Pat Robertson Declares Earth Older Than 6000 Years And Calls For Evangelists To Stop “Covering Up” Science

225px-Pat_Robertson_Paparazzo_Photography260px-Europasaurus_holgeri_Scene_2Pat Robertson remains something of an enigma. Just when you dismiss him as a religious wing nut who says that God gives him tips of who will win elections; atheists want people to be miserable; and causes earthquakes to punish Haitians as Devil worshippers. Then Robertson turns around and calls for the legalization of marijuana and now called for evangelists to stop suggesting that the Earth is only 6000 years old when every scientific fact points to the contrary. I wish he would just pick one side of the sanity/insanity line and stick with it because this is getting confusing.


220px-James_Ussher_by_Sir_Peter_LelyRobertson finally uttered the truth about a ludicrous calculation made in 1650 by the Archbishop of Ireland James Ussher when he estimated that the Earth was created on Oct. 23, 4004 B.C. Yet, forty six percent of pastors insist the Earth is 6000 years old. American politicians like Sarah Palin and others (here) also still proclaim faith in the young age of the Earth as biblically correct even if it is scientifically nonsensical.

Robertson’s surprising comments came on the Christian Broadcasting Network’s “700 Club.” A viewer wrote into the show to express her “biggest fear is to not have my children and husband next to me in God’s Kingdom because they question why the Bible could not explain the existence of dinosaurs.” In response, Robertson said:

Look, I know that people will probably try to lynch me when I say this, but Bishop [James] Ussher wasn’t inspired by the Lord when he said that it all took 6,000 years. It just didn’t. You go back in time, you’ve got radiocarbon dating. You got all these things and you’ve got the carcasses of dinosaurs frozen in time out in the Dakotas.
They’re out there. So, there was a time when these giant reptiles were on the Earth and it was before the time of the Bible. So, don’t try and cover it up and make like everything was 6,000 years. That’s not the Bible. . . . If you fight science, you’re going to lose your children, and I believe in telling it the way it was.”

It is an interesting contrast to so many politicians. In the GOP primary, Huntsman was a refreshing contrast in challenging the party to stop denying science. Had the GOP embraced Huntsman, I am convinced it would have secured the White House. Instead, his candidacy died out with little support as science-denying candidates prevailed in race after race.

This announcement follows an admission from Robertson that he misheard God’s tip on who would win the presidential election. Earlier he told viewers that God told him the name of the ultimate victor. After the election, Robertson explained that he “missed” the message. He explained “I sure did miss it, I thought I heard from God, I thought I had heard clearly from God, what happened? What intervenes? Why? You ask God, how did I miss it? Well, we all do and I’ve had a lot of practice.”

It is part of the yin and yang of Pat Robertson. One moment is he clear and cogent and the next he will channelling bizarre messages from the Almighty.

Source: Huff Post

84 thoughts on “Pat Robertson Declares Earth Older Than 6000 Years And Calls For Evangelists To Stop “Covering Up” Science

  1. “Had the GOP embraced Huntsman, I am convinced it would have secured the White House. Instead, his candidacy died out with little support as science-denying candidates prevailed in race after race.”

    I have to mostly agree. He was the only reasonable candidate the GOP had and while I disagreed with him on a couple of policy issues, he could have gotten my vote with some others. It might not have been a slamdunk for Huntsman, but it wouldn’t have been the through routing that the Mittens got either.

    But Pat picking Team Sanity over Team Insanity? I’m pretty sure Pat is playing out of bounds even if he does occasionally pass the ball to the other team.

  2. I guess Ol’ Pat might not hear so good when God is whispering who to put money on in the Intrade election betting racket, but he CAN hear the laughter of every thinking person when they consider a worldview based on a 17th-Century zealot’s patriarch-lifespan addition skills.

    Srsly, the fundie’s view of science boils down to “If I don’t unnerstan it, it cain’t be true.” As much as I think Muslim fundamentalists are morons too, even THEY accept more science than Xian fundies do.

  3. I liked Huntsman too. But an election is composed of more than a good, clean and wise candidate with good policies and a good platform. Look at McGovern in ’72.

    So, we’ll never know until maybe 2016, if the Rs can change that much—and their supporters too.

  4. Huntsman was anti- gay marriage and anti-abortion and for a tax plan that clearly favored the very very wealthy, but I will agree he seemed more reasonable. He certainly was too reasonable to be nominated by the republican party. His positions are similar to that of Jeb Bush who will be preferred to Huntsman if he does decide to run.

  5. Gene – yes, if the GOP had simply selected a candidate that supports only about 50% of the insanity the party believes they might have won.

    If that were to happen I would be investing in some very large and very sturdy umbrellas to protect me from what would be dropping from the airborne pigs

  6. idealist, Robertson ran in the republican primary in 1988. The party was not as packed with evangelicals as it is now.

  7. SwM,

    Think all the “good” things one misses being away from home so long. :-) Where did he finish? I mean parish!!!

    Re Jeb Bush. Poppy is paying a million a year just to stay alive to get Bush III elected. So it is a given.

    Will he do it without a revolution or with. He will do whatever is needed. Adams? Haw! Pikers!

  8. This election has caused many people on the radical right to re-evaluate. Even Fox ‘News’ viewers are waking up to the propaganda they are being fed day after day (about time, too):

  9. “His positions are similar to that of Jeb Bush who will be preferred to Huntsman if he does decide to run.”

    SwM,

    Although I was wrong in thinking that Jeb would be the GOP nominee this year, he was obviously smart enough not to be, his and the Bush family’s statements in the run-up to this election were definitely, intentionally moderate to position him for the future. Also remember his wife is Latino.

    “Huntsman was anti- gay marriage and anti-abortion and for a tax plan that clearly favored the very very wealthy, but I will agree he seemed more reasonable.”

    I simply could not support someone evincing the above three positions that you point out. The rights of homosexuals are equal in importance to any other constitutional rights being abridged. The opposition to abortion has always been code for the repression of women and of their sexuality. Finally, Huntsman and Bush would definitely favor a continuation of policies that maintain this countries program of socialism for the rich, capitalism for everyone else. To my mind support for any of those three issues alone rules out my support.

  10. Mike S. Jeb’s wife is Mexican, and his son George P. Bush has formed a campaign committee in Texas. Don’t know what he is running for yet maybe AG if Perry does not run for governor and Abbott moves up. The family is definitely on the move again.

  11. “if the GOP had simply selected a candidate that supports only about 50% of the insanity the party believes they might have won.”

    Huntsman to a tee, Frankly.

  12. Swarthmore mom
    1, November 30, 2012 at 9:59 am
    Maybe what Robertson learned at Yale Law School surfaces every once in a while.

    ———————————————————————–

    lol … :evil:

  13. “Robertson finally uttered the truth about a ludicrous calculation made in 1650 by the Archbishop of Ireland James Ussher when he estimated that the Earth was created on Oct. 23, 4004 B.C.”

    ********************************

    Well there’s another one for Satan. Thank goodness, His Holiness the Pope is holding the dogmatic literal truth line. Oh, wait!

    http://www.examiner.com/article/pope-benedict-xvi-declares-aspects-of-christmas-story-as-being-myths

  14. pat said that who would put a nail in good door of a church in “88”.
    the correct prophetic answer is. all theologians that use that house of GOD to speak against GOD. the lynching would then be put in t he hands of the true believers in GOD not JESUS like the antichrist want you to believe.

    since THE BIBLE _ _ _ _ that theology would be turned to science, and that theologians will all be killed for speaking against GOD. it is a clear understanding of who is lying. and the who was as far as I got on the on the mother brothers, and the 12:10 p on huntsmen…
    also that mitt romney was to also have killed himself. romney is a cleric.
    these acts would have closed all religious institutions instantly. instead they are corrupting all nations. let man of any clothe deny this and you have false teachings about the cross being vindicated.

    so lynch pat, I don’t give a shit. pat spoke against GOD publicly and can not be denied, because pats selling GOD.
    PROPHECY says, that I will take the heads of the beast that has many heads. so send it to the FBI.

  15. Swarthmore mom
    1, November 30, 2012 at 11:18 am
    http://littlegreenfootballs.com/article/39052_Jon_Huntsman-_Maybe_Not_Anti-Science_But_Definitely_Anti-Womens_Rights

    ====================

    Hasn’t that been a permanent plank of the Republicans, after fiscal conservatism. How could Roe vs Wade happen, they have wailed for years. And Malisha awakened me to what they did for revenge on mothers who want child custody.

    The only difference between a Republican and a caveman is that the Republican carries a Bible too.

  16. This is all self interest on Robertsons part the quote “If you fight science, you’re going to lose your children, and I believe in telling it the way it was.”

    This is the ‘tell’ to the real issue, to see his religious organization keep herding in followers. He knows future generations would have to be almost completely isolated -and some are during this social phenomenon of home schooling.

    He already has the home schoolers, but it is not enough so he has to adjust his doctrine to keep the money flowing into his coffers.

  17. “I do not think much of a man who is not wiser today than he was yesterday.”
    ~Abraham Lincoln

    Does this mean Honest Abe finally after all this time likes ol’ Reverend Pat now?

  18. Mespoo

    There you are doing the same mistake again. GeneH should bite you hard.
    If Abe likes people who progress, etc.

    That is not what it is…Abe said that he DISLIKED those who could not grow. He did NOY say that he liked ALL who could grow.

    Were you serious? You must have been kidding and I, as usual, went for it. LOL.

  19. This is all self interest on Robertsons part the quote “If you fight science, you’re going to lose your children, and I believe in telling it the way it was.”

    Well yes, and it’s logical to be self-interested in that way. In 2007 my ex-husband did something very wrongful and unlawful and my son said to him, “if you do that, you’re going to lose your son.” The guy couldn’t help himself and the natural consequence naturally occurred. But I saw that it was his (the father’s) own psychotic behavior that ended up depriving him of a relationship with his only son. He COULD NOT change; he COULD NOT give up the hope and illusion of control; he COULD NOT stop his obsessive and damaging behavior. If he had been able to, his motivation would have been self-interest. But that’s not all bad. Self-interest is good if it can make people understand that there doesn’t ALWAYS have to be a “lose-lose” in place.

    Robertson sees, accurately, that he can’t maintain control of young minds by backing such absurdity that NOBODY listens to him any more. He’s playing the long game, and not the short one. Smarter than a rock.

    His religion may not die out as completely as the dinosaurs.

  20. Einstein was on to something. Shook up the world. Turned time inside out and proved size doesn’t matter. Just approach C squared and suddenly nothing is as it once seemed to be.

    I have been busy casting a mid-size thermonuclear reactor between NGC 2770 and NGC 3314. My arm got sore so I had some time to kick back watch you all here.

    Does anyone know how I can do a better job teaching the basics on how to make something from nothing? My students complain I’m boring.

  21. Wondering about the universe is not something these con men Christianists are interested in. Not at all, they already know all the answers.

    The ‘Bible’ tell them what to think, and that little voice in their head tells them how to manipulate those stories. For maximum profits.

    Even Einstein could not move them unless money was involved.

    Gee, Malisha, was your ex did what Greenspan thought was impossible for banksters. Greed over saving anything from complete destruction.

  22. Jill

    You may be able to get some ideas from the recent PBS NOVA series “The Fabric of the Universe.” It is very current and does a good job of explaining how expansion unfolded, possible multiverse, dark energy, etc. Its four 1 hour parts. Just a thought.

    This is part four, “Universe or Multiverse?”: http://video.pbs.org/video/2168433605

    The other parts are “What is space?”(deals with Newtonian physics, “The Illusion of Time”(introduces Einstein, space-time, and relativity), and the 3rd is about quantum mechanics like entanglement and multiple dimensions.

    How to get kids excited and engaged in cosmological science is tough, but if they get the desire to investigate the science they may realize we are living in one of the most exciting eras of scientific discovery thus far. The numbers involved(heat, density, expansion rates) are one of the turn offs for the young, I think. Wish I could try to help more. What age of student are you teaching?

  23. When I come across his channel I dont stay for more than a few seconds. I just assumed he was some eighth generation Scot living in the hills somewhere around Montauk who never read nuthin but the bible and really knew nuttin bouth birthin babies. Now I hear that he went to Yale Law School and that he believes in a longer history of the Earth. He was saying he went to Yale and I thought he said Jail. So, went I spin the channels I will give him more time next time if there is one. Life is short.

  24. when pat robertson becomes the sane voice in the room you might want to ask the nice people in the white coats if they can increase your dosage.

  25. I used to watch the 700 Club just for the comedy. Nah, that’s just a punch line for trying to understand how others think, though I did feel like I was watching a parody. I read a lot of Communist literature and histories for the same reason. Try to explain a locker full of books on Communism, including “Lenin on Art and Literature” when you’re in the military in WEPS during the Cold War. I think it slowed my second security clearance down just a bit.

    The old main-line Protestant churches, as well some of the oldest post-Protestant, were losing members over their liberalization of Biblical interpretation. These post-Protestant fundamentalist groups suffer the same problem, not for liberalizing, but because their fundamentalism was creaking by so much science contradicting Genesis.

    Robertson is the gift that keeps on giving.

  26. How cool was that? Eddington with Hyades proved the old boy right and like a rounded earth, science shook. Still shakes.

    And a thousand years is as a day…

  27. This may double post, as variation, but in response to pete,

    All of us are to some degree irrational, or heaven forbid, “insane”, but have moments of lucidity. Give the man his moment. You likely won’t see it again.

  28. “Many hairy black holes for you for Christmas. Hang them on your tree if you can.” I tried that but the really small ones evaporated, the larger ones ate the tree. I’ll go with traditional ornaments.

  29. Malisha,

    “This is all self interest on Robertsons part the quote “If you fight science, you’re going to lose your children, and I believe in telling it the way it was.”

    Yep, a moment of lucidity. Self-interest is a great driving force for that.

  30. I live in the Appalachian mountains near the east coast’s largest xmas tree producing county. I had to work in the area for a while. I saw guys in what basically looked like space suits(heavy-duty chem suits) constantly spraying chem on the trees growing on hundreds of acres of steep hillsides. Its the only way to keep the trees looking the way people expect them to look.

    I used to fly fish in the streams and rivers that drained these same watersheds..

    I’ll never get another xmas tree, I don’t think. I just can’t support the destruction and abuse of what was once treasured land and water just to have a pretty tree in the house for a month.

    I also knew an organic farmer that had a small plot of unsprayed xmas trees(little firs or spruce; can’t remember) and the difference is striking. Still nice trees, but you get a house full of bugs along with the tree, plus things like lichens growing on the bark.

    Not trying to tell anyone how to feel about the xmas tree market, but like many things, consumers are separated from the impacts/production methods of the product.

  31. idealist707,
    “That is not what it is…Abe said that he DISLIKED those who could not grow. He did NOY (sic) say that he liked ALL who could grow.” I wouldn’t give this to Gene H., he has a real problem with the syllogism.

    You are right though, disliking those who do not grow does not imply liking all who grew, or all who could grow, or liking all the taller kids on your block who were shorter last year. Though I mix meanings of growth, words seldom having one meaning. Or even one good definition. (The 1979 movie “The Warriors” used the technique I’m using.)

  32. Blind Faithiness,

    No disagreement here. We’ve used artificial for two decades, would’ve used living but I don’t want a pine tree in my backyard. Inappropriate. Either way, my attempt at black hole ornaments was less than satisfactory.

  33. Sorry to disappoint Bible scoffers but the Bible doesn’t say the earth is exactly 6,000 years old. In fact, no significance is placed on the age of the earth. There are passages that talk about the earth being “void and without form”, which could have been that way for thousands of years. If you run across someone who says the earth is EXACTLY 6,000 years old, and not a second more, they aren’t able to use the Bible to back up such claim.

    We do find discrepancies in the alleged age of the earth today. Aside from the fact that the alleged age of the earth has increased exponentially over just a few decades, as scientists try their best to make a guess, there are discoveries that point to a relatively young earth as opposed to the usual x-billion year astronomical number that’s always bantered about with reckless abandon.

    It is foolish for anyone, scientists included, to put an age to the earth, when we know full well that ten years from now, it will be something different. That’s testimony enough that no one really knows. The astronomical figures that are usually regurgitated are necessary to give some sort of validity to evolutionism – it makes it easier, if you will, to explain all the diverse life forms if the earth is x-billion years old. It is a problem, however, when you try to explain the discoveries that point to a relatively young earth (thousands of years old instead of billions of years) and try to rectify such with evolutionism. No one in their right mind would think evolution happened in several hundred thousand years – simply not enough time.

    Science isn’t married to the astronomical figure of x-billion years or x-million years. Science simply means knowledge gained by observation. Science should – I repeat – SHOULD be open to the data that points to a relatively young earth (thousands of years) instead of millions or billions.

  34. Hi, Hubert C.,
    “Science simply means knowledge gained by observation. Science should – I repeat – SHOULD be open to the data that points to a relatively young earth (thousands of years) instead of millions or billions.” It should, and is, but the problem is that the data points elsewhere. If there were substantial data across disciplines that the Solar System were so young, we wouldn’t have 4.5 B for Earth. In fact if there were data in one discipline, geology for example, that the Earth were so young, the fight would be televised like MMA.

    Since I use Merriam-Webster I’ll use “3a : knowledge or a system of knowledge covering general truths or the operation of general laws especially as obtained and tested through scientific method
    b : such knowledge or such a system of knowledge concerned with the physical world and its phenomena : natural science. The earlier two were on states of knowledge and systematization. Your definition is too simple, but gives great latitude (I’ve dealt with yours for too many years.).

    “Science isn’t married to the astronomical figure of x-billion years or x-million years” by astronomical do you mean “large” or determined by astronomy? Of course science isn’t married to x-whatever and you’ve acknowledged that with “….the alleged age of the earth has increased exponentially over just a few decades…”, though a few decades is roughly 8 to 10, but that parallels the change in our ability to measure and the newer understandings of our Universe. Hubble in ’23 showed what was thought to be internal structures of the Milky Way were actually external (they’re called Galaxies) and from there with each decade we’ve pushed back the age of the Universe. Science isn’t married to any age of Universe or Solar System, it’s just the more they look they older it gets. I expect the Universe to go up by another B before I die, barring a Bus tomorrow.

    “It is foolish for anyone, scientists included, to put an age to the earth, when we know full well that ten years from now, it will be something different.” I agree if you mean nothing more than the tentative. As for something different, it likely will be older still, maybe not by much. The chance of a younger earth disappeared well over a hundred years ago with knowledge of radioactive decay.

    OT your comment, [which is just the usual veiled attempt to go after evolution] when I was a kid planets were considered rare, abnormal occurrences, but since ’95 roughly they’ve discovered they were wrong. Likely the opposite in fact, and therefore many more chances of planets supporting life.

    Hubert, we’ve done this before, many years ago. Your arguments haven’t changed, but your chance of being right has steadily declined. I have assiduously avoided being a fallacy nazi in all this.

  35. Ariel,

    The really small ones not only evaporate, they radiate like hell. And they are still very heavy. Nothing like one to create a problem holding up the tree.

    But you did not comment the hairy part. Surely you must.

  36. Ariel,

    I admire your capability to put names on these things that I recognize, but can’t name. They don’t teach them to engineers, and I had no time nor intersest to study them myself. Re syllogisms.

    ““That is not what it is…Abe said that he DISLIKED those who could not grow. He did NOY (sic) say that he liked ALL who could grow.” I wouldn’t give this to Gene H., he has a real problem with the syllogism.====

    U was thinking of quoting the “all of the people some of the time!, but it was too long I felt.

    As for Warrior script, never seen the like—but Monty Python was close at times aa was “Brasil”, also by a Pyton man (?) anw with Robert de NIro in cameo as the masked hero. Do you remember the first morning in the office and the fight over the “shared” desk.
    Well, I shared a desk with two guys upon arriving at Grummans hanger “office” working on the man on the moon project. Guess they thought that we would produce more if we were at meetings and not at our desks. I think I spent =.000001 percent of my time at meetings. I was not important enough to rate a donut and coffee. But I did great stuff that nobody else could, so they kept me. :-)

  37. So what is it that they spray on the xmas trees while they are still in the ground out there in NC? It kills bugs and of course runs off the tree and onto the ground and into the ground water and thence into the wells and thence into the drinking vasser? All for a greener tree in the living room that is bug free so that we can chum with the other pagans on the day that the xmas foks stole from us pagans on December 25th when the prophet Jesus was really born in July? And Pat Robertson says that the Athiests of all people Stole Christmas? And now he is siding with second grade science?
    My Dog the world is shrinking.

  38. Mespo,

    Do you think they’ll pull a Dante and go after the Pope or just say he’s not being Politically Correct?

    Not bad for a Hitler Youth….. Blasphemy under any other name…..

  39. First, you need to get your Christians straight, Mr. Turley. Not a good sign your article is credible. Evangelical Christians want to spread the word. There are probably as many evolutionists, or at least a good many in Evangelical churches as there are creationists. What you must have meant to refer to were FUNDAMENTALIST Christians, who believe in a word-for-word literal interpretation of the Bible, including the geologic age it purports. If you want to be taken seriously as a journalist, use serious journalistic methods and make sure you understand the dynamic before attempting to educate others.

  40. Hubert Cumberdale 1, December 1, 2012 at 2:07 am

    It is foolish for anyone, scientists included, to put an age to the earth, when we know full well that ten years from now, it will be something different.
    ===========================================
    Yeah, the Earth will be ten years older ten years from now.

    So will you, but it is not foolish to tell others how old you are.

    They will get it, and will know you are not talking about 10 years from now.

  41. William Hedrick 1, December 1, 2012 at 8:08 am

    First, you need to get your Christians straight, Mr. Turley. Not a good sign your article is credible. Evangelical Christians want to spread the word. There are probably as many evolutionists, or at least a good many in Evangelical churches as there are creationists. What you must have meant to refer to were FUNDAMENTALIST Christians, who believe in a word-for-word literal interpretation of the Bible, including the geologic age it purports. If you want to be taken seriously as a journalist, use serious journalistic methods and make sure you understand the dynamic before attempting to educate others.
    ==========================================
    Does that go for flat earthers too?

    Mission Statement

    The mission of the Flat Earth Society is to promote and initiate discussion of Flat Earth theory as well as archive Flat Earth literature. Our forums act as a venue to encourage free thinking and debate.

    (About the Flat Earth Society)

  42. I’m not sure about the exact chemical combination on the xmas trees, but probably a combination of insecticides and fungicides. Had to be harmful to humans/vertebrates too, otherwise the workers wouldn’t be in full suits with supplied air tanks(not just organic vapor masks). Also, these chems don’t just go into ground water. The slopes that trees are grown on are 30% grade and steeper with solid granite a few meters under the surface,, so runoff tends to go straight to the headwaters of minor then major waterways.

  43. BlindFaithiness,

    Just what I was worried about. I assumed that the whole of Carolina gets its water from the mountain runoff. So drinking out of the Neuse River at Raleigh, is not recommended. And we all know where “mountain spring water” comes from—the tap of course. Paying for a fraudulent product.

    Or was it the America government that we were talking about. Certain painful similarities.

    Don’t tell me that there is a controlled for contamination downstream.

    Remember the effluent from the coastal plain pig farms poisoning the Pamlico and Albemarle sounds?

    Good ol’ Carolina. Went Red this time too.

  44. “Science should – I repeat – SHOULD be open to the data that points to a relatively young earth (thousands of years) instead of millions or billions.”

    Hubert,

    Science IS always open to new data. I fear you are not. Yous are a person of
    Faith and Faith is not open to new data by its definition: http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/faith . If it works for you Hubert, live and be well. It’s when people of your faith try to impose it on education, women’s rights and other matters that I object. My “faith” is different then yours and I am as confident in mine as you are in yours. this is true for most people, but unfortunately in your writing you show a tendency to try to make your faith supreme. This connotes to me that you suffer from one or more of the “seven deadly sins” and that you know nothing of the “Golden Rule”.

  45. “What you must have meant to refer to were FUNDAMENTALIST Christians, who believe in a word-for-word literal interpretation of the Bible, including the geologic age it purports.”

    William Hedrick,

    The distinction you make is a good one, which I and many others here fully understand. The problem is this. Evangelical Christians have continually deferred to Fundamentalist Christians on our national stage. By your silence, broken only by a small few, Fundamentalist Christians have become the “voice” of Christianity in this country. Those of us who are not of either theological position, while cognizant of this, believe that the onus is on those of your faith to distinguish themselves from those who would mold Christianity into their radical model.

  46. Jon Huntsman Has A Job To Do
    By Charles P. Pierce
    11/30/12
    http://www.esquire.com/blogs/politics/jon-huntsman-and-republican-party-113012

    I have to admit, I came to like Jon Huntsman a little bit during his brief stint as a Republican presidential candidate. He was an Out Now guy in regards to Afghanistan, which appealed to me. And he had the undeniable asset of Not Being Insane, which was enough to allow him to maintain his viability almost all the way to Easter.

    But now, well, he’s behaving in a fashion that calls to mind the question that my old Irish grandmother used to direct at people she thought were behaving above their station.

    I think the deliberation about the Republican Party that we’re having is a very healthy thing,” Huntsman told CNN. “And if we don’t wind up at the end of the exercise with a mission statement that is one sentence long, then we’re toast. That one statement ought to be, ‘Balance the budgets and get out of people’s lives.’ And you ought to build the party around that because we have strong libertarian roots that go way back to the early days of the Republican Party…

    Huntsman went on to warn that the party was occasionally consumed by such “fringe issues, and it gets us stuck in the alleyways of life that take our focus away from what is really important for the American people, and that is individual freedom and that is getting the budgets balanced so people can get on with their lives.”

    He also modestly refused to comment about the (admittedly unlikely) possibility that he would be appointed Secretary Of State, although he did imply that he’d serve if asked.

    Will of god, my grandmother would say, and who’s your man when he’s at home?

    Can you see the problem here? Of course, you can. Huntsman is another Green Room Republican, beloved of the courtier press with its deficit-fetishism and its maudlin shawlie’s worship of “bipartisanship.” (Listening to Huntsman’s fans among the elite media is like listening to Ron Paul’s more fervid followers, except less fun.) He has less influence within the Republican party as it is presently constituted than I do. And he is not likely to develop any as the party goes through with the largely cosmetic “introspection” that at the end will result with people like Eric Cantor still considered to be leaders and people like Paul Ryan still considered to be philosophers. More Republicans take Sean Hannity seriously than take Jon Huntsman seriously, and the competition there isn’t even close. Asking him what the Republicans should do so the country would start looking at them less as the vehicle for ungovernable white rage is like asking a dead deer by the side of the highway for a traffic report. If Huntsman really wants to help the country, he can get the hell off TV, go back into the party, and straighten it out from within. I keep hearing about these sensible Republicans. They must be looking for a leader by now.

  47. “So, I asked this god a question and by way of firm reply, he said, ‘I’m not the kind you have to wind up on Sundays.'” J Tull

  48. As for Huntsman, as any CIA careerist will tell you, going overseas is to commit career suicide.
    Why? Simply because you don’t count, you are not in the loop, and it is difficult making deals and kissing up from there.

    Having left the stream, you can never bathe in the same one again. If you are stupid besides that, well…..!

  49. Further on MikeS: He first puts a chair behind you so that when you fall, as you will if your brain is working (big IF), then you will sit down comfortably. And not being hurt emotinally, you will listen to the rest of the lesson, drinking in the enlightenment without rancor in your heart.

    Is this then sweet reasoning?

  50. clergy say I have given nothing.
    some say give.
    others say they don’t see anything.
    those that have seen say nothing to anyone for fear of being called insane should they try to explain.
    Genesis _ _ _ _ in the beginning let there be light.
    to stand in the true light of GOD, is to be light.
    rocks are compressed light.
    the universe is full of rock
    light is the universe.
    hell is the distance from GOD. so GOD is the universe. because the universe is finite in size and growing not expanding. thus creating new stars, and the imagination of kids.
    laser is compressed light.
    light travels thru the earth.
    where is the dead deer on the side of the road? deer season is over and I did not get one.
    children must be taught to be creative so i gave away things like how to create their own universe and multi-universes on history channel.
    I worte several comedians shows including sinbads show on children on adhd, incorporated with men, and toilets and how to fix a marriage in three seconds.
    laughter is the best medicine, but there was the nuclear war over four years ago. you should be dead so the antichrists can not say they were not given a second chance, knowing that they had to hang them selves they are now lying about THE BIBLE IN MANY WAYS.
    WHERE IS THE LOVE…?
    children must be taught the basics. what I did not give away is being stolen. the parents will be the culprits because they are told that JESUS is not here. yet the antichrist has been walking for a thousand years.
    ONE man is predicted to take on the world and HE is here now.
    the presidents will deny this because they follow the flock to get votes.
    good clip on the creation elain it made sense. laughed MY ass off.
    I wrote many of the commericials that you watch on tv and gave them away. some include flo, and the sign that, every one is a comedian, and the viking garth saying to joan of arc, what is it like to work with noah? as well as many other commercials. some targeted at children as well as adults. does the dodge really move heaven and earth? ram tough!
    the antichrist criticize because I am only responding to the jts religion only. so I leave no comment.
    if you want to tell a politician some thing you set down with another person and talk about something while a politician is eating by themslf they have their mouth closed and will steal your idea and claim it for them selves. it will get built like the lite rail did in phoenix. and then I had a sun dial put in at the flee market.
    but politicians can’t change certain things so just don’t tell them when they have proven that they are trying to rule the world.
    abortion will be legal every where in the world is a law written about by GOD as is written. that I will set things right. the antichrist will be destroyed from all religions.

  51. I suppose the only thing about Pat Robertson that is surprising to me is why (editorial) we think he remains relevant in the least or why (editorial) we devote coverage to him or even discuss his ideas?

  52. Kraaken,

    While praying to graven images is forbidden, we instead let those who speak in the name of the holy muffin do our thinking. Such a one is Robertson.

    We opponents attempt to gather the storms of nature to destroy him and thus free his followers from his power.

    Now, addicted like tobacco smokers and meth users, they need another replacement for the holy muffin, or another speaker in his name. So freedom is not achieved through Robertson’s fall.

    Some will even follow those who speak other tongues and call themselves “businessmen”; although they are only con men who save like Jesus in a Cayman bank.

    And in the name of righteousness, we will destroy the lives of non-whites as proof of our white power, which Dog gave us as proof of our purity and reward for following him. He even gave us a White House for our proper leader.

    That Dog-given power even extends to making money as a reward on our investments in the domination of other nations, as they, demonstrably since not being part of us, must also be impure, even though they guise themselves like us.

    Anathema upon all these peoples, we are Dog’s only exceptional people.

    And oddly there are more than just those who cross themselves, who believe likewise.

    Any questions?

  53. “If Jesus saves, well, he’d better save himself from the gory glory seekers who’ll use his name in death.” Hymn 43

  54. Pats real problem, from an anon commenter at Andrew Sullivan:

    “I totally agree with what your Millennial reader wrote, and I want to add a few points. First, we have grown up in the most diverse America in history. My closest friends don’t look like me, don’t go to the same church, and some don’t even speak English as their first language. We have more contact with immigrants, gays, the disabled, and multicultural families than any generation before us. So when a party tries to bemoan the loss of the “white establishment,” even my white male friends – the supposed members of this establishment – are shocked and alienated. You can’t try to win a demographic and think they won’t notice that you are leaving behind their girlfriends, boyfriends, classmates and coworkers.

    We are also the most educated generation yet. And while you can try to write off academia as a liberal indoctrination, what is really happening is that the anti-science, anti-evidence, anti-fact machine of the GOP can’t stand up to people who know how to ask the right questions and have the Internet to find the answers. We are not going to take kindly to a party that would pass Medicare and start two wars without paying for any of it, blame the deficit on the next president, and then try to bill itself as the fiscally responsible party. The facts are out there, whether it’s about climate change, birth control, or what you voted for on the House floor last year.

    The Internet only strengthens both of those traits in our generation. “

  55. Shano,
    “We are also the most educated generation yet.” Yeah that’s been said every generation. Shibboleth, bromide, or just trite. You can be well-educated but still a fool.

    What I haven’t heard or read is the most wise. Or ethical, given the last few surveys on cheating to get ahead. The latter did improve with the last survey though.

  56. Idealist707,
    “I admire your capability to put names on these things that I recognize, but can’t name. They don’t teach them to engineers, and I had no time nor intersest to study them myself. Re syllogisms.”

    Thanks for the kind words. My degree though is BSChE. I went through special classes in JHS and early HS, when they picked out the 30 to 40 kids with the highest IQs and gave us special classes. My semantics class employed fallacies as a teaching tool. As well recognizing word choice by denotation and connotation, and thus the writer’s bent on directing the reader emotionally.

    After that, it’s what you read on your own.

  57. >> “If you fight science, you’re going to lose your children, and I
    >> believe in telling it the way it was.”

    Yeah, right. More likely, Pat Robberbaron (the blood diamond profiteer) is admitting this is a battle he can’t win. He realized that if he keeps fighting it, HE looks like the dinosaur.

    It’s far easier to maintain a lie and control people if there is some ruth in your lie. A lie that is easily exposed by curious children isn’t going to last long.

  58. shano,

    “ah yes, Ariel, you have the corporate institutional administrative lingo down perfectly.”

    Was that from “We are also the most educated generation yet.” Yeah that’s been said every generation. Shibboleth, bromide, or just trite. You can be well-educated but still a fool.”? If so..

    How that has anything to do with my response I don’t know. Should I consider it a leap of faith? With all that means?

    Or just really dumb? One atheist to another you’re better off with the first sentence this paragraph.

    If it wasn’t, remember there’s no sub-threading, so what the hell were you actually referring to other than some self-referential fantasy?

    Now that I’ve done my loose Ad Hominems, you do realize, going all Gene H. on your ass, that “ah yes, Ariel, you have the corporate institutional administrative lingo down perfectly” was nothing better but exactly the same?

    OT on this, but certainly on you, Atheism means nothing other than “no gods”. It doesn’t bestow rationality, logic, ethics, morality, truth or anything else. It only means “no gods”. What you do with it after is solely what you do.
    Some do it poorly…

    After listening to a seminar by O’Hare at ASU I knew I would never join American Atheists, or likely any atheist group. I could get the same “how” of thinking at a Kingdom Hall. The “what” was different but the “how” not .

  59. The “braggadocio” is just a word with emotional freight that you choose for your purpose. I’m not a braggart, you can’t be self-deprecating, or depreciating, and a braggart no matter how you twist the words. Nor am I disposed to doing “empty boasting'” ; nor “arrogant pretension” except as a response, to which I have to ask why not?

    I try, in my wording, to give a lot of “outs” for others. That they choose not to or can’t recognize the opportunity isn’t my fault. Compromise is a buy-in that too many on comments won’t do if only for showing weakness in some way.

  60. There’s an inane photo shop philosophy production company working . Anyone can use silly historical reconstructions to sell a program. Melodrama by the minute by the attention seekers is just a childish need to diminish the quality of every day life . Pat Robertson is finally doing the right thing by his 700 Club religious TV followers, even though there will be a lot of smelling salts passed around by the superstitous
    To Jill :
    Who can’t make pseudo analytical games by playing with numbers. “Are you a girl or are you just a meanie ?” How many silly syllables did you get from that phrase ? You can put your arm down now , Jill. ) There are more important issues in life than indulging in what are most likely dishonest retrogressive obsessions .

  61. We simply do not know how old the earth and the cosmos of which it is a part is. We have no way to date anything that is not dated according to a dating system (calendar) we understand.

  62. Mac,
    Whose calendar. Julian? Mayan. One on this list?
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_calendars

    How about clocks. Atomic clock? There are lots of ways to date things that do not depend on ordinary calendars. Such as these:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radiometric_dating

    Then for cosmic ages, there is redshift dating.
    http://imagine.gsfc.nasa.gov/docs/features/exhibit/map_age.html

    Our own Milky Way galaxy is a little more than 100,000 light years across, meaning that it takes light one hundred thousand years to make it across from one side to the other. The Milky Way galaxy contains somewhere between 200 and 400 billion stars.

    This video takes us to the oldest and most distant known object in the universe. Each of the bright dots are not stars. They are galaxies much like our own. Some smaller and some larger,with different shapes, but galaxies of stars nevertheless. Galaxy MACS0647-JD is 13.7 billion years old. It is seen by the telescopes as it was 420 million years after the Big Bang. As seen here it is still a very young galaxy, made up of huge masses of dust and glowing gas, which is why it looks fuzzy–that and the distance.

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