We recently discussed the bizarre report that the Saudi Arabian government was going to sue a Twitter user for a tweet where he compared the death sentence given poet Ashraf Fayadh to ISIS executions. It appears that decapitations of non-believers ordered under Sharia are materially different from decapitations of nonbelievers ordered by ISIS under Sharia law. Now, as if struggling to bring home the absurd distinction, another Saudi Sharia court has sentenced a Saudi Arabian woman to death by stoning for adultery. The man? He gets 100 lashes.
The 45-year-old married woman who is a maid in Riyadh reportedly confessed. Saudi Arabia routinely denies due process to accused persons, including access to lawyers, and has long been condemned for the use of torture. The Saudi courts still apply the medieval Sharia law and denies basic freedoms to women, religious minorities, dissidents, artists, and journalists.
Presumably, a Saudi stoning for adultery is also materially different from an ISIS stoning for adultery.
Just to refresh your memory, Saudi Arabia is the chair of the Human Rights Council . . . and of course our key ally in the war against Islamic extremism.
India Against Rss (@IndiaAgainstRss)
You should see how many cows are efficiently run through the processing plants to make hamburgers, steaks and meat pies.
I don’t think the guilt thing is going to work on Brits or Americans…you never know about women though…I guess it depends on the period they’re in.
I forgot to remind you that I have also frequently remarked about moderate, modern Muslims living peacefully alongside everyone else here in the US, as well as the Muslim friends I have known. I’ve learned a smattering of Farsi and Arabic, in fact.
Your persistence in claiming that I’m persecuting Islam is absurd. I oppose radical extremist Islam that engages in violence. I have zero problem with people worshiping as they please, obeying our laws, and enjoying the modern West.
Most religions go through a reformation phase. Catholicism has had several major upheavals. There were reformations when the Church was wealthy and corrupt, granting Indulgences. And there has been a sweeping backlash against the pedophilia scandal. Mormons reformed when they abandoned polygamy, which was formerly a pillar of their faith. Now it’s only the Fundamentalist splinter groups that still engage in it.
Islam is no different. I consider those who live a modern lifestyle to be reformers. And obviously I feel that the more extremist forms of Islam that are practiced, where gays and rape victims are killed in the name of “honor”, and antisemitism is rampant, need to be reformed.
Karen,
I mean, if you say I made those vile comments, then obviously you are right, I must have but just forgot.
I am afraid however that the people reading us might assume you to be a dishonest, lying and hypocritical person, because as they read that exchange, they all can tell that those comments were from the rabbi I quoted… considering the whole quotes thing and how there is a link and everything.
it would bug me greatly if they were to think even lesser of you based on this misunderstanding, so please, provide a definitive proof that I actually made those comments.
As I said above, you do not need apologize for being unable to back up your accusation, it happened to a great many better people than you. I forgave you already 🙂
According to your previous statements, you support the rights of middle eastern women, but not when they are massacred by israel. That is an odd contradiction there, but, hey, all of us have our oddities.
I know Paul is wondering, please enlighten him about your views on extremism.
I’ll even quote an earlier conversation we started but never got to finish, the one where I responded very clearly to your question but am still unsure where you stand about this so important topic, despite attempting to track you down across blogs and threads.
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karen said to Po:
Do you consider crashing a van deliberately into a civilian bus stop, hitting people, and then jumping out with a knife to stab a woman with a baby a terrorist attack? Yes or now. And this time answer the question.
Po answered:
yes, I do!
Do YOU consider the bombing of hospitals, of schools, of ambulances, the dropping of a missile on 4 kids playing on the beach, the lighting of a sleeping family on fire a terrorist act? Yes or no? And this time answer the question!
No, Po. You wrote that. Nov 18. 10:20 PM. The Rabbi link above.
You see, the internet is forever. And you can say you support Israel’s right to exist all you want. You’ve also adamantly opposed Zionism, which is a movement that supports a Jewish Homeland. You can’t have it both ways.
That entire rant against Israel was disturbing. I think Jews have the right to Israel just as much as Muslims have the right to Mecca and Medina. Which, by the way, they drove Jews out of.
I’ve opposed extremism of any creed. So, again, you can lie all you want and claim I only oppose Muslim extremism, but you would be demonstrably wrong. I’ve included Yearning for Zion as a form of Mormon extremism. I opposed the Rabbi’s remarks in the very blog to which I linked. I’ve opposed extremism Jews murdering that Palestinian boy in retaliation for Palestinian extremists murdering those Jewish teenagers.
So if you continue to lie, the written record undermines you.
HAHAHAHAHHAAHAHAHAHHA…COUGH COUGH..HAHAHAHAHAHA…HAHA…HA
karen, seems like you forgot to link the quotes where i supposedly made “”disturbing Nazi/death to Israel rant you contributed to on another thread…””
The quote you offered was contributed by Patriot, unless you are saying that he and I made the same statements or wrote that statement together? I don’t remember ever meeting patriot???!!! Then again, we are getting old, friend, and sometimes have a hard time remembering things truthfully.
I am a little confused. I believe you to be intellectually honest and therefore if you make a statement accusing me of something, that you would prove it, or at least apologize.
Considering you were unable to prove your accusations, I am assuming you are about to apologize. no need, old chap, I’ll be charitable and accept your apologies BEFORE you make them.
As I said before, I support Israel’s right to exist, unequivocally…and as for judaism, how could i hate it when Islam comes from Abraham and Moses and Jesus, and the quran urges us to follow their example?
Right?
My in laws would get really upset at you for calling me an anti-semite, you are lucky this came after thanksgiving, otherwise I would tell on you and you’ll get a call from them, am sure.
Nah, just kidding, I would never get you in trouble, old friend 🙂
Now, those statements you said I made in that thread blaming Jews for the genocide? Those were made by a Jewish rabbi, not me. I guess he is antisemitic too! Those damned antisemitic rabbis!!
Any logical/honest person would certainly see, following the timeline, that the link was offered as an answer to bambam’s refusal to acknowledge that Zionism committed terrorism. ( I am not blaming you, not everyone is born logical/honest, it is a gift some have and some don’t. We certainly cannot blame those of us who are not gifted with it?! That would be mean!)
Just as you, old friend Karen, are refusing to answer my question about Israeli terrorism.
Perhaps you overlooked it, here it is again, please answer so we can move on. You refusal to address it seems to suggest that you stand by your lifelong support of the massacre of thooooooooooooooooousands of women and children, as long as they are palestinians. I know that ain’t so, but I would be horrified if some of our friends here think it true.
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karen said :
Do you consider crashing a van deliberately into a civilian bus stop, hitting people, and then jumping out with a knife to stab a woman with a baby a terrorist attack? Yes or now. And this time answer the question.
Po answered:
yes, I do!
Do YOU consider the bombing of hospitals, of schools, of ambulances, the dropping of a missile on 4 kids playing on the beach, the lighting of a sleeping family on fire a terrorist act? Yes or no? And this time answer the question!
Oh, isn’t the Internet wonderful? Everything is in print, and look, Po even capitalized it into shouting so we couldn’t mistake how he felt about the Jews and Nazis.
For anyone who forgot, here is what must be 265 pages of “Po hates Israel 24/7” http://jonathanturley.org/2015/11/23/israeli-police-officer-who-brutally-beat-american-teenager-is-given-just-45-days-community-service/
And here is that thread that circled the drain when Patriot and Po hate Israel 24/7, when Po said, “IT IS COMMON KNOWLEDGE THAT ALL THE SAGES AND SAINTS IN EUROPE AT THE TIME OF HITLER’S RISE DECLARED THAT HE WAS A MESSENGER OF DIVINE WRATH, SENT TO CHASTEN THE JEWS BECAUSE OF THE BITTER APOSTASY OF ZIONISM AGAINST THE BELIEF IN THE EVENTUAL MESSIANIC REDEMPTION.”
http://jonathanturley.org/2015/11/17/chief-rabbi-declares-paris-attacks-as-divine-punishment-for-the-treatment-of-jews/
And then he wrote:
“Read “The Millions That Could Have Been Saved” by I.DombIt is an historical fact that in 1941 and again in 1942, the German Gestapo offered all European Jews transit to Spain, if they would relinquish all their property in Germany and Occupied France; on condition that: a) none of the deportees travel from Spain to Palestine; and b) all the deportees be transported from Spain to the USA or British colonies, and there to remain; with entry visas to be arranged by the Jews living there; and c) $1000.00 ransom for each family to be furnished by the Agency, payable upon the arrival of the family at the Spanish border at the rate of 1000 families daily.
The Zionist leaders in Switzerland and Turkey received this offer with the clear understanding that the exclusion of Palestine as a destination for the deportees was based on an agreement between the Gestapo and the Mufti.
The answer of the Zionist leaders was negative, with the following comments: a) ONLY Palestine would be considered as a destination for the deportees. b) The European Jews must accede to suffering and death greater in measure than the other nations, in order that the victorious allies agree to a “Jewish State” at the end of the war. c) No ransom will be paid This response to the Gestapo’s offer was made with the full knowledge that the alternative to this offer was the gas chamber.”
“These treacherous Zionist leaders betrayed their own flesh and blood. Zionism was never an option for Jewish salvation. Quite the opposite, it was a formula for human beings to be used as pawns for the power trip of several desperadoes. A perfidy! A betrayal beyond description!”
Blaming the Jews for their own genocide. Claiming their leaders were hand in hand with the Nazis to bring about as many casualties as possible. When we knew that many host countries turned away Jewish refugees, exposing the lie that Jews proclaimed they would rather go to the gas chamber than accept any other destination than future Israel. You also think the Jews were behind 9/11, so we shouldn’t be surprised.
If Jews anywhere get murdered, it must be their own fault, according to your logic.
Karen says:
If Jews anywhere get murdered, it must be their own fault, according to your logic.
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And yet when Palestinians get massacred, it is their fault?!
if that statement above I strongly condemn of ALL extremism ( religious or secular, Christian, Jewish and Muslim, wherever it is to be found, whether Assad, the US, Israel, hamas, isis, right wing Christianity that targets planned parenthood or Saudi Arabia) is too broad for you, you can still address my previous one found below:
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By the way, karen, I think you forgot to follow up on your question to me earlier. I answered your question but I could not find where you answered mine. You must have overlooked it, so here it is again:
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Karen said :
Do you consider crashing a van deliberately into a civilian bus stop, hitting people, and then jumping out with a knife to stab a woman with a baby a terrorist attack? Yes or now. And this time answer the question.
Po answered:
yes, I do!
Do YOU consider the bombing of hospitals, of schools, of ambulances, the dropping of a missile on 4 kids playing on the beach, the lighting of a sleeping family on fire a terrorist act? Yes or no? And this time answer the question!
What is strange about the Planned Parenthood attack is that neighbors have been interviewed saying that religion and abortion were the only two things this maniac didn’t ramble about. He sounded mentally disturbed.
I don’t know yet if it was domestic terrorism, because I don’t know if he was trying to stop abortion, or just a lunatic with illegal firearms. Did he see something on the news about PP selling body parts, and chose it as an impromptu target? We’re still trying to figure out a motive.
He was registered to vote as unaffiliated, as a woman, but I don’t know if he was just insane when he filled it out.
http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2015/11/court-records-colorado-planned-parenthood-shooter-not-republican-identifies-as-woman/
Po:
After that disturbing Nazi/death to Israel rant you contributed to on another thread, there is no “safe comment” for you. In fact, that entire thread was extremist and off-putting.
I have condemned wrongdoing regardless of the race, creed, or political affiliation of the wrongdoer, as anyone can read.
Israel has been the spiritual homeland of the Jews for thousands of years. The Muslim expansion conquered it, but they finally got it back. Just as I would expect Muslims to regain Mecca if, God forbid, it was ever wrested from them. In fact, I would expect Muslims to literally go insane if it was lost to them. And it wouldn’t matter if workers arrived to take advantage of the jobs, and then decide they didn’t want Muslims to run Mecca after all. And I sincerely doubt that Muslims would educate and employ people who openly called for Mecca’s destruction. Seriously.
The Palestinians already have a homeland. It’s called Jordan. It’s much larger than Israel. If you don’t like it, take it up with the fall of the Ottoman Empire. Muslims have Mecca and Medina. The Jews have Israel. Let it go and live in peace.
Karen, obviously you must have mistaken me for someone else… I have NEVER made a nazi/death to israel comment, EVER!
I can understand your mistake however, as I get old too I sometimes misremember things.
No need to apologize, we are among friends after all 🙂
I have stated very clearly that Israel DOES have the right to exist, what it does not have however, is the right to oppress the Palestinians. Most of humanity understands those two are not one and the same, but there are still those outside of it who struggle to understand that…No worries, perfectly understandable.
Perhaps I forgot, would you please provide me with the quote? if you do, i swear I’ll make dinner for you, or we can go to any expensive place you’d like.
I’ll even take it one step further, I believe that Israel has more of a right to exist than Saudi Arabia does! What do you make of that?
Meanwhile, we all would greatly appreciate your, you know, letting us know where you stand in terms of my strong condemnation of ALL extremism ( religious or secular, Christian, Jewish and Muslim, wherever it is to be found, whether Assad, the US, Israel, hamas, isis, right wing Christianity that targets planned parenthood or Saudi Arabia).
Your refusal to condemn all extremism seems to suggest you are partial to some extremism, which would make some of our friends here see you in a light much different from the one you and I see you.
I know you care for all women and children, whether Jewish, christian, Muslim or atheists, and you certainly would condemn any government that murders them, imprisons them without cause and legal standing, tortures them…won’t you? please?