A new study from the National Campaign to Prevent Teen and Unplanned Pregnancy has identified an area of young adults who have been overlooked by prior campaigns: young evangelicals. The study found 80 percent of unmarried evangelical young adults have had sex. That is virtually the same (8 percent below) the national average. With a campaign infused with religiosity this year and all of the talk of “real America” versus urban America, the study challenges stereotypes.
The article below says that “Studies have not found that abstinence-only programs cut pregnancy rates, sexually transmitted diseases (STDs), or even the age when sexual activity begins.”
However, last year, a study indicated some success from these programs. Here is what the Washington Post reported:
Only about a third of sixth- and seventh-graders who completed an abstinence-focused program started having sex within the next two years, researchers found. Nearly half of the students who attended other classes, including ones that combined information about abstinence and contraception, became sexually active.
Perish the thought that we could have a substantive debate on this question, but it would make for an interesting exchange.
Source: Think Progress
I don’t have access to the link….But I have read that some do no.t consider oral……sex….this is one of the problems with warts and gonorrhea in the mouth….
millions of years of evolution vs. abstinence training, kind of like Couture vs Walton.
Wham, bang.
I suspect the distribution of those teens having unprotected sex is disproportionally skewed towards Southern states where birth control occupies the same status as boll weevils. I used to want to travel abroad to visit the Third World. Little did I know I could have just driven south a few hours.
Mespo, What statistics do you use to support your suspicion? The south is often shown as having a bunch of uncouth Goobers and it is sometimes true, especially in more rural areas. But having lived in Pittsburgh, Pa, North Platte Neb. Lake Charles, La. Alexandria, Va, Bethesda, Md Philadelphia, Pa and Beach Haven, NJ and being a native of southeastern NC. I have seen Ignorance, racism, teenagers out of control, Parents who have no idea how to raise their children. I have seen: Uncouth behavior, Tactlessness( especially from Philly) and all sorts of ill natured behavior from people in general in all the places I have lived. All Including my native state but no more than the other places I have lived. But it would be wrong to lump all yankees into the same category as you seem to lump all southerners. One thing that is true of most southerners that I have never seen up north is a duty of hospitality….. I have a respect for most of your posts here But it is galling to always hear the same prejudiced slurs.
Jo:
well said.
Dont be too hard on Mespo, he is a southern boy born and bred I think.
You know how it is when you see kin acting badly, you want to distance yourself from the behaviour.
People are people around the world, we all have our faults and virtues.
Lets let Cole Porter suggest a reason:
Jo, Roco is right. Mespo was pulling somebody’s leg. He is a Southerner himself. Heh!
Roco , Thank you for the Cole Porter Vid… The last four days have been very bad for me and But who can be sad during Cole? TY
OS,
Mespo is a Southerner, but I am not sure that he was pulling our collective legs. He is correct that in many Southern states the Teapublicans are attempting to make birth control illegal.
Mespo, I apologies if I jumped to conclusions. I hear many slur aimed at Southerners so very often. I guess I am oversensitive.
Roco, So In Love by Cole Porter is a beautiful song. Yours was more appropriate in the situation but I love Cole Porter and you have cheered me up.
rafflaw:
can you provide links to that? I dont think they are true Tea Party people. I think they may be evangelical republicans. Those people scare me more than you progressives do, at least I know you guys arent waiting for the second coming.
Raff, this is true of the teabaggers here in the south but the south is not the only part of the country with teabaggers or ignorance. The south is often focused on as the hive of ignorance of this country because of Hollywoodization and media one idea at a time attitude. We have a great deal of ignorance this is true, but look around you where ever you live. Look and you will see it. If you don’t see it you need to open your horizons. Some of the kindest people I have ever met (outside of my native NC) were from Duquesne PA. Bohunks Poles Eastern Orthodox Steel mill workers a diverse community but they were also the most racist. Openly racist at any rate. I am very fond of the people from the Pittsburgh area. But Ignorance abounds everywhere.
Roco didn’t you hear about the rapture in May?
It did’t happen, you say??? Sure It did and there is now a silver alert for that one lil ole lady who disappeared in Iowa.
“Only about a third of sixth- and seventh-graders who completed an abstinence-focused program started having sex within the next two years, researchers found. Nearly half of the students who attended other classes, including ones that combined information about abstinence and contraception, became sexually active.”
From my recollection, this seems about what I’d expect on ratios for sexual activity at that age. But note the wording. The word is “focused”. I have no issue with a sexual education program that focuses on abstinence as long as that focus is coupled with actual sex education in re biological processes and information to avoid pregnancy and STDs if the students should choose to be active. A recommended course of action is not the same thing as an incomplete education. My recollection of sex ed. was along those lines of complete but recommending abstinence and it was at a secular public school. As I never got a girl pregnant or contracted an STD more serious than mono (which may or may not have been from sexual contact), I’d say that part of my education served me well.
Roco,
Some of us are waiting for the first coming.
Elaine:
have you talked to your husband about that?
Roco,
I thought you were speaking of the Savior and Judgment Day.
Elaine,
.
That was just wrong, wrong, wrong… Thank god I am I looking to replace this laptop…..
Coffee all over….
Ya’ll make me laugh.
I….well…..i guess everything devolves to sex. Come on. As adults do you really think the time has come or is that just atributing a biological function to a non-biological dimension? it seems the subject of teen sex comes and goes over and over again. The discussion of older people having sex never seems to pop up. or come to our attention. In the coming years (usually before 70 or so I guess) we will be discussing geriatric sex alot more. I don’y know how old Elaine is but it could be she’s just waiting for her husband and doesn’t want to talk about his comings and goings. Don’t worry Elaine he’ll be coming soon and then you can tell Roco and me that we needn’t worry so much about coming events in your life.
When my daughter was a teen she and her boyfriend (cute but dumb as a brick) left his house to go to the movies. The boys mother called me and told me that Kelly had left her purse and the “little brother had tipped it over” She had seen a … GASP…. prophylactic !!! Maybe I should have a talk with my daughter!
Kelly came home and let me tell you we did have a talkin’ to. The mother should never have found only a condom in her purse. The mother should have found at the very least four condoms.
Kelly knew my views were that she was too young for sex. I think all the aspects of a sexual relationship is too much for an immature mind. But I am not a fool and I knew that when they decide to have sex that a teen will have sex.
Abstinence is a good thing to stress Whether from moral or psychological grounds. And the biology of sex ed should be taught so they will know the ins and outs of sex (OK Now that wasn’t called for Jo)(Sorry)
But even the most religious kid will not forgo sex because Mom and Jesus say so, Sarah Palin.
Kelly as most teens do made up her own mind about sex but I taught her to ALWAYS be safe.
AY,
“That was just wrong, wrong, wrong… Thank god I am I looking to replace this laptop…..
“Coffee all over….’
I hate to play teacher–but shouldn’t that be god with a capital “G”?
You know, people are often discussing why sports figures always want to bring God into their victory speeches but never into their comments on a loss. I want to know why people so often bring God into their successful orgasms, but never mention Him in their misfires.
Gene, Does Goddamnit count?
angrymanspeaks,
I am of an age where I could be a member of AARP–but I’m not. Instead…I’ve decided to start my own organization of angry elders who are fed up with Washington, our current politicians, Wall Street, and the way our country is being run. My organization is AARPO–which stands for “Aged And Really Pissed Off.”
P.S. You can come join us any time you feel the urge.
Jo,
Why indeed it does! I stand corrected.
Elaine,
Would a lesser god…still be with a “G”…..
Elaine, You can sign me up. Just dont send mail like aarp does all the time.. Its always addressed …….Hey Jo you’re old!
Gene,
Can an orgasm be unsuccessful?
raff,
It all depends on how you handle it….
The 8% difference in the rate of premarital sex between Evangelicals and general population is probably explained by the fact that Evangelicals marry earlier so that they can have sex (another result of Abstinence campaigns in addition to higher rates of STD’s among sexually active Evangelical teens), which partly explains why Evangelicals (at least, the SBC) have higher rates of divorce than the general population.
Just as much sex with more unwanted pregnancies, more STDs, and more divorces — God save ‘em, or is it God save us from ‘em.
Oro:
it’s the latter.
AY,
The capital “G” denotes the one and only true God. Of course, those who believe in God believe that THEIR god is THE one and only true God.
Jo,
Welcome to the ranks of AARPO!
Ignore those emails from “that other organization.” You’re as young as you feel…or is it what you feel?
*****
AY,
I bet I know what your next comment will be!
Elaine,
I read something recently that said something like this: “Show me how you spend your money and I’ll show you where your God is at.”…..
Oro Lee, Amen, protect us all from the Southern Baptists. And may I add the Missionary Baptists, Primative Baptists and…………
(Full disclosure I was raised Missionary Baptist….. but I outgrew it)
TY Elaine I will return the hated mailers with added nasty comments from now on.
AY,
That wasn’t the comment that I was expecting.
Elaine,
In so many thing is life….I agree in plurality….
Jo:
“Mespo, What statistics do you use to support your suspicion?”
************************
I thought most educated folks knew the South is the epicenter for crime, teen pregnancy, poor education, and most other social ills. Other areas of the US aren’t perfect but compared to our Bible Belt cousins, they are positively halo-clad. Here’s some crime stats to get you going from Sam Harris’ “Letter to a Christian Nation.”
“Of the twenty-five cities with the lowest rates of violent crime, 62 percent are in “blue” states and 38 percent are in “red” states. Of the twenty-five most dangerous cities, 76 percent are in red states, 24 percent in blue states. In fact, three of the five most dangerous cities in the United States are in the pious state of Texas. The twelve states with the highest rate of burglary are red. Twenty-four of the twenty-nine states with the highest rate of theft are red. Of the twenty-two states with the highest rates of murder, seventeen are red.”
Here’s the bottom of the State Enlightment Rankings which takes into account SAT scores, infant mortality, prisoners per 100,000 pop, births out of wedlock, gonorrhea rate, and 7 other criteria:
42 NEVADA 437
43 TENNESSEE 441
44 GEORGIA 446
45 LOUISIANA 449
46 NORTH CAROLINA 457
47 ALABAMA 458
48 FLORIDA 467
49 MISSISSIPPI 495
50 SOUTH CAROLINA 541
See a pattern yet? And this from someone who lives in the semi-southern Commonwealth of Virginia (We’re #24. Yippee!). We can see across the southern boundary and “it ain’t pretty” as our Southern cousins might say. Slurs? Maybe, but lots of facts and experience to go with it.
True story, FWIH:
The Billy Graham Crusade came to the Big City. On teen-night, I and other teens who attended the baptist church in my small town were bused to the big event. (I wasn’t feeling well, but went because it knocked $10 off summer camp fee). Baptist churches in all the surrounding towns bused their teens to the Crusade (as I recall, they all used public school buses).
Well, I got to feeling bad during the service and went to lay down in the bus. Lo and behold, a fellow teen from my church was in the bus having carnal with a teen from one of the other small towns. After our initial surprise and exchange of pleasantries, I moved to the back of the bus and laid myself down to sleep while the other two continued to get to know each other.
Whenever i hear the word “chutzpah,” I think of those two.
Mespo, “Of the twenty-five cities with the lowest rates of violent crime, 62 percent are in “blue” states and 38 percent are in “red” states. Of the twenty-five most dangerous cities, 76 percent are in red states, 24 percent in blue states. In fact, three of the five most dangerous cities in the United States are in the pious state of Texas. The twelve states with the highest rate of burglary are red. Twenty-four of the twenty-nine states with the highest rate of theft are red. Of the twenty-two states with the highest rates of murder, seventeen are red.”
Red state, Blue state? Are the only red states southern and only blue states everywhere else???? What red state blue state map are you looking at? The statistics for the red states that are so dismal seems to encompass A great deal of the Us. According to Wikipedia map entitled “Average margins of victory in the four presidential elections between 1992 and 2008″ The states are: Alaska Montana, South Dakota, North Dakota, Idaho, Wyoming, Nebraska, Utah, Arizona, Colorado, Kansas, Oklahoma, Texas, Arkansas, Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama, Georgia, South Carolina, North Carolina, Virginia, West Virginia, Indiana, Kentucky, and Tennessee. However if you use the map designated “Summary of results of the 1996, 2000, 2004, and 2008 presidential elections:” add the states of Ohio Florida And Nevada to the red states list.
So I dont think much of the first set of statistics you list. The second set seems to hold more value. Seems at any rate .
Here’s the bottom of the State Enlightment Rankings which takes into account SAT scores, infant mortality, prisoners per 100,000 pop, births out of wedlock, gonorrhea rate, and 7 other criteria
But I would like to see the statistics of each state individually side by side and also the other 7 criteria. And what happens to the enlightenment scale if we add the scores of the several other criteria of “Enlightment” How about assholishness HMMMMMM The North might start edging us out…. Oh wait a minute You are from Virginia …. and Virginia is considered by everyone to be a Southern State.
I rescind my apology from earlier.
Jo,
I think we may all define “assholishness” in different ways.
It is all because of Obama.
Elaine this is very true.
assholishness … would that fall under the factor of Health or Lifestyle?
I checked the site and can’t decide where to put it or how to test for it … but then I’m from Ohio listed at #28 and if I wanted to gain enlightenment I should probably move to the #1 state, Minnesota, where I could, conceivably, run into Michele Bachmann and her enlightened army of armed and dangerous constituents.
The only two places I would rather live are the upper peninsula of Michigan or New Mexico and they are both burdened with less enlightenment than Ohio so I’d be jumping from the frying pan into the fire.
I guess I’d best stay put and accept the inference of assholishness though I’m pretty sure, if and when a test for it is developed, our abundance of teabaggers will guarantee us a righteous placement. Of course I live in the northern part of Ohio on Lake Erie and the majority of teabaggers live in southern Ohio.
Jo:
“Oh wait a minute You are from Virginia …. and Virginia is considered by everyone to be a Southern State.”:
****************
Not since we got hornswoggled into fightin’ that little war of your’n in 1861.
Here’s the site:
http://law2.umkc.edu/faculty/projects/Ftrials/states/usMAIN.html
This is the problem with trying to regulate teen sex. You find out things that you did not want to know.
Pyscopath,
Go ahead and try to regulate teen sex and see how far you get! My guess is that it would keep you busy 24/7.
STATE ENLIGHTENMENT RANKINGS*
Ever wonder where all the other enlightened people like yourself hang out? Worried that a move might bring you next door to an apathetic, illiterate, tobacco-chewing, cockfight-watching, snakehandling, gonorrhea-carrying axe murderer?
http://law2.umkc.edu/faculty/projects/Ftrials/states/usMAIN.html
I dislike the use of “enlightenment” in this context, so here’s some similar data labeled with the very tongue-in-cheek title of “7 deadly sins”:
http://www.wired.com/culture/education/magazine/17-09/st_sinmaps
You can certainly take issue with these labels (“pride” is a total cop-out), but look at theft, violent crime and STDs per capita – the “bible belt” sure seems to be a hotspot for a lot of bad behavior – particularly of the unprotected sex kind.
Also, there’s data that could be characterized as “southerners are fat, lazy, eat like crap and make themselves sick, which the rest of us are going to have to pay for” but that would be rude, so here’s a funnier presentation of that data:
http://boingboing.net/2011/03/08/passport-ownership-p.html
“Passport ownership prevents diabetes” (Yeah, like the lack of pirates causes global warming)
(Would now be a good time to bring up the “welfare” state versus “donor” state issue? No? OK, I’ll move on…)
Regarding comparing abstinence-only to others: 1) That seems to be lumping both “no sex ed” in with “well rounded sex-ed”, which seems problematic. and 2) I wonder how this study controlled for factors associated with self-selection for abstinence-only programs…
“Can an orgasm be unsuccessful?”
My older, smarter brother told me,
“Sex is like pizza.
When it’s great, it’s great.
When it’s not great, it’s still pretty good.”
This is too good not to share.
Headline reads: “Anti-gay “pastor” charged with stealing $150K…blames gays. No, really.”
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/09/30/1021694/-Anti-gay-pastor-charged-with-stealing-$150Kblames-gays-No,-really?detail=hide
Otteray,
I loved the following post title at Matt Taibbi’s blog:
GOP Debaters Get Shit Wrong, Don’t Care
SEPTEMBER 23, 2011
http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/blogs/taibblog/gop-debaters-get-shit-wrong-dont-care-20110923
From the CDC 2009 stats:
http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm6006a6.htm?s_cid=mm6006a6_e
teen abstinence is actually pretty easy. when the kids are about twelve let them watch grandma and grandpa after grandpa gets a script for viagra.
that’ll hold’em till they hit their mid twenties.
p.s. i’ve been sprinkled as a lutheran and as a child dunked as a southern baptist. haven’t been back since i was 17. i didn’t like their answers to my questions.
Mespo Thanks for the link to the site, I’ll try to take a look at it tomorrow.
Mespo My original comment to you was about the way you spoke about the South in general
You said “I suspect the distribution of those teens having unprotected sex is disproportionally skewed towards Southern states where birth control occupies the same status as boll weevils. I used to want to travel abroad to visit the Third World. Little did I know I could have just driven south a few hours.
The third world remark was really disturbing. As was driving a few short hours.
Even if I grant every statistic you threw out there, there was this exchange
Me: “Oh wait a minute You are from Virginia …. and Virginia is considered by everyone to be a Southern State.”:
****************
You: ” Not since we got hornswoggled into fightin’ that little war of your’n in 1861.”
OK here I go. Yes especially since “We the hornswogglers”
(theReal South?????) Somehow Tricked? Forced? the po’ lil’ ole’ Virginians into fightin “our” war.
First let me say that the Civil War (or any other of the silly names have been given to the Civil War Take your pick) began for all intents and purposes with South Carolinas secession on Dec 20th (some say the 24th) 1860. I’ll make a list so it will be better viewed.
South Carolina ……………….. 12/20/1860
Mississippi………………………..01/09/1861
Florida……………………………..01/10/1861
Alabama…………………………..01/11/1861
Georgia……………………………01/19/1861
Louisiana………………………… 01/26/1861
Texas……………………………….02/01/1861
VIRGINIA…………………………..04/17/1861
Arkansas………………………….05/06/1861
Tennessee……………………….05/07/1861
and last but not least
North Carolina…………………..05/20/1861
(Maybe ya’ll dragged my po’ lil’ ole’ state into it!)
Now as if that isn’t enough 06/15-19/1861 The
2nd West Virginia Convention Seceded FROM VIRGINIA
It was Union territory and Admitted to the United States in its own right 06/20/1863. For WVa to secede from Va means Va wanted to stay with the Confederacy. You weren’t “hornswoggled into fightin’ that little war of your’n in 1861.” Say Rather That Little War of OURS”
Now that we have established that VA was a Southern State of its own volition …. So what …. Its the 21st century!
Virginia is considered to be a Southern State by the country as a rule. And the fact that YOU Say: “And this from someone who lives in the semi-southern Commonwealth of Virginia (We’re #24. Yippee!). We can see across the southern boundary and “it ain’t pretty” as our Southern cousins might say. Slurs? Maybe, but lots of facts and experience to go with it.” Doesn’t change anyones views except maybe yours.
Maybe you have been ridiculed for your accent and lumped into the same catagory as all of your statistics Its galling for an intelligent man to be assumed to ignorant or stupid because of his place of birth (residence?) or accent. You are not ignorant or stupid and you know this. So why feed the stereotype with slurs against the South???
I grant that there many type of problems here in the South; Republicans, Teapartiers, Ignorance, Poverty, Crime,(This is one of the statistics that bothers me . Los Angles has a horrible crime rate but also a very dense population. Lump Places like that against sparser pop and say its per capita… we lose)
I do thank you sincerely for the link as there are very bad problems here in the South. We are just not comperable to a third world country.
Jo:
“I do thank you sincerely for the link as there are very bad problems here in the South. We are just not comperable to a third world country.”
*************
Of course you’re right about my hyperbole, after all we know for certain: The food’s better, the people nicer, and you won’t find 50 roaring vehicles spinning around a track in Nairobi.