The evidence continues to roll in on the Zimmerman case. While the new evidence is not entirely bad for the prosecution, it does contain some evidence that will likely bolster the defense of George Zimmerman in the second degree murder trial over the killing of Trayvon Martin. Regardless of the ultimate impact, the evidence again shows (in my opinion) that prosecutor Angela Corey over-charged the case in Florida.
Some of the new evidence shows that Martin had traces of THC (the active ingredient of marijuana) in his blood stream and urine. Martin was suspended from school due to a marijuana offense (though it involved an empty marijuana baggie). Another benefit to the defense is that Martin father is shown denying that the voice calling out for help was his son — though he later changed that view when he says he was given a better recording. Other witnesses have indicated that it Zimmerman who was calling for help.
Generally, the existence of drugs in the system of a victim or defendant is admissible. The suspension would appear inadmissible under standard evidentiary rules.
There is also evidence that some neighbors described Zimmerman as a bully and a racist. That would help bolster the reported hate crimes prosecution being considered by the Obama Administration, though I still have reservations based on the evidence as it currently stands. Also the police viewed the shooting as “avoidable” — if Zimmerman had left the matter to the police.
I am not sure how much of the neighbor’s view of Zimmerman as a bully or racist could come into evidence. Such accounts, however, can have the benefit of further discouraging Zimmerman from taking the stand as a witness — always a benefit to the prosecution because (while they are told that a defendant has a right not to testify (jurors expect to hear from defendants).
On the whole, however, I would view the evidence as more positive to the defense. First, I have previously said that I was most interested in the distance of the shot and forensics. It now appears that Martin was shot from an intermediate range (no more than 18 inches and as little as an inch away). That would support the claim of Zimmerman that they were in a wrestling fight when the gun was fired. The greater the distance the stronger the case for the prosecution. The defense will likely present expert testimony to try to reduce the range further on the stand. Also, the report does have people at the scene saying that Zimmerman’s nose appeared broken — supporting the later medical report of the family doctor (though such injuries could occur from Martin defending himself).
Moreover, at least two witnesses appear to support Zimmerman in describing the man in the hoodie at straddling the other man and throwing punches. The report state that the man in the “‘hoodie’ [was] on top of a white or Hispanic male and throwing punches ‘MMA (mixed martial arts) style.’ He then heard a pop. He stated that after hearing the pop, he observed the person he had previously observed on top of the other person (the male wearing the hoodie) laid out on the grass.” One report also says that Zimmerman can be heard yelling for help 14 times on a 911 call recorded during the fight.
While the reports blame Zimmerman for getting out of his vehicle (he says that he was trying to get a house number for the police), that is not itself a crime. Of course, none of this means that Zimmerman was not the aggressor. Given the presumption of innocence and the need to prove the elements beyond a reasonable doubt, this evidence presents an added problem for the prosecution in my view. I have expressed skepticism over the way the case has developed and how it has been charged from the outset. As a criminal defense attorney, I would view this as a strong defense case even on the manslaughter charge, particularly given the poor police work at the scene.
What do you think?
Here is the police report.
Source: ABC and NY Daily News
Various combinations and permutations of actions by Zimmerman and Martin are possible to fill in the blanks. Different witnesses say different things about who was on top but nobody knows much about how they got to where they got to. Three things occur to me, to be important:
1. What did Zimmerman SAY to the cops that night in his three statements, and what did he SHOW them the next day on the video taped reenactment?
2. What part did Frank Taafe play in all this and how soon was he involved in it, and was Frank Taafe in fact the “mystery witness” who saw Martin viciously beating up Zimmerman (and if so, why did he not stop it?)?
3. Why would Martin not be presumed to be standing his ground, even if he beat the living daylights out of Zimmerman, since first, “Shit, he ran,” and then — Zimmerman followed?
It’s not as terribly complex as the Zistems want us to believe it is.
Sling
I have the geography just right, you misunderstood. The 50ft I wrote was from the SUV to the spot martin lay dead….not his house. Read what I wrote before you lambast me for not looking at a picture when I did
Its 600ft from the suv to the rearentrance/martin house
I believe the SUV was at he elbow or bend so ZImmerman while in the car had clear view down both streets and would be obvious to the police when they turned on to Twin Trees Ln they would sethe truck down the street at the elbow
Wrong on the pot. The fact the THC was found in the BLOOD test which only stays in the BLOOD FOR A FEW HOURS means that Martin was very likley high as the blood test would not have been done post-mortem for AT LEAST a few hours. You are confusing urine with blood thc tests
His suspicions were not unfounded. Sure you think they are cause in hindsight you know he was on the phone but he had a hoodie on. Zimmerman did not know he was on the phone. Suspicious was an honest assessment by a concerned citizen
Sling you posted: Your (A), (B) and (C) or simply creative works written with bias against Martin
Did you not see that A is anti-zimmerman and pro-martin? I was laying out three possible scenarios of what happened in the blind spot in fair minded manner. What other scenario would you propose for consideration outsid e of A, B, or C?
Sling you then said: Your (A)(B)(C) is simply ‘creativity’ on speed.
The A, B, and C are meant to cover all likely BLINDSPOT explanations. A supports your point, B supports mine, and C is a third one
Why do you act as if you didnt even read them and they are all just pro-zimmerman….did you even read them before commenting on them?
Zimmerman was merely trying to keep an eye on him. If that means getting out of the SUV to move into a position (and stay in positon) to keep an eye on hjm, thats fine.
What they said to each other doesn’t really mean much. Heck a boss may get in your face at work and say angry things to you about your competency, but that doesn’t mean you get to pin him down and beat the fuck out of him cause he “inflamed” the situation.
You say, maybe Zimmerman pushed Martin and it left no scar which then gave Martin license to beat the fuck out of zimmerman. well okay maybe Z pushed him, thats plausible, but I still don’t believe that means Martin gets to do what he did to Zimmerrman. He should return the push (matching the force in return) or just leave. Not go apeshit. People get pushed every day and they dont go apeshit in return unless they are just looking for an excuse to go apeshit
I’m going to jump in again.
Zimmerman is doing what he thinks is his job without regard for what his behavior is doing to Martin. He identifies a “suspicious” character.
Martin is minding his own business, talking with his girlfriend and notices this guy following him. He gets really nervous. Is this guy planning to hurt him? He’s relieved when he loses the guy. Then concerned when the guy shows up again. We know this from his girlfriend.
Z calls the cops on their direct line to report the suspicious character. While on the line he gets out of his car to follow M and, if the witness is to believed, Z chases M. I don’t believe that M chased Z, he just wants Z to leave him alone.
Now M has a dangerous guy chasing him, one who could be a mugger or someone who intends to hurt him.
While M is still on the phone: “Why are you following me?” “What are you doing here?”or “You got a problem, homey?” “no”. The phone gets knocked from M’s hand. I don’t believe M would confront Z for a fight with a phone in his hand. He would have put it away. I believe the girlfriend’s account. The response of “What are you doing here” is more indicative of the bully/intimidation that Z would use. I don’t see him laying back with “no”
Without witnesses to back this up, Z may have tried to “detain” M, possibly to impress the cops, and possibly by showing his gun after knocking the phone out of M’s hand. This would be reason enough for M to go after Z (stand his ground) to try to disarm or disable him.
Forensics might help here – the distance of the gun from M. Is it possible that both Z and M were standing? Did M bleed from the shot? If so, why was there no blood from M on Z? I have the impression that M was face down after the shot. If this is true, how did this happen? How did Z get out from under M? If M was on top of Z when the shot was fired, I would expect him to be a dead weight and Z would have to roll M off, onto his back before Z could get up. Is it possible that M had gotten off Z to end the fight and Z pulled the gun at that time?
Manny, I say this because I stopped some rednecks from spotlighting deer on my property at night by yelling out to them “I called the game warden”!
I had not even called the warden yet, but those guys ran away so fast I did not need to…..
5) Martin is witnessed viciously beating Zimmerman in a pinned position and Zimmerman shoots him after crying for help 14-20 times for SOMEONE ANYONE to intervene so he would not have to shoot Martin.
Manny
So, Manny if this is so, couldn’t Zimmerman have shouted “I’m neighborhood watch and the cops are on the way”!!! or “The cops are coming” Or “I just called 911″! or Get off, the cops are coming”!
If George was so afraid for his life, this would have helped to scare off an attacker. Why can’t George say these things if he is capable of calling for help?
Manny O
Taking your steps
1) The “4 downright suspicious behaviours” are simply behaviours that Zimmerman interpreted as suspicious.
Zimmerman says “He looks like he’s on drugs or something.” What does that look like?
We know from the autopsy that Martin was not on any drugs. The traces found in his system indicated that it had been one or two days since he could have smoked pot.
The explanation for him not to be walking as Zimmerman expects someone to walk was that he was on a phone call. His body language is often going to look like he’s talking to someone physically with him. He’s going to be proceeding erratically.
Zimmerman interprets Martin walking towards the SUV as Martin “coming to check me out”, but the reality is that Martin has to pass the SUV in order to continue on his way home.
Zimmerman says that Martin is staring at him. The most likely reason for Martin to be looking intently at the SUV is that it must have hung a right to go down Pine Trees and slowed so that Zimmerman could check out this person he had seen walking towards the clubhouse. Remember that Zimmerman was not “on patrol”. He was on his way to the store.
In other words, the four “downright suspicious” behaviours are
a) Martin’s body language due to his conversation with the girlfriend
b) Martin being on his intended path home from the 7-11
(c)(d) Zimmerman appearing to be as suspicious to Martin as much as Martin appeared to be suspicious to Zimmerman.
By “Same Locale” I assume you mean – anywhere within the gated community.
2) Agreed. He reported his suspicions, although they were completely unfounded. Fine.
3) This is where the problems start. It is only fine *up to a point*.
Provided he keeps a safe distance and can keep Martin in view at all times, then it is useful to know where the person suspected if headed. No problem with that.
The moment that Zimmerman can not see precisely where Martin is – That’s when he starts to behave stupidly.
I know that prior to yesterday (day before?) you had absolutely no idea whatsoever what the ground looked like where this all took place. Please take time to review the photograph that you posted and to get the location up in Google Maps satellite view so you can get accurate distances.
Zimmerman is in his SUV on Pine Trees between the clubhouse and the bend.
From there he can see Martin take the pathway from the street and towards the T-junction with the path that leads down behind the houses to his destination.
If Zimmerman gets out and walks on the Northern pavement, he would be able to watch Martin’s progress along that section of path to the side of the house.
But…Martin is walking into a dark area. There is no public lighting in there. There may be enough light from the streets getting into that area that Zimmerman could see Martin turn down the central path.
And immediately Martin turns down the central footpath, Zimmerman has lost sight of Martin.
== This is the moment that any further following becomes reckless. ==
4) “BIG BLIND SPOT in terms of CERTAIN DATA”
Correction – Big blind spot in terms of just about everything.
I’ll continue following your structure and deal with this below
5) Your description is not informed by witness statements available. It is also ‘creative’.
Again, – as with your failure to find out anything about the geography prior to making assertions – your insistence that there must have been public lighting despite the police report that there was none – you have not researched the available documents.
Local residents first hear an argument break out.
Some report two individuals chasing.
Eventually it becomes Zimmerman on his back and Martin on top, hitting him.
A witness reports Zimmerman calling for help a number of times, but does not approach or help. Indistinct shouts are heard in the background of a 911 recording.
There is a shot.
The shouts picked up on the 911 call are indistinct.
Nobody appeared to have heard Zimmerman shout the likes of “Help me please so that I don’t have to shoot this guy”. They only report shouts for help.
We have nothing except your creativity to suggest that Zimmerman was thinking “I know I have a gun, but I really really don’t want to use it. ZOMG I hope help comes before I start losing consciousness. I will be forced to shoot before that happens.” – sort of thoughts.
Now I follow you back to the beginning of the Big Blind Spot.
Manno. You’re doing it again!
The house (Martin’s) is not “within 50ft of the SUV”. I thought that we had cleared up the matter of distances and geography. Please do as I suggested and review the photograph and maps.
All we have now is
1) Zimmerman’s account
2) Girlfriend’s account of her conversation with Martin and what she overheard when it seemed the two met.
Zimmerman says “He ran”
We don’t know where Martin started to run – if indeed he did run. Martin says to hid girlfriend that he is going to walk fast and not run. Zimmerman may have judged an increase in speed to a fast pace as running.
Running or not, once Martin disappears from view, Zimmerman or ourselves have no indication of his speed – other than him telling his girlfriend that he is not going to run.
We don’t know if the fast-walking is intended only for the section of path that gets him off the street and onto the central path. We simply don’t know anything about his pace or his maintenance of it.
We do have the girlfriend telling him to run. We don’t have the girlfriend reporting him out of breath. The probability is that he was not running.
Your (A), (B) and (C) or simply creative works written with bias against Martin
You are fixated on running and outflanking with absolutely nothing to base it on.
You’ve got distances and places all screwed up again. Please pay attention to reality.
You’ve got Martin’s house within 50 feet of the SUV.
You’ve got the place of death within 50 feet of the SUV.
Lookit. The SUV isn’t even within 50 feet of the beginning of the footpath.
This is ‘creativity’ taken to excess – and written in the face of the actual photographs and maps pointed out to you.
We certainly appear to have Zimmerman moving fast by the sound of his breathing and wind noises.
For Martin running, we only have Zimmerman for (while he could see Martin) and the girlfriend against (being in communication with Martin)
We have Martin continuing his conversation with the girlfriend – and almost certainly not running during all the conversation.
We have two reports of what words were exchanged when they did meet up.
(I know it’s all up above umpteen times, but just to keep the flow going, here we go again):-
We have two accounts of the conversation that that happened before anybody got physical.
One from Zimmerman and one from the girlfriend.
Although differing in detail, the both exhibit on two things
1) The exchange began with Martin asking a question
2) Zimmerman’s response to the question that could not be considered to be doing other than inflaming a situation.
In the girl’s account, the conversation is preceded by Martin saying to her “He’s here again”
Think about it.
To any reasonable person, that has to mean. ‘He has returned to some particular place’ or ‘ He is near me again’.
It definitely does not sound like “I’ve found him”
====== quoted from an earlier post of mine =============
Girl’s account :
Martin: “Why are you following me?”
Zimmerman “What are you doing around here?”
It was Martin that asked the ‘perfectly fair question’. Those were the first words spoken by either of them.
Zimmerman’s response was threatening, because he was refusing to answer Martin’s perfectly fair question.
Zimmerman was bullying Martin.
On the other hand, if you accept Zimmerman’s version of the conversation that happened before anybody got physical then:
Martin: “You got a problem, homie?”
Zimmerman: “No”
In this version, Zimmerman is also inflaming the situation. This was his chance to say what he was doing. Instead he gets ‘cute’ – “No”.
That “No” is very confrontational. They both know that Zimmerman was following in the dark.
No matter which version of the conversation you choose to accept, Zimmerman was inflaming the situation.
====== end quote ===========
They came across each other.
Zimmerman had an opportunity to talk.
Instead of saying “Neighbourhood Watch” – which would have explained what he was doing – he did something else.
As for who got physical first – we absolutely don’t know.
The girlfriend can only report the sounds of a scuffle after the exchange of words.
The injuries suffered by either are absolutely no guide as to who got physical first.
We don’t know if one pushed the other. We simply don’t know.
Pushing or grabbing isn’t going to leave to leave neon-lit evidence of its happening.
Witnesses report two men chasing. They don’t know who was chasing who. They do report the sounds of an argument.
All we can tell from the injuries is that Zimmerman was coming off worst.
It may seem surprising that Martin’s hands were not significantly marked from hitting Zimmerman, but the dead don’t bruise easily.
That’s your Big Black Hole.
Your (A)(B)(C) is simply ‘creativity’ on speed.
Yet again, you totally get the geography wrong.
Yet again, you base your scenarios on wild assumptions about running, and totally messed up geography.
What’s the core of it?
Zimmerman followed Martin into the dark. He did not know where Martin was exactly, and he followed into the dark.
That was reckless and stupid. That evaluation is plain common sense
That it is common sense is reinforced by
1) Neighbourhood Watch rules that forbid such action
2) “We don’t need you to do that.”
When, because of Zimmerman’s recklessness, the two encountered each other, Zimmerman made no attempt to explain what he was doing.
He clearly had an opportunity – even by his own account.
Martin dies because of Zimmerman’s recklessness and stupidity.
Manny, people who take adderall and don’t kill any innocent kids are fine with me; I know a few of them, in fact. Not ONE of them would want to be compared with George Zimmerman, thank you very much!
Manny, George does not need to abuse drugs to act wrong. He acted wrong and he killed a kid who was doing nothing wrong, when his job was to wait for the cops.
I don’t even know what you’re talking about any more. You have fantasized all this intrigue and predatory behavior on Martin’s part when there is no evidence of it and when it can only be imagined with a totally contrived and clearly bogus interpretation of the physical evidence.
You say:
Lets think of the unfolding events linearly.
But you MEAN, “Let’s think of the events unfolding in a way that supports Zimmerman’s ridiculous story.”
1) Martin displays the 4 downright suspicious behaviors in the SAME LOCALE where other young black males had committed felonies RECENTLY. The fact it was the same locale makes it NOT PROFILING.
Sorry, Manny, but that is just wrong and even worse, it is senseless. People (cops or others) do not “profile” people where they are NOT; they profile people where they ARE. Being of the same race as someone who was previously in the same place, and being thought of as a criminal for that reason, is being PROFILED. Geography doesn’t change that. What you’re saying is that Zimmerman was RIGHT to profile Martin because there had been a Black criminal in that neighborhood before!
2) Zimmerman reacts as a concerned citizen, reporting it to 911. No condemnation for Zimmerman here.
Fine. Nobody DID condemn him for that. We just don’t like the fact that he killed somebody.
3) Zimmerman instinctively (just like so many others on this forum have posted when seeing a suspicious person) went to see “where he was going” once Martin started to RUN toward the rear entrance where Martins house was. Still no condemnation for zimmerman. Keeping and eye on someone is just fine.
If Zimmerman had only “kept an eye” on Martin, he would have stayed in his car. No condemnation. At the point, however, when he says, “These assholes always get away,” that is not “keeping an eye” on anything. You just want to overlook that little part.
4) BIG BLIND SPOT in terms of CERTAIN DATA
DATA: Zimmerman followed Martin; he caused a confrontation; he killed an innocent citizen in violation of Florida and federal law.
5) Martin is witnessed viciously beating Zimmerman in a pinned position and Zimmerman shoots him after crying for help 14-20 times for SOMEONE ANYONE to intervene so he would not have to shoot Martin.
We shall see. I doubt that this happened, but if any of it DID happen, I would say Martin was particularly good at self defense and at standing his ground and if Zimmerman had not had a loaded gun on him, Martin would have been able to turn him over to the police that night when they arrived. And that is what SHOULD have happened.
anon nurse – why so baselessly cynical against people that need adderal? Do you just disagree that adderal should even be on the market? Do you suspect all people prescribed adderall are abusing it?
“The Adderal may calm people down if TAKEN AS DIRECTED. You do not know if he was doubling up on his pills or snorting them in order to get high. And neither do the police because they neglected to take a drug test.
I would need a pill count on this prescription to believe that he was taking it as directed.” -shano
Yep.
Manny, having seen TWO teenagers talk on their cell phones outside, I can say that Martin is just meandering about talking to DeeDee. He has no intention of even looking for George. He is glad he lost George. It is ridiculous to even suggest this. He is walking and talking on the phone! That is all.
The police are highly critical of George for mouthing off to Trayvon after he hunted him down. George cannot help but be a smart ass, a bully, for not giving Martin the information he needed to know he was not in any danger.
George got fired from a job for being a bully and bothering people and having a smart mouth. It is part of his character.
The Adderal may calm people down if TAKEN AS DIRECTED. You do not know if he was doubling up on his pills or snorting them in order to get high. And neither do the police because they neglected to take a drug test.
I would need a pill count on this prescription to believe that he was taking it as directed.
Correction: Looking for Malisha’s thoughtful response to the previous post that was in response to her assertion the 4 suspicious behaviors are irrelevant
Martin may have been afraid initially (in scenario B and C) but fear after that is ruled out by how Martin inexplicably WENT BACK towards Zimmerman in scenario B. You cant have him both “afraid” and also mindlessly wandering back to Zimmerman unaware of that supposed source of this great fear. Pick a lane and drive in it. The two insinuations are mutually incomaptible
Martin had other options to meander around such as Long Oak Rd in the opposite direction of Zimmerman…that did not involve going back to the “creepy Zimmerman”. This is what he would have done if afraid if not gone back to this house. Try again.
George does not OBVIOUSLY get close to him, any more than I would say Martin OBVIOUSLY got close to Zimmerman. Nothing defacto on either side Besided Scenario C references them both inadvertently and unwittingly bumping into each other as they round corner
The 1/4 inch cut/scrape did not necessarily could have been pre-existing and if it did there is certainly the possibility it came from his vicious blows hitting zimmerman’s fingernails as zimmerman put up hands to block his volleys. To say that zimmerman must have hit the phone out of his hand AND that’s how he got that abrasion is blind speculation on top of a blind speculation…but sure maybe that happened and thats what gave Martin his free and clear license to felony battery. I am sure the Jury will hear that and have no need to deliberate
In scenario C, we know the phone went dead, but we don’t know why If they encountered each other surprisingly at a corner fight/flight may have kicked in and clearly Martin chose Fight which would necessitate he drop the phone and start beating this guys face in before he saw it coming
You say he followed Martin, but the evidence points to Zimmerman merely keeping an eye on him at distance until he lost him. This is not an arbitrary blindspot in the sequence of evens IT IS A BLINDSPOT. Just like the other posters did in the same situation when they came upon suspicious characters in their community. They kept and eye on them. Its not illegal and not worthy of being beaten half to death by a pissed off youth
Zimmerman actions were not disgusting because its a blind spot. We dont know what happened, but we know what happened before and his actions were beyond legal reproach period. You dont know “he tracked him down” and produced a confrontation. there is zero evidence of any “sarcasm” or mouthing off or bullying unless you expect anyone to believe like Sling that No=Eff You. Or “What are you doing here” is bullying…give it a rest, that’s going nowhere. If you want to talk about sarcasm or bullying speech its “You gotta problem Homey?!” but it doesn’t even matter.
There is no law that requires George to say anything. In fact he has a right to remain silent. And guess what…remaining silent or not answering a question does not give a 17yo black male the right to beat the fuck out of anyone. Wake up man! Forsake the dead end position of incorrigibility
I dont know why I am even answering such an off the wall question…but Adderall affects people who don’t need it like speed. For people that need it medically it CALMS THEM DOWN…opposite effect of speed.., you gotta be able to do better than this. Where is Malisha’s thought response to my previous post? That was who it was for
Manny, your number-
c. Martin was not pissed like George was. (those assholes always get away) Trayvon does not say “some creepy asshole is following me”. Martin was just talking to DeeDee. After he lost George he probably did not give him another thought. Really.
Martin was AFRAID of George or he would not have RUN to get away from him! This is confirmed by DeeDee who urges him to run. Martin was like all other teens these days, he is out walking, talking on the phone having a private conversation. Then: the creepy guy finds him again!
George OBVIOUSLY gets close enough so there is physical contact. I certainly think there is enough evidence to say that George knocks the cell phone out of Trayvons hand, causing the 1/4 inch cut on his ring finger (a very odd place for self injury). Words are spoken, the phone goes dead.
The actions of Zimmerman before your arbitrary ‘blind spot’ are NOT beyond reproach. he follows a stranger (who he hints to the dispatch may have a gun in his waistband) into the dark, down a dark foot path when he should have gone back to his vehicle to wait forr police.
The actions of Zimmerman once he tracks down Trayvon are disgusting. He is sarcastic, he mouths off, he bullies with his speech. George holds all the knowledge here, he knows why he is following but refuses to tell Martin. he knows the police are on the way but refuses to tell Martin.
George makes a lot of mistakes here.
How do you know Zimmeramn did not grind up some Adderal pills and snort it before he left the house and was stoned out of his mind? Speed kills baby, in more ways than one.
Malisha
You said
Your four “reasons” had nothing to do with the crime of murder.
Thats where you and Sling make a mistake given our (as a forum) hindsight perspective
My point was never to say, yet you respond as if it was, that the 4 suspicious activities of Martin earned him death
That is a total mis-characterization of ALL of my assertions in my opinion
Its important to take yourself out of hindsight 20/20 mode and go back to the scene as it was developing on the night in question. Thats my basis for saying the events leading up to the shooting are important
Lets think of the unfolding events linearly.
1) Martin displays the 4 downright suspicious behaviors in the SAME LOCALE where other young black males had committed felonies RECENTLY. The fact it was the same locale makes it NOT PROFILING.
2) Zimmerman reacts as a concerned citizen, reporting it to 911. No condemnation for Zimmerman here
3) Zimmerman instinctively (just like so many others on this forum have posted when seeing a suspicious person) went to see “where he was going” once Martin started to RUN toward the rear entrance where Martins house was. Still no condemnation for zimmerman. Keeping and eye on someone is just fine
4) BIG BLIND SPOT in terms of CERTAIN DATA
5) Martin is witnessed viciously beating Zimmerman in a pinned position and Zimmerman shoots him after crying for help 14-20 times for SOMEONE ANYONE to intervene so he would not have to shoot Martin.
So now lets go back to the beginning of the BIG BLIND SPOT, Zimmerman is free and clear…done nothing wrong or unusual or aggressive. Just acting like a good neighbor
Only three things I think could have happened at the BIG BLIND SPOT point
A) As you believe, Zimmerman literally out-sprinted Martin before Martin could get to the safety of his house within 50ft of the SUV, manhandled him, and earned Martin’s vicious retaliation, before Zimmerman shot him
B) As I believe, Zimmerman did not sprint after him and overtake him considering Martin had a running lead..and instead Martin was pissed that “this guy” was disrespectfully staring at him in his mislead young mind. He got out of zimmerman’s line of sight losing him, doubled back on a parallel path…confronted and then attacked Zimmerman for nothing other than Zimmerman staring/reporting him to 911 based on Martin’s 4 perfectly suspicious behaviors
C) Another possibility, is they mutually rounded a blind corner and simply met when neither of them intended it. Martin was already pissed at Zimmerman and Zimmerman was already suspicious of Martin. Considering Martin had no signs of taking a single blow from Zimmerman or even a bruise from being grabbed, Martin must have attacked Zimmerman first shortly after they rounded the blind corner or Martin would have some sign of taking a blow or being grabbed
In scenario B and C Martin screwed up…he should not have attacked someone period, but he sure as hell should not have attacked someone who was legally permitted to carry a weapon and who was legally permitted to use it to protect himself from great bodily harm or death under self-defense laws. Martin at this point in B and C turned into a predator for no legally justifiable reason. Staring at someone and reporting them to 911 should not result in retaliation period
In Scenario A, I look at the “RECENT Character expression” of both actors. Don’t think that the lawyers won’t establish character with the judge/jury…it is relevant and critical in such cases where there is a huge blindspot. I
So I hope you see, the actions of Zimmerman before the BLIND SPOT are beyond reproach. But those same actions I believe made Zimmerman a target for a pissed off Martin.
And I would add…those same actions by Zimmerman before the blindspot DO NOT make him a target for violence though so many insinuate it does and that “Martin had a right to attack this creepy Zimmerman” for no more than staring at/keeping an eye on Martin and reporting his suspicious activities to 911
Lastly, putting aside character, Scenario A is most improbable considering the place where Martin was shot and the fact Martin was running towards his home. I believe Zimmerman would have to have been in a dead sprint while on the call with 911 to have a snowballs chance in hell of overtaking an already running youth of 17 AT THE PLACE OF DEATH..just 50ft from where the suv was. I don’t even think that’s possible for the 100 meter dash olympian gold medalist…Martin had to have doubled back and he had to have done that of his own volition which is damning to the idea that Martin was scared/afraid.
And here I’ve been on the blog all this time trying to imitate GZ’s voice: “These assholes always get away, these assholes always get away…”
@Malisha: It is worth if for the voice; Karl speaks in a very gruff monotone; and I think everybody that watches the movie at some point tries to imitate Karl’s voice.
“tonight you die!”
GZ
Wow, I really AM ignorant! I had no idea there even WAS such a movie, and what great dialogue — almost as good as, “You got a problem homie?…No?…Well you do now!”
I need to watch more movies. (I do like popcorn…)
OK. Thanks.
I’ve only got slingbacks.
Maybe I could work some blades into the toe areas