Send Lawyers, Guns, and Money: Newsom Calls For Gun Ban Modeled on Texas Abortion Law

California Gov. Gavin Newsom thrilled many this weekend by saying that his administration will model a new law on Texas’ abortion ban that would let private citizens sue anyone who makes or sells assault weapons or ghost guns. It won’t work. Legally, that is. It will be hugely successful politically, but not without costs to the state and potential litigants.

Gov. Newsom denounced the Supreme Court in Women’s Health v. Jackson for refusing to enjoin the Texas law that allows people to sue anyone who “aids or abets” an abortion performed after about six weeks. That led to widespread calls for the passage of legislation to “codify Roe,” including from the White House.

Newsom, however, wants to replicate the law to limit Second Amendment rights the way that conservatives used it to limit reproductive rights.

“I am outraged by yesterday’s U.S. Supreme Court decision allowing Texas’s ban on most abortion services to remain in place. But if states can now shield their laws from review by the federal courts that compare assault weapons to Swiss Army knives, then California will use that authority to protect people’s lives, where Texas used it to put women in harm’s way.”

Newsom said that his staff will be working with the Legislature and California Attorney General Rob Bonta to craft the bill to let citizens sue anyone who “manufactures, distributes, or sells an assault weapon or ghost gun kit or parts” in California. They could seek damages of at least $10,000 per violation plus costs and attorney’s fees.

Good luck with that.

The problem is multifold. First, the Texas law was quickly found to be unconstitutional by the district court, as would the California law. Indeed, many of us declared the law as facially unconstitutional under existing precedent on the day that it was enacted. That means that, while there are litigation costs, those costs would decrease quickly as other courts declare challenges to be unconstitutional.

Second, the Supreme Court just allowed pre-enforcement challenges so the California law could be challenged to avoid any “chilling effect” on gun rights. Eight out of nine justices agreed that such early challenges are permissible against those with enforcement responsibilities in the abortion area. As a state that has led efforts to limit gun rights, there are a host of such officials with similar licensing powers in California.

Third, and most importantly, Newsom limited the law to gun manufacturers, distributors, and sellers” to the exclusion of a wider array of purchasers or “aiders and abetters.” The Texas law was so menacing because it exposed such a wide array of people to potential lawsuit. It would not be quite as popular to go after gun owners or gun rights groups. Yet, Newsom is targeting businesses which are going to be less intimidated by such litigation costs in a law that would be clearly unconstitutional.

That is why, if the law is crafted as Newsom suggests, this won’t work legally. Nevertheless, there will be much cooing on cable programs at the cleverness of Newsom and the comeuppance for conservatives. Newsom will seize the moment in terms of popularity while leaving the costs to others to bear in the later failed litigation.

Newsom did not help things by declaring “If the most efficient way to keep these devastating weapons off our streets is to add the threat of private lawsuits, we should do just that.” That is openly acknowledging that this law is meant to achieve indirectly what the state has failed to do directly: reduce gun ownership. That is precisely why the Supreme Court just green-lighted pre-enforcement challenges to the Texas law and now, with the help of Newsom, the California law would collapse quickly on the same grounds.

In the recent decision, Chief Justice John Roberts noted that

“The clear purpose and actual effect of S. B. 8 has been to nullify this Court’s rulings. … Indeed, “[i]f the legislatures of the several states may, at will, annul the judgments of the courts of the United States, and destroy the rights acquired under those judgments, the constitution itself becomes a solemn mockery.” United States v. Peters, 5 Cranch 115, 136 (1809). The nature of the federal right infringed does not matter; it is the role of the Supreme Court in our constitutional system that is at stake.”

With his bravado, Newsom has guaranteed that courts will strike down his law as an open “mockery” of gun rights precedent and he will actually box in liberal judges and jurists in voting against the California law on the same grounds.

Indeed, the California law would put the Biden Administration into a bind. It just intervened first as an amicus party and then an actual party in the Texas litigation. (As expected, the Court tossed out the Biden Administration’s lawsuit as “improvidently granted”). The Administration insisted that such a law is an abomination given that the rights of abortion are established and this is an effort to nullify those rights through exposure to lawsuits. Here Newsom himself said that that is precisely what they want to do.

So, will the Biden administration refuse to oppose the law in defense of established gun rights as it did reproductive rights? If so, it would support criticism of the Justice Department of advancing political agendas and make Attorney General Merrick Garland look like a feckless functionary. With the mid-term elections looming and falling polling numbers across the country, that is probably not a choice the Biden Administration would like to make to defend a legislatively-supported soundbite.

Once the early courts strike down the California law, some citizens could face sanctions for frivolous lawsuits seeking litigation costs (unless such motions are blocked under the law).  Moreover, there will be a great expense of drafting and defending a law designed to support a soundbite. Many judges will be even less enamored with being asked to participate in what is largely political performance art.

That is why the new California law is certain to play better on cable than in the courts.

418 thoughts on “Send Lawyers, Guns, and Money: Newsom Calls For Gun Ban Modeled on Texas Abortion Law”

  1. What Democrat cities and states are doing with guns will have unintended consequences just like Prohibition of alcohol did.

  2. This comment by Ben: “Did you know Chemtrails are a government conspiracy by the Deep State designed to make Americans so gullible and dumb they actually believe Chemtrails are a government conspiracy and that there is a Deep State?”

    1. Mr. Turley is awdully quiet on the damning emails coming from Ingraham and Hannity and Trump Jr and others when the Capitol Riot was going down.

      I know Fox is full of bullocks and some of you know Fox is full of bullocks but maybe now the whole country will wake up to the reality that Trump is guilty as sin of causing a riot and not doing anything to stop it.

      He should be in prison, he should not be allowed to run for president again, and the Republican party should be disbanded,

      IF Liz Cheney ran for president as a Republican I might vote for her.

      She’s bringing integrity back to that side of the aisle, and politics in general.

      Yay.

        1. No these ideas are now America’s ideas.

          The deplorable proles had their ideal Vulgarian Candudate for four years with the expected , prophesied catastrophic result.

          And now Trump and his phony cronies are being strung up by their lies by Liz Cheney and others 8n front of the whole country.

          Good stuff. Great stuff.

          Political theater.
          .
          Ride the crest? Don’t be such a square

          1. Ben, you say the same things over and over again but they always lack content. They are convenient to say and you don’t have to think or know anything. You can be a doofus and say all sorts of things.

            However, every time you have to deal with fact you are scr-wed because of your overwhelming ignorance.

            Let’s take things one issue at a time.

            Should the borders be open (Biden’s position) to illegal aliens, drugs , slavery, murderers and rapists?

            Should the borders be open (Trump’s position) to legal immigration based on the needs of America?

            You are either for drugs, murderers, illegals, and rapists or not. So far that is your stated opinion.

            1. Ben, you say the same things over and over again but they always lack content. They are convenient to say and you don’t have to think or know anything. You can be a doofus and say all sorts of things.

              However, every time you have to deal with fact you are scr-wed because of your overwhelming ignorance.

              Let’s take things one issue at a time.

              Should the borders be open (Biden’s position) to illegal aliens, drugs , slavery, murderers and rapists?

              𝐒𝐨𝐫𝐫𝐲 𝐛𝐮𝐛𝐛𝐚 𝐛𝐮𝐭 𝐭𝐡𝐞𝐫𝐞 𝐢𝐬 𝐧𝐨 𝐥𝐞𝐠𝐚𝐥 𝐨𝐫 𝐦𝐨𝐫𝐚𝐥 𝐬𝐨𝐥𝐮𝐭𝐢𝐨𝐧 𝐭𝐨 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐛𝐨𝐫𝐝𝐞𝐫 𝐜𝐫𝐢𝐬𝐢𝐬, 𝐣𝐮𝐬𝐭 𝐚𝐬 𝐭𝐡𝐞𝐫𝐞 𝐢𝐬 𝐧𝐨 𝐥𝐞𝐠𝐚𝐥 𝐨𝐫 𝐦𝐨𝐫𝐚𝐥 𝐬𝐨𝐥𝐮𝐭𝐢𝐨𝐧 𝐭𝐨 𝐡𝐨𝐦𝐞𝐥𝐞𝐬𝐬𝐧𝐞𝐬𝐬, 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐩𝐨𝐥𝐢𝐭𝐢𝐜𝐚𝐥 𝐫𝐞𝐟𝐮𝐠𝐞𝐞𝐬 𝐢𝐧 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐌𝐢𝐝𝐝𝐥𝐞 𝐄𝐚𝐬𝐭 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐍𝐨𝐫𝐭𝐡 𝐀𝐟𝐫𝐢𝐜𝐚 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐚 𝐥𝐨𝐭 𝐨𝐟 𝐨𝐭𝐡𝐞𝐫 𝐩𝐫𝐨𝐛𝐥𝐞𝐦𝐬.

              𝐍𝐨𝐭 𝐰𝐚𝐬𝐭𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐛𝐢𝐥𝐥𝐢𝐨𝐧𝐬 𝐨𝐧 𝐬𝐨𝐦𝐞 𝐬𝐲𝐦𝐛𝐨𝐥𝐢𝐜 𝐰𝐚𝐥𝐥.

              𝐀𝐧𝐝 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐟𝐨𝐮𝐧𝐝𝐚𝐭𝐢𝐨𝐧 𝐭𝐨 𝐚𝐥𝐥 𝐨𝐟 𝐭𝐡𝐢𝐬 𝐢𝐬 𝐨𝐯𝐞𝐫𝐩𝐨𝐩𝐮𝐥𝐚𝐭𝐢𝐨𝐧.

              𝐀𝐬 𝐬𝐭𝐚𝐭𝐞𝐝 𝐞𝐥𝐬𝐞𝐰𝐡𝐞𝐫𝐞, 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐰𝐨𝐫𝐥𝐝 𝐢𝐬 𝐨𝐯𝐞𝐫𝐩𝐨𝐩𝐮𝐥𝐚𝐭𝐞𝐝 𝐛𝐲 𝐚 𝐟𝐚𝐜𝐭𝐨𝐫 𝐨𝐟 𝟖 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐢𝐭’𝐬 𝐨𝐧𝐥𝐲 𝐠𝐨𝐧𝐧𝐚 𝐠𝐞𝐭 𝐰𝐨𝐫𝐬𝐞.

              𝐓𝐡𝐞 𝐄𝐧𝐠𝐥𝐢𝐬𝐡 𝐡𝐚𝐝 𝐚 𝐠𝐫𝐞𝐚𝐭 𝐬𝐨𝐥𝐮𝐭𝐢𝐨𝐧 𝐢𝐧 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝟏𝟕𝟎𝟎𝐬: 𝐓𝐫𝐚𝐧𝐬𝐩𝐨𝐫𝐭𝐚𝐭𝐢𝐨𝐧 𝐭𝐨 𝐍𝐨𝐫𝐭𝐡 𝐀𝐦𝐞𝐫𝐢𝐜𝐚.

              𝐈𝐓 𝐰𝐨𝐫𝐤𝐞𝐝. 𝐈𝐭 𝐬𝐰𝐞𝐩𝐭 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐬𝐭𝐫𝐞𝐞𝐭𝐬 𝐜𝐥𝐞𝐚𝐧 𝐨𝐟 𝐭𝐡𝐢𝐞𝐟𝐬, 𝐝𝐫𝐮𝐧𝐤𝐬, 𝐯𝐚𝐠𝐫𝐚𝐧𝐭𝐬 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐮𝐧𝐝𝐞𝐬𝐢𝐫𝐚𝐛𝐥𝐞𝐬.

              𝐈 𝐞𝐯𝐞𝐧 𝐰𝐫𝐨𝐭𝐞 𝐚 𝐝𝐲𝐬𝐭𝐨𝐩𝐢𝐚𝐧 𝐧𝐨𝐯𝐞𝐥 𝐚𝐛𝐨𝐮𝐭 𝐭𝐡𝐚𝐭 𝐜𝐚𝐥𝐥𝐞𝐝 𝐍𝐨 𝐌𝐚𝐧 𝐍𝐞𝐞𝐝𝐬 𝐍𝐨𝐭𝐡𝐢𝐧𝐠.

              𝐁𝐮𝐭 𝐭𝐡𝐞𝐫𝐞 𝐢𝐬 𝐧𝐨 𝐬𝐨𝐥𝐮𝐭𝐢𝐨𝐧 𝐬𝐡𝐨𝐫𝐭 𝐨𝐟 𝐦𝐚𝐬𝐬 𝐢𝐧𝐜𝐚𝐫𝐜𝐞𝐫𝐚𝐭𝐢𝐨𝐧 𝐨𝐫 𝐠𝐞𝐧𝐨𝐜𝐢𝐝𝐞.

              𝐖𝐡𝐢𝐜𝐡 𝐢𝐬 𝐰𝐡𝐲 𝐢𝐭 𝐡𝐚𝐬𝐧’𝐭 𝐛𝐞𝐞𝐧 𝐬𝐨𝐥𝐯𝐞𝐝.

              Should the borders be open (Trump’s position) to legal immigration based on the needs of America?

              𝐓𝐡𝐞𝐫𝐞 𝐚𝐫𝐞 𝐥𝐞𝐠𝐚𝐥 𝐰𝐚𝐲𝐬 𝐭𝐨 𝐠𝐞𝐭 𝐢𝐧𝐭𝐨 𝐀𝐦𝐞𝐫𝐜𝐚 𝐛𝐮𝐭 𝐭𝐡𝐞𝐲 𝐚𝐫𝐞 𝐥𝐨𝐧𝐠 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐢𝐧𝐯𝐨𝐥𝐯𝐞𝐝 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐞𝐱𝐩𝐞𝐧𝐬𝐢𝐯𝐞.

              𝐂𝐚𝐥𝐢𝐟𝐨𝐫𝐧𝐢𝐚 𝐝𝐞𝐚𝐥𝐬 𝐰𝐢𝐭𝐡 𝐨𝐮𝐫 𝐢𝐦𝐦𝐢𝐠𝐫𝐚𝐧𝐭𝐬 𝐩𝐫𝐞𝐭𝐭𝐲 𝐰𝐞𝐥𝐥 – 𝐭𝐡𝐞𝐲 𝐤𝐞𝐞𝐩 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐚𝐠 𝐢𝐧𝐝𝐮𝐬𝐭𝐫𝐲 𝐫𝐨𝐥𝐥𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐭𝐨 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐭𝐮𝐧𝐞 𝐨𝐟 $𝟏𝟎𝟎 𝐛𝐢𝐥𝐥𝐢𝐨𝐧 𝐚 𝐲𝐞𝐚𝐫.

              𝐒𝐨 𝐰𝐞 𝐭𝐚𝐤𝐞 𝐜𝐚𝐫𝐞 𝐨𝐟 𝐭𝐡𝐞𝐦.

              𝐁𝐮𝐭 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐆𝐨𝐥𝐝𝐞𝐧 𝐒𝐭𝐚𝐭𝐞 𝐡𝐚𝐬 𝐚 𝐇𝐞𝐚𝐫𝐭 𝐨𝐟 𝐆𝐨𝐥𝐝.

              You are either for drugs, murderers, illegals, and rapists or not. So far that is your stated opinion.

              𝐔𝐦𝐦𝐦𝐦𝐦 𝐈 𝐝𝐨𝐧’𝐭 𝐫𝐞𝐦𝐞𝐦𝐛𝐞𝐫 𝐬𝐭𝐚𝐭𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐭𝐡𝐚𝐭 𝐩𝐨𝐬𝐢𝐭𝐢𝐨𝐧.

              𝐈 𝐬𝐚𝐲 𝐭𝐞𝐫𝐫𝐚𝐟𝐨𝐫𝐦 𝐯𝐚𝐬𝐭 𝐭𝐫𝐚𝐜𝐭𝐬 𝐨𝐟 𝐝𝐞𝐬𝐞𝐫𝐭 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐭𝐮𝐫𝐧 𝐭𝐡𝐞𝐦 𝐢𝐧𝐭𝐨 𝐩𝐞𝐧𝐚𝐥 𝐜𝐨𝐥𝐨𝐧𝐢𝐞𝐬, 𝐣𝐮𝐬𝐭 𝐚𝐬 𝐕𝐢𝐫𝐠𝐢𝐧𝐢𝐚, 𝐆𝐞𝐨𝐫𝐠𝐢𝐚 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐌𝐚𝐫𝐲𝐥𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐰𝐞𝐫𝐞 𝐩𝐞𝐧𝐚𝐥 𝐜𝐨𝐥𝐨𝐧𝐢𝐞𝐬 𝐟𝐨𝐫 𝐄𝐧𝐠𝐥𝐚𝐧𝐝 – 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐥𝐚𝐭𝐞𝐫 𝐀𝐮𝐬𝐭𝐫𝐚𝐥𝐢𝐚.

              𝐈𝐧 𝐟𝐚𝐜𝐭, 𝐭𝐡𝐚𝐭’𝐬 𝐩𝐫𝐨𝐛𝐚𝐛𝐥𝐲 𝐰𝐡𝐨 𝐲’𝐚𝐥𝐥 𝐚𝐫𝐞 𝐝𝐞𝐬𝐜𝐞𝐧𝐝𝐞𝐝 𝐟𝐫𝐨𝐦?

              𝐓𝐡𝐞 𝐬𝐜𝐮𝐦 𝐨𝐟 𝐆𝐫𝐞𝐚𝐭 𝐁𝐫𝐢𝐭𝐚𝐢𝐧, 𝐭𝐫𝐚𝐧𝐬𝐩𝐨𝐫𝐭𝐞𝐝 𝐭𝐨 𝐀𝐦𝐞𝐫𝐢𝐜𝐚?

              𝐖𝐨𝐮𝐥𝐝𝐧’𝐭 𝐬𝐮𝐫𝐩𝐫𝐢𝐬𝐞 𝐦𝐞.

              1. “𝐒𝐨𝐫𝐫𝐲 𝐛𝐮𝐛𝐛𝐚 𝐛𝐮𝐭 𝐭𝐡𝐞𝐫𝐞 𝐢𝐬 𝐧𝐨 𝐥𝐞𝐠𝐚𝐥 𝐨𝐫 𝐦𝐨𝐫𝐚𝐥 𝐬𝐨𝐥𝐮𝐭𝐢𝐨𝐧 𝐭𝐨 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐛𝐨𝐫𝐝𝐞𝐫 𝐜𝐫𝐢𝐬𝐢𝐬”
                Sure there is. Allow only legal immigrants to enter. Simple. Those that enter illegally can be sent back out. Simple. Trump drastically cut the numbers down. Biden increased the numbers.
                Any six-year-old could figure that out.

                “𝐍𝐨𝐭 𝐰𝐚𝐬𝐭𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐛𝐢𝐥𝐥𝐢𝐨𝐧𝐬 𝐨𝐧 𝐬𝐨𝐦𝐞 𝐬𝐲𝐦𝐛𝐨𝐥𝐢𝐜 𝐰𝐚𝐥𝐥.”
                The wall worked and prevented drugs from entering as well.

                “𝐀𝐧𝐝 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐟𝐨𝐮𝐧𝐝𝐚𝐭𝐢𝐨𝐧 𝐭𝐨 𝐚𝐥𝐥 𝐨𝐟 𝐭𝐡𝐢𝐬 𝐢𝐬 𝐨𝐯𝐞𝐫𝐩𝐨𝐩𝐮𝐥𝐚𝐭𝐢𝐨𝐧.”

                You could start the population reduction, but I don’t think you find that desirable. The US doesn’t need to reduce its population.

                “𝐀𝐬 𝐬𝐭𝐚𝐭𝐞𝐝 𝐞𝐥𝐬𝐞𝐰𝐡𝐞𝐫𝐞, 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐰𝐨𝐫𝐥𝐝 𝐢𝐬 𝐨𝐯𝐞𝐫𝐩𝐨𝐩𝐮𝐥𝐚𝐭𝐞𝐝 𝐛𝐲 𝐚 𝐟𝐚𝐜𝐭𝐨𝐫 𝐨𝐟 𝟖 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐢𝐭’𝐬 𝐨𝐧𝐥𝐲 𝐠𝐨𝐧𝐧𝐚 𝐠𝐞𝐭 𝐰𝐨𝐫𝐬𝐞.”
                State your reasons and proof. The fertility index in America is low, so without immigration, our population decreases. Problem solved. Biden is the problem for the US, according to you.

                Should the borders be open (Trump’s position) to legal immigration based on the needs of America?
                “𝐓𝐡𝐞𝐫𝐞 𝐚𝐫𝐞 𝐥𝐞𝐠𝐚𝐥 𝐰𝐚𝐲𝐬 𝐭𝐨 𝐠𝐞𝐭 𝐢𝐧𝐭𝐨 𝐀𝐦𝐞𝐫𝐜𝐚 𝐛𝐮𝐭 𝐭𝐡𝐞𝐲 𝐚𝐫𝐞 𝐥𝐨𝐧𝐠 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐢𝐧𝐯𝐨𝐥𝐯𝐞𝐝 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐞𝐱𝐩𝐞𝐧𝐬𝐢𝐯𝐞.”
                The illegal ways are more expensive, dangerous and impose costs on society.

                “𝐂𝐚𝐥𝐢𝐟𝐨𝐫𝐧𝐢𝐚 𝐝𝐞𝐚𝐥𝐬 𝐰𝐢𝐭𝐡 𝐨𝐮𝐫 𝐢𝐦𝐦𝐢𝐠𝐫𝐚𝐧𝐭𝐬 𝐩𝐫𝐞𝐭𝐭𝐲 𝐰𝐞𝐥𝐥 – 𝐭𝐡𝐞𝐲 𝐤𝐞𝐞𝐩 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐚𝐠 𝐢𝐧𝐝𝐮𝐬𝐭𝐫𝐲 𝐫𝐨𝐥𝐥𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐭𝐨 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐭𝐮𝐧𝐞 𝐨𝐟 $𝟏𝟎𝟎 𝐛𝐢𝐥𝐥𝐢𝐨𝐧 𝐚 𝐲𝐞𝐚𝐫.”
                That is accomplished at the expense of schools, hospitals and their citizens. You are a misanthrope. We don’t need illegals. If necessary, we can provide work permits, but you don’t know enough to figure out anything but mass killing. What is wrong with you?

                “𝐁𝐮𝐭 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐆𝐨𝐥𝐝𝐞𝐧 𝐒𝐭𝐚𝐭𝐞 𝐡𝐚𝐬 𝐚 𝐇𝐞𝐚𝐫𝐭 𝐨𝐟 𝐆𝐨𝐥𝐝.”

                Not for the middle-class. The heart of gold is an act that steals other people’s money. Are you a thief as well?

                You are either for drugs, murderers, illegals, and rapists or not. So far, that is your stated opinion.
                “𝐔𝐦𝐦𝐦𝐦𝐦 𝐈 𝐝𝐨𝐧’𝐭 𝐫𝐞𝐦𝐞𝐦𝐛𝐞𝐫 𝐬𝐭𝐚𝐭𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐭𝐡𝐚𝐭 𝐩𝐨𝐬𝐢𝐭𝐢𝐨𝐧.”

                Probably too many drugs. Biden’s policies have permitted drugs, murderers and rapists in while Trump was doing an excellent job of keeping them out. You support Biden, so you support raises and murderers.

                “𝐈 𝐬𝐚𝐲 𝐭𝐞𝐫𝐫𝐚𝐟𝐨𝐫𝐦 𝐯𝐚𝐬𝐭 𝐭𝐫𝐚𝐜𝐭𝐬 𝐨𝐟 𝐝𝐞𝐬𝐞𝐫𝐭 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐭𝐮𝐫𝐧 𝐭𝐡𝐞𝐦 𝐢𝐧𝐭𝐨 𝐩𝐞𝐧𝐚𝐥 𝐜𝐨𝐥𝐨𝐧𝐢𝐞𝐬, 𝐣𝐮𝐬𝐭 𝐚𝐬 𝐕𝐢𝐫𝐠𝐢𝐧𝐢𝐚, 𝐆𝐞𝐨𝐫𝐠𝐢𝐚 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐌𝐚𝐫𝐲𝐥𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐰𝐞𝐫𝐞 𝐩𝐞𝐧𝐚𝐥 𝐜𝐨𝐥𝐨𝐧𝐢𝐞𝐬 𝐟𝐨𝐫 𝐄𝐧𝐠𝐥𝐚𝐧𝐝 – 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐥𝐚𝐭𝐞𝐫 𝐀𝐮𝐬𝐭𝐫𝐚𝐥𝐢𝐚.”

                I see, Ben, you wish to turn the US into the world’s prison camp. Not smart, but based on your other ideas, understandable.

                1. Sure there is. Allow only legal immigrants to enter. Simple. Those that enter illegally can be sent back out. Simple.
                  Trump drastically cut the numbers down. Biden increased the numbers.
                  Any six-year-old could figure that out.

                  𝐓𝐫𝐮𝐦𝐩 𝐜𝐥𝐚𝐢𝐦𝐞𝐝 𝐡𝐞 𝐝𝐫𝐚𝐬𝐭𝐢𝐜𝐚𝐥𝐥𝐲 𝐜𝐮𝐭 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐧𝐮𝐦𝐛𝐞𝐫𝐬 𝐝𝐨𝐰𝐧, 𝐛𝐮𝐭 𝐡𝐞 𝐜𝐥𝐚𝐢𝐦𝐞𝐝 𝐥𝐨𝐭𝐬 𝐨𝐟 𝐭𝐡𝐢𝐧𝐠𝐬.

                  𝐘𝐨𝐮 𝐜𝐚𝐧’𝐭 𝐛𝐞𝐥𝐢𝐞𝐯𝐞 𝐚 𝐰𝐨𝐫𝐝 𝐡𝐞 𝐬𝐚𝐲𝐬, 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐭𝐡𝐚𝐭’𝐬 𝐰𝐡𝐚𝐭’𝐬 𝐛𝐞𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐝𝐢𝐬𝐜𝐮𝐬𝐬𝐞𝐝 𝐢𝐧 𝐂𝐨𝐧𝐠𝐫𝐞𝐬𝐬 𝐭𝐨𝐝𝐚𝐲.

                  𝐇𝐞’𝐬 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐏𝐚𝐭𝐡𝐨𝐥𝐨𝐠𝐢𝐜𝐚𝐥 𝐋𝐢𝐚𝐫.

                  The wall worked and prevented drugs from entering as well.

                  𝐍𝐨 𝐢𝐭 𝐝𝐢𝐝𝐧’𝐭 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐧𝐨 𝐢𝐭 𝐝𝐢𝐝𝐧’𝐭.

                  𝐈𝐭 𝐜𝐨𝐬𝐭 𝐛𝐢𝐥𝐥𝐢𝐨𝐧𝐬, 𝐰𝐚𝐬𝐧’𝐭 𝐜𝐨𝐦𝐩𝐥𝐞𝐭𝐞𝐝 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐝𝐢𝐝𝐧’𝐭 𝐬𝐭𝐨𝐩 𝐚𝐧𝐲𝐨𝐧𝐞 𝐟𝐫𝐨𝐦 𝐝𝐨𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐚𝐧𝐲𝐭𝐡𝐢𝐧𝐠.

                  𝐖𝐚𝐤𝐞 𝐮𝐩. 𝐃𝐨𝐧’𝐭 𝐛𝐞 𝐬𝐮𝐜𝐡 𝐚 𝐬𝐚𝐩.

                  You could start the population reduction, but I don’t think you find that desirable. The US doesn’t need to reduce its population.

                  𝐍𝐨 𝐢𝐭 𝐝𝐢𝐝𝐧’𝐭 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐧𝐨 𝐢𝐭 𝐝𝐢𝐝𝐧’𝐭.

                  𝐈𝐭 𝐜𝐨𝐬𝐭 𝐛𝐢𝐥𝐥𝐢𝐨𝐧𝐬, 𝐰𝐚𝐬𝐧’𝐭 𝐜𝐨𝐦𝐩𝐥𝐞𝐭𝐞𝐝 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐝𝐢𝐝𝐧’𝐭 𝐬𝐭𝐨𝐩 𝐚𝐧𝐲𝐨𝐧𝐞 𝐟𝐫𝐨𝐦 𝐝𝐨𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐚𝐧𝐲𝐭𝐡𝐢𝐧𝐠.

                  𝐖𝐚𝐤𝐞 𝐮𝐩. 𝐃𝐨𝐧’𝐭 𝐛𝐞 𝐬𝐮𝐜𝐡 𝐚 𝐬𝐚𝐩.

                  State your reasons and proof.

                  𝐌𝐲 𝐦𝐚𝐭𝐡 𝐢𝐬 𝐂𝐚𝐥𝐢𝐟𝐨𝐫𝐧𝐢𝐚/𝐍𝐨𝐫𝐰𝐚𝐲.

                  𝐍𝐨𝐫𝐰𝐚𝐲 𝐢𝐬 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐛𝐞𝐬𝐭-𝐫𝐮𝐧 𝐜𝐨𝐮𝐧𝐭𝐫𝐲 𝐈’𝐯𝐞 𝐞𝐯𝐞𝐫 𝐬𝐞𝐞𝐧.

                  𝐀 𝐦𝐨𝐝𝐞𝐥 𝐟𝐨𝐫 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐰𝐨𝐫𝐥𝐝.

                  𝐍𝐨𝐫𝐰𝐚𝐲 𝐡𝐚𝐬 𝐨𝐧𝐥𝐲 𝐟𝐢𝐯𝐞 𝐦𝐢𝐥𝐥𝐢𝐨𝐧 𝐩𝐞𝐨𝐩𝐥𝐞.

                  𝐓𝐡𝐞𝐲 𝐡𝐚𝐯𝐞 𝐛𝐞𝐞𝐧 𝐭𝐡𝐫𝐢𝐟𝐭𝐲 𝐰𝐢𝐭𝐡 𝐭𝐡𝐞𝐢𝐫 𝐨𝐢𝐥 𝐰𝐞𝐚𝐥𝐭𝐡 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐭𝐡𝐞𝐢𝐫 𝐬𝐨𝐯𝐞𝐫𝐞𝐢𝐠𝐧 𝐰𝐞𝐚𝐥𝐭𝐡 𝐟𝐮𝐧𝐝 𝐢𝐬 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐥𝐚𝐫𝐠𝐞𝐬𝐭 𝐢𝐧 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐰𝐨𝐫𝐥𝐝.

                  𝐂𝐚𝐥𝐢𝐟𝐨𝐫𝐧𝐢𝐚 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐍𝐨𝐫𝐰𝐚𝐲 𝐚𝐫𝐞 𝐚𝐥𝐦𝐨𝐬𝐭 𝐞𝐱𝐚𝐜𝐭𝐥𝐲 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐬𝐚𝐦𝐞 𝐬𝐢𝐳𝐞.

                  𝐂𝐚𝐥𝐢𝐟𝐨𝐫𝐧𝐢𝐚 𝐡𝐚𝐬 𝟒𝟎 𝐦𝐢𝐥𝐥𝐢𝐨𝐧.

                  𝐈𝐟 𝐂𝐚𝐥𝐢𝐟𝐨𝐫𝐧𝐢𝐚 𝐡𝐚𝐝 𝐨𝐧𝐥𝐲 𝟓 𝐦𝐢𝐥𝐥𝐢𝐨𝐧 𝐩𝐞𝐨𝐩𝐥𝐞, 𝐢𝐭 𝐰𝐨𝐮𝐥𝐝 𝐛𝐞 𝐥𝐢𝐤𝐞 𝐍𝐨𝐫𝐰𝐚𝐲: 𝐫𝐞𝐧𝐞𝐰𝐚𝐛𝐥𝐞 𝐠𝐫𝐢𝐝, 𝐞𝐥𝐞𝐜𝐭𝐫𝐢𝐜 𝐜𝐚𝐫𝐬, 𝐬𝐮𝐛𝐬𝐢𝐝𝐢𝐳𝐞𝐝 𝐦𝐞𝐝𝐢𝐜𝐚𝐥 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐞𝐝𝐮𝐜𝐚𝐭𝐢𝐨𝐧.

                  𝐒𝐨, 𝐂𝐚𝐥𝐢𝐟𝐨𝐫𝐧𝐢𝐚/𝐍𝐨𝐫𝐰𝐚𝐲 = 𝟖.

                  𝐑𝐨𝐮𝐠𝐡 𝐦𝐚𝐭𝐡, 𝐛𝐮𝐭 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐩𝐨𝐩𝐮𝐥𝐚𝐭𝐢𝐨𝐧 𝐞𝐱𝐩𝐞𝐫𝐭𝐬 𝐚𝐠𝐫𝐞𝐞 𝐰𝐢𝐭𝐡 𝐦𝐞.

                  𝐓𝐡𝐞 𝐢𝐝𝐞𝐚𝐥 𝐰𝐨𝐫𝐥𝐝 𝐩𝐨𝐩𝐮𝐥𝐚𝐭𝐢𝐨𝐧 𝐢𝐬𝐧’𝐭 𝟖 𝐭𝐨 𝟗 𝐛𝐢𝐥𝐥𝐢𝐨𝐧.

                  𝐈𝐭’𝐬 𝐛𝐞𝐭𝐰𝐞𝐞𝐧 𝟏 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝟐 𝐛𝐢𝐥𝐥𝐢𝐨𝐧.

                  𝐀 𝐟𝐚𝐜𝐭𝐨𝐫 𝐨𝐟 𝐞𝐢𝐠𝐡𝐭.

                  The fertility index in America is low, so without immigration, our population decreases. Problem solved. Biden is the problem for the US, according to you.

                  𝐁𝐢𝐝𝐞𝐧 𝐢𝐬 𝐟𝐢𝐱𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐚𝐥𝐥 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐬𝐜𝐫𝐞𝐰𝐮𝐩𝐬 𝐨𝐟 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐓𝐫𝐮𝐦𝐩 𝐚𝐝𝐦𝐢𝐧𝐢𝐬𝐭𝐫𝐚𝐭𝐢𝐨𝐧 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐢𝐬 𝐝𝐫𝐚𝐠𝐠𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐀𝐦𝐞𝐫𝐢𝐜𝐚 𝐤𝐢𝐜𝐤𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐬𝐜𝐫𝐞𝐚𝐦𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐢𝐧𝐭𝐨 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝟐𝟏𝐬𝐭 𝐂𝐞𝐧𝐭𝐮𝐫𝐲.

                  𝐓𝐡𝐚𝐭’𝐬 𝐯𝐢𝐬𝐢𝐨𝐧. 𝐓𝐡𝐚𝐭’𝐬 𝐥𝐞𝐚𝐝𝐞𝐫𝐬𝐡𝐢𝐩. 𝐓𝐡𝐚𝐭’𝐬 𝐌𝐀𝐆𝐀.

                  𝐓𝐡𝐞𝐫𝐞’𝐬 𝐦𝐨𝐫𝐞 𝐭𝐨 𝐌𝐚𝐤𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐀𝐦𝐞𝐫𝐢𝐜𝐚 𝐆𝐫𝐞𝐚𝐭 𝐀𝐠𝐚𝐢𝐧 𝐭𝐡𝐚𝐧 𝐰𝐚𝐥𝐤𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐚𝐫𝐨𝐮𝐧𝐝 𝐢𝐧 𝐚 𝐬𝐭𝐮𝐩𝐢𝐝 𝐫𝐞𝐝 𝐡𝐚𝐭.

                  𝐘𝐨𝐮 𝐝𝐨𝐧’𝐭 𝐠𝐞𝐭 𝐢𝐭, 𝐛𝐮𝐭 𝐢𝐭 𝐝𝐨𝐧’𝐭 𝐦𝐚𝐭𝐭𝐞𝐫.

                  Should the borders be open (Trump’s position) to legal immigration based on the needs of America?

                  𝐓𝐡𝐞𝐲 𝐚𝐫𝐞 𝐨𝐩𝐞𝐧 𝐭𝐨 𝐥𝐞𝐠𝐚𝐥 𝐢𝐦𝐦𝐢𝐠𝐫𝐚𝐭𝐢𝐨𝐧, 𝐛𝐮𝐭 𝐭𝐡𝐞𝐫𝐞 𝐚𝐫𝐞 𝐦𝐚𝐬𝐬 𝐪𝐮𝐚𝐧𝐭𝐢𝐭𝐢𝐞𝐬 𝐨𝐟 𝐝𝐞𝐬𝐩𝐞𝐫𝐚𝐭𝐞 𝐩𝐞𝐨𝐩𝐥𝐞 𝐰𝐡𝐨 𝐫𝐢𝐬𝐤 𝐰𝐚𝐥𝐤𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐚𝐜𝐫𝐨𝐬𝐬 𝐌𝐞𝐱𝐢𝐜𝐨 𝐨𝐧 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐨𝐮𝐭𝐬𝐢𝐝𝐞 𝐜𝐡𝐚𝐧𝐜𝐞 𝐨𝐟 𝐠𝐞𝐭𝐭𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐢𝐧𝐭𝐨 𝐀𝐦𝐞𝐫𝐢𝐜𝐚.

                  𝐖𝐡𝐚𝐭 𝐭𝐨 𝐝𝐨 𝐰𝐢𝐭𝐡 𝐭𝐡𝐞𝐦?

                  𝐒𝐨𝐲𝐥𝐞𝐧𝐭 𝐆𝐫𝐞𝐞𝐧?

                  𝐓𝐡𝐞𝐫𝐞 𝐢𝐬 𝐧𝐨 𝐬𝐨𝐥𝐮𝐭𝐢𝐨𝐧. 𝐒𝐨𝐫𝐫𝐲. 𝐎𝐫 𝐢𝐭 𝐰𝐨𝐮𝐥𝐝 𝐡𝐚𝐯𝐞 𝐛𝐞𝐞𝐧 𝐬𝐨𝐥𝐯𝐞𝐝.

                  The illegal ways are more expensive, dangerous and impose costs on society.

                  That is accomplished at the expense of schools, hospitals and their citizens. You are a misanthrope. We don’t need illegals. If necessary, we can provide work permits, but you don’t know enough to figure out anything but mass killing. What is wrong with you?

                  𝐌𝐨𝐬𝐭 𝐨𝐟 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐢𝐦𝐦𝐢𝐠𝐫𝐚𝐧𝐭𝐬 𝐢𝐧 𝐂𝐚𝐥𝐢𝐟𝐨𝐫𝐧𝐢𝐚 𝐰𝐚𝐧𝐭 𝐭𝐨 𝐰𝐨𝐫𝐤 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐥𝐢𝐯𝐞 𝐝𝐞𝐜𝐞𝐧𝐭 𝐥𝐢𝐯𝐞𝐬 𝐢𝐧 𝐚 𝐥𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐨𝐟 𝐥𝐚𝐰𝐬.

                  𝐓𝐡𝐞𝐲 𝐜𝐨𝐧𝐭𝐫𝐢𝐛𝐮𝐭𝐞. 𝐀 𝐥𝐨𝐭. 𝐓𝐡𝐞𝐲 𝐩𝐚𝐲 𝐭𝐚𝐱𝐞𝐬.

                  𝐓𝐡𝐞𝐲 𝐝𝐨 𝐣𝐨𝐛𝐬 𝐰𝐡𝐢𝐭𝐞 𝐩𝐞𝐨𝐩𝐥𝐞 𝐰𝐨𝐧’𝐭 𝐝𝐨.

                  𝐘𝐨𝐮 𝐰𝐚𝐧𝐭 𝐭𝐨 𝐩𝐢𝐜𝐤 𝐥𝐞𝐭𝐭𝐮𝐜𝐞?

                  𝐍𝐨 𝐲𝐨𝐮 𝐝𝐨𝐧’𝐭.

                  Not for the middle-class. The heart of gold is an act that steals other people’s money. Are you a thief as well?

                  𝐁𝐮𝐥𝐥𝐬𝐡𝐢𝐭. 𝐓𝐡𝐞 𝐦𝐢𝐝𝐝𝐥𝐞 𝐜𝐥𝐚𝐬𝐬 𝐢𝐬 𝐚𝐥𝐢𝐯𝐞 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐰𝐞𝐥𝐥 𝐢𝐧 𝐂𝐚𝐥𝐢𝐟𝐨𝐫𝐧𝐢𝐚 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐦𝐚𝐤𝐞𝐬 𝐮𝐩 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐯𝐚𝐬𝐭 𝐦𝐚𝐣𝐨𝐫𝐢𝐭𝐲 𝐨𝐟 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐜𝐢𝐭𝐢𝐳𝐞𝐧𝐬 𝐡𝐞𝐫𝐞.

                  𝐃𝐨𝐧’𝐭 𝐛𝐞 𝐬𝐭𝐮𝐩𝐢𝐝.

                  You are either for drugs, murderers, illegals, and rapists or not. So far, that is your stated opinion.

                  Probably too many drugs. Biden’s policies have permitted drugs, murderers and rapists in while Trump was doing an excellent job of keeping them out. You support Biden, so you support raises and murderers.

                  I see, Ben, you wish to turn the US into the world’s prison camp. Not smart, but based on your other ideas, understandable.

                  𝐘𝐨𝐮’𝐫𝐞 𝐚 𝐰𝐚𝐬𝐭𝐞 𝐨𝐟 𝐭𝐢𝐦𝐞.

                  𝐁𝐢𝐝𝐞𝐧 𝐢𝐬 𝐥𝐞𝐚𝐝𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐜𝐨𝐮𝐧𝐭𝐫𝐲 𝐰𝐢𝐭𝐡 𝐯𝐢𝐬𝐢𝐨𝐧 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐜𝐨𝐮𝐫𝐚𝐠𝐞.

                  𝐈 𝐤𝐧𝐨𝐰 𝐲𝐨𝐮 𝐦𝐢𝐬𝐬 𝐓𝐫𝐮𝐦𝐩, 𝐛𝐮𝐭 𝐲𝐨𝐮’𝐫𝐞 𝐚 misinformed 𝐝𝐨𝐥𝐭.

                  𝐘𝐨𝐮 𝐤𝐞𝐞𝐩 𝐰𝐚𝐭𝐜𝐡𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐇𝐞𝐞 𝐇𝐚𝐰 𝐫𝐞𝐫𝐮𝐧𝐬 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐰𝐚𝐭𝐜𝐡𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐅𝐨𝐱 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐛𝐞𝐥𝐢𝐞𝐯𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐞𝐯𝐞𝐫𝐲𝐭𝐡𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐭𝐡𝐞𝐲 𝐭𝐞𝐥𝐥 𝐲𝐨𝐮, 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐞𝐯𝐞𝐫𝐲𝐭𝐡𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐰𝐢𝐥𝐥 𝐛𝐞 𝐀𝐎𝐊.

                  1. We have data from multiple sources. You are ignorant of them. You can check with the Mexican government to see how badly Biden is doing. Biden’s policies threaten the stability of Mexico. Trump reduced all the problems on the border significantly, and it wasn’t just by building the wall.

                    You are ignorant of the facts.

                    You support murder, rape and drug importation that killed 100,000. You support diseases crossing the border, including Covid and drug-resistant TB. Why are you so hateful?

                    You sound drugged out and are unable to provide any facts.

                    Tell us what Biden has done to make things better at our southern border.

                    1. We have data from multiple sources.

                      𝐘𝐨𝐮 𝐡𝐚𝐯𝐞 𝐧𝐨𝐭𝐡𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐟𝐫𝐨𝐦 𝐧𝐨 𝐨𝐧𝐞. 𝐘𝐨𝐮 𝐰𝐚𝐭𝐜𝐡 𝐅𝐨𝐱 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐛𝐞𝐥𝐢𝐞𝐯𝐞 𝐰𝐡𝐚𝐭 𝐭𝐡𝐞𝐲 𝐭𝐞𝐥𝐥 𝐲𝐨𝐮.

                      𝐅𝐨𝐱 𝐣𝐮𝐬𝐭 𝐠𝐨𝐭 𝐛𝐮𝐬𝐭𝐞𝐝 𝐥𝐲𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐭𝐡𝐫𝐨𝐮𝐠𝐡 𝐭𝐡𝐞𝐢𝐫 𝐭𝐞𝐞𝐭𝐡 𝐚𝐛𝐨𝐮𝐭 𝐉𝐚𝐧𝐮𝐚𝐫𝐲 𝟔, 𝐛𝐮𝐭 𝐲𝐨𝐮 𝐝𝐨𝐧’𝐭 𝐜𝐚𝐫𝐞.

                      𝐘𝐨𝐮 𝐝𝐨𝐧’𝐭 𝐰𝐚𝐧𝐭 𝐭𝐨 𝐭𝐡𝐢𝐧𝐤, 𝐬𝐨 𝐲𝐨𝐮 𝐥𝐞𝐭 𝐅𝐨𝐱 𝐝𝐨 𝐲𝐨𝐮𝐫 𝐭𝐡𝐢𝐧𝐤𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐟𝐨𝐫 𝐲𝐨𝐮.

                      You are ignorant of them. You can check with the Mexican government to see how badly Biden is doing.

                      𝐘𝐞𝐬 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐌𝐞𝐱𝐢𝐜𝐚𝐧 𝐠𝐨𝐯𝐞𝐫𝐧𝐦𝐞𝐧𝐭 𝐢𝐬 𝐚 𝐩𝐚𝐫𝐚𝐠𝐨𝐧 𝐨𝐟 𝐯𝐞𝐫𝐚𝐜𝐢𝐭𝐲.

                      Biden’s policies threaten the stability of Mexico.

                      𝐖𝐡𝐨 𝐭𝐨𝐥𝐝 𝐲𝐨𝐮 𝐌𝐞𝐱𝐢𝐜𝐨 𝐢𝐬 𝐬𝐭𝐚𝐛𝐥𝐞?

                      𝐌𝐞𝐱𝐢𝐜𝐨 𝐢𝐬 𝐝𝐢𝐫𝐭𝐲, 𝐜𝐨𝐫𝐫𝐮𝐩𝐭 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐡𝐨𝐩𝐞𝐥𝐞𝐬𝐬.

                      Trump reduced all the problems on the border significantly, and it wasn’t just by building the wall.

                      𝐈𝐭 𝐰𝐚𝐬 𝐛𝐲 𝐬𝐞𝐩𝐞𝐫𝐚𝐭𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐢𝐧𝐟𝐚𝐧𝐭 𝐜𝐡𝐢𝐥𝐝𝐫𝐞𝐧 𝐟𝐫𝐨𝐦 𝐭𝐡𝐞𝐢𝐫 𝐩𝐚𝐫𝐞𝐧𝐭𝐬.

                      𝐆𝐨𝐨𝐝 𝐟𝐨𝐫 𝐡𝐢𝐦.

                      𝐓𝐡𝐞 𝐬𝐢𝐭𝐮𝐚𝐭𝐢𝐨𝐧 𝐚𝐭 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐛𝐨𝐫𝐝𝐞𝐫 𝐢𝐬 𝐍𝐎𝐓 𝐅𝐈𝐗𝐀𝐁𝐋𝐄.

                      𝐒𝐨𝐫𝐫𝐲. 𝐍𝐨𝐭 𝐛𝐲 𝐚𝐧𝐲 𝐥𝐞𝐠𝐚𝐥 𝐨𝐫 𝐦𝐨𝐫𝐚𝐥 𝐦𝐞𝐚𝐧𝐬.

                      𝐓𝐫𝐮𝐦𝐩 𝐟𝐚𝐢𝐥𝐞𝐝. 𝐁𝐢𝐝𝐞𝐧 𝐢𝐬 𝐟𝐚𝐢𝐥𝐢𝐧𝐠.

                      𝐅𝐚𝐢𝐥𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐛𝐞𝐜𝐚𝐮𝐬𝐞 𝐢𝐭’𝐬 𝐍𝐎𝐓 𝐅𝐈𝐗𝐀𝐁𝐋𝐄.

                      You are ignorant of the facts.

                      𝐘𝐨𝐮 𝐰𝐨𝐮𝐥𝐝𝐧’𝐭 𝐤𝐧𝐨𝐰 𝐚 𝐭𝐫𝐮𝐞 𝐟𝐚𝐜𝐭 𝐢𝐟 𝐢𝐭 𝐣𝐮𝐦𝐩𝐞𝐝 𝐢𝐧𝐭𝐨 𝐛𝐞𝐝 𝐰𝐢𝐭𝐡 𝐲𝐨𝐮.

                      You support murder, rape and drug importation that killed 100,000.

                      𝐃𝐫𝐮𝐠 𝐢𝐦𝐩𝐨𝐫𝐭𝐚𝐭𝐢𝐨𝐧 𝐤𝐢𝐥𝐥𝐞𝐝 𝟏𝟎𝟎,𝟎𝟎𝟎?

                      𝐒𝐚𝐲𝐬 𝐰𝐡𝐨?

                      𝐎𝐡 𝐰𝐞𝐥𝐥 𝐦𝐨𝐬𝐭 𝐝𝐫𝐮𝐠 𝐚𝐝𝐝𝐢𝐜𝐭𝐬 𝐡𝐚𝐯𝐞 𝐨𝐧𝐞 𝐟𝐨𝐨𝐭 𝐢𝐧 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐠𝐫𝐚𝐯𝐞 𝐚𝐧𝐲𝐰𝐚𝐲.

                      You support diseases crossing the border, including Covid and drug-resistant TB. Why are you so hateful?

                      𝐈 𝐨𝐧𝐥𝐲 𝐡𝐚𝐭𝐞 𝐛𝐥𝐢𝐧𝐝, 𝐝𝐮𝐧𝐝𝐞𝐫𝐡𝐞𝐚𝐝𝐞𝐝 𝐢𝐠𝐧𝐨𝐫𝐚𝐧𝐜𝐞.

                      You sound drugged out and are unable to provide any facts.

                      𝐘𝐨𝐮 𝐬𝐨𝐮𝐧𝐝 𝐛𝐫𝐚𝐢𝐧𝐝𝐞𝐚𝐝 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐚𝐫𝐞 𝐫𝐞𝐠𝐮𝐫𝐠𝐢𝐭𝐚𝐭𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐚𝐥𝐥 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐁𝐒 𝐟𝐞𝐝 𝐛𝐲 𝐅𝐚𝐮𝐱 𝐍𝐞𝐰𝐬.

                      Tell us what Biden has done to make things better at our southern border.

                      𝐇𝐞 𝐰𝐞𝐧𝐭 𝐝𝐨𝐰𝐧 𝐭𝐡𝐞𝐫𝐞 𝐰𝐢𝐥𝐥 𝐊𝐚𝐦𝐚𝐥𝐚 𝐚𝐧𝐝𝐚 .𝟓𝟎 𝐜𝐚𝐥 𝐦𝐚𝐜𝐡𝐢𝐧𝐞 𝐠𝐮𝐧.

                      𝐓𝐡𝐞 𝐥𝐢𝐧𝐞𝐝 𝐮𝐩 𝐚 𝐛𝐮𝐧𝐜𝐡 𝐨𝐟 𝐢𝐦𝐦𝐢𝐠𝐫𝐚𝐧𝐭𝐬 𝐰𝐡𝐨 𝐭𝐡𝐨𝐮𝐠𝐡𝐭 𝐭𝐡𝐞𝐲 𝐰𝐞𝐫𝐞 𝐠𝐨𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐭𝐨 𝐦𝐞𝐞𝐭 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐩𝐫𝐞𝐬𝐢𝐝𝐞𝐧𝐭.

                      𝐈𝐧𝐬𝐭𝐞𝐚𝐝, 𝐭𝐡𝐞𝐲 𝐝𝐫𝐨𝐩𝐩𝐞𝐝 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐭𝐚𝐢𝐥𝐠𝐚𝐭𝐞 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐦𝐨𝐰𝐞𝐝 𝐝𝐨𝐰𝐧 𝐚𝐥𝐥 𝐨𝐟 𝐭𝐡𝐞𝐦.

                      𝐊𝐚𝐦𝐚𝐥𝐚 𝐩𝐮𝐥𝐥𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐭𝐫𝐢𝐠𝐠𝐞𝐫 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐬𝐰𝐞𝐞𝐩𝐢𝐧𝐠, 𝐰𝐡𝐢𝐥𝐞 𝐁𝐢𝐝𝐞𝐧 𝐟𝐞𝐝 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐛𝐞𝐥𝐭.

                      𝐖𝐨𝐫𝐤𝐞𝐝 𝐠𝐫𝐞𝐚𝐭.

                      𝐋𝐞𝐭 𝐭𝐡𝐚𝐭 𝐛𝐞 𝐚 𝐰𝐚𝐫𝐧𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐭𝐨 𝐚𝐥𝐥 𝐨𝐟 𝐭𝐡𝐞𝐦.

                    2. “𝐘𝐨𝐮 𝐡𝐚𝐯𝐞 𝐧𝐨𝐭𝐡𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐟𝐫𝐨𝐦 𝐧𝐨 𝐨𝐧𝐞.

                      Ben, let’s start with 6.8% inflation from Nov to Nov. Where do you think those numbers come from?

                      Then we can deal with more numbers. Until you can provide data to back yourself up you are ignorant.

                    3. The inflation is caused by the Trump administration printing a tsunami of dollars to keep the country running, combined with increased demand due to Covid restrictions being lifted, combined with constipated supply from Covid problems.

                      And just general worldwide economic upheaval from Covid.

                      Biden hasn’t been in office a year.

                      You think he can fix four years of mismanagement by a Lysol huffer that fast?

                      By clicking his fingers?

                      Give him 4- 8 years and see where the economy is.

                      Just like it took Obama 8 years to clean up the mess left behind by Bush43.

                      Republicans screw it up. Democrats clean it up.

                    4. Ben you demonstrate total ignorance no matter the topic. You forget about facts because the facts demonstrate your ignorance.

                      We are in debt. Biden is pushing trillions of dollars in spending that mostly doesn’t build the economy to pay off the loans. He does that at a time of rising inflation. Deal with the facts.

                    5. Well think of the quarter billion dollars a day America is no longer wasting in Afghanistan because Biden had the wisdom to withdraw from a dumbass war and occupation that wasted $2 trillion.

                      Reading about that right now in The New Yorker.

                      And think of the money the Federal government is saving by no longer flooding the VA with more emotionally and physically damaged veterans.

                      Biden saw what that loan to Tesla engendered – and will continue to inspire – so he’s all in on the Green New Deal and is hoping to continue that with the infrastructure plan.

                      If you lived where I lived you would know that electric cares are the future.

                      Well Biden wants 500,000 EV charging stations across the country by 2030, and he is exactly right.

                      Biden is dragging America kicking and screaming into the 21st Century.

                      It’s called vision and leadership.

                      This is all way over your head, but don’t worry.

                      The future is gonna happen without you, as you watch those Hee Haw reruns.

                      Click here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xsZPWsVNTqo

                    6. Trump was withdrawing from Afghanistan in an orderly fashion maintaining strength. When the Taliban acted up he hit them hard and not one American life was lost. Biden screwed up the withdrawal, killed Americans, didn’t get everyone out and didn’t make America secure. He acted like a fool;

                      You support fools. You like taking a strong position and converting it into a weak one so people die. That goes along with you love of permitting murderers and rapists come across the southern border.

                      Why type of person are you that doesn’t care about American families. Are you some type of crazy Nazi?

                    7. Read this right now: https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2021/12/20/the-secret-history-of-the-us-diplomatic-failure-in-afghanistan

                      Trump agreed to release 5000 Taliban, including murderers, drug dealers and killers of soldiers.

                      Trump didn’t have the nerve or the courage to declare a complete withdrawal.

                      It might have gone wrong and cost him the election that he lost anyway.

                      He could have done it any time during his four years.

                      But when Trump was asked to find Afghanistan on a map, he pointed to the Appalachians and bragged about all the hillbilly prostitutes he nailed.

                      Because Trump is an idiot, as are his followers.

                    8. “Trump agreed to release 5000 Taliban, including murderers, drug dealers and killers of soldiers.”

                      Your mind is twisting the facts. Not unusual from drug use. Biden let murderers and rapists in. Trump didn’t release anyone. Trump was President of the US not Afghanistan.

                      You didn’t even get your New Yorker story correct. How dumb is that.

                    9. That spring, the Taliban submitted the names of the five thousand prisoners for whom it was demanding release before power-sharing talks could begin. A group of U.S. intelligence officers and other officials reviewed the Taliban names and produced an “objection list,” which contained several convicted murderers, including Nargis Mohammad Hasan, an Afghan police officer born in Iran who, in 2012, had killed Joseph Griffin, an American police trainer, at the Kabul police headquarters. Also on the list was a prisoner known as Hekmatullah, a former Afghan soldier who had killed three off-duty Australian soldiers while they were playing poker and the board game Risk. Their cases were just two of dozens of “insider attacks”—killings of off-duty soldiers and civilians, typically by Taliban recruits—that had come to shadow the American war.

                      Ghani’s advisers were developing their own list of several hundred prisoners who they said were problematic—murderers, kidnappers, and drug traffickers, some on death row. In late May, Ghani released just under a thousand prisoners, whom his advisers had identified as low-risk. But the Taliban held firm: release all five thousand or no negotiations. “The Talibs became adamant,” Khalilzad recalled. “They knew that we were so desperate that the intra-Afghan negotiations begin.”

                      Rather than put more pressure on the Taliban, the Trump Administration continued to focus on getting Ghani to bend. As they wrestled over the prisoner problem, Khalilzad visited Ghani at the Arg palace, carrying a message from Trump: “We are ready to work with President Ghani, but if there is a perception that the big picture is being sacrificed for small matters then we are ready to change our relationship.”

                      Ghani was unmoved. “The U.S. doesn’t owe us anything,” he told Khalilzad. “If you want to leave, then leave—no hard feelings.”

                    10. “That spring, the Taliban submitted the names of…”

                      Everything was conditional on the Taliban doing our bidding or paying a heavy price.

                      With Biden, the US did the Taliban’s bidding and paid the price. So far the price is small, but it in time Biden will have cost America money and more lives. Biden is weak in the head just like you. He’s senile and you fried your brains.

                    11. Oh it sounds like we were doing the Taliban’s biding.

                      Why else would Trump agree to release 5000 prisoners including drug dealers and murderers and terrorists who had killed allied soldiers.

                      You say I like murderers and rapists and drug dealers.

                      Sounds like Trump liked them enough to release 5000 of them.

                      Trump didn’t have the balls to withdraw from Afghanistan so he left that mess to Biden, who did it fairly efficiently and cleanly.

                      We’re out, were no longer wasting billions of dollars and getting civilians and Americans killed.

                      Because of Biden.

                      Trump was too busy huffing Lysol to bother withdrawing forces.

                    12. “let’s start with 6.8% inflation from Nov to Nov.”

                      Which in reality is more like 15%. See Peter Schiff (the man who predicted the 2008 collapse).

                      That skyrocketing inflation is, of course, a tax — especially on the middle class. So much for the Left’s claim to be concerned about the well-being of middle class Americans.

                    13. >>”“let’s start with 6.8% inflation from Nov to Nov.”

                      >Which in reality is more like 15%”

                      Sam, I am curious what you are driving at.

                    14. “Sam, I am curious what you are driving at.”

                      That the actual rate of inflation is *not* 6.8% It’s closer to 15%.

                    15. Sam, I am pretty sure we are heading in that direction of even higher, but I don’t know of any way of squeezing the numbers to reasonably get to 15% at this time. The best I can get to is 10.8 using a one month basis.

                    16. “The best I can get to is 10.8 using a one month basis.”

                      See Schiff’s analysis. I’m not a financial expert. He is.

                      That analysis focuses on two things: 1) The (crooked) *method* used to calculate the CPI now, as opposed to the method used pre- about 1980. 2) The actual rise in prices of products and services in the major categories: meat, lumber, fuel, rents, et al.

                    17. Sam, that is fine. Unless I explain the numbers carefully I try to use numbers that are not based opinion. For decades I have agreed the CPI is a very imperfect measure. By the way sometimes it is too high as well as too low.

                      We calculate COLA increases based on the CPI, so when those increases are large many times similar people will suddenly change the course and say the inflation rate is calculated above the real rate.

                    18. Sam, did he provide the 15% number? If yes, can you please post his comment that does so.

                    19. Did Schiff “provide the 15% number? If yes, can you please post his comment that does so.”

                      It was an interview, and I can’t recall the specifics.

                      See also Williams, on the previous page of these comments. He makes the same point. with arguments and historical analyses.

      1. “She’s bringing integrity back to that side of the aisle, and politics in general.”

        Uh, no she is not.

        This comment is stunning. Media brainwashing is a real thing.

        If anyone doubted what Pelosi was up to with the completely bogus J6 Committee, here it is.

        DC not only stands for District of Columbia, but also what comes out of it:

        Dishonest Commentary…..nothing but propaganda….that brainwashes the masses….intentionally.

        Exhibit A: an idiot Progressive who says he would actually consider voting for a Cheney for president.

        Mission accomplished Nancy Pelosi. The people really are as stupid as you think they are.

        1. Wow. You’re a fine one to accuse anyone of being brainwashed.

          This is a look behind the curtain at just how phony Fox News 8s.

          knew all along but maybe now the rest of the country will get it.

          Pelosi?

          What does she have to with anything?

          She was just an older woman scurrying for her life from a stupid white trash tsunami.

          I’m sorry if your spous3(s) were in that group.

          No I’m not.

          You’re an idiot prole.

          Brainwashed. Right.

          it’s raining here. We need it.

        2. Liz Cheney is great.

          She’s probably backed by her dad who has some sense of integrity and is appalled the Pussy Grabber was voted in by a mob of Fox-zombified proles.

          So he gave his girl the greenligyt to tear Fox and Trump a new one.

          She’s 4ad. Like Pelosi-class 4ad.

          There’s nothing phony about the J6 committee.

          A mob of stupid, milulletheaded proles raided the Capitol, seduced by the lies of the Pussy Grabber.

          Yiu bet they’re gonna get to the bottom 9f it and guess who’s at the bottom, huffing Lysol like Dennis Hopper in Blue Velvet?

          All we need now is the pee tape.

          1. “She’s 4ad. Like Pelosi-class 4ad.”

            Lefty Ben says Liz Cheney is rad. He’s a True Believer: Liz is gonna save Democracy!

            And once again: Media brainwashing is a real thing.

            Ben is Exhibit A.

          2. Lefty Ben thinks Dick Cheney passed on his “sense of integrity” to his daughter Liz whose gonna Save Democracy!

            To repeat: Mission accomplished Pelosi, et al.

            The media IS the virus.

            Ben’s brain is in the washing machine & going through a heacy duty spin cycle right now.

            When “Liz is great! She gonna Save Democracy! Daddy Dick passed on his integrity to daughter Liz!” comes out of a lefty lunatic’s mouth?

            Could there BE any more proof it is real thing?

            Oh hell no.

            1. Yep, she’s gunning for the Pussy Grabber.

              It’s gonna get ugly(er)

              CNN)Liz Cheney is going to New Hampshire. She’s getting her political operation in order. And she’s raising money like mad from icons of the Republican Party.

              The Wyoming congresswoman is clearly exploring her political options and power well beyond her congressional district, even if she’s not talking openly about a run for president.

              “I’ve never had a conversation with her about 2024,” said Eric Edelman, a former ambassador, Pentagon official and adviser to former Vice President Dick Cheney. “If there was going to be a Never Trump candidate, I can’t think of anyone better.”

              Eight months after she voted to impeach Donald Trump, Cheney continues to be one of the party’s most vocal critics of the former President and his hold on the Republican Party. The three-term House member has also said she would do “whatever it takes” to prevent Trump from becoming president again and has not closed the door on running for the White House herself.

              Cheney’s immediate political goal, however, is to retain her House seat from Harriet Hageman, a Trump-backed primary challenger. To help, she is marshaling the forces of the pre-Trump GOP establishment.

              On October 18, former President George W. Bush will attend a fundraiser for Cheney in Dallas, co-hosted by former US Sen. Kay Bailey Hutchison and top Bush campaign aides Karl Rove and Karen Hughes.

              Former Republican House Speakers John Boehner and Paul Ryan also raised money for Cheney earlier this year. And on top of that, Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell and Sens. Lindsey Graham and Mitt Romney have all donated to Cheney through their respective political action committees.

              Her fundraising hauls have been impressive for the standards of Wyoming’s at-large district — more than $1.5 million in the first quarter of 2021 and nearly $1.9 million in the second, by far her two best fundraising performances ever.

              Cheney’s political schedule is also drawing attention.

              On November 9, she will travel to New Hampshire, the home of the first presidential primary, to speak at St. Anselm College’s Institute of Politics. The event is sponsored by the Loeb School of Communications, whose president, Joe McQuaid, is also the conservative publisher of the Manchester newspaper, the New Hampshire Union Leader, and a gatekeeper for Republican White House hopefuls.

              All of this comes as Cheney continues to play a heightened role in the national conversation, despite her ouster from the House Republican leadership team earlier this year. She is the co-chair of the House select committee investigating the events of January 6, and is just one of two Republicans serving on the panel.

              In an interview with CBS News’ “60 Minutes” this week, Cheney repeated her condemnations of Trump, calling his actions on January 6 “unforgivable.” She also criticized Republicans, like House Minority Leader Kevin McCarthy, for continuing to embrace Trump.

              “What he’s done is embrace Donald Trump. And if I were doing what he’s doing, I would be deeply ashamed of myself,” Cheney said.

              Winning reelection first

              Trump has made taking out Cheney a top priority, setting up what the congresswoman told “60 Minutes” would be “the most important House race in the country in 2022.”

              While a number of Republican candidates have jumped into the at-large district’s primary, Trump announced on September 9 he would back Hageman, the same day she entered the race.

              “I strongly endorse Republican House of Representatives Candidate Harriet Hageman from Wyoming who is running against warmonger and disloyal Republican, Liz Cheney,” the former President said in a statement.

              An attorney and former Republican National Committee member, Hageman was once a political adviser to Cheney, who responded to the endorsement on Twitter: “Here’s a sound bite for you: Bring it.”

              Since Hageman declared her candidacy, Cheney allies have highlighted her opponent’s past statements and actions opposing Trump.

              A New York Times article documented Hageman’s alliance with Texas Sen. Ted Cruz at the 2016 Republican National Convention in the effort to force a floor vote on the nomination. At the time, Hageman referred to Trump as “racist” and “xenophobic,” according to the Times.

              But since then, Hageman has taken Trump’s side. She told CNN’s Alex Rogers that Trump is the “leader of the party” and that “there are legitimate questions about what happened during the 2020 election.”

                1. She might not win the presidency bjt she might be sinking his battleship.

                  Or maybe Pussy Grabber’s supporters are all as old. Fat, corrupt, vulgar and stupid as he is and he can do no wrong?

                  It don’t matter. Only reason Trump got in was because people don’t like or trust Hillary and they wanted to give the game show host a shot.

                  But Trump failed in every way and got voted out by a landslide.

                  You really gotta screw it up to be a one term president.

                  It’s unlikely he will win again and hopefully he will go.to prison and/or have a heart attack on top of another sad stripper.

                  1. Ben, why do you like illegal drugs that kill a hundred thousand people, murderers and rapists? Tell us.

                    1. The world is overpopulated by a factor of eight.

                      Covid, drugs, assault weapons, abortion, rap music – whatever you got to reduce the population = all for it.

                      The right wing proles don’t want to use masks or take vaccinations?

                      Cool.

                      See ya!

                    2. Ben, thank you for being honest. You want murderers and drugs, perhaps nukes as well to kill people and reduce the population. OK. Now we understand where you stand. You hate people. One might want to call such a hateful person a nutcase.

                      Is it OK if population reduction starts with you?

                    3. In other words, you become facetious when you don’t have the facts. But, how are we to know when you don’t have the facts and are being facetious? We have to accept what you say as the truth. Knowing how stupid that was, should we have assumed that you were being facetious when you said you voted for Biden?

                      You rarely have any facts to prove what you say is true, so I understand you are ignorant. Your only choice is to be facetious and determine after the fact when you are or are not facetious based on how dumb your comments were.

                      “Kill the scum”

                      I’m not ready to go on a killing spree killing you and your like.

                    4. Killing spree?

                      Where I live you’d only get in with a rake in your hand.

                      Maybe.

                      And because you are ignorant and anti-Biden, you get the boilerplate Biden defense.

                      I alwasy ask the anti-Biden Trumpers to answer this, but they never do.

                      Biden is cleaning up the mess Trump left behind, and moving America into the 21st Century.

                      THE BOILERPLATE

                      Under Obama, Biden loaned Tesla $465 million to Tesla under the Advanced Technology Vehicles Manufacturing program.

                      Tesla used the money to modernize and robotize the Fremont plant and build the Tesla S.

                      Tesla paid that loan back nine years early with $15 million interest, and that loan is creating tens of thousands of jobs and hundreds of billions in new wealth.

                      And God knows how much tax revenue. And it’s a gift that is going to keep on giving long into the future.

                      Look at the factory in Texas, and the jobs created there.

                      And look at what that loan has inspired, like Ford investing $11 billion to build battery factories and a truck plant in Kentucky.

                      The success of the Tesla S sparked that, and the success of the Tesla S has a foundation in that loan overseen by Biden.

                      Point me toward any one thing Trump attempted or achieved that comes anywhere close to that one loan by Biden to Tesla.

                      The truth is, the sum total of everything Trump attempted and achieved don’t add up to that one loan by Biden to Tesla.

                      That is proof that the Green New Deal is the Real Deal, and it’s the foundation of the American Jobs Proposal and the Infrastructure Plan.

                      That’s MAGA. That’s vision and leadership and success.

                      There’s more to Making America Great Again than parading around the proles in a stupid red hat.

                    5. Ben, you have been told by more than one person why the Tesla loan meant very little. Only ignorance permits you to believe that loan was a turning point.

                      With just a reduction of regulation, Trump stimulated the economy without the Solyndra type losses and without picking winners and losers. Even if one wishes to believe the Tesla loan was smart, it was picayune compared to the economic boost a reduction in regulations that Trump did.

                      America is surviving today despite Biden’s failures based on what Trump did. Biden has doubled down on all the bad things. Inflation year to year is taxing everyone, especially those poor and in the middle class who have to pay a 6,8% ‘inflation tax’ with every purchase. That might not mean much to you, but it means a lot to everyday Americans. To make things worse, those living in the north will be paying much higher fuel taxes to keep themselves warm.

                    6. Without that loan Tesla would have been dead in the water. Everything sprouted from Uncle Sam loaning Tesla $465 million to modernize Fremont and build the S.

                      They did it very fast, went public and the market cap of Tesla has increased a trillion dollars since then.

                      Trump brought unemployment ot 20% and tanked the economy even worse than Bush43.

                      That one loan by Obama/Biden is going to resonate far far off in the future.

                      Look at what it spawned: The Porsche Taycan, the VW electric cars, the Ford F150 Lightning and Ford investing billions in Kentucky, or what’s left of Kentucky.

                      Much of that goes back to that loan to Tesla – which they paid off nine years early.

                      Pull your head out.

                      Trump trashed the economy.

                      What is his legacy?

                      Lying about election fraud and inciting a riot.

                      He should be in prison and hopefully he will be.

                      Prole.

                    7. “Without that loan Tesla would have been dead in the water.”

                      Ben, why should anyone accept what a drugged mind has to say when he deals in fantasy and made up facts.

                      Prove your contention, Tesla would have been dead in the water.
                      Show us how Tesla’s benefit to the economy outweighs Obama’s failures.

                      You can’t do any of these things because you know nothing.

                      When we talked about the Palestinians that refused to pay their rent you disappeared from the discussion. Why? Because you drew conclusions while being ignorant of the facts. Do you need me to send you a link to that discussion where the facts were clear.

                      Right now you are drawing projections and all sorts of numbers out of thin air. That makes you appear dumb.

                    8. “Without that loan Tesla would have been dead in the water.”

                      Ben, why should anyone accept what a drugged mind has to say when he deals in fantasy and made up facts.

                      𝐆𝐨𝐨𝐝 𝐪𝐮𝐞𝐬𝐭𝐢𝐨𝐧. 𝐈 𝐝𝐨𝐧’𝐭 𝐤𝐧𝐨𝐰 𝐰𝐡𝐲 𝐈 𝐰𝐚𝐬𝐭𝐞 𝐭𝐢𝐦𝐞 𝐚𝐫𝐠𝐮𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐰𝐢𝐭𝐡 𝐲𝐨𝐮, 𝐛𝐮𝐭 𝐢’𝐯𝐞 𝐥𝐞𝐚𝐫𝐧𝐞𝐝 𝐲𝐨𝐮 𝐜𝐚𝐧 𝐥𝐞𝐚𝐫𝐧 𝐚 𝐥𝐨𝐭 𝐚𝐫𝐠𝐮𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐰𝐢𝐭𝐡 𝐩𝐞𝐨𝐩𝐥𝐞 𝐰𝐡𝐨 𝐝𝐨𝐧’𝐭 𝐤𝐧𝐨𝐰 𝐚𝐧𝐲𝐭𝐡𝐢𝐧𝐠.

                      Prove your contention, Tesla would have been dead in the water.

                      Show us how Tesla’s benefit to the economy outweighs Obama’s failures.

                      𝐎𝐛𝐚𝐦𝐚’𝐬 𝐟𝐚𝐢𝐥𝐮𝐫𝐞𝐬?

                      𝐎𝐛𝐚𝐦𝐚 𝐢𝐧𝐡𝐞𝐫𝐢𝐭𝐞𝐝 𝐚𝐧 𝐞𝐜𝐨𝐧𝐨𝐦𝐲 𝐝𝐞𝐬𝐭𝐫𝐨𝐲𝐞𝐝 𝐛𝐲 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐢𝐧𝐜𝐨𝐦𝐩𝐭𝐞𝐧𝐜𝐞 𝐨𝐟 𝐁𝐮𝐬𝐡𝟒𝟑.

                      𝐑𝐞𝐦𝐞𝐦𝐛𝐞𝐫 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐆𝐫𝐞𝐚𝐭 𝐑𝐞𝐜𝐞𝐬𝐬𝐢𝐨𝐧?

                      𝐈𝐭 𝐰𝐚𝐬𝐧’𝐭 𝐬𝐨 𝐠𝐫𝐞𝐚𝐭.

                      𝐎𝐛𝐚𝐦𝐚 𝐫𝐞𝐬𝐜𝐮𝐞𝐝 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐀𝐦𝐞𝐫𝐢𝐜𝐚𝐧 𝐛𝐚𝐧𝐤𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐬𝐲𝐬𝐭𝐞𝐦, 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐢𝐧𝐭𝐞𝐫𝐧𝐚𝐭𝐢𝐨𝐧𝐚𝐥 𝐛𝐚𝐧𝐤𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐬𝐲𝐬𝐭𝐞𝐦.

                      𝐇𝐞 𝐫𝐞𝐬𝐜𝐮𝐞𝐝 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐀𝐦𝐞𝐫𝐢𝐜𝐚𝐧 𝐚𝐮𝐭𝐨 𝐢𝐧𝐝𝐮𝐬𝐭𝐫𝐲 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐬𝐚𝐯𝐞𝐝 𝐭𝐞𝐧𝐬 𝐨𝐟 𝐭𝐡𝐨𝐮𝐬𝐚𝐧𝐝𝐬 𝐨𝐟 𝐣𝐨𝐛𝐬.

                      𝐎𝐛𝐚𝐦𝐚𝐂𝐚𝐫𝐞 𝐞𝐱𝐭𝐞𝐧𝐝𝐞𝐝 𝐪𝐮𝐚𝐥𝐢𝐭𝐲 𝐡𝐞𝐚𝐥𝐭𝐡𝐜𝐚𝐫𝐞 𝐭𝐨 𝐭𝐞𝐧𝐬 𝐨𝐟 𝐦𝐢𝐥𝐥𝐢𝐨𝐧𝐬 𝐨𝐟 𝐀𝐦𝐞𝐫𝐢𝐜𝐚𝐧𝐬.

                      𝐇𝐞 𝐫𝐞𝐜𝐨𝐠𝐧𝐢𝐳𝐞𝐝 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐜𝐨𝐧𝐟𝐥𝐢𝐜𝐭𝐬 𝐢𝐧 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐌𝐢𝐝𝐝𝐥𝐞 𝐄𝐚𝐬𝐭 𝐰𝐞𝐫𝐞 𝐚 𝐦𝐚𝐬𝐬𝐢𝐯𝐞 𝐰𝐚𝐬𝐭𝐞 𝐨𝐟 𝐭𝐢𝐦𝐞, 𝐦𝐨𝐧𝐞𝐲 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐥𝐢𝐯𝐞𝐬 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐫𝐞𝐝𝐮𝐜𝐞𝐝 𝐀𝐦𝐞𝐫𝐢𝐜𝐚𝐧 𝐟𝐨𝐫𝐜𝐞𝐬 𝐭𝐨 𝐝𝐫𝐨𝐧𝐞𝐬, 𝐜𝐲𝐛𝐞𝐫 𝐚𝐧𝐝 𝐒𝐩𝐞𝐜𝐢𝐚𝐥 𝐅𝐨𝐫𝐜𝐞𝐬.

                      𝐀𝐬𝐤 𝐚𝐧𝐲𝐨𝐧𝐞 𝐢𝐧 𝐭𝐡𝐞 𝐦𝐨𝐝𝐞𝐫𝐧 𝐦𝐢𝐥𝐢𝐭𝐚𝐫𝐲: 𝐈𝐭’𝐬 𝐚𝐥𝐥 𝐚𝐛𝐨𝐮𝐭 𝐝𝐫𝐨𝐧𝐞𝐬.

                      𝐒𝐢𝐥𝐞𝐧𝐭 𝐛𝐮𝐭 𝐝𝐞𝐚𝐝𝐥𝐲 𝐝𝐞𝐚𝐭𝐡 𝐟𝐫𝐨𝐦 𝐚𝐛𝐨𝐯𝐞.

                      𝐁𝐮𝐬𝐡 𝐰𝐚𝐬 𝐬𝐩𝐞𝐧𝐝𝐢𝐧𝐠 $𝟏𝟎 𝐛𝐢𝐥𝐥𝐢𝐨𝐧 𝐚 𝐦𝐨𝐧𝐭𝐡.

                      𝐎𝐛𝐚𝐦𝐚 𝐬𝐩𝐞𝐧𝐭 $𝟏𝟎 𝐛𝐢𝐥𝐥𝐢𝐨𝐧 𝐢𝐧 𝐭𝐰𝐨 𝐲𝐞𝐚𝐫𝐬.

                      You can’t do any of these things because you know nothing.

                      When we talked about the Palestinians that refused to pay their rent you disappeared from the discussion. Why? Because you drew conclusions while being ignorant of the facts. Do you need me to send you a link to that discussion where the facts were clear.

                      𝐈 𝐝𝐨𝐧’𝐭 𝐜𝐚𝐫𝐞 𝐚𝐛𝐨𝐮𝐭 𝐏𝐚𝐥𝐞𝐬𝐭𝐢𝐧𝐞.

                      Right now you are drawing projections and all sorts of numbers out of thin air. That makes you appear dumb.

                      𝐘𝐨𝐮 𝐰𝐨𝐮𝐥𝐝𝐧’𝐭 𝐤𝐧𝐨𝐰 𝐬𝐦𝐚𝐫𝐭 𝐢𝐟 𝐢𝐭 𝐣𝐮𝐦𝐩𝐞𝐝 𝐢𝐧𝐭𝐨 𝐛𝐞𝐝 𝐰𝐢𝐭𝐡 𝐲𝐨𝐮.

                      𝐌𝐲 𝐠𝐮𝐞𝐬𝐬 𝐢𝐬 𝐲𝐨𝐮 𝐚𝐫𝐞 𝐛𝐨𝐫𝐝𝐞𝐫𝐥𝐢𝐧𝐞 𝐬𝐞𝐧𝐢𝐥𝐞. 𝐑𝐢𝐠𝐡𝐭?

                    9. “𝐆𝐨𝐨𝐝 𝐪𝐮𝐞𝐬𝐭𝐢𝐨𝐧. 𝐈 𝐝𝐨𝐧’𝐭 𝐤𝐧𝐨𝐰 𝐰𝐡𝐲 𝐈 𝐰𝐚𝐬𝐭𝐞 𝐭𝐢𝐦𝐞 𝐚𝐫𝐠𝐮𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐰𝐢𝐭𝐡 𝐲𝐨𝐮, 𝐛𝐮𝐭 𝐢’𝐯𝐞 𝐥𝐞𝐚𝐫𝐧𝐞𝐝 𝐲𝐨𝐮 𝐜𝐚𝐧 𝐥𝐞𝐚𝐫𝐧 𝐚 𝐥𝐨𝐭 𝐚𝐫𝐠𝐮𝐢𝐧𝐠 𝐰𝐢𝐭𝐡 𝐩𝐞𝐨𝐩𝐥𝐞 𝐰𝐡𝐨 𝐝𝐨𝐧’𝐭 𝐤𝐧𝐨𝐰 𝐚𝐧𝐲𝐭𝐡𝐢𝐧𝐠.”

                      You don’t make sense, but it is understandable. Frying one’s brains on drugs last a lifetime.

                      You continue to change the subject and never deal with the facts that you got wrong. All you do is make things up. What is wrong with your brain?

        3. Dishonest Commentary = Fox.

          Ingraham and Hannity and even Junior were freaking out and begging the president to do something.

          But he didn’t.

          And then they put their Faux News masks back on and continued lying to the proles.

          Ingraham and all the Foxymorons make me think of the women who collaborated with the Nazis. After World War II they were stripped to their underwear, heads shaved, swastikas tattoosled on their foreheads and paraded in front of jeering and spitting partisans before they were run out of town.

          1. I wonder who introduced Ben Marcus to his new word “prole,” it shows up in almost every recent comment of his.

            1. I answered this prolifically.

              Was it censored?

              WAS I CENSORED!!!???

              Prole is from 1984. It’s a book. Don’t worry. There are many you haven’t read.

              Most of them.

              Prole basically is a short form of “deplorable” using the same letters but less of them.

              Look at the people going to.prisom for thr Capitol riot.

              Those are prole.

              WAS I CENSORED???

              Oh I made a pun and just realized it.

              PROLIFIC.

              Ha.

              1. Ben, bring some love, k? you be spewing the hate. love is love, baby. can’t exclude no one. or it isn’t love. Tis the season, yo.

                1. I’ve said it before and I’ll said it again: The support for Trump helps me understand how the German people could have supported Nazism and Hitler out of ignorance, arrogance, fear, insecurity, laziness, racism, hatred, self–hatred and self interest.

                  Hitler was truly dangerous while Trump is a buffoon,

                  But still – anyone who can’t recognize him as a charlatan and a fraud needs to get their heads examined.

                  No mercy.

                  No prisoners!!!!

                  1. If you want to understand how the German people could have supported Nazism and Hitler look no further than Dr. “I am Science” Fauci who tells us HE must not be questioned because HE “is science.”

                    You must trust his word and do as he tells you without question! Get the jab! Wear 3 masks! Ask your relatives for their papers before you allow them in your home for the holidays! Now it is time to get your babies jabbed!

                    If you can’t question “science” then it is ANTI-science, then it is “propaganda.”

                    Goebbels himself told us this.

                    THAT is how the Germans could have supported Nazis and Hitler: They were good people who were overcome by the propaganda.

                    Wake up, man. Your civil rights and liberties ARE being infringed right now. This is not about whether you take the jab or not. This is about our rights as citizens. Give me Liberty or give me death! Do NOT comply!

                    1. Let’s not forget Dr. “I am science” Fauci creating FEAR. Fear the unvaccinated! They are not safe to be around! They are the cause! They are the problem! They are why this pandemic will not end!

                      ALL of this is “PROPAGANDA” and LIES. Coming from the GOVERNMENT. Coming from BIDEN. Coming from Dr. “I am science.”

                      THIS is why the Nazis were able to DO what they did!

                      Wake up people! THIS is a hill to die on. Right here. Right now.

                    2. Fauci is just trying to protect numbskulls from themselves.

                      How many people have died from Covid in America? 800,000+

                      How many people have died total? 5,336,773

                      It’s a worldwide pandemic, you idiot that is killing more people and doing more damage than a World War.

                      Fauci is just trying to protect people.

                      That’s his job.

                      You want the liberty to ignore him?

                      Swell. Ignore him.

                      Bur don’t while when your liberty leads to death.

                      Are you American?

                      Shame.

                      No American should be that stupid.

                  2. “Fauci is just doing his job.”

                    Now you know how the Germans could do what they did. YOU would have turned Anne Frank in.

                    1. Fauci has quite a rabbit hole to go down. Check out his AIDS killing spree. Or abusing foster children to conduct his experiments. Or torturing puppies. The man is an evil little sadist. History will tell the truth. Inshallah.

                  3. “You just hide out in your double wide and watch Hee Haw and Fox and everything will be okay.”

                    Ha! How did you know I used to love Hee Haw? And these double wides are amazing. You would never know you was in a trailer if you came fer supper.

                    Like I said, YOU would have turned in Anne Frank.

                    1. None of you are right about anything.

                      The dumbest bunch of proles the world has ever seen.

                      Although it is true my great uncle was Emmanuel Schafer, the Butcher of Belgrade.

                      He murdered 7000 Jews in a Sauer gas van in Belgrade – for which he served six years in prison.

                      But I’m half Jewish, so that excludes me from being a Nazi.

                      Trump supporters are much closer to Nazis than I could ever be,

                      The support for Trump helps me understand how the German people could have supported Hitler and Nazism out of arrogance, ignorance, fear, insecurity, hatred, greed and self interest.

                      Now I’m gonna cleanse my brain of your stupidity by watching Jeopardy!

                    2. “None of you are right about anything.”

                      I gave you the inflation rate Nov-Nov. That is a number that can be verified. That proves your statement wrong.

                      Being half Jewish doesn’t mean you can’t act like a Nazi. That has been proven over and over again on this blog by you. You have even stated how it would be a good thing for most of the people in the world to die because it is 8 times overpopulated. You support murderers and rapists. What more proof do you need. I am repeating what you told us about yourself. Do I need to repeat everything you have said? It’s disgusting enough hearing it the first time.

                    3. Ben, you can’t deal with any facts presented to you and you can’t present any facts.

                      All you do is repeat the same video.

                      Maybe you forgot you have used it already. Drugs do that to the brain.

                    4. Inflation rate November – November.

                      You think the effects of Trump’s failed presidency just stopped when he slithered out of office?

                      Slithered out of office, lied about election fraud, inspired a riot and had the complete lack of class not to attend Biden’s inauguration?

                      Biden hasn’t had enough time to wreck the economy and he’s trying to fix it.

                      As Obama did after the Great Recession.

                      Give Biden four years.

                    5. “Biden hasn’t had enough time to wreck the economy and he’s trying to fix it.”

                      By spending trillions of dollars more on programs that do not boost the economy?

                      By letting murderers and rapists in over the southern border?

                      Keep it up Ben, you are making yourself look dumber and dumber.

                    6. All those programs boost the economy.

                      You’re too old to recognize this, but America and the world are at the start of a massive transition to electric cars running on renewable energy.

                      You’ll be gone and forgotten when it really hits, but in the next 30 years. ICE stinkpots are gonna be history and everyone will be rolling in electric cars.

                      There’s money to be made in transition.

                      That loan to Tesla and the success of Tesla and Ford investing billions in factories in Kentucky and a hundred other things are proof of that.

                      Biden is investing in the future.

                      Just because you don’t have a future doesn’t mean it’s not going to happen.

                    7. “All those programs boost the economy.”

                      Show us how those social programs boost the economy. You can’t because it isn’t true.

                      Read Bastiat, broken windows.

                    1. Now that we have established that you know nothing and are wrong about almost everything, you want to send us pictures.

                      You are nuts.

  3. Karen says:

    “The way you see people is not reality. Anyone who would see themselves with the same animosity that an internet troll views others would be in serious depression.”

    That’s amusing because that’s precisely what I think of you! However, I don’t think, as do you, that this country is going to Hell. Your side believes that the Democrats pose an *existential threat* to life as you once knew it. I don’t think that of Trump.

    Trumpism will die out eventually much like McCarthyism after lawyers are found guilty of lying and Radical Right cable networks are found guilty of defamation. Trumpism will be held accountable in the court of public opinion when its perpetrators are ultimately held accountable in courts of law.

    I do devote too much of my precious time on this blog as do you, and like you, I believe in what I am saying. I have convinced a few people on this blog of my contentions. No Trumpists actually dispute my specific assertions and my examples of Turley’s hypocrisy. Instead, I am subjected to name-calling, character assassination, accused of TDS, and told to leave the blog.

    I repeat again and again that for the most part I agree with Turley’s opinions and criticisms of the MSM. My overriding complaint is his working for Fox News which is the main culprit in fanning the rage in our day and age of which I applaud Turley for denouncing. The problem is that Turley refuses to acknowledge his employer’s hand in this deplorable state of affairs.

    I would be content were Turley simply to state:

    “I am not going to criticize Fox, or any of the Rightwing networks for that matter, until I leave Fox’s employ. I acknowledge that I am not an impartial and objective legal commentator so long as I am on Fox’s payroll.”

    That’s all.

  4. This is just Newsom feeling cocky and taking a victory lap and thumbing his nose and slapping his buttocks at Texas, because California came through Covid with a $38 billion surplus, which was distributed to Californians in need, and to help them pay gas and electric bills and rent.

    And also to be the only state fo write stimulus checks.

    Texas seems to be making some noise about catching up with California in terms of influence, progression, productivity and prosperity, but they’re still a far distant second.

    Look at everything Texas has to offer to get people to live there: No income taxes, a freezer full of brisket, no capital gains, a lifetime supply of Dr. Pepper.

    California seems to punish citizens with high taxes and whatnot, and still there are 12 million more people in California than Texas.

    Must be a better place to live.

    And our governor is a smartass.

    Good for him.

  5. So much lunacy in this thread from ignorant trolling fools that didn’t bother to read and understand what Turley actually wrote and instead the stupid trolls went off on their usual ad hominem tangents against Turley, SCOTUS and conservatives. Are you fools really the blithering idiots your portray in these threads or are you intelligent trolls trying to manipulate others with your gaslighting BS. Either way I look at this, you people have become the anti-constitutional evil regressive totalitarians that you claim to be against, you and your Pravda like “progressive” media outlets are the real enemy of we the people of the United States of America and an actual enemy to our representative democracy.

    If this comment angers you because you think I’m talking about you, you’re right.

      1. Ben Marcus wrote, “Texas Shmexas. If they want to make abortion illegal, swell. Long as those Texans stay in Texas, it don’t make no nevermind.”

        Are you another intolerant anti-Liberty regressive wanting to restrict the lives and liberty of those you disagree with or are you just plain blind to how your imbicilic anti-American rhetoric comes across?

        1. Nope. I know Texas pretty well. First chicken fried steak i ever had was wearing a coat and tie at the River Oaks Country Club.

          There is a level of Texas that is friendly and great, kind of like aloha in Hawaiians.

          But then there is a vast layer of phony, pumped up Texan who are dumber than dirt.

          Anti-American?

          My ancestors made America great.

          I’m anti-stupid, ant–prole, anti-Trump

  6. What if the fetus was in the mother for 160 months, and she be like “to hell with this, I want an abortion”?

    1. Rittenhouse was an assault weapon.

      The dude shooting the other dude in Texas over child custody looked like an assault weapon.

      Sandy Hook was an assault weapon?

      Mass shootings are usually not handguns.

    2. Handguns are more numerous but assault weapons are more effective..

      Guns used in mass shootings in the U.S. 1982-2021

      Published by Statista Research Department, Dec 1, 2021

       Handguns are the most common weapon type used in mass shootings in the United States, with a total of 146 different handguns being used in 98 incidents between 1982 and November 2021. These figures are calculated from a total of 125 reported cases over this period, meaning handguns are involved in about 78 percent of mass shootings.

      The involvement of semi-automatic rifles in mass shootingsOwing to their use in several high-profile mass shootings, there has been much public discussion over suitability or necessity of assault weapons for the purpose of self-defense. While any definition of assault weapon is contentious, semi-automatic rifles are generally the main focus of debates around this issue. Since 1985 there has been a known total 49 mass shootings involving rifles, mostly semi-automatics. This figure is underreported though, as it excludes the multiple semi-automatic (and fully automatic) rifles used in the 2017 Las Vegas Strip massacre – the worst mass shooting in U.S. history, killing 58 and wounding 546. In fact, semi-automatic rifles were featured in four of the five deadliest mass shootings, being used in the Orlando nightclub massacre, Sandy Hook Elementary massacre and Texas First Baptist Church massacre.

      Mass shootings and gun controlDespite evidence of strict gun control measures reducing the frequency and severity of mass shootings in countries like Australia, citizens in the United States remain deeply divided over the issue. According to a survey about the expected impact of gun laws on the number of mass shootings, a slim majority of Americans believe that gun control measures will have little-to-no effect. Most likely, this opinion is influenced by an underlying commitment among many in the U.S. to the greater importance of protecting gun ownership rights than limiting access to firearms. This sits in sharp contrast to many other developed countries. For example, most Canadians support a ban on civilian owned firearms.

    1. Fine.

      Then pass a law defining abortion as murder. Then any woman convicted of getting an abortion is a murderer. And should be punished accordingly. Death penalty? (Maybe burning at the stake?) Just life? (Perhaps shackled in a dungeon?)

      And, of course, any person who is convicted of assisting that abortion, is an accessory or accomplice to murder. 20 years? 50? Maybe just the rack?

      While you’re at it, make “blasphemy” a capital offense.

      Then you’ll be only a few steps from your dream: An Inquisition.

  7. To justify government banning abortion, many conservatives use this (fallacious) premise: Abortion isn’t mentioned in the Constitution.

    So I’m going to try the same point, from a different angle:

    In a constitutionally limited republic, like ours, a private individual can take any action, unless that action is expressly prohibited by the law.

    Government, by contrast, can take only that action that is expressly permitted by its constitution.

    1. You are correct in saying that the individual is left free in their liberty to do as they please and government can only do that which is expressly granted to them by the People. Except that abortion takes the life of a human being. There are plenty of laws proscribing that. Roe v. Wade is a travesty of a court opinion in that it elevated killing a human being based on a supposed right of privacy. Yet, nowhere do we have the private right to violate the inalienable rights of another human being either in the common law, the laws of our nation or the Constitution.

      1. “There are plenty of laws . . .”

        You’re conflating laws and Constitutional amendments.

        Where in the Constitution does it grant government the authority to use its police powers to control a woman’s body and medical choices?

        1. Sam, you are arguing from one corner of the room. Where does the Constitution say mothers have a right to kill their offspring? The people held the right to **life**, liberty and property (happiness) in high esteem,

          We have conflicting rights and conflicting definitions. Abortion occurred when the Constitution was written. It happened at the local level, where the people living in that community decided whether it was right or wrong. There was a penalty for abortion, whether shame or something else. It wasn’t as if the people were advocating the mass killing of the unborn

            1. Sam, I assume you don’t like the word offspring. Here is the M-W definition.

              “the product of the reproductive processes of a person, animal, or plant”

              Did you think the offspring of two bonafide persons is a plant? 🙂

              1. “I assume you don’t like the word offspring.”

                What I respect is the precise use of language. In the context of abortion, “offspring” is a grossly over broad word. And “to kill their offspring” is a grotesque smear campaign.

                1. “What I respect is the precise use of language.”

                  Sam, don’t go Randian on me. You, of course, have word preferences because those words help bring you to the conclusion you desire.

                  I used an accurate word with real meaning.

                  Offspring, definition #1a Merriam Webster: “the product of the reproductive processes of a person, animal, or plant” You will have to provide your rationale as to why that word isn’t good enough.

                    1. Primary dictionary definitions do generally use context as a guide. That is up to you to show how the word isn’t in context with abortion. You are using a technique similar to that of the Randians. I like Rand, but not the definition part.

    2. Just to be clear, Sam: NO ONE, not the Court, nor the Texas law, nor any other governmental entity, is “banning abortion.” The ISSUE has always involved the length of the [window] (following conception) during which a woman must choose to terminate a pregnancy.

      1. “NO ONE, not the Court, nor the Texas law, nor any other governmental entity, is ‘banning abortion.’”

        That is incorrect.

        Criminalizing an abortion *outside* that “window” is a ban on abortion . . . outside that window. Besides, a total ban has always, and is now, the endgame.

  8. If NATO uses nuclear weapons against Russia, sure, there will condemnation, but so what? Being condemned doesn’t mean anything. The regimes of North Korea, Syria, and Iran, China, and Russia have been condemned for lots of condemnable things that they have done, but so what? Have they ever been punished? No. Were they toppled from power? No. So why should the West be?

    1. Condemnation AND contamination.

      No one is using nuclear weapons on anyone.

      if NATO wants to punish Russian aggression, kick them out 9f the UN or Olympics or cut off their energy supplies or don’t allow Suits to be broadcast in their country or play the Pina Colada song non stop over their Internet or something.

      Nukes are for kooks.

      1. Instead of using the pipeline as leverage to protect Europe and Ukraine, Biden gave the Russians the ability to have that pipeline which significantly threatens Ukraine and adds threats to Europe.

        Knowledge is dangerous when used by people who can’t incorporate more than one point at a time.

        Ben, when it comes to international affairs, you don’t seem to know anything. Nukes are a threat, and Iran threatens to wipe Israel off the map. They already fund the terrorist groups and pay for a large part of the 4,000 missiles attacking civilian areas in Israel just a short while ago.

        What do you think will happen if Iran goes nuclear?

  9. U.S. Supreme Court ruling “Fletcher v. Peck” (1810) was essentially ruling that state/local governments are indeed bound by the U.S. Supreme Court’s interpretation of “constitutionality” under Article VI of the U.S. Constitution. Section 2 of Article VI explicitly includes state and local officials by name. Section 3 of Article VI legally mandates that all government officials take a constitutional Oath of Office before they are granted any governing authority over any other person within their jurisdiction.

    For example: local Jim Crow era laws were always illegal in every state, commonwealth and territory. The 10th Amendment (states’ rights) can’t be interpreted to violate other constitutional rights of any person in that local official’s jurisdiction.

    This not only benefits progressives but also benefits conservatives as well. It also means that conservatives’ rights are protected also. A state or local government can’t infringe on gun rights or property rights if it violates U.S. Supreme Court rulings on constitutionality.

    Any fair written rulebook is fair to all Americans so everyone relax, it benefits all sides and restrains all sides from unconstitutional authority. The whole point of “Judicial Branch” courts is to rule on the law even for unpopular causes and unpopular people. If the U.S. Constitution is fundamentally flawed, we have a constitutional amendment process to improve it.

  10. Federalists Setting Stage For ‘More’ Polarization

    In some ways, the abortion battle now being waged in the courts is a test case. Can the states make an argument that a civil right can be reversed on the state level? Can they make the case that all that the Constitution has not explicitly spelled out should be reserved for the states?

    Edited from: “We’re Edging Closer To Civil War”

    Today’s New York Times

    ……………………………………………………………….

    One of the court’s conservatives pretentiously proclaimed that letting states set their own abortion laws will somehow cool the controversy. ..It won’t..!!

    With both Mississippi and Texas, the court is signaling that states are perfectly free to ignore federal laws. And now California intends to test this premise to illustrate the folly of said thinking.

    1. Ah, but you are wrong. As I stated in another comment, NO ONE, not the Texas law or any state law or entity is “banning abortion.” The moving target for courts concerns the “viability” standard declared in a post-Roe case, that addresses the [window of time] during which a woman must choose to terminate a pregnancy.

      1. “. . . the [window of time] . . .”

        So there’s a right (to an abortion), but one can act on that “right” only within the government’s proscribed time? And there’s a “right” to free speech, but only where and when government permits it? And there’s a “right” to property, . . .

        Rights are not permissions. A government that proscribes a right is authoritarian. (See the pandemic lockdowns, shutdowns, vax mandates.) Its move to totalitarian is merely a matter of time.

    1. Ben, CA has the highest poverty level of all 50 states. Only DC has a higher poverty rate, and it’s not a state.

      1. California is burdened with 1/9th the population of the entire country.

        Idaho + Montana + Oregon + Nevada + Arizona + New Mexico still don’t add up to California’s 40 million.

        If California had 1/50th the population of the entire country the Happy Few 6,600,000 residents of California would live like sultans and there would be zero poverty.

        Too many people = poverty.

        1. Ben, you were bragging about how well people were doing in CA.

          I didn’t mention the total number of Californians in poverty. I referred to the rate. CA could have a lower rate of poverty than, say, Mississippi, yet have more poor people. Instead, CA has both a higher rate of poverty, and a higher number of poor people.

          If all the business owners, job creators, and tax payers left CA, leaving behind 6 million poor people, would CA poverty be solved? How would benefits for those poor people get funding?

          You are focused on a magic population number which you’ve settled on as the sweet spot, without any regard to what those remaining people need to be able to contribute.

          1. Case in point. Newsom banned gas powered outdoor motors – lawnmowers, weed whackers, generators, etc.

            Are landscaping companies supposed to plug their equipment in to homeowners’ power, and just hang out while everything charges? How are they going to afford all new equipment?

            Without a generator, what are we to do when CA’s unstable power grid shuts down? In my area, it does so regularly, coincidentally around most major holidays. Without a generator, I’d lose a fridge and freezer full of food every time. What are people to do who need medical equipment, when the power goes out, and they’re not allowed a generator? “Die quickly to reduce the surplus population?”

            You do not seem willing to discuss the ways in which policy makes it harder to live in CA. Regular power outages combined with an electric car would straighten you out.

          2. IF California had only 6,600,000 people, everyone would be rich,

            It would be like Norway,

            I don’t know what effect that population decrease would have on the GDP, but California has always been a rich state.

            From the ground up.

            Agriculture alone is worth $100,000,000,000 all in and 6,600,000 people might not be enough to run the state.

            The poorest parts of Mississippi are poorer than California, I promise you.

                    1. I know, right? Them-what-don’t-know-nothing can lurn you a lot of funny.

                      And yet you, Ben, fly here on Gull Wing, hovering from On High Malibu, to grace us with your Know-It-All presence.

                      How did we get so lucky?

                    2. Well you can learn a lot arguing with people who don’t know nothing and don’t have their facts straight.

                      For example there is a Facebook page called California Sucks! where I spend time arguing with dingalings who don’t understand and/or are not worthy of the Golden State.

                      When the anti-Californians sneer about Tesla moving to Texas, I usually say: “Part of the reason they moved is because it’s cheap. Musk paid $5,000,000 for 2100 acres outside of Austin. Land is five million an acre in California.”

                      Which is hyperbole, but the truth is eye-raising.

                      To build the circular Apple Park in Santa Clara, Apple paid $156 million for a square mile.

                      There’s 640 acres in a square mile so that pencils out at $243,750 an acre.

                      Austin is like $2,380.95 an acre.

                      There it is.

                      There are other good reasons for Musk and Tesla to move to Texas, but that’s a good one.

                      Texas is cheap and they have to offer a lot of incentives for people to live there.

                      Same with Nevada.

  11. “It will be hugely successful politically, but not without costs to the state and potential litigants.”

    The same is true for Texas.

    “if states can now shield their laws from review by the federal courts …”

    That’s the question that the Supreme Court has so far refused to answer for SB 8.

    “First, the Texas law was quickly found to be unconstitutional by the district court”

    Yet SCOTUS has refused to stay it, as has the 5th Circuit. It is at this moment preventing women from obtaining abortions in Texas.

    “while there are litigation costs, those costs would decrease quickly as other courts declare challenges to be unconstitutional.”

    But that isn’t what’s happening in Texas.

    For goodness sake Turley, address the known facts, and if you don’t know them, educate yourself.

  12. The Texas S.B.8 and Gov. Newsom’s proposed statute create private plaintiffs to sue about abortion and guns, respectively. Where is the real blood on such a plaintiff’s nose? Where is standing?

  13. Choose to drive a car. Choose to keep and bear arms. Choose to have sex.

    Proscribe vehicular homicides. Proscribe unjustified and criminal shootings. Proscribe elective abortions.

    Will Newsom ban cars and sex, too?

  14. Chief Justice John Roberts’ Desent From Texas Abortion Law

    “The legislature has imposed a prohibition on abortions after roughly six weeks, and then essentially delegated enforcement of that prohibition to the populace at large. The desired consequence appears to be to insulate the State from responsibility for implementing and enforcing the regulatory regime,”
    …………………………………………………………..

    If Justice Roberts is incorrect in his interpretation, then California has every right to implement a similar law for the purpose of harassing gun manufacturers and distributors.

    California’s law is only defective if Roberts’ interpretation is correct.

    1. ROBERTS MUST HAVE ISSUED A FULLY PERVASIVE UNANIMOUS DECISION THAT THE RIGHT TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS IS ABSOLUTE.

      CHIEF JUSTICE ROGER TANEY WROTE TO “CRAZY ABE” LINCOLN THAT LINCOLN HAD NO LEGAL BASIS OR AUTHORITY TO SUSPEND HABEAS CORPUS.

      “CRAZY ABE” SIMPLY WENT AHEAD AND FURTHER INCRIMINATED HIMSELF.

      45,000 ROAD DEATHS PER YEAR – SHALL WE MAKE CARS ILLEGAL – WAS THE CAR OR THE DRIVER RESPONSIBLE – DO AMERICANS HAVE A RIGHT TO KEEP AND BEAR CARS?
      __________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

      Allow me to clarify. That is Chief Justice Roberts, not His Majesty King Roberts.

      Justice Roberts should have been impeached and convicted a very long time ago for his failure to strictly adhere to and obey the oath he took to SUPPORT the Constitution.

      His adjudication of the Affordable Care Act was an egregious crime of high office; His Majesty King Roberts took the law and Constitution into his own criminal hands.

      His Majesty King Roberts commingled the definitions of the words state and federal to falsely support the unconstitutional “exchanges” related to Obamacare.

      States may modify the Constitution through the interminable and formidable amendment process delineated in that document.

      His Majesty King Roberts has no authority to find and decide anything other than that Americans have the absolute right to keep arms and to bear them.

      Certainly you, as His Majesty King Roberts, can read.
      __________________________________________

      2nd Amendment

      A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

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