been having computer issues. I got a new one off HSN for business, and have been learning Windows 10. Meanwhile, my Squeeky Computer has been screwing up since I upgraded Firefox, and I am not sure if I need to replace the keyboard again, or maybe the Synaptics touch pad. Sooo, I bought a wireless mouse and have been using that. Or just use Chrome.
Plus Christmas. Plus, I have been re-tasking my numerous Kindle Fires for different purposes, like one is dedicated to running a Line 6 guitar amp that goes on line and finds any sound you want, and another to my nightime bluetooth speakers by the bed, and another as a repository for all my Amazon Music, like 30 gigs worth.
Which, if you like music, Amazon has some amazing “Big Box” mp3 collections for 99 cents each. So, I got two versions of Beethoven’s Symphonys. And 3 Baroque Music collections some over 10 hours each. Plus Ballet music, and Cafe Music, a Telemann, and a Mendelssohn which has the Violin Concerto in Em, which is like Heaven Music. Sheesh, I went crazy and bought about 30+ of them and now have about 245 hours of music paid for. Most of it is not the standard recordings, but the London Symphony and the Hungarian State Orchestra are not exactly chumps. Not Von Karajan level on Beethoven, but not chumps by any stretch.
Some of the Big Box stuff is still $2.99, but they have lowered a bunch to 99 cents, like this one, which is over 14 hours of Baroque Music:
https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B0098TPQ9O/ref=pd_mp3_als_qp_pa
Squeeky Fromm
Girl Reporter
Wow. Powerful video, and I actually am near WiFi to view it.
I feel uncomfortable on a visceral level whenever any white person uses the N word. People can say that it’s unfair that blacks can say it. But the fact remains that there is a cultural context that exists when a white person used it, no matter his intention.
It did drive home the erosion of black culture and their participation in their issues.
It was moving how both sides started out furious with the other and then realized there was another perspective, hugging at the end. Very emotionally charged video with some biting truths. I did feel the urge to give the black guy a makeover to improve his job prospects – conservative haircut and clothes, diction, and address education gaps. Black or white you won’t show well in a competitive job market if you look, act, and dress like you are at a party or not serious.
This is one of those videos that I found extremely moving, but would hesitate to share because of the language and anger at first.
mespo, I agree w/ your take on this clip. Good find.
It’s not really a huge challenge identifying the real problems. But it is obvious at this point that the Democrats who insist on keeping the Blacks on their own plantation, have no path forward for these communities. Housing projects since FDR deliberately and specifically banned black families from participating, that can and should be addressed as a matter of equity. Most Americans would not support a program that so mistreated Black families even after serving in WW2.. $55 Trillion from War on Poverty money has been largely wasted and pocketed by the sticky finger Democrats who ran the cesspool cities like Chicago, Baltimore and Detroit. We can’t go back and fix that but we can honestly evaluate the reasons why the two products that the WOP was supposed to deliver, equal access to education and access to economic growth did not occur. We can find the culprits like the Democrat Teachers Unions that condemn black and other inner city children to their failed public schools, although the ADM in Baltimore for a student is equal to the tuition of the gold standard for private schools, The Calvert School (also in Baltimore). Somebody could arrange to block Nigerian and other African immigrants from taking the affirmative action jobs and university slots that were apportioned to American blacks as a redress of grievances. Well heeled Nigerians who immigrate here do not share the background of the American black man.. What is racist is to keep lying to Blacks about the nature of the problem and using them to guilt America into giving them entitlements that keep them as a permanent underclass. I think the report card is in and it doesn’t seem that the Democrats ever believed in the potential of the black community, nor did many of their own leaders, Obama come to mind. Crap..is it really still okay for the Democrats to tell Blacks that their share of the American dream is Food Stamps and free phones? I think that a large part of the Black community snapped when they were finally able to see a Black President and he did absolutely NOTHING for them for the entire eight years he was in office. Did he even form a Blue Ribbon Committee to work on the inner city problems?
The real story here is how extremist idiots are labelled left or right, liberal or conservative, progressive or regressive; well that one has some merit. The reality of the situation is that ISIS is not an Islamist religious extreme but a group of mentally retarded losers that found how they could use religion as a platform to steal, rape, etc; in other words get it without working for it. The mindless knee-jerk reaction is to call them liberals. As well, the morons in the sheets that burn crosses and rant and rave are not Republicans or conservatives. They are simply mentally short, as are those like this mutt Martinez. As long as these idiots are placed in the liberal/conservative arena, they have credibility. Those that place them there, have none. The real danger in this country doesn’t come from the obvious idiots that grab the microphone from time to time but from those that immediately label them left, or right, liberal or conservative, progressive or regressive. It is this responsive angst that gets buffoons like Trump elected: no substance, no details, no nothing; just a lot of anger, bluster, BS, lies, and jingoes. The dupes lap it up. Aye, therein lies the rub.
Actually, Wahhabism, as practiced by ISIS, is a very well-subscribed interpretation of Islam.
Except ISIS are Salafists, not Wahhabists.
Andrew sounds like you are a reincarnation of another alias.
Yes, they are Salafists, but follow fundamentalist Wahhabi Sunni doctrine.
They are synonymous.
Close mespo, but I don’t think entirely correct. All Wahhabi’s might be Salafists, but not all Salafists are Wahhabi’s.
ISIS is.
Mespo, you might know more than I do so are you saying that Salafists that are not Wahhabi do not exist in ISIS? (I don’t remember what separates the two, but I think it has to do with leadership from the past more than existing theology.)
The important issue that we completely agree with you state below to Issac. “it does matter that ISIS is practicing a well-subscribed version of Islam and draws remote support as a result.”
Mespo, I was troubled by the difference between Salafists and Wahhabi so I looked it up. I cannot say the distinctions are that clear to those not familiar with the region and the people but in one summary I found the following:
Summary:
salafism started in the thirteenth century. Wahabism started in the 19th century
salafism started by a few controversial scholars
one started in Iraq one in Najd.
both were unpopular
wahabism was strategized and more violent, salafism a little less so
wahabism became more successful
wahabism later acclaimed the title salafism.
Read more: Differences Between Wahabism and Salafism | Difference Between http://www.differencebetween.net/miscellaneous/religion-miscellaneous/islam-religion-miscellaneous/differences-between-wahabism-and-salafism/#ixzz501duKGB0
Here’s my primer on Wahhabism starting with Part I. You can read about it here. Note the similarities in thought: https://flowersforsocrates.com/2015/01/10/is-it-time-to-make-fundamentalism-a-crime-part-1/
Thanks for the excellent Esposito articles on fundamentalism and a very Interesting blog that appears quite worthwhile. I didn’t see anything that distinguished the Wahhabi from the Salafist, but I don’t think such a distinction is necessary for most discussions. However, I saw nothing that distinguishes the Wahhabi from the Salafist. I do recall being corrected by an expert when I said the two were the same. The golden rule I took from that explanation was that all Wahhabis can be called Salafists but not all Salafists can be called Wahhabi.
They have differences but are just offshoots of fundamentalist Islam. To that extent the differences have little to distinguish the belief systems.
mespo, I don’t disagree and I am more than satisfied with your interpretation. I do have to recognize that other groups like the Taliban are also fundamentalist groups that need not be Wahhabi. I think that is correct? I think it is appropriate to use the term fundamentalist for more than one group, but I think the term Wahhabi is more specific as is the term Salafi.
It’s a you say potato: I say pototo thing.
Actually, you illustrate my point extremely well. ISIS purports to practice this or that perverse version of whatever religion they see will advance their desire for power. If it is seen as a desire for power by lowlifes then it will be easier to wipe out by the Islamic world as well as the Western world. Giving them a foothold in religion is a weapon that must be taken away from them. So, explain all you wish regarding Wahhabism, Suffism, thisism, thatism, or whatever. In the end it comes down to a bunch of people who are stealing what others work for. It is as old as time itself. The rest is all BS.
Your gibberish aside, it does matter that ISIS is practicing a well-subscribed version of Islam and draws remote support as a result.
The only gibberish here is yours which serves to support the thugs that parade their basest instincts by attaching themselves to something that is life worthy and evolving; religion. The intent of religion is community, understanding, and faith. If this drek that thugs embrace is even referred to as religion, then it survives. It is as old as mankind; theft, rape, something for nothing. The best way to eradicate this filth is to isolate it. Eventually, as has been the way of these attempts at power, it will subside; but only by isolating it and eradicating it; not by accepting it even by way of labeling it, into a religion. When this thuggery succeeds, it attracts the vermin that seek a free ride. When it is limited and offers misery, then it subsides. Read your history. Slavery, bigotry, theft, rape, and a host of other evils have attached themselves to Christianity, Buddhism, Islam throughout history and into the present day. That does not make these evils religion.
issac – slavery is a precept of the Old Testament, not the New Testament. Slavery is a precept of Islam. Does this make the religion evil? Well, only Jews strictly follow the Old Testament, but they don’t have slaves any longer, so they are not evil. Islam, on the other hand, still has slaves and is evil.
Paul
We look to the past for enlightenment, both through our noble achievements and our ignoble ones. Religion serves power. Power is used for noble goals as well as ignoble goals. At this moment in our world the most noble religious expressions are those that include all freedoms as have been chronicled throughout history as being necessary for mankind to continue to evolve, societally. You can work your mumbo jumbo into this to mean whatever you wish; or simply be obtuse as is your way from time to time. The noble anchors of the past serve to allow the noble pursuits of the future. We screw up from time to time and play the blame game. However, when society throughout the world arrives at a level of societal evolution as is found today in most of the world, to refer to the past as a paradigm regarding slavery, etc. its nothing short of self gratification.
ISIS and the other extreme variations that purport to be religions are not, as serves humanity. ISIS is not a religion but a power that uses religion, as with the Catholic religion during the inquisition. You can slip some of your knowledge in here to rub one off. Catholics as wells as most established religions-oil up and define established-do not resort to the methods used to secure followers and power any more. Even the worst examples of Islam are evolving. It is only the desperate harbingers of power that resort to the guise of religion-not religion but the guise-in order to advance their schemes. This can also be found in our own country with the hate, blame, lies, hypocrisy, etc bandied about by both sides. For, it is the fact that we are relegated to two sides that is our anchor to the past and will always prevent America from ‘being great again’. One side against the other is always the easiest way for those prospects for the guise of religion.
issac – basically, you threw a bunch of stuff against the wall and hoped some of it stuck. None of it did because you do not know what you are talking about. You are trying to compare things that are incomparable. Evidently, they do not teach history in Canda because you are illiterate when it comes to World History.
Paul – I believe that Graduate Schools of Education are not only embracing a PC perspective but even more insidious — producing teachers who promote group think. I talked to my niece yesterday who is a hs junior. She was complaining about having to write an essay for history class. I asked her what the issue was as she loves history. Turns out the teacher has put the class in groups so she has to do the essay with 2 other classmates!! All this emphasis on teamwork undermines individuality – students forced to arrive at a “consensus” to pass.
Autumn – well, if we have to arrive at a consensus, I would fail. This sounds like a graduate of the Univ of Phx. They are big in the pod model. Personally, I was never a fan of group work because I did not want to depend on others for my grade
Is that dope Isaac Canadian?
Canada imprisoned Ernst Christof Friedrich Zündel (April 24, 1939 – August 5, 2017) for thought crime of denying the Western-approved definition of “holocaustianity.” Canada and 17 EU nations have such thought crimes, and have actually imprisoned violators.
Canada and EU nations justify such laws by saying that violations are “likely to incite hatred against an identifiable group.” These nations have criminalized hatred. They have criminalized thoughts. Canada also imprisons vendors who print signage and literature in English rather than French.
Isaac should consider cleaning up his own nation’s problems rather than ranting like a spoilt little girl about President Trump.
England has similar thought control laws. Trump recently Tweeted videos originally posted by an English woman, displaying Islamic crimes. She has been arrested prior in England, and faces prison time now, for thinking unkind thoughts Re. Islam.
These are the same POS nations who condemn the USA for our death penalty. What a crock!
Climate fanatics use the exact same justification to imprison climate change “deniers.”
I respectfully request our intrepid blog author Turley do an article Re. thought control laws, specifically Re. “holocaust denial.” Those supporting the Western approved version of holocaustianity state how obvious is the definition. Then why is it necessary to imprison those who disagree? Why not imprison flat earthers?
Upon request, I’ll post link to the following video: a gentlemanly older male displays several ORIGINAL not copied newspapers from the early 20th C, including the NYT. The man reads the articles, which falsely claim the “murder of 6 million innocent Jews.”
The true sole purpose of the invention of Israel was to establish a Western approved government in the middle of the world’s then-primary oil source, being the middle east, in the early stage of the industrial revolution. DNA scientists, even one a Judaic, have proved a thousand times over that so-called “Jew” DNA came from Khazaria, not the ME.
If Jews “need” a Jewish State to exist, why do more than 50% of the world’s Jews chose of their own free will to live elsewhere? People and their cultures live and die every day, to one degree or another. The world no more needs a Jewish State of Israel than it needs to resurrect the ancient Roman capital.
The actual, physical foundation of the Southern Baptist Conference is the nation of Israel. Without the nation of Israel, the SBC ceases to exist. If they love it so much, move Israel to Texas or wherever the hell is the SBC capital.
“The true sole purpose of the invention of Israel was to establish a Western approved government in the middle of the world’s then-primary oil source, being the middle east”
That is pure ignorant bullsh!t.
“slavery is a precept of the Old Testament, not the New Testament . . .”
The apostle Paul would differ with you: “Slaves, obey your human masters with fear and trembling, in the sincerity of your heart . . .” (Eph. 6:5 (NET))
JAY – I will walk that back then. 🙂 Regardless, Christianity does not practice slavery anymore.
The word may have been interpreted as “slaves”. The original Greek used by Paul more correctly meant ‘servants”.
Issacbasonkavick:
Here’s the opinions of the followers of that “worthy and evolving religion” you defend. Lest you think Wahhabism isn’t remarkably well-subscribed, he’s some polls to disabuse you of your fantastic and romantic notions:
We’ll start with the easy one:
𝐁𝐁𝐂 𝐑𝐚𝐝𝐢𝐨 (𝟐𝟎𝟏𝟓): 𝟒𝟓% 𝐨𝐟 𝐁𝐫𝐢𝐭𝐢𝐬𝐡 𝐌𝐮𝐬𝐥𝐢𝐦𝐬 𝐚𝐠𝐫𝐞𝐞 𝐭𝐡𝐚𝐭 𝐜𝐥𝐞𝐫𝐢𝐜𝐬 𝐩𝐫𝐞𝐚𝐜𝐡𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐯𝐢𝐨𝐥𝐞𝐧𝐜𝐞 𝐚𝐠𝐚𝐢𝐧𝐬𝐭 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐖𝐞𝐬𝐭 𝐫𝐞𝐩𝐫𝐞𝐬𝐞𝐧𝐭 “𝐦𝐚𝐢𝐧𝐬𝐭𝐫𝐞𝐚𝐦 𝐈𝐬𝐥𝐚𝐦”.
ICM Poll: 20% of British Muslims sympathize with 7/7 bombers
NOP Research: 1 in 4 British Muslims say 7/7 bombings were justified
Channel Four (2006): 31% of younger British Muslims say 7/7 bombings were justified compared to 14% of those over 45.
People-Press: 31% of Turks support suicide attacks against Westerners in Iraq.
YNet: One third of Palestinians (32%) supported the slaughter of a Jewish family, including the children:
World Public Opinion: 83% of Egyptians approve of attacks on American troops.
26% of Indonesians approve of attacks on American troops.
26% of Pakistanis approve of attacks on American troops.
68% of Moroccans approve of attacks on American troops.
90% of Palestinians approve of attacks on American troops.
72% of Jordanians approve of attacks on American troops.
52% of Turks approve of some or most groups that attack Americans (39% oppose)
A minority of Muslims disagreed entirely with terror attacks on American troops.
About half of those opposed to attacking Americans were sympathetic with al-Qaeda’s attitude toward the U.S.
World Public Opinion (2009): 30% of Palestinians support attacks on American civilians working in Muslim countries. 24% support the murder of Americans on U.S. soil.
Only 74% of Turks and 55% of Pakistanis disapprove of terror attacks against civilians on U.S. soil.
Pew Research (2010): 55% of Jordanians have a positive view of Hezbollah
30% of Egyptians have a positive view of Hezbollah
45% of Nigerian Muslims have a positive view of Hezbollah (26% negative)
43% of Indonesians have a positive view of Hezbollah (30% negative)
Pew Research (2010): 60% of Jordanians have a positive view of Hamas (34% negative).
49% of Egyptians have a positive view of Hamas (48% negative)
49% of Nigerian Muslims have a positive view of Hamas (25% negative)
39% of Indonesians have a positive view of Hamas (33% negative)
Pew Research (2010): 15% of Indonesians believe suicide bombings are often or sometimes justified.
34% of Nigerian Muslims believe suicide bombings are often or sometimes justified.
16% of young Muslims in Belgium state terrorism is “acceptable”.
Populus Poll (2006): 12% of young Muslims in Britain (and 12% overall) believe that suicide attacks against civilians in Britain can be justified. 1 in 4 support suicide attacks against British troops.
Pew Research (2007): 26% of younger Muslims in America believe suicide bombings are justified.
35% of young Muslims in Britain believe suicide bombings are justified (24% overall).
42% of young Muslims in France believe suicide bombings are justified (35% overall).
22% of young Muslims in Germany believe suicide bombings are justified.(13% overall).
29% of young Muslims in Spain believe suicide bombings are justified.(25% overall).
Pew Research (2011): 8% of Muslims in America believe suicide bombings are often or sometimes justified (81% never).
28% of Egyptian Muslims believe suicide bombings are often or sometimes justified (38% never).
ICM Poll: 25% of British Muslims disagree that a Muslim has an obligation to report terrorists to police.
Populus Poll (2006): 16% of British Muslims believe suicide attacks against Israelis are justified.
37% believe Jews in Britain are a “legitimate target”.
World Public Opinion: Majorities in Egypt (63%) and Libya (61%) supported the 9/11/2012 attacks against American embassies, including Benghazi.
Pew Research (2013): At least 1 in 4 Muslims do not reject violence against civilians (study did not distinguish between those who believe it is partially justified and never justified).
Pew Research (2013): 15% of Muslims in Turkey support suicide bombings (also 11% in Kosovo, 26% in Malaysia and 26% in Bangladesh).
PCPO (2014): 89% of Palestinians support Hamas and other terrorists firing rockets at Israeli civilians.
Pew Research (2013): Only 57% of Muslims worldwide disapprove of al-Qaeda. Only 51% disapprove of the Taliban. 13% support both groups and 1 in 4 refuse to say.
Palestinian Center for Political Research (2015): 74% of Palestinians support Hamas terror attacks.
“The real danger in this country doesn’t come from the obvious idiots that grab the microphone from time to time but from those that immediately label them left, or right, liberal or conservative, progressive or regressive.”
Then you grab that microphone to say
“It is this responsive angst that gets buffoons like Trump elected: ”
Hmmm, Issac, do you realize who you were initially talking about?
Issac, the topic was a guy that published a genocidal screed in the newspaper published by a publicly supported university. Would you not agree that it is wrong to suggest eradication of a race?
You banter a lot about “liberal/conservative”. Let me guess, you are a “third way” type? Do tell, what is your “third way”?
Third way types would never vote Republican if a loaded gun was put in their mouth. They’d just say, “shoot!”
They are liars like Isaac, who want to perceive themselves as being above it, and want to elevate themselves above their common liberal progressive libtard friends.