Zubeidat Tsarnaeva, the mother of Boston Marathon alleged bombers Tamerlan and Tzhokhar Tsarnaevso, appears to be wanted for theft in the United States — a charge that could make her interview with authorities more complex for any lawyer. She failed to appear on a theft charge in Massachusetts in October. The looming charges appear to be one of the reasons for her reluctance to return to the United States.
The legal status of Zubeidat Tsarnaeva is uncertain. From court records she would appear in violation of a court order to appear to answer two counts of malicious/wanton damage and defacement to property. In June, she stole $1,600 worth of clothing from a Massachusetts Lord & Taylor store. She was due in court on October 25, but never showed up. It is not clear if a bench warrant was issued after her non-appearance.
To make matters worse, she was captured in a religious rant on CNN when called about her son: “If they are going to kill him. I don’t care. My oldest son is killed, so I don’t care. I don’t care if my youngest son is going to be killed today. I want the world to hear this. And, I don’t care if I am going to get killed too. And I will say Allahu Akbar!“ It appears that, like her oldest son, Zubeidat Tsarnaeva has become more religious in recent years. It is a chilling insight into those who replace conventional maternal and moral values with extreme religious views. I realize that she is clearly distraught but this is a pretty unnerving response.
The use of religion at such moments strikes many faithful people as curious like the recent people convicted of stealing parking fees who noted that they would not steal during Ramadan. Of course, in nations committed to Sharia law like Saudi Arabia, stealing $1,600 worth of clothes commonly would result in having your hand cut off.
Source: Daily Mail
Great post Katie.
Sorry for you loss.
I’m agnostic, so I don’t have a reason/interest in claiming superiority. But I think it’s ridiculous to pull our random bits of the Quran as evidence that our “Christian” nation has a more developed moral code… Anyone whose ever read the bible knows there is some wild, awful stuff in there, too. The bible supports slavery, rape, misogyny, and other major human right violations. I know, many Christians claim that when David prayed that God would bash the babies of his enemies against rocks to kill them, he was still a good guy because of the historical context/war/whatever. Still, that prayer sounds sorta nasty… Everyone in entitles to believe as they wish, but people may want to examine their own holy books before demonizing others. They all can be read in different ways, are really old and have been translated into a billion languages by God know who. One of the lovely ideas in Islam is that most moderate Muslims believe in 100 paths to God. They believe that godly Christians may enter paradise. Many moderate Muslims also believe that the Quran can’t be read in another language besides Arabic. I had a Russian friend, in college who marries a Turkish Muslim. She fell in love with the religion and spent 6 years learning Arabic, just so she could read the Quran. Many Muslims will say that one of the sources of their faith is because the Quran is so beautiful, in Arabic, that no human could write it. Arabic and English do not translate well… Anyway, have similar thoughts about the bible, as the Quran, some of it sounds lovely, like the Sermon on the Mount. Other parts sound a little nuts. I don’t know a lot about the hadiths… There are a lot of terrible examples of Muslims and Christians, but I don’t think either religious population benefits by ripping at each other. Just my 2 cents.
As far as the women in question, I don’t know her situation. I don’t know her story or her mental status. But, as someone who also lost a child, I know that I said crazy things for a year after my sweet daughter died. I still freak out, sometimes. I begged the doctor to kill me, when she was in the hospital. I told my family I didnt care if they hung around or all jumped off cliffs. Nothing mattered. The life I had, died with my child. Nothing could comfort me. I wanted the whole world to burn and I wanted to feel the flames. It’s an unimaginable pain. So, I think this woman’s words should be understood in the context of her pain. I don’t know know her deal, like I said. It does seem like she really lacked parenting skills, at the very least. Maybe she’s terrible, but I don’t see how anyone can make that judgement, based on her words in the article above. I can see her words meaning:
My child is dead. My life is over. Take everything, my life, my family…. I can’t possibly hurt more than I do and my life is over, anyway. God help me!
Katie, I am so sorry for your loss. It is an unimaginable one.
Po, I’m sorry to hear about your computer crashing on you.
But that’s not all, Quran and Hadith comes with many weird stories. About Sun landing in water when Mohammad tries to explain where it goes when it goes sunset. There was also one about Mohammad being so scared when there was an eclipse. About Jewish transforming into Rats, Pigs, and Monkeys. Heck, that’s only tip of an iceberg.
If you want to stick with Quran/Hadith and defend them, that’s fine with me. I just happen to know that I don’t think a real god would have endorsed all Talmud, Bible, or Quran because… they all support slavery. Would a real god actually endorse slavery? Any old book that tells you that it’s ok to force people to become your slaves WILL not pass my litmus test.
Even Buddhism thinks Caste system is ok, which I’m not ok with. I guess there’s no such thing as a perfect religion.
Thanks for the concern, ChaZ.
I can see how to the untrained eye, there are”weird” stories in the Quran and the hadith. I concede that I dismiss some of the hadith myself because they either contradict the quran or contradict the established character of Muhamad AS, namely, gentleness, care, patience, goodwill.
Now, everyone I speak to who dismisses the Quran outright, including brother in law, have never read it, and get their information from people/sites known for their Islamophobia. So, have you read the Quran?
Religion came to us on the wings of miracles, and whether, Jews, Christians, Buddhists or else, the faithful must believe in both the divine and the prophetic miracles. Otherwise, there can’t really be faith.
A reading of the Quran reveals that rarely was an established custom, even one that went against Islam, dismissed outright. Most of them were slowly and gradually phased out, including the drinking of alcohol, and slavery.
When the Quran came, slavery was not only an established arabian custom but also a global one. It was inherent to any society and any conflict because the losing side was either massacred or enslaved. Islam at least recommended that slaves be treated well. One ought to feed his slaves as he fed himself, and dress him as he dressed, not overwork them, not mistreat them, and free them as penance for breaking the fast or killing a fellow muslim, or simply for that was the right thing to do ” and God is aware of all the good you do.”
There is no perfect religion because there is no perfect human being. The religion is simply guidelines that are to be relevant for the length of humanity, it is therefore up to human beings, up to the adherents to figure out how the edicts and rules relate to the times. The more perfect the religious are, the more perfect their religion, the more flawed the individuals, the more flawed their religion. Simple as that.
One thing atheists do is talk as if religion need their approval to exist and thrive. That is a fallacy. Every year, hundred of thousand of people convert to Islam because they listen to knowledgeable Muslims or read the Quran, and find in it the answers they seek.
All these billions of Muslims that are just getting along with their lives in remote villages – but who in their spare time are forming plans to kill non-Muslims (and particularly Americans with their hateful freedoms) …..
How about instead of bombing them, drop leaflets telling them about Greek philosophy?
.
Christian arrives at the Golden Gates…
Voice booms “I gave you My Commandments and dictated a bunck of books. I sent My own Son down to firm up on some of the detail. How do you think your life stacks up against that?”
Christian says “But the Greek philosophers taught us that those rules don’t apply. Your son was a complete pussy with all that loving/forgivness sh*t. I’ll bet he’d have spoken out against abduction and torture of innocents, massive collateral damage, …..”
Voice interrupts and booms “F*ck the Greek philosophers. You can take up any complaints with them. You’ll find them in Hell – for I am a vengeful Jehovah – plus I got this real bad headache. Couldn’t you even freaking read my books?”
.
Can you imagine if JC was around today? He’d definitely be in TIDE.
“Now when JC saw the crowds, he went up on a mountainside and sat down. His disciples came to him, and he began to teach them.”
That’s a CIA signature strike right away!
Miracles of loaves and fishes are fine as you like your loaves and fishes done to a crisp.
Alternatively it might be that all the billions of Muslims are stuck with the books, but Christians have more flexibility because of ‘Christian Exceptionalism’ (TM).
no, because of Greek philosophy which is man centered for the most part. you know Aristotle, Plato, Epicurus, those guys. less faith more reason.
ChaZ,
Your quotes Quran and Hadith here might get you into TIDE. Be careful!
That asise, they relate to killing apostates as opposed to killing non-Muslims (non – as in never were).
Your point appears to be that billions of Muslims are constantly on alert for the opportunity to kill an apostate.
Others might build on that to assert the billions of Muslims are itching to kill all non-Muslims — and kill Americans in particular because “they hate our freedoms”.
.
What this logically means….
If it’s in the Bible and the Gospels, everybody who is even nominally a Christian lives by the word of the books.
7 days of Creation?
Sun goes round the Earth?
The Ten Commandments? C’mon. You’re kidding me.
Don’t even start with the weak watery stuff that JC came out with.
.
Alternatively it might be that all the billions of Muslims are stuck with the books, but Christians have more flexibility because of ‘Christian Exceptionalism’ (TM).
That Huffington Post story linked above with extracts….
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/04/26/zubeidat-tsarnaeva-terror-list_n_3164332.html
The headline is:
Zubeidat Tsarnaeva, Bombing Suspect’s Mom, Also On Terror List
So what does this mean?
In around March 2011, the Russians asked the FBI to check out the mother and elder son. Presumably the Russians heard some local gossip. It might be more likely that an informant in the Chechen community in Boston had flagged to them that the son’s sudden interest in religion had resulted in people in the mosque having to give him attitude adjustment chats to stop him from interrupting the sermons.
FBI found nothing to report. It seems that they found so little to report that their names didn’t even make it into TIDE at the time.
About 6 months later the Russians went to the CIA rather than the FBI this time.
This time around, their names get added to TIDE.
The sidebar link to the story within the Huffington Post reads:
Just how Ominous is the information exactly?
This is explained in story that the Ominoussidebar text links to:
If we are to believe the details in the story, then just having the intelligence service of a cooperative state ask about a person is not enough to get them into TIDE. It seems that the names got into TIDE only after the Russians went to the CIA – 6 months after they went to the FBI.
I get the impression that sections of TIDE are shared with the intelligence services of friendly states.
The reason the Russians asked about them was apparently:
So anyway…..
After they get into TIDE at the behest of the Russians, the mother and the son actually …………. “travel back to Russia”.
The Russians can now interview and investigate them on their own patch without having to depend on the FBI/CIA.
It appears that they didn’t do any better at linking them to terrorism.
— Not unless the ‘mother’ we see on TV and the dead ‘brother’ are stand-ins for a pair that are now incarcerated in some Gulag.
Now that would be Ominous.
It seems that TIDE is a sort of club with very loose entry requirements. Members then have opportiunities, along with about 3/4 Million other people to clock up Frequest Mention points.
It appears that neither of them got to clock up points prior to the bombings.
Given the intense scutiny under which anything to do with the woman would have been both in the US and by the Russians post-bombing, the fact that she is still wandering around giving TV interviews indicates that she is somewhat lacking in the Ominous department.
Po said: “You conveniently left out the main message of the Quran, that there is no compulsion in religion, that one cannot be forced to believe in God, because that goes against the whole idea of faith. That the misguided have done such acts does not cause it to change the message of the book.”
Po, I’m sorry to say this, the excerpts from Quran and Hadith below really does disprove what you just said above:
The Quran:
Qur’an (4:89) – “They but wish that ye should reject Faith, as they do, and thus be on the same footing (as they): But take not friends from their ranks until they flee in the way of Allah (From what is forbidden). But if they turn renegades, seize them and slay them wherever ye find them”
Qur’an (9:11-12) – “But if they repent and establish worship and pay the poor-due, then are they your brethren in religion. We detail Our revelations for a people who have knowledge. And if they break their pledges after their treaty (hath been made with you) and assail your religion, then fight the heads of disbelief – Lo! they have no binding oaths – in order that they may desist.”
The Hadith:
Bukhari (52:260) – “…The Prophet said, ‘If somebody (a Muslim) discards his religion, kill him.’ “ Note that there is no distinction as to how that Muslim came to be a Muslim.
Bukhari (83:37) – “Allah’s Apostle never killed anyone except in one of the following three situations: (1) A person who killed somebody unjustly, was killed (in Qisas,) (2) a married person who committed illegal sexual intercourse and (3) a man who fought against Allah and His Apostle and deserted Islam and became an apostate.”
Bukhari (84:57) – [In the words of] “Allah’s Apostle, ‘Whoever changed his Islamic religion, then kill him.’”
Bukhari (89:271) – A man who embraces Islam, then reverts to Judaism is to be killed according to “the verdict of Allah and his apostle.”
I stayed up last night, ChaZ, way past my bedtime, thinking of you. I wrote you a long letter breaking down your arguments and offering , well, better ones. Then my pc crashed and I lost the whole of it. Instead of rewriting it, I thought I’d quote other sources. Enjoy.
“The imposition of tribute upon the conquered Jews served as a precedent for provisions in the Islamic law requiring the exaction of tribute known as jizya from non-Muslims under Muslim rule, and confiscation of land belonging to non-Muslims into the collective property of the Muslim community.[5][7][8] In return, non-Muslim citizens were permitted to practice their faith, to enjoy a measure of communal autonomy, to be entitled to Muslim state’s protection from outside aggression, and to be exempted from military service and the Zakat, which is obligatory upon Muslim citizens.” Wikipeadia. (Pretty generous, I think)
“Much of fundamentalist Muslims’ ideas about religion-state relations are shaped by the Hadith literature, the oral sayings and doings attributed to the Prophet, which, as I said, were collected centuries after his death and I doubt most academic historians would consider them reliable. (I know saying so will offend some of my readers, but, well, I’m a historian.) The Hadith literature is just enormous, a kind of Muslim Talmud, and I find many of the reports contradictory to others. Some of them are actually Jewish law brought in by Jewish converts (as with stoning adulterers) that contradicts the Qur’an (which prescribes whipping instead). ”
Pr Juan Cole, Historian.
http://www.juancole.com/images/2013/04/relviolence.jpg
http://www.juancole.com/2013/04/islamic-forbids-terrorism.html
Blouise, NTTAWWT.
Zubeidat Tsarnaeva, Bombing Suspect’s Mom, Also On Terror List
By EILEEN SULLIVAN and JULIE PACE 04/26/13 04:19 PM ET EDT AP
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/04/26/zubeidat-tsarnaeva-terror-list_n_3164332.html?
“WASHINGTON — U.S. intelligence agencies added the mother of the Boston bombing suspects to a government terrorism database 18 months before the bombings, two officials told The Associated Press. She called it “lies and hypocrisy” and said she has never been linked to crimes or terrorism.
The CIA asked for the Boston terror suspect and his mother to be added to a terrorist database in the fall of 2011, after the Russian government contacted the agency with concerns that both had become religious militants, according to officials briefed on the investigation. About six months earlier, the FBI investigated Tamerlan Tsarnaev and his mother, Zubeidat Tsarnaeva, also at Russia’s request, one of the officials said. The FBI found no ties to terrorism.”
nick,
…. or you don’t want to admit you did … 😉
Blouise, I shook Wilt Chamberlain’s hand once. I was awestruck @ how big he was in every respect. That was back in the early 70’s. When I read his bio and alleged 10,000 sexual partners I realized I didn’t see his apparently most impressive attribute.
nick,
The football, baseball, and hockey players are big but the basketball players are the ones to see … it’s the height … they have to bend in order to get through the doorways.
Blouise, I bet when those big football players crowd into an elevator other folks look @ the weight capacity of the lift and start doing the math!
nick,
I know 😉
White, black, brown, purple, or green … with so many football, baseball, basketball, and hockey players living here, the only thing one can really say with confidence is that more than one of them in an elevator takes up all the space … though they almost always offer to hold the little ones so a family can crowd in.
The link to the Falk piece: “Collective self-reflection in the wake of a national tragedy”
http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/opinion/2013/04/201341864010806370.html
Collective self-reflection in the wake of a national tragedy
The American global domination project is bound to generate all kinds of resistance in the post-colonial world.
Last Modified: 19 Apr 2013 08:59
by Richard Falk
Excerpt:
What unfortunately remains taboo at this moment of 24/7 commentary on American security policy is any type of self-scrutiny by either the political leadership or the mainstream media, but at least there are a few hopeful signs of awakening on the part of the citizenry.
Boston Marathon bomb suspect ‘identified’
Listening to a PBS programme hours after the Boston event, I was struck by the critical attitudes of several callers: it is horrible, but we in this country should not be too surprised, given our drone attacks that have unwittingly targeted weddings and funerals in Afghanistan and Pakistan.
Another caller asked if it is not retribution for the kind of torture inflicted by American security forces acting under the authority of the government, verified by pictures of the humiliation of Islamic prisoners at Abu Ghraib or in light of the authoritative reports of officially sanctioned torture as detailed in the 577 page report of a task force chaired by two former senators – one a Republican, the other a Democrat – and containing senior military and security officials.
Is it not time that one among our politicians had the courage to connect these dots? Can we not ponder WH Auden’s haunting line: “Those to whom evil is done/do evil in return”?
The American global domination project is bound to generate all kinds of resistance in the post-colonial world. In some respects, the US has been fortunate not to experience worse blowbacks, and such could yet happen, especially if there is no disposition to rethink US relations to others in the world, starting with the Middle East.
America’s military prowess
Some of us hoped that Obama’s Cairo speech in 2009 was a beginning of such a process of renewal, timid in many ways, yet with a tonality that seemed to acknowledge that relations with the Islamic world needed a fundamental shift in the direction of reconciliation, including a move toward a more balanced approach to the Palestine/Israel situation. But as the months passed, what became evident, especially given the strong pushback by Israel and its belligerent leader, Bibi Netanyahu, was the accelerating back peddling of the Obama presidency.
Now at the start of his second presidential term, it seems that Obama has recognised the constraints, and seeks to confine his legacy to such domestic concerns as immigration, gun control and health care, abandoning the international agenda except to handle crisis diplomacy in a manner that does not disturb the global status quo or shorten America’s global reach. Obama’s trip to Israel, punctuated by his speech in Jerusalem on March 21, was more in the spirit of a love letter to the Israeli public than a genuine effort to bring a just peace, and contrasted with the much more visionary outlook exhibited in his early first term visit to the Middle East.
Self-scrutiny and mid-course correction of America’s global role is long overdue. Such a process is crucial both for the sake of its own future security and for the wellbeing of others. Such adjustments will eventually come about either as a result of a voluntary process of self-reflection or through the force of events. How and when this process of reassessment occurs remains a mystery.
Until it does, America’s military prowess and the abiding confidence of its leaders in hard power diplomacy makes the US a menace to the world and to itself. This is as true if Mitt Romney rather than Barack Obama was in the White House. The continuity reflects bipartisan support of a globe-girdling geopolitics, which has so far refused to acknowledge the evidence of national decline that is accentuated by pursuing an unsustainably ambitious global security role.
Richard Falk is Albert G. Milbank Professor Emeritus of International Law at Princeton University and Visiting Distinguished Professor in Global and International Studies at the University of California, Santa Barbara. He is also the United Nations Special Rapporteur on Palestinian human rights.
Bron
Between the many quotes taken out of context, and the deductions you arrive to from them, you are all over the place. I have met your ilk before, and I realize there is nothing I can do to change your mind, for everything I offer, you’d twist and use as further proof for your fears.
Most of the bilion and half (or 2) Muslims worldwide have better to do than worry about converting the rest of the world to Islam. Between fulfilling their own lives, their religion and take care of their family, converting anyone, especially by force, is not even a blib on the radar of their wishes.
You conveniently left out the main message of the Quran, that there is no compulsion in religion, that one cannot be forced to believe in God, because that goes against the whole idea of faith. That the misguided have done such acts does not cause it to change the message of the book.
Every instance where fighting was urged in the Quran, was directed at the pagan arabs who were molesting and terrorizing the Muslims, the Persians who were warring against them, and the associated Jewish, Christian tribes, and the Romans, who all came together at one time or another to fight this nascent religion. It is also reiterated many times in the book to live in peace with anyone who chooses to live in peace, and to treat them justly.
Finally, if it is true that the whole of the Muslim world hates America, wouldn’t they be a bit justified? A tiny bit? No?
Finally 2): Only a clueless american can claim Iraqis are better off now than under Sadaam. Get off Faux News and watch Democracy Now, Al Jazeera English (ooh, scary!)
Blouise, I bust balls w/ my black buddies all the time about their unique names. They bust mine about the lily white, Justin, Amy, Megan, etc. It’s our way of being honest. However, I respect it is not everyones cup o’ tea. To each their own.
SlingTrebuchet,
I spent an hour looking for follow up reports on the 2 men taken from that plane. Nothing … in fact some of the initial reports seem to have been, ahem, updated with no longer any mention of them being strip searched or detained for 4 hours. What remains in the newer versions is that they were removed because passengers complained about their speaking arabic, that they weren’t sitting together, and that no one returned anyone’s calls for additional info. I did find three other reports about incidents at Logan that day (4/16/13) but nothing more on those 2 men:
It’s as if they never existed!