The video below shows a disturbing scene where a Cleveland municipal bus driver decked an obnoxious female passenger after a loud and profane shouting match. It is equally disturbing to hear the laughing of some of the other passengers on the bus — a shocking example of a moral abyss in our society.
The 22-year veteran of the Regional Transit Authority has been suspended. He is shown saying that “She want to be a man, I’m gonna treat you like a man” after decking her. This of course misses the point that you cannot deck men or women for verbal abuse on a city bus.
The question is the liability for the city. The driver was clearly working at the time for purposes of respondeat superior. However, is this a “frolic or a detour” from this scope of employment? Drivers are trained not to get involved in fights, but to call police. Yet, the driver was acting to “keep order” on the bus and could be seen as performing a task related to this job, even if it was done in violation of city guidelines. Even if vicarious liability is not applicable, there is straight negligence in firing or training or supervision that could be alleged. We often see these cases with security staff who use excessive force but a bus driver is not a security personnel position.
As for the driver, this is clearly assault and battery under torts as well as a potentially criminal act. Either way, the suspension is a predictable move as would eventual termination.
[WARNING: The video is peppered with curse words and racial slurs.]
Warning the video below shows violence and includes graphic and racist elements:
Source: Washington Post
Eddie,
When women do get equal pay and equal this and equal that, let’s talk. In the meantime, if you’re a foot taller and 80 lbs heavier, don’t lay a hand on me for any reason.
Welcome to the new world, ladies. You want equal pay, equal this, and equal that? Fine. You hit me, I’m gonna beat your tuchas down.
Oh yeah, open your own freaking doors.
And we wonder why so many women are physically abused. He’s much bigger than she is and his mouth was just as bad. But it’s all her fault.
just think of how much fun this would have been if the driver or the woman had been armed.
Jude is of course correct.
But beyond that, when people see a verbal confrontation between a low-wage worker and a customer, without any information as to who started the confrontation, I think the natural assumption is to assign the blame for starting the argument to the customer. Customers are extremely rude to servicepeople all the time and regularly verbally abuse them, knowing that “the customer is always right” and the workers’ fear of reprimand will shield them. So in this situation, not only do we see the woman as initiating the physical confrontation, but we also assume that she was the aggressor in starting the verbal altercation. This assumption could of course be incorrect, but without more information, it’s an assumption anyone who has ever worked a low-wage job will understand making.
bettykath, the reason I assume the problems starts with her slapping the bus driver is because that is when it starts. You can mouth off at people, it’s not against the law. When you assault someone, you break the law. She was then breaking the law.
“Perhaps there is hope for our lazy society. Perhaps we might even start demanding that parents take responsibility for raising and educating their children too. ”
Nothing says taking responsibility like blaming the other person for making you loose your temper.
Josh, If anyone said to me what the driver said to that woman, I might forget that I’m non-violent and slapped him as well. Furthermore, he wouldn’t have said something like that to a man, fully expecting a mouthful of fist.
What I see is that everyone assumes the problem begins with her slapping the bus driver and ignoring everything that precedes it. He was just as mouthy as she was and we don’t know what all precedes what we saw. It’s like those who assume the Zimmerman case is all about who threw the first punch at the confrontation, and ignoring the preceding 10 minutes of Zimmerman’s profiling, and pursuing as if they have no significance.
How refreshing and inspiring!
It seems that those in favor of the provoked beatdown far outweigh those that favor a course of action that demands victimization with the only recourse in life being to pursue some sort of legal remedy after the injurious facts.
Perhaps there is hope for our lazy society. Perhaps we might even start demanding that parents take responsibility for raising and educating their children too. Perhaps we might deny services to people who cannot accept them with grace and thanks. Might we even find everyone using “please” and “thank you” instead of “gimme” and “I’ll do what I want”?
How would people’s opinions differ if the unruly/rude/violent passenger had been a man and the driver had been a woman? I suspect there would be more universal condemnation of the initial “laying hands on” by the passenger…
Tracy 1, October 15, 2012 at 3:15 pm
Bettykath
What the driver said was, and I quote, ” look like somebody done sliced your face up.” He did NOT say he was going to, or wanted to slice her face up. Was it needed? Probably not. But at that point, it was still non-violent. SHE is the one who assaulted him first.
————–
Neither of them should have been subjected to the verbal abuse of the other. It’s not clear who started it, but as the person in charge of the bus, he had a responsibility to NOT respond in kind. Whoever started it, the other should not have engaged with the bus driver having the greater responsibility b/c of his job.
We heard different things from the driver, but no matter, it was insulting either way.
I guess a woman’s slap is deserving of a fist and followup beating. Yes, I can see your point, she was asking for it. [sarcasm]
I’d go back to the thread on evolution but I think it’s been continued here with John Wayne enthusiasts.
Damn. He’s lucky she didn’t shoot him dead in self-defense!
Well said Shady- Grady, well said.
Betty by patient I mean that he did not lose it as I might have were someone to repeatedly subject me to a torrent of racial insults and profanities. It wasn’t until she attacked him physically that he defended himself physically.
I see this as not that different from that girl in Seattle who shoved a cop and then got punched in the face. A bus driver is not a cop of course but in each situation a woman initiated physical violence on a man in the mistaken belief that the man wouldn’t respond. This is foolish and needs to stop. Nobody, regardless of gender, should be putting hands on another person. But if you do, you need to be prepared for consequences.
Bettykath
What the driver said was, and I quote, ” look like somebody done sliced your face up.” He did NOT say he was going to, or wanted to slice her face up. Was it needed? Probably not. But at that point, it was still non-violent. SHE is the one who assaulted him first.
Shady, He was not patient during the verbal abuse. It was a tit for tat exchange. Instead of ignoring her, he engaged her. “Somebody ought to slice your face up” isn’t exactly calming dialog. He needs to lose his job.
She initiated the physical confrontation after a long period of verbal abuse. The driver was patient with the verbal abuse. Once the woman spit on the driver and hit him that’s a different level of offence. Everyone has the right to defend themselves. No one should accept being hit just because their attacker is female.
John Drabble, Thanks for your perspective. The “walk in a person’s shoes” comes to mind.
I’m a retired bus driver. I can’t count the number of times I’ve sat in that drivers seat trying to safely operate a fully loaded 60 foot vehicle through downtown rush hour traffic with jay walking pedestrians while a passenger verbally abused me including threats of violence. Your choices are to stop the bus and call for help incurring the wrath of the passengers who want to get home (it takes “forever” for security to show up) and sit there taking more further abuse from the passenger or simply keep driving hoping you will arrive at the abuser’s stop soon. The passenger is a coward because they know if the driver get’s out of the seat he places his job in jeopardy whether he hits her/him or not.
It’s a highly stressful job and after 22 years apparently he had just hit his limit on how much abuse he could take. It’s hard to tell from the video but she made some sort of physical contact with him while he was in his seat. He responded in a manner that he will pay dearly for–loss of job, charged with assault, etc. It was a mistake on his part but an entirely understandable response to the abuse from my point of view.
How many people have jobs where they are subjected to verbal abuse and very real threats of assault almost daily. I was spit on twice during my transit operator career. How many readers here have ever been spit on at work?
Tracy, My old man taught me to never start a fight. He also taught me how to determine a fight was inevitable. And then you throw the first haymaker and go for the quick KO. I grew up in a street fighting city. I really didn’t like to fight but one must adapt to your enviroment.