New York State Senator Greg Ball (R) took little time after the Boston bombing to call for the torture of 19-year-old Dzokhar Tsarnaev. Ball went to Twitter to call for the teenager to be tortured in the name of all of the values we hold dear as Americans.
Ball sent out a tweet stating “So, scum bag #2 in custody. Who wouldn’t use torture on this punk to save more lives?” It is the new normal in America. Ball feels entirely comfortable in speaking of torture in the most casual terms. It also shows how torture is always the answer since you cannot say for sure that there are not more bombs after an attack.
Later, Ball dismissed notions that torture (which is a federal crime and a violation of international law) is wrong: “If people find that offensive, they’re going to have to check their own conscience,” he reportedly said.
Later his office issued a statement:
“Terrorists play by a different set of rules by manipulating the greatest strengths of our open society against us. One of the questions to be asked is this: is “torture” ever justified in the war against terror, if it can save lives? I am not shy in joining those who say yes, and I believe we must give those tasked with protecting us every constitutional and effective tool to do so.”
“Every constitutional and effective tool” for Ball includes a tool long defined as a war crime. I have previously written about the corruption of American values on torture.
The willingness of politicians like Ball to embrace torture is a product not simply of the Bush Administration’s legitimation of torture but the Obama Administration’s refusal to prosecute anyone for torture. As I have written before (here and here), the Obama Administration has destroyed some of the core Nuremberg principles, particularly in its revisal of the “superior orders defense” to excuse U.S. officials. The failure to prosecute has allowed those who ordered the torture program to continue to speak out in favor of torture. It has destroyed any credibility of the United States in demanding prosecutions in other countries and given support for politicians like Ball to rally supporters behind a banner of torture.
Ball’s bio states that he “grew up on the family estate of Stephen and Jean Kennedy-Smith, sister of President John F. Kennedy, where his parents were both caretakers. He is the Chairman of the Senate Committee on Veterans, Homeland Security, and Military Affairs.” He is a graduate of United States Air Force Academy (USAFA) and is currently completing his Thesis for his Master’s of Arts in Liberal Studies with a concentration in International Affairs from Georgetown University.
Source: Raw Story
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/apr/23/special-dread-terrorism-muslims-west “For Muslims in the US and Canada, terror’s enduring damage is the erosion of trust and an unjust stain of guilt by association.”
We dont need no Kennedy caretakers in the NY Senate. He can hold Chamberlane’s umbrella. Anyone recall that one?
Give Ball a job on the subway pushing the passengers in when it gets real crowded. We can call him Pushy.
Punk Puss face guys like Ball need some time in prison and some torture from the rear end.
Oh, the bombing suspect, otherwise known as Punk Puss will get tortured. You can count on that Senator Ball.
HumpinDog is speaking about the gang known as PWP. Perps Without Purpose arose in Leavenworth Prison in 2010. They are coming to a prison near you. Punkpusses of the world beware.
Anybody with the name Tsar appelled to the first half of his last name who comes from that part of the world has got to be questioned when he hits the U.S. border. While it may be Springtime for Muslims in Egypt, it is gonna be solitary for Punk Puss in the joint. Otherwise he is gonna get gang raped by perps without purpose which is the name of a gang in that federal prison in Leavenworth. When he hits Kansas they will be calling him Dorothy.
Porkchop 1, April 23, 2013 at 8:47 am
Dredd:
“Speaking of conspiracy theories, one of the federal charges was conspiracy.”
Actually, no — there is no conspiracy charge at this point. He was charged with:
“(1): Use of a weapon of mass destruction, in violation of 18, United States Code, Section 2332a(a); and malicious destruction of property resulting in death, in violation of 18, United States Code, Section 844(i).”
That information is from the transcript of his initial appearance.
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Actually yes.
The statute reads:
(18 U.S.C. 2332a(a)). The alleged factual scenario and the statute fully support the conspiracy charge.
Forbes: “In a criminal complaint unsealed today in U.S. District Court for the District of Massachusetts, Tsarnaev is specifically charged with one count of using and conspiring to use a weapon of mass destruction …”
Guardian: “He has been charged with … using and conspiring to use a weapon of mass destruction …”
Dredd:
“Speaking of conspiracy theories, one of the federal charges was conspiracy.”
Actually, no — there is no conspiracy charge at this point. He was charged with:
“(1): Use of a weapon of mass destruction, in violation of 18, United States Code, Section 2332a(a); and malicious destruction of property resulting in death, in violation of 18, United States Code, Section 844(i).”
That information is from the transcript of his initial appearance.
@Gene H.
“Gene H. – April 22, 2013 at 5:43 pm – … [clip] … That’s a consequence of declaring war on a tactic instead of a group of people, for example, the country that provided the money and manpower for 9/11 – Saudi Arabia…”
I agree with you 100% brother! What are your feelings about the “Phil Marshall*” incident recently (Jan-2013)? Do you smell a Saudi (et al) rodent or two as well?
*Author of novels: “Lakefront Airport” and ““The Big Bamboozle:…”
I truly think Dzhokhar’s defense attorney is going to push for blaming EVERYTHING on Tamerlan and suggesting that Dzhokhar was under some sort of Svengali effect which I believe Patricia Campbell Hearst used to some limited success in her defense. She got 35 years, served 22 months, and a POTUS commuted her sentence, then another POTUS issued a full pardon.
If in fact the Tsarnaev’s escape extradition to Russia for “alleged” crimes or plots against Russia (per Vladimir Putin’s potential future contention), then I don’t think the trial will run anything like what everyone here expects it will for Dzhokhar. Somehow I feel the POTUS will intervene in some strange way. As why did the POTUS authorize Jay Carney to make that totally FUBAR comment about “terrorists”? And what type of strange relationship does the POTUS have with Mr. Putin (see incident in South Korea with POTUS and Medvedev back in March 2012).
I know all of the Tsarnaevs are naturalized citizens now. But that did not stop Amir Mohamed Meshal (a natural born US citizen) from getting extraordinary rendition to Somalia and Ethiopia with the help of 2 FBI agents and 2 “unknown” US officials (wink wink).
If Dzhokhar’s “ambulance chaser” lawyer doesn’t come back with a comment like: “Your honor my client ran over his brother to stop him from continuing his terroristic rampage. That indicates to me, your honor, a true turn around in behavior and intent. My client pleas not guilty your honor.” I’d be surprised otherwise…
I’m just not feeling a natural life-cycle of jurisprudence in this scenario. I’m not predicting anything but I just feel things will become very strange and real soon. I could be wrong (and I usually am) – LOL
“I’m just not feeling a natural life-cycle of jurisprudence in this scenario. I’m not predicting anything but I just feel things will become very strange and real soon.”
SOTB,
I have that same strange feeling in my gut.
Porkchop 1, April 22, 2013 at 10:00 pm
Dredd, there were two of them, and they apparently agreed to commit the crime. That’s a conspiracy.
I expect more federal charges than those, though. There were two separate explosive devices at the race, and more during the police chase.
=============================
Tru dat.
That is a popular “theory of the case” in federal criminal prosecutions:
(On The Origin of “Conspiracy Theory” – 3). The severe criticism the government received after the JFK assasination, when it decided NOT to prosecute that crime as a conspiracy theory caused a cultural phenomenon:
(ibid).
The Punk Puss should get no sympathy for being young. Eighteen, Up and Out. He is 19.
They can convict him of felony murder of his own brother. He is not insane enough,or even plausibly insane, to win a not guilty by reason of insanity defense. He is going to prison for the rest of his life. If he gets the death penalty so be it. The contenance of this Punk Puss and his older bro, will be front and center for years. Punk Puss and the caps backwards approach to life will suffer as a result of this case. The Punk Puss affect wont be “cool” anymore. If he gets punked in prison by some perp then so be it. The only issue remaining now is whether they had accomplices or mentors. If so, whether there was a Muslim Brotherhood conspiracy and beyond that a Russian KGB level of conspiracy. I sort of doubt that there are any accomplices.
The 26th Amendment made adults out of every kid who reaches age 18. This Punk Puss was 19. He is an adult. He is a punk adult but nevertheless he needs no sympathy for his age. Punks of the world need to realize that they are not cool. They are perp bait. Prison will be rough on this punk. Solitary confinement is better than the alternative out there in general pop with the perps.
Hey, OS, if I were this defendant… I’d bring up every affirmative defense that I could…. But you are the expert in crazy…. There’s NGRI as well as lacking criminal capacity at the time of the offense as well as other tactile defenses I would make….
I feel for the defense… They have their hands full…. Then if hey beat these charges…. Well… I know hold the Feds treat them… They do not like to loose and will do what thy have to in order to win….
Pete9999,
I agree with you….
guess they’ll have to cork up the hole in the back of his throat before they waterboard him.
fair trial and a legal hanging.
for the record nick, i’m against the death penalty. my reason in just one word. texas
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-04-22/marathon-bombing-suspect-being-probed-in-2011-homicide.html
AY,
From everything I have seen and read, the defendant in this case is not “crazy,” as you put it. There is a lot of difference between a crippling injury with possible brain damage and major mental illness in the usual sense of the word.
OS,
Lets be realistic… A Person in these shoes will not get a fair trial…. Period…. More than likely the judge will anoint what the prosecutor wants…. The defendant federally have to prove by clear and convincing standards that he was crazy at the time of the offense…. One hell of a hurdle….used to be you alledged it… The prosecutor has to debunk your defense…. Still that way in a lot of states…. But, you must bring it up….. But hey, you deal with crazy all the time…. So, it will not really matter what I have to say…. You probably know more than I ever want….
Dredd, there were two of them, and they apparently agreed to commit the crime. That’s a conspiracy.
I expect more federal charges than those, though. There were two separate explosive devices at the race, and more during the police chase.
Speaking of conspiracy theories, one of the federal charges was conspiracy.
The theory of the case is going to include a conspiracy theory:
(Guardian, emphasis added).
Glenn Greenwald @ggreenwald
Tsarnaev presented to a Magistrate, told of his rights – decent handling of this so far by the DOJ http://www.lawfareblog.com/2013/04/tsarnaev-has-been-mirandized-by-the-court-what-is-the-next-interrogation-issue/?