Below is my column for BBC on the Sanders campaign and my recent discussion of the election with over a dozen of his supporters at the University of Michigan. Biden is being portrayed as the effective nominee after last Tuesday and at least one Democrat is suggesting the cancelation of the remaining primaries. However, polls show a distinct lack of excitement about Biden as a candidate. His express selling point is that he is better situated to defeat Trump. That leaves an obvious vacuum on positive passion that was so evident at the Sanders rally that I attended.
Here is the column:
Standing in front of the library of the University of Michigan on Sunday, Bernie Sanders could be excused if he paused a moment to reflect on the estimated ten thousands of cheering supporters.
It was 60 years ago at the University of Chicago that Sanders began what he later described as “the major period of intellectual ferment in my life”.
Sanders joined the Young People’s Socialist League and other organisations and organised his first protest. He could only marshal a force of 32 students to occupy the administration building, but he ultimately prevailed. Sanders spent much of his life fighting for big ideas with small crowds.
Now, he has not just the numbers but the movement that he always dreamt of. Indeed, he is the movement. While some might not want socialism, everyone in this crowd desperately wants Sanders.
Watching from the edge of the massive crowd was one person who knew all too well what Sanders may have been thinking as he stood before this university crowd. Alan Haber smiled while holding fliers for Earth Day, wearing a tiny pin that simply read “SDS.”
The initials stood for The Students for a Democratic Society, a radical student organisation from the 1960s. Hader was its first president. Although others grew more moderate or conservative with age, Sanders and Hader continued to organise and agitate and wait for the crowd that might eventually form.
Those crowds got smaller and smaller for decades. Now the crowd was finally here and waiting for the first major presidential candidate in our lifetimes to call himself an unabashed socialist.
Most of Sanders’ supporters would not be born for decades when he stormed the UChicago administrative building. However, they identified with this 78-year-old radical in a way that Joe Biden can only dream of. Before the rally, I found two students setting up the stage hours before Sanders would emerge.
Arden Shapiro and Hazel Gordon are precisely why the Democratic establishment is so worried about this movement – and so seemingly incapable of tapping into its energy. While they would vote for Biden if forced to in an election against Trump, they see Sanders as the only true and clear voice in the race.
Arden said that she was “really angry” about the level of corporate control in our system perpetrated by both parties. A trans woman, Hazel said that she saw Sanders as the only person truly fighting to help people secure medical insurance, particularly mental health coverage.
Hazel said that she viewed Biden as taking the side of corporations and did not support anything she believed in. Arden would later help introduce Sanders at the rally and called on her fellow students to bring five friends to the polling places to secure a win in Michigan over the establishment.
Others were even more direct. There were the guys distributing “Eat the Rich” T-shirts. Another supporter carried a sign reading “Make Racists Afraid Again”. Those images unnerve many traditional Democratic voters who see this movement as potentially careening out of control.
Sanders has never done particularly well with people of his own age. Many of those who once joined his causes in the 1960s are now worried about their 401k accounts and social security payments. Sanders had to wait for a new generation and they are here in droves. The problem for the Democratic party is that they are including leaders like Biden in their fight against the “establishment”.
Indeed Sanders drove home that point in his speech where he denounced Biden and his “billionaire backers” for trying to kill this movement. The only reference in the speech that drew greater boos than Biden was a reference to ICE raids.
For them, the future lies with Bernie and younger voices like Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez who electrified the crowd. Whatever happens Tuesday, Sanders has found his audience and they are not going away. Sanders has shaped a rising generation that does not recoil from the term “socialism” and believes, as he did, that compromise only invites betrayal.
Every establishment figure now appears lined up against Sanders and over a dozen people told me that the concerted effort has only angered them more with the Democratic party. While half insisted that they would reluctantly vote for Biden if needed, half were not sure or outright refused to support Biden.
In other words, many are likely to stay at home. They are ready to storm the White House, the ultimate administrative building, for Bernie but not willing to walk into a polling place for Biden.
One former Michigan graduate wearing a homemade “Socialist Butterfly” jacket with Bernie’s picture on it said that she became a socialist after listening to Sanders in 2016. She is back again in 2020 with the same commitment. She still “feels the Bern” but feels nothing for Biden.
The Democratic establishment is hoping that the hatred for Trump will fill that void, but the co-ordinated effort against Sanders is only reaffirming the view that it is the establishment writ large that is the problem.
Jonathan Turley gives legal analysis for the BBC and is the Shapiro Professor of Public Interest Law at George Washington University. He was called as a Republican witness to testify at the Trump impeachment hearing before the House Judiciary Committee.
Sure, people have gotten really excited for thousands of years at the prospect of raiding their neighbors and looting all their stuff. Those without economic literacy will not predict any change in jobs or the economy. There is the fabled mythical money tree that will spring up, eternal, to pay for all the free stuff Bernie Sanders is demanding as the entitlement of everyone on the globe, and all illegal aliens welcome to come partake of its generosity. There will be money for all, food for all, jobs for all, in fact all jobs will be pleasant and rewarding, college for all, degrees in whatever you like for all, no more fossil fuels but magically everything made of fossil fuels for all, housing for all, pot for all…it will be like the frolicking, thoughtless Eloi from The Time Machine. No one will grow old because they will be euthanized by the free healthcare for all. It will be called the Morlock Healthcare Act.
People should put their passion into each other, not fake candidates. Bernie will once again betray his supporters and back Biden. He’s already said he would do so. My question to Bernie people is, if you want a real movement for change, why aren’t you looking to each other? Bernie will do what Bernie always does, just as he is told. You do not need Bernie. You need to pull together with every person who wants the best for our nation and try to make justice in this nation again. Bernie is a millstone regarding that prospect and I don’t know why his followers can’t see who he truly is.
In the meantime: “According to his lawyers, Assange was ‘handcuffed 11 times; stripped naked twice and searched’, the IBAHRI says. Assange’s case files were also confiscated after the first day of the hearing, which will decide whether Assange will be extradited to the US, where he is wanted on 18 charges of attempted hacking and breaches of the 1917 Espionage Act. Proceedings began last month, were adjourned after four days, and are set to resume on 18 May.
IBAHRI co-chair the Hon Michael Kirby said Assange’s treatment may constitute breaches of his right to a fair trial and protections enshrined in the United Nations Convention against Torture and Other Cruel, Inhuman or Degrading Treatment or Punishment. ‘It is deeply shocking that as a mature democracy in which the rule of law and the rights of individuals are preserved, the UK government has been silent and has taken no action to terminate such gross and disproportionate conduct by Crown officials. Many countries in the world look to Britain as an example in such matters,’ Kirby said. ‘On this occasion, the example is shocking and excessive.’
read about it!
“Bernie will once again betray his supporters and back Biden.”
What’s that saying, ‘Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice shame on me.’ Bernie Bros are fools and suckers.
According to The Guardian, “former secretary of state Madeleine Albright has endorsed Joe Biden for the 2020 Democratic party nomination.”
Yes, that’s the same Madeleine Albright who thought that half a million Iraqi children dying because of U.S. sanctions on Iraq was “worth it”. But regarding that outrageous, immoral statement by her, hardly any attention from the mass media in the U.S.
https://fair.org/extra/we-think-the-price-is-worth-it/
Yet another example of why the mass media can’t be counted on to help the citizenry make informed electoral choices.
Yes, that’s the same Madeleine Albright who thought that half a million Iraqi children dying because of U.S. sanctions on Iraq was “worth it”. But regarding that outrageous, immoral statement by her, hardly any attention from the mass media in the U.S.
I guess biologist don’t care about precise citation.
Albright, like anyone else with serious responsibilities, has to assess trade-offs. You just strike poses.
Albright later apologized for the exchange which she claimed set a false premise she did not challenge- Saddam`a part in allocating resources as there were no sanctions on food or medicine – and the researcher responsible for the estimate of deaths, retracted after revisiting both Baghdad and her study.
Psmag.com/news/the-iraq-sanctions-myth-56433
In any case, candidates are not responsible for the entire life of those who endorse them.
@bythebook:
I think you’ve missed the “elephant in the room”. Regardless of whether the estimate of Iraqi children deaths caused by U.S. sanctions was accurate, in fact, even if it had been entirely hypothetical, Albright stated that number of deaths was “worth it”. The “collateral damage” rationalizations she was willing to engage in say worlds about her, and I have nothing but contempt for her.
And while I don’t judge Biden entirely by one endorsement, it does end up in the pile of accumulating evidence regarding what I might expect from his presidency. And it ain’t good.
i agree that a candidate is not responsible for their endorsements. that’s an endless waste of time to try and sort out.
albright however is a loser, she was a war hawk, you can’t dress it up.
Biologist, should the Clinton administration have canceled sanctions on Iraq and normalized relations with Saddam Hussein?
@Seth Warner:
You ask: “Should the Clinton administration have canceled sanctions on Iraq and normalized relations with Saddam Hussein?”
A compound question from you. The sanctions as structured were hurting people we shouldn’t have been hurting. We could have chosen different sanctions, or found some other way to apply pressure. And not having those (or indeed, any) sanctions in no way implies that we should have normalized relations with him.
Furthermore, while sanctioning Saddam, we were perfectly willing to have normal political and commercial relations with China, an oppressive dictatorship.
Biologist, it doesnt sound like you have any specific answer here. The truth is that Saddam’s regime was exploiting sanctions to profit off black markets. Those 500,000 children that died more than likely died from Saddam’s policies. But you’re just trying to blame Bill Clinton who never mounted a real invasion. I suspect you’re nothing more than a disgruntled Bernie Bro.
Bernie gives fiery speeches. So did Fidel Castro….Then Fidel fell
When the political and economic establishment — in both major parties — has such a firm grip on the nomination process, 10% of the American public thinks “Judge Judy” is on the Supreme Court, and an even greater percentage is watching “The Masked Singer”, it’s no wonder that the primary season will bring us a general election “choice” of Biden or Trump.
Who is this establishment you think controls both parties, and how did they let Trump become the GOP candidates and leave their supposedly hand picked Democratic candidate dead broke only 2 weeks ago?
Your candidate can’t win an election outside of Vermont- both Michigan and Washington state voted for Biden. Face facts. That doesn’t make him a bad person or even not the best candidate- my first choice is long gone – but most Democrats don’t agree with you or him.
@bythebook
Oh, the Democratic establishment (and more than a few Republicans) would probably have rather had Bloomberg, or Buttigieg, for example, but when those didn’t get enough traction with the voters, they started pushing Biden.
Who is “they” and if they are the establishment how are they so weak? You get that Buttigieg`s supposed 60 billionaires were limited to $2800 each, right ($168,000 total by the way and public information). How did they get all those black voters in SC and elsewhere to pivot from the plan you imagine was in place?
@bythebook
Yes, I know that there are relatively low limits for direct contributions to candidates. But I’m sure you know full well that people and corporations have other ways of supporting specific candidates and helping them get elected. (Doubly-so after “Citizens United”). And candidates have many ways of indirectly demonstrating their “appreciation”. It’s the standard unstated quid pro quo of politics, and it’s relevant not only to Trump, but also to most major party politicians.
” You get that Buttigieg`s supposed 60 billionaires were limited to $2800 each, right ($168,000 total by the way and public information).”
Pure ignorance.
If you think the extent of the billionaires’ influence in a candidate’s election is limited to their individual contributions, you’re a rube.
Furthermore, “They” – the major donors, the think tanks, the mainstream media, the DNC, the other failed candidates, etc.. – obviously had only major preference, anybody but Sanders. Once a crack of daylight was exposed in the South Carolina primary, “They” made a strategic move in coalescing around Biden since Pete and Klobuchar could not make any inroads with the southern Black vote.
This was not some sort of clandestine conspiracy. “They” obviously did not want Sanders. Pete and Amy played ball by dropping out of the race, and the PR machine got behind Joe in full force just in time for Super Tuesday. Do you think this same sort of consolidation would have played if Biden wouldn’t have mopped the floor with the others in South Carolina? What would the outcome have been last week if that didn’t happen?
Another example of “Their” influence is the total absence of coverage of Biden’s obvious drift toward senility. What if the media devoted half as much coverage to his sundowning comments about being arrested with Mandela, confusing his wife with his sister, bizarre comments like “…all men and women created by the-go-you know you thing,” as much as Sanders’s comments about Cuban literacy or the repeated Socialist references? My guess would be that a lot Joe’s voter base, who the exit polling has shown have overwhelmingly picked him based on electability and not based on his policy, would have moved to the Sanders camp. But we’ll never know because, in what has to be deliberate effort by the media, he still is not making any major appearances.
it’s no wonder that the primary season will bring us a general election “choice” of Biden or Trump.
Has nothing to do with it. If there actually are people who are confused and think Judith Scheindlin is on the Supreme Court, they’re derived from the 30% of the population who never vote.
And, no it isn’t politically disengaged people who gave you Trump v. Biden, but the people who care to vote in primaries and caucuses, who are your most engaged people. At no time in the history have more than 20% of the adult citizen population cast ballots in such events.
As for Trump, there haven’t been many candidates for the office who’ve been anywhere near as accomplished in the world outside of electoral politics. Its something of a step down for him to be doing what he’s doing. If you cast a ballot for Barack Obama, a man who at age 44 had had a simulacrum of an adult life rather than the reality of one, it takes some mix of stupidity and chutzpah to complain about anyone else’s electoral choices.
So, was it the inheritance, the multiple bankruptcies leaving banks and sheet rock hangers holding the bag, Trump Universiy, ripping off his own charity, or claiming the greatest loss for the year of any American to the IRS in the 90’s that made you think Trump was presidential timber?
You never stop recycling the same lies. The thumbs up you give Natacha are a function of the two of you having the same MO.
He applied for reorganization on the same set of Atlantic City properties 4x before selling them some years ago. He was an equity investor in those properties, just like everyone else. When you’ve mastered the concept of ‘equity investor’, you can move on to attempting to demonstrate that the lenders in question took haircuts. I have news for you: sheet rock hangers very seldom extend loans to their employers.
As has been noted before, the family’s older residential real estate business is run by his brother. Trump invested in lines of business his father never entered – commercial real estate in Manhattan, resort properties, entertainment properties. His net worth exceeded his father’s by 1982.
I guess Trump shares his tax returns with TIA, so he has information the rest of us lack. Trump stiffed small timers and banks.
“….Donald Trump often portrays himself as a savior of the working class who will “protect your job.” But a USA TODAY NETWORK analysis found he has been involved in more than 3,500 lawsuits over the past three decades — and a large number of those involve ordinary Americans, like the Friels, who say Trump or his companies have refused to pay them.
At least 60 lawsuits, along with hundreds of liens, judgments, and other government filings reviewed by the USA TODAY NETWORK, document people who have accused Trump and his businesses of failing to pay them for their work. Among them: a dishwasher in Florida. A glass company in New Jersey. A carpet company. A plumber. Painters. Forty-eight waiters. Dozens of bartenders and other hourly workers at his resorts and clubs, coast to coast. Real estate brokers who sold his properties. And, ironically, several law firms that once represented him in these suits and others.
Trump’s companies have also been cited for 24 violations of the Fair Labor Standards Act since 2005 for failing to pay overtime or minimum wage, according to U.S. Department of Labor data. That includes 21 citations against the defunct Trump Plaza in Atlantic City and three against the also out-of-business Trump Mortgage LLC in New York. Both cases were resolved by the companies agreeing to pay back wages.
In addition to the lawsuits, the review found more than 200 mechanic’s liens — filed by contractors and employees against Trump, his companies or his properties claiming they were owed money for their work — since the 1980s. The liens range from a $75,000 claim by a Plainview, N.Y., air conditioning and heating company to a $1 million claim from the president of a New York City real estate banking firm. On just one project, Trump’s Taj Mahal casino in Atlantic City, records released by the New Jersey Casino Control Commission in 1990 show that at least 253 subcontractors weren’t paid in full or on time, including workers who installed walls, chandeliers and plumbing.
The actions in total paint a portrait of Trump’s sprawling organization frequently failing to pay small businesses and individuals, then sometimes tying them up in court and other negotiations for years. In some cases, the Trump teams financially overpower and outlast much smaller opponents, draining their resources. Some just give up the fight, or settle for less; some have ended up in bankruptcy or out of business altogether….”
https://eu.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/elections/2016/06/09/donald-trump-unpaid-bills-republican-president-laswuits/85297274/
I guess Trump shares his tax returns with TIA, so he has information the rest of us lack. Trump stiffed small timers and banks.
You keep making this assertion. But you never say who got stiffed or for how much.
Tax returns are not balance sheets and they’re not bankruptcy settlements, so no clue why you’d bring that up. Just who does the bookkeeping for your business?
“….Donald Trump often portrays himself as a savior of the working class who will “protect your job.” But a USA TODAY NETWORK analysis found he has been involved in more than 3,500 lawsuits over the past three decades — and a large number of those involve ordinary Americans, like the Friels, who say Trump or his companies have refused to pay them.
Who did the ‘analysis’?
Did you notice the weasel words ‘has been involved in’? Plaintiff, defendant, co-respondent or what?
I’d suggest also you read George McGovern’s account of his foray into the hotel and conference center business. Years after ceasing operations, he was still trying to settle lawsuits, mostly, he said, from people alleging personal injury on his property.
DSS, I don’t think Anon will ever understand the concept of ‘equity investor’. He thinks he is a financial genius because he can do his own personal taxes which are likely menial at best. I think he is most talented at separating bent nails from the straight ones.
One should note that it was shortly after those Atlantic City bankruptcies that Trump signed onto The Apprentice. Which suggests he really needed the money.
it shows he refocused from operations onto branding. and that he expected to make better money at branding,. which he obviously has. smart
No, Kurtz. Trump is a day-trading snake oil salesman who rooks vulnerable, gullible people who are xenophobic, racist, misogynistic and who believe what they see on reality TV. They’re the same people who think that professional wrestling is for real.
Smart and shrewd aren’t the same thing. Trump is not smart in the sense of being intelligent, but he is shrewd and manipulative.
Natch: so strident! Ever the screeching harridan, the kind of person who just loves to say that big men, right wingers, Republicans etc, anybody not on your happy list, is unintelligent.
and yet when presented with evidence to the contrary,never retracts, nor bothers to qualify.
what does that make her? does that indicate intelligence? or merely intensity?
or perhaps Trump is all the bad that she says. To which i might reply: “it took one to know one! ” because her pattern of strident vitriolic posts have no obvious design except to divide and enflame.
I have not heard her ever qualify nor retract a single falsehood of years of prattling on this website. She is by far the most consistently vicious commentator in endless insutls and sweeping defamations and falsehoods, almost entirely aimed at one man, Donald Trump.
Nobody in the anti-Trump faction has staked out a position even half as ardently hateful and unqualified as her. You guys better try harder! Book, you have tried but you’re far behind.
From her words one would think that the only bad person in America worth denouncing was Trump! IT has all the intensity and single mindedness of Captain Ahab chasing the white whale.
Natch, you get the gold star cap in the red guard mob.
Here is your type. read it and understand; there is still time to turn back from your wolf’s milk
https://www.cnn.com/2016/05/15/asia/china-cultural-revolution-red-guard-confession/index.html
Kurtz, you are too kind to Nastytata.
Kurtz, you have no idea if it was smart or successful since he has hidden his tax returns. The very people who think he’s a big success – like you and TIA- cheer him on. Meanwhile, he can’t get bank loans.
“accomplished in the world”? Really? Accomplished at what, exactly? Bankrupting businesses? Racking up thousands of lawsuits for cheating contractors and suppliers? He was supported by his father well into his forties because everything he did flopped. What about Trump University ($25 million settlement with his victims). How about Trump Steaks? Trump golf accessories? What about the consent decree to settle the racial discrimination in housing lawsuit? What about 3 failed marriages? (I count the current one as failed because he cheats on her, like the previous 2). Then, there’s his military career. He cheated his way out of service to his country, too, by lying like he has done all of his life. The only thing he’s been successful at so far is selling himself as a reality TV performer. You saw his heavily-tranquilized performance last night. No one buys it. The market is tanking again today.
What I find amazing is that people like you think you are sufficiently superior that you can criticize other people, including Obama’s very successful presidency, when you fall for the “self-made billionaire” persona of a reality TV performer. You really believe it is a step down for Don the Con to be stinking up the White House? OK. Have him get the hell out before we’re in a complete recession.
Accomplished at building a business, Natacha. What are your accomplishments?
What business is that? Trump companies? They’re trying to sell the lease for the old post office in Washington, D.C. because it’s failing. They have to borrow money from Russians and Saudi Arabians because they are deadbeats. They are losing money.
But….tell you what: let’s see the tax returns. That’ll settle this once and for all.
“Obama’s very successful presidency”……?? Says who??
A survey of historians rated Obama our 12th best President. They had Reagan higher, an unexplainable outcome I admit.
12th best based on what, popularity numbers with the public?? Natacha thinks popularity equals success. A survey of the Democrat party that he left in shambles would suggest otherwise. Democrats lost more than one thousand seats in state legislatures, governors’ mansions, and Congress during Obama’s time in office More Democratic state legislative seats were lost under Obama than under any president in modern history. So much for nurturing his political party to carry on whatever accomplishments he had, besides Obamacare, which is a disaster.
I think Obama was better than Republicans credit him, but I can’t imagine how he could be considered the “12th best.”
Trump is also far better than he’s credited by Democrats. But we know there’s no fairness to be had in such things., And most “historians” ie taxpayer funded university perfessers, are likely Democrats by a very wide margin.
As I noted, the historians had Reagan ahead of Obama.
https://www.politico.com/story/2017/02/all-time-best-president-united-states-rankings-235149
Natacha – Obama was a very successful president and Joe Biden was the greatest VP this country has ever seen, right? Congratulations, you’ve been propagandized.
Natacha – Obama had a “historic” presidency. That does not equal “successful” presidency. Even Progressives and Democrats would not call Obama a “successful” president.
Turley’s Poor Bernie Columns Are An Avoidance Of Trump
But now these Poor Bernie columns are a daily feature of this blog. They seldom vary. ‘Bernie is an enlightened visionary whom Democrats are wantonly rejecting’.
I believe Turley’s motives for writing these columns are twofold:
1) By harping on Bernie, Turley avoids Donald Trump who has conspired with rightwing media to misinform the public regarding the Coronavirus. Only yesterday did Trump finally acknowledge the danger after weeks of playing it down.
2) Turley wishes to create a paper/e-trail expressing sympathy for Independent Bernie. This way Turley can claim he’s ‘not’ a Trump defender. And with Trump currently imploding, Turley has a strong motivation to distance himself.
So if these Poor Bernie columns seem redundant, Turley is only positioning himself. Please stand by for more newsworthy columns sometime in the future.
JT positions himself as the Miss Manners columnist for Democrats while meanwhile, daily, an indecent , lying, braggart president pollutes our system without his comment. Of course Katy Tur (sp?) is as powerful as the president, if not more so, so his vigilance is well placed.
“Only yesterday did Trump finally acknowledge the danger after weeks of playing it down.”
Paint Chips, that is a lie. His first discussion was optimistic but he said that things could be good or get a lot worse. He covered the entire spectrum. Where have you been all this time with regard to influenza this season which I believe has been involved in the deaths of well over 100 Americans every DAY? Do you know how many Corona deaths we have had since January? You obviously don’t because knowledge takes work and to you ignorance is bliss.
Allan: He said that COVID-19 was a hoax. I previously alluded to an interview I saw last weekend with a Trump supporter who said she believed it was a hoax, and that COVID-19 was just the flu and that Democrats were using it to attack Trump. Trump, Jr. actually accused Democrats of hoping millions of people will die, so they can use that against Trump. There has never been any Democrat who has said anything like this.
Listen to what Trump actually said the first time he spoke: he said there were 15 cases, all of them not very ill, but one was sicker (he was on a ventilator), but they’d all get better, and “very soon” there will be 0 cases. Then, he threw in a statement that it might get worse, but we’d have a vaccine “very quickly”, which Dr. Fauci immediately corrected. With absolutely no evidence, he said it would be gone by April. There’s no reason to believe that this virus behaves like seasonal influenza at this point. The entire tenor of his speech was deceitful and misleading–his sad attempt to play down an impending crisis, but the problem is there are gullible people who believe what he says. That’s where the practice of Fox News passing along talking points or pivoting to try to make Trump look good cross the line into immorality. This includes their attacks on mainstream media. They have convinced Trump supporters that mainstream media cannot be trusted. Last evening, I saw an interview with an older woman who was turned away from some game or another because of COVID-19. She said the media were exaggerating the risk. She might wind up dead because she’s been misled into believing that the COVID-19 pandemic was made up by media to “get Trump”. That’s what happens when you have a pathological liar in the White House. He cannot be trusted.
The misleading argument about seasonal flu and the morbidity and mortality is another Fox News misleading talking point used to try to downplay the lack of readiness due to Trump’s incompetence and mishandling of this crisis. With influenza, there are treatments–Tamiflu, for instance, plus there are vaccines. We don’t have any treatments or a vaccine for COVID-19, which is a “novel” virus. It is clearly way more virulent than seasonal flu, and has a much higher mortality rate. We still don’t know all of the means of transmission–droplets to be sure, but studies have shown it can live up to 9 days on surfaces under certain conditions. Because of the lack of testing, positive cases are still out there infecting others. The situation with seasonal flu is irrelevant to the risk of COVID-19.
Last evening was indeed the first time Trump admitted there’s a problem, but he still had to praise himself repeatedly, and reassured big business that they’d be taken care of by us taxpayers. His banning of travel from Europe other than the UK makes no sense. There are 12 European countries with fewer COVID-19 cases than the UK, plus he didn’t ban travel to and from S. Korea, which is a hot bed of COVID-19. What’s to stop someone in a “banned” country from going to England and traveling from there? He also said that young people don’t get very sick, but older people and those with comorbidities don’t do as well. This is also misleading. Young people generally do better, but they can die, too, so if someone is in the younger age group, they shouldn’t feel they are safe. Importantly, they infect others, so they need to stay quarantined.
” He said that COVID-19 was a hoax”
No you are misquoting him. He said that the blame being put on him for coronovirus by the Dems and mass media was a hoax, and it is. The virus is no hoax, obviously.
Now that’s not to say that he has made all the right moves. He hasn’t and dowplaying it was a big mistake.
I’ll add this. The CDC was plenty mismanaged at the outset of this and that was an institutional issue preceeding trump and whatever budgetary choices he made to strip them of some funding, which was not the right move either
At some point you have to allow that the US government is huge and full of deeply ingrained institutional cultures and that there is a limited power in any POTUS to rectify existing problems. Because that is clearly reality
I could give some examples of problems that Obama had with existing federal institutions which gave him needless trouble but then you or somebody else would get triggered by the notion of the “Deep State” but yes it exists and its constituencies fumble the ball often.
That will continue to matter who is president and about the only chance there is of shaking up the deeply incompetent and selfish parts of the federal bureacracy is another term of Trump. Who knows how this year will end up however and it’s almost a certainty other incompetent bureacracies like FEMA will show all their inglorious ineptitude before this mess is done.
Fools like Natch will leap to blame every failure which will be perpetrated by every ingrained, incompetent federal bureaucracy on Trump, who, as we konw, has been the target of the Famous But Incompetent from before he was even sworn in!
I’ll say this. the CHICOMS are a bunch of gangsters but there are days when i look at them and say at least they seem like an organized pack of hoodlums instead of a bunch of rival competing gangs like our federal apparatchiks!
NUTCHACHA’s “benefits,” “entitlements” and right to kill babies are threatened by Americans (Americans believe in the Constitution and the Constitution is distinctly conservative). Whatever will this false construct, NUTCHACHA, do in an environment of freedom wherein she must perform and succeed on her own merit in the total absence of the crutches of generational welfare, affirmative action privilege, etc.
To begin with, NUTCHACHA would have to show the proper deference and respect to her superiors, as do all actual Americans, before she would even be allowed to attempt to put her foot in the door. NUTCHACHA is so supported by communists and communistic laws and programs that she has no fear. Big surprise.
NUTCHACHA is a loser.
Under communism, there are no losers.
He outright said that COVID-19 was a hoax, made up by the Democrats. Later on, after massive backlash, he then tried to correct what he said earlier by arguing that what he meant to say was that Democrats were turning it into a hoax to attack him. It’s just like the attempt to repair his praise for White Supremacists in Charlottesville after they killed Heather Heyer.
Failures at the CDC did NOT precede Trump. Obama set up the multi-agency collaborative rapid response team which Trump dismantled and he did de-fund CDC. That was a serious mistake, because these scientists would have been on top of this last December, we’d know a lot more about how this virus behaves by now, and we could have jump-started research into chemotherapy and a vaccine. Trump also said he could get back these scientists “very quickly’. They’ve all moved on to jobs in academia and industry, and they’re not going to give up their jobs for a temporary gig at the CDC. Plus, they’re not up to speed. We are way, way behind. As an example: I went to my dentist this morning, and asked about face masks. The hygienist told me that they don’t know if their standing order will get filled. She said dentists who don’t have standing orders are scrambling.
I doubt anyone really believes that the CDC, as a government agency for example, is deeply incompetent. What we lack now is a leader who cares more about us than the stock market and soliciting praise and adulation, and who won’t lie to us. It’s the lying that is spreading fear and distrust.
“He outright said that COVID-19 was a hoax”
That statement rattles in your head but it isn’t true. You need to be strapped down.
You took her quote out of context, not adding the clause “made up by the Democrats”…which is precisely what Trump said.
Yes, Trump said something like that when he discussed the claims made by Democrats that seem to be so happy that people will die and suffer.
Nat has been making false claims forever. You can join her.
Natacha –
https://www.factcheck.org/2020/03/trump-and-the-new-hoax/
“Allan: He said that COVID-19 was a hoax.”
That is not true. If it were you could provide a tape, but you can’t.
I stopped reading after the first bit of nonsense so if you think there is anything of particular importance in the rest of your reply let me know.
Why is this old fool Alen still coughing phlegm on these threads??? He adds nothing to any discussions.
Beatrix, are you Alan or Estovir? It’s funny Alan didnt reply for himself here. Has he been Beatrix a along?
Paint Chips, I am not like you, Anon, Anonymous or anyone that cannot live with themselves. I keep one name and only one name. Try being honest and then you don’t need to constantly change your name.
Paint Chips I am here because you have an intellectual disability and I want to see to it that others recognize the dangers of eating lead paint. You have reached the moron stage so there is little we can do for you but we can use you as the example of what happens.
I don’t think there is any evidence that Turley intends any such thing
The only thing I would agreewith you said seth peter is that Trump was downplaying coronavirus. That was a big mistake. and yes he finally is up to speed.
By the way, Steve Bannon was on record almost all the way back to January saying coronavirus was a big deal and very bad thing coming. But we know that Steve Bannon was forced out in the first year or so, and you guys hate his guts for whatever reasons.
Steve Bannon said weeks ago that Trump should come out big and hard against corona virus. Bannon was right and Trump should fire whatever losers told him to downplay it, and bring him back on board asap.
Mr Kurtz – if you guys had/have been following the daily reports of Styx, you would know how much trouble we could be in and how much trouble China is in. BTW, still do not trust the numbers from China.
i have been following Simone Gao and Dr Steve Hatfill and Guo Wenghui who have been on Bannon’s show
and a lot of other sources including my own, guanxi connections on the ground near the banks of the Yellow river
the China numbers are understated, but we are seeing the same problem emerging here, a lack of adequate testing. this is to some extent a function of the novel nature of the virus on both sides
but on their side, a deliberate understatement for political reasons–
here the understatement relates to the big existing problem of the offshored nature of reagent manufacturing. there is a shortage of the chemical necessary to extract RNA for test kits, because why?
because it’s made in china!
https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2020-03-11/coronavirus-testing-kits-lack-key-ingredient-causing-confusion
i also follow certain financial analysts who have been deep into the facts on this since the Lunar new year
so far the year of the Rat is a disaster!
I don’t trust China, either, Paul, so we are in agreement on this point. But, what’s sad is that Chinese restaurants here in the US are being rejected, and some Chinese people are being harassed. It’s like the toilet paper shortage: irrational fear, which Trump bears some measure of blame for causing because of his mishandling of this crisis.
Natacha – Trump has been telling people not to panic. How the hell is he responsible for the run on toilet paper?
Because no one believes anything he has to say. I think it’s monkey-see-monkey-do. You walk into a store and see people with shopping carts piled high with toilet paper, and you think that maybe they know something you don’t, so I probably should load up some, too. (I must admit: I did this last Friday). I don’t think TP comes from China, but it’s fear and distrust of the federal government.
Natch, you’re a fool. The primary source of business for Chinese restaurants in Chinatown is Chinese people. The primary source of business for restaurants outside Chinatowns, is Americans. All restaurants are feeling the hurt and soon going to feel it worse.
one small positive on this disaster is that Asian Americans are arming themselves, wisely, as a precaution against unforeseen contingencies which may arise. Arms are insurance policies against not one thing but a thousand things.
We welcome our fellow law abiding Americans in arming themselves per their Second Amendment rights! And we know that folks like AR -15s, and it was Democrat candidate Joe Biden who said just a day ago that nobody needs an AR-14! Im sure he meant AR 15 of course.
https://abc7.com/gun-sales-surge-in-asian-communities-during-coronavirus/6004628/
Business is off at all places where people can expect to catch the a virus, in case you havent noticed.
It’s ridiculous to blame Trump but that’s all you can do. you’re like a worser more irrational and annoying version of the bozos who blamed Obama for every bad thing.
Anyhow i am in regular contact with Chinese owned businesses on a near daily basis. The regular customers are still regulars, but that too will dwindle off as people get the picture about the necessity of containment at this urgent time.
First of all, I didn’t say that Chinese restaurants should be boycotted– just that this is happening. Someone explained it to me thusly: you don’t know who’s working in the kitchen of a Chinese restaurant. Maybe some relative who came here before the travel ban, and could still pass it around. There are reports that you can get COVID-19 a second time. The idea seems stupid to me, but there’s fear here, and Trump’s downplaying of the infection, calling it a “hoax”, his false claims that we’d have 0 cases and a vaccine “very soon” feed into this fear. I haven’t blamed Trump for anything other than his lying and lack of leadership. It was the height of irresponsibility to ever downplay COVID-19 as a “hoax”, or for Don, Jr. to say Democrats want millions of people to die so Trump will look bad. That is politicizing this crisis.
Nat, why don’t you opine about the H1N! (Swine Flu) of 2009. Then you might get a bit of perspective.
Natch repeated something that AOC is blathering on the internet, that Chinese restaurants are losing business because of racism. i just watched her say it again. oh, i doubt it.
i’ll point someething out here about AOC and her own district which includes Queens New York. That includes a “new” Chinatown called Flushing.
Flushing has hundreds of Chinese restaurants. And it’s like 75% Asian by population in the neighborhoods. That means if they are losing business, it’s mostly because Asians aren’t coming. Nothing to do with racism unless you’re trying to maintain they’re racist against themselves. Which seems unlikely to me, but what do I know.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hUdzo_Xs1kw
just listen and you will hear Mandarin. a little English, but Mandarin, Putonhua, not Guandong hua. Cantonese that is. Can you tell the difference? I can.
Now, let me ask you, if a Chinese resident of America says, let’s not eat out at Chinese restaurant, because maybe ….. is that racist? I have heard that very same thing several times the past month…. from Chinese people here. : “bu yao Zhong guo cai”
JT is still busy carrying Trump water while pretending otherwise. If by “establishment ” he means the millions of American Democratic voters who have rejected Bernie, he may have a point, but the election of both Obama and Trump tells us that what he means for the word is very weak to non-existent in our modern world. It somehow had managed to leave Biden flat broke before hundreds of thousands of Sout Carolinian blacks resuscitated his candidacy. Some establishment that it is. While JT was looking elsewhere, party politics became a brand only and personalities, funded by internet donations and a $2800 limit for even those billionaires Bernie keeps telling us are buying Biden, the ephemeral but true powers in modern politics. JT should try to keep up with the modern trends obvious to even amateur observers, and no, the establishment, which even “allows” non-party members to run in its primaries, is not responsible for Biden, Voters are.
Thanks for the article, Professor. And thanks for the hollow responses of the Trumpsters.
Setting aside polling data and pivoting to actual primary turnout data, what’s become clear is that what Bernie has that Biden doesn’t is this: Bernie has a motivated minority of the party. Energized, yes. But they’re not turning out the way the Biden crew is. In fact, statistically speaking, Bernie’s base is less motivated to show up and vote for him than it was in ’16…
A number of reasons for it, actually. Primarily the main one seems to be that Dems are dedicated to getting Trump out. They’re horrified by what happened in ’16 and are resolutely set on Trump’s removal. Just the last couple days is evidence enough…, Trump is incapable of leading, especially in a crisis. His talk from the oval office last night is, literally, all the evidence needed to prove it. But he’s got a track record of everyday in office previous to back it up. The man has ridden the economic recovery of Obama, granted throwing in actions to keep it going (pressure to keep rates down mainly). And his handling of Covid 19 (rather not handling it) is making worse the effects worse of a market not being willing to coast on momentum alone anymore.
He should be self quarantined to Mar a Lago for the remainder of his term. And if he protests, he should be met with the 25th amendment. He’s that bad at his job.
Having said that, I enjoyed Bernie’s press conference yesterday where he made clear he’s going to hold Biden’s feet to the fire on the main issues important to Sanders. Rightfully so. And Biden needs to hire Bernie’s staff if/when he drops out to try to make inroads with their insight into the younger vote.
Bernie has struck an emotional core with the younger vote. They haven’t motivated enough to show up for him in droves at the polls — but they’re still there as untapped potential. Biden et al have to make a serious effort to pull them in.
Bernie has always been much better running from behind. His week as “front runner” coming out of Nevada was near disaster for him. Unforced errors one after the next. Still, one thing running from behind (but just behind) has afforded Bernie: a huge influence on shaping policy for the Dems going forward.
Interesting times relegating the buffalo fart spray on the wall that is Trump into obscurity. It’s a trash fire. And when he leaves the oval office, a Covid 19 hazmat team should come in and bleach the place.
“Just the last couple days is evidence enough…, Trump is incapable of leading, especially in a crisis. His talk from the oval office last night is, literally, all the evidence needed to prove it. But he’s got a track record of everyday in office previous to back it up. The man has ridden the economic recovery of Obama, granted throwing in actions to keep it going (pressure to keep rates down mainly). And his handling of Covid 19 (rather not handling it) is making worse the effects worse of a market not being willing to coast on momentum alone anymore.”
************************
You know Paulie J if you keep repeating your foolishness, click your heels together three times and clutch little ToTo, we’re likely to still consider you the little lost girl you so obviously are. Otherwise, you’ve got the Emmett Kelly Jr. spot locked up in our hearts and minds.
So mespo, are we down from that high number of cases noted by the president (15) to zero yet? And how do you fu a national teleprompter speech to confuse all cargo from Europe with only people? Must be Obama’s fault.
Bahahahahaha.
Awesome, thanks for the Emmett Kelly jr. reference, Mespo. Had to look him up. So this is a little different from your normal toilet treat of a response. Still the world is a better place for it. I’ll clutch Toto. You just keep clutching the thing you normally clutch.
“You just keep clutching the thing you normally clutch.”
*********************
That would be your loose grasp on reality.
Oh snap. A mutant mumbles.
Paulette J:
“Oh snap. A mutant mumbles.”
*************************
I wouldn’t call you that. Just uninformed, scattered-brained, ideological and dead wrong whenever logical analysis or truth comes into play. I’d gravitate more to the lower form of the species than any evolved variety but what do I know? Maybe you did work for Dr. Xavier — in your mind?
You know what you know, Mespo.
And not what you don’t.
Okie dokey then. That’s settled.
Doubtful.
“You just keep clutching the thing you normally clutch.”
His double chin?
A little lower.
Ha.
PS Mespo, your hero also falsely claimed that insurers were going to waive charges on virus treatment last night and had to be corrected later. Of course his needless insult of the EU – even if one agrees with his action -:and failure to voice a unified response for a worldwide pandemic, including encouragement to places like Italy, are all unforced errors we will pay for eventually.
btb:
“PS Mespo, your hero also falsely claimed that insurers were going to waive charges on virus treatment last night and had to be corrected later.”
****************
He said “co-pays and deductibles” which is what most people pay. Funny how commonly used words confuse you. As for the EU, where is the GoFUndMe page to get you a home in some No-Go zone in Brussels or Stockholm?
No, actually, he said “co-pays”. Didn’t mention deductibles, which caught my attention, since it’s only March and unless you’ve been sick or hospitalized, most people probably haven’t met their annual deductible. It was reported that the private labs want $1,600 per test if you don’t have coverage. Thank God the rollback of Obamacare didn’t go through, or there would be about 30 million uninsured right now.
It is truly stupid not to eliminate all barriers to testing, or to allow private labs to do testing without requiring that it be free to the patient and that they must share data on the number of tests done and number of positives with the CDC. Trump wants to downplay the extent of the spread, so I’m doubting we’ll get accurate numbers, since private labs don’t have to report this information. It would be money well spent to cover the cost for everyone. The untested, if they have COVID-19, will just pass it along to others. In the long run, it will cost us more money for treatment. Prevention is cheaper.
Meepo, insurers have not agreed to cutting any carges to anyone in treatment of the coronavirus, in contradiction ofTrump’s teleprompter national speech. How does someone fu that?
locking out travel from Europe is a no brainer now. that you guys are needling him over this smart move unmasks your partisan bias.
trumps made several mistakes on coronavirus but blocking travelers from europe is not one of them.
you guys are the open borders crowd, everywhere and always. it’s insanity!
Obviously quarantining and isolation are part of the strategy, Kurtz. It’s the haphazard way Trump did it which stray into the realm of flagrant idiocy, i.e, leaving the U.K. out; leaving South Korea out, etc…
Not notifying the involved countries beforehand was an extra special touch. Diesel powered boneheaded-ness.
Main thing is, it’s a day late and a dollar short. Time for this type of isolation was 2 months ago. Covid 19 is here. Went over 1300 cases this morning. In other words, well past the point where masturbatory isolationist policy will do any good. The energy spent toward it now is energy and resource not spent testing. Knowledge on the ground is the essential step now so accurate quarantining can be prescribed.
Trump’s border fetish is not a realistic tool when dealing with a virus. The market knows it. Down 8% today. Dow’s down nearly a third in the last week. Wall Street is praying for Trump to check into reality enough to take actions that should’ve happened a couple months ago and he’s proving himself completely inadequate. Trump needs to self quarantine at Mar a Lago. Only way mitigation can work now is to work around him. He’s incapable.
In order to forestall a hospital overload within a couple of weeks what’s required is a) massive testing, b) expedited treatment research and development, and c) the 25th amendment.
book,
i think the massive downward moves in the market are just as much based on the collapsed price of oil and the financial contagion that will result in collapsing shale oil businesses, if the price per barrell continues to be way way below their breakeven which somebody told me was about 70$ per bbl. not sure if that number is correct but you get the idea. US is a net oil exporter and the collapsing price per barrell can devestate the economy and throw banks into deep trouble.,
as for borders, the idea is to slow the spread by staunching the flow of new spreaders. borders and border closings are part of that. yes there is an ample amount of cases onshore now already but the idea is to “flatten the curve” you can look that up for more info
“somebody told me was about 70$ per bbl. not sure if that number is correct but you get the idea. ”
Kurtz, I don’t know the exact pricing and I’m not sure anyone can adequately provide exact numbers, but one has to understand that different wells have different costs. Fracking requires much higher revenues per barrel. Old oil wells require high revenues as well. Easy to get to gas can have very low costs.
I think Saudi costs are below $10 (costs have to be defined) but Russia’s costs might be many multiples of that, say $50. Look for potential changes in Russia since their cash cow isn’t making much money if any.
Well, he didn’t block travel from S. Korea, which has more cases than Europe. Why didn’t he collaborate with the EU instead of knee-jerk unilateral action? And, 14 European countries have fewer cases than the UK. What’s to stop someone from simply getting on the chunnel train, going to London and catching a flight to the U.S.?
Exactly!
he should have banned travellers from So Korea. that was a mistake. and Japan
Tulsi gabbard made a timely warning about that but your bosses in mass media have her blocked.
as for cooperating with the EU, the EU is itself a slow moving bureaucratic monstrosity, that would have been a waste of effort, rather the useful thing would be to coordinate with member nations who remain our allies and partners in spite of the EU not because of it.
National public health agencies, national and local, are where the action is now. All over, everywhere. They’ve been warned about emergent coronovirus threats before, after SARS and MERS, and after the 2015 experiments, but few listened. Worldwide.
As i pointed out ,the Davos boys sponsored a big simulation of what might happen, back last fall, ironically, and it was a very ugly outcome
https://futurism.com/neoscope/recent-simulation-coronavirus-killed-65-million-people
Kurtz, Trump did not block travel from Europe. He blocked it from the EU while senselessly allowing UK travel. He also announced it without giving the EU leaders a heads up and in an insulting way.There is no point in that and we will pay for it somehow, sometime. Like every other word he has spoken on this crisis, he only cares about avoiding blame by trying to place it on others. As Adam Schiff told the GOP Senators before they voted for the whitewash, “You know you can’t trust him.”
He’s a lowlife a.shole and always has been. This time he’s costing lives.
Paulie, I’m fine with Bernie staying in the race as long as he keeps it to issues and cuts the “billionaires” bulls..t. Biden isn’t an empty suit and I’m pretty sure he has more answers on the issues than Bernie does. Yeah, he doesn’t promise the unicorns but unlike Bernie considers the political and budgetary restraints we live with, otherwise known as reality. Still waiting for Bernies plan. Maybe the Mexicans will pay for it.
Gainesville’s now talking to himself.
No doubt you take comfort in not being alone in that category.
DSS, Anon creates his own audience. He has been wrong on almost every major issue discussed on this blog. That is one reason he needs a change in alias.
Agreed, Book.
“Trump is incapable of leading, especially in a crisis…”
Anon, Trump stopped flights from China. The opposition laughed like hyena’s and called him names. Trump dramatically slowed the virus enterring the US.
Trump has rid us of an Obama era rule where Covid testing was delayed because of the FDA’s excessive authority prevented more rapid implimentation of testing on a more local level.
Trump has closed air entry from Europe where most of our cluster cases are now coming from.
Ignorance is the repetition of memes that weren’t right the first time.
Covid 19 is here, Alon. No matter how much you wish it wasn’t it’s time to deal with reality now. It was actually time to deal with it two months ago. We are on the same growth pattern as Italy, statistically speaking. And the markets know the truth. Witness another limit down day today. In fact, you could watch the overnight markets crash as Trump was speaking last night.
As to closing European entry, the U.K., despite its lesser numbers has more cases than many of the countries in the ban. And no ban for South Korea??? Trump is throwing darts at a board not realizing the target is sitting under his chair.
Look, your idiocy license is revoked with this one. No one can afford to be as gullible as you on this. This reminds me of watching the green flash from the compromised power plants in Japan as reporters were on the air saying there was no meltdown. Sticking your head in the sand works when there’s an idiot riding the previous president’s economic recovery but now it’s time to pull your head out of your butt and wake the eff up.
It was the Democrats that wanted to permit the spread from China that Trump blocked. That was a dramatic move that saved a lot of lives.
It was the Obama administration that caused the delay in test kit results.
The EU: Germany might be doing nothing to stop the spread. Italy has closed much of its country down. Borders in the EU are pourous. Of course trump is tying to slow down the virus coming from EU nations.
Trumps campaign for the Presidency highlighted the problems we face now with the Corona virus. He wanted to control our borders where Chinese as well as others enter illegally while being potential vectors of the disease. He wanted to stop outsourcing so we wouldn’t be so dependent on China.
You believe what you do based on total ignorance and an overblown ego in a tiny mind.
Trump is going after the countries that were the vectors of the large clusters in our country.
Absolutely moronic response. Every single thing about Covid 19 makes Trump’s way of ‘governing’ obsolete. It’s hard to imagine a bigger failing of an American president. Every day is a f u clinic.
pauli makes a couple sweeping generalizations which makes no net contribution to the conversation other than animus and vitriol
He is an idiot. Take note how he doesn’t respond to a single point I made. His brain must be made of mush.
My mom, after being a nurse went into immunology and worked in a lab at Yale that was the first to isolate something called Lassa Fever. My mom was lucky because she didn’t actually get Lassa Fever, which a couple people did who were working on the disease. The lead researcher (who my mom worked for) almost died during the process of their isolating Lassa. i used to wash and sterilize glassware and work in an experimental animal room in that lab when I was in high school. I’ve been around a little bit in this realm. Believe me when I say what you’re considering animus and vitriol is standard fare conversation in immunology and emergency response when talking about the Trump administration response to Covid 19.
But I know you won’t believe me. That’s not my problem.
“But I know you won’t believe me. That’s not my problem.”
You think you said something above but you said absolutely nothing. Your mom might have had some knowledge but you seem to have none. Some things are inherited but knowledge isn’t. Of course one has to be able to think in order to recognize that fact.
The ability to wash things is not unique to you. Go ahead and tell us what you know about the present situation. Then we can discuss it point by point. I’m waiting.
Insults aside…
Every single one of your “points” is a generalization. Impossible to talk about because they’re pure abstraction. Take something like:
“Trumps campaign for the Presidency highlighted the problems we face now with the Corona virus. He wanted to control our borders where Chinese as well as others enter illegally while being potential vectors of the disease. He wanted to stop outsourcing so we wouldn’t be so dependent on China.”
In this we have…
-Trump’s campaign
-Corona virus and its potential vectors
-outsourcing and being dependent on China
-“other”s who enter illegally”
Let’s start with the obvious…, if Trump’s campaign actually dealt with Covid 19 we wouldn’t be near the worst in testing for the virus. Period. Bill Parcells quote: you are what your record says you are. Doctors are enraged about that particular failure. Immunologists are equally enraged because it constricts the information they need to research. His budget cuts to CDC and the emergency response team. If Congress bailed him out of these it really doesn’t count in his favor.
Border control does play a role. Exactly the role that border security has played in the Obama administration. In the Bush jr. administration, Building a wall is ineffective at best.
Outsourcing you say? Prove that Trump has remedied the problem in the least bit on any level. Add to that his practice of outsourcing in his own businesses previous to taking office.
-“others” entering illegally Covid 19 most likely entered the country with people flying back and forth between China and here completely legally. Or from cruise ship passengers. Or from military outposts. To assert this came across the border with illegal immigrants is literally unprovable and is born of zenophobia.
Let’s set aside Trump’s campaign and look at his administration’s complete failure with Covid 19. Was it possible to keep it out? No, absolutely not. But the testing failure will go down as possibly the single biggest domestic national security mistake in the history of the country. It will probably kill more people than 9/11. The fact that Trump didn’t go all in on testing because he was mainly concerned with dolling up the prospects of the stock market.is blowing up in his face. And the nation’s. People were desperate last night for a guiding presidential message. Trump got on the air and played out his grudges against the EU without letting any of the countries know it was coming and they were enraged. The overnight stock markets began to crash and continued throughout the day today on Wall Street. . Worst day in the market since the crash in ’87.
Since I’m a trader I’ve often talked on this blog about how Trump has been coasting on the momentum of the market, draining the sugar through tax breaks, Artificially leaning on the Fed to keep rates low to keep the Dow going up. Well, the Dow has come down a third in the last week.
Riddle me this Inspector Allan, how come Trump didn’t include the U.K. and South Korea in his travel ban???
Paulie, I’m sorry we didnt tell you: ‘Alan is the nastiest of geezers. The truth means nothing to him. He makes his own reality’. Alan was probably never cool. No redeeming qualities. Don’t expect to ever connect on any level.
Paint Chips, you have always avoided proving that what you say has any validity. All sorts of people on this list dislike you and call you all sorts of names. When you are what you are all of that is to be expected.
Ha. Not expecting to, Seth. He is a puzzling beast though.
And Allan, my guess is you’re basing your info on a Newsmax article, actually the first half of the article…
here it is so you can review your homework…
https://www.newsmax.com/us/test-kits/2020/03/04/id/956964/
Anon, it appears you read Newsmax much more than I do. I don’t look for talking points. That is in your domain.
Newsmax is toilet paper btw
“Newsmax is toilet paper btw”
That is fine. I like the idea of recycling. You can add it to the NYTimes and WaPo.
Anon, are you saying that open borders reduce the likelihood of disease?
Are you saying that we would have less disease if we permitted Chinese travelers in our borders? There are failures, but who failed? Most likely the CDC. Part of the job of an executive is to put money to its best use. That is what Trump has done and former Presidents have failed to do.
Everytime a President wants to get rid of programs big and small there are those who will complain and generate complaints. Those people make money off of the wasted expenditures.
“But the testing failure will go down as possibly the single biggest domestic national security mistake in the history of the country.”
That is true, but again I ask, who really failed? Why are we outsourcing too much of our vital healthcare needs?
The bureaucracy of the EU works very slowly. I don’t think we are obligated to increase our risks to satisfy their feelings. They never worry about ours. In fact they don’t even carry their weight in NATO. By the way, I don’t believe it is all EU nations that have been excluded. Things are so fluid one can’t be sure of anything.
One can’t say why Trump included or didn’t include a nation in the ban. I believe it is because of where the virus clusters came from and the ability to control where people are coming from. EU travel doesn’t include a passport. Britain might find itself on the list but maybe Britain and S. Korea are handling their travellers in a more predictable way. You immediately spout off against the President without considering all the possible factors.
You or your friends called him stupid and a racist for his ban on China so we all can see that data is not your concern politics is.
Alon,
“Anon, are you saying that open borders reduce the likelihood of disease?”
Provide a quote of me saying exactly that. I’ll wait.
“Are you saying that we would have less disease if we permitted Chinese travelers in our borders?”
Provide a quote of me saying exactly that.
” Part of the job of an executive is to put money to its best use. That is what Trump has done and former Presidents have failed to do.”
Since you’re blaming Trump’s lack of testing on Obama and the two administrations each have/had a budget and stated policy, compare and contrast in actual numbers and policy initiatives.
“That is true, but again I ask, who really failed? Why are we outsourcing too much of our vital healthcare needs?”
This one’s easy. Trump failed. And is failing. And lean into how you think outsourcing affects Trump administration failure re testing. Especially given the level of failure, we’d do well to literally copy how South Korea, for example, has gone about aggressive testing.
“The bureaucracy of the EU works very slowly. I don’t think we are obligated to increase our risks to satisfy their feelings. They never worry about ours. In fact they don’t even carry their weight in NATO. By the way, I don’t believe it is all EU nations that have been excluded. Things are so fluid one can’t be sure of anything.”T
That’s your opinion, an opinion seemingly mirroring Trump’s. Can you back any of this up with concrete fact? Most importantly, WTF does it have to do in the least bit with how we’re testing in the U.S.?
“One can’t say why Trump included or didn’t include a nation in the ban. I believe it is because of where the virus clusters came from and the ability to control where people are coming from. EU travel doesn’t include a passport. Britain might find itself on the list but maybe Britain and S. Korea are handling their travellers in a more predictable way. You immediately spout off against the President without considering all the possible factors.”
Your belief that’s where clusters were/are located. But your belief is inconsistent with fact as the U.K. has disproportionate numbers given their relative size and South Korea is one of the 4 most affected nations on the planet. Why, specifically, do you think the U.K. and South korea are “handling their travellers” in a more predictable way? As far as spouting off against the president…, sometimes you just gotta call a skank out when it sits in the oval office if they’re markedly failing at their job.
“You or your friends called him stupid and a racist for his ban on China so we all can see that data is not your concern politics is.”
As I asked before, can you provide a quote of me actually speaking the words you attribute? Granted, I actually do refer to Trump often as being not that bright, boneheaded, buffalo fart spray on the wall, .etc. however I don’t refer to Trump as actually being racist. As the saying goes, Trump may not be a racist but all the racists think he is one. In my opinion, Trump exploits the racist tendencies of his followers to divide and conquer in the big picture. He’s kind of a demented genius at it…
But as testing provides data to analyse in research, so do specific quotes in dialogue. They make it possible to address what was actually spoken or written versus what someone hears in their mind. Important distinction, which I’m sure you’ll agree with since you’re such a fact based guy and all.
“Provide a quote of me saying exactly that. I’ll wait.”
Actually I am trying to clarify your position.
“Are you saying that we would have less disease if we permitted Chinese travelers in our borders?” That was a question to be answered by you. I was actually writing answers to the rest of the garbage that followed but realized that only permits you an avenue of escape. Therefore I will limit my response and try to deal with one issue at a time.
Democrats called Trumps stupid and a racist for banning Chinese entry into the country. Do you agree or disagree with them?
I reject the premise of your assertion, Allan. Provide a written or taped quote of “a democrat” who said Trump was stupid for a travel ban from China once Covid 19 took off.
“I reject the premise of your assertion”
Get your own research assistant. It was on the news not that long ago.
*Allan concedes he’s talking out of his butt.*
I take note Anon that you cannot clarify your position because it was wrapped in lies. I will ask the question again.
“Are you saying that we would have less disease if we permitted Chinese travelers in our borders?”
Do you beat your wife with Chinese travellers at the border?
Short of producing an actual quote of your assertion there is, literally, nothing to talk about other than whose show you watched on Fox to get this nonsense.
Take note how you avoid a question that is quantitative in nature. It is either yes, no or you don’t know. We all know why you don’t answer the question. Because your answer would either conflict with common sense or agree with a move by Trump disdained by the MSM. Answer the question
“Are you saying that we would have less disease if we permitted Chinese travelers in our borders?”
And I take note of your not producing a solid example of a Dem actually saying what you attribute to them.
Your question is an abstraction, but I’ll answer it anyway. Didn’t actually think the conversation would go so mind numbingly stupid…
First, the toilet dinosaur of a question: “Are you saying that we would have less disease if we permitted Chinese travelers in our borders?”
Of course I’m not saying that. Probably the *only* thing Trump got right initially was in limiting travel from the Wuhan area. It’s basic pandemic protocol. It’s quarantining writ large, a basic public health principle in the face of a pandemic.
But you’re nationalizing and politicizing the question. Using it as a justification for Trump’s nationalism. So you’re jumping from the realm of public health into the political realm.
Of course, what that omits in terms of disease transmission is the fact that Americans came back to the States from that area. Military personnel came back from being stationed in South Korea, etc.
You’re also omitting the fact that extensive testing is the other protocol in assessing disease transmission terrain. Unfortunately, this gigantic misstep of the Trump administration was bad. Just really bad. Like go in the history books bad. Maybe even top the history books bad.
No it’s not Obama’s fault. Trump is president nearing the end of his term. You are what your record says you are.
Is this a tough situation? One of the absolute toughest that any president could face. Unfortunately the dilemma is matched by the least capable president in history having to deal with it. It’s a wildly unique situation. And really the only way to move forward is to sideline Trump, let Fauci speak for the government, and to not be so at war with science as an administration.
On the bright side, this could actually, by default, prove to be good training for the type of collective effort that will be required for the shift over into sustainable energy production. After massive social distancing practices, going through a period of sacrifice in the change over won’t seem so daunting. In fact, it’ll be easy peasy in comparison.
Ditto for the wherewithal to start treating gun violence as the epidemic that it truly is in the States.
So…
a) Trump did the right thing in blocking travel between China and the States in the relatively early stages. It’s basic quarantining/disease isolation procedure.
b) But Trump couldn’t get around his weakness of just trying to make political points and he fell down hard in the other aspects of treating pandemic disease transmission….
And he’s actually proven himself incapable of doing anything else.
By failing to respond to Fox news generated points like: :
“It was the Obama administration that caused the delay in test kit results.”
Sorry…just don’t have time for this sort of low information nonsense. If you’d like to talk about what’s going on with Covid 19 as such, have at it, bud.
I guess you don’t realize that certain testing was centralized by the CDC. That has now been reversed. It’s not Fox News. It is what has happened. There are other problems with the supply chain but that is based on policy. For instance, should we be outsourcing things vital to the health of Americans so that America can be under the thumb of our adversaries? Should Trump have been called stupid and a racist when he closed the borders to chinese citizens. You might disagree or agree which is fine. What is not fine is that you are unable to discuss why and instead continuously make stupid comments.
Trump blamed Obama in his Hannity BJ. The accusation is false. Changes were considered to regulations under Obama but were dropped while he was still in office. Trump has been in office now for 3 years and other than proposing cuts to the CDC budget- as recently as this week in a congressional hearing involving his budget experts – ending a pandemic strike force created under Obama which included a NSC permanent seat is all he has done. He doesn’t want the buck or the check. Never does.
Where is the substance Anon?
You guys were calling Trump a racist for closing the border to illegals and to the Chinese. It’s simple. The Democrats have been playing with the lives of American citizens.
“You guys were calling Trump a racist for closing the border to illegals and to the Chinese.”
Paste a direct quote from me saying what you’ve attributed and then we’ll talk Inspector Allan.
Don’t worry. I’ll wait.
More likely it’ll be clear that you’re making a sweeping generalization based on something going on in your head but not verifiable with a specific quote.
Anon, you have had so many aliases it’s hard to say which one says what. Assuming you didn’t say something similar to that are you denying the other leftists on the list said it? How about the MSM do you admit they said it?
Germany is taking action
https://www.forbes.com/sites/guymartin/2020/03/12/germanys-chancellor-angela-merkel-lays-out-the-covid-19-plan-what-travelers-must-know-as-germanys-cases-spike/#2b19056e219d
Thanks. Till yesterday Merkel was criticized for doing nothing.
We have faced this type of problem many times. I think our fears might be a bit overexagerated, but some of the problems we face are problems created by outsourcing critical areas of our economy. That might be where we pay a very big price. This election year there hasn’t been a single recent Democratic candidate who hasn’t been on the wrong side of the most important issues. Instead they throw the racism card or call a very accomplished man, Trump, an idiot. In the meantime Biden wants to give our soon to be very scarce resources, hospital beds, pharmaceuticals, medical practitioners, etc. to illegal aliens.
no, Paulie, border enforcement is one of many proper responses even now that the coronavirus is onshore in abudnance. the idea is to delay spread so public health has time to treat cases as they develop and slow the exponential spread
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/11/science/coronavirus-curve-mitigation-infection.html
Kurtz, Anon has been one of those that complains the most about Trump but most of what Trump ran on are the things that are protecting Americans.
Border control
Outsourcing.
Over regulation
Oil independence.
The economy
Etc.
We are dealing with a bunch of very foolish people that like to speak but know very little.
We are dealing with a bunch of very foolish people that like to speak but know very little.
Let the record reflect that Allan & Kurtz are talking about themselves without even knowing it
I see Anonymous the Stupid has awakened again trying to make himself appear relavent. What a failure.
Lol!!
What I said is it’s too late to put energy into this more than has been done dating back several administrations. We’re past that now. Energy has to go into testing ASAP.
Allan continues the big lie that Obama changed CDC rules. He did not. Trump has been in office for 3 years, during which time he tried to cut the CDC budget and ended the pandemic task force with a permanent NSC seat which Obana did begin.
Allan seems to be quite the gullible sort, indeed.
Anon, you can’t seem to stay on topic.
That you are ignorant is clear. You mix fact with fiction and get garbage. That you don’t know about the changes that occurred during the Obama administration is fine, but then for you to make up stories only proves you to be a liar. That is not new to anyone here even yourself.
Let us deal with the less esoteric facts. Was Trump right in banning China? Were the Democrats wrong when they disagreed?
Gainesville, one of the impediments to the testing was that a mid-level official of the FDA insisted that a UW researcher demonstrate his proposed test could distinguish Covid-19 from SARS, an impossible task w/o a couple of months to get hold of SARS samples. Increasing the budget of the CDC or the FDA isn’t going to improve the collective decision-making abilities of the people who work there.
TIA, high or low budgets do not account for every positive or negative action within an organization and you are correct that this incident was not budget dependent. There are structural defects within the CDC that are also not budget driven and revolve around HIPPA protections of individual privacy rights. In my opinion we have gone ridiculously overboard in this direction. This is again not budget related, but staff and facilities are and it is a fact that Trump has tried to cut the CDC budget, and as recently as early this week one of his budget mavens reiterated planned cuts during a congressional hearing.
It is also a fact Trump also eliminated a pandemic task force with a permanent NSC seat which Obama had created in reaction to pandemics he faced as president. It is a fact that Obama did not change CDC procedures as Trump and Allan in his continuing ignorance continues to claim.
We can expect Trump to pass the buck always- it’s Obama’s or the EU’s fault – rather than putting his head dosn and doing his job with dignity, seriousness, and unifying leadership. As Adam Schiff told GOP senators before they voted for the whitewash, “You know you can’t trust him.”
” It is a fact that Obama did not change CDC procedures as Trump and Allan in his continuing ignorance continues to claim.”
It was FDA procedures and I posted the WSJ article on the blog. During the 2009 flu which occurred under the Obama Admnistration those labs could do such testing but sometime afterwards that ability disappeared. Trump returned that ability to those labs.
The Anon’s have a lot of trouble with fact and the truth. Lies are much easier for them to produce and they produce them with vigor.
Allan’s quote does not support his and Trump’s buck passing lie. Obama did not change CDC procedures.
It was the FDA and those procedures were changed under the Obama administration. You make things up.
Allan is a liar and his own quotes do not support his BS.
The AP:
“…It’s not true that an Obama-era rule limited laboratories run by companies, universities and hospitals from developing and running tests for the coronavirus during an emergency. No such regulation existed.
The Trump administration’s action Saturday only undid a policy that its own Food and Drug Administration put in place. The new action lets labs develop and use coronavirus diagnostic tests before the agency reviews them. Previously, the FDA had only authorized use of a government test developed by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.
Under a 2004 federal law, the FDA has wide power to authorize drugs, tests and other therapies during emergencies. That means no legal authority was hindering the Trump administration when it earlier decided to limit testing to public health labs using the CDC test.
“All they did was reverse a policy that they themselves set,” said Dr. Joshua Sharfstein, an FDA official during the Obama administration who is now a vice dean at Johns Hopkins-Bloomberg School of Public Health.
Former FDA testing employees said that during public health emergencies the agency tended to increase its scrutiny and require diagnostic labs to seek authorization before launching their tests. But they said that was not a binding policy and it preceded the Obama era.
Trump and Pence appeared to be referring, in part, to draft FDA guidance circulated during the Obama administration in 2014 that called for tighter regulation of so-called laboratory-developed tests, a market traditionally not overseen by the agency. That nonbinding guidance cited a need for accurate and reliable tests to help consumers make better health care decisions. But that guidance, which did not pertain to public health emergencies such as the coronavirus, never went into effect…..”
https://apnews.com/f4cd4c72e896d7fbd8ebd3516e864550
Anon, I guess you are calling the WSJ article a lie as well. Calling others liars doesn’t change the fact that lies are your daily bread
What you have produced is spin: “FDA guidance circulated during the Obama administration in 2014 that called for tighter regulation of so-called laboratory-developed tests” That in one form or another is what Trump just reversed. That the AP glosses over their statement about who changed the rules without providing fact demonstrates they don’t know or they know it happened under the Obama administration.
We we do know is that the Obama administration liked to centralize things into a bigger and bigger bureaucracy while the Trump administration wishes to decentralize. That is one of the differences in ideology between those on the left and those that oppose them.
“The Anon’s have a lot of trouble with fact and the truth. Lies are much easier for them to produce and they produce them with vigor.”
Hard for me to picture you saying this without a megaphone attached to your face, lecturing a bunch of people who don’t care at all.
Of course, it doesn’t venture past a completely surface level and has no speculation as to the most basic question: why would someone lie the way you accuse them of?
On top of that, the dialectics are shoddy as well. Allan has a thesis here: ‘the Anon’s lie’ and it’s up to me to point my finger at anything they say and call it a lie’..
Where is Allan’s antithesis though? Is it (in his mind) that “lies are much easier for them to produce”? Just an observation, there isn’t anyone frequenting this blog who makes as many sweeping generalizations with absolutely no backup to the assertion as Allan does. He’ll regularly attack any counterbalancing attributing source and he’ll produce none of his own while maintaining it’s everyone else’s job to dance to his accusations.
So, on balance, Allan’s ‘lies are easier to produce’ antithesis is basically a faulty syllogism and most likely comes from first hand knowledge of his own condition..kind of a standard level of Trumpian projection. He’s well trained.
He’s also a hatchet chucker, someone who will sit back and tee off on responses to Turley’s articles while almost never responding to the Professor himself, fancying himself as somewhat of a Fox News driven blog moderator of sorts..
That’s a lot of responsibility, actually. I fully recognize how much of a weight that is, so I send my full best wishes toward him on the monumental task he’s undertaken. It’s a tough job — but somebody’s gotta do it, right?
So Allan, have at it, buddy. Here’s me sending the slow clap your way. I mean, you accused people of producing lies “with vigor” like they’re some sort of inconvenient morning boner or something.
You’re an impressive guy, Allan. And I stand in awe.
Do you know what Sander’s supporters have that Biden supporters don’t? Student Debt and a long range vision for a better tomorrow. Tomorrow being literally, tomorrow, as in Friday, the weekend, frat parties and OMG, are they cancelling spring break?
The final chapter of the Circus
About to be revealed.
Which Clown will win the nomination.
I can tell you bernie hasn`t a clue that he is being 2016 again by the democrats.
Bernie was scr-wed in 2016 by Hillary and the Democratic Party but continued to support her. In this campaign season he hasn’t showed himself to be a fighter when challenged by the political organization. I think he has accepted defeat. He likes to rabble-rouse but does he really want to win?
By “screwed in 2016 by Hillary”, Allan means getting his ass kicked in the primaries by democratic voters. Same as 2020.
Anon, as usual you are talking out of the wrong opening.
Well, the mass media pretends it’s “just two old white guys now in the Dem primary” even though Tulsi has not quit.
Tulsi is a woman and Tulsi is part Samoan. So they are ignoring “women and people of color” because why?
Because Hillary said so
https://thehill.com/opinion/campaign/480788-cnns-blatant-and-bizarre-tulsi-gabbard-snub
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8FLF0tuwhAo
Tulsi is shut out of the debate because she is smarter than Joe and more reasonable than Bernie
And not in Hillary’s pocket
the mass media and DNC are conspiring from day one to suppress her. it’s really pathetic
“What Bernie Sanders Has That Joe Biden Doesn’t” ?
This shouldn’t be the question. The real question is what the Democratic Party of today has? The answer is nothing, no policy and no competent leadership.
Alas, 45% of the public is at any one time firmly in their corner. Unfortunately, politics in this country has gotten gruesomely tribal.
Siding with one side or the other is not the same as voting.
oh its not gruesome yet, but gruesome is coming for sure
What Bernie has that Biden doesn’t is that he more-or-less believes what he says (with the usual artifice anyone in public life practices) and he’s more-or-less honest; he isn’t C.S. Lewis, of course. Students of C.S. Lewis’ household accounts have calculated that during one period of his life that 2/3 of his income was donated to others. Bernie’s property holdings are the subject of much ribbing. However, the quantum of his assets isn’t surprising for an elderly pair of bourgeois who’ve not had expensive tastes.
Sanders was the national secretary for the SDS while Hader was its first president.
Um, no. The Students for a Democratic Society was the descendant of an outfit called the ‘Intercollegiate Society of Socialists’, founded around about 1905. It changed its name to the ‘League for Industrial Democracy’ after the 1st world war, and organized a student affiliate. The student affiliate merged around about 1935 with a Communist front organization called the National Student League (I had a dear friend who was briefly a member of the National Student League; his comment on their relations with the Communist Party “they had the thing by the nuts”). The resultant organization – the American Student Union – fell apart over the Hitler-Stalin pact. (Among the ASU alumni later prominent was Molly Yard, who was president of NOW from 1987 to 1991). So, the League reconstituted their student affiliate – as the Student League for Industrial Democracy. One little tidbit about this tiny organization was that James Farmer (founder of the Congress of Racial Equality) was their organizing secretary for a time.
In 1960, the Student League for Industrial Democracy changed its name to the Students for a Democratic Society. The first president to hold office under this name was the late Andre Schiffrin. They held a conference at Port Huron, Michigan in 1962 and seceded from the parent organization. The principal author of their founding manifesto – the Port Huron Statement – was Tom Hayden. The president in 1962-63 was Todd Gitlin. The Port Huron Statement wasn’t a disagreeable polemic. However, the organization was protean in membership and character. Irving Howe related meeting Hayden and others around about 1965 and being quite disconcerted by them, saying that his impression was that they’d not have much compunction about having him shot.
As late as 1966, the organization had just 2,000 members (the Young Americans for Freedom had 28,000 at that time). However, the media was fascinated with them. In three years, their membership increased 50-fold. However, at their 1969 convention they were taken over by what one veteran described as “two varieties of Maoist – mad and madder” and the organization evaporated almost immediately.
wow great history
the thing i like about bernie is you get a sense of focus on policy as opposed to just phony slogans and empty talk. man, that mayor pete sure was good at empty talk. i’d rather deal with someone to the Left that actually can articulate a proposal which advances some concrete notions rather than a sweet smelling fart of hot air
Stats have always shown that students do not come out and vote. Seniors vote though. Biden has the senior vote.
“What Bernie Sanders Has That Joe Biden Doesn’t” ??? Bernie has a heart condition; Biden has cognitive failure. Call it a wash and just give President Trump another term.
You mean the trash-talking, senile, self-indulgent, narcissist, bozo the clown who won’t last a day serving coffee at Dunkin Donuts?
who won’t last a day serving coffee at Dunkin Donuts?
He actually ran a business with $9.5 bn in annual revenue and a workforce of 22,000
Trump’s detractors are a study in a dyspeptic form of magical thinking. They fancy that egregiously false statements are rendered true just by uttering them.
You said, “They fancy that egregiously false statements are rendered true just by uttering them.”
That is incorrect. They have to utter them at least 19 times on both sides of their mouth, and then they are magically rendered true. Haven’t you ever read Goebbels’ diary???
Squeeky Fromm
Girl Reporter
Yes, Comrade Bernard is great with kids. They all like to play imaginary games like, school, and government.
When I read the headline I was expecting the answer to be: “A functioning brain”.
“What Bernie Sanders Has That Joe Biden Doesn’t” ???
Uh, full cognitive function. . .
Squeeky Fromm
Girl Reporter
You realize, of course, that the only remaining IWW (Industrial Workers of the World, Eugene Deb’s socialist labor union) chapter represents the UM student bookstore employees…
“Don’t waste time mourning.Organize.” The continuing relevance of these words continues to amaze me.
I didn’t realize it. Thanks for the info.