The Texas Supreme Court has ruled that the Pleasant Glade Assembly of God cannot be held liable for injuries to a 17-year-old girl from an exorcism performed on her by the church members. Laura Schubert was cut and bruised and suffered lasting psychological trauma but the Texas Supreme Court said that it is all part of free exercise of religion.
The 6-3 decision could have major repercussions for people injured by churches.
What some call a “hyper-spiritualistic environment” seems more like a hyper-negligent environment to tort lawyers. Schubert in 1996 was pinned to the floor for hours and received carpet burns during the exorcism. The experience, the jury found, led her to mutilate herself and attempt suicide. The jury found that she had been falsely imprisoned and abused by the church — awarding her $300,000 (an amount later reduced to $188,000).
The jury determination of false imprisonment is particularly troubling. Since when can a church hold an individual against her will and physically harm her? If she is treated as an adult, it is clearly false imprisonment. As a minor, it would be abuse. Either way, the sweeping immunity extended in the case could allow a wide array of abuse by churches.
For a copy of the opinion, click here.
For the full story, click here.
Many years ago (10? 15?) a ‘youth minister’ at a Colorado Springs invited neighborhood children to a ‘faire’ at his church. We’re talking very young children here — K-2 maybe. Many local parents agreed. Many probably thought of it as nothing more than free child care for a few hours.
Once there, the YM-from-Hell took the children into a room and told them giant bees would sting them to death unless they accepted Jesus. Giant bees would sting their parents to death. I can’t remember all of the details, just that it was wildly inappropriate for small children and many (most? all?) were reduced to tears.
Needless to say, few parents were amused. (Especially the non-Christian ones — I shudder to imagine what he told the Jewish children.) I seem to recall that the local PD didn’t think they could get far since the parents -had- given consent for the YM-from-Hell to take their kids for a few hours. Infliction of emotional distress would run into the first amendment, esp. if this is a fire-and-brimstone church that uses fear with everyone. Maybe those stories were the norm with member’s young children. Legally, when does bad baby-sitting become abuse, especially at a church?
Some parents were talking about a civil suit, but I never saw anything more on the story. By then it was months later and 100+ miles away, so not newsworthy.
I have little hope that the continued sexual, physical, and emotional abuse of children under the guise of religious freedom will stop anytime soon. It is particularly outrageous that all three branches of government continue to turn away from confronting these outrages.
I wonder what the ruling would be if the church was a Mosque or if the exorcism had instead been part of a Wiccan ritual?
gyges: Good question. People like puzzling look the other way when it is Islam but they sure love to pile on Christians don’t they.
I am still waiting for “prestigous” attorneys, such as JT, to take on a religion other than Christianity in this country, but I won’t hold my breath.
puzzling and Gyges,
10/4 on both your posts. My friend was saying how worried he is about the increasing irrationalism in our society. He believes this keeps people in their place as it were, as the critical thought necessary for a real anaylsis of what is happening is completely discouraged. If you don’t really understand why something is happening you can’t really, (or may not even think you ought to) address it.
I find the new age movement quite egregious in this respect. For example there is an unusually high level of childhood leukemia in a township near where I live. I can’t count the number of highly educated new agers who have told me this is because of: 1. those kids’ bad karma 2. they need to learn a life lesson or 3. god is showing other people that they need to live right or they’ll get cancer. O.K., those are three dumb-ass and cruel explanations for this problem. Here’s another–that township has a lot of homes near a leaking toxic waste site. If you’re new age, that dump isn’t going to be cleaned up becuase your understanding of the problem doesn’t include a scientifically based world view. Apparently it “feels right” to blame the victims and forget about them. This attitude certainly helps the owner of the waste site, no clean ups here! So, I agree. There is a lot of damage being done in the name of religion/spirituality. It needs to stop, NOW!
martha h:
“I am still waiting for “prestigous” attorneys, such as JT, to take on a religion other than Christianity in this country, but I won’t hold my breath.”
*********************
Me too. Why not take on the crooks in the mega-churches. They are anything but Christian. I know, let’s call them what they are: Republican shills. Come on, go ahead and hold your breath. You’ll look like Cheney when someone tells him he has to follow the law!
mespo: are you unable to post an articulate paragraph or just an up-chucking of useless baseless inaccurate factoids.
martha j:
The foregoing was witty opinion. No facts (except maybe the “Republican shill” part), they were in my other posts which you glossed right over. If you need me to explain the difference between a fact and an opinion, let me know and I’ll start working on those flash cards.
mr. mespo
will you always be an insulent little boy or will you at some point grow some.
i don’t see you helping anyone in the world at all. all i see is a complainer, a whiner.
I have an idea…
Instead of posting barbs on JT’s Bio, which seems inappropriate to me, perhaps, he would provide a Free-for-All ‘Chat’ section.
It could be fashioned ‘On the Hook’ – whaddaya say?
boo
martha h:
I always thought that since puberty I had “grown some.” that’s what gives me the courage to sally forth against the likes of you neo-cons and try to inject some thought into all that raw emotion. That’s my idea of helping those who cannot help themselves.
Patty C;
That is a fine idea. I second that.
Can this young woman bring charges for kidnapping in Federal Court?
Mespo,
Sit down and shut up! The fossils say No!
Jill
i have an idea.
you puke liberals move to the upper northeast and start your own country.
don’t come bother the rest of us when you get attacked and/or starve because you all are better “thinkers” and “talkers” than those that actually accomplish something.
you all have such wonderful ideas on how religion is the bane of all society.
i implore you to go to iran, saudi arabia, yemen, and do them as much good as you have done in america with bringing out the truth behind religion.
please go. i implore you. help those poor people realize the error of their religion.
go. oh you won’t?
so you are all talk, eh. you are just brave enough to pile on christianity….and that doesn’t take much.
Niblet, russ, percy, martha h…
whooliebacon:
“Niblet, russ, percy, martha h…..
….Henny Youngman, Milton Beryle,Bob Hope etc.
All famous comedians.
martha h:
“you puke liberals move to the upper northeast and start your own country.”
************
Now that’s a novel neo-con idea–”if you don’t love it leave it.” Oh that’s right your predecessor confederates really did try to leave in 1861 but got a little attitude adjustment and came crawling back with a little prodding from General Grant. I have an idea, what say we rescind that little surrender at Appomattox Courthouse and you guys can have all those quaint places back like Mississippi and Alabama back. You could re-institute slavery to do all your dirty work and then sit around sipping mint juleps while lamenting the glory of days gone by. Then you could rush off to Church to learn all you could learn from that First Century guidebook and then come home to beat your slaves, mate with your cousins, and then complain that those immoral liberals are ruining everything. Yeehaw!
Whooliebacon,
I think your are right. The Niblet family is growing by leaps and bounds. Must be Irish like me. By the way, Martha H., do you have something against capital letters?
I thought that I had bad years ago with the Nuns and their disciplinary tactics. I do not remember any Exorcism injuries.
By the way Martha H., How many people have been killed in the name of religion, just in your lifetime??
Whooliebacon,
I think your are right. The Niblet family is growing by leaps and bounds. Must be Irish like me. By the way, Martha H., do you have something against capital letters?
I thought that I had it bad years ago with the Nuns and their disciplinary tactics. I do not remember any Exorcism injuries.
By the way Martha H., How many people have been killed in the name of religion, just in your lifetime??
I thought I would correct my first posting and then I thought I would use a Niblet tactic and just keep posting against myself. It is pretty cool.
“you all have such wonderful ideas on how religion is the bane of all society.”
Creed; not religion.
Amazon.com: The Undiscovered Self: With Symbols and the Interpretation of Dreams (9780691018942): C. G. Jung: Books
But what do you care?
“please go. i implore you. help those poor people realize the error of their religion.”
“go. oh you won’t?”
“so you are all talk, eh”
I visited Pakistan in May of 2002; ventured deep into the heart of an Oliver Stone movie/conspiracy.
http://recordingdevice.tripod.com/
And destined to take the place of the mudshark in your mythology…
No Bin laden goats were found; however, the only tree growing in the VIP garden outside Islamabad was a Bush– G.W. Bush
Stay in your own movie.
martha h wrote:
mespo: are you unable to post an articulate paragraph or just an up-chucking of useless baseless inaccurate factoids.
**************************
Martha h, Mespo is VERY capable of posting articulate sentences AND paragraphs. Do you respond so rudely to those who criticizes ANY religion or do you just respond this way to anyone criticizing christianity only? Just so that’s clear.
Patty C, I like the “Free For All” Chat section too.
Isn’t mentioning Bin Laden outing a CIA agent?
“Isn’t mentioning Bin Laden outing a CIA agent?”
Actually, I meant to say ‘the only American tree growing in the VIP garden was a G. H. W. Bush.’
rafflw asks how many people have been killed in the name of religion:
the last credible statistic i saw estimated that religion has killed 1/100th as many people in 2,500 years as communism killed in 100 years.
Martha H,
Come on now. Don’t hold back this credible source that estimates that communism has killed more than religion in 100 years compared to religion’s 2,500 years. You are either blind or naive. Give us he evidence that the Commies killed more than the Crusades. Don’t for get to add in the various Israeli/Palestinian conflicts. Don’t forget the Indian/Pakistani squabbles, Northern Ireland, the list goes on.
martha h:
“the last credible statistic i saw estimated that religion has killed 1/100th as many people in 2,500 years as communism killed in 100 years.”
****************
[This is just too easy] ok, martha I am now prepared to concede that Communism was a more successful murderer than religion by a factor of one hundred. Quite high praise indeed for religion!
I’m wondering if Martha would have a problem with Christianity’s (all branches included) own past terrorist campaigns in previous centuries. You know, like the INQUISITION and MALLEUS MALEFICARUM during the 1400′s in Europe and the Salem, MA Witch Trials in 1692/93. Or is that “piling on Christianity” too much. @@
Susan,
The Malleus Maleficarum was written by David Addington and Dick Cheney in their past lives! They brought back some of their best techniques with them this time around. Continue “piling on” with facts!
Jill
Hi Jill,
I wonder if either V.P. Cheney or Mr. Addington was Pope Innocent VIII, the Pope who created the MALLEUS, in their “past life.” The fact that a supreme “head of the church” could create such a hideous torture program against so-called “witches” or “heretics” tends to destroy any credibility or respect for that church, as far as I’m concerned anyway.
Everyone but Martha:
I think we’ve gone a little far afield here picking on “the Church.” I have a sneaking suspicion that if we had the ability to follow the history of any group that’s been around as long as Christianity we’d find just as many misdeeds. I’m sure the only reason we don’t know about atrocities committed by the equally old non-western religions is because as a society we’re pretty ignorant of most things things that happened outside of Europe before colonialism. I think that religion is a hold-over from an earlier point in our development as a species and in general fosters a lot of unhealthy attitudes that humanity as a whole would be better off with out.
Martha:
Prestigious lawyers shouldn’t “take on” religions. They should take on people committing crimes in the name of religion, but there’s a difference between a small fringe (the Pleasant Glade Assembly of God, or Pope Innocent VIII for instance) and the whole of the religion. There’s less major cases like that involving other religions in this country because there’s significantly less people that practice other faiths, so less people to commit crimes in the name of those faiths. It’s the same reason why there’s more cases involving people with both eyes then involving people missing an eye.