-Submitted by David Drumm (Nal), Guest Blogger
To get the ball rolling, here’s Paul Krugman: “For the deal itself, given the available information, is a disaster, and not just for President Obama and his party.”
House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi (D-California): “maybe none of us will be able to support it.”
Comment moderation is off, so have at it.
@culheath,
Before I forget, why do you think I like Bush. His brand of compassionate convervativism is just big government progressivism in disguise. he was a big spending fool, just not as follish as Obama. His tax cuts merely got revenues back down to historic levels where they belong. Do you understand what bracket creep is?
kderosa,
You must have rcampbell confused with HenMan … I idolize HenMan
kderosa,
uh huh
SwM,
From the TPM link you posted: ” beleaguered Boehner”.
I told you that guy was a complete and total fool … he’s a front room guy … a meeter and greeter … the guy who drives clients to the red light district … the republicans, being such sticklers for their seniority system, have given him one of the most powerful positions in D.C.
@Blousie
“rcampbell has kept his cool and can thus judge the situation with rational thought and make predictions based on same. He has been proven right in many instances because of this approach and because his knowledge base is sound.”
That’s what’s called an appeal to authority — a logical fallacy.
Politicians last night announced the framework of a deal to increase the debt limit. In addition to authorizing about $900 billion more red ink right away, it would require immediate budget cuts of more than $900 billion, though “immediate” means over 10 years and “budget cuts” means spending still goes up (but not as fast as previously planned).
But that’s the relatively uncontroversial part. The fighting we’re seeing today revolves around a “super-committee” that’s been created to find $1.5 trillion of additional “deficit reduction” over the next 10 years (based on Washington math, of course).
And much of the squabbling is about whether the super-committee is a vehicle for higher taxes. As with all kiss-your-sister budget deals, both sides can point to something they like.
Here’s what Republicans like:
Here’s what Democrats like:
…
But you don’t have to believe me. Just read the fact sheet distributed by the White House, which is filled with class warfare rhetoric about “shared sacrifice.”
(Source)
http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2011/08/grover-norquist-backs-the-new-debt-deal.php?ref=fpb
rcampbell has kept his cool and can thus judge the situation with rational thought and make predictions based on same. He has been proven right in many instances because of this approach and because his knowledge base is sound.
These are the only times that I find the troll traffic useful as thoughtful posters, in their answers to troll ignorance and emotionalism, educate all of us and provide us with rational springboards for further discussion.
@culheath
Since 1940: Truman, Eisenhower, Johnson
Also, with respect to Clinton’s surplus: it didn’t happen until the Republican’s took control of COngress and Clinton triangulated to the center to win the ’96 election.
“Now name a single economic benefit that GW Bush’s terms produced.”
How is that relevant? Also, define economic benefit.
CBS NEWS
Oh,
and I’m not sure how many jobs were saved or created with the $10 million from the stimulus package to fund Operation Gunrunner but it eliminated at least two with the murder of two agents.
Oh wait two agents needed to be hired to fill their position so I guess that qualifies for saved or created.
Senators Kerry and Luger were told that ‘Gunwalking’ was part of Operation Fast and Furious in March 2009
Furthermore in the testimony on page 11, operation Gunrunner is mentioned specifically and on page 12 it mentions the fact the $15 million in funding was recently allocated to the congress. This is not part of the additional $10 million that was allocated in the Stimulus package[p16] to a program directed specifically for Operation Gunrunner.
http://yourdaddy.net/2011/07/26/senators-kerry-and-luger-were-told-that-gunwalking-was-part-of-operation-fast-and-furious-in-march-2009/
kdresoa,
Skip the Clinton part and answer the question, which you didn’t.
Name a president that left the country with r a deficit lower than when he entered office?
And you completely skipped:
Now name a single economic benefit that GW Bush’s terms produced.
@rcampbell,
I know the facts hurt whn they are against you, but ignoring them means you’ll never learn and just keep repeating the same nonsense you ‘ve been spouting over and over and merely looking foolish in theh process. The choice, as always, is yours.
@culheath
“Name a president other than Clinton that left the country with a surplus or a deficit lower than when he entered office? ”
Culheath, name a president other than Clinton that got the benefit of an unprecedented, irrational, tulip-craze-like tech boom.
Also, as I just indicated above, spending under Clinton was at about 18% of GDP in 2000 and at no time greater than 19%. While tax receipts were temporarily at boom induced 20.6% and tanked as soon as the boom was over and before Bush’s tax cuts took effect.
Here’s the way I see it getting played out over the longer term. Obama wins.
This deal could have been gotten two weeks ago. The teabagger GOP got nothing from the deal except a reputation for needless brinksmanship that may still downgrade America’s credit rating. They will bear sole responsibility for that. In the end, all they did was delay the inevitable tax increases that will, because they must, come as part of any substative budget deal. And now, they can’t hold the country’s future hostage. So they wll be forced to toss Griover Norquist to the curb before the 2012 election.
Democrats appear to the ones willing to do the heavy lifting while the GOP will be saddled with their blatant protection of the wealthy and expectation that only the middle class needs to particpate in reducing the debt. That train has left the station and the Dems will hammer it until 11/12.
The President will appear to have represented the middle ground (even though he’s Bob Dole with a deep tan) and the voice of reason. No Republican will be able to stand against him without spewing the teabagger anti-tax nonsense and appearing too far to the right for the independent voters in the center. Obama wins.
kderosa
Your continued efforts to revise history have been ignored.
@rcampbell
Here’s a pretty chart for you to contemplate. It clearly shows that spending is the problem under Bush and Obama, especially under Obama.
Spending under Obama (as % of GDP): 23.2%
Spending under Bush (as % of GDP): 20.5%
Revenue under Obama (as % of GDP): 17.0%
Revenus under Bush (as % of GDP): 17.3%
Do you want to go back to the Clintonian levels of Tax:
rcampbell
At least get your facts straight. The $800+ billion stimulus package was supposed to be to for job creation through public works, but the GOP wouldn’t allow a vote on a package that brought jobs. They demanded more tax breaks businesses perperating the lie that tax breaks create jobs. They didn’t. The package also included money for states to prevent police, fire and education cuts that would have raised the unemployment rate even hire–the GOP goal.
********************************************************************************************
At least you got the “suppose to be for” right
New Mexico Watchdog broke what became a national news story, and fodder for Jon Stewart and Steve Colbert. The website launched by the Obama Administration to track the destinations of billions of dollars of stimulus funds under the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act showed billions going to nonexistent Congressional districts. The website, recovery.gov, reported $26.5 million going to ten New Mexico Congressional districts that do not exist. Those millions were credited with creating 61.5 jobs. Spadework by our Watchdog counterparts in other states showed a total of $6.4 billion reported as being allocated to 440 nonexistent, or “phantom,” Congressional districts.
http://watchdog.org/2255/stimulus-funds-phantom-zip-codes/
Morning Bell: The Fake Jobs of Obama’s Failed Stimulus
Forget everything bad you’ve ever heard about President Barack Obama’s $787 billion economic stimulus. Combing through the data on the $18 million Recovery.gov website, you’ll find tons of Obama stimulus success stories from across the country. In Minnesota’s 57th Congressional District, 35 jobs have been saved or created using $404,340 in stimulus funds. In New Mexico’s 22nd Congressional District, 25 jobs have been saved or created using $61,000 in stimulus cash. And in Arizona’s fighting 15th Congressional District, 30 jobs have been saved or created with just $761,420 in federal stimulus spending.
The it-would-be-funny-if-it-weren’t-our-tax-dollars-at-stake punch line here is that none of the above Congressional Districts actually exist. Yet those jobs “created or saved” claims still sit on the Obama administration’s official “transparency and accountability” website Recovery.gov. As the Washington Examiner’s David Freddoso points out, it would have been nearly costless for the Recovery.gov site designers to limit the input fields so that non-existent Congressional Districts never made it into the public domain, but for whatever reason the Obama administration chose otherwise. Defending the fake data on his website, Recovery.gov Communications Director Ed Pound told ABC News: “We report what the recipients submit to us. Some recipients clearly don’t know what congressional district they live in, so they appear to be just throwing in any number. We expected all along that recipients would make mistakes on their congressional districts, on job numbers, on award amounts, and so on. Human beings make mistakes.”
Pound is dead wrong. The problem with Recovery.gov is not human reporting error, but an error of human design. Highly trained professional economists don’t agree on how to tell when a job has been “saved or created,” yet the Obama administration expects a Kentucky shoe-store owner to accurately create such data? “Just throwing in any number.” That just about sums up the accuracy of Recovery.gov. And the usually compliant mainstream press is beginning to notice.
http://blog.heritage.org/2009/11/17/morning-bell-the-fake-jobs-of-obamas-failed-stimulus/
I see that Grover Norquist is on board with Boehner and likes the “deal.” That, to me, is the biggest warning flag of all. Grab your wallet and run, cause economic predators are about to be loosed on the nation.
Well, it was a good run while it lasted. I don’t know what this country will look like when we come out on the other side, but I have a feeling I will not like it.
http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2011/08/grover-norquist-backs-the-new-debt-deal.php?ref=fpblg
yes, what AY said.
Unless Republicans nominate a Tea Party candidate, Pres. Obama has just kissed his re-election goodbye.